Header Recommendatons

[ktm]

We are finishing up our motor this weekend- rebuilt heads, timing belt, water pump and the like. Looking at the exhaust system and, well, thinking we may need to replace this too. Pretty ugly.

Any recommendations or experiences on headers, including the up pipe?

Any worries with clearing the oil pan and chassis? thinking there isn't much of an issue, but planning on it being tight in the frame.

So far, liking Invidia and Perrin -- others?

[Rasmus]

https://mooreperformanceparts.com/images/2a5063de16b11446c1fe3edd4287de85_ze3j.jpg
https://mooreperformanceparts.com/images/6ca068c3cee4311511e8005a5be06e98.jpg
Moore Performance makes a good twin-scroll header and uppipe. You'll need a twin scroll turbo to see any performance.

http://www.killerbmotorsport.com/index_files/image1427.jpg
Killer B makes a quality equal length header.

Both the Moore and Killer B are equal length headers which will make your 818 sound like a turbo Honda rather than Subaru powered.

[longislandwrx]

Killer B makes a quality equal length header.

Both the Moore and Killer B are equal length headers which will make your 818 sound like a turbo Honda rather than Subaru powered.


The prodigal son returns!

The Killer B has probably the best quality steel you can get in a Subaru header, and a matching price tag.

That being said I picked up a used Perrin header. An "almost equal length header" Good fitment and it was only $300

The invidia and perrin are probably the best two mid priced headers. If you want to save a few a few bucks you could get a

Prosport, the quality is very decent at a good price. I wouldn't go with anything cheaper unless you plan on replacing it every few years.

[wallace18]

My invidia hangs 2" below the frame. Food for thought.

[RM1SepEx]

My invidia hangs 2" below the frame. Food for thought.

as does my FMS header... time will tell how that works out!

[fateo66]

For an unequal length header I haven't seen any nicer quality ones then the Greddy. I have two of them and one I've ran everyday for 6 years with no issues.

[C.Plavan]

I have a Killer B coming (on backorder) I should get it in a week or so. I'm concerned about spending all that cash, and it also sitting "below" the car- So I may cancel and get a less expensive one. I would hate to be scraping it on curbs at the track.

Do we know of any good headers that do not hang down so low?

[ktm]

That's a concern as this car is low enough already. Seems like I read in one of the build posts that the headers were a particularly tight fit, but can't place my finger on what brand or whose build.

Thinking mid priced, and not worried about lasting a long time. gotta figure a long time is over 50K miles. Doubt this car will ever see that many miles. Maybe 5k a year.

[D Clary]

I am using the stock exhaust manifold with grimspeed up pipe and crossover, cost a little but excellent quality and don't hang down. I don't know how much power you loose through the manifolds but with a sort of stock motor I don't think it will matter.

[RM1SepEx]

I agree, no big deal, power wise, with a stock motor... BUT it was just so FUGLY that I had to replace it! Sold it in pieces for almost as much as I paid for my header/up pipe from AJW

[StatGSR]

use the OEM manifold, pull off the heat sheilds, get a new crossover pipe and up pipe, then ceramic coat it and call it good.

[SixStar]

My $0.02 - headers don't make power, they move power. And usually they decrease the area under the curve on the left and shift it higher in the power band. So if you plan on wrapping it out all the time or are chasing those "hellacooldopemadHP#syo!" then a header is the thing to do.

They DO save a bit of weight which is never a bad thing.

First thing my tuner said when I put headers on my WRX was, "Take that **** off right now." I went with the GrimmSpeed ported and coated exhaust manifolds, crossover, up and downpipe and never looked back. We've installed that same setup on several cars and the throttle response is MUCH better plus you gain 500-800 rpm of spool before full boost which means more power sooner and gobs of torque. My 04 makes 220/260 on a bone stock longblock with only PnP intake/exhaust and a stock TD04. And that's wheel HP at 6,000 feet.

[AZPete]

My Perrin equal-length header does not hang lower than the frame (06 WRX).

