Jim's Build Thread

[sethmark]

I’m on track usually twice a month. Rarely not on property. Stop by next time.

[33fromSD]

100% official...fully registered & titled. The state let me do single rear plate only which is great, now I don't need to be worried about anything in the front. Actual Title will be in my hands in 2-4 weeks and the rear plate will be in my hands in 10-14 days. They issued me a temporary 45 day plate in the meantime for me to enjoy the car. If anything gets held up with the plate they will issue another 45 day temporary plate at no additional cost.

Now I just need to play with the alignment and start having some fun with thing.

Office build time (kit arrival to official state registration):
* Kit arrival = 9/25/2020
* Registered with state = 6/4/2021
* Total time Build time = 8 months & 10 days

Jim

149012

[sethmark]

Big congrats! Go somewhere!!!

[e36m3]

100% official...fully registered & titled. The state let me do single rear plate only which is great, now I don't need to be worried about anything in the front. Actual Title will be in my hands in 2-4 weeks and the rear plate will be in my hands in 10-14 days. They issued me a temporary 45 day plate in the meantime for me to enjoy the car. If anything gets held up with the plate they will issue another 45 day temporary plate at no additional cost.

Now I just need to play with the alignment and start having some fun with thing.

Office build time (kit arrival to official state registration):
* Kit arrival = 9/25/2020
* Registered with state = 6/4/2021
* Total time Build time = 8 months & 10 days

Jim

149012

Congratulations!
Total time Build time = 8 months & 10 days has to be a record for a home build

Andy

[33fromSD]

Congratulations!
Total time Build time = 8 months & 10 days has to be a record for a home build

Andy

Thanks.....I think I could easily beat that if I have not been working full time while doing the 33 build and doing other projects in parallel. Its my program management background which helped set goals / schedules and the biggest of the goals was to do something everyday on the car even if it was only 10 or 15 minutes or even if it was just reading / studying the manual or the car for next steps.

I actually miss the daily activity now. Better get back to my 55 F100.

Jim

[sethmark]

With all the parts in hand, I’m pretty sure I could build a car in two weeks. What’s missing from that equation is paint and body. Chassis however is easy.

[33fromSD]

With all the parts in hand, I’m pretty sure I could build a car in two weeks. What’s missing from that equation is paint and body. Chassis however is easy.

Agree...I Go-Karted mine a little less than 60 days after I got the kit, only working part time on it......

[33fromSD]

Okay...pretty much have the alignment completed, just need to do the final Toe-in

FFR's final alignment specs for manual steering call for:
Total Toe-in = 1/16"
Camber = -0.5 deg
Caster = + 3 - 4 deg (although as James points out I like the feeling of the Power Steering setting of + 4 - 7 deg)

My initial settings from the build (just roughly assembling stuff) was:
Total Toe = Severe pigeon toe :rolleyes:
Camber = +1.5 deg ( really bad for tire wear on normal road driving) :confused:
Caster = +13.2 deg (whoops) :rolleyes:
Drove okay for go-kart / first ride after finishing, but you could tell the toe was way off by how it plowed and with 245/40R18s on the front, the steering was very hard (lot of rubber to turn at that camber / caster)

After working on the alignment, I am now at:
Total Toe = ~0" (Still setting this)
Camber = -0.5 deg
Caster = + 7.3 deg

Still working on the final toe-in.

Drove it with the latest settings to make sure I was close and it was night and day difference.....tracked well when no hands were on the steering wheel, turned easy at speed (slower speeds being manual steering it turned harder as one would expect but much much better than it was in my original set up), there was no wondering on the road at speed either. Think I just need to complete the final toe-in and I'll be good to go.

Jim

[33fromSD]

SoDak must be pretty slow for things to do when it comes to titles. I was told it would take 2-4 weeks possibly longer to get my title and I got my title from the state today.

I first registered the car officially last Friday (6/4)...didn't even have the inspection until (6/2). I'm guessing since the inspection was 6/2 and the inspector was from the head office he just went ahead and processed the title once I registered it last Friday verses letting it go through the normal channels.

Odd I got the title before my plate but not complaining..... Another chapter I can close.

Jim

[33fromSD]

Got the final toe-in set last night. I figure I'll recheck Camber, Caster & Toe after I put a few hundred miles on it. Just need to do a really good cleaning yet and then let the cruising begin.

Jim

[33fromSD]

Came back from a trip to Florida and in the mail box was my rear plate....now 100% titled / registered / licensed!!

Installed the plate this morning, took out the 33 for a nice cruise through town, pulled into the Starbucks parking lot to grab a coffee with a friend I was meeting and in pulls a police car who parks a couple spots away.

He walks up all serious like and says "morning", I say morning, he says "I have a problem with this car"......my heart sinks, thinking what the heck did I or didn't I do, so I say what is the issue officer, and he says "that it's not parked in my garage, this thing is really nice. I followed you for about 2 miles and was hoping you were going to stop so I could check it out. What is it, where did you buy it from?". I gave him all the details and he said "he's seen cobra replicas in town but this is the first 33 Hot Rod in town, I like it, sharp car".

Had some other small talk, he finally said he needed to get going and told me to enjoy the ride but "be careful out there" and left.

Kind of cool, I've had a little attention with our 70 challenger but never like this.

Also brought our 2015 Challenger Scat Pack home this morning too. Latest I've ever pulled out the toys. Been a busy spring with home projects, work & a trip.

Jim

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[cob427sc]

It's great that he showed such interest in the car. About 20 years ago, in my first cobra, I got pulled over by a local cop. Couldn't figure out why he would do it other than maybe the exhaust noise. Actually he was in love with the car and ended up buying it from me!

[33fromSD]

It's great that he showed such interest in the car. About 20 years ago, in my first cobra, I got pulled over by a local cop. Couldn't figure out why he would do it other than maybe the exhaust noise. Actually he was in love with the car and ended up buying it from me!

