Camera's 818C

[J R Jones]

Mcamera, My 818 cables are # 80238 0974W and they do fit. I am the third owner and assume these cables came with the kit. Your cables are a different format. You will have to alter cable and case to get the FFR dimensions. I would call the supplier and get the right cable format.
The ZDM transaxle cable mount kit that I have seen on fletch's car does not reverse the cable action. As stated on their web site the ($364) kit fits an MR2 shifter or a plastic Impreza shifter. facing forward.
If you reverse the Impreza shifter you may have issues with side to side lever travel. The shifter action is not symmetrical side to side. N to 1-2 is longer than N to 5-R.
Your nylon shift housing stand-offs are likely to deflect when you are shifting enthusiastically (IMO).

[mcamera]

J R thanks for pointing out my incorrect shifting setup. I didn't realize the MR2 shifter and a backwards facing FFR plastic shifter didn't function the same. I thought the bell crank was used to reverse the motions for both but it doesn't reverse anything. As is, my plastic shifter is backwards on the side-side motions and the front-backwards motions. I spent some time playing with the bell crank to see if I could reverse the motions but the amount of time it would take to develop a fix, make it robust, and look nice is too much. It's a tight area and it would affect my cable mounting or cable length. It's a complete tear up. I'm taking the easy way out and buying the Zero Decibel mid engine shifter. There's too much else to do. I also tried to cut threads on my shifter cable after shortening it and couldn't do it. The metal just spun in my vice and chewed up the end piece. It takes a lot of force to cut threads even with a new die set. Yes I used oil. I have to buy another cable with custom lengths once I get the new shifter in the car.

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I got my Cobb tuner and uploaded the lowest tune which is necessary to use all of the gauges/features. I only pulled 3 codes related to emission items that I removed and the missing secondary O2 sensor. Those will be suppressed when I eventually get a tune. But no big surprises! (yet)

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I bought a Lokar hand brake which is so much better than the monstrous OEM unit. I got it mounted straight, in a comfy area to grab, and only hooked up 1 brake cable to save on mounting room. I made a bracket with 1/4" thick scrap steel so I could mount this as far back as possible. 1/4'' is necessary, there's a lot of force on this bracket that was bending my 1st bracket. The cable took quite a bit of preload to work correctly but now it locks up the passenger wheel and the brake still doesn't drag with the handle down. I really hope the ZDB shifter doesn't interfere with this. It's perfect right now.

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My passenger seat is now mounted. I previously said I would mount it the same as my driver's seat but things changed once I got to work. There's no reason to slide the seat further forward so I ditched the adjuster bar (interfered with the frame bar in front of the seat) and have the seat set at a fixed distance. I set the seat as far back as I could go while still having a comfortable tilt that's not completely upright. I used the sliders for mounting so if I really need to, I can still slide the seat forward for fine tuning. It's not perfect but I had a 6' friend test the seat and decided that was plenty good for anything less than a long road trip. The seat bottom is still tilted to get over the bar in front of the seat.

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I also adopted a stray dog for an hour. Bear wandered into my garage while I was working and offered some advice. Everybody has an opinion.

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[Ajzride]

I didn't realize we had two shifter threads going on at once. We just went through the flipping around a shifter issues here:

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/show...8-Shifter-help

[J R Jones]

Mcam, That looks like a good dog, someone may be distraught. Coincidentally I was in Madison last week working under my MR2 when a dog licked my face. It was a visitor with a recent adoption from Alabama. WT? not enough dog owners in the south?
Threading the cables is complicated by chrome plating which is hard and brittle.
I have another roadster project with Lexus parts and a small cockpit. I had to angle-skew the handbrake handle to the right to clear the shifter. The ergonomics actually feel good.

[aquillen]

I suspect you are not going to revisit trying to thread the cable end(s) but if you do some tips -
Must be a good sharp die (you said it was new), not a cheap die from a low cost tap/die set either.
Sand/grind off chrome if exists (as mentioned above it is another problem spot).
Put a little taper, say 1/4" or less, on the end of the shaft to help the die get started.
You just about must have a lathe or other alignment jig that will hold the die and the shaft in center alignment to each other or the die will walk off center very easily creating a nasty, crooked set of threads that run further off center of the shaft as you get deeper through the die.
Top notch threading lube.
Grip/hold on both the shaft and die must be very strong - this takes a lot of force to cut the threads.
Not easy to do this particular task, especially without prior experience.

