the coyote continues to bite... resolved! :)

Having a bugger of a time with my Coyote Gen 3 crate engine (M-6007-M50C) with the Ford Performance M-6017-M50B Control Pack in my Factory Five Cobra

Lund Tuning and Ford Performance are stumped on this one, been trying to get this running properly since April

Setup is as follows - using VCM BETA Suite

• Gen3 Coyote Crate engine wired as suggested by Factory Five (everyone with a Gen3 coyote uses this guide)
• FPR set to 65PSI with fuel pressure regulator, and verified in VCM Suite
• removed the IMRC controls on the back of the engine, locked them open with MMR lockout kit
• engine fired on first try so all electricals seem to be good
• flashed with Lund Base Tune that accounts for my build, e.g. MAF/intake, removed IMRC, and I have catalytic converters in my headers
• the passenger side (bank1) runs great, gets up to 380F pretty quickly, bank2 (driver side) gets up to about 95F and backfires
• on initial startup it seems that bank 2 fires for a rotation or two, then shuts down that bank

from Lund: its being wonky from the start. bank 1 trends richer and richer then it cycles out of cold start emissions reduction and bank 2 AFR fails goes max lean and trims on bank 2 go to 97% lean correction.
its like that side of the engine stops firing. so far off that it eventually matches the correction on the bank but AFR still pegged lean. this is really weird this is the first I've seen this.

permanent codes - I'm told they'll go away after some drive time
P0356 - Ignition Coil F Primary/Secondary Circuit (Permanent) - e.g. cylinder #6 coilpack issue
P0124 - Throttle/Pedal Position Sensor A Intermittent (Permanent) - not uncommon on these engines I've been told and should go away
P2017 - Intake Manifold Runner Position Sensor/Switch Circuit High Bank 1 (Permanent)
P2022 - Intake Manifold Runner Position Sensor/Switch Circuit High Bank 2 (Permanent)
P2008 - Intake Manifold Runner Control Circuit/Open Bank 1 (Permanent)

troubleshooting:

• have swapped O2 sensors side to side, problem stays on bank2
• got a new 175T harness from Ford - no difference in O2 readings
• swapped coil packs side to side, problem stayed on #6
• swapped plugs from #6 to others - stayed on #6
• NOID light, all COPs firing
• tested all (4) VTC solenoids (2 bank1, 2 bank2) and all function with 12v tests (clicking)
• 3 pages of testing from Ford determined something wrong with engine harness, new harness shipped last week, seemed to get bank #2 up to much hotter (untouchable) temps but on next startup back to cold bank #2 running/shutdown
• checked all plugs, swapped out with new ones too - same issue

tl/dr; coyote fires up fine, shuts down bank#2 and doesn't come up to temp

seriously perplexed as to why this is happening, Lund and Ford are stumped as well... HPL file attached if anyone wants to take a peek at an idea...
hpl file: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ZBl...usp=share_link
in order to use the HPL file, you can use the HP Tuners VCM BETA Suite

I'm still searching the internet for you! UGH!

Very sorry to see this still happening. Sure doesn't match my Coyote experience. Not that that matters a bit to you, which I understand. :mad: One question and comments from my side:

1. You said Ford replaced the "engine harness." Does that mean the physical harness on the engine? The one that comes with the crate motor itself? Not the harness that comes with the crate motor control pack, right? There was another builder a few years ago that had issues with his Gen 2 Coyote. After exhausting seemingly every possibility, Ford provided a new crate motor harness. Problem solved. That Roadster is over 10K miles the last I heard. Just another shot in the dark, but thought I'd throw it out there.

