Andrew & Tamra's 818SR EM Autox Hybrid Destroked Long-Rod Build

[Tamra]

We brought our 818 home today! We've kept a donor thread here (http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?14362-Picked-up-our-STI-hybrid-swap-donor-today!) for the full teardown process, but now that it's time to start assembly, we figured we should create a build thread. Our 818 is #297.

Our excited faces:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/2e211fa3-5b96-422f-b10e-26547d9d5fdf_zpsd6b98240.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/2e211fa3-5b96-422f-b10e-26547d9d5fdf_zpsd6b98240.jpg.html)

We ordered a white body:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/ABA66515-49CB-4213-B3D0-45BAFB51D90D_zps5zzoqmfp.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/ABA66515-49CB-4213-B3D0-45BAFB51D90D_zps5zzoqmfp.jpg.html)

As one of our friends put it, "the 818 is definitely the better move"
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/CD96FA8B-E51A-411A-A566-6878B4DC657D_zps5psbj7ro.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/CD96FA8B-E51A-411A-A566-6878B4DC657D_zps5psbj7ro.jpg.html)


We have never owned Subarus before (Mazda family), and we've definitely never built a car before. Let alone a motor. This will be a learning process. Our goal is to autocross our 818 and also have it be street legal. Our hope is to have it on the road next spring.

We are going to build a 2.34L destroked short block, built for up to 650whp, but we will be tuning it to around 350whp max, with multiple maps. The machined 2.0 Heads will have an upgraded valve train. Oiling will be our limiting factor, so we will be running it at 8k rpm max to start. We are still deciding on the turbo, but leaning toward a BW 200SX twin scroll setup.

We will be doing all of the assembly of our engine. Larry's Power did the machine work on the heads and block and balanced the rotating assembly. We balanced the rods and pistons ourselves to .1 grams. We purchased our parts through Fidelis Motorsports, who also helped us pick the right parts for our goals.

Updated list of parts 9/1/15
2.34L destroked short block
-MPS +2mm H Tuff rods
-JE FSR Pistons
-upgraded Tool Steel Wrist Pins
-75mm WRX cross drilled crank
-King Race and Main Bearings
-ARP Subaru EJ Series DOHC Headstuds

2.0 Chamber Matched Machined Heads
-Shimless buckets
-GSC Beehive Valve Springs w/ Titanium Retainer Valvetrain Kit
-GSC Chrome Polished Intake Valve
-GSC Chrome Polished Exhaust

Turbo Setup
Borg Warner S200SX 51mm .84 a/r twin scroll turbo
Kinuguwa Twin Scroll Header (sits level with the oil pan!)
Custom twin scroll up-pipe, fully divided into divided T4
Two Tial 38mm EWG's, fully divided and plumbed back into exhaust


Supporting mods:
Speed Density with AEM 3-Bar and post intercooler temperature
Injector Dynamics Fuel Injectors 1000cc
Partial TGV deletes
Forge bpv
Grimmspeed ebcs
DW 300lph fuel pump
STI oil pan
Killer B Motorsport Ultimate Oil Pickup
Killer B Motorsport Oil Baffle Windage Tray
New OEM 11mm oil pump, 4 shims
Cobb intake
NGK 1-step colder plugs
Semi-parallel fuel lines
Gates Racing Timing Belt
Group N engine and transmission mounts
Frozenboost AWIC with upgraded Bosch pump


Other items:
ACT StreetLite Flywheel
South Bend Stage 2 Endurance Clutch
OBX LSD (upgraded washers/bolts)
FFR adjustable lateral links
Aluminum control arms for the "castor mod" with 4mm spacers
Stainless steel braided brake lines
Custom sway bar TBD
Koni 30 series shocks with 500lb springs in front (R package)
Race seats - Sparco Corsa
15" and 16" wheels with Hoosier A6/A7's
Prosport Gauges with alarms
Custom shifter routed with cables going straight back
Schroth Profi II ASM FE harnesses with sub straps (DOT approved 5 point)
The car IS street legal and registered

Other project creep TBD


We have very limited space (two 10x20ft garages, one which is fully taken by the Miata and the bike), so when we got it home, first thing was to hang the body panels from the ceiling of our second garage. The bumpers and fender didn't fit, but at least most of them are out of the way.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/DD33E039-FB6E-4C21-99D9-0C8DCD4F8187_zpsx5l6dt7f.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/DD33E039-FB6E-4C21-99D9-0C8DCD4F8187_zpsx5l6dt7f.jpg.html)

All tucked away:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/EFAFE110-DC24-4F7A-BD14-BDCE5228B495_zps4qdi6mki.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/EFAFE110-DC24-4F7A-BD14-BDCE5228B495_zps4qdi6mki.jpg.html)

At this point, all of our donor parts have been cleaned and painted, bushings replaced where necessary, etc. The wiring harness has had a once through and had everything unnecessary deleted, although we haven't re-routed anything yet. The transmission has an OBX lsd installed with the upgraded washers. We are still in process of building the motor, so that is one of the primary items on our list for this week, in addition to taking inventory. The only items on the packing list that were backordered were small items that we will not need for awhile.

Thanks to all of the threads on this forum, we have already learned a great deal. As you read through our posts, please feel free to comment if you see any issues or have any recommendations.

Also, my better (or at least more mechanical) half is Andrew, forum name xxguitarist.

[Rasmus]

E Modified, destroked long rod?! I love you guys.

[Tamra]

E Modified, destroked long rod?! I love you guys.

Our car probably won't be as anorexic as yours :) I mean, our H-Tuff +2mm rods with upgraded ARP bolts are 573.1 grams, whereas yours are only 519 grams. There's no catching up with you now.

[Frank818]

That should be a nice build!
Rasmus vs AndrewandTamra on E Modified. :)

[Tamra]

Forget Jeff Kiesel, we'll have our own competition :) Too bad Rasmus is in Vegas and we're in CT. It'd be fun!

[Rasmus]

We'll meet at SixStar's place in Colorado.

[Tamra]

Howabout Lincoln in a few years :)

[Rasmus]

Howabout Lincoln in a few years :)
Even better. A little 818 head to head (to head to head w/ codrivers).

If I tighten the skills up on the nut behind the wheel, I just might mid-pack.

[wleehendrick]

Congrats on the pickup... You win the prize for the most detailed build title. ;)

[Tamra]

Even better. A little 818 head to head (to head to head w/ codrivers).

If I tighten the skills up on the nut behind the wheel, I just might mid-pack.

Yeah.. us too for sure. It's easy to work on the car compared to tightening that nut. That's the hardest part.


Congrats on the pickup... You win the prize for the most detailed build title. ;)

Hey, at least I didn't say "Andrew & Tamra's 818SR EM Autox Hybrid Destroked Long-Rod AWIC That Might Have a Twin Scroll Build"

...or something mushy...

:)

[Rasmus]

We also swapped the bearings over from the old open front diff to the OBX. Removing them without damaging them was a little challenging, but using an arbor press, some thin walled aluminum tubing, and a piece of steel cut to match, we got them off. Pressing them on the OBX was a piece of cake since they just slide right on.

Old and new (prior to bearing swap):
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Teardown/IMG_7035_zpsfd398ae5.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Teardown/IMG_7035_zpsfd398ae5.jpg.html)


Okay. How in the world did you two get the "hard" bearing off the differential without Subaru's $150 tool or destroying the bearing cage?

[Jaime]

I just destroyed the one on the ring side - it's less than $20 at RockAuto. The one on the other side is easy to get under with a bearing puller.

[xxguitarist]

Rasmus,
On the gear side, I tried a [``````\______/``````````] shaped puller that i'd made to use with C clamps on the other side.. No dice.

I wound up clamping the stock diff in soft jaws on a vise, and sneaking in a (huge) flat head screwdriver to catch the inner race, which had a tiny overlap.
Wound up switching to a small prybar with partial J shape after there was space for it. Slid right off, arguably easier than the other side :D

Not to say there wasn't swearing involved..

[Tamra]

So we finished taking inventory of all of the parts. Factory Five forgot to mention that we have to build it out of paper. No wonder it's so light! (not really - there are 9 boxes of parts still with plenty of paper padding not pictured). It took us 3.5 hours, working together.

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/paper818_zps3ffa69a7.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/paper818_zps3ffa69a7.jpg.html)

Only one pair of items was missing that wasn't on the backorder list. Unfortunately they are a suspension part, so it could hold us up on making it a roller. Hopefully they can get it to us quickly. The sheet metal in general was in good shape, although definitely some burrs to remove. One cockpit piece was very badly dinged up, so we're hoping for a replacement on it. Lots of welding slag and not always the prettiest welds, but nothing that would get in the way of proper function as far as we can tell. It's going to be a race car, some function over form is fine with us.

The body panels will need some gel coat repair around some corners, but nothing unexpected. No broken pieces or anything major. FFR provided us with a gel coat repair kit, and even pointed out some of the areas that weren't the best.

[riptide motorsport]

Very cool......such an exciting time!

[RM1SepEx]

Did you choose one of the two last white kits with the discount...

[Tamra]

Did you choose one of the two last white kits with the discount...

No, we did not. These were supposed to be new panels, and we requested them to be white instead of red. We actually called and asked about the ones with the discount, but they said it was too late as ours was already partially packed up, and there was no way to get the discounted frames powder coated at that point anyway. Although, we do need to check with them, as there appear to be handwritten dates on the backs of the panels and some of them are pretty old dates...

[Frank818]

as there appear to be handwritten dates on the backs of the panels and some of them are pretty old dates...

You don't know? Those are the expiry dates of the panels. :)

[Tamra]

You don't know? Those are the expiry dates of the panels. :)

haha I hope not :) FFR responded and said that ours were indeed new panels, although we are still puzzled about the dates written on the back. They sure looked like dates... 9/27, 6/17, etc. Anyone else have dates on their panels? Were they close to your pick up date or completely random numbers?

Otherwise, FFR was very responsive (emailed back first thing this morning) and helpful. On the one interior panel that was dinged up they are sending us carpet to cover it and the rest of the center console, and they are getting us the missing parts right away.

[RM1SepEx]

I'll check my new panels tomorrow for dates, my original panels were not dated

[Tamra]

Thanks Dan! Ours were on tape on the backside.


Quick time lapse of parts inventory:


http://youtu.be/LXgDt80K8yk

[MrDude_1]

Timelapse is awesome. You should do that for the whole build.

[RM1SepEx]

my nose piece has a piece of tape with the date on it, is is the correct date for when Dave asked them to make up my panels as replacements. the front fender has a spot where it looks like tape was removed, the other pieces, no tape.

[xxguitarist]

Timelapse is awesome. You should do that for the whole build.

We probably will.. But not at quite that slow of a relative speed. 1 min for 3.5 hr still gets a little boring.


my nose piece has a piece of tape with the date on it, is is the correct date for when Dave asked them to make up my panels as replacements. the front fender has a spot where it looks like tape was removed, the other pieces, no tape.

Thanks for checking! I'll see what FFR says about a photo of those labels...

[Mechie3]

I've fallen off with my timelapse. I got a new computer at work and the antivirus won't let me load my video software and the gopro software isn't as user friendly. It's always fun to watch them.

[MrDude_1]

I've fallen off with my timelapse. I got a new computer at work and the antivirus won't let me load my video software and the gopro software isn't as user friendly. It's always fun to watch them.
you should be able to make an exclusion on the antivirus so it knows its ok.
Also, any timelapse is funnier if you play the Benny Hill Theme in the background.

[xxguitarist]

Who says motorcycles aren't practical?

Brought the aluminum front LCA & most of the assorted brackets that need to be painted with me to work today.
http://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd8/xxguitarist/8835FA7C-CE9C-4C9C-8BB5-09A2A782BC13_zpskte3bdoi.jpg

Took all the brackets to the deburring wheel, then a quick media blast. Much better.
http://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd8/xxguitarist/275DAB83-BECD-44E0-87A4-2EE07C3AA313_zpsl7jrhfhx.jpg

I'll drill & mill the LCAs later today for the lower shock perch.

[Tamra]

So we learned tonight that one should never use calipers around the 818.

Upper control arm mounting area (inside of powder coat lip, so area of most clearance):
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/73A449BE-D291-4F4F-992B-74F8BB4925FE_zpszagq3cka.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/73A449BE-D291-4F4F-992B-74F8BB4925FE_zpszagq3cka.jpg.html)

Upper control arm:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/E4DCC2B3-A4FF-4961-AEF7-0C8B7B8B07BC_zpsplpqaj1c.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/E4DCC2B3-A4FF-4961-AEF7-0C8B7B8B07BC_zpsplpqaj1c.jpg.html)


Only 40 thou of interference... nothing many blows with a hammer couldn't fix.... 3 out of 4 corners required this "fix." Also had to reassemble one of the upper control arms, as we had two lefts the way they came. That was easy though.

It is a little heart breaking to have to start smashing our new toy with a hammer on our first night working on it :( Guessing this will be the first of many, though.


Ground off the "nub" in prep for R height:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/8D5780AE-7FDE-4B56-A62C-CC80C3981269_zpsrhivrerm.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/8D5780AE-7FDE-4B56-A62C-CC80C3981269_zpsrhivrerm.jpg.html)

Also milled the mounting points flat:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/AC16A03D-C899-4661-B409-88EB9947F884_zpskwoejofp.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/AC16A03D-C899-4661-B409-88EB9947F884_zpskwoejofp.jpg.html)

Milled the back for parallel nut surface:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/17D28D32-8D9A-47A4-9924-2C39A8916E6B_zpsze2kezgg.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/17D28D32-8D9A-47A4-9924-2C39A8916E6B_zpsze2kezgg.jpg.html)


It was too cold and rainy to paint any of the brackets tonight. Luckily, we have plenty of other things to work on in the meantime... including the short block we haven't gotten to yet. Last night we practiced measuring the clearances on the old set with the bore gauges. Now it's time to do the real thing.

Got some bad news on the body panels. They were not freshly made as we were told, and the dates on the back were the dates dates they were made. We are working with FFR to resolve this issue, and will report back once we have a solution.

[xxguitarist]

So we learned tonight that one should never use calipers around the 818.

This goes double for all the chopped to length spacers. They're almost accurately enough cut to pick the difference between two close standard sizes.. +/- ten thou.

Anyone have some meds to tame a case of OCD? I think that was line item 8 on the engineer's BOM.

Don't get me wrong, it ought to all bolt together OK after a bit of persuasion, and we're very excited still, it's just the sort of thing that gives me a headache.

[RM1SepEx]

When you weld stuff up it "moves" don't adjust with a hammer, make a spreading tool with a bolt and nut and washers

the spacers all can use some grinding. I mixed and matched... I powder coated them all and measured them, you use them like puzzle pieces, may need to make a new one once or twice and making one a wee narrower on the belts sanding wheel of my grinder happened a few times. I had to make some on a lathe for the lower control arms

Good luck with your panels... If like me you want to stay gel coat and avoid the cost of paint they can make panels that look pretty good, not perfect...

[AZPete]

Does it matter when the body panels were made? What matters is the finished product and some guys have complained that their panels were too fresh and still "degassing" (I occasionally do also).

Like Dan said, you'll soon learn that this is not Lego-like where everything fits perfectly the first time. You've got to think constantly about how it should fit and what you can do to make it as perfect as you like. Relax, and post a sign in your garage: "If it were easy, everybody would be doing it."

[Jim Schenck]

If you are doing the dropped ride height then the upper control arms should mount on top of the chassis and not in between the brackets. Use a washer stack or spacers to fill the old control arm space and that way you are still using the strength of both arm mounting plates.

Also I agree with Pete, the longer a panel sits before it has bodywork done the better. Even though the vinylester resin is much quicker to a final cure than the older poly stuff you still want the panel to do as much curing as possible before doing your fitment. The only reason more recent panels would be better would be if there was a change in the process or the part shape, but there hasn't been other than gelcoat color.

Also I have instructions on doing the dropped ride height if you want them, justy shoot me a PM.

[xxguitarist]

When you weld stuff up it "moves" don't adjust with a hammer, make a spreading tool with a bolt and nut and washers

the spacers all can use some grinding. I mixed and matched... I powder coated them all and measured them, you use them like puzzle pieces, may need to make a new one once or twice and making one a wee narrower on the belts sanding wheel of my grinder happened a few times. I had to make some on a lathe for the lower control arms

Good luck with your panels... If like me you want to stay gel coat and avoid the cost of paint they can make panels that look pretty good, not perfect...

Good point on the spreader. Will do for all future adjustments.

What did you use as a replacement stainless tube material for those that you made on the lathe?

We plan to run partial gelcoat, partial vinyl wrap. It will be a race car for us. The panels won't need to be paint-free perfect, but there is the expected work to do anyway.



Does it matter when the body panels were made? What matters is the finished product and some guys have complained that their panels were too fresh and still "degassing" (I occasionally do also).

Like Dan said, you'll soon learn that this is not Lego-like where everything fits perfectly the first time. You've got to think constantly about how it should fit and what you can do to make it as perfect as you like. Relax, and post a sign in your garage: "If it were easy, everybody would be doing it."

Pete, It's more a matter of what we discussed with our sales rep at FFR. We were told we would have fresh, post-red-gel-coat, but white, per our request, panels.
We don't know how they were stored when they were freshly out of the molds. Some panels sit out on the lawn behind FFR. We planned to (and are) baby(ing) them as soon as we got them, storing them in nets, supporting pressure evenly across the surface, in a mostly climate controlled basement garage. Not sure if it makes much of a difference, but any warping sustained in new panels would be on us, not previous conditions.
Also, we paid full price because they said the older, discounted panels were not an option, only to find out we received at least some of the old panels.

We don't expect the build to be easy, or even necessarily straightforward.
The biggest point though, is trust. We just want the story to match the labels on our panels. FFR has been responsive so far, though, to our questions.

We'll give an update later.


If you are doing the dropped ride height then the upper control arms should mount on top of the chassis and not in between the brackets. Use a washer stack or spacers to fill the old control arm space and that way you are still using the strength of both arm mounting plates.

Also I agree with Pete, the longer a panel sits before it has bodywork done the better. Even though the vinylester resin is much quicker to a final cure than the older poly stuff you still want the panel to do as much curing as possible before doing your fitment. The only reason more recent panels would be better would be if there was a change in the process or the part shape, but there hasn't been other than gelcoat color.

Also I have instructions on doing the dropped ride height if you want them, justy shoot me a PM.

Jim,
We'd definitely appreciate the instructions on the R height setup. Our intent is to check clearances at R height, but assemble initially at S height to make it appear more street-worthy to the CT DMV.
I'll PM you for that.

If no changes in process, are there difference in trim or finishing instructions from the molders? It seems like later builds have had less issues with fitment.




I worry that we're coming across more negatively than we intend. We are very excited for this car, the process, and the result. There's huge potential, we just have to figure out how to get there. We want to document the process honestly, for future builders.

[Rasmus]

Option: Assemble the suspension at R height and wind the coil over collars up an extra 22 mm for inspection.

[Jim Schenck]

There haven't been any recent changes in the trim, not in the last year I would say (last one i can think of was for the rear hatch pin mounts last summer). My guess is that all of the info on the forum build threads is benefitting later builders more than any other factor. Also the change to red was done to help with panel quality so that may be helping as well in the very recent builds.

