Tesla Powered 33 Hot Rod

Thanks guys. Definitely a relief to have the first drive go well. I do agree about the engine compartment looking weird. I've been thinking what I want to do with that long term. Got a few ideas between making it a small frunk and hiding everything to some type of cosmetic dressing that highlights it. Not sure yet..

I'll just see how the belts I ordered work out and go from there. It should be here tomorrow. I think I can make them work with some custom brackets tied in to the chassis but I need to work on it more.

Thought this was worth posting... Officially the smallest part worked on for this build. Next to this penny is the resistor I had to change to hopefully get the parking brakes working. Someone very skilled at soldering did the swap for me - no way I could have done it right myself.

Attachment 177770 Attachment 177771

I'll reinstall it this weekend and try it out.

Oh, and it was $13 shipping for this 10 cent part. Reasonable for 2 day delivery but still funny.

That first drive is so BA. Congrats you are really moving along on this. Fun to watch the progress.

Thank you!!

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Originally Posted by progmgr1

I've got seat belts on the list of issues to consider when (if) I finally get to go-cart. Past forum research led to the following posts from other builders:

I got the three-point retractable belts with aircraft buckles from Wesco (http://www.wescoperformance.com/). I fabricated mounts out of some thick steel I had lying around.

I bought a set from Seatbeltsplus.com 3 Point Retractable Seat Belt, End Release Button, 22" Cable
Make sure you get the 22" cable so that it is long enough. I mounted the retractor to the outer FF5 floor brackets and the cable to the inner FF5 floor brackets. I fabricated brackets to slip around the roll bar to attach the shoulder harness. I used 1" ID O-rings above and below the brackets to keep them in position. The cable with the latch must run inside http://www.ffcars.com/forums/attachm...hotrod-93-.jpg

http://www.ffcars.com/forums/attachm...hotrod-90-.jpg

Alternative 4 belt seatbelt with retractor: http://corbeau.com/other/harness-bel...ness-belt.html $109.
I have Schroth's Profi II ASM FE a four point system with their proprietary system (they call it ASM) to prevent submarining with just four belts. Recommended to prevent crushing intestines in crash.

The Schroth system sounds particularly interesting since most builders dislike the 5th belt, and having retractors on a 4 belt system is much more user friendly than the stock FFR system, IMHO.

I hope the above gives you some useful alternatives to consider.

Keith HR #894

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I just got the 3 point harness that FFR uses on the truck. They fit fine and include the upper attach bracket that mounts to the Roll Bar.

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Originally Posted by peterh226

I just got the 3 point harness that FFR uses on the truck. They fit fine and include the upper attach bracket that mounts to the Roll Bar.

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Sounds like those require the roll bar? I did a quick search and couldn't find any images of them.

Well it went quite bad with the parking brake controller mod and test. Didn't solve the clamp pressure problem and after a few cycles one of the ICs blew on the controller - sparks and complete melt down. Sent an email back out with the update so we'll see where it goes from here. That really sucks...

This is what I'm thinking for the upper seat belt bracket. Probably overkill but that's ok. I'm printing out plastic test parts right now to see how it would all fit. Supposed to get the seat belts today too. It would be steel and welded in of course if it works out. I'd notch the upper part of the body like shown in silver below and the upper slip bracket for the seat belt would bolt to the part of the bracket that sticks out a little. That's about as high up as I can reasonably get the upper belt while still looking ok.

Attachment 177815 Attachment 177814

Great job on the first drive. Really REALLY cool!!

One question, and I'm not sure how anal inspection is by you but my wife's 2022 Mach-e, Ford had to include a pedestrian warning system, basically just piping a humming/growling sound through a pair of external speakers so blind or low-sight pedestrians know there is a vehicle by or around them.

Tesla I heard will implement something like this in an HW/SW update later this year for cars coming off the assembly line as well as cars in the field. Do you need to do anything similar for your state to pass inspection?

Jim

Attachment 177830
This is the 3 point seatbelt that FFR sells as an alternative to the Simpsons. It bolts in to the existing lugs on the floor.

