Tony's Coupe Build

[ToeKneeNose]

Yesterday I said goodbye to my Miata I had for 15 years which I took from bone stock street car to full full blown caged race car. About an hour after my old project car was driven away on a trailer, I submitted my order for a Type 65 Coupe complete kit. Something about that money burning a hole in my pocket and the current FFR sale ending led me to pulling the trigger quickly.

I've been lurking in the forums and reading/watching other people's builds and now I'm taking the plunge. I've made a lot of notes but I'm still figuring out a lot of the details and I'll definitely have some new challenges along the way.

Order Placed:

• Base Kit
• Coyote Mounts
• Hydraulic Clutch Master Kit
• Coyote Headers
• Side Exhaust
• 2015 IRS - (Free!)
• driveshaft for Coyote and T-56 Magnum
• Manual Rack
• AC kit for Coyote
• Coyote Installation Kit
• Deleted Brakes, Seats, Gauges, Diff/Spindles, Wheels

Still waiting on the initial invoice with completion date but it will be delivered via Cunningham to my home near Denver, CO.

Plan:
Engine = Coyote Gen 3 pulled from salvage yard or 4x crate motor with Ford control pack
Transmission = T-56 Magnum
Diff = Mustang 3.55 Torsen
Brakes = Cadillac XTS Brembo 14" Fronts, Mustang GT 13" Rears, BMW MK60 ABS
Steering = ePowerSteering setup on manual rack
Dash = ECUMaster ADU7 7" Dash with CAN Keyboard
Power Distribution = ECUMaster PMU-16 solid state power distribution, ECUMaster Battery Isolator, all chassis wiring from scratch.
Wheels = Maybe Forgestar F14 (TBD)
Paint = Current Idea is Ford Hot Pepper Red with Dark Grey stripes inspired by this Shelby Pickup:
pickup.jpg

Realistically, I know this is going to be a slow path and many of these details with shift. I'm giving myself 3 years to get to the point where I am ready for paint. I have a toddler so this project will fit in around family and work obligations.

I have a lot more notes on specifics on all the pieces in-between, but this covers the broad strokes. I'm building more of a streetable performance car rather than a show car. I intent to do some track days and autocross events along with cars and coffee and I plan to do as much of the work myself as possible. Body work and paint is intimidating but we'll see. Hopefully my racecar experience will bring some new perspectives to some of the details of the build.

Thanks for following along.

[JimStone]

Welcome and congratulations on your purchase.

You're really doing this mostly DIY and painting outside the lines, which is cool

Good luck and have fun!

[Jeff Kleiner]

I only have 2 words for you—-POWER STEERING. If you’ve followed this forum for any amount of time you know that it’s not because these cars are hard to steer but because it will allow you to run more caster which will make for a much improved road car. Additionally, if you’ve have any thoughts of track days or autocross you simply won’t be able to keep up with it using a manual rack.

Good luc!

Jeff

[ToeKneeNose]

Welcome and congratulations on your purchase.

You're really doing this mostly DIY and painting outside the lines, which is cool

Good luck and have fun!

It's not that different from others, just a few different pieces to accomplish the same thing and learnings from the mustang universe.

I only have 2 words for you—-POWER STEERING. If you’ve followed this forum for any amount of time you know that it’s not because these cars are hard to steer but because it will allow you to run more caster which will make for a much improved road car. Additionally, if you’ve have any thoughts of track days or autocross you simply won’t be able to keep up with it using a manual rack.

Good luc!

Jeff

You probably didn't catch it in the Plan block, but I'm going to use the ePowerSteering kit with the manual rack.
One of the questions I have for FFR is if the rack ratios are the same between manual and powered options. If they are, no reason to get the powered version just to depower it. If they aren't, I would expect the powered to be quicker and I'll have to figure out a way to decide which one is better with the electric assist.

[AaronR]

I don't have my kit ordered yet, but I've started picking up some of the things I'm going to need (engine, transmission, and a few other things). I'm probably looking at the end of summer, sometime in the fall before I pull the trigger.

Your build sounds awesome! Love to see that you're going with a PDM/PMU, aftermarket ECU, and custom wiring. I'm 100% going with a PDM, but I haven't decided which one I want to use just yet. Since I'm going to be using an 8HP75 transmission, that's influencing my decision quite a bit. I currently have a Terminator X Max, but I think I'm going to skip that and go another route. I would be interested in hearing more about why you chose the ECUMaster when you start diving into that part of your build.