Nice

[33fromSD]

100 miles on her now, it's been running great, but then tonight I was cruising along on the city roads enjoying the ride and I heard a small backfire out of the exhaust, no biggie, the next mile was fine and all of a sudden the engine stuttered a little bit, I came a stop light and it stalled...... oh oh...

Started up just fine, continued on when the light changed, ran good for about another 1/2 mile and she started stuttering really bad and choked off.....great thing about a manual tranny is just push in the clutch, retire it and she started back up and I continued along but then it started doing this about every 30 yards, I couldn't keep it going.

I was lucky I was only ~1/2 mile from home so I limped it along on the shoulder with the hazards on (starting it, getting it going about 20 mph and it choking off; rinse & repeat). Made it home, backed it into the garage, open the hood, nothing noticeable (no leaking gas, no burnt wires, etc.), I don't think it's a heat issue or I would have thought it would have done it the first 75 miles. Letting it run in the garage it switches from running smooth like nothing is wrong to running rough and almost stalling or stalling. Odd.

Seems like a fuel delivery issue to me, at this point I'm not suspecting electrical since it always starts right up, I'm wondering if my electric fuel pump is clogged or failing.

I'm going to let it sit over night and start it cold to see if it still switches from running smooth to running rough / stalling.

No worries, I'll figure it out, I just shouldn't have told a buddy I saw this morning that it's running like champ. :o

Jim

[narly1]

Sounds like you are on the right track by checking for a fuel delivery issue.

You might also want to check that your fuel tank venting is not obstructed as well. Run with the filler cap open would be a simple check.

Another thing might be vapor lock....

[33fromSD]

Sounds like you are on the right track by checking for a fuel delivery issue.

You might also want to check that your fuel tank venting is not obstructed as well. Run with the filler cap open would be a simple check.

Another thing might be vapor lock....

I was hoping you were going to comment narly1. :D Thanks for the input, I'll look into this stuff, it will be later this weekend when I get back to really looking at this.

I was thinking vapor lock last night too when I was lying in bed thinking about this. Besides the venting check I will also trying a couple things regarding potential vapor lock. if I have room (need to check) I'll install a phenolic spacer between the carb & the intake to help reduce some of the heat transfer and I will add some type of heat shielding around the fuel line.

I know when I used an infared temp gauge on various parts of the engine last night, the air cleaner housing was pretty warm.... measured 138F but that was when I had the engine off for about 5 minutes with the hood closed so with heat rising I'm not 100% sure how much of that was heat radiating up in the cool down cycle.

Jim

[narly1]

Thanks for the vote of confidence but I'm hardly an expert on stuff like this. Just trying to help a fellow enthusiast out where I can.

The fact that it was running fine for the first 90-100 miles is a clue....What changed in the last little bit to make it behave the way it is?

This points to the clogging and vapour lock issues.

Venting is probably not the problem or you would have seen it earlier. That being said it's easy to check so why not eliminate it as the problem?

One other thing you might try is running without a hood and sides for a while. If that's all good then it means excessive heat (probably causing vapour lock) is the issue. Again easy to do and costs nothing to try except a bit of your time.

You didn't use teflon tape on any of the fuel line joints by any chance?

[33fromSD]

Thanks for the vote of confidence but I'm hardly an expert on stuff like this. Just trying to help a fellow enthusiast out where I can.

The fact that it was running fine for the first 90-100 miles is a clue....What changed in the last little bit to make it behave the way it is?

This points to the clogging and vapour lock issues.

Venting is probably not the problem or you would have seen it earlier. That being said it's easy to check so why not eliminate it as the problem?

One other thing you might try is running without a hood and sides for a while. If that's all good then it means excessive heat (probably causing vapour lock) is the issue. Again easy to do and costs nothing to try except a bit of your time.

You didn't use teflon tape on any of the fuel line joints by any chance?

Thanks narly1....Agree on all...correct, no teflon tape used on any of the fuel line joints.

Jim

[narly1]

Sorry I had to ask about the tape....as I tend to troubleshoot things based on the the sentiment of this quote:

“Once you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the truth.” - Sherlock Homes”

Especially when something's previously owned and new to me!

Earl

[33fromSD]

Sorry I had to ask about the tape....as I tend to troubleshoot things based on the the sentiment of this quote:

“Once you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the truth.” - Sherlock Homes”

Especially when something's previously owned and new to me!

Earl

No worries at all Earl, I tend to look at all options too.

Thinking about your initial question "The fact that it was running fine for the first 90-100 miles is a clue....What changed in the last little bit to make it behave the way it is?" The short answer is nothing, at least from a mechanical standpoint.

The longer answer is the biggest change is / was driving length & outside temp. The initial 90-100 miles were all 2 miles here, 3-4 miles there, 10-15 minute type runs doing errands, taking people for rides, etc. in 70-80 degree temps. Last night was the first attempt at a longer cruise. I was ~30-45 minutes into the cruise when it started and the outside temp was in the low 90s. I also hit a few stop lights which were fairly lengthy with several lanes of cars around me so little to no airflow besides the electric fan (which worked fine).

Given that, I'm leaning towards vapor lock but I have some stuff to check out before fully making that conclusion.

Jim

[33fromSD]

Good news.....I'm going to officially make the conclusion that my issues is vapor lock due to heat. Why you ask?.......I had 30 minutes before heading to my meeting so I started the 33 up, ran like a champ, no stumbling, good idle, so I decided to take it out for a quick spin (was a little leary cause I didn't have time to get stranded)....drove it about 10 minutes (couple miles), never had any issues, ran like it did the 1st 100 miles. Outside temp is upper 70s (78F).

