Budget Lightweight Wheels Thread

[bnr32jason]

On my search for 5x100 compatible lightweight wheels I ran across quite a few that are available in 818 friendly sizes and offsets. So I figured I would share a few, it would be nice if others would contribute as well. Please try to post as many specs as you can, especially weight.

5x100 wheels seem to be tough to come by in good sizes for us, so I hope this thread can help some people. Sometimes there are group buys for custom size/offset/PCD so you may be able to get other sizes as well.

We each have a different definition of "budget" but for the purpose of this thread I'm defining it as wheels around $300 each new. Of course if you are a savvy shopper or don't mind some scratches you can get higher priced used wheels for around the same money.

*Some weights may be inaccurate, some websites list different weights"

For reference, some stock Subaru wheel weights:

2002-05 WRX 16x6.5 = 16.5lbs
2006-07 WRX 17x7 = 23.5lbs




First off, the tried and true Enkei RPF1:
17x8 = 15.6lbs
17x9 = 16.0lbs
18x8 = 18.0lbs

http://www.oakos.com/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/RPF1SP.jpg





BuddyClub P1 Racing SF (probably good for a NA or stock power build)
18x7.5 +48 = 18.3lbs

http://s1.e-monsite.com/2009/01/27/04/11190244buddyclub-p1racing-sf-gunmetal-jpg.jpg


Kosei K1 TS
17x7 +50 = 14.6lbs
17x8 +45 = 15.5lbs

http://www.tirerack.com/images/wheels/kosei/swap/kosei_k1ts_s_ci3_l.jpg




Motegi Traklite

17x7 +42 = 14.5lbs
17x8 +45 = 15lbs

http://www.hubcap-tire-wheel.com/images/2009/wheels/Motegi-Traklite-Wheels-Rims.jpg




949 Racing 6ULR

Perhaps out of production? Only seem to be available used, not listed on 949 website anymore. Will research more.

http://www.mx5centre.com.au/images/17%20Tungsten.jpg






Now to the upper end of "affordable" ($350+ per wheel):

OZ Alleggerita

17x8 = 15.3lbs
18x7.5 = 16.2lbs
18x8 = 17.5lbs

http://www.tirerack.com/images/wheels/oz/swap/oz_allerghlt_anth_ci3_l.jpg







Will add more later

[philly15]

RPF1's FTW!! thats all ive ever run on my subarus i just traded a guy straight up my 17x8s for 17x9s a little FYI if you go to tire rack and search under the BRZ you can get the RPF1's in 17x9 in a +45 offset vs a +35 or whatever it comes up under most other sites which is cool a little closer to stock offset also i sent a private message to i believe OAKOS automotive while on NASIOC forums and they quoted me 850 for a set of RPF1s a while back maybe last summer i wonder if they are the same price? much better than 1200 on tire rack...

[bnr32jason]

RPF1's FTW!! thats all ive ever run on my subarus i just traded a guy straight up my 17x8s for 17x9s a little FYI if you go to tire rack and search under the BRZ you can get the RPF1's in 17x9 in a +45 offset vs a +35 or whatever it comes up under most other sites which is cool a little closer to stock offset also i sent a private message to i believe OAKOS automotive while on NASIOC forums and they quoted me 850 for a set of RPF1s a while back maybe last summer i wonder if they are the same price? much better than 1200 on tire rack...

I'm just going by what is shown on the Enkei wheel chart here: http://www.enkei.com/size_chart/RPF1.pdf I haven't been searching individual dealers. I didn't want to list different offsets as I think it goes beyond what is needed, but I can add them later.

[philly15]

Yea I know just wanted to give some input on the rpf1 from what I've seen if they are still that price at oakos automotive that's a darn good price for those instead of some crap like Rotas for the same price
Other wheels I know of that are nice:
-Mach v awesomes are 17x9 (I believe weigh 17.9 lbs) ill check that
-drag dr31 are 17x9 (I think are around 19-20 lbs)

Both are dual drilled for 5x100 and 5x114

[bnr32jason]

I actually put Drag DR-9's on my 92 Civic hatchback that's going to be my DD when I get back to the US. Decent wheels for cheap, but I'm not sure I would exactly call them lightweight. Unless we're talking about 19" wheels, I don't consider anything in the 20lbs range to be light, but to each his own. The Drag wheels are a little heavy though compared to the wheels that they emulate, so I'd put them in the same bucket as Rota to be honest. The DR-21 which is a copy of the RPF1 is 20lbs for the 17x7.5 where 17x8 RPF1's are 15.6lbs. Quite a big difference in unsprung weight.

According to the Drag website, the 17x9 DR31 is 22.35lbs. But the real thing (Work Emotion CR-Kai) is 19lbs in the same size. Granted the only way you are going to get those for less than $300 a wheel is from a friend in Japan or used.

