Carl's Mk 4 Roadster Build

[carlewms]

I continued the disassembly in preparations for painting. All that remains to do before I take the body off is:

1. Removal of the windshield;
2. Removal of the DS door;
3. Spot welding the DS SS Roll Bar third leg in the right position; and,
4. Remove the side pipes.

Removing the mocked up components was a lot faster than installing them ... duh! I have managed to organize all in boxes on one shelf to make them easy to find when doing the final assembly.

With the help of some HSRF I filled in some "mistakes" I made when expanding the holes for the ********** rubber grommets. I am not sure it was the right thing to do but I used some some of the material I cutout make the holes for the roll bar to back the repairs in one of the holes.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93569268879/medium/1509881089/enhance

Now I will re grind the hole to better match up with the grommet from **********.

Yesterday I reshaped the opening for the DS side pipes so there was more room between the inside of the pipes and the body ... the pipes and body were almost touching. Now both sides look the same subject to one last check when both side pipes are off.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93569268897/medium/1509881094/enhance

The PS brake cooling vent supplies air to the heater and cockpit. The FFR supplied Air Vent Mesh was formed around the ********** Front Air Duct and two self tapping screws used at the bottom and top of Duct to attach the mesh permanently.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93569268894/medium/1509881093/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93569268895/medium/1509881093/enhance

Between other work I managed to get more of the body sanded with 80 grit in preparation for SlickSand application.

The new air compressor ... and the associated tools is working just fine. I wish I had purchased one years ago.

[carlewms]

I finally found a local paint shop that can provide me the PPG Shop-Line of products. Based on SRobinsonX2 excellent thread on painting and discussions with the local shop this is what I have come up with:

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93576925847/small/1510075824/enhance

A couple of notes:

1. There are 5 levels of quality in the plus series (A-E) with A being the lowest and E being the highest (prices ranged from $357 to $919 per gal of base coat as an example ... B is the one I price out.

2. The dealer says that a separate sealer is made up of the 2K primer, reducer and hardener but I am not sure that I have that right. What do others use for sealer with this series?

3. Quantities ... seem to be a little high but the guy at the counter was not familiar with the FFR body sizes.

I knew there were a lot of different colors available under each of the families (white, blue ...) but I had no freakin idea how many.

Inputs are requested ... meaning I really need your help on making sure that I get this right because I really don't want to make an expensive mistake.

[carlewms]

I know ... it sounds fancy but I just wanted to put all in order so I could get feedback from the professionals and those that have gone before me ...

Thanks to SRobinson2x on the other forum, and Jeff x 2 (J. Miller and J. Kleiner) for their threads and inputs on this ...

Here is the process which includes the major steps I took to get the body work done so far:

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93583072997/medium/1510264270/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93583072982/medium/1510264270/enhance

I have not really kept accurate track of my time on the body work so that won't help others very much ... and I am slow as molasses anyway so the times probably would not make much sense anyway.

Thanks for any feedback ... any time any way!

The Olde Goat

[carlewms]

Here is the latest list of equipment and tools exclusive of the air compressor.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93583172701/medium/1510267362/enhance

This is really a list of the major stuff used since starting the body ...

Carl

[Yama-Bro]

Great lists!

[carlewms]

With the cold temperatures and my cold/flu I have not been able to actually get out do any work on the body of consequence ... so I spent time getting acquainted with the spray gun I chose to paint the car ... here goes

I am reviewing the 3M ACCUSPRAY Paint Spray Gun System and the 3M Paint Preparation System (PPS) from a rookie painter point of view ... in other words a first-time user trying to paint his first car! After consultation with Jx2 (Jeff Miller & Kliener) and some research on line I purchased the following items:

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93607089045/medium/1510877070/enhance

Today I put the gun end of the system together and have the following observations so far:

1. The instructions that come with the system are pretty sparse but there is plenty of additional information on You Tube and 3Ms website;

2. This is a "plastic" system ... although a hard plastic one. The gun itself is a composite with a metal needle, valves, hose fitting and pressure regulator/gage. The instructions and online material clearly warn the user NOT to soak the parts in solvent or clean with a gun washer;

3. Parts of this system are ?disposable? ... meaning that each time you use an atomizing head and the soft inner cup of the PPS, you could throw them away and install new ones instead of cleaning them. 3M does provide instructions to clean the atomizing heads for reuse;