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Originally Posted by 33fromSD

Great job on the first drive. Really REALLY cool!!

One question, and I'm not sure how anal inspection is by you but my wife's 2022 Mach-e, Ford had to include a pedestrian warning system, basically just piping a humming/growling sound through a pair of external speakers so blind or low-sight pedestrians know there is a vehicle by or around them.

Tesla I heard will implement something like this in an HW/SW update later this year for cars coming off the assembly line as well as cars in the field. Do you need to do anything similar for your state to pass inspection?

Jim

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I thought that was a federal requirement already. Maybe it's just a CA thing. Not certain.. My 2021 F150 hybrid had that but it was a terrible implementation - horribly annoying sound so I disabled it. I don't drive without paying attention to my surroundings so the math was easy. 100% annoying vs. 0.01% chance of causing an accident without it.

As for this car, it's not required as far as I know. CA has a process called SB100 that allows for 500 kit/custom cars per year to be registered and exempt from a lot of requirements like emissions. Needs the basics like seat belts, lights, signals, etc. though. I'll find out when I go to register it but in all my research for this car I haven't heard of that being needed.

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Originally Posted by peterh226

Attachment 177830
This is the 3 point seatbelt that FFR sells as an alternative to the Simpsons. It bolts in to the existing lugs on the floor.

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Thanks. That's what I had imagined it would look like. Nice option with a roll bar.

Here's my seat belt mock up with the 3D printed upper bracket and the body notched out. The waterfall panel just needs upper notches and the two will make a rectangular opening where the bracket sticks out. I might machine some nice bezels for the opening later on too. I used the stock lower mount points on the chassis.

I like these belts I ordered. They have a compact retract roller (fits behind the seat), smooth operation, and are well made. The clasp section has adjustable length too. Seems like it will work out fine. Ideally the rear upper slip would be a bit higher but it is what it is. I don't want the roll bar and that's really the only practical way it can be any higher. It comes over the shoulder at a good spot and is really comfortable.

Attachment 177839 Attachment 177838 Attachment 177841

I'll have the steel bracket parts made now. Weld them up and job done!

This is what the bracket looks like...

Attachment 177842

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BradC

I thought that was a federal requirement already. Maybe it's just a CA thing. Not certain.. My 2021 F150 hybrid had that but it was a terrible implementation - horribly annoying sound so I disabled it. I don't drive without paying attention to my surroundings so the math was easy. 100% annoying vs. 0.01% chance of causing an accident without it.

As for this car, it's not required as far as I know. CA has a process called SB100 that allows for 500 kit/custom cars per year to be registered and exempt from a lot of requirements like emissions. Needs the basics like seat belts, lights, signals, etc. though. I'll find out when I go to register it but in all my research for this car I haven't heard of that being needed.

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Federal law for implemented mid-2021 so end-run 2021s & all new 2022 & beyond.

Love to know how you disabled it on your F150 so I can do it on my wife's Mach-e. So annoying to hear it.

Jim

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BradC

Here's my seat belt mock up with the 3D printed upper bracket and the body notched out. The waterfall panel just needs upper notches and the two will make a rectangular opening where the bracket sticks out. I might machine some nice bezels for the opening later on too. I used the stock lower mount points on the chassis.

I like these belts I ordered. They have a compact retract roller (fits behind the seat), smooth operation, and are well made. The clasp section has adjustable length too. Seems like it will work out fine. Ideally the rear upper slip would be a bit higher but it is what it is. I don't want the roll bar and that's really the only practical way it can be any higher. It comes over the shoulder at a good spot and is really comfortable.

Attachment 177839 Attachment 177838 Attachment 177841

I'll have the steel bracket parts made now. Weld them up and job done!

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Looks good. Maybe you have them already but if not and you want your FFR seat cushions to last a little longer and add a little more comfort, Breeze Automotive has adjustable position seat risers with a solid MDF base to help support the cushions. Love mine.