[RM1SepEx]

Re material for spacers... doesn't really matter, basically a custom diameter and thickness washer. I have 3 friends with machining capabilities and I move the work around... :D any stainless makes a great washer, whatever stock they have on hand. You know how it is scrounging engineers always have stock hanging around from other projects! I just donated a chunk of aluminum for a steering wheel adapter and six 6mm screws to another 818 builder... you never buy exactly what you need and those favors come back over and over!

[xxguitarist]

Option: Assemble the suspension at R height and wind the coil over collars up an extra 22 mm for inspection.

That could definitely work. We weren't sure there was enough collar range left to put the car at 22" headlight height.



Re material for spacers... doesn't really matter, basically a custom diameter and thickness washer. I have 3 friends with machining capabilities and I move the work around... :D any stainless makes a great washer, whatever stock they have on hand. You know how it is scrounging engineers always have stock hanging around from other projects! I just donated a chunk of aluminum for a steering wheel adapter and six 6mm screws to another 818 builder... you never buy exactly what you need and those favors come back over and over!

Yep, just wondering if you'd found a good source of stock. I hate machining most stainless steels.

[Hindsight]

I like the milled control arms.... though I'm wondering where you are hiding a milling machine in there?!

[JAubin]

Looking like you guys are off to a great start! One thing before you paint your shock mount brackets, is to check the fit of the bolts...mine and some others hit the welds on the end you have towards the ball joint hole. Needs some grinding (tho a quick shot with the right size end mill would be easiest) just annoying to have to do after you've painted/powdered it.

[xxguitarist]

I like the milled control arms.... though I'm wondering where you are hiding a milling machine in there?!
Thanks! Seemed good to give them a flat surface to set upon, same for the nuts.
We hide it right next to the blasting cabinet, on the other side of the lathe & bandsaw.. at work!


Looking like you guys are off to a great start! One thing before you paint your shock mount brackets, is to check the fit of the bolts...mine and some others hit the welds on the end you have towards the ball joint hole. Needs some grinding (tho a quick shot with the right size end mill would be easiest) just annoying to have to do after you've painted/powdered it.

I think I see where you're talking about- the weld bead protrudes into the head surface area of the bolt?
I'll grind that, not try and mill it. Welds are HARD. Thanks!

[Frank818]

One thing before you paint your shock mount brackets, is to check the fit of the bolts...mine and some others hit the welds on the end you have towards the ball joint hole. Needs some grinding (tho a quick shot with the right size end mill would be easiest) just annoying to have to do after you've painted/powdered it.

You bet! Got caught by that as well.

[wleehendrick]

Yep, just wondering if you'd found a good source of stock. I hate machining most stainless steels.

I bought some additional SS spacer material from onlinemetals.com, cut to length I needed. They can be a little over, so you may need to grind a bit to fit.

[xxguitarist]

Tonight I spent some quality time with my mitutoyo 0.0001 mic and the crankshaft (once I found it).

Subaru does a good job with those cranks. 0.0002 variance across all 4 rod positions, some of which was due to the garage cooling down. I'll re-check them with the garage door closed another night, and pick the rod bearings at the same time/temp.

I've also gotten more comfortable with the fowler bore gauge. It takes a little getting used to the way that it works, since it's all relative measurements, instead of absolutes. It is pretty easy to work with though, once you're used to it.
Say the crank measures 2.0469, you can either set it with "0" there, or at 2.050, using the mic either way, and do a little more math. It has a minimum hold feature, so you can rock it back and forth to make sure you're reading the shortest path, and the side ..wheels, for lack of a better term.. keep you from accidentally measuring off-center.

[Tamra]

Well, made some progress last night and today:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/roller_zps719f030f.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/roller_zps719f030f.jpg.html)

Nothing is torqued yet, and the seats are just set in for fitment purposes (Craigslist find we picked up today! Sparco Corsa seats). The wheels are also for sale, as we will be using Enkei PFO1's as our dailies, and undecided on the race ones, but they worked for the photo op :)


Current plan is to run 500lb springs on the front. Based on other build threads, it sounded like we could not fit them inverted with the sway bar, so just installed them "normal" for now. We will be doing the castor mod as well, but still need to make the spacer.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/frontsuspension_zps69ced929.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/frontsuspension_zps69ced929.jpg.html)

Photo is a little dark, but here are the rears. Running them inverted, 300lb rear springs.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/rearsuspension_zps388d2813.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/rearsuspension_zps388d2813.jpg.html)

An unpleasant byproduct of assembling the axles today was the fact that our central air furnace is in the basement, which is attached to the garage... went out for awhile to pick up the seats, came back, and we were BLASTED with CV grease smell all through our house. Yuck! Guess I'll just tell friends and co-workers I found a new perfume and try to make it a fad...

Test fit the new Sparco Corsa seats we picked up off CL. Man these things are comfy and fit just right! Andrew is 5'11" and 175lbs and they fit him perfectly... wouldn't want to be much larger.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/seats_zps652a6845.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/seats_zps652a6845.jpg.html)

Pretty excited about the progress!
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/us_zps62b4d187.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/us_zps62b4d187.jpg.html)

[Hindsight]

Wow, you two are really making quick progress. Keep up the momentum!

[Tamra]

Took today off to go to probably the last autocross of the season. It was the 50th anniversary of the Tri-State Challenge, so I ended up co-driving an rx-7, Andrew was in a 350z, and a friend of ours drove our Miata (it was musical cars). Connecticut won the challenge, and I ended up with my best finish of the year - 4th by raw and 7th by pax out of 75 drivers!! (Owner of car was ftd raw and pax). Andrew also won cs in the z, and we were shown our Miata's potential through it's 3rd place overall pax finish by our friend that drives at national level events frequently. Fun day and a great finish to our first season autocrossing!

We will try to get the time lapse up of installing the suspension tomorrow.

Also, thanks everyone for the tips. The shock mount bracket tip and the bending rather than hammering tip worked great!

[RM1SepEx]

Sounds like an awesome day!

Our autox season is done, I did get 5th pax out and 2nd raw of over 100 @ our last event at BNAS.

The two of you need to come visit and do an event or two up here! We will have a couple 2 day events, we have the best site in the NE!

Live by the golden rule... due unto others (first) as you wish they would for you

This forum is just full of helpful knowledgeable people, couldn't build w/o it!

[Tamra]

Time lapse of the suspension! :


http://youtu.be/7AvHQz2YDio


Dan, will do next year! Hopefully with the 818 :)

[RM1SepEx]

www.cumberlandmotorclub.com also on facebook the BNAS concrete is very aggressive... My 818 will be ready for events next year as well... I can put you in one of my two DD2 shifters too

[Tamra]

www.cumberlandmotorclub.com also on facebook the BNAS concrete is very aggressive... My 818 will be ready for events next year as well... I can put you in one of my two DD2 shifters too

That sounds fun. Let's plan on it sometime next summer!

[Tamra]

We played with mounting our 27mm Cobb sway bar last night to get an idea of it will fit. We can get it in there (this is NOT an easy in and out swap design like our Miata... it required disconnecting the top of the coilovers) and it has plenty of clearance on the inside toward the coilovers, but not so much on the outside. We adjusted the upper control arms more toward positive camber (we started with it adjusted all the way tight for max camber) and got it to stop hitting. The next issue is going to be how far we can turn the wheel before it hits.

Positive camber:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/A0F1503C-2C92-4A98-906E-3330E7375E90_zpso6m2wb4s.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/A0F1503C-2C92-4A98-906E-3330E7375E90_zpso6m2wb4s.jpg.html)


But it does clear:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/AA9F87B8-C561-4D40-BD36-324571CFB312_zpswkkehxzk.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/AA9F87B8-C561-4D40-BD36-324571CFB312_zpswkkehxzk.jpg.html)

But not so much when we turn the wheel...
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/ADE39A83-EFB1-485C-8401-6310EAC13AAE_zpslgfosmyt.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/ADE39A83-EFB1-485C-8401-6310EAC13AAE_zpslgfosmyt.jpg.html)

We're not sure yet whether it will be the sort of thing where we can cut off the last two adjustment points on the sway (basically be limited to full stiff) and then have full turning radius. We're going to wait and see, because we want to make sure that we can get at least a certain amount of negative camber out of the front.

For now, we'll leave the sway on, but we will have to decide later if it is too limiting in terms of turning radius and camber adjustments. If so, we'll be looking at either a new sway or something custom. Also, 27mm is a HUGE front sway. We prefer an understeer biased car, but we'll have to see if it is too much... if it even fits.

For reference, the wheels are Enkei PFO1's, 17x8, 45 offset.

[metalmaker12]

Looking really good guys, I don't even have the sway bar in, but it looks like some cutting will prob have to happen unless you can space out the bar off the mounting points just enough to clear. I am getting my motor back tomorrow, so over the next month I should have it all together and back to a running cart. Then the finished body will be back on and presto. If you guys are going to be around set up to stop by nicks or my place. I am in Exeter R.I which is not to far from CT border, when there done we gotta have meets. Happy building, looks like your both having fun.

[Hindsight]

Looking good!

I think you can get away with a 35mm offset in the front, and still clear the fenders. Have you considered adding 10mm wheel spacers to see if it will improve the sway bar clearance?

[Tamra]

Looking really good guys, I don't even have the sway bar in, but it looks like some cutting will prob have to happen unless you can space out the bar off the mounting points just enough to clear. I am getting my motor back tomorrow, so over the next month I should have it all together and back to a running cart. Then the finished body will be back on and presto. If you guys are going to be around set up to stop by nicks or my place. I am in Exeter R.I which is not to far from CT border, when there done we gotta have meets. Happy building, looks like your both having fun.


Whose's Nick? Otherwise, that sounds great! We'll definitely be in RI at Thanksgiving time. Not sure what your family/work schedule is, but maybe we could work out some time the day before/after. We'd love to check out your car.



Looking good!

I think you can get away with a 35mm offset in the front, and still clear the fenders. Have you considered adding 10mm wheel spacers to see if it will improve the sway bar clearance?

Yep, we'll definitely be looking at spacers. We are using the wheels to get a baseline idea of what we can fit before buying our race set up. We're going to try to fit 235/40/17's in the front, so it will take some modification. For our race wheels, fender flares might be in the car's future, at least in the front, so we aren't concerned about pushing the wheels out.


On the swaybar note, one thing we just realized is that the sway bar is currently sitting perfectly parallel to the ground (no more rotation downward due to the exhaust cutout portion hitting the frame), but the wheels are at full droop. When we add the end links they will be locked in that position relative to the control arms, which will put them way out of parallel to the ground when the car is set on the ground and the suspension is moved upward by multiple inches. Anyone else know how they are handling this? We're assuming this is not ideal, as we've always been taught that the sway arms should be parallel to the ground. If we adjust it back to parallel with weight on the car, then we are concerned of the effect midcorner when the car cannot droop a wheel due to the sway hitting the frame and holding the wheel up. Maybe we are just thinking of this wrong though... any thoughts?

We could space it off frame more like Metalmaker mentioned, which would give it more rotation...but then it would also push it out toward wheel interference issues. hmmmm this will be fun to play with :) Andrew's thinking custom front mount sway bar with tubing and welded end plates, but we'll have to see.

[metalmaker12]

Nicks, stickshift84

Yeah let me know which day is good for you, just got motor back!!

[Tamra]

Nicks, stickshift84

Yeah let me know which day is good for you, just got motor back!!

That would be great. Yup, we've chatted with Nick a bit on the forums. It'd be great to meet both of you guys. We'll touch base as it gets closer.

[Tamra]

We spent most of today doing the unfortunate required things in prep for winter... swapped the summers for the snows on both 3's and the Miata, and an oil change. Completely cleared out the entire basement to try to determine the source of a musty smell we picked up this week. Pretty sure it was the rear wagon seats, as they had some mold starting on them. Off to the dump they went along with all of the carpet from the donor, and our basement smells good now. Hoping when we wake up in the morning it will still smell good. Also picked up all the leaves in the yard and weed-wacked. Might or might not have had the fire department called on us when we tried burning some of the leaves... whoops. For the record, it was contained to our fire pit!

On the car, we worked on the rod bearings tonight. The King Bearings are outstanding in their tolerances. We managed to get clearances of .00215 to .00230 as the largest variance. We are running slightly looser clearances for the higher rev goals of the engine.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/64F78D9F-5E26-40BE-B1F4-9F559B21C343_zpsey6r4sb7.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/64F78D9F-5E26-40BE-B1F4-9F559B21C343_zpsey6r4sb7.jpg.html)
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/49D01FA0-A0AB-45D6-9D56-E5784CABB770_zps52ezyafu.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/49D01FA0-A0AB-45D6-9D56-E5784CABB770_zps52ezyafu.jpg.html)


Tomorrow we will work on the main bearings and *hopefully* close up the short block.

[metalmaker12]

Exciting, double/ triple check it all. Have fun is most important.

[Tamra]

Well, today had some highs and lows.

Highs included getting the main bearings measured (wow that took forever. We checked them so many times we lost count, and kept mixing and matching the STD and STDX ones to get the right clearance), we painted pretty much all of the panels (hoping to prevent aluminum corrosion), and met Glynn (Scargo). Overall, it was a great day!

The low included our worst CL buyer experience ever. The guy, who was not very literate and used "bro" and "yo" alot, bought our 02 WRX wagon doors, not realizing they wouldn't fit a sedan (they were clearly advertised as wagon doors). We then missed his call back, which was followed by an additional 25 calls, ending with threatening us saying " I know your address and I'm going to come get my money back." We did not meet him at our house, but we were pretty worried regardless. We got the police involved (boy were they not nice or helpful, and told us that it didn't qualify as a threat since he didn't threaten to physically harm us), but finally the police officer agreed to call the guy back for us and have him meet us at the police department to give them their money back, in exchange for us getting the doors back. He showed up with a big thug looking guy that even made the police officer nervous, but at least we hope the guy is happy and will leave us alone.

On that note, CL is still our big winner, with $2820 in parts sales, followed by Nasioc $1445, ebay at $1110, and a local forum at $600, for a total of just under $6k in parts sales to date.

Time for some well earned wine and scotch...

[Tamra]

Double checked the mains again this evening just to be sure after everything had sat in a consistent temperature for awhile. They are sitting at 1.6 - 1.8 thou on #1,3,& 5, and 2.2 thou on 2 & 4, intermixing two STDX and the rest STD.

The rods were straight STDX to get the 2.15 to 2.3 thou clearances, but they were on new rods and a new crank, which makes sense.

We also washed the block, and started figuring out how to gap the rings. Boy this engine stuff is exhausting. I'm sure we are overly stressing about it and checking everything way too many times.

Tomorrow we will actually gap the rings (planning on larger gap - 20 thou top and 22 or 24 bottom, due to our higher rev application). The JE rings measured tight for a 99.75 bore (around 14 thou).

We are not looking forward to figuring out how to actually assemble the short block... the whole long rod thing means the wrist pins won't line up the same with the access holes, so it could require some creativity.

Let us know if you see any issues with these clearances and if you have any tips on assembling the block.

[Jaime]

the whole long rod thing means the wrist pins won't line up the same with the access holes

Shorter or longer is not a problem - the pistons slide. As long as the wrist pin holes aren't offset (more than stock), they will eventually line up with the access holes. You just might have to turn the crank a few more degrees to get them to drop another few millimeters.

[Tamra]

So these JE Piston rings are going to be the death of us. First off, we had an "oops" earlier this week and overground one. We called JE, and good news, found out that bore x .006 was what we should be shooting for (and what our "oops" amounted to). Tonight, went to start gapping the rings to this new spec, and on the very first one, we picked up by hand and with just a slight squeeze it just snapped in half! We weren't using any tools, just by hand went to place it in the cylinder, and it cracked. We can't find any one else that has had this happen per Google. Well that's a confidence booster in JE rings. Anyone know what other rings we could substitute with? We are going to try calling some local shops in the morning to see if they have any in stock.

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/13FB04BC-8F08-4728-B5E1-0DB477C6A414_zpsad6cmuuh.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/13FB04BC-8F08-4728-B5E1-0DB477C6A414_zpsad6cmuuh.jpg.html)

On a more happy note, our twin scroll header and up-pipe arrived today. We aren't sure yet whether the up-pipe will work (will require a T4 flange welded on and EWG's added at minimum). If we can't make it work, then Moore Performance has an up-pipe solution that will work, it'll just cost more.

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/6CBB6FAA-8FEA-4E0E-BF49-341595C2B85C_zpsgrcu9n6r.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/6CBB6FAA-8FEA-4E0E-BF49-341595C2B85C_zpsgrcu9n6r.jpg.html)
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/B81389CD-5AE7-4AC4-9AA8-8E23052D0ABF_zpsqkxdqwnr.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/B81389CD-5AE7-4AC4-9AA8-8E23052D0ABF_zpsqkxdqwnr.jpg.html)

[xxguitarist]

For the record, I haven't been rock climbing for quite a few months. I don't have superhuman grip strength (anymore ;))

The ring wasn't squished down enough to even fit into the bore, nevermind anywhere close to the gap closing up. Heat treating issue?

[metalmaker12]

The learning curve...I have not broken one yet. Knock on wood!! I have not seen or used JE since my GSR days ( at least 13 years ago) and I think since then they have made thinner rings for better heat dissipation etc. Which has made some people really hate installing them. I am really unsure of the use of other rings, I have only ever used the rings that came with the pistons, so I am pretty certain that's what the pistons you have will use. I have only used cp on subaru motors so my knowledge is with cp with EJs. I will ask my friends at Wicked about the ring comparability. Good luck

[Tamra]

Thanks. The weird thing is we weren't even installing them yet. We were still just taking measurements - no ring compressor or piston or anything. We are thinking it had to have had a manufacturer's defect to shatter so easily. Just glad it didn't actually make it into our engine.

[metalmaker12]

Thanks. The weird thing is we weren't even installing them yet. We were still just taking measurements - no ring compressor or piston or anything. We are thinking it had to have had a manufacturer's defect to shatter so easily. Just glad it didn't actually make it into our engine.

That is bothering me and it's your motor. My bud from Wicked does not use JE often in subaru builds but says they should be a good choice to use if everything specs out. The reason he does not use them much is he has seen some imperfections in there quality on the subaru stuff in the more recent years. It could just be a defect, but that's not a defect you want. I have not seen any wide spread issues with there rings, there actually considered to be some of the strongest made. You gotta remember there made very hard and they are sorta brittle. When they get heated they soften a bit. The pistons really need to warm up to work correctly and not damage ****. You might have just bent them to much, but still I have never broken one. I see it to be very hard to break it by measuring it and moving it around. The others are all ok I presume. Hopefully just an isolated issue.

Chris

[Tamra]

Do these look right? Seems that the panels might have changed since the manual?

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/1D14224A-521F-4699-A522-AC8D12D705FF_zps32xjqt9i.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/1D14224A-521F-4699-A522-AC8D12D705FF_zps32xjqt9i.jpg.html)
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/C33672C1-95BB-4260-A875-DDBAE5BC4F15_zpsjschscar.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/C33672C1-95BB-4260-A875-DDBAE5BC4F15_zpsjschscar.jpg.html)

[Jaime]

That's right. Mine fit better with the coolant passage cover on top of the dead pedal.