4. The system is advertised and demonstrated in videos to apply everything from undercoating and high build primers to clear coats. The system has 2.0, 1.8, 1.4, 1.3 and 1.2 mm atomizing heads but the basic system only includes the one each of the later 4 ... so order more of each you want;

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93597902036/medium/1510623424/enhance

5. Unlike other guns, this one comes with just one needle valve common for all atomizing heads. The pressure regulator is called a flow control valve in this 3M world; and,

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93597902039/medium/1510623424/enhance

6. The system requires a minimum of 20 psig at the gun with air and paint flowing (or 30 psig without the paint flowing) and 13 scfm.

Assembly:

1. Air Supply to Gun: After assembly of the pressure regulator, air filter and hose quick disconnect, that assembly is connected to the bottom of the gun. 3M warns to use two wrenches on the fittings to prevent damage to the gun;

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93592663307/medium/1510514812/enhance

2. Atomizing Head to Gun: Connecting the atomizing head 5 Nov 12, 2017 to the gun is pretty straight forward but is also a pretty tight fit ... because it?s plastic you have to be a little careful in making sure it?s positioned properly on the needle with the sleeve fitted to recess in the gun AND the trigger pulled to move the needle back BEFORE snapping the head in place; and,

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93597902033/medium/1510623424/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93597902000/medium/1510623424/enhance

3. 3M PPS Cup to Atomizing Head: With the assembled cup on a flat surface, turn the gun upside down to fit the atomizing head to the cup making sure it?s fully seated and twisted 1/4 turn to lock everything in place. Flip it right side up and put it on a stand.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93604355632/medium/1510798536/enhance

[AC Bill]

Carl, just paint it..You can always put a wrap on it if it doesn't work out..:p

[j.miller]

Just noticed you have a cheater valve on the gun (not a fan) You will need to open it all the way and then adjust your pressure regulator at the compressor to give you the constant PSI at the gun. My best advice for anyone starting to spray is to find the settings that work AND DON'T TOUCH THE KNOBS ! You learn to work with a constant...as soon as you start turning knobs to correct a problem you loose your baseline and you will chase those problems all day long.

[Jeff Kleiner]

Just noticed you have a cheater valve on the gun (not a fan) You will need to open it all the way and then adjust your pressure regulator at the compressor to give you the constant PSI at the gun. My best advice for anyone starting to spray is to find the settings that work AND DON'T TOUCH THE KNOBS ! You learn to work with a constant...as soon as you start turning knobs to correct a problem you loose your baseline and you will chase those problems all day long.

I'm with my friend there! Read pressure at the gun but adjust it at the main regulator. Kind of in keeping with the repeatability and constants that Professor Miller speaks of is my own preference for a digital gauge at the gun. To me it's much easier to always get back to the same setting when I can see something like "22.0" digitally rather than trying to split a 5 PSI scale on the low end of a 100 pound analog. Here's one that turned up on a quick Google but there are lots of options if you shop around:

https://www.amazon.com/OEMTOOLS-25862-Digital-Air-Regulator/dp/B008985UDC/ref=pd_cp_60_4?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=NY79C2KB60VXMPPN9WVR

Yeah, I know, more money...

Jeff

[carlewms]

Al ... that will happen here within the week if I can get back in the garage
Jeff ... Got it.

Do you consult with 3M??? There instructions are identical to yours. The only talk about adjusting that knob unless you want to change the fan and each time you do mess with it you need to reset the pressure to 20 psig at the gun with full flow (air and paint) or 30 psig (air only).

In the end I guess whether it is 20 psig or 22 psig or whatever ... it needs to stay constant. Thanks for helping me out.

Carl

T

[carlewms]

As Jeff suggested below ... I went ahead and used spraying of the Slick Sand to get in some practice with the 3M ACCUSPRAY Paint Gun System.

I have to admit that I futzed around Saturday and the early part of Sunday getting ready ... not so much physically but mentally ... it was like I had "painter's block". Well I finally took the leap yesterday afternoon and here are the results.

