Good call on this, definitely found this to be true. Also had issues with welds protruding up around the ball joint keeping the dust cover from fitting properly.Quote:
Originally Posted by myjones
Printable View
Good call on this, definitely found this to be true. Also had issues with welds protruding up around the ball joint keeping the dust cover from fitting properly.Quote:
Originally Posted by myjones
Finished UCA's last night. Came across several weld interference issues. The one that stands out though is an issue with weld interference on the front upper control arm mounting tabs with regards to the bolt head/nut as well? What is the preferred fix...shrinking the diameter of the head by grinding? As it is tightened, it doesn't want to sit flush on the mount. Might be a little difficult to get at to grind the weld, plus I don't know that that would be the best fix.
LCA's and UCA's on...Attachment 66032
Area of interference...Attachment 66033
Shocks and Spindles next...Attachment 66034
Looking Good
Thanks. It's been slow going but extremely therapeutic so far!Quote:
Originally Posted by wrp
I had to compare your area of interference to my upper arms. I did grind the welds for the nut flange to clear, but yours appears to hit the other end of the nut. If that's the situation your tabs are off position. Make sure your arm has full travel without hitting the tubing above the bushing. Mine has 1/4" clear on the rounded end of the nut.Quote:
Originally Posted by JOP33
Thanks for input...I will doublecheck.Quote:
Originally Posted by erlihemi
Built up Shocks and got them installed. There's got to be a trick to getting the large spacers in on the lower shock mounts...I spent an hour just on the bottom mounts.
Front Shocks...Attachment 66109
You may want to flip the shocks. At first that is how I did it but when it was time to set the car to its final height I had a problem trying to adjust the shocks. Once the rad and the wiring is done there is not much room.
It looks great! Keep it up.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JOP33
Thanks Dave...That was actually my plan, but I have the dual rate Koni's and manual states that they must be installed body down. I am not exactly sure what the implications are of flipping those shocks, but I am sure someone on the forum may have that knowledge to comment as I do agree it will be much easier later on.Quote:
Originally Posted by Niagara Dave
Spindles went on tonight. Relatively straight forward install. I did have some issues with the castle nut on the upper driver side ball joint as it passed the cotter pin relief. I chased the threads and was finally able to get it hand tightened for now. I am hopeful about moving at a little quicker pace this weekend, but so far I have been getting done each night what I set out to do.
Spindles on...Attachment 66136
Attachment 66137
The blue cups go on top the black ones go on the bottom
Sorry I didn't look at all pictures looks like both sets of yours are blue .
There might be some validity to what your saying Kevin. I actually have a second set of dust boots (slightly smaller & black), but they didn't seem to fit quite as well as the blue. The tops do seem to be "flattened" a little more than expected, but they are sagging and have no grease in them at this point...I will look into this a little more. The bottom boots, I believe, are clipped in. Thanks.Quote:
Originally Posted by bakerboerne
Was able to get the Front Brakes installed this morning. One week into the build and here are a few lessons learned...
Have been waiting to pull the trigger on the wheels/tires, but needed some lug nuts to hold the rotor hats on during caliper installation...so I had to run out early this morning and pick up some cheap lugs just for that purpose, poor planning on my part.
The Wilwood Brakes are masterpieces...so of course during build up I took the care to place some brown paper down on my workbench so as not to scratch these beauties (the hats) during the process. Always check for little shards of steel or weld bb's when you do this. After almost breaking my arm off patting myself on the back when I had joined the brake hat to the rotor, much to my horror I turned it over and there were scratches everywhere on the face (I know, Rookie mistake)! Needless to say, I dusted off the workbench, placed a shop rag underneath the next one and made dang sure I didn't scratch it! Guess I will be sanding those and just shooting some rattle can black over them eventually...live & learn.
Front Brakes installed sporting the scratched on black look...Attachment 66177
Man one of these front brakes looks really nice...Attachment 66180
Second one went together without a scratch...Attachment 66179
With the help of my wife, we got the rearend installed this morning...diff, UCA's, LCA's and shocks. Attachment 66217
Lower Control Arms... Attachment 66218
Shocks and Springs... Attachment 66219
Want to throw out a couple of questions. I have come across (several times now) what I am calling "hanging instructions" in the manual. For example, with regards to the assembly of the rear shocks at the lower mount...FFR manual states on the passenger side, place the large spacer in front of the shock and then the 1/8" spacer behind and then they never mention the driver side. So do you assume it gets installed the same way or opposite? I went with the same way as after trying the other way there would be interference with the shock and the frame. Would also like to know if there is anyone out there that has gone with the upgraded koni's and if they actually can be installed body up? No mission critical items as I will follow up later this week with FFR, but you'd think after 1000 of these the manuals would be pretty iron'd out
Will try for the rear brake install later this evening.
