Sponaugle's H6 EZ30R 818S

[sponaugle]

Since I am a month away from my kit arrival I am starting up my build thread.

Donor Car:

I was originally going to use my 2002 WRX as my donor car:

http://www.sponaugle.com/post/JeffCarModelReal.jpg

I purchased this WRX in 2001 when they were first imported to the US, and in 2005 Jeff Perrin and I installed custom EZ30R H6 6 Cylinder motors in our cars. I also had a complete JDM drivetrain swap from a 2001 JDM Spec C. There are extensive build threads about each of these cars at:

Jeff Sponaugle's H6 WRX: http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1437246 and http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1215617
Jeff Perrin's H6 STI: http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1187722

However, I had the opportunity to purchase Jeff Perrin’s 06 STI when the second owner in California put it up for sale. Since my WRX is in fantastic condition, and I just spent 5k on refreshing the suspension, this was a perfect opportunity. This car was at SEMA in 2005:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-AtSema.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-EngineBay.jpg

I purchased the car from the guy in California that purchased the car from Perrin. On delivery to me it looked like this:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-Pickup.jpg

The engine is slightly different then the EZ30R I have in my WRX. It has been sleeved:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-EngineBuild3.jpg

As well, it has larger head studs.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-EngineBuild2.jpg

And custom rods:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-EngineBuild1.jpg

[sponaugle]

The second owner had switched the car over to a ViPEC stand alone ECU, replaced the doors, hood, and trunk with carbon fiber parts, and left the engine and transmission just as Jeff Perrin had built it The car only has 20,000 miles on it, with about 5k on the EZ30R. It makes about 600whp and 560 lb-ft of torque with the 4088 at a medium boost level as Jeff Perrin tuned it.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-EngineBuild4Dyno.jpg

Here is the engine removed from the car on an engine stand. It currently has a twin scroll manifold with a GT35R, although I plan on going back to the GT4088 that Jeff had originally used.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-Engine1.jpg
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-Engine2.jpg

818 Goal:

I’m building an 818S, so this will be registered street car. My 02 WRX is my dedicated track car, I have an 08 STI with ~500whp that is my daily driver (especially in the rain), a twin-turbo 2006 GTO that is my' I have no traction' car, and a new 2014 GT-R that is my 10 sec street car. So…. For the 818 I am going to try and build the fastest 0-60 and ¼ mile acceleration 818S. Given the power output of the EZ30R (~600whp), and the weight of the 818 (1950 lbs with the heavier H6), I think a high 9 second time is reasonable with the right tires, and perhaps mid 10s on a street friendly tire. So.. that is my goal.

I’m doing the build in my shop at my house, which is helpful as I can do small amounts of work at a time and leave everything setup… and I have an 18 month old baby so time is already constrained! I have a lift in the shop, although that won’t really be needed for this build.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818-Shop.jpg

I’ll be tearing down the rest of the 06 STI in prep for the arrival of the kit. I would like to have ABS working, so I plan on moving those pieces over. I am using the STI drivetrain including the hubs and brakes as well as the 6-speed transmission. I have a spare 6-speed that I am going to have custom gears made for once I get everything moving along. To get a decent ¼ mile time I need taller gears. Oh.. and a RaceLogic Traction Control setup (as per http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?10160-Racelogic-Traction-Control-for-the-818)

[Kurk818]

I cant wait to see what youre going to do. Subscribed!

[sponaugle]

I cant wait to see what youre going to do. Subscribed!
Ah, your reasonably close by, and if I remember correctly you are also using STI hubs and a 6-speed transmission?

[sponaugle]

Current Donor Status:

Removed interior pieces and wire harnesses:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-TearDown1.jpg
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-TearDown2.jpg
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-TearDown3.jpg

This car had a set of the Perrin adjustable rear trailing arms, which are not made anymore. Sweet!

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-TearDown4.jpg

Hubs Removed

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-TearDown5.jpg

[sponaugle]

Brembo Brakes Removed. Pretty dirty calipers.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-TearDown6.jpg

After a little cleanup

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-TearDown7.jpg

Transmission removed. I am going to get some custom gear ratios for this one.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-TearDown8.jpg

Most of the important bits removed:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-TearDown9.jpg

The remaining chassis is pretty much completely stripped. I'll weigh the chassis once I get it off the lift to see how much it weighs. If anyone is in the Portland area and wants a chassis, let me know. It is a low mileage never wrecked frame!

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-TearDown10.jpg

Jeff

[Kurk818]

Yup, I have everything figured out as far as installation goes. The only thing left is to fab the bracket to hold the cables at the transmission (the easiest part).


Ah, your reasonably close by, and if I remember correctly you are also using STI hubs and a 6-speed transmission?

[Kurk818]

You have to love the NW cars for how clean they are at dis-assembly. After seeing what other guys are going through, it makes me feel great knowing that is one hurdle i did not have to tackle. :)

[sponaugle]

Yea.. There was not a single rusted bolt, or even spot of rust on this entire car! So glad the car wasn't sold to someone in Michigan. ;)

[Scargo]

Nice. A rebirth. Such a pretty skeleton.

[mikeb75]

<sigh> such a nice looking disassembly. Looks like this is going to be a monster build, can't wait to see where it goes!

[AZPete]

Are you sure 600whp will be enough? There are hills in Portland.

[Canadian818]

Wow! I'm also planning a H6 build, but nowhere near this magnitude. Post pics of EVERYTHING!!!

[Frank818]

You copied my garage floor pattern! lolll

With 600whp are you sure this is going to be an S or an R? loll

[Wayne Presley]

My turbo H6 818 is going to so slow in comparison.... I do have a FFR Cobra with a supercharged 4.6 with twin turbos though, its well into the not enough traction arena :cool:

[thestigwins]

this build is going to be epic. Best part is I live in Portland. I can't wait to see this thing when its all finished up.

[Xusia]

Yeah. I may have to visit you in Portland sometime down the road! :)

[longislandwrx]

Great start but are you sure you have enough gun safes?

Nice shop, donor, build, etc etc etc; And you know so many great local Subaru resources. This will be fun to watch.

[sponaugle]

Are you sure 600whp will be enough? There are hills in Portland.

True True. Hills do eat HP!. Of course the real killer isn't the hills, it is the rain. Even with the RaceLogic traction control there is only so much two tires can do. I'm not really sure what the upper end of power possibilities are with the EZ30R. Jeff and I never really pushed much above 23-24psi. I'm planning on running E98, so I'll be using 6 ID 2000 injectors and a triple pump setup. I would think 800whp is possible, as that is only 133whp/cylinder... but the heads might not be big enough for that.


Wow! I'm also planning a H6 build, but nowhere near this magnitude. Post pics of EVERYTHING!!!

I will. I have a camera in the shop setup ready to go, and a gopro on the ceiling.


You copied my garage floor pattern! lolll

With 600whp are you sure this is going to be an S or an R? loll

Nice! I just picked that pattern at random.. well .. random except that I have a lot of blue cars so that was an easy color choice. I love the tile floor.. it is much softer then concrete so easy on the feet.


My turbo H6 818 is going to so slow in comparison.... I do have a FFR Cobra with a supercharged 4.6 with twin turbos though, its well into the not enough traction arena :cool:

Honestly traction will be the nemesis for this build. Even with a lot of custom work to support larger tires, to get a good 1/4 mile time I will have to run some kind of slick tire. In drag racing it is all about the tires. I was out of Woodburn two weeks ago while ETS was testing their GT-R at the drag strip. It runs slicks in the rear, and drag radials in the front, and the rear hookup is absolutely amazing. (see https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xn9ALi1Mh5E). 0-60 in 1.51 seconds, and a 7.81 1/4 mile time. That is moving. I had my GT-R there and it's weak sauce 10 second runs were just embarrassing. I never thought I would say that!

In any case, it will be fun to see what we can do with this platform.


this build is going to be epic. Best part is I live in Portland. I can't wait to see this thing when its all finished up.

Cool.. I was thinking about have an 818 get together this summer, so anyone withing driving range keep on the lookout.


Yeah. I may have to visit you in Portland sometime down the road! :)

Anytime. I can always use a hand!


Great start but are you sure you have enough gun safes?
Nice shop, donor, build, etc etc etc; And you know so many great local Subaru resources. This will be fun to watch.

Well, you never really have enough guns, or gun safes. You know.. just in case. :)

Jeff

[metalmaker12]

Wow, I am excited!!! But your crazy (in a good way lol)with thinking of putting anything over 400whp in the 818. It's going to be insane fast. I am making like maybe 250-260 whp on a base map and it does like 3.6-3.8 to 60, I am going to get it up to maybe 325 max. It's very fast the way it is. Your car is going to be super nuts fast!!!!awesome!!!

[Wayne Presley]

I'll be using 6 ID 2000 injectors
Speaking of injectors, what type of injector do I need in my EZ30, there seems to be a passage above the injector tip. I've so busy at the shop since I got my car back from SEMA to pull them off to figure that out. I just know they were different.


Well, you never really have enough guns, or gun safes. You know.. just in case. :)
Jeff

I couldn't agree more....

[longislandwrx]

I hope you have the motor in by June... i'll be in Portland and would love to see this Monster.

[svanlare]

Really looking forward to watching your build!

[Oppenheimer]

Now THAT is a home shop!!

Not sure which is more extreme, your 818 plans, or your home shop...

[metalmaker12]

Sick shop

[sponaugle]

Speaking of injectors, what type of injector do I need in my EZ30, there seems to be a passage above the injector tip. I've so busy at the shop since I got my car back from SEMA to pull them off to figure that out. I just know they were different.


Both of the EZ30Rs I have are currently running WRX blue injectors (with the tips removed so they flow about 750ccs). Normal topfeed injectors (from the WRX and STI) work fine in the EZ30R head... but I'm not sure what fits the heads of the EZ30. I *think* the EZ30 heads use the sidefeed injectors, but I have not looked. The STI in 2004 used side feed injectors, and there are some sidefeed to top feed converters.

Jeff

[Wayne Presley]

They are top feed but the recess in the head looks way different. I'll pull one when I get back from the Mitty at Road Atlanta this weekend.

[metalmaker12]

The second owner had switched the car over to a ViPEC stand alone ECU, replaced the doors, hood, and trunk with carbon fiber parts, and left the engine and transmission just as Jeff Perrin had built it The car only has 20,000 miles on it, with about 5k on the EZ30R. It makes about 600whp and 560 lb-ft of torque with the 4088 at a medium boost level.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-EngineBuild4Dyno.jpg

Here is the engine removed from the car on an engine stand. It currently has a twin scroll manifold with a GT35R, although I plan on going back to the GT4088 that Jeff had originally used.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-Engine1.jpg
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-Engine2.jpg

818 Goal:

I’m building an 818S, so this will be registered street car. My 02 WRX is my dedicated track car, I have an 08 STI with ~500whp that is my daily driver (especially in the rain), a twin-turbo 2006 GTO that is my' I have no traction' car, and a new 2014 GT-R that is my 10 sec street car. So…. For the 818 I am going to try and build the fastest 0-60 and ¼ mile acceleration 818S. Given the power output of the EZ30R (~600whp), and the weight of the 818 (1950 lbs with the heavier H6), I think a high 9 second time is reasonable with the right tires, and perhaps mid 10s on a street friendly tire. So.. that is my goal.

I’m doing the build in my shop at my house, which is helpful as I can do small amounts of work at a time and leave everything setup… and I have an 18 month old baby so time is already constrained! I have a lift in the shop, although that won’t really be needed for this build.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818-Shop.jpg

I’ll be tearing down the rest of the 06 STI in prep for the arrival of the kit. I would like to have ABS working, so I plan on moving those pieces over. I am using the STI drivetrain including the hubs and brakes as well as the 6-speed transmission. I have a spare 6-speed that I am going to have custom gears made for once I get everything moving along. To get a decent ¼ mile time I need taller gears. Oh.. and a RaceLogic Traction Control setup (as per http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?10160-Racelogic-Traction-Control-for-the-818)


With that power 8's might happen

[Wayne Presley]

BTW, how big is that rocket?

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818-Shop.jpg

[TahoeTim]

what, no reloading bench???

[sponaugle]

They are top feed but the recess in the head looks way different. I'll pull one when I get back from the Mitty at Road Atlanta this weekend.

Interesting. I may have a set of the older EZ30 heads laying around.. I'll have to take a look. It might be possible to make a custom fuel rail such that you could use the normal top feed injectors.


With that power 8's might happen

By power it would seem possible, but traction is really the key. I'm also a little concerned about the car lifting... there is not a lot of weight in the front when you launch with drag slicks. It will be fun to experiment with.


what, no reloading bench???

Of course! In the shop picture above the wood bench with the two red chairs is a reloading bench. You can see the green heavy press and red turret press on the right side, and on the front left side the out of round bullet micrometer. I primarily do long range shooting with 338 Lapua Magnum for the long reach (>1000 yards), and .308 for the shorter range (<1000 yards). Sako TRG-42 for the .338, and Accuracy International AW for the .308. I love .338LM.... such a great ballistic round.

Jeff

[sponaugle]

Now THAT is a home shop!!
Not sure which is more extreme, your 818 plans, or your home shop...

Sick shop

Thanks for the complements! This is an interesting shop. When I purchased the property a few years ago, the 'shop' was a corrugated steel sided building:

http://www.sponaugle.com/post/shop/Shop1.jpg

The internal structure of the shop was the most amazing part. The entire thing is built out of steel. Lots and Lots of steel.

http://www.sponaugle.com/post/shop/Shop2.jpg

The guy who built it in the 50s worked at a shipyard, and had good access to lots of steel and loved to weld. The main beam supports are 8 inch steel posts that I am not kidding are over 1/2 inch thick pipe. (Schedule 100) The beams alone are well over 1000 lbs each. I have no idea how the guy actually built the place.

Even the foundatation is steel pipe.

http://www.sponaugle.com/post/shop/Shop4.jpg

I built a wood 'shell' around it both inside and out so I could insulate, add drywall, wiring, welding plugs, new exterior walls, and a new roof. I brought in a dedicated 200 amp circuit so I have 2 50 am welding plugs plus the usually other power stuff.

http://www.sponaugle.com/post/shop/Shop10.jpg

Once it was done, it looked just like the house.

http://www.sponaugle.com/post/shop/Shop12.jpg

Before moving tools, etc in:

http://www.sponaugle.com/post/shop/Shop14.jpg

I was originally going to 'replace' the concrete floor since I didn't know how strong it was. I paid a guy to come out and cut it up, and he started with an 8 inch deep cut, which didn't do anything. He switched up to 10, then 12, then 16 inches, and still could not get through.. so the floor is at least 16 inches thick. That is a mind boggling amount on concrete. It calculates to something like 300,000 lbs of concrete. I think the guy was a little crazy. Either way, there was no way I was going to remove that floor... the concrete cutter guys said they could get it out, but would have to use explosives. I added some sealant to the concrete and then put the floor covering on... in the end it was a good deal because the floor is both super strong and easy to work on... and the lift has a really good base to hook into.

One cool thing this guy did was bury steel pipe across the floor just a tiny bit above the surface so that if you had steel laying on the ground it would contact the upper edge of the pipe and conduct to ground... an those pipes were all grounded to the building for welding. Cool Stuff.

Anyways, I lucked out in finding this as a starting point for a shop. 1600 sqft of main space, and 1600 sq ft of storage space in the attic. My wife thinks I am a little crazy, but I'm cool with that.

Jeff

[Kurk818]

Awesome. Thanks for the write-up.

[longislandwrx]

One man, armed with 80 cans of spray foam. Worst day ever. LOL

[sponaugle]

One man, armed with 80 cans of spray foam. Worst day ever. LOL
Yes, yes indeed. It was everywhere.

On an unrelated note, i am considering that switching to a 5 speed might be a good idea considering I need custom gearing and I will not be using more then 5 gears. The 5 speed is lighter.

Any of you guys have recommendations on transmission builders? I have used Andrewtech in the past, but he is on the east coast. I would love to find a builder somewhere out west, perhaps that does ppg or albini gears.

Any recommendations?

Jeff

[Frank818]

My wife thinks I am a little crazy

She's crazy not thinking you're smart! But I bet she's cool with that too.

[Xusia]

I have 2003 5mt transmission case with 2009 internals with virtually no miles (like 20k, IIRC). Wanna trade? :)

[STiPWRD]

Yes, yes indeed. It was everywhere.

On an unrelated note, i am considering that switching to a 5 speed might be a good idea considering I need custom gearing and I will not be using more then 5 gears. The 5 speed is lighter.