To try to solve for a Vapor Lock issue I have ordered the following:
1) 1/2" fiber spacer for between the carb & Intake to insulate the carb from direct intake heat
2) 15 feet of DEI thermal tape for insulating the fuel lines by the engine, anything close to the exhaust and the fuel pump
3) WIX 33040 vapor separator fuel filter
4) 25 ft of 1/4 vapor line so I can run from the WIX filter back to the 1/4" port on the FFR sending unit (right now mine is capped off).

Everything should be here early next week.

I "think" if I can get the fuel system insulated from some of the heat it will solve my issue. Time will tell.

Jim

[narly1]

I have another troubleshooting idea that involves another drive for a similar distance on an equally warm day with a cooler full of ice in the trunk.

[RoadRacer]

Now that you mention it, I did have the same thing happen to me at one of my very first races in the GT40 when I was still setting it up. I had been idling for way too long in the queue for a 1/2 mile sprint on a warm day, and when I when to pull away it was like the fuel pump was playing up - a horrible run.
I added a 1" phenolic (?) spacer under the carb, and this wonderful insulation (https://www.pegasusautoracing.com/productselection.asp?Product=3299) around all fuel lines around the engine (I LOVE this stuff). Solved all the problems.

[33fromSD]

I have another troubleshooting idea that involves another drive for a similar distance on an equally warm day with a cooler full of ice in the trunk.

That's an interesting idea Earl, I'll give that a try sometime this weekend since my parts don't show up until mid-next week anyway.

I do have sound barrier under my tank so that will insulate it some from heat but I'm wondering if I should see if I can install something under the frame by the tank area.

Jim

[33fromSD]

Now that you mention it, I did have the same thing happen to me at one of my very first races in the GT40 when I was still setting it up. I had been idling for way too long in the queue for a 1/2 mile sprint on a warm day, and when I when to pull away it was like the fuel pump was playing up - a horrible run.
I added a 1" phenolic (?) spacer under the carb, and this wonderful insulation (https://www.pegasusautoracing.com/productselection.asp?Product=3299) around all fuel lines around the engine (I LOVE this stuff). Solved all the problems.

Good to hear it solved your issue James, gives me a little piece of mind that I'm on the right trail.

This is my first experience with "vapor lock", so now I understand what folks are referring to...I've dealt with heat soak / saturation tons of time on my older mustangs where they were tough to start after being shut off after along run, but never vapor lock.

I watched a video the other day on you tube where a company attached a clear fuel line to the car to show vapor lock and when the engine was cool, there was a solid flow of fuel in the line with no bubbles, and as the engine heated up, more and more bubbles formed in the fuel line and worked their way towards the carb until there was only bubble (vapor) in the line and the engine stumbled and then stalled. Pretty neat to see.

Jim

[narly1]

Intuitively thinking about vapour lock I'd be more concerned about the insulating the fuel lines (small size component + small volume of fuel = less thermal mass= easier to heat up) than the tank (big component + bigger volume of fuel = large thermal mass = harder to heat up).

If you do some reading on return systems one of the benefits often mentioned is that you are constantly delivering cool fuel to the engine.

Earl

[33fromSD]

I have another troubleshooting idea that involves another drive for a similar distance on an equally warm day with a cooler full of ice in the trunk.

Hi Earl

I gave the cooler full of ice in the trunk suggestion a try yesterday (left the lid off) where outside temps were in the mid-90's (similar to the other day). I also took the exact same route I took the first time this happened, and almost in the exact same spot (I mean eerily within ~50 yards) the car started acting up again and then got worse from there (stumbling, stalling, couldn't keep running, etc.).

Once I limped it home, I Let it sit about 2 hours, then restarted it, and was back to being fine so definitely a vapor lock situation going on here.

Everything I ordered to mitigate the issue should be here today / tomorrow.

Jim

[narly1]

LOL I should have been more specific. I was thinking more along the lines of packing ice around the carb/intake/fuelines.

I don't know how practical my idea is though, thinking about leakage and how to enclose the ice in something that won't melt or catch on fire....maybe put the ice in ziplock bags and then wrap the bags in tin foil?

[33fromSD]

LOL I should have been more specific. I was thinking more along the lines of packing ice around the carb/intake/fuelines.

I don't know how practical my idea is though, thinking about leakage and how to enclose the ice in something that won't melt or catch on fire....maybe put the ice in ziplock bags and then wrap the bags in tin foil?

Oops!! ;) Somebody told me to try those cans of compressed air you use to clean your keyboards when it acts up...supposedly the air comes out very cold and may be enough to cool the carb / lines to figure out (temporarily) if it is vapor lock.

Probably doesn't matter, parts will be here soon so I'll know soon enough.

Jim

[narly1]

Actually you can buy chiller spray for that exact purpose. It gets used alot in electronics troubleshooting, particularly for finding bad solder joints.

[33fromSD]

As part of the steps to resolve my vapor lock issue, last night I got the electric fuel pump moved from the engine bay to the back of the car under the frame about a foot from the filter so fairly close to the tank outlet.

Next up I'm going to install the fiber spacer under the carb to reduce the metal to metal heat transfer from the intake to the carb. I do need to check clearance however before I rip everything apart. I only went with a 1/2" spacer but with 2 gaskets (one below and one above the spacer) we are talking closer to 3/4" and I know with my dual side flow air cleaner I have I'm fairly close to the hood already, just not sure how close. Need to pull out the silly putty to see what clearance I have.

I will also reroute my gas line to get it further away from the headers (right now it's about 3" from the header running up the side of the head) as well as put heat shield on it to help insulate it from the heat.

Finally, I ordered heat shield fabric (not wrap) for the shorty headers which should help to reduce a lot of the heat radiating up from the headers.

I'm hoping with all this that I will have solved my vapor lock issue. Should know by the end of the weekend.