[Tamra]

Thank you!

[mikeb75]

My passenger side panels did not align up as well as the driver side ones did; but I was able to tuck both the vertical dead pedal and coolant cover panels tabs behind the other pieces so the only tabs showing are the bottom ones on the floor. It took a few hours of looking and manipulating them to get everything lined up.

[Frank818]

It changed since the manual and mine did not line up very well as well. I had to trim them and modify many angles to force them in.

[metalmaker12]

35824heres mine.

I am sure the triangle piece goes over the dead pedal as pictured in the paper weight picture book your using, I am unsure if that aluminum has actually had a revision. I would ask FFR if it has because the tab on the dead pedal is telling me that the triangle piece goes over it.

[Tamra]

Well the front firewall is fully riveted (and all panels painted, which took well over 12 hours to do - our hope is to prevent aluminum corrosion, so they are still painted aluminum color. A lot of work for not much visual difference now! lol), one dead pedal is in (waiting on a 2nd one for the driver side, with idea of reinforcing it), steering rack and steering column are on (we can steer!!!!), and pedal box is in (going to install the gas pedal tomorrow). Our piston rings are also due tomorrow.

We are at 63.5 hours of work since we picked up our kit (15 hours on engine, 48.5 on build). We also just passed $6k in parts sales from the donor car! The only parts we are directly replacing that we sold are the pistons and turbo ($500), so far (headers, up-pipe, rods, etc. are still for sale as all of those will be new in this build).

For mounting the master cylinder, we did as others on the forum and shaved the bolt heads so they would fit. We also switched to 1.5" long bolts rather than the provided 1" ones:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/75203EBF-3E23-4C3D-BFFC-1CC5A8DF7519_zpsgacxnxdt.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/75203EBF-3E23-4C3D-BFFC-1CC5A8DF7519_zpsgacxnxdt.jpg.html)

Steering wheel and pedals!
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/6871FA79-7A03-4685-A42B-045E0174B623_zpswd041hid.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/6871FA79-7A03-4685-A42B-045E0174B623_zpswd041hid.jpg.html)

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/6BE18E31-6BA5-43ED-A636-6419B3259640_zps5zt7rpx9.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/6BE18E31-6BA5-43ED-A636-6419B3259640_zps5zt7rpx9.jpg.html)

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Hi Tamra and Andrew,
You guys are doing a great job. Keep up the good work.
I noticed that your steering rack doesn't look parallel to the frame. It might just be the camera angle. Take a look.
Bob
35893

[xxguitarist]

Bob,
I agree. On closer inspection, the 05+ spec spacers that I used to mount the passenger side are holding the steering rack off of the frame mount a little, despite full contact with the FFR U bracket.
The 02 spec spacers which I initially tried would have resulted in crushing the wall of the steering rack or bending the U bracket before the bolts bottomed on the spacers.

The rubber mount is not quite in full contact with the frame tab on that side, so I'll see about spacing the U bracket off of the frame until the rack moves back down to the parallel position. Anyone else had a problem here?

[Frank818]

My U bracket (passenger's side) bent when my mech torqued the bolt, but nothing moved and everything seems to hold very tight, I'm not even sure I'll try to re-do his installation (so many I will but this one I don't think so).

[RM1SepEx]

I had to make a custom mount, but I think those issues were only with early frames...

[xxguitarist]

I could have bent the bracket while bolting it on, but that seemed very wrong.

I went to the longer spacers, which set it firmly in place, but with the rubber part not making full contact on the bottom.
I will probably make a spacer to out the u bracket farther off the outside of the frame, then switch back to the smaller spacers that are called for on the 02.

[Tamra]

Timelapse of the panels, some of the engine, and the pedals (sorry on the pedals, our app cut-out, so missed most of the install and all of the steering wheel):


http://youtu.be/boMV4KAMTVY?list=PLdc0PjaUSDO8Onql4wMLRWNF38IyIAyD R

[RM1SepEx]

I could have bent the bracket while bolting it on, but that seemed very wrong.

I went to the longer spacers, which set it firmly in place, but with the rubber part not making full contact on the bottom.
I will probably make a spacer to out the u bracket farther off the outside of the frame, then switch back to the smaller spacers that are called for on the 02.

I think that between Bob in Cincy, Craig and I last year we determined that there is a huge variation in steering racks. We found that the fluid port positions varied and interfered with the brackets too. I ended up using my air die grinder to modify the bracket (worked through 3 revs with FFR) never could get the arc right to sit the rack into it properly. Also ended up shortening the ears of the bracket and making my own, custom length spacers to get everything lined up right. IIRC it was around this time last year. Early builds also had racks that were mounted too far to the left. You could cheat it to the middle and have more rack travel in one direction vs the other (FFR soln) or move the rack or extend the tie rod or rack itself...

keep smiling, you will get through it.

[metalmaker12]

I made my own spacers and brackets guys, it was not that much effort. I would think by now they had it down.It looks like FFR might still need to revisit the rack mounting to get it right. You will get it, your doing great so far. You get rings in, I hope that's settled.

[Tamra]

We got the short block together today (finally)!!!!!

The start:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/45DAF5F0-B706-4959-8AE2-475F6C26B347_zpsmhtx5aaq.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/45DAF5F0-B706-4959-8AE2-475F6C26B347_zpsmhtx5aaq.jpg.html)

The rings went together much easier this time. We went for 22 thou top gap 25 thou bottom gap per recommendation from JE for our application. Our ring compressor did the job perfectly and they were easy to pop into the cylinders with some pressure by hand.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/F2092AD7-A8C0-48C3-9B0F-6AC2AC4A2B25_zpsqvvt7eu4.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/F2092AD7-A8C0-48C3-9B0F-6AC2AC4A2B25_zpsqvvt7eu4.jpg.html)

The long-rod build made things a little tricky, so we had to go out of order from the FSM. We put the pistons in first.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/4FE4B16C-158E-41B9-A0EF-8213F5669C83_zpsop40bnlg.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/4FE4B16C-158E-41B9-A0EF-8213F5669C83_zpsop40bnlg.jpg.html)

We next put in the crank and rods. With the +2mm rods and -2mm crank, it made the piston pins not line up with the access holes. The line up is nearly at bottom dead center on a standard build, and it's past it for this. Therefore, we had to keep the case a few millimeters apart to get everything lined up.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/5AB73E42-E133-40C2-9951-C14244F7DAF0_zpsmuoo7fig.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/5AB73E42-E133-40C2-9951-C14244F7DAF0_zpsmuoo7fig.jpg.html)

We were able to shift the crank back and forth to get the pins lined up:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/C535D277-A09D-407F-A7D9-CA8086A90C48_zpsjisb7wwd.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/C535D277-A09D-407F-A7D9-CA8086A90C48_zpsjisb7wwd.jpg.html)

We next figured out that our c-clip pliers would not fit through the access holes. We sacrificed some needle nose pliers to the task and ground off the tips to fit in the c-clips. It worked flawlessly, especially on piston 3 which was the deepest to reach in to. The added length and narrowness of the pliers was perfect for the job.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/1A1BE07C-5B3E-4DE0-9DBA-50817A6F255C_zps58yxieh2.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/1A1BE07C-5B3E-4DE0-9DBA-50817A6F255C_zps58yxieh2.jpg.html)

[Tamra]

With all of the pins in, we separated the case halves so we could apply the silicone and add the gaskets.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/7AB8E271-783E-491B-B7A2-CE1713E3B487_zpsqoih2ryc.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/7AB8E271-783E-491B-B7A2-CE1713E3B487_zpsqoih2ryc.jpg.html)

Side bonus, it made putting in the rear main seal an easy task (the FSM has you bolt up and torque the case prior to putting the pistons in, making the rear main seal a difficult task).
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/0068F2E7-57E4-47C0-948A-5E1363550B6C_zpszefibdh8.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/0068F2E7-57E4-47C0-948A-5E1363550B6C_zpszefibdh8.jpg.html)

All done!
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/23702724-EF24-46B0-9DE8-B0FC229DE8F1_zpslaa30iag.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/23702724-EF24-46B0-9DE8-B0FC229DE8F1_zpslaa30iag.jpg.html)


Next we will be putting on the heads and measuring for shimless buckets.


Oh yeah, and for anyone wanting some good general tips on how to assemble a short-block, we found this video helpful:

http://youtu.be/-gmtEQ1GpmA

[Tamra]

Time lapse of the short block assembly!

http://youtu.be/yTx5M11dl6k

[metalmaker12]

Nice job!

[Tamra]

Last night and today were productive again!
Got the heads bolted on:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/4AB41D9F-5E1D-4CC2-A1D0-5607224B0945_zpsqivrqmce.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/4AB41D9F-5E1D-4CC2-A1D0-5607224B0945_zpsqivrqmce.jpg.html)

Gas tank assembled:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/252C33D4-6627-4049-9752-CDCE1CB9B49D_zpsoamw0yfd.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/252C33D4-6627-4049-9752-CDCE1CB9B49D_zpsoamw0yfd.jpg.html)

Started to torque the camshafts in to measure for shimless buckets (picked up 4 of Subaru's smallest shimless buckets, 4.38mm). Oh wait, that wasn't supposed to happen......
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/668BFF0B-F139-4356-A4F6-573EFA7D7879_zpsruhabgg7.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/668BFF0B-F139-4356-A4F6-573EFA7D7879_zpsruhabgg7.jpg.html)

Got it out uneventfully, thankfully:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/276D500E-C961-49A1-BBDA-674D3E49591F_zpsptceklkb.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/276D500E-C961-49A1-BBDA-674D3E49591F_zpsptceklkb.jpg.html)

NOTE: THE SUBARU FACTORY SERVICE MANUAL HAS A MISPRINT. YOU DO NOT TORQUE ALL OF THE CAMSHAFT BOLTS AT 14.5 FT LBS. YOU TORQUE THE TWO SMALLER FRONT ONES AT 7FT LBS. Please learn from our mistake... (and thank you Nasioc)

Thankfully, the rest of the measuring went smoothly and pretty quickly, so now we can get our shimless buckets (and some new camshaft bolts) ordered.

[Hindsight]

Whew, glad you were able to get the bolt out! You two are making amazing progress.

[Tamra]

Whew, glad you were able to get the bolt out! You two are making amazing progress.

Thank you. We have a slightly optimistic goal to have first start by Christmas, so we are trying to push at it a little each day. The engine keeps trying to set us back though!

On the bolt, when it broke we nearly had a heart attack there for a while.

When we first went to torque it (it was the first of the two smaller front bolts), something didn't feel right (we could feel it stretching, whereas the other larger bolts just tightened up and and clicked on the torque wrench). So, we un-torqued everything and pulled it back out, checked it and the head, seemed fine, and then went at it again, then "pop." Crap.

Luckily, as soon as we went at it with a LH drill the bolt actually backed itself out. We at first assumed it was just a bad bolt, so went at it again with one of the other crankshaft's bolts. It felt the same way (could feel that "stretching" feel again), and that's when we stopped and started "Nasiocing" and found out those were supposed to be only 7 ft lbs. We are just going to start with a set of 8 brand new smaller bolts, just in case any of the others were over torqued in their life due to the FSM's misprint.

[Hindsight]

You are lucky it came out so easy. That almost never happens for me. But usually the bolts that break on me are siezed up and do so on removal attempt. I have always had to drill them out and add a helicoil. Major pain. I have also experienced that sinking feeling of over torquing a bolt into aluminum.

RE the manual, what year manual are you using? I checked my 06 manual and it does show the proper torque numbers (7 and 14 or something). If you two would like a copy, PM me your email and I will send it.

[Tamra]

It is for an 02 wrx, which our heads are. Seems like it is just the instructions for the EJ205 that has the misprint, based other nasioc posts.

[metalmaker12]

It's off for the 02 bugeye, but than I believe got revised at some point once subaru techs starting breaking them. I prob should have mentioned that, but it has been like 10-12 years since I lived your pain, Great job getting it out, that's not always such a treat. I am hopeing to cart by Christmas, life's been busy lately or I would be driving it around again.

[Tamra]

LOL thanks Chris. Any other tips? The ones we found today were mostly lack of torque specs, including the valve cover gaskets (about 4 ft lbs, btw) and a few things.

We had today off, and our local Subaru dealership in Milford, CT (Dan Perkin's Subaru - speak with Gene if you ever call for parts) got our shimless buckets today, that we ordered yesterday! Also the 8 camshaft bolts and a few other assorted parts. Such great timing since we were holed up due to the snow today.

We torqued the head bolts for the 3rd or 4th time (ARP recommends re-torquing, and we actually got movement after our initial torque to the 2nd torque, but none after that). We installed the shimless buckets, torqued the cam shafts, and double checked the clearances on the shimless buckets to the camshafts using our feeler gauges - .010 for the exhaust, and .008 for the intake, and we were good to go. Closed up the valve covers!

Question for the Subaru gurus - do these threaded plugs that we marked in pink go in these locations? The machine shop pulled them out. They seem like they are just filler caps of a sort. There is also one on the backside of the engine where it meets the transmission.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/35FF20EA-8074-4023-BF8F-CDD7519C1F88_zpscfusibzs.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/35FF20EA-8074-4023-BF8F-CDD7519C1F88_zpscfusibzs.jpg.html)

Next we added a shim to our 10mm oil pump (for a total of 3 shims, not sure if it had been previously modified). It seems like this is an area where everyone has a different opinion of what is the best way to go. From our research, it sounds like the 10mm pump should flow enough oil for our non-AVCS heads (AVCS heads should use the 11mm). The biggest issue is when the bypass valve opens and the effect it has. The 10mm pump is set to open the bypass valve at 85 psi, it drops to 75psi for the 11mm pump I believe. The more oil that is bypassed, the more everything heats up. Also, the risk of the oil beginning to aerate increases as the revs go up, due to the oil bypassing faster and faster. When the oil aerates, it can cause a sudden drop in oil pressure, which would not be good. Since we are planning on revving this engine higher than stock, this is critical for us to get right. Adding shims increases the psi that the bypass valve opens. This puts more pressure on the system overall, but will decrease the risk of us losing oil pressure at high rpms and with our increased bearing clearances. The real test will be when we start up the car and data-log and monitor the gauges. We will adjust the shims and/or the pump accordingly at that point.

Pulled this off:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/EE219356-0D4F-406C-B212-556C84FCE2F8_zpsetyonfrh.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/EE219356-0D4F-406C-B212-556C84FCE2F8_zpsetyonfrh.jpg.html)

Pulled out the little sleeve to find two shims, added one more, and closed it back up.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/7C44CFEB-51F7-45FD-9947-113DA0D9EB92_zpsk5u0jpbl.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/7C44CFEB-51F7-45FD-9947-113DA0D9EB92_zpsk5u0jpbl.jpg.html)

Then we just gave the engine a good polishing :)
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/C88DBA7B-A1CB-43D6-8673-C9EA38F13887_zps0tusb30s.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/C88DBA7B-A1CB-43D6-8673-C9EA38F13887_zps0tusb30s.jpg.html)

Just kidding... VHT Engine Enamel did the trick though (We had previously sand blasted it and it still didn't look great, but at least it prepped it for paint).

We hope everyone has a Happy Thanksgiving!

[metalmaker12]

Have a happy turkey day guys!! Looking great!!

[Tamra]

Came home from Thanksgiving to find Christmas! Wow, and this is the "little" Borg Warner... the S200SX 51mm with .83 a/r. At least we'll be able to ditch the water tank since all 24lbs of it is oil cooled!
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/B1139A90-14B8-4135-A829-A459BCAB0C73_zpspawck3ue.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/B1139A90-14B8-4135-A829-A459BCAB0C73_zpspawck3ue.jpg.html)

[Aero STI]

That's a great turbo, especially for the price.

[Samiam1017]

whats your plans for the uppipe and wastgate..

[Tamra]

Andrew has access to and practice with TIG equipment, but we aren't quite sure yet. We are going to get the engine in and then see if we can fab it ourselves (starting with our Kinugawa twin scroll up pipe). Moore Performance makes a rotated up pipe with a t4 flange solution for the Subarus also that we will check into if we don't think we can do it ourselves (again no guarantee of 818 fitment though).

Our plan is to run dual EWG's, 38mm TiALs.

We will hopefully know in a week or so if we think we can make it fit without rotating. The turbo is a little bigger than we expected, lol. Twin scroll should be fun!

[Tamra]

Another productive day! We took a few days off for Thanksgiving, so today was the first day of progress since our last update.

We shaved down the TGV rods a little further and got them put back together. This should allow for more air flow, without throwing any codes or causing any emissions issues. The center rod used to be the same thickness all the way across (we had already removed the flappers and smoothed out the walls previous to today).
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/E516749E-FD0E-4A7B-8300-01FDFC6262AE_zpsntzcdlxx.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/E516749E-FD0E-4A7B-8300-01FDFC6262AE_zpsntzcdlxx.jpg.html)

Put together:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/A1937615-8F5A-4301-9F3E-0FE7D33524CA_zpsreumsfns.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/A1937615-8F5A-4301-9F3E-0FE7D33524CA_zpsreumsfns.jpg.html)

For looping the coolant crossover tube to the hard black return line that attaches to the lower water pump nipple, we decided to cut it down and just run a soft hose to the water pump. As our turbo is oil cooled only, we do not need the other black hardline that runs to the passenger side of the engine.

The FFR plan would be to loop #1 (from the coolant crossover) and #2 in this photo together (ignore the blue, this was an idea we had that was scratched). FFR provides a u-shaped hose which works on newer 2.5 engines, in which #1 is placed directly next to #2. Not so much on our 2.0 coolant crossover pipe:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/photo21_zpsf6b9d789.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/photo21_zpsf6b9d789.jpg.html)

We cut the long tube coming up (#1 in the photo above) and flared the ends. This should allow us to put a soft hose on and loop it directly to the nipple on the water pump. This will bypass the heater core and provide the heated water from the engine back into the water pump (this is a return line) to heat the thermostat, which triggers it to open:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/80934BEF-16B4-4278-A72A-569D4D130F67_zpsv9sq1dc7.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/80934BEF-16B4-4278-A72A-569D4D130F67_zpsv9sq1dc7.jpg.html)

Installed:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/E666DDA7-4F5A-431F-A222-2A735F3A0FCD_zpsrl0jdjrw.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/E666DDA7-4F5A-431F-A222-2A735F3A0FCD_zpsrl0jdjrw.jpg.html)

We wrapped the engine harness:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/5D79757E-B0FE-4AE6-95B5-793AFB4EB30B_zpsl36wnwjt.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/5D79757E-B0FE-4AE6-95B5-793AFB4EB30B_zpsl36wnwjt.jpg.html)

[Tamra]

We mocked things up (no gaskets installed yet):
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/1C058AB8-9CE9-484B-8ED4-A236B1D62A04_zpsriw4ey4e.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/1C058AB8-9CE9-484B-8ED4-A236B1D62A04_zpsriw4ey4e.jpg.html)

I'll just list a few different angles in case anyone needs them for reference (particularly the electrical connectors), and in case you see anything we have done wrong:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/507BEF59-014A-4633-9205-88CB61048F02_zpssagzqq87.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/507BEF59-014A-4633-9205-88CB61048F02_zpssagzqq87.jpg.html)
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/84CDD463-2921-41CB-8D7B-4FC465C3080D_zpshiw1ir1h.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/84CDD463-2921-41CB-8D7B-4FC465C3080D_zpshiw1ir1h.jpg.html)
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/A977CBF2-AA1D-415A-B1F9-BC1D92186AAF_zpsrqcdzf5z.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/A977CBF2-AA1D-415A-B1F9-BC1D92186AAF_zpsrqcdzf5z.jpg.html)


This connector we could not find a home for. Any ideas?
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/B4676EB8-86B5-4DD5-93D6-6E9B4899793F_zpsorx71ei2.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/B4676EB8-86B5-4DD5-93D6-6E9B4899793F_zpsorx71ei2.jpg.html)

We will be replacing every rubber hose currently pictured. Here is a very handy list for anyone else doing the same thing:
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2614458

Thanks to Metros build thread (http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?12267-The-Start-of-a-Journey-Metros-Build-Thread/page4)for some helpful visuals as we were putting things together!