Any of you guys have recommendations on transmission builders? I have used Andrewtech in the past, but he is on the east coast. I would love to find a builder somewhere out west, perhaps that does ppg or albini gears.

Any recommendations?

Jeff

Stick to Andrewtech :) There's gotta be some good shops on the west coast but Andrew does a quality job

[sponaugle]

I have 2003 5mt transmission case with 2009 internals with virtually no miles (like 20k, IIRC). Wanna trade? :)
Unfortunately I want to keep the 6-speed as a spare for my 02 WRX track car.

Stick to Andrewtech :) There's gotta be some good shops on the west coast but Andrew does a quality job
Yea.. I contacted Andrew and he is getting me some quotes for straight cut dog box setups. It a somewhat untested setup, as no one has really put 600+whp through a 5 speed while ONLY using the front diff. Time to learn!

Jeff

[sponaugle]

Here is a look at some gear ratios:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/TranGears.png

I am thinking of doing the PPG Synchro Straight Cut gears. With a 3.9 front gear set, I can hit 159mph in 4th gear at 8k rpm, which looks decent for high 9s.

Once nice thing about the 818 is the ease of removing the transmission and changing the front gear set. I can always switch to a 3.7 if I want more speed, or go to 4.1 if I want less.

Thoughts?

Jeff

[longislandwrx]

That 3.08/1.87 is a great 1 2 combo... i'm sure you know, their syncro gears are rated at 400; with big slicks and all that torque I might be worried about my investment. Tony at TIC has broken a few ppg sets with less power, albeit on a heavier car, with no doubt higher shock loads than the 818 will produce.

I do think a 3.7 final drive might be a good idea. That extra 6-8 mph might be helpful.


With decent traction you are going to need that 165+ trap speed in 4th to hit those times.

[sponaugle]

That 3.08/1.87 is a great 1 2 combo... i'm sure you know, their syncro gears are rated at 400; with big slicks and all that torque I might be worried about my investment. Tony at TIC has broken a few ppg sets with less power, albeit on a heavier car, with no doubt higher shock loads than the 818 will produce.
I do think a 3.7 final drive might be a good idea. That extra 6-8 mph might be helpful.
With decent traction you are going to need that 165+ trap speed in 4th to hit those times.

Yes, you are right about the MPH.... a 3.7 would get a little better top end in 4th.. Also the drag radials are a bit taller, so there is some gain to be made there. I wish I could get a gear set that did 60 in 1st gear, as that would make for some really good 0-60 times. With 3.7s and some tall tires it might be doable.. I don't yet know the upper rev limit on the EZ30R. I'll certainly put in an accusump in case the oil pump can't keep up.

It is really hard to say what will break... with such a light chassis and the load from just the rear wheels... And the case load is different since all this load is through the front shaft and diff. I'll plan for some breakage.

Jeff

[longislandwrx]

Agreed...the Hooisier 275/40R17 Drag Radial is 25.7" tall and you could probably shoehorn it under the fenders... That height would be helpful

[STiPWRD]

The dog box will give you quicker shifts than the syncros right? If the ultimate goal is fast times and mainly track use, I'd go with the dog engagement. I've got the syncro PPGs straight 1-2 and helical 3-4, these are great for street driving.

[sponaugle]

The dog box will give you quicker shifts than the syncros right? If the ultimate goal is fast times and mainly track use, I'd go with the dog engagement. I've got the syncro PPGs straight 1-2 and helical 3-4, these are great for street driving.

That is true.. of course I'd like to drive it on the street as well...but that is do-able with a dog box. Hmm.. I got prices from Andrew, and he is ready to build me a transmission.. I just need to decide on parts.
I am going to use the Cusco 1.5 front LSD, which should work well.

Jeff

[Canadian818]

That is true.. of course I'd like to drive it on the street as well...but that is do-able with a dog box. Hmm.. I got prices from Andrew, and he is ready to build me a transmission.. I just need to decide on parts.
I am going to use the Cusco 1.5 front LSD, which should work well.

Jeff

Care to share your prices? Or is it a friends deal? After learning that the 6spd gearing wasn't ideal, and its weight over the 5spd, i've been wondering for awhile now whether or not I should just rebuild my 5spd with taller gears. Its nice to see that you've chosen the same direction and your willing to find those limits, because there's just too many new variables with the 818 to compare what they'll hold up to in an wrx.

[Jvalgardson]

Seriously impressed by your plan. But especially jealous of your shop and donor. ;)

[legacy_y_tu]

Just wanted to say I'm so glad you decided not to use your 02 WRX as your donor.Too beautiful a car to cannabilize. I predict that car is going to be worth some money someday since so many old WRX's are going to be chopped up for this 818 project.

So jealous of your garage too.......

I bought a tune from Tim Bailey from PDX and your shop many years ago and I've got to say it was sweet compared to the OTS Cobb maps. You guys do some great work...anxiously watching your progress here.

Brian

[sponaugle]

Chassis stripping is complete.. Moved chassis to a trailer:

http://www.sponaugle.com/nasioc/forsale/ForSaleChassis1.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/nasioc/forsale/ForSaleChassis2.jpg

It was heavier then I thought it would be. I have not scaled it yet, but I'll do that before I get rid of it.

I convinced some of my friends and colleagues to give me hand. We are all software guys, so lifting cars is not our specialty.. and I am pretty sure non of us have seen the inside of a gym..

Funny video of moving it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oyxgEfnTAo8

I put the chassis plus a few parts up for sale on Nasioc: http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2624645

Jeff

[sponaugle]

Care to share your prices? Or is it a friends deal? After learning that the 6spd gearing wasn't ideal, and its weight over the 5spd, i've been wondering for awhile now whether or not I should just rebuild my 5spd with taller gears. Its nice to see that you've chosen the same direction and your willing to find those limits, because there's just too many new variables with the 818 to compare what they'll hold up to in an wrx.

No problem.. I have the normal list prices.. I'll dig up the email..


Seriously impressed by your plan. But especially jealous of your shop and donor. ;)

Thanks! Compared to the old days of doing stuff on the floor of my garage, my back thanks me every day!


Just wanted to say I'm so glad you decided not to use your 02 WRX as your donor.Too beautiful a car to cannabilize. I predict that car is going to be worth some money someday since so many old WRX's are going to be chopped up for this 818 project.
So jealous of your garage too.......
I bought a tune from Tim Bailey from PDX and your shop many years ago and I've got to say it was sweet compared to the OTS Cobb maps. You guys do some great work...anxiously watching your progress here.
Brian

Cool.. ah the old days of PDX. That was a lot of fun tuning cars and meeting people.

Jeff

[Wayne Presley]

Chassis stripping is complete..
It was heavier then I thought it would be. I have not scaled it yet, but I'll do that before I get rid of it.

I convinced some of my friends and colleagues to give me hand. We are all software guys, so lifting cars is not our specialty.. and I am pretty sure non of us have seen the inside of a gym..

Funny video of moving it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oyxgEfnTAo8

I put the chassis plus a few parts up for sale on Nasioc: http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2624645

Jeff

It weighs about 1040 , I've weighed 3 of them. The 06-07 is about 25lbs heavier

[sponaugle]

It weighs about 1040 , I've weighed 3 of them. The 06-07 is about 25lbs heavier

Cool.. That sounds about right. So a few hundred dollars of scrap value at most..

[sponaugle]

Also, I am looking for suggestions of stuff to buy... I figure I might as well get parts coming in before the kit gets here:

So far on my list:

The VCP rear arms (for wide tires)
The VCP K-Tuned shifter
rori's steering col spacer
rori's shift rod arm
rori's push pull bracket
5-speed dog bog with straight cut gears.
Breeze Radiator piping
replicaparts.com brake master cylinder relocator
zero rad supports

Any other key things I am missing?

Jeff

[wleehendrick]

Any other key things I am missing?


Craig (Mechie3) makes some nice pieces for the 818. You might be interested in some of his Zero Decibel Motorsports parts (I got most of them):
Coolant Bracket Relocation Kit
ABS Plugs for Knuckles
Carbon Fiber Hood Pin Plates
CNC Oil Cap and Fill Tube
Billete Aluminum Handle Dipstick
Aluminum Radiator Supports

His wife just delivered their first, so he may be a little slow to respond.

[STiPWRD]

It weighs about 1040 , I've weighed 3 of them. The 06-07 is about 25lbs heavier

Wow, that's surprising. I would've guessed about half that weight. Me and 3 other guys did pretty much the same thing as in the video with my 02 wrx shell. It definitely felt heavy though.

As far as stuff to buy, are all the OEM parts in great shape? I picked up a bunch of miscellaneous items like wheel bearings, axle pins, steering rack boots, 2.5RS alternator mount, etc.

[longislandwrx]

Interested in the clutch/flywheel... I am wondering why you aren't using it yourself.

[Wayne Presley]

Also, I am looking for suggestions of stuff to buy... I figure I might as well get parts coming in before the kit gets here:

So far on my list:

The VCP rear arms (for wide tires)
The VCP K-Tuned shifter
rori's steering col spacer
rori's shift rod arm
rori's push pull bracket
5-speed dog bog with straight cut gears.
Breeze Radiator piping
replicaparts.com brake master cylinder relocator
zero rad supports

Any other key things I am missing?

Jeff
It's a good list. Think about doing a AWIC, you'll never get enough air an air to air to shed that much compressor heated air out.


Wow, that's surprising. I would've guessed about half that weight. Me and 3 other guys did pretty much the same thing as in the video with my 02 wrx shell. It definitely felt heavy though.

As far as stuff to buy, are all the OEM parts in great shape? I picked up a bunch of miscellaneous items like wheel bearings, axle pins, steering rack boots, 2.5RS alternator mount, etc.

I did my original one that I took apart, then did the GRM 2004 based shell and then I weighed an 07 later. Had to know how much $ to get from the scrapper!

[Wayne Presley]

Both of the EZ30Rs I have are currently running WRX blue injectors (with the tips removed so they flow about 750ccs). Normal topfeed injectors (from the WRX and STI) work fine in the EZ30R head... but I'm not sure what fits the heads of the EZ30. I *think* the EZ30 heads use the sidefeed injectors, but I have not looked. The STI in 2004 used side feed injectors, and there are some sidefeed to top feed converters.

Jeff

Here are the pics of the heads and injectors. If you notice the port in the head has a drilled hole that goes across the head to each injector. The injector itself has two seals on the bottom, one on the tip and that covers the upper cross hole.

http://i213.photobucket.com/albums/cc175/vcpinjectionpb/818-build%201/P1020779_zpsb1e16e5f.jpg (http://s213.photobucket.com/user/vcpinjectionpb/media/818-build%201/P1020779_zpsb1e16e5f.jpg.html)
http://i213.photobucket.com/albums/cc175/vcpinjectionpb/818-build%201/P1020778_zpse8b57d86.jpg (http://s213.photobucket.com/user/vcpinjectionpb/media/818-build%201/P1020778_zpse8b57d86.jpg.html)

Top of the injector looks normal Subaru

http://i213.photobucket.com/albums/cc175/vcpinjectionpb/818-build%201/P1020782_zps6c018cec.jpg (http://s213.photobucket.com/user/vcpinjectionpb/media/818-build%201/P1020782_zps6c018cec.jpg.html)

Bottom is strange

http://i213.photobucket.com/albums/cc175/vcpinjectionpb/818-build%201/P1020781_zps80082291.jpg (http://s213.photobucket.com/user/vcpinjectionpb/media/818-build%201/P1020781_zps80082291.jpg.html)

[RedMonkey]

I'm in love with that shop.

Does the 818 use the stock Subaru engine mounts? Are those EJ mounts I see in the pic below? If so, how did you adapt the mount for the EZ's bolt pattern? Custom bracket?

So many questions...


http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-Engine2.jpg

[Xusia]

Yes, the 818 uses stock mounts. I was under the impression the bolt pattern was the same between the EJ and EZ series.

[Canadian818]

Yes, the 818 uses stock mounts. I was under the impression the bolt pattern was the same between the EJ and EZ series.

I believe you use the EZ mounts, but only two of the three bolts are used to the frame. The info is either in waynes build thread or his "H6 fits" thread.

[swine]

Jeff. Followed your build 10 or so years ago on nasioc and now im doing it again on TFF. Good luck and looking forward to lurking this thread.

[sponaugle]

I'm in love with that shop.
Does the 818 use the stock Subaru engine mounts? Are those EJ mounts I see in the pic below? If so, how did you adapt the mount for the EZ's bolt pattern? Custom bracket?
So many questions...

The EZ30R has a different bolt pattern on the engine side, but the mounts once installed mount into the car just like the EJ mounts. (two single studs). So.. you have two choices:

(1) Make a custom bracket so you can use EJ mounts on the EZ motor

or

(2) Use the EZ mounts.

Interestingly enough I have both solutions. The motor from the Perrin H6 has a set of custom brackets that allows the use of EJ mounts, and in this case the Group N mounts (which are a bit stiffer). The EZ30R in my 02 WRX has the factory EZ30R mounts which are a bit softer.


Yes, the 818 uses stock mounts. I was under the impression the bolt pattern was the same between the EJ and EZ series.

As per above, if you use the EZ mounts on the EZ engine, it will bolt in just like an EJ. I like that Subaru doesn't change things like that!


I believe you use the EZ mounts, but only two of the three bolts are used to the frame. The info is either in waynes build thread or his "H6 fits" thread.

No.. If you use the EZ mounts (at least the EZ30R), once all three bolts to the engine are attached you will have the same single stud sticking down.


Jeff. Followed your build 10 or so years ago on nasioc and now im doing it again on TFF. Good luck and looking forward to lurking this thread.

Thanks! It looks to be a fun build!

Jeff

[sponaugle]

Update:

A few developments:

After looking into the registration process for a kit car here in Oregon (and Portland in particular), I am going to build my car in two stages now. I am first going to put a regular EJ257 engine in the car controlled by an 04 STI ECU so the car will be able to pass OBD-II emissions testing. Once that is complete I’ll swap in the EZ30R.

So, I need to build an EJ257 motor for the registration. I happen to have a set of Cosworth heads and cams laying around, so I’m going to order a new set of block halves from Subaru, get some new pistons, crower rods, and build up a new EJ motor. I’ll use one of my Perrin turbo kits for the exhaust piping, probably a GT35R as the turbo, some ID 1300 injectors for fuel.. and that should do it for a quick engine to get it thru testing. I know.. overkill but if I am going to build an engine it might as well be something I like. I’ll run it in the ¼ mile before swapping to the EZ30R.

I ordered the transmission from Sam at Andrewtech today. 5 speed with PPG syncro straight cut gears and Cusco 1.5 LSD. This should be a good starting point.

Next up: Taking apart the 06 STI wire harness and giving it a diet. I am keeping the ABS so I need to figure that out. I’ll post up my diet plan and spreadsheets.

Jeff

[sponaugle]

Here are the pics of the heads and injectors. If you notice the port in the head has a drilled hole that goes across the head to each injector. The injector itself has two seals on the bottom, one on the tip and that covers the upper cross hole.
Top of the injector looks normal Subaru
Bottom is strange


Weird.. I had not noticed that before. Both of my engines are EZ30Rs not EZ30s... Hmm... I can't tell in the picture of the tip of the injector (it is a bit dark) but is there any kind of hole in the injector that would use that cross hole?

Wayne: Take a look at this: http://www.corner-carvers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=31494&page=2

Jeff

[Kurk818]

Update:

Next up: Taking apart the 06 STI wire harness and giving it a diet. I am keeping the ABS so I need to figure that out. I’ll post up my diet plan and spreadsheets.

Jeff

Look forward to the wire diet. I kept ABS as well but the interconnection of the DCCD (which i removed) with the ABS caused some problems/confusion. I did my best and left it where it is and will go into it further once the engine is fired.

[Scargo]

I kept ABS as well but the interconnection of the DCCD (which i removed) with the ABS caused some problems/confusion.
Can you elaborate? I thought that no signal (eliminating, disconnecting or accidental breakage of the DCCD wire) "just" caused the differential to be in default, locked mode.

[sponaugle]

Look forward to the wire diet. I kept ABS as well but the interconnection of the DCCD (which i removed) with the ABS caused some problems/confusion. I did my best and left it where it is and will go into it further once the engine is fired.


Can you elaborate? I thought that no signal (eliminating, disconnecting or accidental breakage of the DCCD wire) "just" caused the differential to be in default, locked mode.