Jim

[33fromSD]

Last night I installed the fiber spacer between the carb & intake (verified clearnance between hood & carb before & after).
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Next I rerouted my fuel line away from the headers and installed the DEI insulation. As noted previously, originally I had it mounted directly on the driver's side head so it was only ~3" from the headers. Now the hard line is mounted to the frame and there is a flex line that runs from the carb to the frame (can't see it with the insulation installed).
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Next I installed the insulation on the entire fuel line that runs along the rocker area and up into the engine bay as well as a 2 foot section of brake line that is about 3" away from the muffler on the driver's side.
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Fired it back up to make sure there were no leaks as a result of the new plumbing (all good) and let it come up to temp. I was amazed at the temp difference on the fuel lines with just the insulation added. Prior to doing this you could not keep your hand on the fuel line by the carb for a long period of time due to the heat, now I can grab the line and leave it there. Not a real test mind you, but encouraging.

I didn't let it idle for an extended period of time with the hood closed or take it for a long run yet to avoid jinxing myself. I want to make sure I have the heat shield installed on the heaters first which completed my overall plan before doing so. The heat shield should arrive tomorrow (Friday) and I'll install it Saturday and give it a try. I also ordered some DEI insulation for wiring in which I want to install that on the wires running along the intake manifold as an added piece of mind.

First test I want to do when everything is installed is bring it out in the driveway and just let it idle for an extended period. I figure hood closed & just idling while not moving is a worst case situation and if it doesn't vapor lock after an hour or so I think we are good. Next as a comparison, I'll take the same driving route I took when the issue surfaced. Looks like the temps this weekend will be within a degree or two (upper 80's / low 90's) of where they were when I had the issue so it should be a comparable test.

Finger's crossed

Jim

[sethmark]

Two things that I’ve used historically to fight vapor lock. Best is a return line back to the gas tank. That way when the needle seats and the fuel pump keeps pumping it bypasses back to the gas tank. Secondly, you can go old-school and put clothes pins on the metal line to help dissipate the heat and see if it helps. Back in the day used to see fuel lines with literally dozens.

[33fromSD]

Two things that I’ve used historically to fight vapor lock. Best is a return line back to the gas tank. That way when the needle seats and the fuel pump keeps pumping it bypasses back to the gas tank. Secondly, you can go old-school and put clothes pins on the metal line to help dissipate the heat and see if it helps. Back in the day used to see fuel lines with literally dozens.

I installed a WIX #33040 Fuel Filter (link below) last night in the 33. This filter has an added output for a 1/4" return line back to the tank and a lot of folks experiencing vapor lock noted their issues were resolved after installing this.

I then ran a 1/4" line back to the tank and used the 1/4" return inlet on the fuel sender.

I'm getting really good at stripping the interior (seat, waterfall trim, waterfall) with all the fuel and radio issues I've been working on lately. :D

https://www.amazon.com/WIX-Filters-Complete-Line-Filter/dp/B000C9UJAA/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=WIX+Filters+-+33040+Fuel+%28Complete+In-Line%29+Filter&qid=1626428656&sr=8-1

Jim

[33fromSD]

The header heat shield kit was delayed getting to me; was supposed to arrive Friday, finally got it yesterday. I did the passenger side last night (started with the hardest side first). Interesting process, lots of patience is required, but it turned out nice.

It basically comes in two 18"x24" sheets (rolled up). You make a template using butcher's paper or some other stiffer but flexible material (cardboard was too stiff). Next you lay your template on the heat shield material and trace your template onto the heat shield making all lines 1/2" wider.

Next, cut out your shape in the material and then you take a sharp utility knife and carefully cut through the white insulation (only the insulation) 1/2" in front your edge and remove the 1/2" of insulation all the way around the shape just leaving the foil. Next you fold the exposed 1/2" of foil over all the edges and it leaves you with your original shape matching your template but you now have clean edges due to folding over the edges.

Mount the heat shield onto the header using the provided stainless steel wire (use as much as or as little as you'd like) shaping it as you go. If you take your time the results are pretty good, just due to lack of room the passenger side was pretty challenging but the driver's side should be much easier.

Originally I tried winging it and not making a template and it was too cumbersome trying to move around the 18x24 sheet in a tight spot. A template is definitely the way to go.

The interesting thing about this stuff is you don't completely wrap the header, you're just wrapping the heatshielf over the top and around the sides, the underneath is still open so you're not voiding the header warranty. Supposed to reduce heat by 40%, guess we'll see.

I also added heat shielding tube to the spark plug boots since they are fairly close to the header. Some are thing this is a bunch of overkill I know, but I don't want to have to worry about excess heat any more.

I'll do the driver side tonight and do a quick test but then this weekend start it up and just let it idle (worst case scenario) in the driveway with everything closed up for a good hour or so to see how much of a difference there is in temps. I'm confident with all this (including my fuel system changes) that my vapor lock issue will be resolved.

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Jim

[FF33rod]

Will be interesting to see what changes. It should stop direct radiation onto other components so individual hot spots should be reduced.
Nice job on forming the shape!

Steve

[33fromSD]

Driver's side done. I included some pics to show the pattern and taking off 1/2" of insulation and folding the foil over in case I confused some folks.

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I ran the engine until it came up to temp with the hood closed and the results when I open the hood are actually unbelievable. Prior to the heat shield I was measuring 250-300F on the headers easily, and with the heat shield on you can see the temps I took (mid 130s - 150's), pretty much that 40%+ temp reduction the company advertised I would see.

Passenger side:
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Driver side:
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Granted, the true test will be when I just let it idle for an extended period of time in the driveway tomorrow with everything closed up. And of course cruising the same loop when I noticed the vapor lock issue.

Jim

[33fromSD]

Just got done letting the 33 idle in the driveway for an hour & fifteen minutes. There was no stumbling what so ever, so I then took it out for a short cruise (about 15 minutes) and again, no stumbling or misses, it ran strong.