--> https://breezeautomotive.com/shop/in...classic-seats/

Jim

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 33fromSD

Federal law for implemented mid-2021 so end-run 2021s & all new 2022 & beyond.

Love to know how you disabled it on your F150 so I can do it on my wife's Mach-e. So annoying to hear it.

Jim

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I found a thread where a guy ohm'd out the speaker behind the bumper and sourced a resistor and connector to trick the computer into thinking the speaker was still there. If you just unplug the speaker it throws a code. It was a thread specific to my truck so I'm not sure if it would be the same for the Mach E. Might be. I just bought the finished kit from him vs. sourcing everything (attached link). Quick and done. Turns off the stupid back-up tone too which I don't miss at all.

https://megaohmmotorsports.bigcartel.../ford-psbk-ece

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 33fromSD

Looks good. Maybe you have them already but if not and you want your FFR seat cushions to last a little longer and add a little more comfort, Breeze Automotive has adjustable position seat risers with a solid MDF base to help support the cushions. Love mine.

--> https://breezeautomotive.com/shop/in...classic-seats/

Jim

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That sounds interesting but the link doesn't work. Are they still in business? A search by name also goes to dead links.

If you want to make noise with an EV, this is how I'd do it!

https://www.borla.com/products/activ...xoCULkQAvD_BwE

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=241991941252251

I just heard back from Jon at Pantera Electronics about the dead parking brake controller. Amazing support from him on this problem - he replied to me from out of the country on vacation which definitely was not necessary. He thinks I just had a bum controller to start since the resistor changes I made didn't work and then the chip eventually blew. He's sending a replacement out when he returns.

I did a test by applying 12V to the caliper motors with 3A fuses in line - expecting them to blow well before any issues on the calipers. They both worked and locked the brakes down perfectly before the fuses blew so they weren't the problem. Electric parking brake caliper motor current will spike when it hits mechanical resistance in either direction. The controller monitors the current and cuts power when it hits a set threshold. Mine were only traveling a short distance before the power was being cut for some reason and would not lock the wheels.

Blown chip in the yellow circle:
Attachment 177859

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Papa

If you want to make noise with an EV, this is how I'd do it!

https://www.borla.com/products/activ...xoCULkQAvD_BwE

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=241991941252251

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OMG that's funny!! Maybe I could have it make George Jetson car sounds too!

I watched an episode of All Girls Garage where they installed the Borla unit on an Mustang EV. It's programmable so you can customize the sound to your liking and gets louder as you accelerate. Way cool! It was a specially designed kit for the Mustang, rather large.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BradC

OMG that's funny!! Maybe I could have it make George Jetson car sounds too!

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I understand a Tesla can broadcast fart sounds, or did, which is enough for me.
jim

Yeah - if they make it open configurable for sounds you can only imagine what people will come up with!

If they make it open configurable for sounds you can only imagine what people will come up with!

It's probably CANBUS controlled though. Beyond my pay grade to find a CAN throttle position signal from the inverter for my build. If it taps into the throttle pedal directly then maybe. It would have to be reasonable price though since it's kind of just for laughs if I were to do that.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BradC

Here's my seat belt mock up with the 3D printed upper bracket and the body notched out. The waterfall panel just needs upper notches and the two will make a rectangular opening where the bracket sticks out. I might machine some nice bezels for the opening later on too. I used the stock lower mount points on the chassis.

I like these belts I ordered. They have a compact retract roller (fits behind the seat), smooth operation, and are well made. The clasp section has adjustable length too. Seems like it will work out fine. Ideally the rear upper slip would be a bit higher but it is what it is. I don't want the roll bar and that's really the only practical way it can be any higher. It comes over the shoulder at a good spot and is really comfortable.

Attachment 177839 Attachment 177838 Attachment 177841

I'll have the steel bracket parts made now. Weld them up and job done!