Well, there is a bit more to the story. If you look at the electircal diagrams for the DCCD and the ABS, the DCCD controller, the steering angle senor, and the ABS controller are all on the same CAN bus. It appears (but I need to verify) that this is a separate CAN bus from the one the ECU is on. The DCCD controller almost certainly uses the CAN bus messages from the ABS controller as the ABS controller is the unit that has individual wheel speed (the wheel speed sensors go to the ABS controller). As well the steering wheel sensor sends data over that CAN bus.

Unfortunately there is no way to know who/what is listening on the CAN bus without first dumping and decoding the code inside the DCCD and ABS controllers. However what I could do is connect up power and a few sensors to the DCCD controller and see if it is outputing anything over the CAN bus. If it is, I would assume this would be for the benifit of the ABS controller since that is the only other major device on that bus.

My guess is that the DCCD controller is not needed, and the CAN bus connection is indeed used just for communication from the ABS and Steering Wheel sensor to the DCCD unit.

When I have a chance I'll power up both units and see what is coming across the bus.

Also, both the ABS controller and the DCCD controller are on the Subaru Bus, so they can be interrogated and reflashed by the subaru select tool.. Something else that I need to dig into. What I would really like to do is get the ABS code dumped and reverse engineered. That might allow some tweaks based on changes we have made with weight distribution.

Jeff

Documentation for above:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/ABSWireDiagram1.png

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/DCCDWireDiagram1.png

[Kurk818]

I was informed by a local Subaru specialist that if i was to replace the ABS pump with one from a WRX that doesnt have DCCD I shouldnt have any issues. What's your thought on this? I kept the steering sensor.

[sponaugle]

I was informed by a local Subaru specialist that if i was to replace the ABS pump with one from a WRX that doesnt have DCCD I shouldnt have any issues. What's your thought on this? I kept the steering sensor.

Well, the WRX doesn't have DCCD, so I suspect it doesn't have any CAN bus interfaces to depend on. Even the 04 STI DCCD is different, as it does not have a CAN bus. It pulls data from the ABS unit directly ( a signal from the ABS unit when it is active ) plus the wheel speeds.

I suspect the WRX one will work, but I'm also not convinced there will be a problem with the 06 STI one. My guess is the DCCD needs the ABS but not the reverse.

Jeff

[Kurk818]

Im pretty sure youre correct. I sold the STI ABS initially when i planned on not have ABS and ended up installing an ABS pump from an 07 WRX without even considering the implications. Ill look into it more once i have a driving chassis.

[sponaugle]

Update: I have started on the wire diet planning.

I created a spreadsheet of both the ECU pinouts as well as all of the connectors. Sample here:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/ECUPinoutSample.png
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/WireHarnessSample.png

If you want to download the spreadsheet click here: http://www.sponaugle.com/818/06STIECMPinoutMap.xlsx and the STI electrical diagrams http://www.sponaugle.com/818/2006_STI_Electrical.zip.

Jeff

[Evan78]

If you want to download the spreadsheet click here: http://www.sponaugle.com/818/06STIECMPinoutMap.xlsx

JeffAwesome, I'm so glad you're sharing your documentation, but the link doesn't work. (404 error)

[sponaugle]

Awesome, I'm so glad you're sharing your documentation, but the link doesn't work. (404 error)

Sorry about that. Should be fixed now. Also I added a link to the 2006 STI electrical sections.

Jeff

[sponaugle]

I did a bit of clean up on a set of Cosworth heads today.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/CosworthHeads.jpg

They are ready to go to the machine shop for cleanup, new valves and valve seals, and a bit of decking.

I also found my box-o-buckets, which is nice to have when trying to shim new heads and cams!

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Buckets.jpg

Jeff

[sponaugle]

Oh, and the most important update, I dropped a check to FF in overnight FedEx Envelope and called Stewart to arrange pickup. My kit will be ready Saturday, and they will pick it up and bring it to me in Oregon. WooHoo!

Jeff

[Jaime]

I'll say hi to your kit while I'm there getting mine.

[sponaugle]

I'll say hi to your kit while I'm there getting mine.

Do one better, post a picture!
Jeff

[sponaugle]

I need to run an 04 STI ECU since I don't have the 06 ECU and immobilizer linked yet, so I made a mapping of the 04 STI ECU to 06 STI ECU pins. Subaru moved 6 pins such that you can't plug in an 04 ECU and drive away an 06.. of course you could just make a harness and use that with the ECU and the immobilizer would be defeated.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/2004vs2006Pinout.png

I updated the pinout spreadsheet to include the mappings. http://www.sponaugle.com/818/06STIECMPinoutMap.xlsx

I took apart the front hubs and cleaned them up a bit. I love cars that never saw salt!

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/STIFrontHub.jpg

I blasted a set of TGVs as well. I'll primer and paint them along with a manifold.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/STITGVClean.jpg

[Jaime]

Do one better, post a picture!
Jeff
No kit with the name Jeff on it when I was there.

[sponaugle]

Time to start the wire diet.

Since the 06 STI I bought had a pretty hacked up main wire harness I purchased a second complete wire harness from another wrecked 06 STI. As a result I have two of most of the major harnesses.

Here is how the shop floor looked starting out:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/HarnessExplode.jpg

Here is a picture of the two main bulkhead harnesses. (Both are the same harness, once from my car and one from another car). This is the primary bulkhead harness that is really the backbone of the wiring.
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/2BulkHarness.jpg

In case you are curious as to what it plugs into, here is a small annotated picture:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/BulkheadExplain.jpg

Of the two main harnesses, one of them has a pretty hacked up ECU side, so I will be using the other main harness which has a very clean ECU connector.

You can see the hacked up one here:
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/ECUHarnessBad.jpg

Unfortunately this harness does have one problem, the ABS connector was cut off during removal:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/ABSCut.jpg

The other harness doesn't have the problem so I can transfer over that connector. Since the ABS will probably be in the front, I would likely have to extend the wires anyways.

I also have two of the 'rear bulkhead' harnesses:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/RearHarness1.jpg

However I have only one dash harness:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/DashHarness.jpg

I'll document the process for each harness, showing which connectors and wires I have removed how it is repackaged for installation.

Jeff

[Mechie3]

Here's my writeup for an 06 WRX harness. The STI harness will be similar in many respects. You can probably piggy back off of that and save yourself some work.

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?11880-Wiring-Guide-06-WRX-Sedan-with-Auto-AC-HVAC

[sponaugle]

Here's my writeup for an 06 WRX harness. The STI harness will be similar in many respects. You can probably piggy back off of that and save yourself some work.

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?11880-Wiring-Guide-06-WRX-Sedan-with-Auto-AC-HVAC

Yea, I have read that thread many times, and lots of good info there. I'll document what is unique to the STI where possible in case people end up using an STI harness. Great Stuff!!

Jeff

[sponaugle]

For those Subaru nerds out there:

I was flying into the Purdue University Airport and spotted the Subaru of American facility out of the window.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/SOA1.jpg

It is the home of all of the Legacys and Forresters. Pretty big place. Just think of all the Subaru goodness in those walls!

Jeff

[Frank818]

Personal plane, that was?

[sponaugle]

Personal plane, that was?

Private plane thru XOJet yeah. I think American used to have commercial service at Purdue, but that ended a few years back. It was (is actually since I'm still in the midwest right now) a family trip to visit my parents and my wife's family It is a Citation X, which is sort of the GT-R of private jets. Actually it was the fastest I think I have ever been at 706mph. On the way back to PDX I'm going to see if we can push it a bit more get the the planes top speed of Mach 0.92. Even cooler it can cruise at 51,000 feet which is sweet.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/GPS706.png

Jeff

[Frank818]

51k feet, wow that's pretty high, I didn't know those little Cessna's could go that high. For 23 million a piece, you gotta have something good, right? lolll

You're not planing on flying with your 818, I hope? Install the aero parts on the correct side to keep it on the ground. :)

[Mechie3]

You're not far from my house right now.

[sponaugle]

51k feet, wow that's pretty high, I didn't know those little Cessna's could go that high. For 23 million a piece, you gotta have something good, right? lolll
You're not planing on flying with your 818, I hope? Install the aero parts on the correct side to keep it on the ground. :)

Haha.. yea I'll try to keep the 818 on the ground where possible... although I must admit it would be cool to do wheelies in it. ;)


You're not far from my house right now.

Sweet.. Yea I see you are in Indianapolis. I grew up in Kokomo and got my BSEE at Purdue, so I know the area well. My parents live in Attica, and my sister is an Attorney in West Lafayette. Lots of long straight roads here!

Jeff

[sponaugle]

Ok.. Back on track.. Before I left I did make some more progress on the wire harness diet.

I marked every connector with either blue or red electrical tape, red to remove, blue to keep. I then removed all the sheathing and tape, and started unwinding the wires not in use. I started with the rear and front harness.

The rear harness before and after:
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Wiring-6.jpg

With the extra connectors removed I labeled all the remaining connectors:
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Wiring-5.jpg

The front and rear harnesses didn't lose that much stuff as they have more critical things on them. The primary bulkhead harness has most of the removed stuff like HVAC, Doors, lights, etc. I have left in the harness what is needed for ABS, plus for steering controls like lights, turn signals, horn, etc to still work.

I started on the primary bulkhead harness, but will have to complete once I am back from vacation. There are a lot of wires in that harness.

I have to admit I was tempted to just cut off the connectors I need and make my own harness.. it would be so much cleaner. It is clear that there are a good number of connectors that will need to be either cut shorter or extended.

I assume that most people are doing the wire diet method instead of the building a new harness using the connectors?

I'll keep the excel sheet posted above up to date as I get things cut down. There might be a few changes.

[Mechie3]

I did the diet. Mainly because I wanted to keep as many systems as possible (mostly security) and I'm not talented enough in the EE dept to make my own wiring harness and have it work the first time. Looking back, if I had the skills, I'd much rather make my own. Would be cleaner and take less time.

[Kurk818]

Have you tackled the removal of the DCCD wiring?

[sponaugle]

Have you tackled the removal of the DCCD wiring?

I removed the dccd from the harness, and I have the connectors and the controller. If it turns out that I need it installed, I'll wire it directly. I did verify that the private CAN bus is just for the ABS , DCCD, and the steering angle sensor.

I will power up the DCCD on the bench and see what traffic it generates.

Jeff

[sponaugle]

I am now about 90% done with the wire diet of the factory harnesses. The main bulkhead harness is the largest and the biggest pain.

Here is what it looks like now:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Wiring-9.jpg

This harness still has a number of relays as well as the interior fuse panel connections. To make things easier while I am installing things, I labeled all of the connectors and relays:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Wiring-7.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Wiring-8.jpg

For anyone else about to start the wire diet, here is the procedure I used:

I started by mapping out all of the connectors on all of the harnesses, and figuring out which things I wanted to delete. See the spreadsheet a few posts up for the details of how that looks.

Once I knew what I wanted to keep and remove, I went around the harness and put blue tape on everything I wanted to keep and red tape on the things I wanted to delete. I then cut off the red marked connectors and used a label maker to put labels on all of the remaining blue marked ones. I removed all of the black tape and wire protectors, which left a harness with a ton of extra cut wires laying around. Starting at one end and threaded each cut wire throughout the harness until it either came out because it was already cut on both ends, or terminated into a connector.

Once all of the dead wires were removed, I took note of what color wires were on each connector that were free floating. These were from circuits I removed, but were still going through some of the bulkhead connectors. (for example if you remove security there are a number of wires that go to the dash that will now be disconnected. I then went through the wire diagrams and made sure the cut wire colors on those connectors went with circuits I removed. This is really just a step to double check that what I wanted to remove got removed without taking anything else with it.

I did discover one error I made where I removed a diode used in the headlight circuit.

There are a number of buried 'joint connectors' where wires are joined together. When you are unwrapping and cutting, be sure to tape or seal up these joints. You don't want to leave exposed wire ends from the wires you cut out. In some cases I used heat shrink, and in some cases just black tape.

Now that the harness is smaller, I need the 818 chassis to start working on layout. The factory harness is not a perfect match because on the primary bulkhead harness one end is near the steering column, but that same end needs to connect to the 'front engine bulkhead harness' which on the 818 will be partially in the rear. I will probably have to extend some of those wires to reach back to the engine area. The other end of the primary bulkehad harness goes to a rear harness ( fuel tank, etc) so that is well located.

I can see how it would be better to just build a new harness from scratch. Since I am going to run a 4 cylinder engine to get registered and then switch to the H6, I may just do a new custom build harness for the H6 since it needs a number of extra connections anyways.

Also, my straight cut synchro PPG transmission should be done this week from Andrewtech. Woot!

Jeff

[R.Spec]

Cool to have another 818 so close! I just ordered mine last week and can't wait to get it! We will have to connect sometime. I work at Horizontal Motorsports in Tualatin/Sherwood. We are gonna build it at the shop there.

[Frank818]

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Wiring-8.jpg

Are these from the steering column? The brackets look like they are. Too bad I am at work and can't check on my column now.

[Mechie3]

No. They come from under the glove box and console.

[sponaugle]

Cool to have another 818 so close! I just ordered mine last week and can't wait to get it! We will have to connect sometime. I work at Horizontal Motorsports in Tualatin/Sherwood. We are gonna build it at the shop there.

Absolutely. I'm just about to start organizing an 818 NW get together for sometime in July, so stay tuned. What delivery date did you get, since you just ordered.. curious what the lead time is now.


Are these from the steering column? The brackets look like they are. Too bad I am at work and can't check on my column now.

As Mechie said, passenger footwell area:

In Red circles:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/RelayLocation.png

There are two relays attached to the side of the inside fuse panel, but those get removed since they are for DCCD and something else I removed. There is also a starter block relay which I still have in the circuit, but could be removed since I removed the factory security.. however I plan to use that for my own security switch.

Jeff

[R.Spec]

Absolutely. I'm just about to start organizing an 818 NW get together for sometime in July, so stay tuned. What delivery date did you get, since you just ordered.. curious what the lead time is now.


Jeff

They told me november the day before I ordered. I havent got a call yet. I will be giving them a call tomorrow probably. I just talked to Matt Kincaid one of my coworkers and he said he remembers you from way back in the early subaru days of pdx tuning etc.

[sponaugle]

Woot! Time to start building.. my car has arrived!

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/CarArriving.jpg

The car being delivered at Perrin Performance.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/CarInTrailer.jpg

The chassis sitting in my trailer ready to be unloaded at my house.

Now the real fun begins!

Jeff

[Kurk818]

Congrats!. The fun starts now

[Mechie3]

Very nice! Looking forward to seeing this build.

[Aero STI]

Very cool, Jeff. The initial assembly is a lot of fun. I even found the wire diet enjoyable. Things slowed down when I got to mounting the body panels. That's something I would love to have outsourced.

[sponaugle]

I started doing inventory today of everything. My car was complete on 5/10 but didn't get picked up by Stewart until 6/1 because I was traveling.... it seems that extra bit of time waiting there made a difference in terms of backorder stuff. Take a look at the Backorder BOM:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/BOM1.jpg

When my car was originally packed up there was a pretty large list of backorder stuff, but by the time it got picked up there were only 4 items on the list left: a 3/8s rod, the transmission cover, the headlights, and the radiator hose set. I can get quite a bit done without those items! I guess FF is catching up on backorder stuff now.

I got the chassis out of my trailer and into the shop:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/KitInGarage.jpg

[waruaki]

Congratulations

[Frank818]

Yeah they are catching up pretty good on BO stuff, mine was last end of April and nothing on the BO list was useful for me (did upgrades or not using cuz I am using another engine).

That blue subbie could have been the donor.

[sponaugle]

That blue subbie could have been the donor.

Haha.. yea... it is sitting there thinking... that could be me!

So I finished up the inventory, only one mistake on FFRs part ( a small part ), so all is good. I didn't realize how many aluminum panels there were. I am fortunate that my wife has let me convert our guest house into a man cave/ham shack/reloading station/electronics prototyping lab and now body panel storage!

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/BodyPanels.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/AlumPanels.jpg

I do have a question for people who have done powder coating; Did you powder coat every aluminum panel, or just the ones in the cockpit area? Given you have to fit each panel and drill for the rivets, you would have to do all of the fitting first then remove every panel to send off to coating. That seems like a lot of work, but it would be nice to have everything coated.

I suppose I could powder coat all of the internal panels and just paint the other ones.

Jeff

[AZPete]

Jeff, I powder coated only the alum panels that will be seen and not the ones to be covered. Coated were the wheel well panels, front compartment sides & floor, panel under the seats, rear wheel well panels, and others that will be seen. Not coated were the rear firewall, cockpit sides, dead pedal pieces, center console, door frames and any other interior pieces that I will later cover with leather or vinyl.

[Jaime]

I second the leather or vinyl on the interior. I plan on using body filler under the vinyl so the rivets don't show.

