Base Kit vs. Complete Kit

[CraigHarkness]

Hello all!

My Dad (mechanic for over 40+ years) and I, are beginning the planning stage of building a Roadster and had a few questions for the group here. Using his connections with parts dealers, would it be beneficial to by a Base kit and order the running parts needed or should we just spend the extra $$$ and buy the complete kit and save ourselves the headache.

We have the means to spend the extra couple $$$ on the complete kit but wanted to get the opinions of you's here. Another question we have is, is it possible to make this an automatic? I ask because, unlike my father, I am very rusty driving stick. I learned on it but it's been over 10 years, the wife will NOT be driving this but just an overall random question. If it is possible, is it worth it? Does that limit the amount of power?

In terms of engine/trans, what is an option that will give us power and low cost? My dream would be to put a 427 in it but also can't bring myself to buy a brand new one for $24k. Would it be worth searching for an older one that can be rebuilt?

Last question, what is the "average" amount of time completing a build? This is will mostly be a weekend project for my Dad and I so just trying to get an idea on timeline.


Thanks!!
-Craig

[JJK]

Craig,
There a lot more knowledgeable people on this forum than me, but I will give you a brief overview. The base kit was intended for people who had the engine, transmission, brakes, rear axle, etc. from a mustang. But, this has evolved a bit as many choose the base kit so they can spec out all the running gear parts themselves. The complete kit was meant for those who wanted a car with all new parts not from a donor. The complete kit is definitely easier, but as you note it will cost a bit more than harvesting various parts from donor cars.
For engines, check out factoryfiveengines.com, as Blueprint engines has a working relationship with FFR. There you can choose from a variety of engines and transmissions (automatic is an option with all their engines.) Mike Forte can also supply engines and transmissions, he is on the vendor list as well.
The official book response is that a car can be completed to a rolling gokart in about 300 hours, but I honestly think I have put on everything so far at least twice, some things three times. So, I anticipate my actual build time will be much more, as I also have added several of the popular modifications. I enjoy the process though, so building it quickly is of low priority for me.
Good luck, and I am sure others will have a lot of good advice, this is a great community.
JJ

[Jeff Kleiner]

I've built multiples of both...the short answer is that unless you're straying far away from the basic recipe go the complete kit. The parts are good, they fit and they work. When you start going ala carte and have to source everything on your own unless your time is worth absolutely nothing you'll quickly burn up the savings in lost hours and the purchase of parts that are ultimately incompatible.

Jeff

[JohnK]

I don't recall exactly what is in the base vs complete kit, but here's my somewhat-educated opinion. The complete kit is great if you plan to build your car mostly "by the book" with some selected upgrades. As Jeff says, the parts are (mostly) very good quality and will work just fine. IMO, there are two reasons why you'd want to go with the base kit: 1) if you plan to use a donor and harvest a lot of parts. I'm not sure how viable a route this option is anymore, given the age and typical condition of donor candidates. Or, 2) you are the type of person that goes through every build thread collecting all the best ideas to incorporate into your build (which is pretty much what I did). If you go that route you'll quickly find that you've ended up replacing the vast majority of what's in the complete kit with upgraded parts, and you'll find yourself selling a bunch of unused parts in the forums for pennies on the dollar. As just one example, I ended up replacing the entire fuel system (fuel pump, hanger, filter, fuel lines, etc.) with upgraded parts. I replaced all the kit-provided fuel and brake lines with rolls of stainless steel tubing. I replaced the carpeting, the wipers, I could go on and on. Purely personal preference, but it turns into a double financial hit in the end where in addition to the cost of the upgrades you lose most of the money on the unused parts you're selling off. So my advice would be to spend some time reading through build threads and making a list of upgrades that you plan to incorporate into your build, then go back and look at how much of the complete kit you'll end up using if you do those upgrades.

[rthomas98]

I think you are better off going complete kit. Working with factory five on what they are willing to de-content that you are not using for a reduction in price as opposed to trying to build up from a base kit. Because going either way you are going to look at the accessories and click a few. I did not buy my kit from the site I worked with one of their sales people. Opened up a lot more options that they don't list or changes they are willing to make.

On the engine trans front I went with the base Blueprint 302 w/t5. It is still very exciting to drive, my best 0-60 per the speedhut gauges, is 3.9 sec and I am not trained at all. You can't beat 3 year warranty and that performance out of a brand new $10,000 engine and trans pkg better then that. The other option (once again talk to factory five) is the coyote engine. Factory five sells those not sure what the price is now but when I looked at it it was $16k at the time (this was back in 2020). In the end sending an e-mail to F5 directly and talking to a sales person will really help you.