[pwnoz]

Kosei K1-TS, good, cheap, light wheel

[bnr32jason]

Thanks, forgot about those, added them.

[Darkpiggy's dad]

I really like Alfa Romeo wheel styling, the ring of circles theme has been a part of Alfa's design pallet for decades. Their five bolt patterns, however, used to be metric. It would be great if they made something that miraculously fit the 818.

[Ravendas]

The O.Z. Alleggerita HLT are really light.
17x8 = 15.3 lbs
18x7.5 = 16.2lbs
18x8 = 17 lbs

[bnr32jason]

While the OZ Alleggerita HLT's are nice, I would say they are pushing the "budget" part of it, especially when you get into the 18's. The 18" sizes range from $400-440 per wheel, a comparable Enkei RP-F1 is $300 per wheel.

I'll add them to the list, but $1600-$1800 for 18" wheels alone is pushing the edge of "affordable." 17's range from $325-350 per wheel, which is more affordable however.

[longislandwrx]

yeah what's the price cutoff... only paying $450 ea for my gramlites. the 18x9.5 weighs 19.2 lbs.

I would say a budget wheel is under $300

17547

Motegi 16x7 Traklite MR2388678050 about $275 weighs about 12LBS I've seen them go for $600/set which is a steal.

[Turboguy]

$300 can get you some pretty fine wheels.


Considering a set of 4 $300 wheels will amount to 12% of the ENTIRE 818 kit price, I would think the definition of a "budget" wheel would be at or below $150 a wheel - with a $100 perhaps being even more realistic.


Guys have told me they scored high quality Halibrand replicas for far FAR less than $300/pc for their Cobras! And those are some pretty fine rims......

[bnr32jason]

But typically very cheap wheels are also typically quite heavy. Also with the 818 looking so good with bigger wheels, they are naturally going to be more expensive. For the wheels in the $100-150 range they typically weigh 22lbs or more for even a 17" wheel. Compared to something like the Enkei RP-F1 that's adding ~30lbs of rotational mass. The two most critical places to reduce weight are unsprung mass and rotational mass. Heavier wheels will significantly impact acceleration, handling, braking, and pretty much every other aspect of performance.

The idea with this thread is meeting a balance between price and performance. The wheels I got for my 818 run just over $1000 per wheel (granted I didn't even pay half that price) because they are forged and their name brand (Volk Racing CE28N). Mine in 18x9 weigh 16.5lbs compared to a wheel that is considered very lightweight as well, the RP-F1 which in that same size is just under 20lbs. So you can spend MUCH more than $300 per wheel if you are searching for ultra lightweight.

[metalmaker12]

These wheels came on my donor which was 2k with no motor, I made $1050 back selling the trunk with a sti wing, rear doors and some parts to KalStar. So my donor was like $950. I fixed some marks with tig, blasted the wheels and had them powder coated for $200. I then put a set of Hankook RS3 235/45r17 tires that cost $85 to mount and balance. I would say I did pretty go getting a low weight expensive wheel for a low cost and they look great and are what makes a subaru a subaru (Classic Sti wheel)
17550

[bnr32jason]

The picture is kinda small, what year STI are those from?

[mattster03]

Here's another good option, the 949 Racing 6ULR wheel. Extremely popular with the Miata and S2000 world. Also frequently used by WRX and Sti owners.

17X9 +48mm - 18.0lbs - $239 ea

http://www.good-win-racing.com/Mazda-Performance-Part/61-0604.html

(note the link is for 5x114.3mm, however 5x100 is available)

17551

[Xusia]

^Oooh! I like the look of that one. Do they make those in 18" as well (in 4x100)?

[philly15]

i posted about the mach v awesomes earlier here is the link $249 a wheel 17x9 +42 dual drilled for 5x100 and 114, 4 color options basically a remake of the 5zigen FNO1R-C weighs in at 17.8 lbs

http://www.fastwrx.com/mavawwh.html

[metalmaker12]

17556 17557 2004 5x100 Sti wheels

[mattster03]

^Oooh! I like the look of that one. Do they make those in 18" as well (in 4x100)?

Negative, and Negative.

[Ravendas]

Fair enough.
TRMotorsport C2 - 18x8, 19.2 lbs, $164
17559

Drag Wheels DR-38 18x8, 19.6 lbs, $160
17560

That's about the best I can find. Never heard of either company, so no clue if they're any good or not.