[mcamera]

I suspect you are not going to revisit trying to thread the cable end(s) but if you do some tips -
Must be a good sharp die (you said it was new), not a cheap die from a low cost tap/die set either.
Sand/grind off chrome if exists (as mentioned above it is another problem spot).
Put a little taper, say 1/4" or less, on the end of the shaft to help the die get started.
You just about must have a lathe or other alignment jig that will hold the die and the shaft in center alignment to each other or the die will walk off center very easily creating a nasty, crooked set of threads that run further off center of the shaft as you get deeper through the die.
Top notch threading lube.
Grip/hold on both the shaft and die must be very strong - this takes a lot of force to cut the threads.
Not easy to do this particular task, especially without prior experience.

It was surprisingly difficult and maybe the chrome was to blame as you guys have pointed out. I did add a taper and even then it was very hard to get started. I only got a couple threads cut before the whole piece started spinning and getting chewed up. I spent $65 on a tap/die set thinking I would use it again at some point, but a new cable is $60. I'll just have Midwest Control make me the correct cable with their purpose built tools.

[mcamera]

I'm waiting for my ZDB shifter so I'm tying up loose ends so the car will be ready to go kart. Torqueing down suspension bolts, finishing the rear firewall, mounting my homemade charcoal canister, making sure wires/brake lines won't rub moving parts, and putting the wheels on. Last night was the first time I've had the front wheels on and they hit the coolant lines at less than 1 full turn of the steering wheel. I mocked up a 6mm wheel spacer and there was no improvement. What kind of wheel spacers or steering limiters are you guys running? I don't like the idea of limiting the steering so I want to get wheel spacers but need the body installed first to see how far the wheels can be pushed out. My wheels are within the FFR recommended size but might have a higher offset if I remember correctly, they are 215/40R17 with a 45mm offset. I think FFR says a 40mm offset max.

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[Ajzride]

I might be a little disoriented, but looks like you will hit the side pods before you actually hit your hose. Make sure your hurricane bushings are not upside down, that can cause this issue.

[RPGs818SNA]

It does appear from your first photo that your hurricane bushings are upside down. Rev 1Z of the manual includes a photo of the recommended orientation with the flat arm up. The other issue is the coolant pipe protrudes outside the frame piece below it. One of the splash guards requires it to be inside the outer edge of that frame piece. I could not make my coolant pipes behave that way except by bending them upward and inward 7 degrees 6" from the hard pipe end. A little more bend wouldn't hurt.

Thanks for sharing so many helpful details about your build. I've thoroughly enjoyed following it.

[J R Jones]

RPG you have a good eye for detail I had to look several times to spot the C/A mount bracket. I think the Subaru orientation has to be pulled off and rotated 180 degrees to get the flat tab up and outside.
On the coolant tube. It may help to move the rubber coupler aft. Is the coupler too long? Moving the coupler aft will let the flex tube turn inward sooner, and away from the tire.
jim

[Shawn818c]

you'll need a rack limiter so the tires don't hit the frame. Wallace used something similar from Tractor Supply, but I found these on Amazon.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...KIKX0DER&psc=1

Also, up front I'm using a 1.75" to 1.5" 45* silicone elbow to keep the corrugated coolant lines out of the wheel well.

[STiPWRD]

I'm running the shaft collars as well to limit the steering. I found the split version a bit easier to install.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/31223765859...gAAOSwjBhcCy~D

[Shawn818c]

I'm running the shaft collars as well to limit the steering. I found the split version a bit easier to install.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/31223765859...gAAOSwjBhcCy~D

are those actually 5/8" width? I was only finding the split versions in 1/2"

[STiPWRD]

are those actually 5/8" width? I was only finding the split versions in 1/2"

The exact ones I bought were 1/2" wide. The ones in the link I just found quickly as an example.