[longislandwrx]

I did it for the weight as well as the (small) gains in power. I think I calculated the Perrin saves about 17lbs in the rear of the car where it needs it most. I'm doing my best to get the motor weight down, and a header is low hanging fruit.

[D Clary]

I left the heat shields on the manifolds. I was worried that the manifold heat would cook the valve cover gaskets. The Grim speed stuff is thermal coated.

[C.Plavan]

My Perrin equal-length header does not hang lower than the frame (06 WRX).

Are you saying it does not hang lower than the frame on the 06 WRX or on the 818? Have any pictures?

[Rasmus]

Does...

your....

header hang low?

Does it bend, crack, or mo'?
Can it top horsepower up?
Can it make torque down low?
Can it spool the turbo fast?
Does it work with corn-based gas?

Does your header. Hang. Low?!

[hyperian24]

Everyone in my office thinks I'm crazy now..due to the loud and sudden burst of laugh/snort/cough.

Thank you Sir, for improving my Wednesday.

[AZPete]

Rasmus - good one!

Chad, the Perrin EL header is on my 06 WRX 2.5 turbo in my 818S. The bottom is about 1/2" above the 818 frame using OE motor mounts. I can't take a photo because now the header is off while I'm making a firewall panel between the engine and gas tank. I'll post a shot when I get the header back on.
Pete

[D K]

Has anyone tried a front mount header?

[longislandwrx]

Has anyone tried a front mount header?

no room, unless you move the fuel tank. There's only about an inch up there in front of the pulley.

[C.Plavan]

Ok, so I got my Killer B Holy header today. I was going to take some pictures for this thread to show you how it sits on the motor..... the only problem is it hits the oil filter, and it seems the holes are almost 1/4 off on each side. After spending $1400 on a flipping header, you would expect it to slide on like butter.....Not the case. Very disappointed fitment wise. I was able to get it on the drivers side, and it looks like it tucks in nicely, and is not hanging down far at all.

When I have more time tomorrow to mess with it, I'll take some pictures. Again, $1400 and if you have to use a huge pry bar to get it on, and it hits the oil filter (maybe root cause) I'll be sending this POS back for a full refund.

Now you know how I really feel about it, and can hear my frustration after spending time under the 818 trying to quickly install it on a new motor.

EDIT:
I was still pissed off, so I went back out there and removed the oil filter and tried again. No dice. It is going to take major prying. I took pictures- Then with the oil filter side on, I tried to fit the oil filter back on. total interference. I know the other side was not on yet, but even If I get it on- I don't know if it will work.

http://i.imgur.com/ubNZ3Avl.jpg (http://imgur.com/ubNZ3Av)

[metros]

^^^That's disappointing to hear about the supposed best header out there.

[C.Plavan]

Update:

Used this to get it on..... (How much are they selling this header for again?)
http://i.imgur.com/op1VnMRl.jpg (http://imgur.com/op1VnMR)

Then realized I was right all along about the oil filter.......NO WAY TO GET IT BACK ON. Killer B Holy Header is a POS- "Fits every 2.5L" my @$$.
http://i.imgur.com/IPPuSTil.jpg (http://imgur.com/IPPuSTi)

http://i.imgur.com/0axBRTHl.jpg (http://imgur.com/0axBRTH)

http://i.imgur.com/w5G4qSOl.jpg (http://imgur.com/w5G4qSO)

Everyone save your money. I'm going to get some answers.

http://i.imgur.com/Rdrsb3Vl.jpg (http://imgur.com/Rdrsb3V)

http://i.imgur.com/6rmp62vl.jpg (http://imgur.com/6rmp62v)

http://i.imgur.com/OCMGDKKl.jpg (http://imgur.com/OCMGDKK)

[Rasmus]

Chad. That sucks man.

I do notice that you've a water-oil heat exchanger installed between the block and the oil-filter. My 2004 WRX doesn't have one of those. The oil filter just mates right to the block. Perhaps if you deleted the heat exchanger the header would fit?