I am also excited to hear you mention you're going with the electric power assist for steering. That's something I've considered quite a bit for different reasons. I'm really looking forward to what you share about your installation of the power assist setup when you get there too.

On the ABS, I'm thinking about going with a Delta ABS solution. I've actually kind of settled on that for my build, but I will be interested to see what your experience will be like with the BMW MK60 ABS.

This sounds like a fun build!

[PNWTim]

Welcome Tony. Sounds like you have a great build planned.

[ToeKneeNose]

I don't have my kit ordered yet, but I've started picking up some of the things I'm going to need (engine, transmission, and a few other things). I'm probably looking at the end of summer, sometime in the fall before I pull the trigger.

Your build sounds awesome! Love to see that you're going with a PDM/PMU, aftermarket ECU, and custom wiring. I'm 100% going with a PDM, but I haven't decided which one I want to use just yet. Since I'm going to be using an 8HP75 transmission, that's influencing my decision quite a bit. I currently have a Terminator X Max, but I think I'm going to skip that and go another route. I would be interested in hearing more about why you chose the ECUMaster when you start diving into that part of your build.

I am also excited to hear you mention you're going with the electric power assist for steering. That's something I've considered quite a bit for different reasons. I'm really looking forward to what you share about your installation of the power assist setup when you get there too.

On the ABS, I'm thinking about going with a Delta ABS solution. I've actually kind of settled on that for my build, but I will be interested to see what your experience will be like with the BMW MK60 ABS.

This sounds like a fun build!

Regarding the PDM, I went with the ECUMaster PMU-16 because it was what I had experience with in my miata and I was pretty happy with it. It's very open and limited only by your skill but still most of the features you need baked in with an active community around it and their ADU dashes. The Battery Isolator also seamlessly integrates with the PMU-16 and is great at eliminating long unnecessary battery cable runs or awkward battery cutoff switches. It also has some cool auto timeout features and auto crash safety features. I loved all the data and logic that can be applied to all the circuits in the ECUMaster and I'm excited to setup the dash just how I want it.
The AIM PDM32 with the screen was my 2nd choice, and I'm sure it would work, but I had an AIM dash in my Miata and the configuration was a bit clunky and limited when you start getting into multiple custom CAN configurations and custom screen layouts. I'm also not really focused on the data analysis and sharing data that comes from having an AIM. Haltech PDM and dash was limited to propriety CAN messages from my understanding and the Holly dash also had some kind of basic showstopper I can't recall.

I'm excited for the simplicity of the electric power steering. The hydraulic power steering with the Coyote engine just seemed a bit compromised and the tune ability of the electric assist sounds fun. I know some people that put these in their miata from the same vendor so I was happy to see they had a gen 3 coupe kit. Mine should arrive by the end of the week.

I have mixed feelings about which direction to go for the ABS solution. I know I'm doing it and the Delta ABS solution is nice since you have support, new hardware, and you know what you are getting, but the price is a bit high and I think I can get away with less custom work for the wheel speed sensors if I go the BMW route. I'm still trying to wrap my head fully around this topic, but a MK60E5 with the Happy Cactus VR Converter should allow me to use the stock SN95 front rings/sensors at the same time as the stock S550 rear wheel speed sensors. I'm not sure of the performance impacts and I'm sorting out the details before I buy anything. I also haven't really seen many real world impressions of the Delta ABS solution.

In my mind, this is basically just a bigger, louder miata.

[Papa]

Welcome to the fun! There aren't many active Coupe builds going right now, so adding another is a good thing. I look forward to following along.

[jemorgan3]

Im using the ePowersteering kit as well, just be prepaird to use "alternative mounting" for the electric motor.. Im using an LS3 and i see you are planning to use the a ford mod motor. The LS3 has a significantly smaller footprint than the 5.0, and there was ZERO space to mount the motor using the supplied bracket in the engine bay with the accessory section mounted to my motor. I reached out to 520 motorsports, the vendor i purchased my ePowersteering kit for the type 65 from, and he insisted that the best place to mount it is under the dash. It will require moving the fuze panel to the DS footbox on the left side, but i was planning that anyway.

He sent me a bunch of pictures of the last coupe he installed this kit in, and it was a good looking set up. Ill post them tonight when i find time in my build thread "Another LS coupe build".