During this process I will try to keep my "stupid" questions to a minimum, so bear with me...
Question 1: With regards to instructions dealing with vehicles, wouldn't "driver side" or "passenger side" be a more clarified description than "left side" or "right side" (guess this could get confusing outside the USA)?
Question 1A: When Wilwood says "left side shown", is that as you are looking at the vehicle or as you are sitting in the vehicle?
Question 2: I have seen several orientations of the Wilwood Rear Brake set-ups on the 33'...which is correct and why (to be clearer, the clocking of the caliper around the rear axle)? The instructions really don't specify, but yet I have seen them in different locations throughout the forum.
I'm still waiting for the "stupid question" so I can possibly keep up.Quote:
Originally Posted by JOP33
Question 1) I prefer port and starboard as that works with British cars also.
Question 1A) Automotive Industry standard is as sitting in the vehicle, but I can't get any work done there...
Question 1B) I can't remember if clockwise is from the front of the motor or if its counterclockwise for a rear engine car?
Question 2) Most brake pads will work in either direction and the "clocking" is either owner preference or owner oversight. Hoses, emergency brakes, and coil over clearance do matter and that is dependent on the chassis modification. Stick with the FFR manual in most cases. It does have it somewhere in there. Which brings us back to the left and right question, because some of the calipers are labeled the opposite way and then we can't tell the difference between right and wrong.
Enjoy:)
I'll add 2 things to the mix on the 33's rear brakes
The calipers on a 33 are sometimes moved because it makes a better path for the emergency brake cable.
On mine the rear mounted fuel tank also comes into that cable path so mine are in front of the axle and swapped side to side.
The marking on the caliper is wrong at times as well on the 33 because we are off labeling it's use onto a different set-up. <see above
L caliper might work on the right side in front of instead of behind the axle etc. Most often you can just look at the bleeder
screw and put it in the up position to tell which side of the car that caliper works best on. There have been a few builds where
they had to mount the bleeder downward so they bled it pointed up then rolled it back down and bolted it in place.
HTH
Dale
Thanks guys for chiming in. I always appreciate (and can use) the feedback. So I finally did get the brakes fit-up and Dan from FFR confirmed that the Koni upgrades do have to be installed body down and that the clocking on the rear calipers mainly has to do with ease of plumbing lines and e-brake.
Attachment 66332
I was able to get the Pedal Box and Master Cylinders installed over the last two days. I know that my progress is probably a typical days work for many of you, but I have been just trying to get a little accomplished each night. I noticed tonight that the flange connection for the driveshaft seems to be just slightly off centered (toward the passenger side). I am running the four-link with the FFR stock rear control arms, so I am assuming that there is no good way to adjust...are there some critical measurements that I should be taking at this point? Anyway, on to the firewall and steering for later this week.
Pedal Box...Attachment 66594
Master Cylinders...Attachment 66595
I wanted to add a suggestion as to what to do after you grind off the weld splatter, or extra welding material. POR-15 does a very nice job, and blends very well with the black powdercoating. I have used it in multiple areas on my build, and you cannot tell where the touch up was done.
I looked through your thread, and didn't see this recommendation, so I wanted to add it in. If it was already suggested, I apologize.