As part of my futzing ...I spent a large part of Saturday evening watching videos on spraying Slick Sand and reading posts on its application on a fiberglass bodied car. Some of the additional insights I picked up:

1. Don’t reduce more than 10% and don’t do it until the last coat although there sure is a lot of views about thinning this sprayable filler;
2. Make sure the SS is thoroughly mixed ... the solids will settle in the bottom of the can;
3. Reducer with acetone or reducer but the later is better;
4. Filter the primer **before** adding hardener: don’t waste pot life time filtering;
5. Have everything ready to spray (meaning panel preparations, equipment, etc.) **before** adding hardener;
7. Remove the cup strainer; and,
8. Do not let the primer kick in the gun ... virtually impossible to clean after it does (most said no more than 30 minutes in the gun).

Painting Conditions

Temperature: 71 to 77 deg F
Humidity: 24%
Coats Applied: 3 at least
Thinning: Approximately 5% on final coat

Gun Settings
Fan Setting : 1 Turn
Flow Settings: 3 is the baseline
1st Coat - 4
2nd Coat - 3.5
3rd Coat - 3
Stage One Pressure: 35 psig
Stage Two Pressure: 20 psig
Gun Cup Filter: 200 micron filter removed

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93617936065/medium/1511181379/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93617936119/medium/1511181384/enhance

The panels were both cleaned off with compressed air and then wiped down with Eastwood’s Pre Paint Prep. For this “practice” I settled on bottom of the hood and the top of the trunk.

I also “settled” on a whole lot of orange peel mostly on the trunk top. So I need input on what I am doing wrong.

Trunk Lid After Final Application but Before Sanding

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93617936124/medium/1511181384/enhance

Trunk Lid After Partial Sanding with 180 Grit.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93617936201/medium/1511181391/enhance

Here are some of the things I “think” I did wrong:

1. I didn’t always keep the vertical fan perpendicular to the surface;
2. I didn’t get close enough to the surface;
3. One the first pass I increased the flow from 3 to 4 turns ... maybe I was trying to put too much paint down; and,
4. I lost discipline layering more coats at the same time making kickoff of the covered layer harder.Some areas had little or no orange peel ... the rib line belowThis stuff also reveals flaws I missed with Rage Gold ... which is a good thing.

Pinholes

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93617935978/medium/1511181371/enhance

Bigger Holes (not the big round one below) After letting it cure for at least the minimum 2 hours i started blocking out some areas to seem how hard it was going to be to remove the orange peel.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93617935948/medium/1511181369/enhance

Less Orange Peel ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93617936031/medium/1511181375/enhance

Any and all feedback ... even humorous feedback ... is of course completely welcomed. The learning curve is steep for me and I need all the help I can get!

Impressions from using the 3M ACCUSPRAY Spray Gun System in another post ...

[Jeff Kleiner]

Looking at that trunk lid close up it shows a dry spray. I'd say you need to go up with your air pressure (I shoot SS through a 2.2 at 35-37), get closer to your panel, work on staying perpendicular and maintaining a speed that gets good coverage along with a nice wet edge. Let's see if Miller concurs...

Jeff

[carlewms]

Jeff,

Thanks for the feedback. I went out and inspected areas where I knew I had the gun a lot closer to the surface ... and by Jove ... I think you nailed it.

I have spent time sanding to 150 grit today and have managed to get most of the orange cleaned up. It wasn’t has hard as I thought it might be but it sure is easier when there is less OP! I am amazed how smooth it gets ... ��

Clearly ... I need a boatload of practice ... so my next challenge will be to flip the parts over and try again with the SS.

[carlewms]

Last night I put up some poster paper and practiced with the following settings:

Slick Sand: 8.4 oz.
Acetone: 1.2 oz. (about 15%)
Catalyst: 1/4 tube

Gun Settings
Fan Setting : 1/2 Turn
Flow Settings: 3 Turns
Stage One Pressure: 38psig
Stage Two Pressure: 24 psig
Gun Cup Filter: 200 micron filter removed

Fan: ~ 5-6 inches from 6 inches from the surface. I also slowed way down which did create one run ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93623852316/medium/1511315793/enhance

It was a whole different and positive outcome ...almost no OP on the practice so I jumped on the outside of my PS door to see if I could reproduce it on fiberglass.

I will check out the link ... and I really appreciate your detailed feedback.