BTW, ePowersteering reccomends using FFR's manual steering rack for their kit. They say the FFR rack is specifically geared for the lighter weight vs a heavier SN-95 or Fox mustang.

[ToeKneeNose]

Im using the ePowersteering kit as well, just be prepaird to use "alternative mounting" for the electric motor.. Im using an LS3 and i see you are planning to use the a ford mod motor. The LS3 has a significantly smaller footprint than the 5.0, and there was ZERO space to mount the motor using the supplied bracket in the engine bay with the accessory section mounted to my motor. I reached out to 520 motorsports, the vendor i purchased my ePowersteering kit for the type 65 from, and he insisted that the best place to mount it is under the dash. It will require moving the fuze panel to the DS footbox on the left side, but i was planning that anyway.

He sent me a bunch of pictures of the last coupe he installed this kit in, and it was a good looking set up. Ill post them tonight when i find time in my build thread "Another LS coupe build".

BTW, ePowersteering reccomends using FFR's manual steering rack for their kit. They say the FFR rack is specifically geared for the lighter weight vs a heavier SN-95 or Fox mustang.

Thanks for the heads up. I was already thinking it would go under the dash, maybe I saw this in the documentation before I purchased it. It looks like it comes with a weld in bracket for this area but maybe things have been updated or changed recently. Either way, I'm not planning to have a fuse panel under there anyways so I'm good on that front. I'll keep on eye on your thread for the pictures.

[Jeff Kleiner]

You probably didn't catch it in the Plan block, but I'm going to use the ePowerSteering kit with the manual rack.
One of the questions I have for FFR is if the rack ratios are the same between manual and powered options. If they are, no reason to get the powered version just to depower it. If they aren't, I would expect the powered to be quicker and I'll have to figure out a way to decide which one is better with the electric assist.

You're right Tony. Sorry, I did miss that. I am not sure what ratio the manual rack that FFR supplies is. Manual steering in the Fox Mustang, which their rack is based on, is 20:1. Contrast this to the power rack ratios of 18:1 (standard) and 15:1 (sport). My own roadsters have the 15:1 power ratio and when I get ones into the shop with the manual racks the difference is striking...not because of the effort but because of how slooooow they seem!

I've had a couple of roadsters through here with the epower steering and have to say that I'm not a fan. My observation when driving them is that the cars, even when properly aligned with 7-8 degrees of caster and sufficient toe in, do not want to self center or return to center and after initiating a turn it takes a conscious effort to keep the wheel from continuing to turn. They almost feel like they lack caster even though I know that is not the case. On track where you are constantly making changes or corrections it would probably be fine but on the street I find that it is not a good confidence inspiring feel. My cars with hydraulic PS have been rock steady and want to go straight at speed. Just one guy's opinion...

Jeff

[ToeKneeNose]

You're right Tony. Sorry, I did miss that. I am not sure what ratio the manual rack that FFR supplies is. Manual steering in the Fox Mustang, which their rack is based on, is 20:1. Contrast this to the power rack ratios of 18:1 (standard) and 15:1 (sport). My own roadsters have the 15:1 power ratio and when I get ones into the shop with the manual racks the difference is striking...not because of the effort but because of how slooooow they seem!

I've had a couple of roadsters through here with the epower steering and have to say that I'm not a fan. My observation when driving them is that the cars, even when properly aligned with 7-8 degrees of caster and sufficient toe in, do not want to self center or return to center and after initiating a turn it takes a conscious effort to keep the wheel from continuing to turn. They almost feel like they lack caster even though I know that is not the case. On track where you are constantly making changes or corrections it would probably be fine but on the street I find that it is not a good confidence inspiring feel. My cars with hydraulic PS have been rock steady and want to go straight at speed. Just one guy's opinion...

Jeff

I really appreciate your input, especially at this stage. There's probably not a lot of people who have driven both and you're seriously making me reconsider hydraulic. I can still change my coupe order and return the electric setup so now is the time to decide.

This isn't going to be a dedicated track car, but do you think track driving would necessitate a PS cooler?

[Jeff Kleiner]

I really appreciate your input, especially at this stage. There's probably not a lot of people who have driven both and you're seriously making me reconsider hydraulic. I can still change my coupe order and return the electric setup so now is the time to decide.

This isn't going to be a dedicated track car, but do you think track driving would necessitate a PS cooler?