If you're willing to Ebay, these wheels (http://www.ebay.com/itm/TSW-NURBURGRING-WHEELS-18x8-5x100-ET45-MATTE-GUNMETAL-4-RIMS-/310497970970#vi-content) are ~$280 and weigh 18.6 lbs. Not sure if that's "affordable" :D

[longislandwrx]

i posted about the mach v awesomes earlier here is the link $249 a wheel 17x9 +42 dual drilled for 5x100 and 114, 4 color options basically a remake of the 5zigen FNO1R-C weighs in at 17.8 lbs

http://www.fastwrx.com/mavawwh.html

17561

and the Wicked Awesome for those looking for 18s they are 18x9.5 +42 19lbs and only $300ea

[RM1SepEx]

budget and lightweight shouldn't be used in the same sentance... ;-) budget = heavy
you want to keep the wheel/tire weight down go with a smaller diameter
don't forget that you need to figure on the wheel and tire weight, not just the wheel.
for a street vehicle we will have a hard time noticing the "extra" weight on such a small, high powered car.
for the track, every tiny amount matters, spend to your hearts content!
Larger diameter = stiffer, lower sidewalls and wheel damage on crappy roads. (almost ALL roads here in Maine!)
almost all combinations will give use about the same approx. 25 inch rolling diameter
www.discounttiredirect.com has some great discounts/rebates running right now...

[Silvertop]

budget and lightweight shouldn't be used in the same sentance... ;-) budget = heavy
you want to keep the wheel/tire weight down go with a smaller diameter
don't forget that you need to figure on the wheel and tire weight, not just the wheel.
for a street vehicle we will have a hard time noticing the "extra" weight on such a small, high powered car.
for the track, every tiny amount matters, spend to your hearts content!
Larger diameter = stiffer, lower sidewalls and wheel damage on crappy roads. (almost ALL roads here in Maine!)
almost all combinations will give use about the same approx. 25 inch rolling diameter
www.discounttiredirect.com has some great discounts/rebates running right now...

There's a lot of common sense infused into those bullet points!

Initially though, the comment about going with a smaller diameter wheel to keep weight down seemed counterintuitive to me, because the higher profile tire necessary would probably add more weight than the increased size of the wheel -- until I remembered that tire and wheel width would also almost certainly be increasing. So overall wheel/tire weights WILL increase.

If a particular application really requires the adhesion that monster wheel/tire combinations bring, go for it. But really aggressive setups that will be unusable on the street (at least at legal and/or prudent driving speeds) are ultimately likely to be heavier than the stock or near-stock sizes they replace. In that context, the stock 16" WRX wheels I will be using in conjunction with reasonable (for street use) tire sizes really does represent the "budget" rim and tire combination.

That doesn't negate any of the discussion on this thread. We just need to keep an eye on what our individual performance goals really are.:)

[RM1SepEx]

The larger dia/shorter sidewll tires are alsostiffer and built "heavier"

just make sure that if weight is of big concern in your application it is wheel and tire. I'm sure that some lighter rotors and other brake goodies will also be a good source of reducing weight. Someone also mentioned this on the weight thread but I'm guessing that those cast bearing carriers are a big opportunity.

I'm with Silvertop and will at least start with the stock 16s. 205 in front, 225 in the rear on stock rims. Based on the testing video thread all lighter wheel will do for me is make it easier to spin the rear tires!

Longer term... 7 inch wide 17s in the front, 8 wide 17s in the back with a bit more rubber. 16s don't have the rubber width options or rim width options that we reaaly need for best performance.

[shinn497]

Initially though, the comment about going with a smaller diameter wheel to keep weight down seemed counterintuitive to me, because the higher profile tire necessary would probably add more weight than the increased size of the wheel .

Rubber is less dense than aluminum. Therefore, even if the wheel is being replaced by sidewall, it will still be lighter. There is an argument that longer sidewalls are thicker, even if it is true, the weight increase would be negligible compared decreased wheel weight. The sidewalls don't hold up the weight of the car, the air pressure does. All the sidewalls must do is resist flex and hold said pressure in.

[RM1SepEx]

Check out tire weights at tirerack.com same width, larger dia tires tend to be heavier by 1-3 lbs. Larger diameter wheels are heavier as well... so you trade off less sidewall squirm for increased weight. With taller sidewalls you have more tire width allowance variation due to geometry... so with a wider tire on a larger rim you need a wider rim... again results in more weight. Coming from lower HP autocross vehicles wheel/tire weight makes a huge diff with a Miata or MR2

You get lighter wheels by increasing the material strength, wheel stresses also increase with the size. So forge the wheels to get big wheels light and you pay 300-400 and more per wheel.

When you decrease the tire's sidewall you effectively increase the spring rate of the car too. So you have a short, stiff sidewall and upon road "jolts" you get a stiffer ride and possible damage...

Race tracks have much better conditions for these larger wheels due to better surface conditions. But if you want the lightest rotational mass you decrease the wheel size to the minimum that clears the brakes.

Can we get 6UL in the desired sizes. they are light and reasonably priced.

