Best shocks for 818R

[Bill Waters]

I am finalizing my 818R order right now, and will send a check to FFR in the next day or two for a December 14 delivery date. Before I do, I want to sort out my shock choices. My 818 is an R, and will therefore only be used for track events, TT, and wheel to wheel racing.

FFR ships the kit with single-adjustable, monotube Konis; one can order the dual-adjustable Konis (same ones as for the Roadster) for $2000, less the allowance for the standard ones. Obviously, the car hasn't been out long enough for us to have gathered experience with the different setups, but I wonder if anyone has experience with these shock packages enough to suggest the best route - e.g., is Wayne or others aware of better option(s) than FFR's offerings?


Thanks in advance for any help.

Bill

[68GT500MAN]

Give FFR a call and ask for Jim, he is the engineer who was involved in the shock testing and could probably give you the best answer.
Doug

[Santiago]

+1 on a direct call to Jim, and be prepared to ask lots of questions.

The problem with "best" is that there is no one real answer. In the abstract, there are a lot of great shocks out there that are easy to say are "better" than some other shock (Motons are wee-bit better than Monroe Sensa Tracs). But this neatly ignores a host of intended uses - I wouldn't put Motons on my grandma's grocery getter and hardly say these are "the best" shock for her car. So you really need to be clear with Jim about your intended use, tuning needs, reliability concerns, even rebuild budget.

The current Factory R seems to be doing pretty well without the upgraded Konis. That's not a slam-dunk consideration though, and your use/interests may differ enough from what that car has seen to make them sensible. For example, if you're doing enduros in the south you may have greater heat dissipation concerns, and a true threaded-body coil over is going to dissipate heat better than a steel-bodied sleeved shock. For time trial, who cares? For 4-hour enduros, ymmv... You get the idea.

One thing to note, if you're going outside of FFR's offerings, you should be prepared to do some R&D work. Racing shocks need to be dialed into the car's overall suspension set-up. We know that shocks need to be matched to a spring rate range to really perform up to their potential (so you can't just pull a generic shock off the shelf and hope that it'll work well with the spring rate you end up using). They also need to be matched to the unsprung weight. A quality shock supplier is going to ask for a lot of baseline info to get you a shock that will perform well in the car. Take a look at the Shock Shop's questionnaire sheet (they call it their "Critical Damping Analysis data sheet"). Not every shop will ask for this level of information, but it shows what sort of thought goes into tailoring a shock to the proper application.

I'm certainly not saying you shouldn't go this route; I actually think it may be worth it for some - but the question of worth is intimately tied to the question of which is best.

Personally, I've had "good" Koni Yellows on my time trial Mustang...then I went to Penske 7500s and Sachs double-adjustable external reservoir shocks (all made specifically for that chassis application). The Yellows worked. They really did, and the car was fast. But they're not in the same league as the Penske and Sachs. The car is now fast and silky smooth with feedback that's just amazingly telepathic (at least by comparison to the Yellows). It's easier to drive and far more enjoyable at the limit. So the worth of better shocks for me is tied to these experiences.

Stuff to consider.

Best,
-j

[Santiago]

Sorry, just re-read my response and felt it wasn't very helpful for your direct question.
Definitely more in line with "just stuff to consider."

Best,
-j

[Bill Waters]

Thanks for the comments. Spoke with Wayne & he said that he was involved with the development work early-on & that the Konis that come on the 818R are the setup that was arrived-at during testing.

So may ask FFR to ship with the Konis and in meanwhile get Wayne price dual adjustables.

Thanks,

Bill

[Samiam1017]

I'm guessing. But I would think the upgraded shocks are rebuilable and revalvable. And the "standard" are not

[RM1SepEx]

23794

the upgraded ones are double adjustable w/o removing them from the car. The std ones are single adj off the car and not rebuildable...

If I were building an R I'd splurge for the real KONI racing shocks, upgrade is around $2000

[C.Plavan]

23794

the upgraded ones are double adjustable w/o removing them from the car. The std ones are single adj off the car and not rebuildable...

If I were building an R I'd splurge for the real KONI racing shocks, upgrade is around $2000

I almost pulled the trigger and went that route. The only reason I didn't is because the FFR 818R is using the standard R shocks. I figured that is a good baseline. When you get the double adjustable shocks, you will be on your own until you can test them.....a lot. I figured I will upgrade them later after I get a feel for the car first.

Another note- You will be able to use other double adjustable shocks on the 818R- It does not have to be "just" Koni.

[D K]

Can anyone answer me this:
What are the shock lengths (extended/compressed)
And what is the motion ratio f/r?

There might be something already that exists, but for a different application?

David

[Scargo]

I'm certainly wanting to know the kind of things that DK is asking. Weight distribution on the FFR race car, travel, droop bump-stop, etc. Then, recommended spring rates for a pure race car? Recommended sway bar size to pair with shocks? Can we get any direction based on their recent track experience?
I think I want to do something like the double adjustable, gas reservoir shocks that I put on my STI, though I'm almost certain ride height would be different and travel might be more. I think I'd want to run them inverted. Right now I have Motion Control Suspension's 2-way shocks on my STI. I looked at all the big names and liked the fact that they are made in Georgia and MCS has in their resume time with JRZ and establishing/selling Moton before starting MCS.

[D K]

MCS is def a high end company.

What is 'recommended' though?
This car is totally un proven, I dont think there are any 'recommendations' yet.
It just comes down to testing and developing the car.

Besides, recommendations are just opinions.

[Scargo]

I think of all the sports racers that have gone before and then there are the Elise's. I'm sure there are more examples. Surely there are some standard profiles. I'm just lazy right now. Haven't gotten serious yet with my research.
I'm hoping that by the time my kit is ready that more will be revealed.

[D K]

Has anyone had a chance to measure the length of the shocks and/or calculate the motion ratio?

[Scargo]

Wahhh, I need some answers. Like DK, I need to know the motion ratio for the front. I'm assuming the rears are what's normal for GDs?
Weights anyone? Has anyone an actual weight distribution?

[RM1SepEx]

contact Jim