I ended up putting one on my first roadster. Several 50-60 second autocross runs in quick succession really heated the fluid, and turned it black in short order. No issues after adding a small cooler; about 12" wide with just 2 passes.

Jeff

[460.465USMC]

Welcome aboard, Tony! A unique build and approach. I look forward to following along. I hope to try autocross when mine is road worthy...I have much to learn.

[ToeKneeNose]

I just got my sales order and completion date.
I'm looking at completion date of 5/23/2026 and I'm hoping that works out to a delivery date of the first week or 2 of June.
I was surprised they didn't represent the current sale on this sales order but I have a PDF saved just incase.
I also know I have at least a couple changes I want to make to the order.
[EDIT] Just after posting this, I got an updated sales order from FFR with the discount applied. Woohoo!

Here's an update to my plan after talking to a few people:

1. Staying with electric power steering.
I checked with FFR about their rack ratios and they said both of their rack options (manual and hydraulic) are 15:1. This means I don't have to do any depowering to have the quicker speed steering. Maybe they have offered different ratios in the past for the manual rack that have influenced Jeff's experiences but I'm willing to give it a go.

2. New Brake Plan
I was already trying to convince myself I could get by with the GT rear brakes but I spoke to Gordon Levy and I think I'm going to go with Wilwood Aero6/Aero4 brakes. I had already speced these out as my high end option in my notes and didn't think it was going to be necessary but I think Gordon pushed me over the edge. Plus his knowledge and support will be a great support with any issues or questions I have along the way.

3. ABS Plan
I've been scouring the internet trying to piece together some details and the hardest part for this car is going to be wheel speed sensors. I'm still working on my exact plan but I think I'm going to try to make the rear 2015+ IRS wheel speed setup work and add a comparable front setup.
I found an dormant thread from a few years ago by johnpinetree that showed the 96 tooth internal magnetic ring on the rear IRS knuckles. I think I want to try to make some custom tone rings for the front spindles that match this resolution with new mounts for the hall effect sensors. My backup plan is to use the happy cactus box with the stock front tone rings and stock VR sensors, but I fell like this is one extra piece of hardware to configure correctly with some unknowns, and that cost could just go towards making the fronts work. We'll see.
I think the BMW MK60E5 will be sufficient for my goals as long I can source it properly.

4. Coilover Upgrade
I am also planning to get the QA-1 Double Adjustable from Gordon. He has a couple different options and spring rates but he had one that is a street/track version that sounds about right to me. I definitely don't need the hardcore remote reservoir stiff spring setup.
I'm also going to add the sway bars back into my FFR order. I was thinking I would wait until I have the coilovers nailed down to make sure I'm not paying for some sway bars I'm never going to use but Gordon said these pair well with his setup and he has some upgrade options only if I went with the stiffer hardcore version.

5. Engine sourcing
At this point, I think I'm going to go with a salvage yard gen 3 engine. I'm looking at Midway Mustang since I get a little more confidence I won't get screwed and they seem to have some low mileage options regularly. The only down side is that they only sell the whole drivetrain. I should be able to recoup some of the premium by selling the trans and other extra parts locally. This also mean I can change my order to go with the AC kit without compressor since one will already be on the engine.

6. Procurement Updates
-I already received my ECUMaster pieces a week or so ago when I knew I would be embarking on this build. I still need the CAN keyboard but I haven't defined how many buttons I need yet and I might buy directly from Blink since they have some new offerings.
ecumaster.png
-I ordered a 3.55 torsen from a parts dismantler I found on Ebay. I found their direct website and saved some money by skipping eBay. This should be arriving today. Hopefully I did my homework correctly and get the as pictured S273F model.
-The ePowerSteering kit also arrives today.
-I also ordered the Ford IRS knuckle Kit M5970M direct from Ford with a online coupon code I found. I'm guessing the local Ford dealer will call me when it arrives. Currently in transit.

7. Paint Ideas
I know I have a long way to go before this comes into play but I was playing around with some AI images last night. I couldn't quite get the color right but this is pretty close to what I was imagining.
exteriorcolor.png

[jemorgan3]

Id be interested in any pre-fabricated bracket that puts it under the dash!! If you know of or come across that, please let me know!

[ToeKneeNose]

Id be interested in any pre-fabricated bracket that puts it under the dash!! If you know of or come across that, please let me know!

I did received my ePowerSteering kit ordered directly from ePowerSteering. It comes with a motor bracket, but I still have 2 months until my coupe is delivered to set it in there and see where it fits.