[shinn497]

Checked and saw a maximum 2-3 pound difference between 15 and 19 inch for tires. This is comparable to a 2-3 pound difference between 17-18 inches for wheels.

[Xusia]

I'm with Silvertop and will at least start with the stock 16s. 205 in front, 225 in the rear on stock rims. Based on the testing video thread all lighter wheel will do for me is make it easier to spin the rear tires!

Based on the points raised in this discussion - which has been valuable; THANKS!!! - I think this is the route I'm going to go.

It's free (assuming the donor wheels can be used).
As a daily driver, I'm sure to encounter pot holes (roads here are not bad, per se, but there are certainly areas out in the country where I'd be driving that leave something to be desired!) and I don't want to contend with wheel damage (especially if paying $250+ each for wheels).
I've managed some very fine cornering in heavier vehicles on less rubber, so I'm pretty sure at the speeds I'll be traveling on the back roads I can manage with the stock wheel size limitations just fine.

[FFR-ADV]

How about Rota-D 18x9.5 22.6 lb for $249 each in Gold 5x100

For Setup like 818R

http://fastwrx.com/rotadforce.html

Cheers!

[Wayne Presley]

Race tracks have much better conditions for these larger wheels due to better surface conditions.

Ha, you've never driven at Sebring....I've seen daylight under the tires of cars next to me numerous times last time I was there.

[bnr32jason]

How about Rota-D 18x9.5 22.6 lb for $249 each in Gold 5x100

For Setup like 818R

http://fastwrx.com/rotadforce.html

Cheers!

The website says the 18x9.5" wheels are 24.75lbs. But either way, 22.6 or 24.75 is not what most would consider light. They look good, and they meet the budget, but they aren't light whatsoever.

[FFR-ADV]

The website says the 18x9.5" wheels are 24.75lbs. But either way, 22.6 or 24.75 is not what most would consider light. They look good, and they meet the budget, but they aren't light whatsoever.

Hi bnr32jason: The heavier version is 5x114 in +20 offset, the other 5x100 in +40 are 22.6 lb

http://fastwrx.com/rotadforce.html

"Currently available in matte black (main pic) and Hyper Black (inset) in all fitments. 18x9.5 +40 is also available in Gunmetal and Gold. 8.5" width weighs in at 22.6 pounds."

Both Size and Weight matter. Please also list wheels which can wear a 255R18 like the 818R. There is no question that the setup on the 818R (on Forgestars I Think) performed quite well (2nd fastest lap on track with a stock WRX motor even). Emulating the 818R staggered setup seems like it will maximize handling. I am leaning toward Federal 595-RS-R in the same sizes as the Hoosiers the 818R is wearing for an 818SR build. I am interested in lighter wheels that can also carry those tires.

My existing stock WRX wheels/tires will serve for early spring and late fall driving and are certainly less expensive and lighter, but will also likely look a little small (under-filled fenders) on the 818 and will not provide the grip of these larger tire/wheel combinations. Individual build goals will be different.

[bnr32jason]

Pretty much the answer to every lightweight wheel question when you don't have $3k+ to spend, is "Enkei RPF1"

255's would fit wonderfully on a 17x9 RPF1. A very good setup would be 17x7.5 fronts and 17x9 rear, the 17x9's weigh in at 15.8lbs. That setup would run you right at $1000 and be pretty much ideal for the track or street. If you want 18's in the RPF1 you will have to custom order to get 18x8.5 or 18x9 in 5x100. You could try the 18x9.5's but that may be pushing it a little. Perhaps get together a group buy? I'm sure quite a few 818 owners would love to jump in on it with you.

They really are great value for the money. My Volk CE28N's, priced at over $1000 per wheel brand new are only a few pounds lighter per wheel than the much cheaper RPF1's. I would have went with RPF1's had I not found a great deal on the wheels I got. They are probably the most widely used track wheels out there.

[wleehendrick]

Pretty much the answer to every lightweight wheel question when you don't have $3k+ to spend, is "Enkei RPF1"

255's would fit wonderfully on a 17x9 RPF1. A very good setup would be 17x7.5 fronts and 17x9 rear, the 17x9's weigh in at 15.8lbs. That setup would run you right at $1000 and be pretty much ideal for the track or street.

That's the staggered set-up I want, but the fitment chart of the RPF-1 shows that the widest they make in a 5x100 is 8", in either 17" or 18":

http://www.enkei.com/size_chart/RPF1.pdf

Any width over 8" is only available with a differnt (5x114) bolt pattern. :mad:


Perhaps get together a group buy? I'm sure quite a few 818 owners would love to jump in on it with you.

Absolutely! In fact, I'm hoping FFR does this with either the RPF-1 or the Forgestar F-14 and offers a staggered set-up as an option with the right bolt pattern and offsets for the 818.