Here are the photos ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93623852363/medium/1511315795/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93623852478/medium/1511315798/enhance

I don't know if i got too close or slowed down too much but in any case it left this run ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93623852535/medium/1511315800/enhance

With some 150 grit paper it cleaned up rather quickly ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93623852613/medium/1511315801/enhance

Today I sanded it to 150 grit and it was much quicker than the hours I spent fixing the OP on the trunk lid and hood.

Thanks again ... keep the feedback coming.

Carl

[carlewms]

Here is a short video of the results through last evening ...


https://youtu.be/uGPYn166CtM

On the hood top I applied some guide coat to check for low spots ... and found some on the hood top. I did not use guide coat on the door but I found that there is enough difference between the sanded and un sanded SS to see the low spots. While the surface can seem to be perfectly smooth it is not necessarily flat ...

Here is one example of a low spot on the hood ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93628616407/medium/1511469164/enhance

Although a bit difficult to see these low spots continued down the side edges of the hood ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93628616492/medium/1511469169/enhance

On the door ... where I did not use guide coat ... the darker areas are the low spots.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93628616498/medium/1511469169/enhance

On the inside of the trunk lid ... well I think I really did not get enough SS on the vertical sections of the ribs and the edges of the lid.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93629993370/medium/1511527860/enhance

Only one pinhole so far ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93628616395/medium/1511469164/enhance

All has been sanded to 150 grit ... so here are my questions:

1. Since I know that i have low spots ... do I respray SS the low areas now and then resand through 150 grit to eliminate the low spots before moving forward with the 180 grit?

2. Do I have to have all the gelcoat, Rage or glazing putty covered with SS or can the 2K Urethane serve that purpose?

Thanks in advance for your help ...

Carl

[carlewms]

Before proceeding further with application of SS to the doors some repairs had to be completed ...

Passenger Side Door: On my first attempt at mounting the door on the paint fixture, I dropped it on the floor. This caused a crack in the jamb about parallel with the top row of hinge studs.

Last week I completed the structural repair of the crack by first opening up the hole and beveling out the fiberglass surrounding the hole with 80 grit grinding wheel. Using vinyl ester resin 3 layers of mat was applied to the hole. Today I finished the repair with Rage Gold.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93637040540/medium/1511663829/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93637040473/medium/1511663828/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93637040471/medium/1511663827/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93637040480/medium/1511663827/enhance

[carlewms]

About two months ago ... or more ... after getting gaps at the back of the door completed I faired off the HSRF into the side of the door jamb. I don?t know if I made this repair before or after learning that HSRF will not adhere to gelcoat. In any case while cleaning up the HSRF it popped off the gelcoat (the compressed air lifted it off as well); I ended up removing a bunch of the gelcoat to get down to some solid substrate 😡.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93637040469/medium/1511663827/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93637040535/medium/1511663829/enhance

I also filled in some more pinholes/voids on other parts of the door as well ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93637543474/medium/1511671246/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93637548826/medium/1511671364/enhance

So the work tomorrow will be to finish up the Rage sanding and then shoot 3 coats of SS on the inside of the doors and the outside of the DS door. After inputs from various forum posts, I decided that I will spot spray SS on the inside of the trunk lid, hood top, PS door exterior. Monday will be a sanding day!

Thoughts/suggestions/warnings are always welcome.

[carlewms]

Some lessons learned from this round of spraying Slick Sand:

1. Practice and check your spray pattern. Before applying it where it matters test somewhere it doesn't. I noticed the pattern looked wonky ... it turned out that when I put the new atomizing Head on I had the cap midway between the vertical and horizontal position;

2. Spray the hard to get to spots first. As DanEC pointed out spray the ribs and other edges first and then the remainder of the surface to make sure you get good coverage;

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93671592160/medium/1512385427/enhance

3. Make sure to have plenty of room to hold the gun properly over the surface. I had a few tiger stripes, some OP and a large ?blob? of paint on the hood and sone dusting on the trunk lid. This was caused by me being inconsistent in both distance, speed and angles of the gun to the surface. and distracted by the hose and my *** hitting the table behind me. Here is one result:

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93671592092/medium/1512385418/enhance

4. SS shows off a whole lot of previous body work sins ... especially after just one or two coats ... pinholes, gouges and dings;

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93671592079/medium/1512385417/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93671592070/medium/1512385416/enhance

5. Just as in the case of the Rage Gold knocking down my hood blob before it cured too much made it easier to sand later;