Regards,
Steve
Thanks Steve, good suggestion. Luckily, I am only mocking up at this point and will tear down in a few weeks for chassis powder coating. I must say so far that I am glad I held off on the powder coating. Not that things have been too bad, but there are lots of laser tabs that were left on brackets welded onto the chassis that need to be cleaned up and really only a few places that I have had to grind, but they have all been in visible areas. Honestly, I think it has been a good exercise just assembling without the hesitation of having to worrying with paint. As I assemble and find areas that I think will be a little more challenging with paint I note those so I will be a little more cautious when I assemble the second time.Quote:
Originally Posted by WIS89
Spent this last weekend trying to bust through a few things. I was able to get the firewall mounted. I decided to go with 10-32 stainless button heads (64 to be exact). Everything is mounted temporarily for now, as in a few weeks I will be tearing it down for powder. I used a drill/tap combo and it made pretty quick work of it. I haven't decided if I am going to go back with chrome heads yet...I haven't found a good enough price on them as of yet. I was going to go ahead and mount the brake reservoirs as well, but I want to go with a two reservoir set-up (this came at the build-school recommendation), so I am going to order a second reservoir from FFR. I then moved onto the steering column & steering wheel. Then the steering rack & shafts. I personally think the plastic zip ties holding the boots on really set that piece off! My wife keeps asking me why so many things (boots, shock springs) are held together with zip ties...I haven't really came up with a good reply as of yet:confused:. I also had some issues with the steering shaft...apparently there is suppose to be a short set screw that you use on the u-joint near the firewall, I didn't get that, so I just purchased at the local hardware store (I'll check with FFR and see if they'll compensate me for that...jk). That double d rod coming through the firewall also ended up being about 1/2" long, so I ended up trimming it to fit. After getting the steering shaft in, I truly believe that most of the weight of this car is in the u-joints used to connect the rods! After that I jumped to the floor pans and after a lot of back and forth discussion with myself, I decided to go ahead and tap for the 10-32's there is as well. I know that in the end this is overkill and these will all be covered with sound deadner, carpet, etc., but after doing the firewall I had a pretty good system down, so I took the plunge. I used the rest of my button heads where I could and then just finished with rounded 10-32's. When I powder in a few weeks, I will remove the floors and leave some sacrificial screws in to protect the threads from blast media and paint. I hope to do some more layout on the aluminum panels later this week and then I think I am going to try to get going on the brake lines. I might mention that on the floor panels, I cut the front kick panel off and made it a separate piece. This actually came from build-school as well. It makes it much easier to get the floor panels in, but I guess some guys like to install the panel on the outside to give themselves a little more foot space. I am hoping I can seal it off and mount the control module for the steering assist in the little triangular area...we'll see. I will definitely have to extend all the wires though as they don't give you much.
Firewall...Attachment 66843
Steering Rack...Attachment 66844
Steering Column...Attachment 66845
Steering Shaft...Attachment 66846
Floor Panels...Attachment 66847
Kickpanel Cutaway...Attachment 66848
Starting to look like a car...Attachment 66849
Attachment 66850
OK, so honestly tell me, once you got the steering wheel and the seat set in there, did you set in it and make car sounds?
Tim
Just revisiting your earlier posts and noticed your bushings are split.. did they come like that? Mine are solid urethane, no lines like that, and only got delivered a few weeks after yours...Quote:
Originally Posted by JOP33
Hey Jamie
There is a place here in Houston that I got my SS 10-32 button allen head screws... 100 for $8. Coastal Fastener Company. Let me know if you want me to pick you up a couple hundred.
Also did you try to connect the emergency brake cable on the rear brakes ? My cable ends don't look like they are going to fit into the holes in the Wilwood brakes.
Brian
I believe those are just shallow grease channels. Mine had them on some bushings also.Quote:
Originally Posted by RoadRacer
I use Albany County fasteners for a lot of the custom button heads and went with 10-24 threads on anything that gets assembled/disassembled more than once. I couldn't find a pilot for the FFR supplied tool and bought a Pop Rivet brand kit that I like a lot better than the other tool supplied.
Have to be careful with stainless galling and fine thread aluminum inserts seem to cross thread easier, just my preference.
RR, With regards to the grease lines, that came as a suggestion from the instructors at the build school...it allows the grease to continue to flow out. You can just continue the runs from the inside with a hacksaw and just a couple of passes.Quote:
Originally Posted by RoadRacer
Tim, I did sit in the vehicle, but no car sounds....but I did slam on the brakes a couple of times!Quote:
Originally Posted by TDSapp
So last weekend was a complete failure with regards to running the brake lines. I had flare tooling issues (after issues), wasn't impressed with FFR options for running and went off on my own (not a good idea either) and just didn't not like working with the rhino lines that FFR provided...all of that being said, I chock most of the issues up to my experience routing and flaring brake line (uh, none to this point). Here are just a couple of things from a novice's perspective I wanted to mention (take it for what it's worth, again novice)...
1. IMHO, go ahead and purchase a coil of NiCopp line, a straightener and a "decent" flaring tool. The Rhino Lines supplied probably work great if you can stay in the realm of exactly where they are suppose to run, the NiCopp, cuts, bends & flares soooooo much easier.