[mcamera]

You guys have some awesome feedback. I appreciate you pointing out my mistakes and helping me avoid future problems. My 2020 manual did show that I installed the lower control arm rear mounts upside down if you trust the picture. There's no mention of putting the shorter flange towards the outside of the car or anything like that. I spent a few hours removing and rotating those. That may have improved clearance 1/4" (see pics below of before/after) but did not solve the coolant hose interference. I'll be close to interfering with the side pod as pointed out but I'm not going to worry about that until I get my wheel spacers and alignment dialed in more. But a good thing to keep in my mind.

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I don't think I can move the coolant hose coupler back enough to stay within the frame for the splash guard. I've ordered a pair of 45 degree silicone elbows to bring the coolant hose in. I'll have to drain and refill my coolant but a great suggestion, thank you.

I've ordered a pair of 1" ID double split shaft collars for the steering rack. After seeing that full steering lock doesn't leave a lot of clearance to the sway bar link, now I DO want to limit steering at least a little. Maybe I'll need to limit the steering more when I get the splash guards / side pods on, but either way I'll need these.

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Less exciting but more satisfying, I made a couple aluminum brackets to support the bottom of the coolant degas and overflow bottles. I didn't like how they just hung out there asking for a fatigue failure of the top mounts. The degas bracket uses a 1" and a 0.75" spacer for the bottom mounts (can't be seen in the pic) with M6 bolts. These holes must have been leftover from a bracket I removed but were the only mounting spots close by. Luckily there were 2 so the bracket won't rotate. The overflow mount is 1/8"T x 1.5"W aluminum bar bent 90deg with a rubber grommet to hold the post on the bottle. I'm waiting to paint several brackets all at once, but they'll look more finished in gloss black.

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[Shawn818c]

Sorry, I hate to be the bearer of bad news (or maybe you know already) but where you have the cush clamp on your brake line is where the fender well aluminum rivets to. However, you should still be able to go-kart no issues.

Awesome progress!! I'm impressed, crushing me for sure...

[RPGs818SNA]

The latest digital manual, which FFR sent me upon request, adds a photo and a short note saying that the shorter tab goes up. It’s probably worth asking for.
1Z arm bracket.png

I love your brackets, especially the dogleg one for the degas bottle. It’s simple and elegant, and not beyond first time builders like me. Thanks for sharing it.

[mcamera]

Shawn my heart dropped when you said bad news but luckily that's a small issue. I can move that when I get to the fender well install. I didn't like how the soft line was flopping around when I turned the steering wheel. My driver's side hose was really close to the sharp threads on a sway bar mount bolt. Thanks for the heads up!

RPG I'll email FFR. I'm a first time builder too so it took me awhile to figure out a simple design for both. It looks so simple once you see the final product, but it took some trial and error. I was trying to use some scrap 90deg aluminum that was only 0.75" wide to make the overflow bracket and it was this funky box design with several rivets... I decided it was worth it to buy some wider 1.5" flat aluminum and just bend it. The grommet needed a 0.75" hole which was much easier on the wider aluminum. I'm really proud of the dog leg bracket on the degas bottle. That took me 3 prototypes to come up with. I didn't want to mount the bottle to the frame since the engine moves and I thought I only had 1 hole to mount to on the engine head which would allow the bracket to rotate. I tried this crazy bent bracket that attached to the top degas mounts but decided it didn't offer much support. Then I found that 2nd hole on the engine head behind the coil pack wires and things looked more straight forward. If you need metal that's not readily available at your hardware store I recommend OnlineMetals.com. Cheap prices and my stuff always comes the next day. Shipping larger pieces of metal was way more expensive using McMaster Carr. Good luck on your build!

[Shawn818c]

Shawn my heart dropped when you said bad news but luckily that's a small issue. I can move that when I get to the fender well install. I didn't like how the soft line was flopping around when I turned the steering wheel. My driver's side hose was really close to the sharp threads on a sway bar mount bolt. Thanks for the heads up!