2. As for those DTC's you're getting, I've never seen the first one (P0356). It's more than a coincidence IMO that you're getting that error on the same cylinder that you're having problems with. I'm sure you (and others) have seen this same code being widely discussed on Mustang and F150 forums. So sadly doesn't seem that uncommon. I looked through a bunch of them and none listed the solution. FWIW (and again maybe you've seen this...) a good explanation of that code: "I say again - P035x codes are "ELECTRICAL" or "ELECTRONIC" in nature and not fuel/air - compression oriented. Concentrate on _HOW_ does that PCM fail to see +12 volts on the COP control wire when it want's to fire #6, or _HOW_ does it fail to see 'current draw' in that COP control circuit when the PCM grounds the COP control wire to start the firing process, or - _HOW_ does the PCM fail to see the 'reverse EMF' kick (a couple hundred volts for a couple of microseconds) when the Coil fires the plug? You may be tracking this down to a failing component in the PCM circuitry for cylinder 6 COP. Could even be intermittent and/or heat related." As I recall, Ford re-flashed your PCM. Have you tried a different one completely? Has that been offered?

I have seen the P0124 a couple of times, but haven't seen it now in 4+ years on the Coupe. A little surprised you're getting the IMRC codes. Pretty standard practice when you lock out the IMRC's as you've done to suppress these codes in the PCM calibration.

Again, I will say good luck. After all this time you need another big dose of it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by edwardb

Very sorry to see this still happening. Sure doesn't match my Coyote experience. Not that that matters a bit to you, which I understand. :mad: One question and comments from my side:

1. You said Ford replaced the "engine harness." Does that mean the physical harness on the engine? The one that comes with the crate motor itself? Not the harness that comes with the crate motor control pack, right? There was another builder a few years ago that had issues with his Gen 2 Coyote. After exhausting seemingly every possibility, Ford provided a new crate motor harness. Problem solved. That Roadster is over 10K miles the last I heard. Just another shot in the dark, but thought I'd throw it out there.

2. As for those DTC's you're getting, I've never seen the first one (P0356). It's more than a coincidence IMO that you're getting that error on the same cylinder that you're having problems with. I'm sure you (and others) have seen this same code being widely discussed on Mustang and F150 forums. So sadly doesn't seem that uncommon. I looked through a bunch of them and none listed the solution. FWIW (and again maybe you've seen this...) a good explanation of that code: "I say again - P035x codes are "ELECTRICAL" or "ELECTRONIC" in nature and not fuel/air - compression oriented. Concentrate on _HOW_ does that PCM fail to see +12 volts on the COP control wire when it want's to fire #6, or _HOW_ does it fail to see 'current draw' in that COP control circuit when the PCM grounds the COP control wire to start the firing process, or - _HOW_ does the PCM fail to see the 'reverse EMF' kick (a couple hundred volts for a couple of microseconds) when the Coil fires the plug? You may be tracking this down to a failing component in the PCM circuitry for cylinder 6 COP. Could even be intermittent and/or heat related." As I recall, Ford re-flashed your PCM. Have you tried a different one completely? Has that been offered?

I have seen the P0124 a couple of times, but haven't seen it now in 4+ years on the Coupe. A little surprised you're getting the IMRC codes. Pretty standard practice when you lock out the IMRC's as you've done to suppress these codes in the PCM calibration.

Again, I will say good luck. After all this time you need another big dose of it.

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Thanks Paul... it's been a frustrating event, crate engines should 'just work' like many have realized...

as for #1 - yes they shipped a whole new engine harness (the one that comes mounted on the engine) after 3 pages of deep dive testing on the original harness we think we found a break in a ground that would affect the whole engine

for the DTCs - P0365 could have just been thrown from one of the first starts, and had us chase down the bad COP - we swapped COPs around and tested with NOID lights, all were functional, and yes P0356 refers more to a circuit issue so we tested the harness and replaced due to the ground break item we thought we found

the IMRC codes should go away over time - they're tuned out by LUND...

I may just go and redo all my grounds, or at least re-evaluate them, all are bare-metal ground down:

• PDU into the battery negative terminal
• battery grounded to frame
• frame is also grounded to passenger engine mount
• (new ground) frame is grounded to driver engine mount
• fuse panel is grounded to frame (footbox)

Sorry to hear you are having problems. Fuel injection and the electronics are amazing.... when they work. Two things

1. What happens if you flash the motor back to the stock tune? Does the phenomenon go away?

2. The HPL file will not let me open it. To be honest I am not sure I will be much help even if I could open it but thought you would like to know.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kirby

Sorry to hear you are having problems. Fuel injection and the electronics are amazing.... when they work. Two things

1. What happens if you flash the motor back to the stock tune? Does the phenomenon go away?

2. The HPL file will not let me open it. To be honest I am not sure I will be much help even if I could open it but thought you would like to know.