2. Several of the less expensive flaring tools tell you to use the die adapter to set the height of the tube before forming...what I found is when I flushed the tube to that height, the pin got stuck in the tube and had to be pry'd out (in most cases damaging the flare). I was more successful with going just slightly shy of the full height.
3. Ultimately, I ended up bending small pieces for transitions in difficult to reach areas and then using unions on the straight pieces to attach.
4. I strayed from the suggested mounting locations a couple of times, only to later slap my hand on my head when I realized the reason FFR just didn't tell you to hang it in this "wide open" space (I forgot that the exhaust will also need to run through the rearend:mad:).
5. Finally, if you would like to make the perfect bent piece with perfect, beautiful, professional flares, 100% of the time (I guarantee), just don't put the fittings on before you flare the tube! Just kidding guys, I don't know how many times, I patted myself on the back after a flare just to look down and see that I had forgotten the fitting!
Anyway, here are the results of two weekends and this was just to dry fit...I will remove and re-install after powder, that's when the leaks will appear :(
Attachment 67546
Attachment 67547
Attachment 67548
Attachment 67549
Attachment 67550
Attachment 67551
JOP33,
In Pic #4 Looks like you routed your lines up and over like the original design. This is OK, but it will be susceptible to air bubbles. With the compact masters it is an advantage to run the lines low for bleeding the air out. Before you put the body on for the last time, get your brakes thoroughly bled out and leak checked. Maybe use a vacuum bleeder. Don't cycle your pedals much until you get some fluid in those cylinders. I think some of the builds are ruining the seals before they get the pedals set up and adjusted.
Looks like you conquered the flaring adventure. Congrats!
Eastwood's #25304 flaring tool is well worth the money.
Excellent build thread JOP33 !
Thanks MW...going to try to spend a little time today updating from the last month.Quote:
Originally Posted by Midwest 33 Build
Are the upper ball joints welded in place? If so, that should make powder coating interesting. The joints should have some grease in them already. I've got screw-in ball joints on my car and had no problem with them unscrewing. I bought the special ball joint socket, so I could properly torque them to 100 ft.-lbs.
So after completing the the fuel lines, I went ahead and drilled as many holes as I could for any of the aluminum that will be installed later. I know that the screws are overkill, but I did it anyway anywhere that the aluminum crossed a tube. Will be covered with heat/sound protection and carpet at some point...
Attachment 68223Attachment 68224Attachment 68225Attachment 68226
At this point I elected to go ahead and start the tear down for powder. I am certain that there are things I probably should have gone ahead and fit up, but I decided the rest I would do post powder...
Attachment 68227Attachment 68228
I labeled components I wanted to powder (some changed prior to going to the coaters)....
Attachment 68229
Tearing it down...
Attachment 68230Attachment 68231Attachment 68232
Where I work graciously offered to coat the chassis and components at a discounted price! They did an awesome job...
At the Coaters...Attachment 68233
Just Hanging Out...Attachment 68234
Powder Coating...Attachment 68235
Into the Oven...Attachment 68236
Powder Complet...Attachment 68237
And Finally Back Home!Attachment 68238
I was debating leaving the differential black but I fought it as long as I could. I didn't want to strip a brand new rear end down just to powder so I decided to paint it myself. When I bought the powder I also had the supplier give me (2) cans of touch-up aerosol as well as a gallon of single stage paint, so I thought it should match pretty well. The next thing I needed was a place to spray it...so I constructed a redneck paint booth out of PVC and plastic drop cloth. I used a fan and AC vent to suck out what overspray I could. You can see by the pics, I still had issues with it getting on the floor. Luckily it is coming up with thinner and elbow grease. I also went ahead and painted the Ford Racing diff cover I plan on switching out. The next step will be to start putting it back together...for good this time (hopefully).
Moser Rear End...
Attachment 68239
Redneck Paint Booth...
Attachment 68240Attachment 68241
Finished Product...Attachment 68242Attachment 68243
Probably won't be painting the car myself!
Thought there would be an issue too, but at the request of the coaters let all soak in a bucket of thinner for two days...will grease the heck out of them at install.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveS53
There has been a lot of prior comments about the trunk latch being a PITA to get adjusted properly both from the arc it swings through
and from the body flexing enough to hamper the snap action of the latch. Some builders have added a stiffener bar across the opening
and several have said to be sure and leave the trunk floor out until the trunk latch is working properly. Note that on a piece of tape and
stick it on the trunk floor panel when it comes back from the powder coaters and save yourself a 1/2 days work and frustration.
HTH
Dale