Also thanks to the Simplifying the EJ (http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?9288-Simplifying-the-EJ)thread for further assistance! As we will be street registering this car, we will be keeping all of the emissions equipment (or at least the appearance of it).

We'll be working on the fuel lines next. We picked up an STI FPR and will be running rubber lines in "parallel" format (really semi-parallel, as it will be 2S-2P). We also need to look into what turbo inlet options we have, which is still up in the air since we do not yet know the placement of our Borg Warner S200SX.

[Samiam1017]

I think it goes to the power steering pump.

[Ironhydroxide]

yep, power steering pump. ups the idle rev's when the pump kicks pressure out (iirc)

the other thing. the rubber hose that goes to the fitting on the front of the manifold (from the solenoid) that has a whole bunch of random "T"s on it, and that interesting looking black and tan thing.

this is the EVAP circuit. You can delete a LOT of the random "T"s and just go with the Solenoid from the manifold to the evap line from the tank/charcoal canister. Makes it much simpler and keeps the chance for boost/vacuum leaks down.

as for the plugs you were asking about. they are all OIL GALLEYS. make sure they're all sealed up good.
they are also really good for checking oil pressure and temperature. Just saying.

[Tamra]

I think it goes to the power steering pump.


yep, power steering pump. ups the idle rev's when the pump kicks pressure out (iirc)

the other thing. the rubber hose that goes to the fitting on the front of the manifold (from the solenoid) that has a whole bunch of random "T"s on it, and that interesting looking black and tan thing.

this is the EVAP circuit. You can delete a LOT of the random "T"s and just go with the Solenoid from the manifold to the evap line from the tank/charcoal canister. Makes it much simpler and keeps the chance for boost/vacuum leaks down.

as for the plugs you were asking about. they are all OIL GALLEYS. make sure they're all sealed up good.
they are also really good for checking oil pressure and temperature. Just saying.

Thanks guys, much appreciated. Guess that one's not getting deleted :)

Do you have any sort of a visual that shows the evap line routing you are talking about? We are all about simplifying, but we still need to be emissions compliant.

The plugs are all sealed up except for one, which we are going to add a t fitting off of for our oil pressure and oil temperature gauges.


New video from the engine build up. Our Timelapse loves to cut out at the exciting parts, so no intake manifold. But, it is the entire short block to long block assembly!

http://youtu.be/xjwMibuf-Qg?list=PLdc0PjaUSDO8Onql4wMLRWNF38IyIAyDR

[Aero STI]

This is going to be a nice high performance setup, ditch those TGVs!

I have a set of deletes and a ported/polished manifold for a drive by cable throttle if you need it.

[Ironhydroxide]

Nasioc has a write up about it. It doesn't throw any cel. And I highly doubt anyone who understands how the system came stock will blame you for simplifying it

[xxguitarist]

This is going to be a nice high performance setup, ditch those TGVs!

I have a set of deletes and a ported/polished manifold for a drive by cable throttle if you need it.

We would have liked to fully delete them, but this is a for-now compromise, unless our tuner can delete the code without a not-ready status


Nasioc has a write up about it. It doesn't throw any cel. And I highly doubt anyone who understands how the system came stock will blame you for simplifying it

I haven't seen anything about a CEL-free TGV delete option.. Do you have a link? My understanding was that it was just an easy code to delete, but CT is picky on not-ready sensors. I'm trying to avoid having to make a shortened version of the TGV rods to activate the sensors.

[Hindsight]

I asked Wayne that question and if we understood eachother correctly, he said ALL codes can be turned off in the ecu (not just cleared but totally disabled) and doing so will not effect readiness code. Might reach out to him or another experienced tuner to confirm.

[STiPWRD]

I haven't seen anything about a CEL-free TGV delete option.. Do you have a link? My understanding was that it was just an easy code to delete, but CT is picky on not-ready sensors. I'm trying to avoid having to make a shortened version of the TGV rods to activate the sensors.

All you'd have to do is drill out the actual valves off of the rods and shave away the metal from the interior runners of the aluminum housing. The rod would remain the same length and would be there to activate the sensors. I believe this is how you delete the valves without throwing a code and I was going to use this approach until I got a tactrix cable. Now I'm planning to completely delete the actuators, sensors, and rods and then clear the codes.

[Tamra]

Andrew is going to call a tuner today to ask about some other things, so we'll check on the TGV's and removing "not ready" codes as well.

Also, I found a diagram that explains which evap items can be eliminated around the "T" section that Iron mentioned. According to Nasioc, deleting these will not cause a CEL and shouldn't give us a problem passing emissions. We aren't 100% sure how closely they "inspect" during the CT inspection or if this would even matter, since it is still uses the charcoal canister, but we are going to try it this way. This is how the JDM ver7/8 STi cars are setup, apparently.

36190

[xxguitarist]

All you'd have to do is drill out the actual valves off of the rods and shave away the metal from the interior runners of the aluminum housing. The rod would remain the same length and would be there to activate the sensors. I believe this is how you delete the valves without throwing a code and I was going to use this approach until I got a tactrix cable. Now I'm planning to completely delete the actuators, sensors, and rods and then clear the codes.

That's exactly what is pictured above...and is our plan, unless the tuner says it can be taken care of with the Cobb. The flaps are removed, the aluminum divider is cut out.. and I also thinned out the profile of the rods when they're in the "open" position..

[STiPWRD]

That's exactly what is pictured above...and is our plan, unless the tuner says it can be taken care of with the Cobb. The flaps are removed, the aluminum divider is cut out.. and I also thinned out the profile of the rods when they're in the "open" position..

Ahh, couldn't see your pic - my work firewall blocks photobucket. The uploaded pics and other photo sites seem to work fine though. As long as you've removed the valves and aluminum, that takes care of most of the obstruction. I only want to delete the rods to use the tgv sensor 0-5V input for data logging temps.

[wleehendrick]

That's exactly what is pictured above...and is our plan, unless the tuner says it can be taken care of with the Cobb. The flaps are removed, the aluminum divider is cut out.. and I also thinned out the profile of the rods when they're in the "open" position..

I installed GrimmSpeed PnP'd TGV deletes; from what I've read, this should be straight-forward to delete the CEL with the Cobb AP3 once I fire it up. Regardless of what the OBDII reports, the visual inspection of our SMOG check would catch a full delete. Hope if works for you! Luckily, with the SB100 option in CA, I don't have to worry about emissions (ironic, huh?).

[Aero STI]

No restrictions... ;)

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a300/eqlized_aero/2013-02-28_18-35-00_282.jpg

[Hindsight]

Woah, why does that look sleeved?

[Tamra]

We spoke with the tuning shop. Although they can delete the "not ready" codes, we are worried about the visual inspection. We will finish the TGV deletes next winter, after it's road registered :)

Also, it sounds like we will be able to get a base-map for our build for initial start-up, so we will proceed with installing the ID1000 injectors!

Back a few to when we were discussing those oil plugs on the top of the engine that make good ports for oil pressure and temp gauges... FYI in case anyone else is looking to do the same, it sounds like the factory oil sensor, when removed, will not trigger the oil light on the cluster. We'll probably remove that one and just have oil pressure out of one and temp out of the other (there aren't any others that are easily accessible), rather than having to do a T off of one.

[Scargo]

I wonder if the DMV does any inspection for a "new" car or do you go to one of the stations that do inspections? I had a horrible experience with an inspection station that would not believe me that the Cobb downpipe had a cat in it. They saw a few mods and heard the car and told me to get lost. It would have passed had they not rejected me outright.
I may have a fitting that you can have that has a tap for oil temp or pressure. It works with AVCS fitting, however.
Motor looks great. You guys are doing great.

[D Clary]

I have always run my oil temp from the oil pan. If the sender is in the block it will get block temp, unlike the coolant temp that has fluid flow around it the oil ports are dead head for pressure so there is no flow and I don't think the temp is accurate

[metalmaker12]

We spoke with the tuning shop. Although they can delete the "not ready" codes, we are worried about the visual inspection. We will finish the TGV deletes next winter, after it's road registered :)

Also, it sounds like we will be able to get a base-map for our build for initial start-up, so we will proceed with installing the ID1000 injectors!

Back a few to when we were discussing those oil plugs on the top of the engine that make good ports for oil pressure and temp gauges... FYI in case anyone else is looking to do the same, it sounds like the factory oil sensor, when removed, will not trigger the oil light on the cluster. We'll probably remove that one and just have oil pressure out of one and temp out of the other (there aren't any others that are easily accessible), rather than having to do a T off of one.

Oil temp is best in pan guys. KB pan has a port and is a wise investment.

[Tamra]

I wonder if the DMV does any inspection for a "new" car or do you go to one of the stations that do inspections? I had a horrible experience with an inspection station that would not believe me that the Cobb downpipe had a cat in it. They saw a few mods and heard the car and told me to get lost. It would have passed had they not rejected me outright.
I may have a fitting that you can have that has a tap for oil temp or pressure. It works with AVCS fitting, however.
Motor looks great. You guys are doing great.
Thanks Glyn! The inspection for kit cars is only at one DMV location in Waterbury, no other options, so we'd better make a good first impression. It has to pass an emissions test separately as well. Do you know what the thread pitch is? We need M20x1.5 to 1/8NPT.


I have always run my oil temp from the oil pan. If the sender is in the block it will get block temp, unlike the coolant temp that has fluid flow around it the oil ports are dead head for pressure so there is no flow and I don't think the temp is accurate

We were thinking of the recently used oil temp as being beneficial to know as opposed to the reservoir temp, but didn't think about the temp not being accurate. That is something to consider for sure.


Oil temp is best in pan guys. KB pan has a port and is a wise investment.

We already have an STI oil pan. We are considering doing the oil temp from the pan, but just wanted to check clearance to the ground. As ours is OEM, it would have to be through the drain plug, which of course is at the lowest point.

[Tamra]

We installed our Killer B pickup and windage tray tonight, our new STI oil pan, and our new OEM oil cooler and oil filter. We decided to get a new oil cooler as insurance, since we didn't know the previous history of this motor (plus it had ACL bearings in it when we initially opened it up, meaning it had a bearing failure at some point in its life). After reading too many horror stories about not being able to get the metal particles out, we decided not to risk it (despite the fact that our existing oil cooler did not have any grit come out when I cleaned it).

In our excitement, we decided to test fit our Kinuguwa Twin Scroll Headers... only to find they didn't fit. They hit the STI oil pan and have about 1/4" before they would reach the heads. Has anyone experienced this? Any ideas on how to resolve the issue? We have reached out to Flatirons Tuning who we purchased the kit from and are awaiting their response.
The good news is that they sit flush with the pan with the 1/4" gap, so we hopefully shouldn't have too big of an issue with them hanging below the frame rails too far. Does anyone know if the STI oil pan hangs below the frame rails?

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/68BD296B-577E-4827-BDA9-7B988484FCDB_zpsmgl2yhah.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/68BD296B-577E-4827-BDA9-7B988484FCDB_zpsmgl2yhah.jpg.html)

[metalmaker12]

Sti pan does not hang below, the KB pan does barely and my headers kinda lined up with that pan. Uncommon headers usually always have fitment issues even the larger names have fitment issues, you might be able to heat the header tube and bend it just out of the way enough. That's what I do if it's close( up to a 1/4 clearance issue) over that and other mods might need to be done.

[ssssly]

Heat and a pry bar will fix those headers right up.

Those are actually not that bad. Have seen worse from Kinugawa. Decent headers, especially for the price, but they don't generally fit great out of the box.

I'd also suggest a GS 2x thick gasket for those.

[Scargo]

That's funny ssssly. "Have seen worse from Kinugawa". Hard to imagine. But then, one pair of my Full Race (FR) headers was almost as bad against the KB pan. A Moroso pan was not better, either. Did not check a stock STi pan... I ended up cutting about 2/3 through that pipe at the flange and just before the Y and inserting crescent-shaped pieces. That was with schedule 10, 316 SS pipe though. I wanted to get close to a half-inch clearance so I could wrap the hell out of it.
I suspect ssssly is right... that with that thin-wall 304 you can just heat and bend.

I've never heard of GS 2X gaskets before. My concern would be that you will bend the flanges if not extremely careful. Though possibly over-torqued, I have bent the FR 1/2" thick flanges, trying to insure that the gaskets didn't blow out. If your flanges are sitting crooked when loose prior to torquing, and you can't get them flat, then that thick gasket might make the difference.
With my track car I had constant problems with failing gaskets with the FR headers. They are rigid as hell to begin with and heat expansion and cycling seemed to loosen the gaskets in a hurry. Believe it or not, SS 3/8" ARP bolts made a big difference in the header to up-pipe connection. This was recommended by FR. Then I double-nutted the 12 point bolts. In my latest fix for the FR headers I am using staggered V-bands and Inconel bellows.
The pisser is that I believe FR headers are the most expensive ones you can buy and there's no weight savings. OTOH, you will never burn through them. ;)

[freds]

Previously posted in Assembly Tips:

Check That EVERY Flange is Flat
Valuable advice from Charles (Service Mngr. Gillman Subaru in Houston). None of the flanges on the exhaust parts that I have were "true flat", including the FFr after-turbo adapters. Some were terrible! and would almost certainly have leaked, if not immediately...pretty soon thereafter. (and I would probably have blamed the gaskets, and tightened the bolts unreasonably).

Time with a good straight edge and large flat file is time well spent. The flanges won't bend with "normal" torque, and relying on thick gaskets to deform unevenly across a flange surface is asking a lot.

[longislandwrx]

get a few extra studs, PN 800910550

in case you mess up the threads bending the header

[Scargo]

I have my mock-up engine you could borrow to do this bending on. I do not have oxy-acetylene (yet) but I do have a nice MAP gas torch if you want to come here and try bending it. Two torches-one for each end, would be best. You need an excuse to come visit... PS: I now have a 10" Logan lathe!

[Tamra]

Does anyone have a suggested method of how to bend the headers?

Glyn, that is very nice of you to offer. If we decide to go the route of bending the headers, then we will likely take you up on it.

What do you guys think about adding an exhaust flange to each side and getting longer exhaust studs? They are around 3/8" thick and would "lift" the headers off the pan.

[RM1SepEx]

Adding a flange doubles your opportunities for gasket failure but it should be workable and is a simple, elegant solution. I'd try it.

My headers needed to be tweaked a bit, I opened the holes a small amount to get them to start on the studs. I used a heat wrench to apply generalized heat and tightened them down slowly. When I removed them to go from stock 05 to STI pan and pickup etc... they slid right on the second installation. Time, stress and temperature did the trick

[Tamra]

Pretty sure we figured out the issue, and it's not with Kinuguwa. I bought an 04 sti pan, not realizing there were differences. The 06-07 is more cut-away in that location where the header hits. Anyone need an sti pan and don't have headers that loop between the oil cooler and pan? $90 and the pan is yours.

[FlatironsTuning]

We installed our Killer B pickup and windage tray tonight, our new STI oil pan, and our new OEM oil cooler and oil filter. We decided to get a new oil cooler as insurance, since we didn't know the previous history of this motor (plus it had ACL bearings in it when we initially opened it up, meaning it had a bearing failure at some point in its life). After reading too many horror stories about not being able to get the metal particles out, we decided not to risk it (despite the fact that our existing oil cooler did not have any grit come out when I cleaned it).

In our excitement, we decided to test fit our Kinuguwa Twin Scroll Headers... only to find they didn't fit. They hit the STI oil pan and have about 1/4" before they would reach the heads. Has anyone experienced this? Any ideas on how to resolve the issue? We have reached out to Flatirons Tuning who we purchased the kit from and are awaiting their response.
The good news is that they sit flush with the pan with the 1/4" gap, so we hopefully shouldn't have too big of an issue with them hanging below the frame rails too far. Does anyone know if the STI oil pan hangs below the frame rails?

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/68BD296B-577E-4827-BDA9-7B988484FCDB_zpsmgl2yhah.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/68BD296B-577E-4827-BDA9-7B988484FCDB_zpsmgl2yhah.jpg.html)

For what it is worth, it looks like the STI Oil Pan being used here is an early pan, and the 06+ pans design was changed, and should fit with the header with no issues. You can see that there is a "double dip" in the pan above, and the newer pans drop down lower, and make a single dip to clear the headers.

[D Clary]

While you have the pan off, you can weld a bung on the side for the oil temp sender.

[Tamra]

Now this is definitely better. The 06/07 sti pan is definitely different.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/4C3BCF58-FA01-4633-B33F-860A482D9AF5_zpstfld3edf.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/4C3BCF58-FA01-4633-B33F-860A482D9AF5_zpstfld3edf.jpg.html)

Our friend that works at subaru took this photo, showing the difference:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/56FC6218-7DC2-4797-8692-180231260FDA_zpsezjlmteo.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/56FC6218-7DC2-4797-8692-180231260FDA_zpsezjlmteo.jpg.html)

[metalmaker12]

I did not even notice you had old style Sti pan, congrats

[Scargo]

If you want it, I have a Moroso pan and all pieces. Increases capacity.
36229

[Tamra]

No more excuses... this baby is going into the 818 tomorrow! Only 75 hours spent from tear down to build up.... and we haven't even figured out our turbo solution yet or mounted the AWIC.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/273B65D0-2F67-40A2-BDBB-223A101F2A91_zps6ivpnjcs.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/273B65D0-2F67-40A2-BDBB-223A101F2A91_zps6ivpnjcs.jpg.html)

Okay, going back 9 hours earlier......