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sadly the engine does this on the stock tune as well as the Lund Tune...

in order to use the HPL file, you can use the HP Tuners VCM BETA Suite

Do not know if this is physically possible, can you run the right side O2 harness to the left and left to right?
Is it possible to feed info into the O2 harness from regulated voltage supply. Trying to trick the computer with false input.
I do not like hearing the #6 cyl is common to issues, ie coolant getting into cyl and corrupting O2 readings.
How much trouble is a compression check and or draining coolant and running engine?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by toadster

sadly the engine does this on the stock tune as well as the Lund Tune...

in order to use the HPL file, you can use the HP Tuners VCM BETA Suite

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Sorry to hear that. I always start simple with my testing and did not see you mention it.

For the hpl file. I should have been more specific. Google said I needed permission to get to the file. Maybe you need to make it public.

Has an alternate ECM been tried?

Maybe a plugged cat on the misbehaving side? Unlikely since they're new, but something else to check that's not wiring/electronics.

A little late to this one, and a little light on the technical know-how... I can't speak to the PCM/tune issues, but you mentioned something in the original post that caught my eye. You said the PS bank got up to 380F while the DS bank only goes to 95F. You said the DS bank seems to shut down. It sounds like you have half an engine operating.

I may be way off base here, but I'm wondering if there is a blockage internally. It seems as though your troubleshooting has been thorough, at least regarding electronics. Maybe it's not electrical/electronic. Maybe those codes are responding to the issue with the wrong conclusion? Are you getting fuel spraying on the driver side? You noted that bank 2 shuts down. Could that be because there's something in the way?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jab351w

Maybe a plugged cat on the misbehaving side? Unlikely since they're new, but something else to check that's not wiring/electronics.

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I have thought about this, I have a boroscope and I looked at it from the inside through the O2 bung, and it looks good - there is also airflow when the engine is firing, it's just not 'hot' air
I also can see 'light' through the catalytic with the boroscope - both sides are equally visible

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nigel Allen

Has an alternate ECM been tried?

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that' the next step - the ECU I have now was reflashed by Ford a few months ago, but they've seen issues where even a reflashed ECU may have broken stuff inside that they don't catch

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Al_C

A little late to this one, and a little light on the technical know-how... I can't speak to the PCM/tune issues, but you mentioned something in the original post that caught my eye. You said the PS bank got up to 380F while the DS bank only goes to 95F. You said the DS bank seems to shut down. It sounds like you have half an engine operating.

I may be way off base here, but I'm wondering if there is a blockage internally. It seems as though your troubleshooting has been thorough, at least regarding electronics. Maybe it's not electrical/electronic. Maybe those codes are responding to the issue with the wrong conclusion? Are you getting fuel spraying on the driver side? You noted that bank 2 shuts down. Could that be because there's something in the way?

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we've checked pretty much all the mechanicals, sensors, etc. The injectors are functioning, and we're getting spark.
one of the horror stories we've heard is that some crate engines were shipped with Mustang cams on one bank and F150 cams on the other bank - different firing order so it will never run right - we think we're past that point (hopefully!)

Though I'm not a huge fan of the email communications with LUND, they did get me up and running. Had an issue Ford Performance didn't pick up on that they did. I'm wondering if a local tuner would be able to diagnose it with everything in front of them rather than files going back and forth. I hated the process of endless emails to LUND. In my area everyone is so busy that they want nothing to do with my crate motor.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tooth

Though I'm not a huge fan of the email communications with LUND, they did get me up and running. Had an issue Ford Performance didn't pick up on that they did. I'm wondering if a local tuner would be able to diagnose it with everything in front of them rather than files going back and forth. I hated the process of endless emails to LUND. In my area everyone is so busy that they want nothing to do with my crate motor.