[CptTripps]

I second the leather or vinyl on the interior. I plan on using body filler under the vinyl so the rivets don't show.

That's going to be a LOT of filler, and I'm not sure it'll work out how you want. Maybe a better idea would be to use a closed-cell foam like a yoga mat. You could use a regular paper hole punch where the rivets are so the vinyl will smooth over them.

Just a thought...

[Scargo]

There are flush-headed rivets.

[Jaime]

That's going to be a LOT of filler, and I'm not sure it'll work out how you want. Maybe a better idea would be to use a closed-cell foam like a yoga mat. You could use a regular paper hole punch where the rivets are so the vinyl will smooth over them.

Just a thought...

I was going to do something like that. Probably one layer of vinyl with holes and body fill the holes, then a second layer. I don't think any rivets are flush enough not to show through.

[Triathletedave]

Haha.. yea... it is sitting there thinking... that could be me!

So I finished up the inventory, only one mistake on FFRs part ( a small part ), so all is good. I didn't realize how many aluminum panels there were. I am fortunate that my wife has let me convert our guest house into a man cave/ham shack/reloading station/electronics prototyping lab and now body panel storage!

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/BodyPanels.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/AlumPanels.jpg

I do have a question for people who have done powder coating; Did you powder coat every aluminum panel, or just the ones in the cockpit area? Given you have to fit each panel and drill for the rivets, you would have to do all of the fitting first then remove every panel to send off to coating. That seems like a lot of work, but it would be nice to have everything coated.

I suppose I could powder coat all of the internal panels and just paint the other ones.

Jeff

When I received my kit, the first thing I did was to take all of the aluminum parts and panels plus any uncoated steel parts in for powder coating. A wee bit excessive, but I got a good price for the whole kit, and I never have to worry about powder coating anything last-minute as I install parts. It was just a lot easier this way.

[Evan78]

I do have a question for people who have done powder coating; Did you powder coat every aluminum panel, or just the ones in the cockpit area? Given you have to fit each panel and drill for the rivets, you would have to do all of the fitting first then remove every panel to send off to coating. That seems like a lot of work, but it would be nice to have everything coated.

I suppose I could powder coat all of the internal panels and just paint the other ones.

JeffMy frame ran $425 to powder coat, plus another $80 for the front radiator support and rear chassis brace. At the same time, I asked for a price for all of the aluminum and was quoted $1100. I didn't know what would show and what wouldn't so I didn't bother with any of it. Also, if you have the coated before drilling the rivet holes, the powder coater may want to drill some holes for hanging the panels.

[sponaugle]

When I received my kit, the first thing I did was to take all of the aluminum parts and panels plus any uncoated steel parts in for powder coating. A wee bit excessive, but I got a good price for the whole kit, and I never have to worry about powder coating anything last-minute as I install parts. It was just a lot easier this way.

Interesting... did you have any cracking when you then drilled for the rivets?


My frame ran $425 to powder coat, plus another $80 for the front radiator support and rear chassis brace. At the same time, I asked for a price for all of the aluminum and was quoted $1100. I didn't know what would show and what wouldn't so I didn't bother with any of it. Also, if you have the coated before drilling the rivet holes, the powder coater may want to drill some holes for hanging the panels.

Thanks. that gives me a good ball park. I need to figure out what things I will put carpet on etc. I could also just paint the aluminum panels, but of course that is easy to scratch so not as good as a real powder coat.

Jeff

[AZPete]

There are flush-headed rivets.

To make a rivet head flush: drill a 1/4" hole in a piece of wood, drill a 1/8" or 3/16" hole in the aluminum panel and then place the panel on the wood so both holes line up. Place a phillips-head flat-head wood screw in the hole and place the tip of a phillips-head screwdriver on the screw. Tap the screwdriver gently to make a small recess in the panel. When you rivet the panel in place the rivet head will be flush. This is especially good for panels you cover without any padding.

[sponaugle]

I took a look at the Front Suspension brackets that attach to the spindles. They are designed to work with the 5x100 spindles not the 5x114.5 ones. The 5x114.5 brackets I am using are a bit thicker and the bolt holes are a bit farther apart.

Here is a picture of the bracket and the spindle from the side:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/IFSBracket1.jpg

And the top
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/IFSBracket2.jpg


You can see the newer brackets have a second smaller bracket inside, and that bracket seems to be held in place with two thru-hole spot welds. It looks like if I drill out those welds the inside brackets will come off. I would then have to enlarge the upper hole, and potentially cut a washer shim to fill part of the now larger hole.

Anyone else done this mod yet?

Jeff

[Triathletedave]

[QUOTE=sponaugle;158247]Interesting... did you have any cracking when you then drilled for the rivets?

Not so far. The fellow who did my powder coating is pretty fussy, and did a good job. No regrets on my side. Total cost was $800 CAD

[Wayne Presley]

I took a look at the Front Suspension brackets that attach to the spindles. They are designed to work with the 5x100 spindles not the 5x114.5 ones. The 5x114.5 brackets I am using are a bit thicker and the bolt holes are a bit farther apart.

Here is a picture of the bracket and the spindle from the side:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/IFSBracket1.jpg

And the top
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/IFSBracket2.jpg


You can see the newer brackets have a second smaller bracket inside, and that bracket seems to be held in place with two thru-hole spot welds. It looks like if I drill out those welds the inside brackets will come off. I would then have to enlarge the upper hole, and potentially cut a washer shim to fill part of the now larger hole.

Anyone else done this mod yet?

Jeff


There have been a couple that have done it, Pull the inner plates out and put them outside and redrill. The kit is designed around the WRX spindle.

[sponaugle]

There have been a couple that have done it, Pull the inner plates out and put them outside and redrill. The kit is designed around the WRX spindle.

Thanks Wayne! I found the note from Kurk818: http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?11604-What-would-need-to-be-done-to-modify-STI-spindles-to-work-with-the-818

I'll give it a try. It looks like in his case the inner bracket was welded on the edge in a few spots, not the thru-hole spot welds on mine. I'll drill them out tonight and see how it looks.

Thanks!!

Jeff

[Mechie3]

I moutned my firewall and cockpit aluminum with cleco's then took it apart and had it powdercoated. All steel pieces plus 1/2 the aluminum was ~$300. Got a special price since my friend works at the PC shop.

[Kurk818]

Yup, you got it. The new design seems to be easier to modify for the STI spindles.


Thanks Wayne! I found the note from Kirk818: http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?11604-What-would-need-to-be-done-to-modify-STI-spindles-to-work-with-the-818

I'll give it a try. It looks like in his case the inner bracket was welded on the edge in a few spots, not the thru-hole spot welds on mine. I'll drill them out tonight and see how it looks.

Thanks!!

Jeff

[sponaugle]

Yup, you got it. The new design seems to be easier to modify for the STI spindles.

Thanks for the info Kurk818. I drilled out the brackets and that worked great. The width with the brackets removed is perfect for the STI spindle. I used a die grinder the expand the upper hole and that worked well.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/ModifiedBracket.jpg

Here is the modified bracket mounted:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/ModifiedBracket2.jpg


I do have a question for the masses however: Here is a diagram of the size of the upper and lower holes in the STI spindle as well as the bracket.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/IFSBracket3.jpg


In the instruction manual they suggest that you use the stock front OEM lower bolt in the lower hole, and the stock OEM Rear lower or upper bolt for the upper hole. The upper hole is larger to make room for the stock adjustable camber bolt. I verified the part numbers for the rear strut bolts [20540AA100] and they are the same as the front lower (20540AA100) ( in the 02-04 WRX case, the STI has a slight difference in the front lower bolt part number (20540PA010) but the bolt is the same size).

The OEM front lower/rear both Bolt is 13.92mm wide.
The OEM front upper Camber Bolt is 16.33mm wide.

It would seem if you use an OEM rear strut bolt in the top hole, there will be some slop (~2mm). While the bolt may be tightened alot , I can’t see it being safe to rely on clamping friction to keep it from moving. Since that movement would change the alignment, it would seem it best to have a bolt that is very close to the camber bolt/hole size… Since the FF bracket is not big enough for the OEM Camber bolt, that isn’t a solution. You could find a bolt that is very close to 16.15mm in size and that would be a bit better. An M16 metric 10.9 bolt would work pretty well since that would be 16.0mm in size.

Am I missing something?

Jeff

[sponaugle]

Not so far. The fellow who did my powder coating is pretty fussy, and did a good job. No regrets on my side. Total cost was $800 CAD

Thanks for the info. Getting quotes now.


I moutned my firewall and cockpit aluminum with cleco's then took it apart and had it powdercoated. All steel pieces plus 1/2 the aluminum was ~$300. Got a special price since my friend works at the PC shop.

Thanks... I am leaning towards doing it this way. I can get started on the aluminum now and once everything it drilled send them off.

Jeff

[sponaugle]

Am I missing something?
Jeff

And I get to answer my own question: http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?13278-Bushing-the-top-front-spindle-strut-cam-bolt-mount-hole&highlight=upper+strut+bolt

Are most people doing the M16 16.0 mm bolt? That seems like a pretty easy solution, but I am surprised this wouldn't just be part of the kit.

Jeff

[Boog]

Thanks for the info Kurk818. I drilled out the brackets and that worked great. The width with the brackets removed is perfect for the STI spindle. I used a die grinder the expand the upper hole and that worked well.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/ModifiedBracket.jpg

Here is the modified bracket mounted:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/ModifiedBracket2.jpg


I do have a question for the masses however: Here is a diagram of the size of the upper and lower holes in the STI spindle as well as the bracket.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/IFSBracket3.jpg


In the instruction manual they suggest that you use the stock front OEM lower bolt in the lower hole, and the stock OEM Rear lower or upper bolt for the upper hole. The upper hole is larger to make room for the stock adjustable camber bolt. I verified the part numbers for the rear strut bolts [20540AA100] and they are the same as the front lower (20540AA100) ( in the 02-04 WRX case, the STI has a slight difference in the front lower bolt part number (20540PA010) but the bolt is the same size).

The OEM front lower/rear both Bolt is 13.92mm wide.
The OEM front upper Camber Bolt is 16.33mm wide.

It would seem if you use an OEM rear strut bolt in the top hole, there will be some slop (~2mm). While the bolt may be tightened alot , I can’t see it being safe to rely on clamping friction to keep it from moving. Since that movement would change the alignment, it would seem it best to have a bolt that is very close to the camber bolt/hole size… Since the FF bracket is not big enough for the OEM Camber bolt, that isn’t a solution. You could find a bolt that is very close to 16.15mm in size and that would be a bit better. An M16 metric 10.9 bolt would work pretty well since that would be 16.0mm in size.

Am I missing something?

Jeff

Thanks for these pictures/this post. Its something I've been wondering about for a while.

It seems like the only remaining question regarding a 5x114.3, unit bearing and brembo swap using a 5MT are the (potentially) custom axles.

[Scargo]

... It would seem if you use an OEM rear strut bolt in the top hole, there will be some slop (~2mm). While the bolt may be tightened alot , I can’t see it being safe to rely on clamping friction to keep it from moving. Since that movement would change the alignment, it would seem it best to have a bolt that is very close to the camber bolt/hole size…
If this makes you or anyone else more comfortable, I and others have opened up the top hole on our coilovers or struts to gain camber on our heavy-as* Subarus. Mine is a pure track car that has been over the bus-stop curbs at WGI (and so-on) and that clamped spot has not moved. I did use slight pressure so the bolt rested on the side of the hole before I clamped it and then I used my camber plate for the final camber adjustment.
I like the clean, better approach of a larger bolt, but the other will work.

[Frank818]

Well I was using a smaller strut bolt relying on clamping force, but now that I have seen this and what others did, I will order some M16 bolts.

[sponaugle]

I have made a bit of progress. Some of the front and rear suspension parts are mounted, most of the steel brackets are off to powercoat, and I did some drilling in panels for rivets.

The donor STI had Perrin lateral links which are not made any more. The fit great into the chassis, and have nice spherical bearings as well as both legs are adjustable.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/PerrinLinks.jpg

I also drilled the control arms and added the lower shock bracket. Very easy to do with the aluminum arms.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/ControlArm.jpg

One thing that seems odd is the upper mount on the rear shocks. The manual specificly calls out to use a slightly smaller spacer in the front of the attachment point and the slightly larger spacer in the rear. However as you can see in the picture, with the smaller spaces the space is not filled up. I suspect that when I tighten the bolt it will just deform the bracket, but it seems odd.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/StrutTop.jpg

I highlighted the gap with yellow lines.

Does anyone else have this problem?

I also started working on the axles. Since I am using the STI 114.5 spindles, I need to use the STI outer CVs. The causes a problem because the rear outer CVs from the STI are larger in spline count then the WRX ones. The axles provided by FFR will not work.

Here is a picture of the FFR axle, the STI front axle, and the STI rear axle:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/STIAxles.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/STIAxlesZoom.jpg


As you can see the STI rear axles are the perfect length (the same as the provided FFR one). Unfortunately the rear inner CV is larger spline count the the inner front CVs. Since I need to install front inner CVs to go into the transmission, those rear axles will not work. The STI front axles would work in terms of spline count, however the STI front axle is about an inch longer then the FFR axle.

Kurk818 mentioned that he is going to try using them, and it might work. There is about 2 inches of play in the inner CVs (which are the latitude sliding ones). If you start compressed 1 inch due to the axle being longer I am unsure if there is enough room left for full up to full down wheel extension. Once I get my transmission in, I'll assemble everything and see how it works.

I have one other complication that is different from Kurk818. I am using an Andrewtech 5-speed, and 5-speeds usually have stub outputs (held in by a lock ring). I would like to use the 06 STI front inner CVs that I have which are stubs as well. I talked to Sam an Andrewtech and he said he thought it was possible to convert the 5-speed to use axle stubs. On the 04 STI 6 speeds it is pretty easy as there are seals and rings for both designs. Hopefully this will work out.

If by change I can't get the 5-speed to work with the STI stubs, I will have to get a set of WRX inner front stubs (well stubless stubs) and have a custom axle made that can do the STI outers with WRX inners.

Either way I'll get it working, but it would be great to have everything all set to use either a 5 speed or a 6 speed without changing axles,

Oh I also ordered a bunch of goodies from VCP today (AWIC, arms, ktuned shifter), Rori ( Ktuned brackets, rad brackets), ReplicaParts (Brake bracket), Boyds (Fuel Tank), Breeze (Coolant Tubes), Amazon ( Radiator, Nickel Copper Brake Lines ), and BrakeConnect (some 10mm x 1.0 fittings for 3/16s line.) Still need to get the good flare tool (Eastwood).. but stuff is on the way!

Jeff

[sponaugle]

If this makes you or anyone else more comfortable, I and others have opened up the top hole on our coilovers or struts to gain camber on our heavy-as* Subarus. Mine is a pure track car that has been over the bus-stop curbs at WGI (and so-on) and that clamped spot has not moved. I did use slight pressure so the bolt rested on the side of the hole before I clamped it and then I used my camber plate for the final camber adjustment.
I like the clean, better approach of a larger bolt, but the other will work.

Thanks for the info. I now remember that some people used smaller camber bolts in the rear that didn't full connect to the outer bracket (because they were smaller in diameter in the no cam'd part), and those never seemed to slip or move. I went ahead and got some M16 bolts and everything is snug as a rug now.

Jeff

[Bob_n_Cincy]

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/STIAxles.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/STIAxlesZoom.jpg




EDIT: THE PICTURE HAS BEEN CORRECTED

Sponaugle,
In the pictures you took, the FFR axle is labeled incorrectly.
The end that uses a standard snap ring goes into the tri-lobe inner joint.
The end with the spring wire goes to a 8 ball outer joint.
Bob

[Frank818]

I also drilled the control arms and added the lower shock bracket. Very easy to do with the aluminum arms.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/ControlArm.jpg

So you installed the shock mount pointing outwards. The manual shows both orientations, so what made you choose this one?

On the rear upper shock mount, I think I have space as well, I have space almost everywhere where there is something mounted on the chassis, but like you said the brackets will get closer once you tighten them up.

[sponaugle]

Sponaugle,
In the pictures you took, the FFR axle is labeled incorrectly.
The end that uses a standard snap ring goes into the tri-lobe inner joint.
The end with the spring wire goes to a 8 ball outer joint.
Bob

Good Catch Bob.... and now fixed in the pictures! Thanks!
Jeff

[Kurk818]

I dont remember my STI front axles being that much longer than the FFR axles. It was more like 3/8" if im not mistaken. I ended up using the STI axles and installing the rear outer CVs on them. I had to widen my track width accordingly to ensure there was no binding and have some axle movement between hub and tranny. With the 295's that i will be running in the rear, body modification was already going to be needed so having an extra +/- 1/2" was not a concern.