Temps taken on the heat shield on the headers with the hood closed (checked it through the port holes) stayed consistent with the readings above. I checked them every fifteen minutes.

The engine after idling so long climbed to about 210-215 (never got to 220), however the electric fan kept up with it. Once I started my cruise engine temps dropped down to about 190-195. Interesting thing is the port holes I have work better than I thought. With it idling in the driveway and the electric fan going, there is a constant flow of hot air exiting the port holes. I held up a tissue to one of the port holes and there is definitely a decent current coming through them.

I do need to check my 1/4" return line by the tank that I just installed, I now have a fumey smell in the cockpit by the shoulder belt holes and that being the only thing I did to the tank I'm guessing that's the source.

I'm going to call the vapor lock issue resolved. Yay!!

Jim

[33fromSD]

Also took some pics yesterday when it was outside in the driveway.

I included a pic once it was back on the lift looking up at the rear. To me at least, it's cool looking pic (would have been better if I remembered to turn the trunk handle down to the close position, but oh well).

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Jim

[RoadRacer]

wow

[progmgr1]

Very nice job! I hope mine looks that good, someday...
Keith HR #894

[33fromSD]

Last time I posted, I let the car run for an hour plus in the drive way with no signs of vapor lock and then I took it out for a spirited 15 minute drive with no vapor lock so I called the issue resolved which it still is, but I noted that I had a slight gas smell coming from the holes where the seat belts exit. I initially thought it may have been the 1/4" return line I installed (either a clamp not tight enough or I didn't seat it right on the sender nipple).

Today after resolving my stereo issue I was having, I was contemplating taking out the interior one more time (getting good at it) to get a better look at the tank to see if I had a leak. I decided to take the car out first since the smell was more of a slight smell than a strong odor you get when gas is physically leaking. Figured the risk was pretty low but I did throw a fire extinguisher in the car just in case.

After about 40 minutes of cruising (nice to not have to worry about vapor lock any more), I came home, pulled in the garage, and started smelling around the seat belt openings and nothing, not even the slight hint of gas odor.

Any thoughts on that? Is it because when I had it in the driveway idling that perhaps the vent line under the car from the tank was causing vapor odors to rise up into the body cavity exiting out the seat belt holes and by just driving it today the moving air doesn't allow and odors to accumulate under the body and get into the body?

I have an endoscope camera so after I got back and didn't notice any odors, I looked in through the seat belt holes on top of the tank by the hoses and down the right & left side of the tank as well as some of the front and there is no signs of leaking gas anywhere.

Does my theory about vapor rising into the body from the vent line under the car from idling so long hold water, or what does every one think? Not sure if I should mark this down as a fluke and life goes on or if I should dig deeper.

Jim

[RoadRacer]

All I'll say is that when I *fill* my tank, the car smells of gas.. after 5-10 miles it's gone. I just figure when it's super full some gas sloshes down the vent and you can smell it. I don't have a charcoal canister or anything, just an open-ended hose, so I was always surprised it didn't smell all the time (it's just an open hose to a tank of gas after all!)

[33fromSD]

All I'll say is that when I *fill* my tank, the car smells of gas.. after 5-10 miles it's gone. I just figure when it's super full some gas sloshes down the vent and you can smell it. I don't have a charcoal canister or anything, just an open-ended hose, so I was always surprised it didn't smell all the time (it's just an open hose to a tank of gas after all!)

Same As me James, I just have the open ended hose. I may add a charcoal filter, not sure yet. I've heard some folks who've added the charcoal filter are having more issues with fumes so I need to research those some.

Thinking about it more last night, I'm wondering since I added the 1/4" return line for the Wix filter that I added which is supposed to help bleed off excess gas due to the fuel pump as well as vapor from the line to the carb, if since I ran it so long idling in the drive way to test if I resolved the vapor lock issue if that was pushing more pressure into the tank and pushing "warmer" gas / vapor from the engine bay into the tank causing more out-gasing out of the the vent line.

I know when we get these 90 plus degree days that my 5 gallon plastic gas container for filling the mower builds up pressure too, and actually hisses when I open the spout due to the pressure. The 33 could be a similar situation where I created an excessive amount of pressure by not only idling the car for over an hour in one spot but also having the car in the driveway on a sunny, hot (90+ degree) day.

Not sure; I'll just have to keep an eye on it (or a nose).

Jim

[33fromSD]

Finally got around to fixing my booboo from a couple months back where I got the running boards hung up on the trailer while loading it for my inspection and cracked the driver's side running board....still pissed about that, but now it's as good as new and I can put it behind me, just need to cut & buff the area in 48 hours.

After I did the fiber glassing and body filler, I used an air brush for the primer, base & clear....worked pretty damn good. Mixing the material thin enough for the air brush was a PITA but it worked.

Before
152998

After
152999

Jim

[33fromSD]

1 year ago yesterday (9/25) my 33 Hot Rod kit was delivered.

Not to be overly sentimental since I've done a lot of restoration over the years which is almost like a kit car once everything is cleaned up and the reassembly begins, but I'd have to say the whole build your own kit car from the ground up experience was probably one of the funnest builds I ever did. I kind of miss it.

Looking back, I'm not quite sure how I completed the car in a little over 8 months while working 70 hours a week at my day job, but I managed to pull it off. It was a very hectic (in a good way) time but now I find myself with what I could equate to adrenaline let down. Your going like crazy on the car and then it's done. Sure there is still tweaking to be done, but for the most part, the build is done, registered, licensed, insured and on the road so there is this dare i say sadness that it's done. It sure was a fun build build though, I'd do it again in a heart beat. My wife actually actually hinted at the FFR truck the other day. Time will tell.