6 As suggested by others using an artist?s brush I applied a little of the SS from the last spraying to all the pinholes and voids ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93671592115/medium/1512385421/enhance

The shiny reflective spots are the ones where the pinholes were filled in ... next time I will be more careful so I can have less sanding;

7. Respirator Storage. When not in use I sealed up the respirator in a plastic food storage bag ... to keep the sanding dust off and to extend the life of the filter media (supposedly if continued exposure to the fumes will shorten the life of the media);

8. Cleaning Sandpaper. The life of the sandpaper can be extended by using compressed air to remove the dust and other stuff; and,

9. When in proper tune ... interaction between the spray and sandpaper "speak" to you. I found when I got the spray gun the right distance and speed along the surface ... the sound of the spray hitting the surface changed. The sound of the sandpaper when it has done its job changed; if you then hit an unsanded spot changed. Off course this could be that my respirator has failed.

Carl

[carlewms]

Over the last few days I have spent most of the time creating dust from the SS applied to the two doors. I have already swept a pile of the stuff into the trash can.

After applying the last of three coats of Slick Sand to the doors ... it was time to get them sanded down to 180 grit. On the door exteriors, I used a guide coat when I sanded from 120 to 180 grit.

With more practice, applying the SS has gotten better ... near zero orange peel and or dry "dust" on these surfaces.

Here are a few photos of the progress on the doors ...

Passenger Side Door

On the painting fixture ..

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93671592192/medium/1512385430/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93671592194/medium/1512385431/enhance

I have found it easier to sand the doors by removing them to a table top.

After sanding to 180 grit. This door had a lot less Rage on it than the DS door; there was one area where the gelcoat was exposed after sanding but it is flat. My understanding is that, since it is flat, I can cover this area with 2K Urethane Primer before sealing and painting.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93678001996/medium/1512509603/enhance

Driver Side Door. The DS door was a different story ... as expected. When I originally fitted it to the frame and body it required a lot more HSRF/Rage Gold to get matched up to the body.


On the painting fixture ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93671592183/medium/1512385429/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93671592200/medium/1512385431/enhance

After sanding to 180 grit.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93678001997/medium/1512509603/enhance

This door has several spots that either went through to the Rage or Gelcoat.

My admiration for the folks that do this for a living is going up exponentially each day...

Carl

[carlewms]

First ... why Ultra? I am running low on my third can of Rage Gold and had a can of Ultra so I decided to use it on the final skim coats before Slick Sand.

Second ... the interior of the trunk lid has been SS and sanded to 180 grit. It is flat but some gelcoat remains visible but I will cover that with the 2K Urethane Primer. I have something special planned for the interior of the lid so I don't need to go further with any SS.

The exterior of the trunk lid was another issue ... I spent about 3-4 hours getting the exterior ready for another round of SS.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93683975326/medium/1512660224/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93683975325/medium/1512660224/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93683975335/medium/1512660224/enhance

Lessons Learned:

1. I need to practice spraying horizontal surfaces more before getting to base coat and clear;
2. Use a guide coat anywhere that an absolutely flat surface is required ... it is easy to use and reveals all the low spots;
3. The Rage Ultra produces a finer dust than Rage Gold ... almost like a talcum powder ... so I blew off the surfaces of the hood and cleaned the sand paper often; and,
4. There are very few flat surfaces, but lots of compound curves, on these cars ... so I use the largest blocks but sand with a light touch.

Next ... another 3 coats on the areas re engaged with Rage!

[Jeff Kleiner]

... I am running low on my third can of Rage Gold...

Three buckets of mud? Whooee! That's a lot of dust---but you probably realize that by now ;)

Carry on!

Jeff

[carlewms]

Three buckets of mud? Whooee! That's a lot of dust---but you probably realize that by now ;)

Carry on!

Jeff

Darn ... I cannot count ... it should be two cans of Rage Gold ... I have just enough in the bottom of one can for some items on the body!

I will say that between the Rage Gold, Ultra and Slick Sand it looks like a dust storm it the garage and my utility room. It gets into places I cannot mention ... but da Bat might :rolleyes:

[carlewms]

After finishing the hood, doors and trunk lid ... time to focus on the body. With my newly developed sensitivity to finding irregularities in the body after SS, I checked the parting lines on the body ... and I found some areas that needed some more attention.