My Volk CE28N's, priced at over $1000 per wheel brand new are only a few pounds lighter per wheel than the much cheaper RPF1's.

I have 19" x 8.5"/9.5" NISMO LM-GT4 (also made by Rays, like Volk) on my Z now. Even in that size, they're under 20lbs each, lighter than the rubber I wrap them in! I also got a great deal on them; I'd love some forged Rays rims for my 818, but won't be looking to spend $500+ per rim, and finding a staggered set-up in 5x100 will be tough. Hopefully more will be out now there's a 5x100 RWD platform with people looking for better running gear (BR-Z).

[apexanimal]

There's a group buy on nasioc right now for rpf1 in a 17x9.5 width...

The wheel I have my eye on currently is the rota Titan... 17x9 pretty light and affordable...

[Silvertop]

.......My existing stock WRX wheels/tires will serve for early spring and late fall driving and are certainly less expensive and lighter, but will also likely look a little small (under-filled fenders) on the 818 and will not provide the grip of these larger tire/wheel combinations. Individual build goals will be different.

I've been worrying a little about this comment, but then I did the math.

The way the wheels and tires fill up the wheel wells is really more about the difference in tire width than wheel width, modified by the difference in wheel offset. A 255 is 1.2 inches wider than a 225. Half of that goes inboard, which leaves you with .6". After adding back 1/2 inch (13mm), which is the difference between the 818R wheels' 40mm offset and the stock Subie 53mm offset, the net difference becomes 1.1 inches in how the stock wheels with 225's mounted to them will fill the wheel wells as compared to the prototype 818R. Given that the 818R's 255 rear tires actually seem to protrude slightly beyond the wheel wells, I think my stock rims will look just fine with the 225's on them. I'm thinking the front 205's will be OK too.

[bnr32jason]

Maybe I'm misunderstanding, but I think when he talks about filling the wheel wells he is talking about the diameter of the wheels. If I put 17's on my Civic hatchback, they would look huge, if I put 17's on a 818, they are going to look a little small. I'm concerned with weight and performance, but I'm also concerned with aesthetics so I'm going with 18" wheels all around.

[RM1SepEx]

The actual diameter of the tires isn't very different due to increased sidewall height. A civic is huge compared to an 818. I think that 17s will be a very good compromise for the 818 as wider rears will be avail. That being said I'll start with my existing rims and 205 x 16 in front and 225 x 16 in the rear. Long term 17 inch 6ULs, RFP1, and Kosei KI TS should allow 205-225 in the front with 245-255 in the rear. I'd love to see a 17 and 18 inch "set" avail from ForgeStar for the 818, just like the 18s for the GTM.

Remember the 818 is the size of a Miata where 16s and 17s are big wheels, 14s and 15s are "normal". I can understand liking the "style" of bigger wheels, however huge rims with elastic bands stretched across for traction (joking) are not really practical when you have potholes that can swallow a large house pet or a young wild turkey... :-) LOL That is a huge problem for street going cars here in the NE

Dan

[bnr32jason]

The 818 is not the size of a Miata, especially the wheel wells.

For reference, here are 18's on a newer generation Miata:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v157/Dlorah/2006MX-5LE-07.jpg

Then 18's on the 818:

http://stblogs.hotrod.com/files/2012/11/DSC_0180-623x414.jpg

Then 17's:
https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/893756_10151624509828140_1877789499_o.jpg

17's look good, but in my opinion they are just a little too small, 18's look perfect. You put 14's, 15's, or 16's on a 818 and they are going to look almost comically tiny.

We can fit very nice rubber on 18's on the 818, they won't need to be rubber bands. a 225/40 or 45 on the front and a 255/265 40/35 on the rear would look great.

Oh and when I was talking about a Civic I was talking about mine, the EG (92-95) Civic hatchback which will be a tiny little car next to a 818.

[shinn497]

For comparison sake, here is a picture of an 818 chassis next to a miata. I believe both are on 17s but I could be wrong.

17592

They look pretty similiar but I know the miata actually has a shorter wheelbase (by 4 inches). Pictures can mess with perspectives...don't trust them.

The comment about 14 inches on a miata is probably referring to the original na miata. IT was considerablye smaller (2100 pounds) vs the current 3rd gen (2500 pounds). Third gens have those wheel flares and larger wells. Here is a first gen miata for comparison. While looks are subjective, the stock wheels do perform wonderfly.

17593

I believe 18, 17, or 16 is a matter of preference. I will probably go 17X9. I don't like larger wheels and being lumped into the "herraflush" crowd. And I want the lower unsprung weight/rotational intertia. Would actually rather go 16, but they probably won't be available in a larger width.