RPG I'll email FFR. I'm a first time builder too so it took me awhile to figure out a simple design for both. It looks so simple once you see the final product, but it took some trial and error. I was trying to use some scrap 90deg aluminum that was only 0.75" wide to make the overflow bracket and it was this funky box design with several rivets... I decided it was worth it to buy some wider 1.5" flat aluminum and just bend it. The grommet needed a 0.75" hole which was much easier on the wider aluminum. I'm really proud of the dog leg bracket on the degas bottle. That took me 3 prototypes to come up with. I didn't want to mount the bottle to the frame since the engine moves and I thought I only had 1 hole to mount to on the engine head which would allow the bracket to rotate. I tried this crazy bent bracket that attached to the top degas mounts but decided it didn't offer much support. Then I found that 2nd hole on the engine head behind the coil pack wires and things looked more straight forward. If you need metal that's not readily available at your hardware store I recommend OnlineMetals.com. Cheap prices and my stuff always comes the next day. Shipping larger pieces of metal was way more expensive using McMaster Carr. Good luck on your build!

Yes, minor for sure. On the passenger side I went to the upright and now the brake line rubs on the sway bar, going to make a stand off or something.

Did you get the aluminum collars that STi posted?

[mcamera]

Yes, minor for sure. On the passenger side I went to the upright and now the brake line rubs on the sway bar, going to make a stand off or something.

Did you get the aluminum collars that STi posted?

I haven't seen how the wheel well aluminum sits yet, but I would think I can install the aluminum and just mount my hose the same way it is now on top of the aluminum.

I bought similar shaft collars on Amazon. Same dimensions but 1/2" wide.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

[Scott Meyer]

Here’s a shot of most the wheel well aluminum. We did the same on the brake lines since there was no guidance on where to mount them. We’ve cut and trimmed the aluminum panel to fit around the brake hard line to flex line mount.

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[mcamera]

Here’s a shot of most the wheel well aluminum. We did the same on the brake lines since there was no guidance on where to mount them. We’ve cut and trimmed the aluminum panel to fit around the brake hard line to flex line mount.

4AD2311C-A25B-44AA-AF04-EB37086332AD.jpeg

Thanks for the pic Scott. The spot I mounted mine brake line was the only spot that kept decent slack in the line at full steering lock (no wheels on). But now that I've put the wheels on and see that I'm going to limit steering, the mounting location should be a little more flexible. I'll likely just cut any aluminum that I need to when I get there.

[mcamera]

Things are looking good. I bought 2 silicone elbows and installed them. A great suggestion from Shawn. On the driver's side this pulled the coolant line completely out of the wheel well. At full steering lock (~1.25 turns) my tire still hits the elbow and my firewall. At 1 steering wheel turn, there is clearance to everything so that's what I'll set my steering rack limiters to for now. Just a reminder that my car is on jacks so the wheels are at their lowest. When I set the car down, the wheels will be pushed outwards a little due to suspension geometry. What you see here is the worst case scenario (wheels have no load / big road bump / jumping a river Dukes of Hazard style).

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On the passenger side I couldn't push the solid aluminum coolant pipe back any further and the elbow still stuck into the wheel well. I removed the pipe and bent it a little more. Now everything clears. There were no problems routing the accordion pipe with these elbows. They don't force the connection into the LCA's or anything like that.

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My tires do go beyond the firewall when turning, but I think it'll still clear my side pods since they don't come all the way up to the firewall. Still to be confirmed when I get further in my build.

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Bleeding my coolant system today and waiting on my ZDB shifter. Then I can go kart for the first time!

[RPGs818SNA]

If you need metal that's not readily available at your hardware store I recommend OnlineMetals.com. Cheap prices and my stuff always comes the next day. Shipping larger pieces of metal was way more expensive using McMaster Carr. Good luck on your build!

Thanks for the link to OnlineMetals.com, Mcamera. I had no idea that there were so many shapes, sizes, and alloys of aluminum. I recently had to make an angled spacer to go between my 2.5L NA exhaust header and the kit tailpipe to keep it from hitting the frame. I went to the local metal recycler to get a 0.2” thick 4”x4” piece of aluminum. In their pile of pieces, there was a 4x10 piece 0.19” thick with a few small holes drilled in it. My template showed I could fit 3 spacers, 2 for practice and one real. It cost a dollar. With a router table and hack saw, I made this spacer that lowered my tailpipe 2.5 degrees, clearing the frame nicely. Like you, I find creating novel solutions most enjoyable. Hope you get to go karting soon.

exhaust spacer.jpg

[mcamera]

I finished insulating the cabin this weekend. There isn't much room between my seats and the side of the car, so I put the insulation on the outside of the panels in that area. The Noico foam insulation says it's good for 190ºF, so we'll see how it does an inch from the coolant pipe carrying 210ºF coolant. I have the butyl/aluminum faced sound deadening underneath the foam too.