This tool is AMAZING. Did we mention amazing? Thank you to our friend who works at Subaru (10 min away from our house) and let us borrow it, putting the cam sprockets back on took less than 2 minutes.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/7DECAA93-7A0A-49FF-A5EC-54CFB15CA4E9_zpsfjpoxb8j.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/7DECAA93-7A0A-49FF-A5EC-54CFB15CA4E9_zpsfjpoxb8j.jpg.html)

Gates racing timing belt installed. This will have a more frequent change interval (30k miles), but should hold up to the high rpm's better.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/23DC59D5-3879-4DEA-AB28-85576C964A0B_zps4wqcc6hg.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/23DC59D5-3879-4DEA-AB28-85576C964A0B_zps4wqcc6hg.jpg.html)

Did I mention that the crankshaft tool is awesome too? Yup, such a simple tool, but made life so much easier.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/D8BA0603-111C-4D85-9628-A79441202C62_zps6wz3jk7x.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/D8BA0603-111C-4D85-9628-A79441202C62_zps6wz3jk7x.jpg.html)

We also cut down our power steering pump bracket to just make use of the tensioner. The bracket itself was surprisingly light on its own:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/DD774265-D51C-4308-AC1E-F972B31281D3_zpsdpoxxsuz.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/DD774265-D51C-4308-AC1E-F972B31281D3_zpsdpoxxsuz.jpg.html)


Fun video of our engine making its first noises! The rings haven't even been bedded in yet, but listen to that whistle!

http://youtu.be/LQTOCAJ5nkk?list=UUIE74vMoj4ykn7_8mHJ7Gnw

[Frank818]

This belt is awesome!!!! More awesome than your colorless sprocket tool. lolll

[Tamra]

Between the two of us, a friend, and an engine hoist, we got the engine and transmission into the car! We installed our ACT streetlite flywheel (14lbs vs the 24lb stocker) and South Bend Stage 2 Enduro Clutch and pressure plate (rated at 450 ft lbs torque, and the only organic clutch we could find that was rated this highly). Our Flywheel and pressure plate were also balanced by Larry's Power of Groton, CT.

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/8CE8877D-8B0C-4163-8A5E-3127A77B8A1B_zps8cyryyfg.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/8CE8877D-8B0C-4163-8A5E-3127A77B8A1B_zps8cyryyfg.jpg.html)

After a little more effort, the transmission was on, axles installed, and suspension put back into place. We are going to have some figuring to do for our BW S200SX turbo.... there's no way it's going to fit in the stock location, and even rotated might not work. It's looking like we will have to modify the cross brace. Oh, and the whole up-pipe situation is still TBD since it's a T-4 flange turbo...
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/CC6D7C74-800A-4901-89D9-1DEFEC9389C8_zpsql08cpna.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/CC6D7C74-800A-4901-89D9-1DEFEC9389C8_zpsql08cpna.jpg.html)

Time lapse of the past 20 hours or so, leading up to the final install!

http://youtu.be/8PmrAsdx60Y?list=UUIE74vMoj4ykn7_8mHJ7Gnw

[metalmaker12]

Christmas is around the corner, get her done!! Looks great guys, I am happy for you!!!

[xxguitarist]

We're sure trying! The turbo fit will be a little bit of a wrench in the works, but we are still optimistic.

[Hindsight]

Looking great! I dont think you will have much trouble modifying the cross brace. Saw someone else post pics of theirs and it didnt look too elaborate.

[Ellimist]

still optimistic.
That's the key! I've thoroughly enjoyed this thread. Keep up the good work!

[chedda]

I'm so jelly that you got your motor in over the weekend. Looking good you guys! Keep up the good work.

[STiPWRD]

Do you know the part number on the cam sprocket tool? I've found a few variants. Great progress guys!

[xxguitarist]

Looks like it was probably subaru # 499207400, per the FSM & some googling.
Note: That's for an 02, non-AVCS, with plastic gears. It has external features for the one metal intake gear & an internal soft gear shape for the plastic sections.

I'd guess that this will work if you can't borrow the $ubaru one.
http://www.amazon.com/Subaru-STD-Int-Sprocket-Tool/dp/B009ZCLNOG

[STiPWRD]

Thanks, that's the one I was thinking of getting. Those cam bolts can be impossible to remove even with air tools and $59 isn't that bad.

[xxguitarist]

Do you also have the socket cap screw type (allen key) on your motor?

I nearly stripped one of them on dis-assembly, using a biig breaker bar & with the cam locked up with the old timing belt routed around in circles.. We got a new set, and they went on beautifully with the tool.

[Ironhydroxide]

I haven't seen anything about a CEL-free TGV delete option.. Do you have a link? My understanding was that it was just an easy code to delete, but CT is picky on not-ready sensors. I'm trying to avoid having to make a shortened version of the TGV rods to activate the sensors.

I was meaning there's the writeup for the CEL Free Simplification of the EVAP system, not the TGV's. Somehow my slow posting got mixed up with changing subjects. http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2485979

[xxguitarist]

Ah, OK. Yep, we are planning to follow approximately that procedure to get rid of some of the mess. We have most of the hoses hooked up & secured already, just need to add the lines to the charcoal canister (required in CT) and gas tank.

[STiPWRD]

Do you also have the socket cap screw type (allen key) on your motor?

I nearly stripped one of them on dis-assembly, using a biig breaker bar & with the cam locked up with the old timing belt routed around in circles.. We got a new set, and they went on beautifully with the tool.
Yea, same bolts. I couldn't get them loose with an impact gun and trying to keep the cams from spinning. Long story short - my old motor died when one of the cam sprockets seized up, which ripped the timing belt and disintegrated one of the plastic cam gears so it's difficult to keep the other cams from spinning to loosen the bolts. I took the opportunity to replace my other 13 year old plastic cam gears on the new rebuilt heads. That cam gear tool will make a good stocking stuffer.

[Scargo]

There's a lot written about the cam sprocket bolts... Some say the easiest method is to drill the bolt head till the metal gets thin enough to stretch, then it comes right out. I had to do that on one. New bolts are not very expensive.
For you guys, it may be too late, and you seem to have a Subaru mechanic friend nearby, but I just purchased a comprehensive set of Subaru specialty tools for less than half price.
Company 23 tools:
AVCS Int Cam Sprocket Tool
Dual AVCS Exh Cam Sprocket Tool
Camlock Tool 1
AVCS Security Socket
Axle Pin Tool


Grimmspeed - crank pulley tool
Snap On - Subaru ball joint removal tool

If anyone in the area needs to borrow any of these you are welcome to use them. I'll have them in a couple of days.

[Aero STI]

We're sure trying! The turbo fit will be a little bit of a wrench in the works, but we are still optimistic.

This may be of use when you fab your uppipe.

http://elmerracing.com/images/stories/virtuemart/product/2-t4dual.jpg

http://elmerracing.com/raceshop/exhaust/merge-collectors/turbo-merge-collector/2-to-t4dual-detail

[Tamra]

Wow, that is a beautiful part. It will not work, unfortunately. It looks like we will need to rotate our BW ~45 degrees, in which case one EWG (per this design) would go under the cold side toward our block (and away from the exhaust, which we must pipe our EWG's into to pass inspection) which won't work.

But dang, Andrew is impressed that they can carve that out of a block of steel!

[Jaime]

I surprised that they tried. Stainless generally isn't happy to be CNC'd and tig welding up something that shape seems like it would be a lot easier. It's just a plate and four partial tubes.

Also, that part is S355/A572Gr50 steel. It's the type they build ships and bridges out of. Some of the datasheets I found for it have warnings about not using it in places that see high temperatures.

[xxguitarist]

I surprised that they tried. Stainless generally isn't happy to be CNC'd and tig welding up something that shape seems like it would be a lot easier. It's just a plate and four partial tubes.

Also, that part is S355/A572Gr50 steel. It's the type they build ships and bridges out of. Some of the datasheets I found for it have warnings about not using it in places that see high temperatures.

Better yet, cast it!

[Aero STI]

Good catch, I didn't look closely at the material. I just assumed 304 or 321 since it was for an exhaust.

I drew up my own design for my EFR turbo, not sure if I'm going to have it machined or just build something from a flange and tube as mentioned.

The best TO4 flange I've found so far is here. http://www.stainlessheaders.com/turboflanges

[Scargo]

Vibrant makes one. (http://www.amazon.com/Vibrant-Stainless-Steel-Turbo-Flange/dp/B002VPHKG4) I have one of them. About $57, shipped (on Amazon).

[rtz]

Maybe have the stock flange cut off and another welded in place at a lower height?

Couple more turbo flange sources:

http://www.turbo-flanges.com/index.php?cPath=25

http://www.mandrel-bends.com/catalog/flanges-gaskets-36/turbo-flanges-62/

http://www.racepartsolutions.com/index.php/component/customfilters/turbochargers-flanges-accessories/no-manuf?Itemid=564

[xxguitarist]

Thanks for the links, guys.

Last night we did a little chopping/bending of the up-pipe that we had, then switched over to a cardboard routing sketch to figure out what tubing to order. We're going to start from scratch basically.

Fingers crossed, the 2x 45* 2' lengths & additional 90* should be able to get us up to the flange if we handle the rotation of each pipe carefully.

[Hindsight]

Looking forward to seeing this implemented. Have you ever thought of becoming a vendor?? ;)

[Scargo]

This is how I started the process.
36452

[xxguitarist]

Looking forward to seeing this implemented. Have you ever thought of becoming a vendor?? ;)

Heh! If I work up something that is simple enough to reproduce that I can then send a second sample off to a welding house, we'll see about it.

[brian b 36]

We brought our 818 home today! We've kept a donor thread here (http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?14362-Picked-up-our-STI-hybrid-swap-donor-today!) for the full teardown process, but now that it's time to start assembly, we figured we should create a build thread. Our 818 is #297.

Our excited faces:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/2e211fa3-5b96-422f-b10e-26547d9d5fdf_zpsd6b98240.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/2e211fa3-5b96-422f-b10e-26547d9d5fdf_zpsd6b98240.jpg.html)

We ordered a white body:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/ABA66515-49CB-4213-B3D0-45BAFB51D90D_zps5zzoqmfp.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/ABA66515-49CB-4213-B3D0-45BAFB51D90D_zps5zzoqmfp.jpg.html)

As one of our friends put it, "the 818 is definitely the better move"
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/CD96FA8B-E51A-411A-A566-6878B4DC657D_zps5psbj7ro.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/CD96FA8B-E51A-411A-A566-6878B4DC657D_zps5psbj7ro.jpg.html)


We have never owned Subarus before (Mazda family), and we've definitely never built a car before. Let alone a motor. This will be a learning process. Our goal is to autocross our 818 and also have it be street legal. Our hope is to have it on the road next spring.

We are going to build a 2.34L destroked short block, built for up to 650whp, but we will be tuning it to around 350whp max, with multiple maps. The machined 2.0 Heads will have an upgraded valve train. Oiling will be our limiting factor, so we will be running it at 8k rpm max to start. We are still deciding on the turbo, but leaning toward a BW 200SX twin scroll setup.

We will be doing all of the assembly of our engine. Larry's Power did the machine work on the heads and block and balanced the rotating assembly. We balanced the rods and pistons ourselves to .1 grams. We purchased our parts through Fidelis Motorsports, who also helped us pick the right parts for our goals.

2.34L destroked short block
-MPS +2mm H Tuff rods
-JE FSR Pistons
-upgraded Tool Steel Wrist Pins
-75mm WRX crank
-King Race and Main Bearings
-ARP Subaru EJ Series DOHC Headstuds

Supporting mods:
Borg Warner S200SX 51mm .84 a/r twin scroll turbo
Kinuguwa Twin Scroll Header (sits level with the oil pan!)
Custom twin scroll up-pipe that we are making
STI oil pan
Killer B Motorsport Ultimate Oil Pickup
Killer B Motorsport Oil Baffle Windage Tray
OEM 10mm oil pump (TBD to shim)
Partial TGV deletes
Cobb intake
NGK 1-step colder plugs
Forge full recirc bpv
Grimmspeed ebcs
255lph fuel pump
Semi-parallel fuel lines
Gates Racing Timing Belt
Group N engine and transmission mounts
Frozenboost AWIC

2.0 Chamber Matched Machined Heads
-Shimless buckets
-GSC Beehive Valve Springs w/ Titanium Retainer Valvetrain Kit
-GSC Chrome Polished Intake Valve
-GSC Chrome Polished Exhaust
-Injector Dynamics Fuel Injectors Top Feed 1000cc

Other items:
ACT StreetLite Flywheel
South Bend Stage 2 Endurance Clutch
OBX LSD (upgraded washers/bolts)
FFR adjustable lateral links
Aluminum control arms for the "castor mod"
Stainless steel braided brake lines
Cobb 27mm sway bar (TBD if we use this or a smaller one)
Koni 30 series shocks with 500lb springs (R package)
Race seats - Sparco Corsa
Wheels TBD (likely RPF1's) with Hoosier A6's
Lots of gauges
The car will be street legal and registered

Other project creep TBD


We have very limited space (two 10x20ft garages, one which is fully taken by the Miata and the bike), so when we got it home, first thing was to hang the body panels from the ceiling of our second garage. The bumpers and fender didn't fit, but at least most of them are out of the way.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/DD33E039-FB6E-4C21-99D9-0C8DCD4F8187_zpsx5l6dt7f.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/DD33E039-FB6E-4C21-99D9-0C8DCD4F8187_zpsx5l6dt7f.jpg.html)

All tucked away:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/EFAFE110-DC24-4F7A-BD14-BDCE5228B495_zps4qdi6mki.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/EFAFE110-DC24-4F7A-BD14-BDCE5228B495_zps4qdi6mki.jpg.html)

At this point, all of our donor parts have been cleaned and painted, bushings replaced where necessary, etc. The wiring harness has had a once through and had everything unnecessary deleted, although we haven't re-routed anything yet. The transmission has an OBX lsd installed with the upgraded washers. We are still in process of building the motor, so that is one of the primary items on our list for this week, in addition to taking inventory. The only items on the packing list that were backordered were small items that we will not need for awhile.

Thanks to all of the threads on this forum, we have already learned a great deal. As you read through our posts, please feel free to comment if you see any issues or have any recommendations.

Also, my better (or at least more mechanical) half is Andrew, forum name xxguitarist.
andrew did you pickup your car on 10-25 if so my car is the red one behind yours #299 I live north windham ct were are you on your build mine is all built and now dis, and out to powder coat

[brian b 36]

I see your using the stock brakes I own a junk yard in ct and found in yard that a 06 legacy gt has much bigger brakes, vented rear bolts right on and very cheap at the parts store with all that power you might want more brakes

[Tamra]

We are actually thinking of going smaller in order to fit 15" wheels in the front, and just upgrading the pads. Autocross is short and doesn't build up much heat, so most people go smaller and lighter. We might contact you to see if you have any that would work! Which junk yard is it?

[Tamra]

Oh, and we are in Shelton, CT, so a little over an hour from you. Good to see another Connecticut builder!

[brian b 36]

Newington auto parts 860 666 6122 brian

[Tamra]

Last night, we finished up permanently mounting the gas tank and fuel hoses. We left the charcoal canister for a later date, once we figure out where we are mounting items that will be permanently installed...
We put some mats under the gas tank to try to prevent future squeaking. Unfortunately, that made the clearance between the filler hose, the tank, and the chassis next to nothing. Took us nearly over an hour and some repositioning of the tank, but eventually got it on and kept the mats in place.

Then today, we started on this...
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/IMG_7416_zpsad978a73.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/IMG_7416_zpsad978a73.jpg.html)


We only had a couple of hours to work on things before we had family obligations for the rest of the afternoon. Going to really tackle it tomorrow.

Some observations so far were that the WRX had two fuel senders, whereas the 818 only has 1. Andrew forgot about the second sender and was going crazy trying to figure out the pins to work with for the kit. Once the second sender was plugged in (they're in series) the lines ohm'd out easily.

[Buzz Skyline]

i was thinking of putting something under the gas tank too. I ultimately decided against it. I hope I won't regret that. What the heck- it's a kit, I'll just tear it apart if it squeaks.

Wiring - it sucks.

[RM1SepEx]

I ran a bead of silicone around the perimeter and a couple Xs in the middle. Push it down hard to seat it into the soft silicone and it should quiet it down. I didn't have clearance problems using this technique.

Wiring... right now I'm questioning my cut the obvious and get it running wiring plan. I now want to clean it up and I'm doing everything with my body twisted around in the cockpit.

[Hindsight]

Interesting on the fuel sensors. How did you use them both though?

[xxguitarist]

Dan,
We wanted it more removable than that.. We figure there's a 50-ish % chance that we will be doing something different next winter for weight distribution/ slosh handling

Hindsight,
We didn't use both in the kit, just used both to find the appropriate pins in the harness to splice to the single FFR supplied sender.

On that note, anyone know the correct polarity for the FFR:WRX wiring colors for fuel pump & sender? Sender being resistive, it shouldn't matter, but the pump ought to.

[RM1SepEx]

Dan,
We wanted it more removable than that.. We figure there's a 50-ish % chance that we will be doing something different next winter for weight distribution/ slosh handling



Two words in that case:

Wax Paper

[Tamra]

Thanks to the help of two friends (one all day, one for a few hours), we made a lot of progress.

1) Installed the front nose and radiator. Although we are using an OEM radiator, it sat about 5/8" above the frame rail, so we are going to have to space it up. Plenty of clearance on the steering rack though.

2) Installed the coolant lines. Note: the manual is very unclear for which pieces of the oem radiator hoses go where. As a tip, the 90 degree hose goes on the coolant cross over line on the engine, not the 60 degree hose like it makes it sound. Also, the radiator hose adapters are a pain to separate, but there are three hoses within each one. We ended up with the one thick, smallest one left from each of the five. Any ideas where these go? Also, the manual states to make sure the coolant lines are attached to the frame no more than 5" above the bottom frame rail, but the photos show otherwise. We went no more than 5" in order to avoid body clearance issues, but we're not entirely sure why the photos showed them closer to 8" up.

3) Installed the clutch lines. A pipe bender from Autozone worked great and we were able to route them very tidily back to the transmission. As our slave cylinder is further back on the transmission, we had to use one extra piece of the hard line than what the manual said. So now we are short a coupler and a brake line that we will need to replace down the road.

4) Wiring harness has been made sense of. We have a handful of wires (around 8-12) left to extend to the engine bay (attachment points on the transmission and the down pipe), and have not extended the headlights or tail lights yet (tail lights seem like they reach though???). However, the fuse boxes all seem to reach their respective locations without any major issues. We have quite a few open plugs left that we are holding off on doing a full delete until first start, when we can confirm they can be deleted. We should hopefully be able to shave down a bit more of the tangle, but for the time/frustration vs weight loss, we are only going so far.

5) Received our start-up tune from EFI Logics!!!

If you exclude the engine specific work, we are at 77 hours into the build since pickup on October 25th, including inventory (including the engine is 130 hours), which puts us at about 18 hours/week. Around 9 hours on the wiring harness to get it to it's current state, in the car, and an additional 8 hours of deleting things such as ABS, airbags, hvac, stereo, doors, etc., for a total of 17 hours to date. We spent 136 hours on the donor car from May-October, so you can see we have picked up our pace a bit :)

Also, we have officially sold more money in parts from our donor than what we paid for it. We are at $6,450 in parts sales, and a purchase price of $6300 (unfortunately, we overpaid for our donor considering we thought it came with a freshly built motor - see our donor teardown thread linked on p1 for the full story of our lying seller. We might as well have bought a similar car with rod knock for half the price or less, considering our full engine rebuild!). Regardless, our parts sales have really helped us.

We are looking at about $14,000 in upgrades, our full engine build, and maintenance items so far, which is putting us at just under $24k final build cost. We still have a lot of parts listed for sale though, so hopefully we will cut down that final build cost.