This time I used Rage Ultra and the largest spreaders I had on hand to sort of skim coat the parting lines. The basic steps were:

1. Clean the area with Eastwood?s Pre Paint Prep and lint free blue shop paper towels;
2. Apply Rage Ultra (RU) with a large yellow spreader that I could shape around the curve of the fender and a large stainless steel spreader to get the smoothest results possible ... at least in some cases;
3. Before the RU fully set:
- Use the metal spreader to scrape off the excess around the edges and any high spots or ?droppings? on the gelcoat;
- 80 grit on blocks used to further smooth out the ridges; and,
4. After fully curing 80 grit was used to get to the final shape.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93708128257/medium/1513180315/enhance

After all this sanding or shaping ... one of the things I found myself constantly having to check or realize is that what may look smooth visually can be deceiving.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93708128246/medium/1513180314/enhance

To get the "truly" smooth transition you need to sand the RU to the point it blends evenly with the gelcoat as illustrated on the right side above.

I spent almost all my time over the last 2 days working the lines on the body ... tops of the fenders and the line in front of the hood opening, and those from the trunk edge going down the quarter panels just in front of the tail lights.

The front is ready for SS ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93709694213/medium/1513213598/enhance

Parting line across the body forward of the hood opening.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93709805495/medium/1513215751/enhance

Lots of dust created ... DS Rear Fender

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93709694185/medium/1513213597/enhance

PS Rear Fender

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93709694188/medium/1513213597/enhance

Starting to look pretty "shapely" ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93709693840/medium/1513213588/enhance

With the Rage Ultra ... less than 5 pin holes to fix on the body so far.

I should be able to wrap up the RU shaping tomorrow and then get the body off ...

Although the RU loads up quickly on the sand paper ... you can blow it off with compressed air.


DS looking forward ...

[carlewms]

Folks,

Thanks for the encouraging words ... it keeps me in the garage even when it’s full of dust and pieces of used sandpaper.

After a few more applications of Rage Ultra and the creation of more dust ... the fenders are ready for SlickSand. The ultimate test was “feeling up” the entire set of fenders and across the front of the car. I also used a profile gauge to compare the fenders at selected spots and they were comparable (remembering that the body is not perfectly symmetrical anyway).

Here are some photos sighting down the fenders on each side of the car. Unless you all see something I have missed I plan on getting the body on the buck before heading off for the holidays.

Passneger Side

Looking to the rear of the car

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93721066714/medium/1513534851/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93721068428/medium/1513534852/enhance

Looking to the front of the car

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93721067977/medium/1513534838/enhance

Driver Side

Looking to the rear of the car

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93721073676/medium/1513534843/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93721073641/medium/1513534842/enhance

Sorry about the shadows

Looking to the front of the car

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93721067015/medium/1513534840/enhance

My plan is to get the DS roll bar tack welded in the next few days so that I can remove the body and flip it over on its back to:

1. Apply some time of undercoating bed liner to the areas susceptible to rock damage;
2. Reinforce the narrow areas around the rear door jambs (basically put some mat and cloth on the back side of the area;
3. Glaze in all the lips of the wheel wells or fenders;
4. Mount 1/4"-20 studs to support the cables to the lights; and,
5. Fix a self induced cracks in the fiberglass.

Carl

[AC Bill]

Your shaping looks great, Carl. Nice curves like a Playboy Bunny has..;)

So how do get the roll bar off, if you tack the third leg to the hoop beforehand?
As you lift it up as a unit, the third leg will contact the body before you can get the hoop legs fully out. Least that would have been the case with my MK 3.1..Perhaps with the MK4 it is possible..

[carlewms]

Bill,

Regarding the roll bar the third leg actually fits on to another section of tubing that then fits on the stub on the frame. When mounted the end pf the third leg is just below the body. The other two legs have a similar setup but are a little farther into the body.

According to the Breeze instructions there should be enough room to get the third leg off and then pull the front two legs off the mounts.

Off course in practice it may be different ...

I will let you know.

Carl

[carlewms]

After visiting family and friends for the Holidays and a visit by Mr. Flu .... I think I can get back to work.

I have the beast on its back working on the edges for the fenders ... and my question relates to the lower forward end of the fender edge.