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if the new ECU doesn't work - i'll be taking the car to AED - Shaun knows these engines - pricey, but at this point - I have a pricey paperweight...

agree, the LUND email threads are tiresome... Ford is even looking at my hpl files as well, so I think everyone is praying a new ECU will remedy this... gotta love covid cutbacks on integrated circuits :mad:

What 2 things will affect one whole bank of cylinders? A power feed wire for the injectors or the coils as I believe each coil or injector has a separate ground to the ECM for operation. Injectors clogged on one bank is the only other thing I can think of. Sometimes us technical gurus get caught up in more technical aspects of things and forget about some more basic stuff, myself included, too many times! When I would get frustrated trying to diagnose a problem such as this I would start over with the basics first before jumping in too deep. Sometimes you find something and you say on yeah, how did I miss that. Good luck!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mastertech5

What 2 things will affect one whole bank of cylinders? A power feed wire for the injectors or the coils as I believe each coil or injector has a separate ground to the ECM for operation.

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yes, we did a pretty in depth test on the engine harness - the last test was to test a break to ground, all 8 cylinders failed - which was even more odd,
here's the test methodology we used from Ford: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing

you'd think if all cylinders failed, nothing would fire, but Ford said maybe it wasn't fully broken but just enough to carry electrical load to 1/2 the engine

the driver side is a bit odd, the cylinders #6 and #8 are sometimes warmer than #5 and #7 - but not always... but none of the cylinders get to >= 350F like the passenger side - it's a very odd problem

Quote:

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Originally Posted by toadster

yes, we did a pretty in depth test on the engine harness - the last test was to test a break to ground, all 8 cylinders failed - which was even more odd,
you'd think if all cylinders failed, nothing would fire, but Ford said maybe it wasn't fully broken but just enough to carry electrical load to 1/2 the engine

the driver side is a bit odd, the cylinders #6 and #8 are sometimes warmer than #5 and #7 - but not always... but none of the cylinders get to >= 350F like the passenger side - it's a very odd problem

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There may be more than one problem. Yes a not broken but compromised wire can't carry enough current to operate a component. Check the female connectors on the coils and injectors on those two cylinders. They may be opened up too much to make good contact on the male side. I had added more to my post after you read it.

The comment about the wrong cam was interesting. If the truck cam has a different firing order? There are only 2 pairs of cylinders that are swapped I believe. Sometimes 2 sometimes 4. Maybe they are the 2 in question.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mastertech5

The comment about the wrong cam was interesting. If the truck cam has a different firing order? There are only 2 pairs of cylinders that are swapped I believe. Sometimes 2 sometimes 4. Maybe they are the 2 in question.

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yeah, that one is terrifying to think of... you spend $9k on an engine, they test the engine on a mechanical system that tests rotation, etc. (without firing or testing electrical) and you get a dud
would require pulling the engine for sure since the driver's side head is within a 1/4" of the driver footbox, no clearance to pull the head at all

Check compression on that whole side and compare. If those 2 are fairly lower than the others then it's a distinct possibility.

I keep thinking about this problem. And I keep asking myself the same question: what changed?

If I read your initial post correctly, it seems as though the engine did start right up in it original "crate" form. Yes? If that is true, then get it back to that state and start changing things one at a time, testing after each. In my mind, that's the best way to identify the culprit. Right now, I think you have too many variables, but that's just my opinion.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Al_C

I keep thinking about this problem. And I keep asking myself the same question: what changed?

If I read your initial post correctly, it seems as though the engine did start right up in it original "crate" form. Yes? If that is true, then get it back to that state and start changing things one at a time, testing after each. In my mind, that's the best way to identify the culprit. Right now, I think you have too many variables, but that's just my opinion.

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sadly, no it's never fired properly from the start, it did start on the first try though...

Definitely move your engine mount ground to the engine block, and add a ground strap from a cylinder head to the frame.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mark Reynolds

Definitely move your engine mount ground to the engine block, and add a ground strap from a cylinder head to the frame.