Time lapse!

http://youtu.be/fi22zGj24sY?list=UUIE74vMoj4ykn7_8mHJ7Gnw

[Hindsight]

You are going so fast. That is great on the donor car sales. I am at just under $2k in parts sales and the sales have really tapered off at this point.... So even with the motor issue you had, you still did very well. I will probably end up between 25k and 30k on total build cost.

At this pace, you should be go karting within a month!

[Mitch Wright]

Great progress, and good job donor on parts sales.
With all that I am doing to my R I am going to end up close to 30K and building the car I want so no regrets.

[Tamra]

Yup, things add up fast... awic, twin scroll turbo and related components, full long-rod motor build including all the machine work and balancing, lsd, upgraded clutch and lightweight flywheel, cobb accessport, and 6 gauges definitely blew the budget fast... let alone the million other items, even just oem replacement parts, that add up :) No regrets! The budget was blown anyway once we found out we were going to have to build the engine, so we figured that we might as well do it right the first time.

However, with some deal searching we've saved a lot, worked hard to sell parts, and put in a lot of labor (only outsourcing was the actual machine work on the engine) so we feel like we are building the car we want at a great price. Almost nothing has gone untouched on this thing. Can't wait to get it on the road and autocross next season!

[Tamra]

Began work on the up-pipe tonight... We picked up some 1.75" pipes with 45 degree angles, 90 degree angles, and straight. Here's a sneak peak... more to come as it gets finished. We will be coming up with a solution for the cross brace, as our turbo will be right in the middle of it. Thanks to our friend Gene for bringing over his chop saw and mig welder and helping us get started. We will continue another night, as we called it quits at just past midnight.

We started with the Kinugawa flange. Their flange is specific to Kinugawa and you cannot purchase it anywhere, so we had to clean out the old tubing and re-use it, which was a little annoying. However, he was able to mill down past the brazing.

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/2F97AB21-24FE-4AFF-8B5E-4D04D3EE38FF_zpsff7tvnlv.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/2F97AB21-24FE-4AFF-8B5E-4D04D3EE38FF_zpsff7tvnlv.jpg.html)

Then on to the fresh pipes.... more to come later as we finish it up.

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/2AB07D61-CF74-4181-B8C3-810DF0C43F74_zpsq9zw5skd.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/2AB07D61-CF74-4181-B8C3-810DF0C43F74_zpsq9zw5skd.jpg.html)

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/EA590262-9877-4887-861B-F4527E969A6C_zps5y2jkkez.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/EA590262-9877-4887-861B-F4527E969A6C_zps5y2jkkez.jpg.html)

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/813AAF07-0AB1-4560-8A70-0582A10DCB94_zpso9ozqwff.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/813AAF07-0AB1-4560-8A70-0582A10DCB94_zpso9ozqwff.jpg.html)

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/3FC1BEE7-F692-48EE-9FE6-530D187DE5F5_zpsytzayzkv.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/3FC1BEE7-F692-48EE-9FE6-530D187DE5F5_zpsytzayzkv.jpg.html)

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/EB4ADC03-8AE6-4849-8664-A4618EE5CFB8_zpsgbpz3yn7.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/EB4ADC03-8AE6-4849-8664-A4618EE5CFB8_zpsgbpz3yn7.jpg.html)

[Scargo]

Most excellent! You guys are hard working... I have big vise envy.

[Hindsight]

Very cool! I'm jealous of your fab skillz and gear! I have vise envy too.... no matter how hard I tighten the rotation locking level on mine, it will still rotate. Makes it impossible to torque bolts on things I have clamped in the vice because the whole vice just rotates on me.

You two should start making custom exhaust! hint hint. Side exit please. Thanks. ;)

[xxguitarist]

Hindsight, whatever exhaust we make will be pretty unique, our turbo looks like it will be sitting a few different sorts of rotated, and then there's the bit about it having a huge marman (think: John deere & Cummins) flange.

On the vise, it's one of Yost's more affordable large vises. 6.5" apprentice series. The rotation has spun on me, but only when we were trying to bend some of the kiniguwa up-pipe pieces to get a feel for how it might sit. We were pulling on it with most of a 5' lever arm.. And that's just not fair :-) It's a good solid unit, and I have a set of aluminum jaws too, which are awesome for things you don't want to damage (like when checking rod bearing sizes!)

[Hindsight]

I'd be happy with a vise that lets me torque a bolt on a piece clamped in it to about 45ft lbs. Mine only holds to like 15 or so. I'll look into a yost vise. A good vise is just so crazy expensive.... even ~$175 seems a lot to pay for a vise. By the time this project is over, I'll probably have spent more in additional tools than on parts for the car. I need to come up with some sort of side business to help justify the tool expense lol.

I have thought about just drilling a 1/4" hole that goes through the top-flange and into the base of the vise I have, while the vise is oriented perpendicular to the bench (normal non-rotated orientation), and then inserting a steel rod into the hole to "lock" the vise in position for when I need to torque things down.

[metalmaker12]

Unfortunately a good vise is not cheap. This Wilton was about $750-1000 15 years ago36590

[metalmaker12]

Unfortunately a good vise is not cheap. This Wilton was about $750-1000 15 years ago36590

Looking good guys, good idea to tack it in with mig, you going to have it tig welded. I do that ya know. I can get it done asap also.

[Scargo]

I noted the South Bend Stage 2 Endurance Clutch in the picture. I was just given a positive heads-up about South Bend clutches. Why did you pick it and the ACT StreetLite Flywheel? I have the ACT (SB10-HDG6) HD-M/Race Sprung 6-Pad Pressure Plate Kit and ACT XACT flywheel Prolite 600240. I like the clutch. Very light, smooth feel, but that's in my 400 WHP STi @3000 pounds...
Why didn't you pick the 1.9 pound lighter flywheel?

[xxguitarist]

I'd be happy with a vise that lets me torque a bolt on a piece clamped in it to about 45ft lbs. Mine only holds to like 15 or so. I'll look into a yost vise. A good vise is just so crazy expensive.... even ~$175 seems a lot to pay for a vise. By the time this project is over, I'll probably have spent more in additional tools than on parts for the car. I need to come up with some sort of side business to help justify the tool expense lol.

I have thought about just drilling a 1/4" hole that goes through the top-flange and into the base of the vise I have, while the vise is oriented perpendicular to the bench (normal non-rotated orientation), and then inserting a steel rod into the hole to "lock" the vise in position for when I need to torque things down.

We can certainly torque to well over 100 ft*lb with this before it begins to move. The pin approach might work.


Unfortunately a good vise is not cheap. This Wilton was about $750-1000 15 years ago36590

Looking good guys, good idea to tack it in with mig, you going to have it tig welded. I do that ya know. I can get it done asap also.

Secondary argon flow regulator on the way to do back-gas, and I'll TIG it at work. Trying to decide if I want to do the flanges with filler for 304 or silicon bronze brazed.


I noted the South Bend Stage 2 Endurance Clutch in the picture. I was just given a positive heads-up about South Bend clutches. Why did you pick it and the ACT StreetLite Flywheel? I have the ACT (SB10-HDG6) HD-M/Race Sprung 6-Pad Pressure Plate Kit and ACT XACT flywheel Prolite 600240. I like the clutch. Very light, smooth feel, but that's in my 400 WHP STi @3000 pounds...
Why didn't you pick the 1.9 pound lighter flywheel?
We wanted a little extra weight in the flywheel to make launches for Pro-SOLO easier. There's not a lot of shifting, so not too much need for quick engine speed changes, relative to the track. This seemed like a good intermediate option. It's balanced with the pressure plate, and relative orientation was noted by the machine shop.

[Scargo]

Good answer. I concur...
On the welding: why would you risk braze? I would think a rod for 304 would be preferable. With a hot turbo you will be on the verge of melting bronze.

[xxguitarist]

The solidus melting point for Silicon-Bronze is around 1600F, so it's still pretty hot for a turbo.
Agreed, it's a lot lower than the stainless rod would be.
The kiniguwa was made with brazed flanges. Convenient since I had to mill them off of it.

The tubes will definitely be with filler for 304, it's just on the flanges, there is some filling to do & the sil-bronze won't be as likely to try and warp them on us.

[Tamra]

We have a tacked up-pipe and turbo placement! We will have to modify the cross brace, but it looks like not as much as we initially thought.

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/2A7A8058-7F2F-49C4-B2B5-E72B6B478E0A_zpsqeqxzlzs.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/2A7A8058-7F2F-49C4-B2B5-E72B6B478E0A_zpsqeqxzlzs.jpg.html)

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/351C9D68-54FF-4B57-B76F-745CD2890235_zps47qg2yjy.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/351C9D68-54FF-4B57-B76F-745CD2890235_zps47qg2yjy.jpg.html)

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/49E83F7F-A639-4500-9DD8-EC627BF1E794_zps78slebdc.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/49E83F7F-A639-4500-9DD8-EC627BF1E794_zps78slebdc.jpg.html)

[Hindsight]

Wow, that REALLY makes me want to do a rotated setup!

[metalmaker12]

Nice

[Tamra]

More progress today!

Bled the clutch. Thanks to some tips we found on the forum, we clamped the slave cylinder open, and we disconnected the push rod and slid a bolt through it for ease of pressing. Doing it this way it got more travel than pressing the pedal alone and helped speed up the process.

It only took us a few minutes before it seemed that all of the air was out of the line. No vacuum or anything. Thanks for the tips on the forum!
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/B2EE9568-8128-47AC-BD47-EF4EDBAE51AA_zpsqreotgra.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/B2EE9568-8128-47AC-BD47-EF4EDBAE51AA_zpsqreotgra.jpg.html)



Next, we thought we were going to have a problem when we found out we received the wrong plug and play adapters for our ID1000 injectors. Since those weren't going to work, we decided we would just crimp them in with the provided connectors. We started trying to find any local places that would have an F-type crimp tool. Plenty had the crimpers for f-type connectors, but they were for the coax type. Thankfully, we figured out that Andrew's work had what we needed, so we made the 1 hour round trip run out to grab the tool.

The ID1000's included one extra crimp, which is good, because we broke one on the 2nd injector after over crimping it just a little. That made us a little nervous since we didn't have any others to botch, but we realized that it didn't actually take much force to get a good crimp with these connectors, and the rest went smoothly and all crimped thoroughly.

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/A45332BF-BB65-4B18-86C4-D9238C2BFE10_zpsgnfd7lch.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/A45332BF-BB65-4B18-86C4-D9238C2BFE10_zpsgnfd7lch.jpg.html)

Next we moved on to plugging up some holes. Since our turbo won't be ready for first start (still finishing the up-pipe and also Kinuguwa sent us the wrong turbo feed and return lines and fittings - for the record their idea of 4an and 10an lines is not standard! We will be ordering them from somewhere else), we plugged the turbo feed line using our original banjo bolt and some clamped hose (hopefully that will hold! We will probably wrap a towel around it just in case...). From our research, it seems like this will be fine since the NA cars don't have a line there. Let us know if you see any problem with this. We also capped the water return, since our turbo is not water cooled and this will not be used. Finally, just slipped on a cap over the return line to keep things clean.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/705E3F8B-19C5-4A7A-B30C-49E9F1553320_zpshcateuz0.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/705E3F8B-19C5-4A7A-B30C-49E9F1553320_zpshcateuz0.jpg.html)


We added our oil pressure sensor and capped our pcv on the heads. We then attached hoses with clamps to the two crank case venting spots, ran them into the original crank case vent using it as a T, and then into a catch can. The catch can will be eventually be looped into a Venturi running into the exhaust. We also ran a 2nd catch can between the two heads with another T. It will also be ran into the exhaust most likely. We are not positive if this will affect our inspection, but we do not see anything explicitly not allowing it. On that note, we found out that our car will be exempt from emissions in CT, but must have the emissions equipment for the year of the motor in the car present for the initial inspection. Oh yeah, and we'll need a statement from Subaru verifying the year of our engine and transmission...

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/489C4DE2-5BEB-482F-A8DB-5D10327FBEB1_zpsqhv8bt2v.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/489C4DE2-5BEB-482F-A8DB-5D10327FBEB1_zpsqhv8bt2v.jpg.html)


So the next thing left us a little puzzled. Has anyone had any issues with the transmission and engine mounts not lining up properly? So, backing up a few steps, we pushed the engine all the way to the passenger side as far as it would go (about 2" of movement available on the engine mounting points, left to right). It is still biased toward the DRIVER side by about 1/2" somehow?? The mounts must not be square on the chassis? So then we are left with two problems - the first is that the transmission will be angled slightly toward the driver in order to line up with the mounting holes (we really don't want to move the engine an inch further toward the driver side, making it 1.5" biased toward the driver. If anything we want the opposite for weight balance!). Second, is that the transmission mount bolt sits too far forward. Has anyone had to dremel out the mounting hole in order to get the transmission mount to slide in? It will go in as it is, but it is putting a lot of twisting pressure on the mount that doesn't seem good. Our mounts are brand new, Group N.

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/DF75244F-3BA5-4D8E-AD43-7EE4C05EB5C3_zpsvad0pj80.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/DF75244F-3BA5-4D8E-AD43-7EE4C05EB5C3_zpsvad0pj80.jpg.html)

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/D290678F-23EE-4527-A601-295D6A6D39C4_zps8gbutvbs.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/D290678F-23EE-4527-A601-295D6A6D39C4_zps8gbutvbs.jpg.html)

[RM1SepEx]

Tamra, I thought I had this problem, make sure that each mount is in the right location and orientation, next loosen up everything and work at it, by doing that I was able to get them to line up. I'd also do yourself a favor and cut those trans mount bolts shorter IIRC they are about 1/2 inch too long and they stick down creating some interference issues.

[Tamra]

Tamra, I thought I had this problem, make sure that each mount is in the right location and orientation, next loosen up everything and work at it, by doing that I was able to get them to line up. I'd also do yourself a favor and cut those trans mount bolts shorter IIRC they are about 1/2 inch too long and they stick down creating some interference issues.

Thanks Dan. We will double check everything today.

We also have a friend that is going to bring over a banjo fitting so we don't have to use the hose and clamp to block the oil feed line.

[metalmaker12]

Check you put the motor mounts on the correct way on each side. You might have put one on wrong since you can mismatch the orientation within the sub mount that bolts to block.

[Hindsight]

I think you could also block the oil feed by using a regular bolt (whatever size and pitch the banjo bolt was.... guessing maybe m10x1.0?) and then get an M10 crush washer.

[metalmaker12]

I think you could also block the oil feed by using a regular bolt (whatever size and pitch the banjo bolt was.... guessing maybe m10x1.0?) and then get an M10 crush washer.

I have blocked them off with just a bolt this way. M10x1.5mm

[Tamra]

Well guys........ it's alive!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


http://youtu.be/QhoVEEp3JWA



We ended up just putting a bolt in the turbo feed. I think it was actually an M12 though. We put the Cobb directly on the throttle body, which effectively bypassed the awic (that we don't have yet) and the turbo, while still allowing the maf to function properly.


The day started out with extending wires to the engine bay. We just used wiring from the deleted portions of the harness and tried to match up the colors. It worked out pretty well actually. We only had one casualty, which was our friend Tim's jacket to the soldering iron (and a touch of skin as well).

We filled the car with coolant. We are pretty sure there will be some bleeding to do still, as we only got in about 2.3 gallons of the Subaru Super Blue coolant in it. Added 4.2 quarts of Rotella T oil to the engine. Although relatively accessible now, I imagine that will be a pain with body panels on! Also put in a couple of gallons of gas.

We installed the rear shift linkage so that we could test that the gears were working properly and ensured it was in neutral. We forgot to buy the washer on the drain plug, so we couldn't fill the transmission with oil for the start-up. We just pressed the clutch pedal during start-up to prevent the gears from engaging.

We then started attempting to download our Cobb tune from EFI logics, but our Cobb was not connecting to the car (kept repeating the message "make sure the ignition is switched to the on position"). We figured out we had a ground disconnected from the ecu after about 30 or 40 minutes of searching for the issue. Then, we were free and clear and the tune was in!

Next, we had to prime the engine with oil since it is brand new, so we unplugged the fuel pump and coils. We weren't having much luck initially despite turning over the engine for probably nearing 60 seconds (in short bursts). We then pulled the oil filter, and on the next attempt oil started spilling out. It must have had an air bubble or something, and so within another few quick turns we had oil come out of the turbo oil feed and we knew we had made it through the entire engine. We also saw pressure on the oil gauge of around 60 psi just from cranking.

Next, we reconnected the fuel pump and coils and started switching the key to the "on" position repeatedly to prime the fuel system. We were starting to get concerned because we could not get the engine to to start after repeated priming. I was wondering if 2 gallons of fuel wasn't enough, so we dumped in the remaining 3 gallons (for a total of 5 gallons), and it made an immediate difference. The fuel poured out of the return line within a few more times of switching the key to the on then off position.

Then, it fired up! Considering the ID1000 injectors, we were pretty impressed with how smoothly it idled. A little loud... but with no up-pipe or exhaust, I guess that would do it :) Oil pressure hovered right at 90 psi. We then celebrated by going out to Sushi with our friends Tim and Gene who spent all afternoon into the evening with us finishing things up.

Overall, a success and 4 days ahead of our Christmas goal!!!

[Tamra]

Our friend Tim captured the "official" first startup with his go pro:


http://youtu.be/Z7WZOgZ76iI

Such a great day! We are not sure whether our sense of excitement or relief was greater when it fired up (you know, first engine we've ever built and all).

[Bob_n_Cincy]

congratulations, Great job.

[metalmaker12]

Be careful not to run it too much with bigger injector duty cycle not mapped in cause it will run pretty lean. Nice job, it runs and should be all set. You beat your deadline and congrats. Much to do now, get it all together and have fun.


Ps 2 gal is a bit low because the FFR tank pickup is a bit to high in there, so more fuel like 3-5 gal min. The Boyd gets down to a gal and than you experience the same thing. So don't run it low and you'll be all set. Your gas gauge working good, 1/4 tank is my max empty on this car. And my mistake on bolt that one is an m12 1.25. The other banjos are smaller.

[Frank818]

Wow that is great it's running! Now you just need 4 wheels and you're off! lolll

[Tamra]

Thanks guys!

Metalmaker - we had a startup tune from Efi Logics for our setup, including the id1000's. It idles great!

It's crazy that we need that much fuel for it to run sitting still. I imagine at autox we will need more like 3/4 tank+.

[Scargo]

Perhaps you can lower the pickup? On my STi I added foam to the bottom of the tank and it allowed me to get down to much less than 1/4 tank before it sputtered on long, high-speed turns. Almost 1/4 tank improvement.
Great to see it running. I know that feeling of relief and excitement.

[Tamra]

We will likely switch to a front mounted fuel cell next winter if we have problems at autox, either from starvation or massive sloshes (both of which seem likely, but we will give the FFR tank a chance first).

[metalmaker12]

Thanks guys!

Metalmaker - we had a startup tune from Efi Logics for our setup, including the id1000's. It idles great!

It's crazy that we need that much fuel for it to run sitting still. I imagine at autox we will need more like 3/4 tank+.