[bnr32jason]

The "stance" or hellaflush fad doesn't really have much to do with big wheels it's all about width and offset. I think the picture of the track setup 818R might be what you are referring to, since there is a little bit of "poke" on the rear wheels since they are coming out a little beyond the fender. But the wide slicks on it compound the issue and make it appear they poke out even further. Run 255mm street tires on that 18x9 and it will look much more square to the fender.

I would say that Factory Five made the right choice by going with 17's on the front and 18's on the back. I've considered doing something similar, but only 17" size I can find for my wheels are 17x7.5 +50, and I don't want to have to run a huge spacer to get them near flush to the fender. For my wheels, the 18x8.5's on the front will weigh in at just under 16lbs where the 17x7.5's are 13.8lbs. So it's a substantial difference, but it's a street car, so I'll choose form over function in this case. Also adding a big enough spacer to get them anywhere near the edge of the fender would add at least a pound per wheel, probably more since they would likely have to be bolt on spacers, but even if they weren't, the extended lugs would add weight as well. So my 13.8lb wheels are now close to 15 or more just to get a decent looking offset.

[shinn497]

I'm wondering. Why 18's on in the rear? Aren't larger wheels about feel...which should only matter on the ones that do the steering (sidewall flex, slip angle, etc. etc. ). I could understand if the overall diameter was different, or if larger diameters were wider, but neither is true.

On a side note I do see this kind of setup more often than not in so-cal....

17595

To each his own i suppose.

[bnr32jason]

Kinda the same reason that GT cars run 18's or larger on the back in most cases. It's a really really long and complex answer that I'm not going to get into because it always end up being debated on the internet. Grassroots Motorsports did a test about a year ago and the results were that a larger wheel with a shorter sidewall handled better than a smaller wheel with a larger sidewall.

http://www.scienceofspeed.com/products/exterior_performance_products/NSX/TAITEC/JGTC_front_bumper/takata20000402.jpg

The JGTC NSX in the picture ran 19.5x14's in the back, but they only weigh 16.3lbs (I've got one as part of my motorsports collection).

[RM1SepEx]

My point is that the car is approximately the same size, NA and NB Miatas came with 14 & 15 inch wheels and weights are much closer to 2300 lbs vs 2100 but weight doesn't matter. A NC Miata looks just fine with stock 16 inch wheels and higher profile tires. It will also accelerate faster nwith 16s than 18s due to lower rotating weights. Miatas are very wheel weight sensitive.

Look at the photo with the 17s on the S and 18s on the R... the wheel diameters are virtually identical between 25 and 26 inches depending on wheel width tire type and size, profile etc...

We are talking styling opinions here... :-) 16s can fill in the wheel wells just fine with the correct fitment. As wheel size and tire sizes increase costs rise dramatically...

IMNSHO :-) 17s should be a "sweet spot" as you can get wider than 225 rears and run narrower front tires. 16s are too limited but will be used on many "budget minded" builds.

[bnr32jason]

Styling and aesthetics are of course very subjective. What looks good to one may not look good to another.

Even though the Miata and the 818 may be overall similar in size, the wheel wells appear to be quite a bit larger, so for aesthetic reasons we've got more wheel well to fill than on a Miata.

But there are handling advantages to running a larger wheel with a smaller/stiffer sidewall, that has been proven time and time again. So while acceleration may slightly suffer, handling will improve enough to offset the VERY minor loss in acceleration.

[Silvertop]

We are talking styling opinions here... :-) 16s can fill in the wheel wells just fine with the correct fitment. As wheel size and tire sizes increase costs rise dramatically...

IMNSHO :-) 17s should be a "sweet spot" as you can get wider than 225 rears and run narrower front tires. 16s are too limited but will be used on many "budget minded" builds.

I seem to be on precisely the same page as RM1SepEX. Overall wheel/tire height will or can be virtually identical regardless of wheel height if the correct profiles are chosen. And while it may be true that very low profiles perform better at the extremes, wheel diameter for me is largely a stylistic issue. I have never really liked the modern trend toward very tall wheels. Looks "funny" to me. I know, that's just me....... And if I do wind up going to a taller rim in order to make wider tires available, I'm quite sure I wouldn't go any bigger than 17's, front OR back. Different strokes. And to my eye, the 16's will look just fine.

[nucleus]

budget and lightweight shouldn't be used in the same sentance... ;-) budget = heavy
you want to keep the wheel/tire weight down go with a smaller diameter
don't forget that you need to figure on the wheel and tire weight, not just the wheel.
for a street vehicle we will have a hard time noticing the "extra" weight on such a small, high powered car.
for the track, every tiny amount matters, spend to your hearts content!
Larger diameter = stiffer, lower sidewalls and wheel damage on crappy roads. (almost ALL roads here in Maine!)
almost all combinations will give use about the same approx. 25 inch rolling diameter
www.discounttiredirect.com has some great discounts/rebates running right now...