Also without the heat exchanger you simplify your setup. YMMV. Let us know what you do.

[C.Plavan]

Chad. That sucks man.

I do notice that you've a water-oil heat exchanger installed between the block and the oil-filter. My 2004 WRX doesn't have one of those. The oil filter just mates right to the block. Perhaps if you deleted the heat exchanger the header would fit?

Also without the heat exchanger your simplifying your setup. YMMV. Let us know what you do.

That is something worth noting. Thanks. I do not know these EJ motors at all. So if I can remove that HE we may be in business. But again, they state it fits ANY EJ.

[Rasmus]

You're welcome. I believe the water-oil heat exchanger is there to help bring the oil up to temp faster by using the coolant's heat. You can run an EJ just fine without one.

[longislandwrx]

Chad, I know on the Perrin and several other headers you have to remove that:

23535

[C.Plavan]

Well crap- I wish I knew that, and THEY told me. It does not state that on their website. Thanks guys. I guess I have more work to do. Let me pry this thing back off....

[longislandwrx]

Yeah I would call them and confirm. If you're not pissed now, you will be when you see the prices.

You'll need part numbers

21311AA051 ~$225
21317AA022 ~$40

and a new o-ring just in case:

21370KA001 ~$5


I've got a 20% off coupon for all this, if you are interested send me a PM

[SixStar]

Chad. That sucks man.

I do notice that you've a water-oil heat exchanger installed between the block and the oil-filter. My 2004 WRX doesn't have one of those. The oil filter just mates right to the block. Perhaps if you deleted the heat exchanger the header would fit?

Also without the heat exchanger you simplify your setup. YMMV. Let us know what you do.

Someone has been in there mucking about. Every turbo EJ has an oil cooler. FWIW it's also a particulate catcher also, when those motors go (which they do) it has to be replaced. Learned the hard way after not replacing one on a spun bearing and having to replace the engine again after 1,500 miles.

[Rasmus]

Someone has been in there mucking about.
I'm the only one that changes the oil on my wagon. It's not there. Never has been. I didn't delete it.

[C.Plavan]

Chris from Killer B just called me. He states there is a problem. I sent him some pictures and he said he would get back to me. The stud issue he thinks is a shipping "Incident". The oil filter should fit fine he says, even with the oil cooler. He will determine once he sees the pictures I emailed him.

Stay tuned.

[Xusia]

I'm the only one that changes the oil on my wagon. It's not there. Never has been. I didn't delete it.

Are you the first (and only) owner?

[Mitch Wright]

I am using a Moore Performance twin scroll header on my R, Ryan, Dale and Joe have been great to work with and there stuff is really first class.

[C.Plavan]

The overpriced Killer B Holy header is being returned. Plain and simple- will not fit, does not "bolt on". Save your money.

[longislandwrx]

So was there a problem with the cooler? did they figure that out at least?

[C.Plavan]

"I have never seen a cooler like that". FYI- its OEM stock 2013.

[C.Plavan]

FYI- This was a little concerning email From Rally Sports Direct. It even states it will fit all 2002-2014 WRX's..... The whole point is that it would not fit or install...... Thankfully Killer B will take it back....

"Hi Chad,
Once the header has been installed we are not able to take it back as a return, but we have asked Killer B to take that back. We are just waiting for their response right now and we will let you know as soon as we get an answer. Please let us know if you have any questions or concerns in the meantime."

[StatGSR]

^ i just think they are hung up on the term installed, typically an item that was installed is also then used (and would not be returnable). obviously an item like yours, you cannot find out out that it doesn't fit without attempting to install it.

[Xusia]

^You are, of course, absolutely right. I don't know if I want to do business with a company that is:
1. Inflexible
2. Doesn't understand what you just said

[AZPete]

I hope you paid with a credit card.

[metros]

It was never technically installed as that would mean all the bolts were attached.

[AJW Performance]

Hello folks, don't mean to revive a thread from the dead but wanted to give some input to this Killer B header issue.