Ok good, yeah usually it won't even run without a base map. A base map will be pretty much what it should be at idle, it's just as you get on it, it will need trimming. It sounds as it should, you burp coolant yet, the yellow funnel commonly used on subarus works pretty good. You have to get a lot of the coolant in first to help the process . Don't be afraid to drive it, the load on the engine seats the rings, just starting it with no load does not help or do any good. Your using that break in oil correct? Looking good and happy for you guys!! Happy holidays

[pwnoz]

So the next thing left us a little puzzled. Has anyone had any issues with the transmission and engine mounts not lining up properly? So, backing up a few steps, we pushed the engine all the way to the passenger side as far as it would go (about 2" of movement available on the engine mounting points, left to right). It is still biased toward the DRIVER side by about 1/2" somehow?? The mounts must not be square on the chassis? So then we are left with two problems - the first is that the transmission will be angled slightly toward the driver in order to line up with the mounting holes (we really don't want to move the engine an inch further toward the driver side, making it 1.5" biased toward the driver. If anything we want the opposite for weight balance!). Second, is that the transmission mount bolt sits too far forward. Has anyone had to dremel out the mounting hole in order to get the transmission mount to slide in? It will go in as it is, but it is putting a lot of twisting pressure on the mount that doesn't seem good. Our mounts are brand new, Group N.


Do you find a solution to this yet? I'm also using brand new Group N mounts and I'm having a similar problem. My transmission mount is similarly as far forward as your's, but it's not angled like that. And like you, I can twist the mount to get it in the hole, but I don't want to put unnecessary stress on the mount/bolts.

[RM1SepEx]

pwnoz, did you check the mount orientation and IDed by myself and Chris (Metalmaker12)? I think if you make sure that they are oriented correctly and position everything loosely it will line up. It is easy to get the motor mounts backwards the offset is slight.

[Bob_n_Cincy]

pwnoz, did you check the mount orientation and IDed by myself and Chris (Metalmaker12)? I think if you make sure that they are oriented correctly and position everything loosely it will line up. It is easy to get the motor mounts backwards the offset is slight.
This is what the left motor mount should look like from the back of the car.
36746

[metalmaker12]

I used group n mounts and they went right in no prob. I am really going to doubt the frame is off because there welding fixture is rather beefy in those areas. Of the mounts are reversed it causes this issue even in a subie. I am thinking that's the problem

[pwnoz]

This is what the left motor mount should look like from the back of the car.
36746

Thanks for the picture. That must be my problem, it looks like I have the mount bracket reversed.

[xxguitarist]

This is what the left motor mount should look like from the back of the car.
36746

Thanks!
Would you be able to get a photo of the other side too? Then we can double check both?

By the way, there's a stamped steel part that will cover most of the exposed part of your flywheel.


Ok good, yeah usually it won't even run without a base map. A base map will be pretty much what it should be at idle, it's just as you get on it, it will need trimming. It sounds as it should, you burp coolant yet, the yellow funnel commonly used on subarus works pretty good. You have to get a lot of the coolant in first to help the process . Don't be afraid to drive it, the load on the engine seats the rings, just starting it with no load does not help or do any good. Your using that break in oil correct? Looking good and happy for you guys!! Happy holidays

Our subaru friend brought over a funnel modified with rad cap attached, but we didn't idle long enough to use it. Had to hold in the clutch, since the trans wasn't filled yet.

We have rotella T in for break in (conventional, not T6),

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Thanks!
Would you be able to get a photo of the other side too? Then we can double check both?
By the way, there's a stamped steel part that will cover most of the exposed part of your flywheel.
,

Thanks, I know about the flywheel cover, I just know where it is at right now.

Here is the only picture I have of the right motor mount. As you can see, there is an upper and lower heat shield as the up pipe is pretty close to it.
Bob

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=36776&d=1419413614

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=36777&d=1419414251

[Tamra]

Do these look right to you guys?

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/DSC_0071_zps42e2e6a9.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/DSC_0071_zps42e2e6a9.jpg.html)

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/DSC_0072_zps43038e63.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/DSC_0072_zps43038e63.jpg.html)

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/DSC_0074_zps6b65285b.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/DSC_0074_zps6b65285b.jpg.html)



And just for fun, here's a current picture!
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/DSC_0064_zpsf47c46d8.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/DSC_0064_zpsf47c46d8.jpg.html)

Here was our turbo and intercooler bypass:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/DSC_0075_zps28ae96b7.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/DSC_0075_zps28ae96b7.jpg.html)

We took the last few days off from the car to spend time with family. My parents flew into town and we showed them around NYC, then spent Christmas with Andrew's family up in RI. Now we're back in CT and my parents are excited to help on the car (we'll see how long that lasts), and my dad is going to install our windshield for us (perks of having a glass shop owning dad! Thank you Joe's Mobile Glass of Medford, OR!!).

[Tamra]

We did some research and checked again, and we think our mounts are on the correct sides. However, since we shoved the engine toward the passenger side, it does tilt it (since the mounts that the engine set in are triangular, when we shoved them toward the passenger side, then that side of the engine tilted up). It is giving the illusion that the engine is toward the driver side, since the top of the engine technically is. However, we still feel there is something strange, because when we measure the lowest part of the engine vs the highest part of the engine, the lowest part is sitting centered, and the highest part measures 1/2" toward the driver side. We would expect the lowest part to measure closer to the passenger side.

It is also strange that although the one mount (driver side) is all the way toward the passenger side of the slot, the passenger side mount is in the center.

Any ideas?

Also, we still have no solution for the transmission. We will likely just dremel it so it does not put strain on the mount.

Here's two more photos just in case anyone has any ideas:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/F6A1B27E-86BC-4CF5-8462-80BD7FEE576C_zpsfh9p9tdd.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/F6A1B27E-86BC-4CF5-8462-80BD7FEE576C_zpsfh9p9tdd.jpg.html)

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/117DA55D-436C-4628-8041-95832D10D2B6_zpslm2k84tc.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/117DA55D-436C-4628-8041-95832D10D2B6_zpslm2k84tc.jpg.html)

[wleehendrick]

Here's two more photos just in case anyone has any ideas:

Sorry, no ideas; mine dropped in fine. I just had to mention, though... those few rusty OEM bolts look so out of place with everything else so clean!

[Scargo]

It looks OK to me. I believe the silver painted mounting plates that bolt to the case are marked L and R. I think I have put them on backwards.
I like the aluminum heat shield you put on to protect the mounts. Clever and a good idea.

[Ellimist]

aluminum heat shield you put on to protect the mounts. Clever and a good idea.
What's good about heat shielding the mounts? Maybe I missed the intent or explanation earlier in the thread... Sorry if that's the case.

[Scargo]

Notice the proximity of the headers to the mount. It's worse on the right side where you have the addition of the up-pipe. There's also the risk of an exhaust gasket leaking at any of three or more areas. I had a fire because the up-pipe gasket blew out. A friend, who was using quality hose, had an oil fire because the (wrapped) headers got his (wrapped) hoses too hot.
36938
Now, I assume the headers will be wrapped but it is still a good idea to protect the mounts. They will soften and probably even deteriorate with exposure to high heat. A lot of the rubbers and urethanes are not good for more than 200-300° and then they will still soften. Most of us put in "N" mounts to stiffen the connection. You sure don't want to be going backwards when you're on the track or pushing the engine for extended periods. If you will not do a track day or a constant 80 on a hot day then you may have no worries. And, stock exhaust is shielded.

[Tamra]

Sorry, no ideas; mine dropped in fine. I just had to mention, though... those few rusty OEM bolts look so out of place with everything else so clean!

Haha I know! But, they were perfectly functional with good threads, so no point in paying money for new bolts (the ones we did replace added up fast!), and not worth the effort to try to get them looking new again. Although they do stick out a bit, especially the suspension ones, next to all of the shiny parts!


It looks OK to me. I believe the silver painted mounting plates that bolt to the case are marked L and R. I think I have put them on backwards.
I like the aluminum heat shield you put on to protect the mounts. Clever and a good idea.

We can see the R on the passenger side one by shining in a flash light, so we know it is right. The driver side one is different so it should be marked L, although we can't see the L since the engine blocks it on that side. The mounts themselves are the same.

Our original engine mounts had heat shields, but we either lost one or it was never there, so we just made new ones out of some scrap aluminum we had. We thought it turned out pretty nice, and with more coverage than the original ones!


What's good about heat shielding the mounts? Maybe I missed the intent or explanation earlier in the thread... Sorry if that's the case.

Yup, as Scargo said, just to help with the heat from the headers.


Notice the proximity of the headers to the mount. It's worse on the right side where you have the addition of the up-pipe. There's also the risk of an exhaust gasket leaking at any of three or more areas. I had a fire because the up-pipe gasket blew out. A friend, who was using quality hose, had an oil fire because the (wrapped) headers got his (wrapped) hoses too hot.
36938
Now, I assume the headers will be wrapped but it is still a good idea to protect the mounts. They will soften and probably even deteriorate with exposure to high heat. A lot of the rubbers and urethanes are not good for more than 200-300° and then they will still soften. Most of us put in "N" mounts to stiffen the connection. You sure don't want to be going backwards when you're on the track or pushing the engine for extended periods. If you will not do a track day or a constant 80 on a hot day then you may have no worries. And, stock exhaust is shielded.

Yes, we will be wrapping the headers and up-pipe with DEI Titanium Exhaust Wrap, so that should help. The hoses also have the OEM heat shields on them where they go closest to the headers, so hopefully that should help too.

Our up-pipe is now tig welded, but we need to add the two Tial wastegate pipes now. We will mock that up tonight and hopefully finish the up-pipe this week. We also have our downpipe materials ordered.

[RM1SepEx]

So we know that they are on the correct sides, did you loosen up all the bolts, lift the engine slightly and wiggle it around to get all the mounts to line up?

[Tamra]

My parents were game to help on the car this weekend, so we got a bit more finished up. The hard brake lines are completed, the Goodridge lines installed, and the brakes are bled and working properly. We had one caliper that gave us some trouble (piston kept freezing up - not sure why this would suddenly be a problem as we didn't notice any issues when we drove the donor car around - oh well!), so we researched rebuilding vs just buying a reman one, and went with the $75 reman one from Autozone.

We also ran the shifter cable. It is not adjusted yet so we'll have to fiddle with that one, as it doesn't want to go into gear using the shifter yet, most likely due to the awkward angle. The manual doesn't show it connected at all. We haven't researched this yet on the forums, so we'll have to start searching to see what solutions others have come up with.

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/57DF6060-E706-405D-93E7-734AF96F5502_zpslh0my1mu.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/57DF6060-E706-405D-93E7-734AF96F5502_zpslh0my1mu.jpg.html)

My dad of Joe's Mobile Glass (Medford, OR) installed our windshield. That was... fun. First off, we found that we had to start chopping up our windshield frame surround in order to fit it around the brake master cylinder reservoir, and to access the bolts on the upper control arms. We are pretty happy with how it turned out, and we can fill the reservoir using a funnel with a flexible hose. It's not what we would call convenient, but at least it is accessible now. Interesting that the manual never mentioned this step... the photos look like it fit perfectly with no cutting. I wonder how they managed that?

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/DSC_0104_zps309a434c.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/DSC_0104_zps309a434c.jpg.html)

Situating the windshield frame to get it level and even front to back was also a bit of a challenge, but we got it there eventually. It is important that it is lined up how it will be for final fitment in order to get the windshield in correctly. The windshield frame is also very flexy, so for installation we ended up having to use some clamps to essentially flex the windshield surround and the windshield together into the right position for the sealant to have a chance to set properly. My dad said it was definitely one of the more challenging windshields he has installed, and he has been in the business for nearly 30 years working on everything from Porsches to Semi-Trucks.


We also flipped the hurricane bracket and added 4mm spacers to our front aluminum control arms (the "caster mod" to help fit wider tires):
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/B91CCEA3-B78C-4289-BEE9-31F96608CDCD_zps5tgxdvty.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/B91CCEA3-B78C-4289-BEE9-31F96608CDCD_zps5tgxdvty.jpg.html)


We torqued the suspension (a few bolts will be loosened and retorqued when at final ride height), and set it on the ground for the first time!

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/DSC_0085_zps88fd2b0e.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/DSC_0085_zps88fd2b0e.jpg.html)

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/DSC_0084_zpse9a61824.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/DSC_0084_zpse9a61824.jpg.html)


We have 255/40/17 Direzza Z2's on the rear with our Enkei PFO1 17x8 et45 wheels. They clear all of the suspension at the moment, although the alignment has not been finalized. We were planning on running 5mm spacers with these wheels as our dailies, but we might be able to get away without depending on the final alignment. Our autox wheels with have a lower offset, so we should be able to run even wider tires. Still TBD on the wide tire trailing arms.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/DSC_0098_2_zps2cda8397.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/DSC_0098_2_zps2cda8397.jpg.html)

The front tires are 235/40/17 with the same Enkei PFO1 17x8 et 45 wheels. The passenger side clears the frame at full lock (1.5 turns) with about 3/4" to spare between the tire and the frame, although would hit our 27mm Cobb sway bar if we didn't pull it up by hand. We would have to knock out at least the last adjustment point on the front bar if we were to use it (basically would be stuck at full stiff or medium all the time). Since the Subaru sway bar is not level from side to side, it is lower on the passenger side than the driver, and so it interferes most on just that side.

The driver side tire hits the frame at 1.25 turns to the left. We are assuming this is an alignment difference from side to side, so we will have to work on this.

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/DSC_0101_zps98fee2e0.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/DSC_0101_zps98fee2e0.jpg.html)

[Tamra]

Wide angle view from the drivers seat!

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/DSC_0108_zpsac7cb16e.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/DSC_0108_zpsac7cb16e.jpg.html)


We've got to finish up a few more things before go-kart stage. For one, finish the turbo and downpipe and connect the o2 sensor, and two, connect the evap system to the charcoal canister, and three, finish burping the coolant. Oh yeah, and the gas pedal and shifter... and mount the seats, and buy/install an AWIC, and a few other things lol. Lots left to do, but it's fun to see progress!

The car currently throws CEL codes due to the evap and o2 sensors not being hooked up. We went to start it for my parents and it ran terribly, and we figured out it was going into limp mode. We cleared the codes, unhooked the battery, re-hooked it back up, reflashed the tune, and it started right up and idled smoothly again for around 30 seconds. We won't try running it again until we get everything hooked up properly.

[Tamra]

So we know that they are on the correct sides, did you loosen up all the bolts, lift the engine slightly and wiggle it around to get all the mounts to line up?

We did that initially and it still seemed off. We will try again this week (another long weekend coming up!!) and see if we can get it situated better before taking a dremel to the transmission slots.

[Hindsight]

Looking great.... look at all that wiring!!! It's intimidating. The windshield does not sound fun.... not looking forward to that on my build. Have you considered using a remote brake/clutch reservoir? Keep us posted on the wheel/tire fitment!

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Tamra,
You did a very clean job trimming your windshield surround.
What tools/method did you use for this cut?
Thanks
Bob
36953

[xxguitarist]

Looking great.... look at all that wiring!!! It's intimidating. The windshield does not sound fun.... not looking forward to that on my build. Have you considered using a remote brake/clutch reservoir? Keep us posted on the wheel/tire fitment!

I did a little more wiring diet the other day, but plenty to go.. Hopefully not much to extend, at least.


Tamra,
You did a very clean job trimming your windshield surround.
What tools/method did you use for this cut?
Thanks
Bob
36953

The radiused areas were a step-drill for corners, straights are a 3" air cutoff wheel. Followed up with a file. It's dusty and messy, but it cuts easily.

[Tamra]

Looking great.... look at all that wiring!!! It's intimidating. The windshield does not sound fun.... not looking forward to that on my build. Have you considered using a remote brake/clutch reservoir? Keep us posted on the wheel/tire fitment!

The reason we didn't go with the remote reservoir is because it required cutting the windshield surround anyway. Since we were going to have to cut it, and we found a method that allows us to fill the reservoir without too much hassle (although, Mike Everson's solution does make it look much easier to fill!), then we figured we would save the money for elsewhere.

[Hindsight]

Makes sense. Can you use a pressure bleeder with your solution? I'm hoping I can with Mike's.

[RM1SepEx]

Tamra, RE the shifter post above:

The FFR shifter assembly at the rear of the car contacts the rear bodywork/screen when in 2nd, 4th, Reverse gears. While there are solutions that require you to buy a new shifter arm you can re-purpose the existing arm with a bandsaw, a welder and a drill.

It is detailed on my thread at

[http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?10649-RM1Sepex-Build-Thread/page14 go to post # 543

If you are keeping the stock FFR plastic shifter assembly I would add a piece of angle to the front of the assembly to get rid of the squishy feel as the plastic distorts. Adding metal should stiffen it up, a short piece of 2 inch angle should do it where the cables clamp. I went with the FFR optional shifter and once I tightened up the pivot it shifts very positive, I do wish that the cables were shorter to lessen the throw.

[Frank818]

17x8 +45 235s clear the frame by 3/4? Wow, did you do anything to the rack or fully OEM (with PS removed of course)?
I hit the frame good with 17x8 +38 215s. 2003 rack.

[erlihemi]

Tamra, the two of you and friends are doing an awesome job!!
I noticed you mentioned going to a different fuel tank and had some concerns with the FFR tank. Its the same tank as the 33HR and we have had some less than happy reports on the FFR tank. I am particularly unhappy with the tank and are several posts on the 33 forum regarding the issue. Since you mention AutoX you may want to consider a baffled tank with foam inserts. Attached is a picture of the inside of the FFR tank.
3696636967

Considering that you need the tank 1/4 full just to keep fuel in the "basket" (sump) and that getting the tank "full" is nearly impossible you end up with 50-80lbs of liquid ballast sloshing from one side of the car to the other as you chase the cones. Probably not the best handling option available. You guys are doing such nice work it would be a shame to have an Achilles heel behind the seat :)
Note the white powder around the welds. Looks like welding flux which surprised me as most production welding uses inert gas.

[Scargo]

And, in my day, when we did custom gas-tanks for armored luxury cars, the tank was coated inside with 3M stuff (http://s3.amazonaws.com/industrialfiles/catalog/product/3M/tds/tds_ec776.pdf)that went into airplane tanks, rusty motorcycle tanks, etc... I don't know what we're seeing in the images provided. It does not look like a tank coating job.
Then there's no baffling in the pictures shown. The shape of the tank presents challenges that don't look to be addressed for a "sports car". Even my custom '64 Nova SS had a box installed with swinging doors to control fuel surge around the pickup tube.

[Tamra]

Makes sense. Can you use a pressure bleeder with your solution? I'm hoping I can with Mike's.

I think we will be able to use a vacuum bleeder, but not a pressure bleeder with our setup. We are ordering a set of speed bleeders instead for now, since the bleed nipples on the calipers were rusted.


Tamra, RE the shifter post above:

The FFR shifter assembly at the rear of the car contacts the rear bodywork/screen when in 2nd, 4th, Reverse gears. While there are solutions that require you to buy a new shifter arm you can re-purpose the existing arm with a bandsaw, a welder and a drill.