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I used 4.75" of wood blocks to set my ride height all around which settled out to 4-5/8". I'm debating going up to 5" for rough Michigan roads. We also have a lot of steep curbed driveways in my area directly off of 50mph roads with no turning lane. I don't think anybody will appreciate me slowing down to 2mph to crawl over a curb.

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I've started on the body work and it's messy. I'm already annoyed that FFR gave us 5/8" long screws to attach the tail lights through 1/2" of material. There are almost no threads to get the nut on. Looks like I'll have to find longer black screws.

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[Jetfuel]

Thanks for the link to OnlineMetals.com, Mcamera. I had no idea that there were so many shapes, sizes, and alloys of aluminum. I recently had to make an angled spacer to go between my 2.5L NA exhaust header and the kit tailpipe to keep it from hitting the frame. I went to the local metal recycler to get a 0.2” thick 4”x4” piece of aluminum. In their pile of pieces, there was a 4x10 piece 0.19” thick with a few small holes drilled in it. My template showed I could fit 3 spacers, 2 for practice and one real. It cost a dollar. With a router table and hack saw, I made this spacer that lowered my tailpipe 2.5 degrees, clearing the frame nicely. Like you, I find creating novel solutions most enjoyable. Hope you get to go karting soon.

exhaust spacer.jpg

I'll be cautious using aluminum in the exhaust system, the extreme temperatures and contact with dissimilar metal will accelerate the corrosion and cracking, and the difference in expansion will most likely make it a loose joint in no time thus creating a leak.

Jet...my .02

[J R Jones]

I concur with Jetfuel. The corrosive gas/condensate in the exhaust will not be kind, and corrosion of the steel exhaust will accelerate corrosion of the aluminum spacer, like an anode.
jim

[RPGs818SNA]

Thanks Jet and Jim. I had no idea that the aluminum would cause so many problems. Fortunately it’s just for the go kart stage, and will be replaced with a real tailpipe with muffler. It was fun to design and make, and solved my immediate problem, but next time I’ll use stainless.
RPG

[FFRWRX]

I’ve used header gaskets before that are “dead soft” aluminum; fairly common. Is that much different than what is shown here? I honestly don’t know, but I don’t think it is unreasonable to try it.

[mcamera]

My girlfriend's parents are coming up tonight for a vacation in Traverse City and her dad is really into cars, so I temporarily rigged up the FFR shifter so I could take him for a ride. The shifter feels awful, the turning radius isn't great, and there are no seatbelts, but it's drivable! The engine pulls great up to 4000rpm with the mildest Cobb tune. I didn't want to go any faster in my neighborhood which is good because I forgot to tighten my lug nuts. Out of all the things I checked I forgot one of the basics. But that's why you take it easy on the first drive. They're torqued down now. I also saw a cop fly by on the main road with his lights on and decided to park the car just in case.



Rear bumper is looking good and I'm waiting on the ZDM shifter that I hope greatly improves the shift quality.

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[mcamera]

My family and I were having a great vacation in Northern Michigan until we hit a deer on the highway yesterday. I was driving my mom's Equinox next to a truck and didn't see the deer until they ran in front of the truck. I missed the 1st one but hit the 2nd one at about 70mph. Nobody was hurt, just a few scrapes and ringing ears from the airbags. We were grateful the deer hit low and didn't come through the windshield. It makes you appreciate the safety in modern cars and wonder how well the 818 would do in a crash with its low hood and no a-pillar or roof structure. I didn't think you would feel a 200lb deer that much when hitting it with a 3500lb car, but it felt like driving through a wall.

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[mikeb75]

Happy to hear no one was injured, sorry about the accident!

e=mc^2 ... lots of energy to dissipate, glad it went through your car (mostly).