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I have a ground strap on both sides into the block,
so add another ground strap from the head to the frame? both heads?
https://i.ibb.co/4jbZmBM/IMG-9742.jpg https://i.ibb.co/FmckFP3/IMG-9741.jpg


also, installed the new ECU, fired up great initially - temps on bank2 got up to 250-270F, we even got some oil burn-off from the headers, then it shutdown bank2 again and went back to it's usual issues
several restarts to test again, the bank2 only gets 95F, no hotter and definitely not firing again - even changed all the plugs on the driver side (bank2) and same issue

for the short time it ran 'well' it seemed that 2 of the 4 cylinders, we think #6 and #8 fired hotter than the others, hard to remember because it was just under a minute

video to see the startup, you will notice the oil burn-off around 50 seconds, then shortly thereafter shuts down bank #2 (gets quieter)
https://youtu.be/gKHxYLKjmio

Any new codes thrown by the PCM? It sounds like the PCM is going into some kind of protection mode. Hopefully there is a code stored to give you a clue. Were all codes cleared before the latest startup so that you could distinguish between anything old vs. new?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Alan_C

Any new codes thrown by the PCM? It sounds like the PCM is going into some kind of protection mode. Hopefully there is a code stored to give you a clue. Were all codes cleared before the latest startup so that you could distinguish between anything old vs. new?

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had to re-up the HP Tuners access so Lund will have to setup the new VIN/ID to talk with this PCM, so I cannot log until then...

added a new 10GA ground to the driver side head, between a sensor mount screw into the head, and drilled into the frame and took off the powdercoat to bare metal

https://i.ibb.co/prhdLLC/image.png

- no place to move the passenger side ground that is in the engine mount though, the driver side block ground is solid as well

still no differences in firing, will have to talk with Ford/Lund on Monday

OK, so you have a new computer. ECU/PCM/whatever - we are talking about the same thing, I hope. (not trying to be annoying, just want to ensure we're all clear.) What was the programming on the new unit? Stock or Lund?

Here's where I'm going with this: if it is stock, and the DS bank shuts down, there has got to be a mechanical reason for that. I do not believe (and I may well be in the minority, or flat out wrong) that this is an electrical/electronic problem. I keep thinking fuel, but you don't seem to be getting lean codes. It started out OK, i.e. started and ran as you indicated, so that tells me the electrical stuff is OK. It would tend to tell me fuel, because it would take a few rpms for the fuel problem (i.e. a blockage) to come into play.

I try to stick to fundamentals. It is either fuel or spark. Or compression. If compression is bad on a brand new engine, you need to send it back. Or it's the the cam, most likely. You've done your homework on the electrical - it certainly seems like that part of it is covered. Maybe the tune, but you had similar issues, apparently, with the factory tune.

Please prove me wrong, but I gotta believe this is a fuel problem. Or the wrong cam, but you'd probably have a damaged piston by now.

Spitballing, but I am wondering if a problem with the solenoid or controls for the variable valve timing for the bank in question could be at play here???

Jeff

Al_C Brings up a salient point. It certainly could be a fuel flow issue. Fuel flows in from the driver side fuel rail, then flows through a cross pipe, to the the passenger side fuel rail. If there is a sufficient restriction preventing fuel flowing freely to the passenger side, there would be a pressure drop once the injectors start opening. I.E. The fuel pressure builds up in the passenger side rail when the fuel pump is running and the engine is not yet started. This is possible because it is a non-return system.

For readers that are unsure of this concept, You can carry out the following experiment:
1. get your garden hose and put a kink in it , near the start, that restricts flow to a trickle.
2. Put your thumb over the end of the hose and you will feel the pressure build up until it reaches full pressure.
3. Release your thumb off the end of the hose, there will be a short high flow of water, but then it will reduce to a low pressure trickle.

I have watched your most recent video and the engine does seem to run like a coyote should on initial startup. That makes me think there isn't major internal issues.
A possible way to test this this hypothesis, without pulling things apart (which I'm sure you don't want to do as you are in the middle of a warranty claim process) is to:
1. run the fuel pump continuously.
2. Try starting the engine and see if it fires on all cylinders each time.
If the engine does fire correctly each time, then I guess there is a possibility that there is a manufacturing defect with the fuel rail or some sort of partial blockage between the left and right hand rails preventing sufficient flow.

Disclaimer: I have a gen1 engine without the direct injection fuel system. I am not sure if both fuel systems are operational at idle, or on start-up. So my experiment above might be useless.