I only disagree completely! Even just a few pounds of extra wheel weight will be noticeable on this lightweight car.

Also, the lightest wheels at the tirerack.com are also the cheapest! So, no, budget does not equal heavy! Hard to beat the Kosei wheels!

Nuke

[nucleus]

Something you guys don't seem to realize is that as you go to a larger wheel, the shorter sidewall actually reduces your acceleration numbers...

[bnr32jason]

I only disagree completely! Even just a few pounds of extra wheel weight will be noticeable on this lightweight car.

Also, the lightest wheels at the tirerack.com are also the cheapest! So, no, budget does not equal heavy! Hard to beat the Kosei wheels!

Nuke

The Kosei K1's are great wheels if you are on a low or medium budget. But there are significantly lighter wheels out there if you are willing to buy used or spend significantly more.


Something you guys don't seem to realize is that as you go to a larger wheel, the shorter sidewall actually reduces your acceleration numbers...

I fully realize the difference in acceleration from a stop, but the increase in handling capability is why people go with larger wheels and stiffer sidewalls.

But a well built tire will grip well enough in a straight line and have a stiff sidewall. You don't have to have a wrinkle-wall slick to get good acceleration numbers. I'd rather give up 0.5 seconds in my 0-60mph time while dropping a full second off my lap time.


But, anyways, the simple fact is, larger wheels with shorter/stiffer sidewalls are faster than smaller wheels with bigger sidewalls as far as track laptimes go. Grassroots Motorsports tested this twice, once last year some time and once probably 10 years ago in another issue. Now of course you can't go to extremes, so a 22" wheel with a 15 series sidewall is going to be crap, but when going from something like a 225/50/16 to a 225/40/18, as long as they are both lightweight wheels, despite the heavier weight of the 18, lap times will be better on the 18's in most cases.

[shinn497]

I wish I could read this article.

*EDIT: Found something similar where they got .1 seconds faster with a 1 inch increase*

I wish they had done it more scientifically with more telemetry and a control while only varying one factor at a time.

[RM1SepEx]

I only disagree completely! Even just a few pounds of extra wheel weight will be noticeable on this lightweight car.

Also, the lightest wheels at the tirerack.com are also the cheapest! So, no, budget does not equal heavy! Hard to beat the Kosei wheels!

Nuke

you need to remember that they had problems putting the power down with the 255 Hoosiers R6 on the 818R in the track video. That's with a rather ordinary tune. Most of us are making cars for the street and will have far less grip than the Hoosiers. Wheel weight isn't going to be a huge factor with this lightweight car in WRX configuration, lighter wheels, accelerate the rotating mass faster, spin em up easier... you have more than enough power. It will be more important with a normally aspirated config. As far as reducing unsprung weight... yes lighter wheels are better but except for the most demanding situations the stock setup should work just fine.

And there are tons of wheel cheaper than the Kosei... all quite a bit heavier tho

For racing, sure lower, stiffer sidewalls mean better cornering. It also means a rougher, more jarring ride. Taller tires will gear you a bit higher and they weigh more so acceleration may decrease a bit but if you can't put full power down is that really an issue?

[Highway Star]

The 818 is not the size of a Miata, especially the wheel wells.

Then 18's on the 818:

http://stblogs.hotrod.com/files/2012/11/DSC_0180-623x414.jpg

Then 17's:
https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/893756_10151624509828140_1877789499_o.jpg

17's look good, but in my opinion they are just a little too small, 18's look perfect. You put 14's, 15's, or 16's on a 818 and they are going to look almost comically tiny.

We can fit very nice rubber on 18's on the 818, they won't need to be rubber bands. a 225/40 or 45 on the front and a 255/265 40/35 on the rear would look great.

Oh and when I was talking about a Civic I was talking about mine, the EG (92-95) Civic hatchback which will be a tiny little car next to a 818.

The difference I see between the show 818 with 18" wheels and the street 818 with 17" wheels I attribute to the spokes. On the 18" they go to the outer edge of the rim. On the 17", they go to the inside of the rim, making them look even smaller. I'd go for the 18" style in a 17" size.

For the street, I'll give up a little in performance for more compliance and rim protection over the crappy roads.

[Samiam1017]

Something you guys don't seem to realize is that as you go to a larger wheel, the shorter sidewall actually reduces your acceleration numbers...

It's accually the overall tire diameter that effects this has nothing to do with shorter profile sidewalls. If you want to accelerate faster a smaller diameter tire size is what you need. If you want more mpg bigger overall tire. Keep in mind both effect speedometer readings.

[apexanimal]

He's talking about the fact that increased sidewall height lends to better straight line grip...