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G'day Brad,

Looks like you are well under control with a seat belt solution, but I thought i would just pass on my Roadster solution:

Retractable seat belts are required by law in South Australia. However, on the roadster, the seat belt shoulder strap is too low when installed in the conventional position, to meet the requirements. The workaround is to fit the shoulder strap in the centre of the car, where the body curvature is highest, per the pic below. Not the best photos, however you can see the red seat belt release button alongside the drivers seat. The retractors are mounted in the trunk.

Surprisingly you get used to it quickly, just like the reverse speedometer.

Attachment 177870Attachment 177869

Thanks for all the detail you have put into documenting your build. It has been great to follow along. I work with industrial inverters / battery systems. It is great to see a fun application like a hot rod. So much more exciting than a boring UPS. :)

Best of luck with your firmware issues.

Cheers,

Nige

Thanks Brad

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BradC

That sounds interesting but the link doesn't work. Are they still in business? A search by name also goes to dead links.

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Weird, link works for me going back into the thread and clicking on it.

Any ways, yes, they are still in business, they are out of Massachusetts. Here is another link, but worse case if that still doesn't work, then Google "Breeze Automotive" and they should come up.

https://breezeautomotive.com

Jim

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BradC

If they make it open configurable for sounds you can only imagine what people will come up with!

It's probably CANBUS controlled though. Beyond my pay grade to find a CAN throttle position signal from the inverter for my build. If it taps into the throttle pedal directly then maybe. It would have to be reasonable price though since it's kind of just for laughs if I were to do that.

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This video suggests a differing format, requiring windows down for broadcast:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqkURdcNGC4

Windows down adds to the deception, repulsing if not warning bystanders.

There is however a warning mode:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S_DYT77pEW4

Low Tech?
jim

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 33fromSD

Weird, link works for me going back into the thread and clicking on it.

Any ways, yes, they are still in business, they are out of Massachusetts. Here is another link, but worse case if that still doesn't work, then Google "Breeze Automotive" and they should come up.

https://breezeautomotive.com

Jim

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Yeah - the link works now for me too. Maybe just something with my home PC at that time. Thanks!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nigel Allen

G'day Brad,

Looks like you are well under control with a seat belt solution, but I thought i would just pass on my Roadster solution:

Retractable seat belts are required by law in South Australia. However, on the roadster, the seat belt shoulder strap is too low when installed in the conventional position, to meet the requirements. The workaround is to fit the shoulder strap in the centre of the car, where the body curvature is highest, per the pic below. Not the best photos, however you can see the red seat belt release button alongside the drivers seat. The retractors are mounted in the trunk.

Surprisingly you get used to it quickly, just like the reverse speedometer.

Attachment 177870Attachment 177869

Thanks for all the detail you have put into documenting your build. It has been great to follow along. I work with industrial inverters / battery systems. It is great to see a fun application like a hot rod. So much more exciting than a boring UPS. :)

Best of luck with your firmware issues.

Cheers,

Nige

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That's a great solution too. Very clean build - thanks for sharing and for the feedback! The Hot Rod has the frame members rising up on the outer sides already so it makes more sense to tie into that and keep them in the traditional orientation for this chassis.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by J R Jones

This video suggests a differing format, requiring windows down for broadcast:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqkURdcNGC4

Windows down adds to the deception, repulsing if not warning bystanders.

There is however a warning mode:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S_DYT77pEW4

Low Tech?
jim

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That's funny.. Even better with the passenger side seat speakers.

Got the firmware update this morning. I'm working form home today and while on a boring call I couldn't help myself - had to update it and see. All good now! That's a big relief.

I had the iPad set up with an automation script to open the controller app directly when power is connected. I have it connected to unswitched power in the car so it stays charged always with just a momentary NC switch that breaks power temporarily. When I start up the car, I'd have to hit that button or the iPad screen to bring up the controller app. Totally fine but not as slick as I'd like. I was looking for other options on a different boring meeting yesterday at work (there's a theme here I think.. ha) and I came across time delay relays. Had never thought about that before. I ended up buying one that's programmable. I'll set that up to be normally connected on the switched side iPad power. When the key switch power comes on, it will disrupt the iPad power for 1 second and then restore it. That will make the iPad screen come on when I turn the key which will eliminate the extra manual switch. Much slicker! Still no way that I can find to make the display lock automatically when I shut off the car but I do have a small accessibility button enabled on the screen so I don't need access to the side buttons.