For now, the 2021 winter project is to get the 55 F100 I took a hiatus on to work on the 33 finished up to the full assembled / mock up stage where I can hopefully get it into paint sometime in April. As you can see from the pics, the frame is sandblasted / painted & the new TCI IFS front & parabolic leaf spring rear suspension with Curry 9" rear end is installed, new box, fenders, bed is installed and the new 302 crate motor is in, although it needs to come again to adjust drive line angles.

I'm bringing it home today to my home garage so I can work on it on the weekends (primarily Saturday afternoons & Sundays) and on Saturday mornings / early afternoon I'll tackle the final body prep on my 67 Mustang convertible I've been working on for a couple years (all the new metal is installed). Hoping to get that in paint by April as well (if not sooner).

9/25/2020 Kit Delivery
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May 2021 Completion
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Winter 2021 Project - 55 F100
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Keep moving forward on those builds everyone. I love watching the progress on everyone's builds.

Jim

[33fromSD]

For those interested, here is some pics of the 67 Mustang with all the metal work completed

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Jim

[Straversi]

The 33 is gorgeous. Congratulations! Love the full fenders and running boards.
Glad you found a few more projects to keep you busy. You are a machine.
-Steve

[RoadRacer]

Yeah, beautiful - my favorite "finished" 33 :D

I owned a 56 F100 once - actually owned it twice - still have fond memories. Have fun with it!

[narly1]

"Finished" is just a state of mind, LOL.

If the builder is happy with the result thus far then mission accomplished!

Earl

[33fromSD]

Hey all, just checking in, it's been a while.

I miss working on the 33, but I really miss driving it (stored for the winter). The frame off restoration on my 1955 F100 pickup is coming along nicely. Started the engine today for the first time, sounds great.

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engine video --> https://photos.app.goo.gl/CUUSGHqbgDoGCP749

Jim

[33fromSD]

Not much on the 33 (still stored for winter, couple more months), I sprayed the sealer and base on the box of the 55 F100 yesterday, will do the clear coat this morning.

Color is '08-13 Chevy Atomic Orange. Decided to tint the sealer in case I get stone chips it will hide a little more. My daughter damn near had a stroke when she saw the sealer; "Please tell me that is not the color it's going to be Dad" She says.

Sealer --> 163372

Base --> 163373 163374 163375

Jim

[33fromSD]

Tailgate, front stone guard, and some misc smaller parts painted Thursday night. Took them out of the booth this morning.

Couple runs that need to be addressed but it is what it is. I believe this is because while the homemade paint booth does great at pulling out the fumes / over spray it also sucks a good portion of the heat out so the ventilation keeps the parts right at the lower end of curing for the clear and then until I figured that out I wasn't giving the parts enough time to fully flash between coats so I'm getting runs. Fixable, just more work.

Doing the rear fenders today, I'll proof that theory when I clear those. The good news is color is going on. (y)

Jim

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163856 163857 163858

[33fromSD]

Rear Fenders done. What I mentioned above about cooler temps affecting the clear coat and not waiting long enough between the coats of clear was the exactly the problem.

When I cleared the rear fenders instead of waiting 5-10 minutes between coats like they suggested (@70F) I waited 15-20 minutes (@60-ishF) and the results are dramatic. So much better!

Sure wish I would have thought of this earlier to avoid some work for myself but oh well, live and learn. Now I just need to rinse and repeat this process on the running boards, rear roll pan, front fenders, hood & cab and life will be good.

Just very minor orange peel on the fenders which willl be easy to get out.

Jim

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[33fromSD]

Got a call from a laser engraving company in my hometown yesterday that my data plaque was done. It's been so long that with all the other projects I'm into these days honestly I forgot my wife took it in to have the VIN# laser etched on the plaque and I just assumed it was sitting in some drawer in my shop waiting for me to do something with it.

This company ended up doing it for free and were highly apologetic it took so long. Apparently it got mixed up in some paperwork they had on the counter the day my wife brought it in and it was shoved into a file. We took it in (June of 2021) and it wasn't until Monday this week (August 22nd, 2022) that they opened that particular file for some reason and there sat my plaque.

Kind of a nice surprise. Now I need to figure out where on the firewall to put it.

171438

Jim

[RoadRacer]

Ha, never did use mine!

[33fromSD]

And the plate is now installed before I lose it for another year plus.

171440

Jim

[33fromSD]

Ha, never did use mine!


I honestly thought I still had it in a drawer somewhere. :o

Nice surprise.

Jim

[peterh226]

And the plate is now installed before I lose it for another year plus.

171440

Jim

We engraved ours with a Cricut and I was thinking of a similar placement on the firewall. The official State of Michigan VIN sticker is on the chassis next to the steering shaft.

[Mastertech5]

Nice touch!

[33fromSD]

We engraved ours with a Cricut and I was thinking of a similar placement on the firewall. The official State of Michigan VIN sticker is on the chassis next to the steering shaft.

yup, SoDak puts their official sticker on the door jam (see PIC the day I got it in May of 2021) for "ease of visibility" as the inspector noted. The sticker is formality anyway since the DMV has the VIN in the system, I just wanted the VIN on the date plaque FFR provided permanently attach to the firewall in case down the road the state's sticker ever fell off or got damaged, or the car was repainted, etc.

171447

Jim

[33fromSD]

My wife surprised me with a coffee table book of progression photos she had made for the 33 Hot Rod I built a couple years back (boy, it doesn't seem that long ago already).

She said she'll do something similar for the 55 F100 I'm working on.

Still digging out from the big winter storm we got, I'm hoping to get back to the 55 F100 this weekend.

Jim

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[Just 1 More]

My wife surprised me with a coffee table book of progression photos she had made for the 33 Hot Rod I built a couple years back (boy, it doesn't seem that long ago already).

She said she'll do something similar for the 55 F100 I'm working on.

Still digging out from the big winter storm we got, I'm hoping to get back to the 55 F100 this weekend.