Your 5speed to STI hubs is another problem im glad im not dealing with. LOL


One thing that seems odd is the upper mount on the rear shocks. The manual specificly calls out to use a slightly smaller spacer in the front of the attachment point and the slightly larger spacer in the rear. However as you can see in the picture, with the smaller spaces the space is not filled up. I suspect that when I tighten the bolt it will just deform the bracket, but it seems odd.



I highlighted the gap with yellow lines.

Does anyone else have this problem?

I also started working on the axles. Since I am using the STI 114.5 spindles, I need to use the STI outer CVs. The causes a problem because the rear outer CVs from the STI are larger in spline count then the WRX ones. The axles provided by FFR will not work.

Here is a picture of the FFR axle, the STI front axle, and the STI rear axle:

[i

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/STIAxlesZoom.jpg


As you can see the STI rear axles are the perfect length (the same as the provided FFR one). Unfortunately the rear inner CV is larger spline count the the inner front CVs. Since I need to install front inner CVs to go into the transmission, those rear axles will not work. The STI front axles would work in terms of spline count, however the STI front axle is about an inch longer then the FFR axle.

Kurk818 mentioned that he is going to try using them, and it might work. There is about 2 inches of play in the inner CVs (which are the latitude sliding ones). If you start compressed 1 inch due to the axle being longer I am unsure if there is enough room left for full up to full down wheel extension. Once I get my transmission in, I'll assemble everything and see how it works.

I have one other complication that is different from Kurk818. I am using an Andrewtech 5-speed, and 5-speeds usually have stub outputs (held in by a lock ring). I would like to use the 06 STI front inner CVs that I have which are stubs as well. I talked to Sam an Andrewtech and he said he thought it was possible to convert the 5-speed to use axle stubs. On the 04 STI 6 speeds it is pretty easy as there are seals and rings for both designs. Hopefully this will work out.

If by change I can't get the 5-speed to work with the STI stubs, I will have to get a set of WRX inner front stubs (well stubless stubs) and have a custom axle made that can do the STI outers with WRX inners.

Either way I'll get it working, but it would be great to have everything all set to use either a 5 speed or a 6 speed without changing axles,

Oh I also ordered a bunch of goodies from VCP today (AWIC, arms, ktuned shifter), Rori ( Ktuned brackets, rad brackets), ReplicaParts (Brake bracket), Boyds (Fuel Tank), Breeze (Coolant Tubes), Amazon ( Radiator, Nickel Copper Brake Lines ), and BrakeConnect (some 10mm x 1.0 fittings for 3/16s line.) Still need to get the good flare tool (Eastwood).. but stuff is on the way!

Jeff

[Kurk818]

I also drilled the control arms and added the lower shock bracket. Very easy to do with the aluminum arms.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/ControlArm.jpg


Jeff

Did you have to modify the bracket or the a arm to ensure that the bracket was fully seated? I ground away a tiny bit of the a-arm to ensure a tight seat.

[sponaugle]

I don't remember my STI front axles being that much longer than the FFR axles. It was more like 3/8" if I'm not mistaken. I ended up using the STI axles and installing the rear outer CVs on them. I had to widen my track width accordingly to ensure there was no binding and have some axle movement between hub and tranny. With the 295's that i will be running in the rear, body modification was already going to be needed so having an extra +/- 1/2" was not a concern.
Your 5speed to STI hubs is another problem I'm glad I'm not dealing with. LOL

I'll have to do a detailed measurement, as the 'inch' was just a guess. I'm also looking at at least 295s in the rear, so body work for me as well. When you say you widen the track, did you do that by lengthening the lower lat links and the upper links?


Did you have to modify the bracket or the a arm to ensure that the bracket was fully seated? I ground away a tiny bit of the a-arm to ensure a tight seat.

Yea, after drilling I did flatten the spots out so the bracket would fit flat. Once I torqued everything down it looks pretty good.. and the angle of the bracket doesn't make a huge difference since the upper joint pivots. I used 10.9 metric hardware for that, and some threadlocker.


So you installed the shock mount pointing outwards. The manual shows both orientations, so what made you choose this one?

On the rear upper shock mount, I think I have space as well, I have space almost everywhere where there is something mounted on the chassis, but like you said the brackets will get closer once you tighten them up.

Yea, the manual has an almost equal number of pictures with each orientation.. but more of them with the aluminum arms has it this way. Is is possible it is reversed in the R ride height? Changing the orientation makes a slight change in the angle the shock is at, but does not really make a difference in terms of suspension movement (aside from a small amount of precompression). I would hope it doesn't matter which way you do it.

I am digging building this car... Lots of cool stuff to learn and it seems pretty easy so far.. minus my own crazy choices of course.. ;)

Jeff

[Wayne Presley]

I am digging building this car... Lots of cool stuff to learn and it seems pretty easy so far.. minus my own crazy choices of course.. ;)

Jeff

The cascade effect of coloring outside the lines :-)

[Kurk818]

[QUOTE=sponaugle;158886]I'll have to do a detailed measurement, as the 'inch' was just a guess. I'm also looking at at least 295s in the rear, so body work for me as well. When you say you widen the track, did you do that by lengthening the lower lat links and the upper links?

That is correct.



Yea, after drilling I did flatten the spots out so the bracket would fit flat. Once I torqued everything down it looks pretty good.. and the angle of the bracket doesn't make a huge difference since the upper joint pivots. I used 10.9 metric hardware for that, and some threadlocker.


I drilled and tapped mine. Then torqued them down with locktite

[sponaugle]

I dont remember my STI front axles being that much longer than the FFR axles. It was more like 3/8" if im not mistaken. I ended up using the STI axles and installing the rear outer CVs on them. I had to widen my track width accordingly to ensure there was no binding and have some axle movement between hub and tranny. With the 295's that i will be running in the rear, body modification was already going to be needed so having an extra +/- 1/2" was not a concern.
Your 5speed to STI hubs is another problem im glad im not dealing with. LOL

I went out and measured my axles. The front STI axle was 21 5/8, and the FFR axle was 20 13/16, so a difference of 13/16th. Less then the 1" I guessed at, which is good. I suspect with even just 3/8 - 1/2" track width addition it will be in the working range. Once I get everything mounted I'll do some more measurements.

Jeff

[sponaugle]

That is correct.


BTW, what wheels did you end up picking? Size/Offset?

EDIT: You already answered that question in that fender thread!


My front tires are 255/30/18 with a 35mm offset. So far the with the current setup and off set i have the following issues; tires contact the sway bar at the links and minor frame contact. Im hoping a majority of the issues can be taken care of with some spacers. The rears are a 20mm offset and do not have any issues with suspension contact or the trailing arm. Body modification will definitely be required. Ill keep posting as more progress is done.


I am planning on purchasing the jdmflares.com flares for my kit once the body is on and exact dimensions are finalized. I have 10.5" rims with 295s on the rear and 8.5" rim with 255 for the front.

http://i.imgur.com/gkgGrEhl.jpg

So 10.5 wide 20 offset rear, and 8.5 35 offset front. Not Rota?

[Kurk818]

They are not Rota's. They are Miro 398's. I have since put on 15mm spacers in the front to clear the brembo and help out with the clearance between the inside back sheet metal panel. I will need to create a depression within the panel to ensure no wheel rub at full lock. (shouldnt be more than 3/8" additional clearance)

[sponaugle]

They are not Rota's. They are Miro 398's. I have since put on 15mm spacers in the front to clear the brembo and help out with the clearance between the inside back sheet metal panel. I will need to create a depression within the panel to ensure no wheel rub at full lock. (shouldnt be more than 3/8" additional clearance)

Thanks Kurk. Sure enough even Amazon has the rears:

Rear 18x10.5 5x114.3 +20mm offsets: http://www.amazon.com/Miro-398-18x10-5-5x114-3-Wheels/dp/B009B1ROR6

[Kurk818]

Are you looking to buy those rims? PM me and ill let you know what i bought them. I got a way better deal then they advertise.

[sponaugle]

Some parts came in before the weekend..

New crank, oil pump, water pump, oil cooler, wheel studs, head studs and timing belt.
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Parts1.jpg

I sent all of the steel brackets off to powder coat.
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Parts2.jpg

A new rivnut tool, and a new coolant fill system.... if you have not used one of these before, it is a great way to get a complete coolant fill. You put a vacuum on the coolant system first and check for leaks. If all is good you then open a valve and use the vacuum in the system to pull coolant in. It gets a very complete fill with very few air pockets.
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Parts3.jpg

A new shortblock case ready for parts.
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Parts4.jpg

A new radiator.
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Parts5.jpg

Jeff

[Frank818]

Jeff, is that the UView 550000?

[sponaugle]

Jeff, is that the UView 550000?

Yep, that is the one. I think it is $107 on Amazon.

Jeff

[Boog]

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Parts3.jpg


Is that drill insert for rivets or rivnuts? I've been looking for something similar to the Dafra DRNCA-4210 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_5sBzK82Wb4), which doesn't seem to have any distributors in the US.

[sponaugle]

Is that drill insert for rivets or rivnuts? I've been looking for something similar to the Dafra DRNCA-4210 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_5sBzK82Wb4), which doesn't seem to have any distributors in the US.

Unfortunately not. It is just a rivet tool. I looked for that rivnut tool but could not find it in the US. I did find a similar one at Grainger: http://www.grainger.com/product/RIVEDRILL-Rivet-Nut-Installation-Tool-3EHT4. It was a lot more expensive however.

Jeff

[sponaugle]

I temporarily installed the front suspension components to see how everything fit.

Once both sides were done, I noticed the drivers side upper control arm ball joint bracket was backwards.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/UpperLCAOops.jpg.

Even though my kit is a new kit (#198) I was surprised that got the older angled upper brackets.

I followed the procedure in the tips thread and removed thread from the fixed side of the bracket, and flipped the bracket over. Now the passenger side looks like this:
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/PassengerSideUCA.jpg

And the drivers side...
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/DriversSideUCA.jpg

I don't like this solution. While it is possible to have both side adjusted to the same final outcome, it will happen with different side length adjustments on each side of the car. Since on the passenger side the front bracket coupling is fixed (it does not rotate), and on the drivers side the rear coupling is fixed, to get the same x-y position the brackets will be at difference rotations (and thus the turnbuckles at different lengths.). To be clear I don't just mean the front turnbuckle on one side will be the same the rear on the other, I mean it will be different then both the turnbuckles on the other side.

This means the total available adjustability is now limited by two different variables and where they overlap (assuming you want the same settings on each side.) Because of this I am going to try to get a set of the straight brackets.

Anyone else noticed this?

Jeff

[metalmaker12]

I temporarily installed the front suspension components to see how everything fit.

Once both sides were done, I noticed the drivers side upper control arm ball joint bracket was backwards.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/UpperLCAOops.jpg.



Even though my kit is a new kit (#198) I was surprised that got the older angled upper brackets.

I followed the procedure in the tips thread and removed thread from the fixed side of the bracket, and flipped the bracket over. Now the passenger side looks like this:
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/PassengerSideUCA.jpg

And the drivers side...
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/DriversSideUCA.jpg

I don't like this solution. While it is possible to have both side adjusted to the same final outcome, it will happen with different side length adjustments on each side of the car. Since on the passenger side the front bracket coupling is fixed (it does not rotate), and on the drivers side the rear coupling is fixed, to get the same x-y position the brackets will be at difference rotations (and thus the turnbuckles at different lengths.). To be clear I don't just mean the front turnbuckle on one side will be the same the rear on the other, I mean it will be different then both the turnbuckles on the other side.

This means the total available adjustability is now limited by two different variables and where they overlap (assuming you want the same settings on each side.) Because of this I am going to try to get a set of the straight brackets.

Anyone else noticed this?

Jeff


I totally agree with ya

[metalmaker12]

Thought you were running a H6

[Frank818]

Jeff, my kit is 181 and I don't have that problem. My upper arms look quite straight with minimal adjustments. But, they are on the wrong side, I have the longer arm pointing to the back instead of the shorter arm pointing to the back. I need to flip them side to side, not over. Now that I think about it, maybe that's the way (longer arm pointing back) they should go? Not sure if it would give more adjustments though.

[sponaugle]

I totally agree with ya

Thought you were running a H6

Thanks! I was debating writing a little matlab program to calculate the change in adustability, but probably a waste of time. ;) I am going to run the H6, but I am putting in a EJ257 first so I can pass the registration emissions. The H6 runs with a Vipec ECM that does not do OBDII. I have a 2004 STI ECU laying around that I'll use with the 4 cylinder and that will do OBDII. Since I have 3 other Subarus, it isn't a bad idea to have an extra built long block sitting around.


Jeff, my kit is 181 and I don't have that problem. My upper arms look quite straight with minimal adjustments. But, they are on the wrong side, I have the longer arm pointing to the back instead of the shorter arm pointing to the back. I need to flip them side to side, not over. Now that I think about it, maybe that's the way (longer arm pointing back) they should go? Not sure if it would give more adjustments though.

Hmm.. Yes I was surprised to have the older angled brackets. I contacted FFR to see if I can get the straight ones.

Jeff

[sponaugle]

I have started on the engine build. Since this is really just an engine for chassis break in and getting registered, it is not going to be anything fancy. New case and crank, Weisco pistons, Crower Rods, Cosworth heads and cams, and a GT35R twin scroll turbo. I know... I can't resist having just a little bit of fun.

I had a bunch of bearings in my parts cabinet that I forgot about. Looks like I have both std and extra size of each which is good for matching.
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Parts6.jpg

Crank Journals
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Parts7.jpg

New pistons measure up.
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Parts8.jpg

And the bore gauge..
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Parts9.jpg

I'll post up the detailed data on the clearances once I make a final pass.

Jeff

[sponaugle]

The boyd tank came in yesterday so I dropped that in to see how it fits. Perfect. It makes is easy to push the firewall back.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/BoydTank.jpg

I do need to find someone in Portland with a brake large enough to bend that back aluminum panel about 20 extra degrees to make up for moving the firewall. Any ideas?

My VCP trailing arms also came in:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/RearSuspension.jpg

It was interesting that the spacers provided were cut down on one side as mentioned by others, but my chassis did not need the cut down. Perhaps they made a production change in the chassis. I ended up making some spacers from some bar stock I had. Wayne have you heard this from anyone else?

My daughter Audrey (~21 months old ) loves coming out to the shop to help out.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/AudreyChassis.jpg

[Boog]

I wanted to mention that your detailed writeup on the GTO forum about the Racelogic TCS was very impressive and sold me on the benefits of the module. Too often there seem to be a lack of curiosity and analysis as people are so focus on the 'what' of results without looking at the 'why' to back it up. Thanks for giving back to the various communities.
(Posting here so as to not pollute your calibration Q&A thread)

[Wayne Presley]

The boyd tank came in yesterday so I dropped that in to see how it fits. Perfect. It makes is easy to push the firewall back.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/BoydTank.jpg

I do need to find someone in Portland with a brake large enough to bend that back aluminum panel about 20 extra degrees to make up for moving the firewall. Any ideas?

My VCP trailing arms also came in:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/RearSuspension.jpg

It was interesting that the spacers provided were cut down on one side as mentioned by others, but my chassis did not need the cut down. Perhaps they made a production change in the chassis. I ended up making some spacers from some bar stock I had. Wayne have you heard this from anyone else?

My daughter Audrey (~21 months old ) loves coming out to the shop to help out.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/AudreyChassis.jpg

Jeff, Could you measure the width of the front bracket? And you are going to want to offset the front rod end toward the inside of the car for more tire clearance. The tank fits well, I know the guy that designed it :rolleyes:. The firewall can be done a number of ways. I cut the 90° and 75° bends out and welded them together. Or you can cut the 3" section between the 90 and 75 to 1/2" on each side, overlap the two 1/2" sections and bolt them together (or weld).

Audrey is cute and enjoy every minute you can with her. You'll turn around one day and she'll be all grown up. My oldest daughter got married last weekend and my youngest graduates from Auburn in 6 weeks. Seems like yesterday they were born...

[metalmaker12]

I have started on the engine build. Since this is really just an engine for chassis break in and getting registered, it is not going to be anything fancy. New case and crank, Weisco pistons, Crower Rods, Cosworth heads and cams, and a GT35R twin scroll turbo. I know... I can't resist having just a little bit of fun.