Edge View

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93753521116/medium/1514688169/enhance

Inside View

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93753521523/medium/1514688185/enhance

Should I trim off the tab and fill in with Rage or leave it and fill in up to the tab with Rage?

[carlewms]

Here are some better photos ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93754974850/medium/1514749910/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93754974672/medium/1514749905/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93754974487/medium/1514749899/enhance

[edwardb]

I trim that mostly off. Not the best view, but you can see that area in this pic from my Anniversary build:

http://i867.photobucket.com/albums/ab234/edwardb123/Factory%20Five%2020th%20Anniversary%20Mark%204%20R oadster/Body/IMG_0552_zpsnkdzvn2x.jpg (http://s867.photobucket.com/user/edwardb123/media/Factory%20Five%2020th%20Anniversary%20Mark%204%20R oadster/Body/IMG_0552_zpsnkdzvn2x.jpg.html)

[Jeff Kleiner]

I trim them something like this eliminating the wide "triangle" and following the outer edge until it curves inward then widening the radius a bit.

http://www.ffcars.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=313777&d=1514760662

The idea to me is to make the edges appear to roll in more like the original aluminum skin.

Jeff

[carlewms]

Paul and Jeff,

Thanks for your responses ... I have trimmed the PS down and will get it smoothed out with Rage before tackling the PS. It sure makes it look better to have that "extension" out of the way.

Carl

[carlewms]

It started like this ....

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93754974487/medium/1514749899/enhance

Work in Progress ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93775437008/medium/1515520389/enhance

Finished ... I think Let me know what else I need to do if I missed something here please

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93775437090/medium/1515520391/enhance

Carl

[carlewms]

Before taking the body off we first made sure that the parts were all in the right spots ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93775055731/medium/1515498531/enhance

My friend Craig came over before the holidays and TIG welded a three spots on the Breeze Stainless Steel Roll Bars ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93775055742/medium/1515498533/enhance

Two of the spots are seen here and the third is on the front of the roll bar. The markers around the tubes are the approximate locations where the tubes exit the body when it it installed.

After getting the roll bar back fully welded by JB Custom Welding (they had fantastic service ... took them in the morning and they had them ready in the early afternoon); the distance between the two front legs needed some adjustment by about .5 inches.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93773084129/medium/1515384844/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93775055741/medium/1515498533/enhance

After a few more minor adjustments ... like polishing the tube extending from the frame to the rear leg ... the fit came out pretty good.

Front or Hoop Legs to Frame:

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93775055753/medium/1515498534/enhance

Rear Leg to Frame:

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93775055720/medium/1515498530/enhance

My questions for the group ...

1. Drilling the SS will be tough as I understand it; what tips/tricks can you recommend?

2. What type of drill bits do you recommend for SS?

3. Is there a better way than through bolts to attach the leg components? Some have actually tapped and threaded the inside tube wall in two locations and then used at screws to fix the location of the tubes vertically.

Thanks in advance for your thoughts.

[boat737]

Probably overkill (OCD), but for the third leg near where the body hole is, it is a bit tight for a through bolt. So I took two coupling nuts (3/8 - 16 if I remember right), put a small 1/4" or 3/8" square bar stock spacer between them, and welded them all together. Drilled two matching holes in both the upper and mid third leg, ground down the edges of the coupling nuts to fit in the third leg mid tube, then welded the coupling bolt assembly in the end of the mid leg (just inside the end of the mid tube). This way there is no bolt near or showing at that body hole. For the frame mounts, I just did a 5/16 " thru bolt.

[carlewms]

Boat,

Thanks for the idea ... it sure looks clean and strong enough. I have about exactly the same amount of room to install some type of retaining device.

I assume you used SS hardware for all the fittings???

Carl

[boat737]

Boat,

Thanks for the idea ... it sure looks clean and strong enough. I have about exactly the same amount of room to install some type of retaining device.

I assume you used SS hardware for all the fittings???

Carl

I did use SS hardware. The funny thing is though, those mid legs on the Breeze roll bar may not be SS. A magnet sticks to them. Doesn't mean that they aren't stainless, but there does seem to be some ferrous material in them. I didn't notice that until after I had MIG welded my little assemble in the tube. It welded in fine though, so who knows. I'm not that experienced in welding different metals, but I didn't notice any problem.