I believe the instructions provided were fairly generic and possibly even with roadster references, but the bracket and is specific for the coupe. Maybe you can match what you have to the pictures to see what bracket you received.
https://epowersteering.com/?s=factory+five
Here's the coupe kit:
PScoupe.png

Here's the roadster kit:
PSroadster.png

[ToeKneeNose]

1 month out from my completion date and I'm mentally putting all the pieces together.

I really want to get the build to a roller as soon as I can so I can free up my lift for occasional normal maintenance activities and not have to build a rolling stand. I already have wheel dollies.
With that in mind, I've been trying to get all the suspension, brakes, and wheel/tire details sorted.

Wheels/Tires:
I've probably been thinking about this the most. I'm sold on the Forgestar F14 wheels in matte black, it's just the sizes I've been contemplating.
I spent a lot of time looking through the tire repository thread, reading a few of the current builds, and old ones, searching TireRack size options, and playing with differences on willtheyfit.com. It's all armchair building, but I think I narrowed down my choice to 2 options.
Option 1:
Front: 19x10 +12 with 275/30R19, Rear: 19x11 -25 with 315/30R19
Option 2:
Front: 18x10 +12 with 275/35R18, Rear: 19x11 -25 with 315/30R19
The "snowman" wheel setup is where I started and seemed too slack in the front sidewall and too tight in the rear sidewall. I started looking at 18s with a larger 335 rear tire and smaller front tire, but then I realized I should just reduce the rear wheel width to reduce the stretch. Then I started looking at tire options for 19x11 and 18x11 inch wheels and a 315 seems like the sweet spot for my liking.
Option 2, with a 18" front, seems to open up a few more tire choices, but I'm generally looking for at the super 200 treadwear tires category and the RT660+ is available in the option 1 sizes.
I'll think about it a little more. I like the filled in 19 inch look on the car.

Related to wheels, why does FF have you press out the rear wheel studs to match the fronts? I'm guessing this is due to the variety of the rear setups they support with the fronts always the same SN95 hubs?
I'm contemplating using extended bullet nose ARP studs on all 4 corners and matching them to the larger rear S550 stud size. It would be a better fit for the Forgestar F14 wheels too.

ABS:
I'm working on gathering all the pieces for a BMW MK60E5 install. I want to do a full bench proof of concept before I put anything on the car. I think I'm just waiting for the main electrical connector before I start playing around with it.
My plan is fit the magnetic reluctance rings to the front hubs and mount a BMW sensor to the knuckle. The ABS rings from the Chrysler 300 are less than 1mm larger than the diameter of the moog hub I bought, so I'm thinking I can shim and epoxy it in place.
absring.png
For the rear, I really hope I can get the stock S550 sensor and reluctance ring to work with the BMW ABS control module for a nice clean and easy install. If not, maybe I can put one of the rings on the CV axle near the hub.
Mounting the pump is also going to be a real challenge. It might end up somewhere above the battery or maybe I can figure something out in front of the footwell. That's a future problem.
I'm trying not to use the happy cactus box unless I really have to. It's an option to use the SN95 front wheel speed sensors and S550 rear wheel speed sensors to fall back to if needed.

Fuel System:
I found a new in box Aeromotive fox body in-tank fuel hanger with a 340 lbh pump on Facebook marketplace for a good discount. In the process, I met a good shop resource about an hour from my house that had worked on a supercharged type 65 coupe somewhat recently. He had made a nice aluminum coolant expansion tank that fit right in one of the front triangles that caught my attention.
I also spec'd out all the main fuel system components and sizes for the system. I really like the Radium products I've used in the past so I'm going to use their Multi-Port Regulator and their 6 micron microglass fuel filter. These are setup to work with a 1/2" (-08AN) feed line and 3/8" (-06AN) return line. I'll hold off purchasing these for a little bit to let my credit card cool down.

I also bought one of the steering wheel turn signal switches from ie427. I'm planning to do the steering system after the suspension is on and I want to get all the pieces laid out at one time.

[dstelter]

installed my ePowerSteering about a yr ago. took a bit to figure out the layout of the unit. But glad i went this route.

[ToeKneeNose]

installed my ePowerSteering about a yr ago. took a bit to figure out the layout of the unit. But glad i went this route.

any broad strokes of tips or guidance you can share, or even a few pictures of your solution?