[CaptB]

I went back and forth and it is appealing cost-wise for the base kit but in the end I am VERY happy I went with the complete kit and ordered my driveline from Forete's. Everything is new and it was enough hard work to get the car done without refurbishing parts. Just my .02 cents and my opinion is worth exactly that!

[Mike.Bray]

I absolutely hate dealing with used parts. The sourcing, cleaning, inspecting, modifying, etc. I've done it plenty of times and the "savings" just isn't worth it to me. And although a low probability there's the risk of missing a crack or a defect. I once had a late 60s IRS third member out of a Corvette that after tearing apart, cleaning, and reassembling I found a crack in the housing. Ugh.

[phileas_fogg]

Adding to your analysis options, you could buy the complete kit and then have F5 credit you back the parts you know you don't want. I don't know that that saves you any money, but you don't have the hassle of selling, say, the F5 side pipes when you know you want the Gas-N's. I deleted the side pipes, seats, and some other stuff just so I wouldn't have to go through the findasellerpackageship process.


John

P.S. I say go with the manual transmission. It's so much fun! And nothing will motivate you to learn to drive a stick than a manual roadster sitting in your garage.

[gbranham]

Totally agree. I went base kit and donor route on my first one. I'm not cleaning any parts on my 2nd.

I absolutely hate dealing with used parts. The sourcing, cleaning, inspecting, modifying, etc. I've done it plenty of times and the "savings" just isn't worth it to me. And although a low probability there's the risk of missing a crack or a defect. I once had a late 60s IRS third member out of a Corvette that after tearing apart, cleaning, and reassembling I found a crack in the housing. Ugh.

[Ted G]

Go complete and ask Factory Five to delete the parts you don't want or will source elsewhere. Although they don't give you a lot for the deletion, it is better than having all the extra parts in your garage.

[CaptB]

Go complete and ask Factory Five to delete the parts you don't want or will source elsewhere. Although they don't give you a lot for the deletion, it is better than having all the extra parts in your garage.

What he said. If I had thought it out better I wouldn't have a stack of FFR parts that need to be sold!

[Fman]

Hello all!

My Dad (mechanic for over 40+ years) and I, are beginning the planning stage of building a Roadster and had a few questions for the group here. Using his connections with parts dealers, would it be beneficial to by a Base kit and order the running parts needed or should we just spend the extra $$$ and buy the complete kit and save ourselves the headache.

We have the means to spend the extra couple $$$ on the complete kit but wanted to get the opinions of you's here. Another question we have is, is it possible to make this an automatic? I ask because, unlike my father, I am very rusty driving stick. I learned on it but it's been over 10 years, the wife will NOT be driving this but just an overall random question. If it is possible, is it worth it? Does that limit the amount of power?

In terms of engine/trans, what is an option that will give us power and low cost? My dream would be to put a 427 in it but also can't bring myself to buy a brand new one for $24k. Would it be worth searching for an older one that can be rebuilt?

Last question, what is the "average" amount of time completing a build? This is will mostly be a weekend project for my Dad and I so just trying to get an idea on timeline.


Thanks!!
-Craig

Craig, my car has been on the road now for a couple years, have 5200 miles on it now. I went complete kit because of the headache factor of sourcing used parts and I wanted to build a completely "new" car. Everything FFR sent me looked like good quality suspension components and up to this point have had no issues with them. Took me about 300 hours to build it but that did not include paint/fitment which I sourced to a local painter in my area, my car was in go-kart at 8 months and completely finished in about one year with paint and I worked on it about one full day a week. Average builds on these are 1-2 years depending on part supply issues which seem to be getting better. If you want a 427 you will need to go with after market block (I went Dart) or you could do a 408 with a 351 Windsor block. Most engine builder won't do a 427 stroker with a Windsor block. Best bang for your buck imo would be a 347 and will have plenty of power. The 427 is a great engine option but you pay for it. I would recommend you call Mike Forte to discuss engine options or if you are in the Nor Cal area I have engine builder local to me who has done multiple engines now for Cobra builders.

[DanQ]

I went with the complete kit because after all the other cars I have restored, the part I hated the most was disassembling rusty, dirty parts, cleaning them up, reconditioning them, before I could actually install them. I am really looking forward to just assembling a vehicle, without all the other BS involved in using a donor. Also, there are a few parts that are exclusive to F5 and may not be readily available at your O'reilley's or NAPA. I have been a mechanic for 40+ years and could have easily sourced a lot of the parts, but thought I would give this route a try. My '33 Hot Rod is arriving early next week, and it is 100% paid for, and now I can hardly wait for boxes and boxes of clean, new parts to arrive!

[Ducky2009]

Try creating a list of ALL the parts you'll need to purchase. You'd be amazed how mush isn't included in the basic kit.