[Jetfuel]

Thank God you all were not hurt.
Count your Blessings
As for an 818...it will take the legs out from under making the deer land flat way high on the hood and that’s as far as I want to think about that scenario

Jet

[J R Jones]

Mcam, That is a lot of air bag deployment. Looks expensive. If the windshield was also broken, I would predict a total.
I had a buck take-out the LF fender and left doors on my E46 BMW which totaled that, but no air bags were involved. CL parts made it a DIY bolt on. Even the right color!
The blue on that SUV looks great. Mom OK?
Yeah you don't want to confront animals with an 818s or a motorcycle.
jim

[mcamera]

Thanks for the kind words. My mom is fine, she was in the back seat furthest from the impact. We're waiting on the insurance adjustor to tell us if it's totaled. It's a 2019 Equinox so it's still worth a good amount of money. It'll be close.

[mcamera]

I cut out the side vent and gas cap hole on the driver's side. I'll paint the vent and gas cap black but I don't think I like the wirey mesh and thick surrounding metal on the side vent. I may cut the vent larger and just do a thicker black mesh behind it without the metal border. I need to look around for inspiration before I cut the hole bigger.

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I received 1 glossy and 1 matte headlight bucket so I emailed FFR. Their supplier updated to the matte style and I just happened to get 1 of the old glossy buckets. They shipped me a matching matte bucket within a few days. I taped the headlight in place to help hold it while I drilled my holes. It would be really hard to hold it in place with 1 hand while drilling with the other hand because it slides around so easily. This also gave me a chance to step back and make sure it was centered well with the body opening. I drilled in the middle of the body flange as directed but in 2 places that put my hole right next to the bucket. The bucket flange is round and narrow in a couple spots which doesn't help. My bolt would go straight into the side of the bucket at the angle needed to be flush on the body. You can see in my pics that the bolt wouldn't sit flush on the body because it was hitting the side of the bucket.

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I debated how to get those 2 bolts flush. Drilling in another location with a flatter flange would rule out the entire outside perimeter of the headlight which would mean no support on that side of the bucket. Cutting the bolt shorter wouldn't help because the nut was actually jammed up against the side of the bucket, forcing the bolt to follow that bad angle. I eventually ran to the hardware store and bought some smaller #6 countersunk bolts. The bolt/nut is small enough to allow a better angle and the smaller head means it sits lower in the countersunk hole of the body flange so it doesn't stick out. In the pic below they're the 2 bolts on the right side of the bucket. You'll also notice just above the headlight that I had to re-drill 1 hole because the bolt landed inside of the plastic headlight bracket where I couldn't reach to attach a nut.

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I'm still working on trimming/molding the headlight lens with a heat gun. I want the perimeter to be as flush with the body flange as possible for the double sided tape. I don't want 1 area to have a gap and be constantly trying to peel the tape up. Did everybody paint a black perimeter on the lens on the outside? I'd like to paint the border on the inside of the lens so the paint doesn't get chipped from road debris. But I don't know if that will adhere/hold up well with the double sided tape?

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[FFRWRX]

I don't think I like the wirey mesh and thick surrounding metal on the side vent. I may cut the vent larger and just do a thicker black mesh behind it without the metal border. I need to look around for inspiration before I cut the hole bigger.

I agree, not crazy about the look with the metal surround. A thinner one maybe? Or as you say, a clean vent cutout with the metal behind it. I'll see what you come up with.

[idf]

[QUOTE=mcamera;457047]I cut out the side vent and gas cap hole on the driver's side. I'll paint the vent and gas cap black but I don't think I like the wirey mesh and thick surrounding metal on the side vent. I may cut the vent larger and just do a thicker black mesh behind it without the metal border. I need to look around for inspiration before I cut the hole bigger.

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I had originally installed the vent and border powder coated black and decided I didn't like it. I cut out the vent larger and left it open with the inner fender well painted black. I think it looks good and hopefully flows more air.Vent.jpg

[J R Jones]

Warning Mcam, Counter sink head fasteners are problematic with plastic parts. The head shape puts a spreading clamp load on the inside of the hole and will cause radial cracks around the hole.
Any flat bottom head is better, Socket head button head, phillips head or slot head. Even a carriage type fastener could work, but that head diameter is usually larger. "T" bolts could work but are rare.
The 818R guys enlarge the side vents and go for a sharper radius on the leading edge of the scoop for more air. (Hobby Racer & Sgt Gator)
jim

[narkosys]

for the side vents, have you seen VRaptor's side scoops?