A number of years ago I had exactly the same issue with a ~ 2,000 horsepower Detroit 2 stroke diesel generator. On full load it would run normally for a few minutes and then the horsepower would taper off to zero (This generator was running in parallel with three others). The generator would then enter into a reverse power condition which is a major issue. Fortunately, the automation system would shut the generator down at this stage. There was much head scratching and quite a number of people took a look at it. The mechanics said it was electrical and the sparkies said is was a mechanical issue and both teams walked away. I engaged a old school diesel guy to assist, and we fitted pressure gauges to the fuel rail. In the end we found the issue was a coarse fuel strainer in the diesel tank. It was clogged with rust and scale. However when the set shut down there was enough of a back-flow 'pulse' to push some of this scale off of the strainer. That way the next time we started up the set, it ran OK until we applied full load and there was a high flow resulting in a large pressure drop across the strainer.


I really hope you find the answer soon. It certainly looks like electrical is ruled out now.

Best of luck,

Nige

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jeff Kleiner

Spitballing, but I am wondering if a problem with the solenoid or controls for the variable valve timing for the bank in question could be at play here???

Jeff

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Hey Jeff, that's really good point. I don't know VVT systems well, so only having a guess here. If the VVT was out of kilter, would the engine still run on that bank, albeit not well? Unless, of course the feedback from the VVT position sensor causes a shutdown condition?

Cheers,

Nige

Quote:

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Originally Posted by toadster

added a new 10GA ground to the driver side head, between a sensor mount screw into the head, and drilled into the frame and took off the powdercoat to bare metal

https://i.ibb.co/prhdLLC/image.png

- no place to move the passenger side ground that is in the engine mount though, the driver side block ground is solid as well

still no differences in firing, will have to talk with Ford/Lund on Monday

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All engine grounds should have the ability to carry the starter motor current (which is the highest current likely to flow) If your main ground is disconnected, becomes resistive due to corrosion, or fails, full starting current (I measured ~150 amps on my Coyote) will flow through this wire and likely turn it into smoke.

Cheers,

Nige

I would think that if the PCM has detected a fault, it will post a code for diagnostics. I like the idea that there could be a fuel starvation issue with the affected bank. That makes the most sense and could explain why there have been brief signs of life. Given all the effort that has been applied so far, it would be worth it to remove the fuel rail, injectors, and clean everything thoroughly.

Since it’s the driver side having issues, I doubt it’s a blockage. Fuel comes in on the driver side.
Mike

Quote:

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Originally Posted by michael everson

Since it’s the driver side having issues, I doubt it’s a blockage. Fuel comes in on the driver side.
Mike

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Oh, whoops. I had my sides mixed up!

Nige

Since we're all grasping at straws (or so it would seem), how about this: disconnect the fuel line from the fuel rail. Fabricate some sort of way to hook up a shop vac to the fuel rail. Better yet, while doing that, put some sort of filter screen (cheesecloth, etc.) prior to the vacuum and let her rip. It would be interesting to see if you catch any junk coming out of the fuel rail. Yes, even in my Gen II, the fuel does go in on the DS. However, at some point, there is a split and it gets dispersed on both sides. If you were to try to blow it out with compressed air, it would only clog an injector if there's something there. If you vacuum it, you might get it out.

The other side of this experiment is that you can find nothing and say to me "I told you so". That's fine, I just want to eliminate the possibility of a fuel issue and get your problem solved.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Al_C

Since we're all grasping at straws (or so it would seem), how about this: disconnect the fuel line from the fuel rail. Fabricate some sort of way to hook up a shop vac to the fuel rail. Better yet, while doing that, put some sort of filter screen (cheesecloth, etc.) prior to the vacuum and let her rip. It would be interesting to see if you catch any junk coming out of the fuel rail. Yes, even in my Gen II, the fuel does go in on the DS. However, at some point, there is a split and it gets dispersed on both sides. If you were to try to blow it out with compressed air, it would only clog an injector if there's something there. If you vacuum it, you might get it out.

The other side of this experiment is that you can find nothing and say to me "I told you so". That's fine, I just want to eliminate the possibility of a fuel issue and get your problem solved.