It is detailed on my thread at

[http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?10649-RM1Sepex-Build-Thread/page14 go to post # 543

If you are keeping the stock FFR plastic shifter assembly I would add a piece of angle to the front of the assembly to get rid of the squishy feel as the plastic distorts. Adding metal should stiffen it up, a short piece of 2 inch angle should do it where the cables clamp. I went with the FFR optional shifter and once I tightened up the pivot it shifts very positive, I do wish that the cables were shorter to lessen the throw.

Thank you! This is very helpful.


17x8 +45 235s clear the frame by 3/4? Wow, did you do anything to the rack or fully OEM (with PS removed of course)?
I hit the frame good with 17x8 +38 215s. 2003 rack.

Well, it only clears the frame on the passenger side currently, but the alignment looks fairly good on that side. We will play with the adjustments this week and see if we can get the driver side to clear. We also do not need the steering wheel to reach full lock either, so we will be fine with putting in stoppers. To get the tires to fit, we put the aluminum control arms on and did the caster mod, where we flipped the bracket and also added a small 4mm spacer. According to Nasioc, if we increase the spacer size it should increase the caster and give us more clearance to the frame rail. It might take some experimenting as we set the alignment, or maybe not since they seem pretty close as is!
The rack is full OEM, a 2002 steering rack we believe.

The interesting thing was that the front from the outside, top edge of the tires measured 70" (yes, I know this isn't a true track width measurement, but it was just for quick comparison), and the rear, outside top edges measured 65" (admittedly the rear did have a significant amount of negative camber in its current setting and the front was more or less around 0 or a little negative). We also have the adjustable lower FFR links in the rear set to no particular size right now. Our front arms with the spacer also increased the front track width (possibly the widest sedan arms offered, plus the spacer, pushed the center of the tire out and forward). Our Miata in the driveway was 63" front and rear, but the tires sit inside the fenders a little (195 series for winter).


Tamra, the two of you and friends are doing an awesome job!!
I noticed you mentioned going to a different fuel tank and had some concerns with the FFR tank. Its the same tank as the 33HR and we have had some less than happy reports on the FFR tank. I am particularly unhappy with the tank and are several posts on the 33 forum regarding the issue. Since you mention AutoX you may want to consider a baffled tank with foam inserts. Attached is a picture of the inside of the FFR tank.
3696636967

Considering that you need the tank 1/4 full just to keep fuel in the "basket" (sump) and that getting the tank "full" is nearly impossible you end up with 50-80lbs of liquid ballast sloshing from one side of the car to the other as you chase the cones. Probably not the best handling option available. You guys are doing such nice work it would be a shame to have an Achilles heel behind the seat :)
Note the white powder around the welds. Looks like welding flux which surprised me as most production welding uses inert gas.

Dang, that is very empty isn't it? We've decided to run with it this year and we will deal with running with a 100% full tank for one season, and then next winter we will look at fixing it. With a really full tank, we will have weight problems but not sloshing problems at least. Why is it difficult to actually fill it?
We decided against adding foam to this tank because it would make the fuel level sensor not work.


And, in my day, when we did custom gas-tanks for armored luxury cars, the tank was coated inside with 3M stuff (http://s3.amazonaws.com/industrialfiles/catalog/product/3M/tds/tds_ec776.pdf)that went into airplane tanks, rusty motorcycle tanks, etc... I don't know what we're seeing in the images provided. It does not look like a tank coating job.
Then there's no baffling in the pictures shown. The shape of the tank presents challenges that don't look to be addressed for a "sports car". Even my custom '64 Nova SS had a box installed with swinging doors to control fuel surge around the pickup tube.

We looked at the POR-15 fuel coating product, but decided against it because we weren't concerned about longevity. We agree that we wish a few baffling things had been addressed, and we will likely switch to a front mounted fuel cell (plus, isn't the 33 hotrod tank something like 15 gallons?!?). However, next season will be devoted to setting the car up and determining which other things we want to change about it, so we will tackle it at that point. For now, we want to keep the additional cost and complexity down until we know for sure that we dislike the FFR tank and have a better idea of exactly what we want from the car.

[flynntuna]

In another thread Wayne brought to the table a new product from Holly which can solve the low fuel problem. It's worth a read.

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?15476-Building-an-818R-in-Mt-Pleasant-NC&p=182608#post182608

http://bangshift.com/general-news/new-products/must-see-holley-just-changed-fuel-system-game-big-way/

[Scargo]

When I looked on Holly's site there was only one big size pad shown and it was not yet available. What a tease they are.
Andrew and Tamra, It would cost you $25 for two of these 14 x 6 x 4 pieces of foam (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Anti-Slosh-Fuel-Cell-Safety-Foam-14-x-6-x-4-/151017264763). That's cheap! You should be able to cut and jam them in where it won't affect the sensors. Who cares if the fuel gauge works anyway? ;)
With my STi, the gauge works above a 1/4 tank. I never run more than about six-seven gallons for a 20-30 minute session. Imagine auto-x'ing for twenty minutes!

[xxguitarist]

A friend of ours showed us Holley's release. It looks like an amazing product, we'll definitely look into it if we don't take a different approach.

I'd mostly found small bits of foam for the fuel cell. I'll have a look at the larger pieces, see if we can fit them somehow so they can't slide into the level sender area.

[Frank818]

TamAndrew, regarding your spacer on the rear side of the LCAs (where there are 2 big bolts horizontal going through the black plate and into the alu LCA), you just added the spacer and it allowed you to have 3-4 caster and at least -0.5 camber? Or you did something else also? I will re-read to make sure I understand.

[xxguitarist]

TamAndrew, regarding your spacer on the rear side of the LCAs (where there are 2 big bolts horizontal going through the black plate and into the alu LCA), you just added the spacer and it allowed you to have 3-4 caster and at least -0.5 camber? Or you did something else also? I will re-read to make sure I understand.

Frank,
Can't speak to exact results by angle, as we havent done any alignment, nor do we have a flat surface to measure on.

It will, however, increase both caster & (-)camber, since it moves the rear of the LCA out, pushing the lower ball joint forward & out, as the front mount becomes a pivot.

[Jaime]

Are you sure it moves out? If it pivots on the front mount of the control arm, it has no where to go except forward.

[xxguitarist]

Are you sure it moves out? If it pivots on the front mount of the control arm, it has no where to go except forward.

Since the lower balljoint is offset towards the rear of the car from perpendicular with the front mount of the LCA, yes, it moves outward. Not much, but it does.

Prove it to yourself & duplicate this paper model, if you would like.
The red arrows indicate the "after" of increasing the caster spacer. It sits outboard a little, and a bit forward.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/4841D7D0-5DCD-4A47-875B-D97604F7A6ED_zpswuw44eyz.jpg

[Jaime]

My math tells me it moves out 13% of the amount it moves forward. Moving it forward 1/2" moves it out a sixteenth. I wouldn't be able to tell if it moved that much.

[Tamra]

We played with the front suspension today to see if we could figure out the issue with our driver side tire hitting the frame rail before full lock. Per some nasioc research, we found that the hurricane bracket holes do have some play in them (the holes are oblong shaped to permit some caster adjustment as far as we can tell), and we noticed that our passenger side was definitely pushed toward the front of the car more than our driver side one. We did some initial measurements, and the driver side was about 1/2" further back at a point near the shock mount, compared to the passenger side.

We tried loosening the bracket that connects the hurricane bracket to the control arm, and accidentally mangled a bolt. NOTE: make sure you remove the hurricane bracket bolts before the bolts that connect into the control arm! Thankfully, it was just the one bolt that got messed up, not the control arm (possibly even marred the bolt coming out of the steel bracket, not the control arm).

After undoing the hurricane bracket so it was completely loose, we then threaded back in the bolts connecting the bracket to the control arm, using a slightly shorter M12x1.25 bolt temporarily until our new one comes in on Monday (none of the local auto parts or bolts stores carried it). In this photo, you can see the oblong bolt hole size in the hurricane bracket, and how much movement you can get out it to adjust the caster further:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/771DCAD3-D19F-40CE-BD62-5D858F5F97F2_zpshdzcxn45.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/771DCAD3-D19F-40CE-BD62-5D858F5F97F2_zpshdzcxn45.jpg.html)

In order to line everything back up to set the hurricane bracket at our desired location (basically as far toward the front of the car as we could get it), we used a bottle jack to push the arm forward until the bracket was lined up with the holes. The bushings are under some twist with this caster mod (enough that we could not move the control arm forward by hand force), but according to Nasioc it does not seem to cause any long term issues:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/C1B5B8B2-2337-45D9-8E16-3DA31EE5E41D_zpsmxxmduqd.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/C1B5B8B2-2337-45D9-8E16-3DA31EE5E41D_zpsmxxmduqd.jpg.html)

Unfortunately, the driver side arm is still about 1/8" set further back than the passenger side. We are wondering if it is something with the mounting brackets being slightly off (I'm sure all builders have noticed that when the brackets were welded, there was some movement, thus requiring some prying to get some of the bolts and spacers to fit into place).

Good news is, the driver side tire only brushes the frame at full lock now, although the passenger side still has about 1/2" clearance with similar alignment.

We tried to run the front R Konis inverted, and found out this would not work. The bottom of the shock hits the S mounting bracket before you can reach the R mounting hole:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/F3A231FA-263F-4F66-A0EA-BB74DF74C0F3_zps3z4zjac5.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/F3A231FA-263F-4F66-A0EA-BB74DF74C0F3_zps3z4zjac5.jpg.html)

Instead, we ran them the normal direction, but in the R mounting hole. This is to gain some shock pre-load at full droop, whereas before we had about 1/4" of movement.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/273399E9-D395-4709-B2FA-FA840B1729F2_zpsnl5cqsk0.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/273399E9-D395-4709-B2FA-FA840B1729F2_zpsnl5cqsk0.jpg.html)

The front of the car is currently sitting at about 4 1/8" ride height, but we have some significant bump steer potential issues. It seems to take about a 5" ride height to get the tie rods to run parallel to the ground. Our ideal street height is between 4-4.5", so we are going to have to add a bump steer kit. Has anyone else encountered this issue with the 818S?

[Frank818]

Ok tnx for the spacer explanation. I guess I'll and see if someone achieves 3-4 caster and at least -0.5 camber by just adding a spacer in there and not cutting the threads on the A-arms.

But Jaime's maths worry me, 1/2" spacer is thick and it would only move 1/16" out? But then again, I have no idea 1/16 out translate to how many caster/camber degrees...
Andrew, what size is your spacer again?

Regarding the bumpsteer on an S, maybe it's cuz you use the R shocks' mounting holes?

[xxguitarist]

We are running in the R hole so that the spring is under (VERY) slight preload when at full droop. We have the 500 lb springs up front to start out, as that's typically better for auto-x, improves turn-in, and lets the rear articulate more to keep the tires on the ground. The bump steer issue is the same for a given ride height, regardless of if it's loose springs and the S holes or slight preload and R hole.

Our front tires are larger than average, but to get to anything under 5" frame height, it will require some bump steer correction.

With a 4mm spacer + flipped plate, it's likely around +1* castor.
With that, following Jamie's ratio, you've got an extra 0.1* neg camber.

[metalmaker12]

We played with the front suspension today to see if we could figure out the issue with our driver side tire hitting the frame rail before full lock. Per some nasioc research, we found that the hurricane bracket holes do have some play in them (the holes are oblong shaped to permit some caster adjustment as far as we can tell), and we noticed that our passenger side was definitely pushed toward the front of the car more than our driver side one. We did some initial measurements, and the driver side was about 1/2" further back at a point near the shock mount, compared to the passenger side.

We tried loosening the bracket that connects the hurricane bracket to the control arm, and accidentally mangled a bolt. NOTE: make sure you remove the hurricane bracket bolts before the bolts that connect into the control arm! Thankfully, it was just the one bolt that got messed up, not the control arm (possibly even marred the bolt coming out of the steel bracket, not the control arm).

After undoing the hurricane bracket so it was completely loose, we then threaded back in the bolts connecting the bracket to the control arm, using a slightly shorter M12x1.25 bolt temporarily until our new one comes in on Monday (none of the local auto parts or bolts stores carried it). In this photo, you can see the oblong bolt hole size in the hurricane bracket, and how much movement you can get out it to adjust the caster further:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/771DCAD3-D19F-40CE-BD62-5D858F5F97F2_zpshdzcxn45.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/771DCAD3-D19F-40CE-BD62-5D858F5F97F2_zpshdzcxn45.jpg.html)

In order to line everything back up to set the hurricane bracket at our desired location (basically as far toward the front of the car as we could get it), we used a bottle jack to push the arm forward until the bracket was lined up with the holes. The bushings are under some twist with this caster mod (enough that we could not move the control arm forward by hand force), but according to Nasioc it does not seem to cause any long term issues:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/C1B5B8B2-2337-45D9-8E16-3DA31EE5E41D_zpsmxxmduqd.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/C1B5B8B2-2337-45D9-8E16-3DA31EE5E41D_zpsmxxmduqd.jpg.html)

Unfortunately, the driver side arm is still about 1/8" set further back than the passenger side. We are wondering if it is something with the mounting brackets being slightly off (I'm sure all builders have noticed that when the brackets were welded, there was some movement, thus requiring some prying to get some of the bolts and spacers to fit into place).

Good news is, the driver side tire only brushes the frame at full lock now, although the passenger side still has about 1/2" clearance with similar alignment.

We tried to run the front R Konis inverted, and found out this would not work. The bottom of the shock hits the S mounting bracket before you can reach the R mounting hole:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/F3A231FA-263F-4F66-A0EA-BB74DF74C0F3_zps3z4zjac5.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/F3A231FA-263F-4F66-A0EA-BB74DF74C0F3_zps3z4zjac5.jpg.html)

Instead, we ran them the normal direction, but in the R mounting hole. This is to gain some shock pre-load at full droop, whereas before we had about 1/4" of movement.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/273399E9-D395-4709-B2FA-FA840B1729F2_zpsnl5cqsk0.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/273399E9-D395-4709-B2FA-FA840B1729F2_zpsnl5cqsk0.jpg.html)

The front of the car is currently sitting at about 4 1/8" ride height, but we have some significant bump steer potential issues. It seems to take about a 5" ride height to get the tie rods to run parallel to the ground. Our ideal street height is between 4-4.5", so we are going to have to add a bump steer kit. Has anyone else encountered this issue with the 818S?

I am running at 4.5 all around, at 818s mounting locations and it's all good. Very slight bump steer but not a issue, it seems to drive pretty good at this height for me. You gotta remember as you drive it it settles a few times so you will be going through adjustments often at first. I think I set it at 5.25 at first and it settled at 4.5. When I did alignment I had +3-+4 caster. This helps greatly!

Spacers can bring the tire out more and changing the Coilovers mounting location to R will give you more camber. But bump steer will increase a lot so yea a kit is a good option. I am just not sure changing just one mounting location is a good or bad idea so your pioneering this method. It makes sense in theory, so as you are give it a try.

[Quiny]

My dad of Joe's Mobile Glass (Medford, OR) installed our windshield. That was... fun. First off, we found that we had to start chopping up our windshield frame surround in order to fit it around the brake master cylinder reservoir, and to access the bolts on the upper control arms. We are pretty happy with how it turned out, and we can fill the reservoir using a funnel with a flexible hose. It's not what we would call convenient, but at least it is accessible now. Interesting that the manual never mentioned this step... the photos look like it fit perfectly with no cutting. I wonder how they managed that?

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/DSC_0104_zps309a434c.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/DSC_0104_zps309a434c.jpg.html)

Situating the windshield frame to get it level and even front to back was also a bit of a challenge, but we got it there eventually. It is important that it is lined up how it will be for final fitment in order to get the windshield in correctly. The windshield frame is also very flexy, so for installation we ended up having to use some clamps to essentially flex the windshield surround and the windshield together into the right position for the sealant to have a chance to set properly. My dad said it was definitely one of the more challenging windshields he has installed, and he has been in the business for nearly 30 years working on everything from Porsches to Semi-Trucks.

Did you do any paint prep to the windshield surround before you set in the glass?

[Tamra]

I am running at 4.5 all around, at 818s mounting locations and it's all good. Very slight bump steer but not a issue, it seems to drive pretty good at this height for me. You gotta remember as you drive it it settles a few times so you will be going through adjustments often at first. I think I set it at 5.25 at first and it settled at 4.5. When I did alignment I had +3-+4 caster. This helps greatly!

Spacers can bring the tire out more and changing the Coilovers mounting location to R will give you more camber. But bump steer will increase a lot so yea a kit is a good option. I am just not sure changing just one mounting location is a good or bad idea so your pioneering this method. It makes sense in theory, so as you are give it a try.

Thanks Chris. We'll watch for how much it settles, as we don't want to go below 4" for street height. We will use a smaller wheel/tire combo for racing to get it lower that way, without affecting alignment or bumpsteer.

We suspect that we had issues with the loose springs because of using the 500# ones on the front, so there is less static sag. The R mounting hole allowed us to have some pre-load at full droop.

On the bump steer, we would rather that the tie rods be "wings down" than "wings up" like they currently are (or at minimum, horizontal), so we will definitely do a kit or build one ourselves.



Did you do any paint prep to the windshield surround before you set in the glass?

No, just a thorough cleaning since we are not planning to paint. The windshield surround only had one blemish spot that is out of the way of the windshield, so we should be able to work on it without problems. On the windshield and frame, he used the typical primer for the windshield urethane adhesive.

[Tamra]

We started mocking up our turbo today and figuring out the AWIC solution.

We are thinking the Frozenboost Type 3. It has the inlet and outlet ports both on the same side. The hose on the turbo cold side outlet is just for an example, as we haven't ordered anything yet. With this orientation, it would take about a 45 degree bend between the intake manifold and the AWIC, and a 90 degree out of the turbo cold side. It would be set about like this:
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/04D62D19-28DE-4CF0-A000-A92003A183C9_zpsbvhdpots.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/04D62D19-28DE-4CF0-A000-A92003A183C9_zpsbvhdpots.jpg.html)

We would also have our Forge BOV in the middle, recirculating back to the Cobb intake.
http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/ag408/wrx818/Build/C468C7ED-9D3E-46A1-BD28-2C158A2577EB_zpsntynkwid.jpg (http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/wrx818/media/Build/C468C7ED-9D3E-46A1-BD28-2C158A2577EB_zpsntynkwid.jpg.html)

Anyone have any thoughts on this set up? Andrew's engineering OCD be damned, if it sits crooked like this it seems like we would have the shortest air flow path, which would be optimal. We haven't purchased it yet, but hope to pull the trigger tomorrow.

[Hindsight]

I think its brilliant. I wouldnt have thought of it because my brain thinks everything needs to be symmetric. But the most efficient design is less distance, less volume, fewer bends, lower angle ends. Seems you have got that nailed.

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Tamra,
With your turbo set up. Craig's setup that I used will work nice.
Bob

37197

[Ellimist]

Tamra,
With your turbo set up. Craig's setup that I used will work nice.
Bob

37197

Bob (or Craig if he sees this - I guess I'll also post on his thread to ask), is Craig's setup complete or is he still tweaking it? I ask because I've been planning to either do Wayne's or Craig's AWIC kit....that said, I still haven't started breaking down my donor, so I'm a ways out from ordering myself.
-Ben