[bnr32jason]

He's talking about the fact that increased sidewall height lends to better straight line grip...

But typically that isn't true.

A stiffer sidewall is great for turning because the sidewall won't flex and roll over on itself under hard cornering. But the side effect is that for straight line acceleration the stiff sidewall doesn't allow the tire to flex down and get more rubber on the ground. Think about dedicated drag cars, they typically use tires with very tall and very soft sidewalls for added straight line traction.

[Samiam1017]

Found this while searching around for wheels. Shows what the differences between two setups will do. http://www.rimsntires.com/specs.jsp

[Xusia]

For the street, I'll give up a little in performance for more compliance and rim protection over the crappy roads.

You think as I do!

[bnr32jason]

Of course each town is different, but Seattle has some pretty nasty roads here and there, hell, Okinawa has some terrible roads too. My Civic Type R ran 245/40/18 and 225/40/18 and I never had a bent wheel or anything and that was hitting some nasty potholes and bumps. In the last ten years I don't think I've had a car with smaller than 17" wheels on it. I've never had a bent wheel or anything like that. But there's where using high quality, high strength wheels (such as name brand forged wheels) comes in handy, they are much less likely to bend than something like Rotas.

[tmoretta]

What is KalStar?

[Wayne Presley]

https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/893756_10151624509828140_1877789499_o.jpg

17's look good, but in my opinion they are just a little too small, 18's look perfect. You put 14's, 15's, or 16's on a 818 and they are going to look almost comically tiny.



Just look at how visually different wheels in the same size look. The R and S have the same size wheel....Just saying that the R wheel is black and still looks bigger than the silver S wheel.

[apexanimal]

But typically that isn't true.

A stiffer sidewall is great for turning because the sidewall won't flex and roll over on itself under hard cornering. But the side effect is that for straight line acceleration the stiff sidewall doesn't allow the tire to flex down and get more rubber on the ground. Think about dedicated drag cars, they typically use tires with very tall and very soft sidewalls for added straight line traction.

You just said what I did... No arguments here.

[Highway Star]

Just look at how visually different wheels in the same size look. The R and S have the same size wheel....Just saying that the R wheel is black and still looks bigger than the silver S wheel.
The R sitting lower probably adds to the effect as well.

[bnr32jason]

You just said what I did... No arguments here.

I read what you said the wrong way. :)

[nucleus]

He's talking about the fact that increased sidewall height lends to better straight line grip...
You got it

[Xusia]

What about the TSW Nurburgring? It's available in 17" & 18" 5x100. Weight around 18 pounds. Seems pretty decent...

[shinn497]

I was actually just looking at those. But how much do they cost?

[apexanimal]

900-1000

[Xusia]

In the neighborhood of $240-$250 each.

[wallace18]

I bought Nittio 225/40ZR18 NT05,s for $167 each and MB Boost wheels for $114 each. Discount tire. I thought this was a good buy for a street car. I may do some autoX but mostly just cruise the back roads and embarass some high dollar cars.

17934

[metalmaker12]

I like your style wallace, I am with you on the back road driving, can't wait. Hows the 33, I have not kept up

[bnr32jason]

I like the look of those MB Boost wheels, but the quoted weight direct from MB on the 18x7.5 is 27lbs! I know they were cheap, but that is HEAVY even for cheap wheels.

[Kalstar]

What about the TSW Nurburgring? It's available in 17" & 18" 5x100. Weight around 18 pounds. Seems pretty decent...

I like these.

18lbs

$850.00 for all 4 including the shipping. I have seen them for as low as 185.00 each plus shipping on other sites.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/17-inch-17x8-TSW-Nurburgring-bronze-wheels-rim-5x100-jetta-gti-impreza-tt-legacy-/300871216931?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item460d526f23&vxp=mtr

Look at the blue WRX

http://www.carid.com/images/tsw/info/tsw-gallery.html

[wallace18]

I like your style wallace, I am with you on the back road driving, can't wait. Hows the 33, I have not kept up The 33 is out for paint. I hope to have it done by August when my 818 is ready for pick up. After I build the 818 I will have to decide which one to keep and which one to sell.

[Kalstar]

Evo 6 Looks like a winner too at only 560.00 and only 18 lbs.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-ENKEI-EVO-6-SILVER-17-CUSTOM-WHEEL-SET-5x100-4-5-/130539340078?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item1e64c0412e&vxp=mtr

Great wheel guide

http://www.passatworld.com/forums/55-wheel-tire-forum/338361-ultimate-wheel-weight-guide.html

[Xusia]

That's a really good price you found on the Nurburgring wheels, but it pales to the price on the Evo 6 wheels! I'll have to look into those a bit more. Thanks! :)

[Wayne Presley]

Here's a great list of wheels
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7535