So the Killer B header essentially fits all 02-05 WRX, and 04-07 STi. It should also fit all 08+ WRX, and STi but will NOT fit 06-07 WRX, LGT, and Forester XT this is because of the oil cooler, it is angled.

Here are some photos:

Not noticable as much from the top, but at an angle...
http://i957.photobucket.com/albums/ae53/nancarrowa/AngledOilCooler1_zps3216fe3d.jpeg (http://s957.photobucket.com/user/nancarrowa/media/AngledOilCooler1_zps3216fe3d.jpeg.html)

It is a noticeable change as opposed to this one...
http://i957.photobucket.com/albums/ae53/nancarrowa/AngledOilCooler2_zpsb0d018fc.jpeg (http://s957.photobucket.com/user/nancarrowa/media/AngledOilCooler2_zpsb0d018fc.jpeg.html)

Here is a STRAIGHT Cooler:
http://i957.photobucket.com/albums/ae53/nancarrowa/StraightOilCooler1_zps6a380ebc.jpeg (http://s957.photobucket.com/user/nancarrowa/media/StraightOilCooler1_zps6a380ebc.jpeg.html)

Please let us know if you have any questions!

[C.Plavan]

What header would fit with my angled oil cooler?

[07FIREBLADE]

A custom made one from techworks. I will let you know how it fits when mine shows up this week. Tom's also a vendor.

[bossman43]

A custom made one from techworks. I will let you know how it fits when mine shows up this week. Tom's also a vendor.

Did you ever receive the custom header? Does it hang below the frame rails? Is there any aftermarket header that fits an EJ257 engine and doesn't hang below the frame in the 818? I am debating what to do about my exhaust and this thread doesn't have any clear conclusions.

Let me know what happened in your case.

Thanks,

-Mike

[bossman43]

AJW,

I have an EJ257 from 2006 STi donor with the oil heat exchanger deleted and the Killer B oil pan. Will the Killer B Holy Header hang below the frame in an 818? If it fits, I am interested in getting one. Let us know...

Thanks,

-Mike

[Zach34]

Reviving this to bring some closure to the frame clearance issue. From what I gather above and from my searches on other posts, the following is how much people have reported each header protrudes BELOW the frame on the 818, disregarding motor mount selection:

Killer B - 2" below
Perrin EL - (one reports 3/8" below with picture, another reports 1/2" above with no picture)
Full Race - ??
OEM - clears?

Any testimonials for clearance with the frame for the above choices?

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Reviving this to bring some closure to the frame clearance issue. From what I gather above and from my searches on other posts, the following is how much people have reported each header protrudes BELOW the frame on the 818, disregarding motor mount selection:

Killer B - 2" below
Perrin EL - (one reports 3/8" below with picture, another reports 1/2" above with no picture)
Full Race - ??
OEM - clears?

Any testimonials for clearance with the frame for the above choices?


Zach,
I'm running an wrx OEM exhaust manifold. I installed a belly pan that ramps from the square bar behind the gas tank area to the square bar below the motor mounts.

The exhaust touches my pan at the right end joint of the crossover pipe.



66349

[Hindsight]

Wayne said the NEW Perrin E4 headers clear the frame.

[Zach34]

Thanks guys. Updated:

Killer B - 2" below
Perrin EL - (one reports 3/8" below with picture, another reports 1/2" above with no picture)
Perrin E4 (PSP-EXT-055)?? - clears (per Wayne)
Full Race - ??
OEM - flush with frame

[brian b 36]

I used a afe header it fit real nice on my sec 818 on the first one i used a tomioka and it drops 2 in below the frame

[Zach34]

aFe Power - clears
Full Race - ??
Killer B - 2" below
Perrin EL - (one reports 3/8" below with picture, another reports 1/2" above with no picture)
Perrin E4 (PSP-EXT-055)?? - clears (per Wayne)
OEM - flush with frame
Tomioka - 2" below

[Mitch Wright]

The JDM Twin scroll header with OEM heat shields between 3/8 to 1/2 (i think it is closer to 3/8) below the cockpit frame rail.