I had a bunch of bearings in my parts cabinet that I forgot about. Looks like I have both std and extra size of each which is good for matching.
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Parts6.jpg

Crank Journals
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Parts7.jpg

New pistons measure up.
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Parts8.jpg

And the bore gauge..
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Parts9.jpg

I'll post up the detailed data on the clearances once I make a final pass.

Jeff

Nothing serious just like 4-5 grand in parts for a break in engine lol. Certainly better than more than 75 percent of the 818 on this forum. Very nice, I will be starting my engine build soon.

[metalmaker12]

I have purchased the uview airlift 5500000 on ebay for $80 shipped, I have never really used one and on a wrx you prob leak test/fill via degas tank ??i am guessing you will have to clamp off overflow tank hose??

[sponaugle]

I wanted to mention that your detailed writeup on the GTO forum about the Racelogic TCS was very impressive and sold me on the benefits of the module. Too often there seem to be a lack of curiosity and analysis as people are so focus on the 'what' of results without looking at the 'why' to back it up. Thanks for giving back to the various communities.
(Posting here so as to not pollute your calibration Q&A thread)

Thanks. It was interesting to see how the data supported the road feel of the system.


Jeff, Could you measure the width of the front bracket? And you are going to want to offset the front rod end toward the inside of the car for more tire clearance. The tank fits well, I know the guy that designed it :rolleyes:. The firewall can be done a number of ways. I cut the 90° and 75° bends out and welded them together. Or you can cut the 3" section between the 90 and 75 to 1/2" on each side, overlap the two 1/2" sections and bolt them together (or weld).


Sure! Here is a picture with the spacers before adding some extra:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/TrailingArmSpacer.jpg

And here is a picture showing the size:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/TrailingArmSpacer2.jpg

I have the spacers about even right now, but once I get my wheels in I might need to space it over a bit and will just rotate the spacer I made to the other side.

I took your advice and cut the aluminum to about 1/2 inch on each side and it worked perfectly. Thank you for the tip!!

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/MovedFirewall.jpg



Audrey is cute and enjoy every minute you can with her. You'll turn around one day and she'll be all grown up. My oldest daughter got married last weekend and my youngest graduates from Auburn in 6 weeks. Seems like yesterday they were born...

Indeed, Even just these last 20 months have been a blur. Audrey has taken to preferring to go in one of my cars instead of my wifes car because mine are louder and as she says 'wow sounding'. She really like the sound of my 08 STI. Congratulations on the wedding and graduation. Lots of activity in your house! More recently Audrey has shown interest in what spanners are for:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818//AudreySpanner.jpg


Nothing serious just like 4-5 grand in parts for a break in engine lol. Certainly better than more than 75 percent of the 818 on this forum. Very nice, I will be starting my engine build soon.

I know.. a little OCD on my part, but I figure it is always good to have a spare engine in case something happens during race season. You never know when something bad will happen to a good engine! I'll be watching your thread to see how your engine progresses.


I have purchased the uview airlift 5500000 on ebay for $80 shipped, I have never really used one and on a wrx you prob leak test/fill via degas tank ??i am guessing you will have to clamp off overflow tank hose??

The overflow tank line should not need to be clamped during the vacuum since the radiator cap will stay closed. In the past without the Airlift I have typically just removed the top radiator hose and filled the block to full then the radiator, then run for a heat cycle. I have borrowed a airlift from a friend before and it worked perfectly, and given the size of the lines in the 818 I suspect air bubbles will be a bigger problem. I used the degas tank to fill and leak test and that worked great. When you put the vacuum on the system the soft hoses usually collapse a bit.

Jeff

[metalmaker12]

Ok cool, so no coolant in anything like it says to pressure test and than just vacuum feed coolant from a bucket to entire system. Seems easy enough, I hope it's an easier way than what I did the first time.

When I was at that stage my daughter was wrenching right there with me, and in the shadows her brother is a future car builder also. Shes 3 1/2 and he is 2 months

3098030979

I am having my bottom end/heads completely checked out by a machine shop. The bottom end will get all if needed machining, all new bearings and forged Crowler rods and cp pistons. The heads will get resurfaced and valve job and maybe ported and polished

[Wayne Presley]

I took your advice and cut the aluminum to about 1/2 inch on each side and it worked perfectly. Thank you for the tip!!

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/MovedFirewall.jpg

Jeff


Glad that worked out for you, you may have to trim the bottom of the new "middle" piece for a perfect fit.

[sponaugle]

When I was at that stage my daughter was wrenching right there with me, and in the shadows her brother is a future car builder also. Shes 3 1/2 and he is 2 months
3098030979

I am having my bottom end/heads completely checked out by a machine shop. The bottom end will get all if needed machining, all new bearings and forged Crowler rods and cp pistons. The heads will get resurfaced and valve job and maybe ported and polished

That is awesome. When she get's her license in 13 years it will be a classic car!


Glad that worked out for you, you may have to trim the bottom of the new "middle" piece for a perfect fit.

Yea, there is some good extra overhang I can trim off. I like the extra room for the seat!

I am waiting on some parts from Powdercoating right now.. so off topic...

I drove my bugeye to work for the first time in about 3 months... so I snapped a few pictures before I left.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Bugeye-1.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Bugeye-2.jpg

13 years old (March of 01), 25k miles, 14 different engines, 23 different turbos, 4 different engine management systems and probably 2000 dyno pulls. Paint still looks ok.

And I built a real quick bench flasher so I could check out the 04 STI ECU I purchased used. All looks good and flashed great.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/BenchFlash.jpg

Jeff

[Bob_n_Cincy]

And I built a real quick bench flasher so I could check out the 04 STI ECU I purchased used. All looks good and flashed great.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/BenchFlash.jpg

Jeff

Hi Jeff,
I can't believe what that car has been through.

I would like to find out if I can flash a CPU.
What power and communication pins are required for flashing.
Thanks
bob

[nuisance]

Glad that worked out for you, you may have to trim the bottom of the new "middle" piece for a perfect fit.

What does it mean "cut the aluminum to about 1/2" on each side"?

Thanks, John

[sponaugle]

Hi Jeff,
I would like to find out if I can flash a CPU.
What power and communication pins are required for flashing.
Thanks
bob

It depends on the year. In the case of the 04 STI, you need to connect 3 power pins and about 5 ground pins, two communication pins (technically K-Line and L-Line), the 'Ignition' Pin (to 12vs) and the 'Test Pin (to ground). If you tell me what year/model, I can give you the exact pin numbers. You need a 12V power supply and and female OBD2 connector (I just got a cheap extension cable from Amazon for $5 and cut it in half).

[sponaugle]

What does it mean "cut the aluminum to about 1/2" on each side"?

Thanks, John

If you look at the aluminum sheet that makes up the top part of the 'behind the seats' firewalll, it has three sections. A lower section angled at about 60 degrees, a small 3-4 inch flat 'shelf' section, then a third straight up to the top section. That middle 'shelf' section is what Wayne was referring to. I used a saw to cut out most of that 'shelf' and left about 1/2 inch on each side which now overlaps. That 'moves' the firewall back 2-3 inches. Since I am using the Boyd tank the lower firewall section just slid back. It gives you a nice bit of extra room for the seats.

Jeff

[nuisance]

Thanks Jeff, now I get it. I missed Wayne's tip to you a few posts ago. Too late, I did it a little differently, but it will work out.

John

[Frank818]

13 years old (March of 01), 25k miles, 14 different engines, 23 different turbos, 4 different engine management systems and probably 2000 dyno pulls. Paint still looks ok.

Of course the paint still looks ok, 80% of your 25k miles were done on the dyno! :D

I am impressed by the number of engines and turbos you've run. Why so many turbos and which one(s) you prefer?

You working in IT (networking, stuff like that)?

[metalmaker12]

That's an alarming amount of hardware to go through.

[sponaugle]

Of course the paint still looks ok, 80% of your 25k miles were done on the dyno! :D
I am impressed by the number of engines and turbos you've run. Why so many turbos and which one(s) you prefer?


A lot of that was R&D work back when I started PDXTuning. A guy on the east coast (Al) and I were the first to import the JDM Spec C motors, so my first two swaps were to two different versions of the Spec C 2.0L EJ207 engines (different heads). From there I did a number of different combinations and types.. when the 04 STI came to the states I got one of the very first shortblocks and ran those with some JDM heads. I broke a lot of motors along the way... on the 2.0L side a few broken rods and some ring landings, same on the 2.5L but a bit more spectacular. Lots of different Cams.. Kelford, etc. I was one of the first the break the first gen WRX 5-speed transmissions.. and I have video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-mtnZjlO0w&feature=youtu.be

This is back in... probably 2002... Before I went to the JDM motor I had a VF22 with some larger injectors and a front mount. This is 2nd session out on a track day at PIR. Jeff Perrin is in the passenger seat. Oh those 5-speeds.

I did drag race a few times, but mostly stuck to track days. I am a crappy drag race driver. I was surprised to find an old video of my car drag racing at PIR:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ILC6Ymp1CsQ

I think this was with an FP Green I has just installed. I think the best time I ran in that car was 11.03 some time back with the first EZ30R and a 35R.

No question I abused my car. Lots of stupid things.. way way to much timing and boost, crappy knock systems, inconsistent fuel.. all in all a great way to learn!

I did do a track day just a few weeks after I installed the Spec C motor.. and it was a Subaru of America sponsored track day. Probably 40 Subarus there, 80% stock. I was first out on the track, and managed to lap every single other car. If I remember correctly that motor died from an oil supply issue during a later track day. I made a funny video (sped up) of that first session, which I was surprised to still find on my laptop:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LBB6-QH11ds

As for turbos, I tried a lot of them. VF22, VF23, VF35, VF39, AVO400, AVO500, AVO600, 16G, 18G, 20G, Green, Red, Black, GT3071, GT3076, GT3586, GT4082, some crappy Chinese ones.. and the list goes on. At one point I added up how much I spent.. but I don't do that any more. :)

As far as which turbo I liked best... while there are better turbos now, at the time I probably liked the FP Green the most. I had it installed on a built 2.5L and tracked it a lot. I think today I prefer the GTX30s and 35s and the EFRs, although Tim put a nice Precision 6066 on his car and made 620whp just a few days ago.

Now I feel old. :)

Jeff

[Bob_n_Cincy]

It depends on the year. In the case of the 04 STI, you need to connect 3 power pins and about 5 ground pins, two communication pins (technically K-Line and L-Line), the 'Ignition' Pin (to 12vs) and the 'Test Pin (to ground). If you tell me what year/model, I can give you the exact pin numbers. You need a 12V power supply and and female OBD2 connector (I just got a cheap extension cable from Amazon for $5 and cut it in half).
Hi Jeff
I have an 04 forester XT donor.
It came with an auto trans, I have to flash to a manual trans.
Thanks
Bob

[Frank818]

My god, 25k miles and all this? Not many cars in their whole life can be proud of going through all these adventures.

I sort of think to change my turbo with the 818. GTX30xx for earlier boost. I currently have an old GT3582R 0.63AR and can't have twinscroll. I think the boost will hit too hard in early mid-range. Yes I have a nice controller, but I won't benefit all the turbo's potential until late mid-range if I dial it back. I guess I'll drive the car for a while first and decide later.

Keep up the good adventures with the blue bug eyes!

[longislandwrx]

love the plate too.

[sponaugle]

Bob,
The 04 Forrester XT ECU is very similar to the 04 STI ECU. The pinouts are almost the same for flashing. Let me upload my latests wire spreadsheet and I"ll link to it from here, and that will give you the info you need.
Jeff

[sponaugle]

love the plate too.

Yes, I dig the nerd plates, and there is a bit of a networking theme. Here are 6 of the plates I have on some of my cars. The DMV likes me. ;)

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Plate1.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Plate2.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Plate3.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Plate4.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Plate5.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Plate6.jpg

The oldest is TCPIP, which I got back in 95 when I worked at Intel. Strangely enough I don't have IPV4.

Jeff

[Frank818]

A "bit" of networking theme, you say? lolll

[longislandwrx]

and a vanity call sign? is there anything you don't do? :cool:

[sponaugle]

and a vanity call sign? is there anything you don't do? :cool:

haha.. yea my wife says I have a hobby problem. However since having a daughter I have made efforts to focus. Now I pretty much just do car stuff, electronics development, ham radio, long range shooting, and astrophotography. I did say focus, didn't I? :)

Jeff

[sponaugle]

I have been debating for a while as to how and what to do for gauges in my 818. While I like good analog gauges, over the years I have developed a few preferences in how to read data.

For things like temperature, voltage, peak values, etc I prefer some kind of direct numerical readout. I don’t mind sweeping needle gauges, but I find it easier to process direct numerical numbers. Things that are peaky and transient work well with a gauge that has some kind of hold time or secondary hold feature.

Here are my baseline requirements:

I want a system that ties all the gauges together into a single system.
All data from all gauges can be data recorded at all times to something like an SD card, or streamed over wifi/Bluetooth
Support for complex triggers for certain types of displays ( overboost, AFR too lean under boost, etc)
Support for any aftermarket sensor (voltage, RTD, current, SPI/I2C, etc)
Fast (>50hz) and accurate (at least 10 or 12 bit A/D)
Ability to interface with other dash system (AIM, etc)
Ability to integrate with the factory ECU (SSM and CAN)
Accelerometers, GPS, Roll/Yaw, Lineal Shock Sensors, etc.

There are a lot of gauge systems that tie gauges together, but I can’t find one that does all the rest of the stuff… So I think I am going to build the system myself and make it open source.

My thinking goes something like this:

I would like to have a central system that integrates all the sensor data, has long term SD storage, Interface connections to things like the stock ECU and AIM Dash system, and interface to display systems. For simple digital readout numbers I like displays like this:

https://dlnmh9ip6v2uc.cloudfront.net/r/600-600/assets/2/b/4/f/c/51e9760fce395f4d7b000000.png
https://www.sparkfun.com/products/11442 which is a simple 7 segment display. I would make a PCB to mount them on that can be mounted behind the dash with cutouts and windows.

For graphing there are lots of OLED displays:

http://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0045/8932/products/OLED128-stripchart_large.jpg?v=1378378368

It is harder to make my own circular analog gauges, so I am thinking I might use this:

http://www.plxdevices.com/images/MULTDM6/MULTDM6_logo.png
http://www.plxdevices.com/product_info.php?id=MULTDM6

I have a set of these in my 08 STI, and the displays are configurable to be whatever you want. You can create images for each sensor set and for each value, so you can make pretty much anything you can imagine. (Graphs, circular gauges, any combo of colors and fonts, etc)

These guys are designed to work with a bunch of sensors PLX sells, but the protocol to talk to the display is very simple (a serial chain protocol). I could make my device output that stream and use that display for more gauge like stuff.

Talking to the stock ECU is trivial (SSM2, 4800 bps protocol, lots of data elements available), and CAN is also easy to do.

I am thinking of using an ARM Cortex M4 CPU based board (perhaps a Beaglebone Black) for the main brain.

For the interface to the sensor, I could roll my own with a microcontroller and some A/Ds, or I could just use the RaceCapture device.

http://www.autosportlabs.net/images/thumb/d/d8/RaceCapturePro_inforgraphic.jpg/800px-RaceCapturePro_inforgraphic.jpg

The RaceCapture has the analog inputs, digital inputs, and can also do CAN in the upcoming release. It has a telemetry output that is a JSON stream that I believe has all of the captured data… it would be pretty easy to interface the RaceCapture to the something like the BeagleBone Black, and from there I could drive the digital displays and the MFDs. It would be straightforward to also drive LEDs (shift lights, etc), WI systems, AIM Dash, etc.

What do you guys think?

Jeff

[JeromeS13]

Why not just let the AiM dash do all of the datalogging? Have you looked at the new MXL2 or MXG?

[Wayne Presley]

Why not just let the AiM dash do all of the datalogging? Have you looked at the new MXL2 or MXG?

That's what I would do.

[sponaugle]

Why not just let the AiM dash do all of the datalogging? Have you looked at the new MXL2 or MXG?

That's what I would do.

Thanks guys!
Hmm.. The MXL2 does have a lot of features. The MXG has an amazing display.... that would look nice in the 818! Actually it does most of what I want. The only downside is the cost.. it is $2600, and that doesn't include a few of the extras.

http://www.aim-sportline.com/images/common/foto_mxg_290.jpg

The RaceCapture Pro is $400, and I suspect I would probably use two of the MFDs plus a collection of 7-segment displays... The BeagleBone Black is $49.. I could drive a real display over HDMI if I wanted the super configurable stuff.
I would guess total cost is about $850. Both solutions need sensors of course.