Jim

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Thats cool

[33fromSD]

Finished up the the 55 Ford F100 this weekend (for the most part, couple minor things left), also installed the new rims / tires.

Now all I need is some nice weather so I can start the driving it / tweaking on it / rinse & repeat. Since this was a complete frame off restoration from the ground up, there is bound to be some stuff here or there that needs tweaking.

Jim

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[JimLev]

Very nice Jim.
Love the exhaust exits in the running boards.

[33fromSD]

Very nice Jim.
Love the exhaust exits in the running boards.

Thanks Jim, It took a long time to find exhaust tips that were the same thickness as the running boards, but it paid off. The look is good and the sound is great.

it was a fun build considering it started out like this (pics).

Jim

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[peterh226]

Which 4 post lift do you have? I'm debating what to do and if I have room...

[33fromSD]

Which 4 post lift do you have? I'm debating what to do and if I have room...

Hi Peter

I use Eagle 4-post lifts sourced from Eagle Equipment, they are out of Greensboro, NC so when I order one I can get it in a few days shipped direct to a local hub who will load it on my trailer and off I go. I have 5 now in total (one at our home garage & 4 our shop/storage facility) and have never had any issues with any of them. The oldest one is the one with the 55 F100 on it and that one is going on 10 years old.

Lot of debate between 2-Post & 4-Post lifts, both are good in my opinion, I just personally prefer 4-Post cause I can use them for storage of vehicles in the winter (double stack vehicles) as well as I can use them for pretty much any work needed on any vehicle.

Link --> https://www.eagleequip.com

Jim

[FF33rod]

On the lift topic, a couple of months ago I purchased and installed a mid rise 2 post lift. Love it. Two features sold me on this approach: 1) the posts are portable, bolt them in place for use or unscrew them and wheel them to the corner out of the way 2) I have a low ceiling in the garage so mid rise works perfect, I can sit on a stool under the car no problem. Works great in my tiny "2" car garage....
https://www.babco.ca/MaxJax-M7 (I have the M6)
Steve

[progmgr1]

I have a Max Jax low rise 2 post lift in my garage. Due to a wonky back and knees, I couldn't have built my car without it. That said, a full size 4 post lift would have been easier to use and provided better access to the car, but I just didn't have the vertical space available.

Keith HR #894

[33fromSD]

I have a Max Jax low rise 2 post lift in my garage. Due to a wonky back and knees, I couldn't have built my car without it. That said, a full size 4 post lift would have been easier to use and provided better access to the car, but I just didn't have the vertical space available.

Keith HR #894

Yup, I should have mentioned that. To have a fixed 4-post lift or even 2 post lift you need a minimum 10' ceiling height if you want to be able to stand under a "car". For a truck you'd need min 16' foot ceilings.

I have 10' 6" ceilings in my home garage so I can lift any of our cars and stand under them easily, but the for the 55 F100 I can only lift it about 4 feet which is plenty for a rolling stool to work under the vehicle comfortably. In our shop we have 24' ceilings so no issues on any vehicle.

Jim

Jim

[TxMike64]

Sorry to threadjack Jim... (maybe we could ask for another sub-thread for tools, lifts, general garage stuff)

I like the idea of the 2-post mid-rise MaxJax and have seriously considered them. What are yall's thoughts on a mid-rise scissor jack?

[peterh226]

I just ordered an Advantage DD9000HD 4 post. It will be nice to work underneath and not deal with the jack stands. Guess this means I'm gonna do some more builds in the future. Guess I need to finish this one first!
I decided on the 4 post as I can roll it around and don't have to worry about any concrete issues.

[33fromSD]

55 Ford F100 is done and on the road.

Now I need to get the 33 out of storage.

Jim

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[JimLev]

Great job Jim.
Last week I sent you a PM about your 250 Lb rear springs, did you see it?
If you still have them and want to sell them let me know, I’ve got 300 Lb in the rear and want to soften the rear up a little.

[33fromSD]

Great job Jim.
Last week I sent you a PM about your 250 Lb rear springs, did you see it?
If you still have them and want to sell them let me know, I’ve got 300 Lb in the rear and want to soften the rear up a little.

Sorry Jim, I missed that PM (rarely check it). Let me check if I still have them, I think I do. I need to run out to the shop Saturday anyway, so I'll look then.

Jim

[peterh226]

Referring to post #182
I also learned that you need to get the steel correct, and the door skin will follow. That small bend on the door beam makes a huge difference.

[33fromSD]

Referring to post #182
I also learned that you need to get the steel correct, and the door skin will follow. That small bend on the door beam makes a huge difference.

Yup, many want to blame the fiberglass door shell (not saying those are perfect by any means) but you need to tackle the steel work first before touching the fiberglass. On mine I found 90% of my alignment / fit issues was the metal work twisting the door shell out of shape. After I reshaped the metal work, the other 10% on the fiberglass corrected pretty easy.

Jim

[JimLev]

Sorry Jim, I missed that PM (rarely check it). Let me check if I still have them, I think I do. I need to run out to the shop Saturday anyway, so I'll look then.

Jim

Jim,
Did you get a chance to look for those springs?

Thanks, JimLev

[33fromSD]

Jim,
Did you get a chance to look for those springs?

Thanks, JimLev

Pretty sure I have them, at least I saw a bunch of sets of springs up on the shelf. You're talking the 8" 250 lb springs right?

Jim

[JimLev]

Yes, 8” 250 Lbs.

[33fromSD]

Yes, I physically have them in my hands as I type this, my son ran out to the shop and got them. PM me your address and I'll try to get them shipped out this week sometime.