[Bob_n_Cincy]

The JDM Twin scroll header with OEM heat shields between 3/8 to 1/2 (i think it is closer to 3/8) below the cockpit frame rail.

Mitch,
Thanks for referencing to the header to the cockpit frame.
I like the list that Zack is putting together. But the reference needs to be the same for each header on the list.
Using the bottom of the cockpit frame is one method.
As second method would be measuring with a straight edge between cockpit and motor mount bar.
Which method is Best?
Also, we might want to and oil pan clearances to this list.
Bob

[Mitch Wright]

Bob, it makes sense to me to take the measurements from the lowest point on the chassis.

[Zach34]

aFe Power - clears
Full Race - ??
JDM twin scroll w/heat shields - 1/2 to 3/8" below
Killer B - 2" below
Perrin EL - (one reports 3/8" below with picture, another reports 1/2" above with no picture)
Perrin E4 (PSP-EXT-055)?? - clears (per Wayne)
OEM - flush with frame
Tomioka - 2" below

[axelthrasher]

aFe Power - clears
Full Race - ??
JDM twin scroll w/heat shields - 1/2 to 3/8" below
Killer B - 2" below
Perrin EL - (one reports 3/8" below with picture, another reports 1/2" above with no picture)
Perrin E4 (PSP-EXT-055)?? - clears (per Wayne)
OEM - flush with frame
Tomioka - 2" below
Tomei UEL - 2" below (http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?14892-Tomei-style-unequal-length-header)

It should also be added that the Tomei UEL doesn't play nice either... Unfortunately, I bought the Tomei UEL for my 818s... and looks like I will now be swapping my Tomei UEL with my Perrin UEL (which isn't made any longer) on my DD WRX to source a header that actually plays nice with the 818... :-/

[Zach34]

aFe Power - clears
Full Race - ??
JDM twin scroll w/heat shields - does not clear (1/2 to 3/8" below)
Killer B - does not clear (2" below)
Perrin EL - ?? (one reports 3/8" below with picture, another reports 1/2" above with no picture)
Perrin E4 (PSP-EXT-055)?? - clears (per Wayne) (FFRSpec72 reports 1/4" clearance)
OEM - clears (flush with frame)
Tomei UEL - does not clear (2" below (http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?14892-Tomei-style-unequal-length-header))
Tomioka - does not clear (2" below)


Updated with some clarity added. Would be nice to fill in some blanks, specifically the following:

-How much does the aFe Power clear the frame?
-I know somebody has tried the Full Race headers. Can we get a definitive clearance yes/no?
-Can someone supply a good picture and specify which engine/engine mounts used of the Perrin EL so we can settle that?
-Verify part number of the Perrin E4. This seems to be emerging as the go-to aftermarket header choice.

[icky]

aFe Power - clears
Full Race - ??
JDM twin scroll w/heat shields - does not clear (1/2 to 3/8" below)
Killer B - does not clear (2" below)
Perrin EL - ?? (one reports 3/8" below with picture, another reports 1/2" above with no picture)
Perrin E4 (PSP-EXT-055)?? - clears (per Wayne) (FFRSpec72 reports 1/4" clearance)
OEM - clears (flush with frame)
Tomei UEL - does not clear (2" below (http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?14892-Tomei-style-unequal-length-header))
Tomioka - does not clear (2" below)


Updated with some clarity added. Would be nice to fill in some blanks, specifically the following:

-How much does the aFe Power clear the frame?
-I know somebody has tried the Full Race headers. Can we get a definitive clearance yes/no?
-Can someone supply a good picture and specify which engine/engine mounts used of the Perrin EL so we can settle that?
-Verify part number of the Perrin E4. This seems to be emerging as the go-to aftermarket header choice.


Also, I don't know if it changes engine height but motor mounts may influence clearance.