Of course I have to write all the software for my solution so there is that.... and there is no way I will have an interface as polished as the AIM guys. Then there is the satisfaction of doing it yourself, which on a kit car has some merit. Then again... hmm.. I'll have to think about this.

Jeff

[Wayne Presley]

Or a RaceTechnologies Dash2 PRO

[Sgt.Gator]

I have the original AIM MXL Pista that Phoenix Performance installed in 2006. I've updated the capability by adding the new AIM SmartyCam HD and GPS receiver. The GPS plugs into the SmartyCam, the SmartyCam plugs into the MXL Pista, and all of them can be made to connect thru the canbus.
So now I get all the datalogging/video/gps integrated together, here a video example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_cg1czAz724

Because the new AIM dash MXL2 and MXG are out you could probably find these older ones available at very good prices from guys that are upgrading.

[JeromeS13]

I'm also perfectly content with my AiM MXL Pista.

[sponaugle]

I got my wheels and tires today. I was going to get the Mira 398s like Kurt did, but the 18x8.5s are on back order. I called Luke at TireRack and they had the Enkei RFP1s. Since I am planning on doing some reasonable power I wanted to be able to run a larger tire. I also have the STI hubs so my wheels need to be in 5x114.3.

For the front I got the RFP1s in 18x8.5 +30 Offset with 255/35R18 tires.
For the rear I got the RFP1s in 18x10.5 +15 Offset with 295/30R18 tires.

Both front and rear are the same rotational size at 25.1 inches. I got R888s, which are a bit wide for their size. The front 255s are 10.2" wide and the rear 295s are 11.8" wide.

First, a picture:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/NewWheels1.jpg

Now to fitment. The rear wheels have a low offset, and combined with the wide tire make a perfect fit. (at least as far as the frame and suspension is concerned).

Here is the clearance on the rear wheel:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/NewWheels3.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/NewWheels4.jpg

I could fit 305s if I wanted. Enough room on the inside with both the upper links and the lower trailing arm. (with the help of the VCP arms).

My guess is you could get away with +20 offset as well, which is what Kurt is doing. I think +25 offset would be a bit too close. at least with a 10.5" wheel.

On the front, I knew the +30 offset was going to be a problem. I bolted the wheels on without any spacers, and ta full lock the wheel was into the bottom chassis brace. I added a 20mm Perrin spacer and it is just enough. A +10mm offset version of that wheel would be just what you need.

Here is the front tire at full lock:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/NewWheels2.jpg

This should be the worst case as the suspension is fully unloaded and the wheel at the lowest point (which brings it closer to the lower frame member).

On the top side there is a lot of room:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/NewWheels5.jpg

I assume I will have body work to do. I did measure the front and rear track. (outside edge of wheel to wheel). In the rear it is 73" and the front 71". My 02 WRX is 69". Without the 20mm space the fronts were noticeable closer.

So if you are looking to run some wide tires and wheels, you have some more data to start with.

Jeff

[metalmaker12]

Nice, I like em bro

[Frank818]

I read all in the Wheel section, but this setup is killa. loll I assume a lot of body work though, but if you're prepared for it then it's fine.

[Wayne Presley]

Jeff, you do know that you will have to widen the front and rear fenders to fit them in right?

[Kurk818]

Looks awesome and really aggressive. Love it.

I have approx 3/8" away from the trailing arms on the back with my setup in the rear. The fronts will require minor modification to the sheetmetal within the wheel to avoid rubbing. My goal was to fit the size of tires i wanted with minimal/reasonable amount of bodywork.

Modified my 6speed shifter to accept the reverse lock out pull. Just mount and test drive :)

[Aero STI]

That's a great wheel/tire setup. Good work!

[sponaugle]

Nice, I like em bro

Thanks!


Looks awesome and really aggressive. Love it.
I have approx 3/8" away from the trailing arms on the back with my setup in the rear. The fronts will require minor modification to the sheetmetal within the wheel to avoid rubbing. My goal was to fit the size of tires i wanted with minimal/reasonable amount of bodywork.
Modified my 6speed shifter to accept the reverse lock out pull. Just mount and test drive :)

Thanks.. you were the one who gave me the idea! Yea I assumed I will need to work on the sheetmetal for the liners.


That's a great wheel/tire setup. Good work!
Thanks!


I read all in the Wheel section, but this setup is killa. loll I assume a lot of body work though, but if you're prepared for it then it's fine.

Jeff, you do know that you will have to widen the front and rear fenders to fit them in right?

Yea, I figured I would need to do some work. I know next to nothing about fiberglass work, so I am pretty sure I am biting off more then I can chew. However pushing outside the comfort zone is really the key to staying sharp. Trust me I'll be posting up all kind of cool failures related to this project. I wonder how much a replacement fender is from FFR? :)

A few years ago I decided to purchase a big diesel truck, which I also knew nothing about. This is what I ended up with:

http://www.sponaugle.com/post/M35NewTop2.jpg

I really had no idea what I was getting into. Lots of new tools to buy (50mm sockets!), but now I'm reasonably comfortable working on it. It is a 7.8L multifuel, so it can run on diesel, gasoline, kerosene, motor oil, tranny fluid, and just about anything else that burns. I have not done an engine rebuild yet, but I hope to do that sometime in the next few years. The engine alone weighs more then the entire 818!

It is fun to drive to work. Police seem to dig it.

Jeff

[Frank818]

Jeff, plz don't ever put those truck wheels on the 818 even if you become a fiberglass expert and want to do huge body work to make them fit. :) Keep 'em on the green monster! 6x6 or 4x6, btw?

[sponaugle]

Hi Jeff
I have an 04 forester XT donor.
It came with an auto trans, I have to flash to a manual trans.
Thanks
Bob


Bob,

Here are the pin outs I used:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/FlashPins.png

The ECM pinouts look to be correct for your ECU. The 04 Forester ECU is almost the same as the 04 STI ECU.

Note that the Subaru pin number designations for the OBDII connectors are backwards from the standard. There is a picture of the pinouts above on the left side, and that is the Subaru number scheme. You will notice that the OBDII Pin column has the official pin number ordering. Ignore the OBD Conn column, that is the color of the wires in the OBDII plug I chose.

The test mode pin needs to be pulled to ground to flash.

You can download my entire wiring spreadsheet here: http://www.sponaugle.com/818/06STIECMPinoutMap.xlsx


Jeff

[sponaugle]

Jeff, plz don't ever put those truck wheels on the 818 even if you become a fiberglass expert and want to do huge body work to make them fit. :) Keep 'em on the green monster! 6x6 or 4x6, btw?


6x6 of course. It does pretty well in the snow. :)

Jeff

[matteo92065]

Bob,



You can download my entire wiring spreadsheet here: http://www.sponaugle.com/818/06STIECMPinoutMap.xlsx


Jeff

I enjoy reading your build thread. I am also using it for reference. You have one of the nicest pinout maps I've seen. Awhile ago I saved it and put it into my wiring folder, I recently started my harness diet and I was really confused when I tried cross referencing your spreadsheet with my harness. At the top of the page it says its "2006 ECU". Being new to Subaru's (and all harnesses for that matter), I didn't know that my '06 WRX harness is not the same as your '06 STI harness. I see now that the file name calls out the model.
Point being, for anyone else that might use this great ECM spreadsheet, be aware that it is for '06 STI (different than WRX). However the B40 plug is standard across Subaru platforms. Thanks for sharing your work!

[longislandwrx]

instead of flaring the fenders, why not stretch the whole body out 6 inches... mount the sides out 3" each and widen the front and rear lids and bumpers by 6"

supercar stance. why not. yolo?

[sponaugle]

instead of flaring the fenders, why not stretch the whole body out 6 inches... mount the sides out 3" each and widen the front and rear lids and bumpers by 6"
supercar stance. why not. yolo?

That is a potentially fantastic idea! I would need to be careful to keep the shape and angles the same, and since the front hood slopes to the slide a bit I would probably have to do some careful mock ups. Something to consider.

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Bob,

Here are the pin outs I used:

The ECM pinouts look to be correct for your ECU. The 04 Forester ECU is almost the same as the 04 STI ECU.

Note that the Subaru pin number designations for the OBDII connectors are backwards from the standard. There is a picture of the pinouts above on the left side, and that is the Subaru number scheme. You will notice that the OBDII Pin column has the official pin number ordering. Ignore the OBD Conn column, that is the color of the wires in the OBDII plug I chose.

The test mode pin needs to be pulled to ground to flash.

You can download my entire wiring spreadsheet here: http://www.sponaugle.com/818/06STIECMPinoutMap.xlsx


Jeff

Thanks Jeff

[sponaugle]

I did a few quick measurements:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/NewWheelsTest1.jpg

I used a jack to lift the wheel up (with the spring removed from strut) to the maximum high position. Once in this position I turned the wheel to both sides lock to lock.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/NewWheelsTest6.jpg

As I expected, with the wheel up there is more space between the frame and the tire.

I used a jack to put the suspension at what *might* be the height.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/NewWheelsTest3.jpg

Can anyone who has their car on the ground tell me what the distance is marked with the red line? I'm just looking for a general idea of what the 'level' position is.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/NewWheelsTest4.jpg

I played a bit with the upper adjustments and started with about 1.5 degrees of negative camber. I don't have turn plates so I guessed at 20 degrees of wheel turn to get caster.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/NewWheelsTest5.jpg

Caster was about 4 degrees negative. A stock STI is around 3.5 degrees.

Obviously this is just a rough measurement.. I am curious what other people have started with. It *seems* like it would be hard to get much more caster, and perhaps only -2 degrees of camber.

Jeff

[sponaugle]

Thanks Jeff

BTW: I updated the spreadsheet btw and didn't give it a different name, so I would download it again to get the latest corrections. (including just now I changed the ECU desc to say STI).

Jeff

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Jeff
This was in the 818R watkins glen october 2013
Wilwood 13" front and rear brakes
Standard monotube Koni shocks that come with the R
400lb front 500lb rear springs
Front end is -3 camber +3.5 caster and 1/16" toe out
Rear end is -2.5 camber...

[Frank818]

These tires... just amazing...

Where did you get that camber/caster tool?

[sponaugle]

These tires... just amazing...

Where did you get that camber/caster tool?

http://www.amazon.com/Joes-Racing-28210-Magnetic-Adapter/dp/B009EVLVDQ/ref=sr_1_24?ie=UTF8&qid=1405570919&sr=8-24&keywords=camber+gauge

[nuisance]

Jeff

I also did a quick few measurements yesterday on my R. I was able to get 4 degrees castor, but only -1 camber (it will be easy to get more with a little modding).

Could you take a look at bumpsteer while you're at it? I was getting huge (2 degrees) readings from ride height to 2" compression. This was with the Baer bumpsteer kit installed. I'd be curious to see where an S lands.

Thanks, John

I didn't mean to hijack your build thread, and so I took my report to the "R" discussion thread on steering.

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?12311-818R-Suspension-and-the-Steering-Rack

[sponaugle]

Jeff
I also did a quick few measurements yesterday on my R. I was able to get 4 degrees castor, but only -1 camber (it will be easy to get more with a little modding).
Could you take a look at bumpsteer while you're at it? I was getting huge (2 degrees) readings from ride height to 2" compression. This was with the Baer bumpsteer kit installed. I'd be curious to see where an S lands.
Thanks, John
I didn't mean to hijack your build thread, and so I took my report to the "R" discussion thread on steering.
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?12311-818R-Suspension-and-the-Steering-Rack

No worries John.. it is an interesting topic. I did some quick measurements, and from full drop to full lift single wheel toe increased a bit over 1/4" in at the rotor (not tire). As the wheel goes up it toes in. From level to max compressed it was about half that. Given this is one wheel, total toe would be twice that, or a bit over 1/2" at the rotor. That is about 2,2 degrees total toe in from lowest to highest (both wheels), or 1.1 degrees toe in on each wheel.

Here are some pictures of the suspension in three positions:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/BumpSteer1.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/BumpSteer2.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/BumpSteer3.jpg

I drew some very approximate lines to show the UCA, LCA, and Steering link lines. In theory for zero bump steer the lines should intersect at the same point. If the steering line is intersecting below the CA intersections the car should bump steer in (toe in)... and indeed that is what the picture shows.

I also measured the camber as the wheel went from lowest to highest:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/CamberCurve.png

Dotted line is a linear interpolation.

At ride height (or somewhere close to that) I have it set to about -2 degrees camber and about 4 caster.

Jeff

[Mechie3]

I made a spacer for my steering rack to extend one side so that the inner tie rod joints were both centered on the front control arm bolt axis.

[RM1SepEx]

Craig, They fixed that rack offset issue but I'm not sure at what chassis #. Early chassis they cheated to one side should have additional bumpsteer...

[Frank818]

How can I tell if it's fixed?
I can tell I can easily adjust the toe with perfectly equal length steering boots.

BTW Jeff, how did you manage to compress the suspension without lifting the frame? Very early after I compress the suspension, it stops and the chassis lifts, cuz it's too light.

[nuisance]

No worries John.. it is an interesting topic. I did some quick measurements, and from full drop to full lift single wheel toe increased a bit over 1/4" in at the rotor (not tire). As the wheel goes up it toes in. From level to max compressed it was about half that. Given this is one wheel, total toe would be twice that, or a bit over 1/2" at the rotor. That is about 2,2 degrees total toe in from lowest to highest (both wheels), or 1.1 degrees toe in on each wheel.

Here are some pictures of the suspension in three positions:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/BumpSteer1.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/BumpSteer2.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/BumpSteer3.jpg

I drew some very approximate lines to show the UCA, LCA, and Steering link lines. In theory for zero bump steer the lines should intersect at the same point. If the steering line is intersecting below the CA intersections the car should bump steer in (toe in)... and indeed that is what the picture shows.

I also measured the camber as the wheel went from lowest to highest:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/CamberCurve.png

Dotted line is a linear interpolation.

At ride height (or somewhere close to that) I have it set to about -2 degrees camber and about 4 caster.

Jeff

Jeff, thanks. I was curious about the "S" versus the "R". It seems the "S" is going to need some bumpsteer work as well.

Remember, when you draw those lines, they need to go through the pivot points, and not just follow the arm. The arm could be omega shaped and it wouldn't matter, it is all about the pivots. The LCA ends up way off if you use the arm itself.

Thanks for the camber curve too. I was seeing something like that, but I need to turn down the turnbuckles in the upper arms so I can start with -3 or so, then run the curve. It is a long virtual swing arm though, so it should be OK.

[Mechie3]

Craig, They fixed that rack offset issue but I'm not sure at what chassis #. Early chassis they cheated to one side should have additional bumpsteer...

Yes, they fixed the uneven bump steer, but the distance between the inner tie rod pivots is still less then that distance between the front suspension arm pivots.

[Wayne Presley]

BTW Jeff, how did you manage to compress the suspension without lifting the frame? Very early after I compress the suspension, it stops and the chassis lifts, cuz it's too light.

Frank, notice that there are no springs on the shocks...

[STiPWRD]

Jeff, any chance you know the pins required to reflash an 02 wrx ECU?

[Frank818]

Frank, notice that there are no springs on the shocks...

Awesome catch, that's why. Tnx Wayne.

[tango68ss]

The second owner had switched the car over to a ViPEC stand alone ECU, replaced the doors, hood, and trunk with carbon fiber parts, and left the engine and transmission just as Jeff Perrin had built it The car only has 20,000 miles on it, with about 5k on the EZ30R. It makes about 600whp and 560 lb-ft of torque with the 4088 at a medium boost level as Jeff Perrin tuned it.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-EngineBuild4Dyno.jpg

Here is the engine removed from the car on an engine stand. It currently has a twin scroll manifold with a GT35R, although I plan on going back to the GT4088 that Jeff had originally used.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-Engine1.jpg
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Donor-Engine2.jpg

818 Goal:

I’m building an 818S, so this will be registered street car. My 02 WRX is my dedicated track car, I have an 08 STI with ~500whp that is my daily driver (especially in the rain), a twin-turbo 2006 GTO that is my' I have no traction' car, and a new 2014 GT-R that is my 10 sec street car. So…. For the 818 I am going to try and build the fastest 0-60 and ¼ mile acceleration 818S. Given the power output of the EZ30R (~600whp), and the weight of the 818 (1950 lbs with the heavier H6), I think a high 9 second time is reasonable with the right tires, and perhaps mid 10s on a street friendly tire. So.. that is my goal.