Got the seat belt brackets yesterday. All welded up and installed now.

Attachment 178105 Attachment 178106 Attachment 178104 Attachment 178107

I have a cover for the 12V battery printing right now. Once that's done I'll put the seats back in and it'll be ready for a higher speed drive test. I was hesitant to go very fast in my court for obvious reasons, plus no belts in it. The chassis shop that did the rear suspension final welding has about a half mile road in front that's pretty isolated. I'm going to ask them if I can trailer it over and do some drive tests. Technically not legal but I doubt anyone will care - it's not like it makes a bunch of noise! Weather is supposed to clear up late next week finally so I'll see if I can plan that.

If all goes well with the drive I'm shooting to get it over to the body shop the first week or two of February. I decided I don't want to do any of that here. They've done a bunch of 33's before and know all the tricks so I'm just going to hand it off. I'll definitely strip it down to just a roller chassis - I don't want body shop dust in all the battery boxes and wiring. That's a nightmare to get clean. I'll have a lot to work on still while it's there, plus they'll be done with the chassis relatively quickly and will finish up body work and paint on a body buck. I'll get the chassis powder coated and work on final assembly while the body in being worked. That will be the really fun stage I think.

12V battery box is in. It was a 70 hour print job so I'm glad it fits! The lid is machined from some extra 3/16" G10 I had laying around. Covered in leftover vinyl wrap I had from the underbody panels. I might add a pluggable charge port connector now that I think about it. Make it easy to plug in a maintenance charger for the battery when the car sits for a while.

Attachment 178211 Attachment 178210

Yesterday I made some underbody skids to help protect the lower battery boxes. These are expendable aluminum rails running the length of the lower boxes in case I high center on a tall speed bump or hit something on the road. Much easier to replace or repaint these than have a damaged battery box. The front wedge parts are 3D printed in fiber stranded nylon with heavy layers of carbon fiber filament embedded for strength. I could have machined these in aluminum but since I have access to the printer at work why not make it easy!

Attachment 178213 Attachment 178212

I got the replacement parking brake controller board and it didn't work either. Frustrating. Pantera Electronics has been great about it but there's just some incompatibility with the version of calipers I have I guess. They said I could ship my calipers to them (in PA) and they would work on it, but I don't want to mess with that. They're going to just refund my money if I ship it back. Fair enough - I'm done with messing with it. The alternative is to wire both to a momentary polarity reversing switch and put resettable 5A fuses on each side. That ensures they both have fairly close clamp forces and will automatically stop at a repeatable point each time. You can do the same thing with power window switches but I think I would need one per side and that's just not a good option.

The timed relay I got for the iPad power up worked but it drained my 12V battery like crazy. It was supposed to have a very low static current draw but that's clearly not the case. I measured it at 150mA which is nuts. Not a good option for my 20 AH battery.

Went back to researching those and found this one: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

This thing is really cool. You can program it to do tons of different functions with an additional programmer board. The price was about $40 for both which isn't bad at all, and Timers.Shop had great support with some questions I asked by email before I bought it. I thought I'd post it up to share since it has other potential uses for custom cars. I programmed it to have the output power on at all times, and interrupt it for 2 seconds when I turn on the ignition. That triggers the iPad script and brings the screen up automatically when I hit the ignition switch.

The 12V battery charge/maintenance port went here next to the main charge port. Simple enough..

Attachment 178448

I 3D printed a temporary center instrument panel and just zip tied it in place here for the road testing I need to do. Seems like it will look nice in the dash. I'll machine the final one in aluminum of course.

Attachment 178447

Looks great!

Sounds like maybe you found the solution you wanted but in the future you may want to look at magnetic bi stable latching relays. These are designed to stay in an open or closed state without continuous current.

Steve