Jim

[33fromSD]

Hey All

I've been enjoying the 33 quite a bit these past few weeks. It's running very well (definitely solved my vapor lock issue) and it seems like folks really enjoy seeing it out an about in town. Most kids call it a hot wheel. Most adults are either waving / giving thumbs up or asking "what make is it" or "where did you buy it" or "can you pull into a parking lot so I can look at it". Those conversation are great, especially when you tell them them you built it yourself and then it turns into a whole other level of conversation with tons of question / curiosity. It's been really fun.

Actually had one lady when her husband ran inside the gas station for something ask me for the FFR info so she could research it, she was thinking a 33 HR would be a great birthday present for him and since I was in town she asked if she did order it and he if ran into issues when he started building it if I would help. I said yes, so we exchanged contact info. Turns out they only live a few blocks from me.

I don't have the hard top so excessive interior heat is not an issue but one thing I discovered / fixed which may help everyone is I noticed there is a ton of heat the pours into where the fiberglass tunnel cover and the firewall meet. When wearing shorts you could feel hot heat on my knees. After looking deeper into it the area I noticed that was the culprit.

To fix this, I bought some DEI BOOM mat shielding meant for trans tunnels and firewalls (link below). I covered the underside of trans tunnel as much as I could (got about 80% of it), and then where the trans tunnel meets the firewall I did a double layer of this stuff about 1" up on the firewall wrapping it down around to the trans tunnel about 5" on the trans tunnel so I'm completely closing off any gaps between the firewall & the trans tunnel.

The difference is night and day. I no longer feel any excessive heat on my knees or anywhere for that matter. May sound odd, but I also noticed I'm getting better air flow through the vents I installed on the side panels since some of the heat is no longer escaping into the interior and being forced out the side vents.

Figured I'd let folks know in case they have not addressed this area yet, may help the folks with hard tops a lot.

Link --> https://www.summitracing.com/parts/dei-050509

Jim

[narly1]

Re the trans tunnel I was looking at that and was thinking how it isn't much of a heat barrier compared to the sheet aluminum-insulation- sheet aluminum "sandwich" used in the current HR variants.

Your observations confirm this and reinforce my thinking that I will need to do some insulating in that area.

Earl

[33fromSD]

Hey Earl

Don't let the sheet aluminum-insulation-sheet aluminum set-up lull you into a false sense of thermal protection. I keep my registration/insurance info in a plastic bag under the seat cushion and prior to doing anything besides the sheet aluminum-insulation-sheet aluminum set up, I was melting the plastic bag to the seat cushion due to the excessive heat coming up through the floor panels.

After discovering that, I put DEI acoustic / thermal BOOM mat on the underside of the floor panels (which by the way really quieted down the noise inside the car) as well as 2 layers of muffler wrap around the FFR mufflers, and a layer of the DEI tunnel wrap on the underside of the floor panels along the whole exhaust route (on top of the boom mat). Since then, I have no more melting issues on the seat.

The sheet aluminum-insulation-sheet aluminum alone is not sufficient.

Jim
Jim

[narly1]

I'm planning on setting up the layers as follows:

passenger compartment

interior carpet
sound damping matting
inner aluminum panel
homebrew lizard skin made from a mixture of glass microballoons & self etching aluminum primer
FFR insulation
homebrew lizard skin made from a mixture of glass microballoons & self etching aluminum primer
"outside" aluminum panels
self etching aluminum primer
Rhino bed liner

road surface

From your experience it sounds like I should be adding 1 or more layers of the DEI BOOM mat (or similar) as well. The question is where? I haven't checked yet, is there enough room between the lower and upper aluminum panels for the BOOM mat to fit in as well as the FFR provided insulation? And/or a 2nd layer between the inner panel top side & the sound matting?

Earl

[33fromSD]

I'm planning on setting up the layers as follows:

passenger compartment

interior carpet
sound damping matting
inner aluminum panel
homebrew lizard skin made from a mixture of glass microballoons & self etching aluminum primer
FFR insulation
homebrew lizard skin made from a mixture of glass microballoons & self etching aluminum primer
"outside" aluminum panels
self etching aluminum primer
Rhino bed liner

road surface

From your experience it sounds like I should be adding 1 or more layers of the DEI BOOM mat (or similar) as well. The question is where? I haven't checked yet, is there enough room between the lower and upper aluminum panels for the BOOM mat to fit in as well as the FFR provided insulation? And/or a 2nd layer between the inner panel top side & the sound matting?

Earl

The insulation panel's FFR supplies fills up that cavity to the top, so unfortunately there is no room to add a layer of boom mat under the aluminum sheet. It sounds like from above you should be fine. with everything you're doing. My only point is the sheet aluminum-insulation-sheet aluminum alone is not a good plan.

Jim

[Guy G]

Jim
Gotta say I’m blown away with your build. Short of power plant, I’m pulling the trigger on that same car on Wednesday. I’m doing a factory tour, since I live about 1 1/2 hours away in NH. Your thread is LOADED with good points that I will put to use.
The funny thing is, your 55 F 100 is very similar to the 53 I built in 2001! Brought back many memories.
Just for the record, and full disclosure, I plan on stealing a few of your ideas! I love the side panel vents! ( hope you’re ok with that)
I’ll probably start a thread of my own when it gets here. I’ll keep you tagged.
Thank you for the info.
Guy

[33fromSD]

Jim
Gotta say I’m blown away with your build. Short of power plant, I’m pulling the trigger on that same car on Wednesday. I’m doing a factory tour, since I live about 1 1/2 hours away in NH. Your thread is LOADED with good points that I will put to use.
The funny thing is, your 55 F 100 is very similar to the 53 I built in 2001! Brought back many memories.
Just for the record, and full disclosure, I plan on stealing a few of your ideas! I love the side panel vents! ( hope you’re ok with that)
I’ll probably start a thread of my own when it gets here. I’ll keep you tagged.
Thank you for the info.
Guy

Absolutely Guy, feel free to use whatever you feel is useful. Congrats on the 33, it's a great project.

Jim