I’m doing the build in my shop at my house, which is helpful as I can do small amounts of work at a time and leave everything setup… and I have an 18 month old baby so time is already constrained! I have a lift in the shop, although that won’t really be needed for this build.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818-Shop.jpg

I’ll be tearing down the rest of the 06 STI in prep for the arrival of the kit. I would like to have ABS working, so I plan on moving those pieces over. I am using the STI drivetrain including the hubs and brakes as well as the 6-speed transmission. I have a spare 6-speed that I am going to have custom gears made for once I get everything moving along. To get a decent ¼ mile time I need taller gears. Oh.. and a RaceLogic Traction Control setup (as per http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?10160-Racelogic-Traction-Control-for-the-818)

Jeff,

I cannot wait to see this EZ30 in your 818! Impressive! For you guys wondering what this sick engine came out of... well here you go!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YCu2MLqPcQ0

[Brando]

You know Mick the ginge? Man with guys like that in your inner circle I expect an insane 818 coming from you

[sponaugle]

Jeff, thanks. I was curious about the "S" versus the "R". It seems the "S" is going to need some bumpsteer work as well.

Remember, when you draw those lines, they need to go through the pivot points, and not just follow the arm. The arm could be omega shaped and it wouldn't matter, it is all about the pivots. The LCA ends up way off if you use the arm itself.

Thanks for the camber curve too. I was seeing something like that, but I need to turn down the turnbuckles in the upper arms so I can start with -3 or so, then run the curve. It is a long virtual swing arm though, so it should be OK.

Thanks. I did a quick new set of lines on one of the pictures:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/AdjustedBumpSteer.jpg

They are much closer together now.


Jeff,

I cannot wait to see this EZ30 in your 818! Impressive! For you guys wondering what this sick engine came out of... well here you go!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YCu2MLqPcQ0

Thanks! It has been a fun build so far.

That video is hilarious! I am going to have to give Jeff a hard time on Monday. I have those wheels in the attic of my shop.. they are just too ugly to keep looking at! :)



You know Mick the ginge? Man with guys like that in your inner circle I expect an insane 818 coming from you

Yes... Mick was part of the PDXTuning gang so I've know him for a long time. He has a very cool yellow WRX wagon track machine with a dry sump setup.

[sponaugle]

Update: Pedal Cluster

I installed the Replica Parts master brake cylinder re-locator:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/BrakeBracket.jpg

I had to trim the top bolt a bit, and notch the pedal cluster to make room for the nut.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/BrakeInstall1.jpg

I also did a bit of triming on the pedal cluster so it would not interfere with the chassis. ( above the clutch switch)

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/BrakeInstall2.jpg

The Accelerator pedal from the 06 STI doesn't look like the DBW one in the manual. The bolt holes are almost vertical, not diagonal.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/06STIAccelPedal.jpg

I made my own mounting bracket using a piece of 90 degree angle aluminum. Here it is taped into place for test fitting.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/AccelBracket.jpg

The position turned out great. it is very similar in spacing to the stock WRX and STI. You can't tell from this picture, but the accelerator is slightly behind the clutch and brake pedal.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/818Pedal.jpg

[sponaugle]

I also got the radiator installed.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/RadInstalled.jpg

I need some upper brackets. I have the rori lower mounts which work great. Craig I think you make those cool replacement brackets right? Is there some measurement you need first?

Jeff

[Frank818]

Jeff, the gas pedal you show from the manual is the CABLE pedal from earlier models (02-04 I think, or 02-05). There are other pages for the DBW.

If I recall the upper rad mounts from Craig are all the same and do work with Rori's lower brackets, if I remember the upper rad mounts are adjustable or something. Someone will explain better. :)

[sponaugle]

Jeff, the gas pedal you show from the manual is the CABLE pedal from earlier models (02-04 I think, or 02-05). There are other pages for the DBW.

If I recall the upper rad mounts from Craig are all the same and do work with Rori's lower brackets, if I remember the upper rad mounts are adjustable or something. Someone will explain better. :)

That page just happened to be open as I was checking to see if the cable pedal was different. The 05-06 DBW pedal looks like this:

http://thumbs1.ebaystatic.com/d/l225/m/meQBZyyjqWUTxGc5zzfhGug.jpg

You can see the bolt holes are diagonal, not straight like the STI pedal. I assume that Kurt has also had the same issue since he is also using an STI donor. Either way it is an easy fix.

Unrelated to this, I made a small change to my bugeye EZ30R and took it for a drive. Something is just not right... :)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X5Q5VLB_l_A

Jeff

[Wayne Presley]

That page just happened to be open as I was checking to see if the cable pedal was different. The 05-06 DBW pedal looks like this:

http://thumbs1.ebaystatic.com/d/l225/m/meQBZyyjqWUTxGc5zzfhGug.jpg

You can see the bolt holes are diagonal, not straight like the STI pedal. I assume that Kurt has also had the same issue since he is also using an STI donor. Either way it is an easy fix.

Unrelated to this, I made a small change to my bugeye EZ30R and took it for a drive. Something is just not right... :)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X5Q5VLB_l_A

Jeff


That didn't sound like 9000 rpm to me...

[sponaugle]

That didn't sound like 9000 rpm to me...

Bingo. I flashed a new image onto the PIC I built for converting the RPM pulses from 3 per revolution to 2 per revolution, but accidentally disabled it... So that was more like 6700 rpm. :) I have a new converter I built to put in that also does speedo correction so it will be spot on to 150mph, plus do the usual 3-2 rpm conversion as well as drive some shift lights.

The sad part is that even with all the gizmo and with the EZ30R, my GTR just walks it:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rSnrqqHt2T4


Jeff

[sponaugle]

I did a test fit of the radiator tubes (from Breeze):

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/RadTubing1.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/RadTubing2.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/RadTubing3.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/RadTubing4.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/RadTubing5.jpg

See anything obviously wrong/stupid?

Oh, and I spent a little time getting a new shelf system for my little 'electronics lab'.. nothing fancy.. it was a mess before:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/NewLab.jpg

It feels good to get stuff organized.

Jeff

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Hey Jeff, all looks great. Especially the lab.
I need to take time to clean up my messes.
One thing I see on your car that is unusual is the coolant exit pipe tube. I don't think anyone else has taken it through the frame above the gas tank.
I don't see a problem except the pipe might short out the terminals on the fuel level sender.
The tube on the passenger side of the car might be to high and interfere with the door area.
Bob

[K3LAG]

Your passenger side tube needs to be lower and go around the frame like the drivers side. The side pod won't fit on the car with it that high. I believe the manual says it can be no more than about 5" from the bottom of the frame.

Larry

[sponaugle]

Hey Jeff, all looks great. Especially the lab.
I need to take time to clean up my messes.
One thing I see on your car that is unusual is the coolant exit pipe tube. I don't think anyone else has taken it through the frame above the gas tank.
I don't see a problem except the pipe might short out the terminals on the fuel level sender.
The tube on the passenger side of the car might be to high and interfere with the door area.
Bob


Your passenger side tube needs to be lower and go around the frame like the drivers side. The side pod won't fit on the car with it that high. I believe the manual says it can be no more than about 5" from the bottom of the frame.
Larry

Thanks guys! I'll move it and see how it fits.

[Bob_n_Cincy]

This is Michael Everson tube on that side.32110

[nuisance]

Just put mine on the other day...mine looks like Bob's in the back passenger side. I got the wrong pipe for driver's front, so I'm waiting for the right one. Your driver's side rear isn't hitting the engine at the right angle. Maybe you got a wrong pipe too?

[K3LAG]

Just put mine on the other day...mine looks like Bob's in the back passenger side. I got the wrong pipe for driver's front, so I'm waiting for the right one. Your driver's side rear isn't hitting the engine at the right angle. Maybe you got a wrong pipe too?

They changed the design of that pipe to accommodate the fuel filler outlet on the Factory Five tank. The previous pipe, without the extra bend, only works with the Boyd tank.

Larry

[Frank818]

Jeff which side you installed your rad? Something's wrong on mine, ok I have the earlier version with the inlet on the top side, not top middle, but is yours lower and top mounts on the rad looking like mine?
Not even sure what is the top and bottom.

3211932120

[sponaugle]

I got my eastwood flare tool today.

Critique my work:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Flare1.jpg
This is the flare I made using the 3/16 OP.1 and OP.2 Die (45 degrees double flare)

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Flare2.jpg
These are the lines that were sent by factory five, Labeled 3/16s Inv Flare

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Flare3.jpg
Comparison of the two.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/Flare4.jpg
Side shot of the two..
The look different. The factory lines look like the inner part is machined. Am I doing something wrong?

Jeff

[sponaugle]

Jeff which side you installed your rad? Something's wrong on mine, ok I have the earlier version with the inlet on the top side, not top middle, but is yours lower and top mounts on the rad looking like mine?
Not even sure what is the top and bottom.

Hmm. that is an odd radiator. Mine had posts sticking out of the top and bottom. I'll take a picture.

Jeff

[Frank818]

Hmm. that is an odd radiator. Mine had posts sticking out of the top and bottom. I'll take a picture.

Oh freakin crap. :( There goes some more custom brackets for me. :)

Hey your flares look like a trumpet, taken with such high close-up. Very nice. What sound they make when you blow through them? lolll

[Sgt.Gator]

Jeff which side you installed your rad? Something's wrong on mine, ok I have the earlier version with the inlet on the top side, not top middle, but is yours lower and top mounts on the rad looking like mine?
Not even sure what is the top and bottom.

3211932120

The bottom of the radiator has the drain ****, the black plastic plug on the right.

[sponaugle]

Oh freakin crap. :( There goes some more custom brackets for me. :)

Hey your flares look like a trumpet, taken with such high close-up. Very nice. What sound they make when you blow through them? lolll

I did some more practice fittings, and have them looking better. I'm using a champfer bit to prep the inside and outside a tiny amount. That makes the fold over smooth and crack free.

I have to admit I was skeptical about the Eastwood Flare Tool, but yes, it is worth the money. It is so easy to use, and very very consistent. I am using Nickel-Copper lines which seem a bit easier to flare, and they are much easier to bend. If you are doing your own lines, give them a try.

Jeff

[Wayne Presley]

Jeff,
Try more pressure on the second flare. I've done some flares with my flaring tool on the NiCo tubing and they look OEM.

[Aero STI]

Jeff, you fell off the map for a bit.

If you're looking for a good DIY method of gauging, I would recommend the various displays from 4D systems. Here is what I'm playing with at the moment.

http://i.imgur.com/3r0MfbLl.jpg

They're incredibly configurable and have I2C, SPI, plus additional GPIO. I believe they've been mentioned elsewhere on this forum, but it may have been a different forum.

http://www.4dsystems.com.au/products

[Aero STI]

And here are the 4D systems uLCD-220RD in action.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mse4oLJeyug

[sponaugle]

Jeff,
Try more pressure on the second flare. I've done some flares with my flaring tool on the NiCo tubing and they look OEM.

Thanks Wayne. That did the trick! Here is how I did my brake lines:

This is how the line looked right after cutting.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/NewFlare1.jpg

I then used a chamfer bit:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/NewFlare4.jpg

To clean up the end.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/NewFlare2.jpg

I then cleaned up the outside and used the Eastman tool to do the flare.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/NewFlare3.jpg

The flares worked great, and I didn't have a single leak!

Jeff

[sponaugle]

If anyone else is considering doing their own brake lines, I give it a thumbs up. I ended up using Copper Nickel brake lines with 10mm fittings as well as a few of the SAE fittings. Since I made my own custom lines I could have the 10mm fittings on the ends that went into Subaru parts, and on the lines that went into the brake bias I could use the SAE fittings.

I had not done brake lines before, so it took a couple of test runs to get the placement correct, but the Copper Nickel is very easy to bend and mold to a path. I did about 12 flares and not a single leak thanks to the Eastwood Flare tool.

Here are the front lines. I have not attached the lines to the firewall yet.
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/BrakeLines1.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/BrakeLines2.jpg

Here the lines are running along the side of the chassis. The black stuff is rubber tubing I used to protect the lines from rubbing.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/BrakeLines3.jpg

In the rear I used this 10mm Metric 3 way splitter.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/BrakeLines4.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/BrakeLines5.jpg

Once it was all buttoned up I did a complete bleed and everything worked great. The pedal is surprisingly stiff.

If you are considering doing the brake lines yourself, I say go for it!

Jeff

[sponaugle]

More Updates:

I started working on building the 2.5L engine I am going to use for break in.

Here are the parts ready for assembly. New case, Crower Rods, Weisco pistons, coated ACL bearings.
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/EngineBuild4.jpg

I started by measuring the crank main and rod bearing surfaces.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/EngineBuild5.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/EngineBuild8.jpg

I then put a set of HX (+.001) bearings in the rods, torqued them, and measured the I.D.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/EngineBuild7.jpg

I also measured the rod bolt stretch to compare to the recommended torque. The spec sheet calls for .005" to .007" or 45 lb-ft. At 45 lb-ft it read a bit over .0075", so I lowered to 42 lb-ft and that put the stretch right at .0065". Perfect!

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/EngineBuild6.jpg

I then put the first set of H bearings in the case, reassembled and torqued the case, and measured.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/EngineBuild9.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/EngineBuild10.jpg

[sponaugle]

I ended up doing a complete pass with the H bearings, then the HX bearings, and finially with a mix of ½ H and ½ HX. Here are the resulting tolerances:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/EngineBuildSpecs.jpg

I ended up rod bearing clearances between .00165” and .00180” which is what I have used in the past.
With the H bearings the mains were too tight, and with the HXs it was too loose. I did the tops in H and the bottoms in HX and that gave me a good .00100” to .00140”.

I attached all of the rods to the crank, checked the bolt stretch, and prepped the crank to drop into the case.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/EngineBuild11.jpg

The crank dropped in.
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/EngineBuild12.jpg

The case all buttoned up with the crank installed... Time for pistons.
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/EngineBuild13.jpg

Next up I did the measurement of the rings in each cylinder.
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/EngineBuild14.jpg

I ended up using .020” for the top ring and .023” for the 2nd ring.
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/EngineBuild15.jpg

I also measured each of the pistons and the cylinder bores. Pistons were very close with 3 of them within .5 10,000ths, and one a bit smaller.
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/EngineBuild23.jpg

[sponaugle]

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/EngineBuild24.jpg

I installed the pistons using a ring compressor.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/EngineBuild17.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/EngineBuild18.jpg

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/EngineBuild19.jpg

Piston installed with the wrist pin and lock in place.
http://www.sponaugle.com/818/EngineBuild21.jpg

After getting all 4 pistons installed, the shortblock was complete:

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/EngineBuild22.jpg

[sponaugle]

Jeff, you fell off the map for a bit.

If you're looking for a good DIY method of gauging, I would recommend the various displays from 4D systems. Here is what I'm playing with at the moment.

http://i.imgur.com/3r0MfbLl.jpg

They're incredibly configurable and have I2C, SPI, plus additional GPIO. I believe they've been mentioned elsewhere on this forum, but it may have been a different forum.

http://www.4dsystems.com.au/products

Thanks Andrew. Yes, I have been pretty busy the last month with some vacation, work travel, and of course a never ending list of other car projects!

Those are great looking displays! A few other people have mentioned 4d systems, and looking at what you have done the look very promising. I'll take a look.

Jeff

[Frank818]

Your brakes lines are absolutely stunning. Really. Awesome flares too.
And what on earth are you using to take such perfect close up pix? Don't you have anything wrong anywhere? Looks like not. :)

[sponaugle]

Your brakes lines are absolutely stunning. Really. Awesome flares too.
And what on earth are you using to take such perfect close up pix? Don't you have anything wrong anywhere? Looks like not. :)

Thanks Frank! It is all in the flare tool. As for the pictures, it is a mix of things. Some of the close ups are just using the macro mode on my Panasonic DMC-ZS20, and a few of them are from my Canon 1Ds Mark III. [an old camera, but still a great full frame body] The ones with the very short focal lengths are taken with this lens (http://www.amazon.com/Canon-85mm-f1-2L-Lens-Cameras/dp/B000EW9Y4M) which I call the holy hand grenade because it is short and heavy... but being F1.2 it can take pictures in very low light. Some of the engine pictures are taken with a camera I have in the shop (the very first Rebel XTi)... and some of the crappy ones are taken with my RAZR Droid HD phone.

[Frank818]

Yeah I figured the great looking pix weren't taken with a phone! :) But soon they will be capable of that. :)

[sponaugle]

I got my transmission from Andrewtech. It is a 5 speed with straight cut PPG gears and synchros plus a Cusco 1.5 Differential.

I mounted up the shifter mechanism to see how it works, and.. it works!

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/NewTransmission.jpg

Now that I have the shortblock finished, time to start on the long block... here is a table with some of the parts ready to install.

http://www.sponaugle.com/818/EngineBuildingPart2.jpg