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DEFINITELY DO NOT USE A VACUUM CLEANER NEAR FUEL.
the brushes on the vacuum motor create sparks and will ignite the fuel/air mix being drawn across the motor. (The air flows over the motor to keep it cool, as it exhausts the vacuum cleaner. That is why the exhaust air is quite warm)

I grew in a coastal country town. 2 fellas got their picture on the front cover of the local paper.
They bought an old boat together. There was a lot of rust in the fuel tank, so they drained it over a few beers and grabbed the wife's vacuum cleaner to suck out the the rust. It resulted in an almighty kaboom as the vacuum exploded into thousands of shards. Luckily only a few cuts from shrapnel.
On the funny side, the dust filled contents of the vacuum cleaner bag blasted themselves all over the guys and they came staggering out of the shed looking like something from a daffy duck dynamite gag. fkn hilarious.

Cheers,

Nige

Nige, I worked in fire protection and "special hazards" for a couple of years. The tragedies I was exposed too.... even fuel-wet rags are hazardous.
OTOH my septic tank service vacuums our effluent (and methane) with a hydraulically driven centrifugal pump that develops frightening levels of suction. That itself is a hazard.
Piston pumps are the ultimate in pumping force and indeed they lift wet concrete to the top of sky scraper construction.
jim

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nigel Allen

All engine grounds should have the ability to carry the starter motor current (which is the highest current likely to flow) If your main ground is disconnected, becomes resistive due to corrosion, or fails, full starting current (I measured ~150 amps on my Coyote) will flow through this wire and likely turn it into smoke.

Cheers,

Nige

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good call Nige - I was reading grounding rules and minimum 14GA to BODY, not frame, so I'll at least up the ground to that size.
Currently, there's the FFR ground 2GA with a ground strap (connected to the engine mount) on passenger side, and a ground strap on driver side (into the block) - from the pics above

the smaller 10GA wire is connected currently to the rear of the drivers side head and into the frame
I found another location that I can add another ground to frame on the passenger side at the front of the head - starting to feel like Medusa herself is entering the engine bay... may hook that one up as well.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jeff Kleiner

Spitballing, but I am wondering if a problem with the solenoid or controls for the variable valve timing for the bank in question could be at play here???

Jeff

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yes, starting to think this is electro-mechanical - my son and I tested the VVT (variable valve timing) solenoids and the CPS (cam position sensor) - they all respond to 12v testing with activation (clicking)
it feels like it could be temp related, once the engine gets warm the driver side will fire for a revolution or two (at least we think it's firing because it's noticeably louder) then goes quiet

we've tested all these on the driver side, all seem to respond well

Orange: Cam Position Sensor (12v+ testing) engine off
Blue: Coil on Plug (NOID light) - engine running
Yellow: VCT (12v+ testing) - engine off
Green: Fuel Injector (NOID light) - engine running

we've unplugged the VCTs and CamPS and started the engine, and the software sees them as failed or unplugged

https://i.ibb.co/mRMGQmF/coyote-wiring.png

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nigel Allen

DEFINITELY DO NOT USE A VACUUM CLEANER NEAR FUEL.
the brushes on the vacuum motor create sparks and will ignite the fuel/air mix being drawn across the motor. (The air flows over the motor to keep it cool, as it exhausts the vacuum cleaner. That is why the exhaust air is quite warm)

I grew in a coastal country town. 2 fellas got their picture on the front cover of the local paper.
They bought an old boat together. There was a lot of rust in the fuel tank, so they drained it over a few beers and grabbed the wife's vacuum cleaner to suck out the the rust. It resulted in an almighty kaboom as the vacuum exploded into thousands of shards. Luckily only a few cuts from shrapnel.
On the funny side, the dust filled contents of the vacuum cleaner bag blasted themselves all over the guys and they came staggering out of the shed looking like something from a daffy duck dynamite gag. fkn hilarious.

Cheers,

Nige

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OK, got me there. My bad. I guess I didn't think that one through. I'd still like to evacuate the fuel rail to ensure there's no blockage, but I stand corrected on the vacuum.