One more tip. Use anti seize with the stainless bolts in the stainless coupling nuts. It's amazing how those suckers want to gall and ruin a perfectly good project. I use that messy grey stuff that seems to get all over my hands, clothes, and work bench. Any lube or PTFE will help though.

[CraigS]

Just in case that roll bar is ever needed for it's intended purpose, I'd use through bolts. The bolts would be loaded in shear and the short bolts would be taking that load right at their weakest spot-the threads. I would use a 3/8 G5 standard bolt that is sized so that it is solid all the way through the outer tube. Probably need a few extra washers under a nyloc nut. And it wouldn't hurt to cut off maybe half of the threads. You don't see them so appearance isn't an issue.

[Straversi]

I like the floor jack/tubing bender. I read the post but didn't notice the photo. I was wondering how you corrected the bend. Great idea.
-Steve

[carlewms]

Craig and Boat ... thanks for the recommendations.

It looks like I might have enough room for a through bolt if I came perpendicular or from the side of the rear leg. The marker is approximately where the tube emerges from the body.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93779366482/medium/1515768042/enhance

It will probably be easier to drill it off the car ...

Thanks,

Carl

[boat737]

Just in case that roll bar is ever needed for it's intended purpose, I'd use through bolts. The bolts would be loaded in shear and the short bolts would be taking that load right at their weakest spot-the threads. I would use a 3/8 G5 standard bolt that is sized so that it is solid all the way through the outer tube. Probably need a few extra washers under a nyloc nut. And it wouldn't hurt to cut off maybe half of the threads. You don't see them so appearance isn't an issue.

Interesting point. I will swap out my two bolts for one's with a small shoulder, i.e., a partially threaded shank.

More food for thought: With just a thru-bolt, there is no friction between the inner and outer tubes. So a compression of the roll bar tubes will only be prevented by the thru-bolt in shear, (unless the thru-bolt is tightened to the extent that the outer tube is deformed and collapsed onto the inner tube providing a friction fit. as opposed to a slip fit.) That would have the undesired effect of making the roll bar nearly impossible to disassemble and remove from the car.

However, my two bolts (still in shear) will be fastening the inner tube to the outer tube without deforming either tube. The bolts are still providing the same amount of shear force, but the assembly has the additional friction of the two tubes being fastened together. I'm bettin' that mine is at least as strong as just a through bolt. Could be wrong though.

[carlewms]

Craig and Bolt,

After further research .... here is the route I believe works best for me in terms of ease (I am not a proficient welder) and strength.

There is enough room to install a 7/16" diameter bolt in the rear leg just below the body. I found the following McMaster Carr Grade 8 bolts that I believe will work.

I need 3" to get a clear 1.5" of shank for the tubes that connect to the frame stubs.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93783274493/medium/1515901986/enhance

3 1/4" are needed for the roll bar to transition tube.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93783274487/medium/1515901986/enhance

Depending on tolerances I may have to put some extra washers and will probably have to cut off some of the threads to get the one for the outboard leg to fit.

What do you all think?

Carl

[boat737]

Hi Carl. For the lower tubes into the frame studs, 7/16 may be overkill. If they are like mine, the tubes are bottomed out to the mounting stub base, so they're not going to collapse any further, even with no bolt. I would think 5/16 or 3/8 inch max at those three spots, especially Grade-8 (those are pretty strong bolts). As for the third leg below the body line, your choice. I'm still thinking 7/16 may be a bit much though. JMHO

[carlewms]

Boat,

Thanks ... being an old ... well very old engineer (that has not done this type of analysis in ages), I decided to look into the materials and physics of it all. First I did not do any dynamic load analysis; I just looked at the shear strength of the different components. Here is what I found:

1. 304 Stainless Steel has compressive strengths ranging from 29,733 to 44,962 psi (azom.com);
2. The shear strength of the Grade 8 and Grade 5 bolts is summarized in the following table:

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93784669943/small/1515964903/enhance

3. Here is a graph of the same data:

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93784669941/medium/1515964903/enhance

Thoughts or Semi Conclusions:

1. Since the integrity of the roll bar system depends on the roll bar and the bolts, based on the compressive strength of the 304 SS the bolts would fail before the roll bar tubing (at least in compression);

2. The dynamic loads during a roll over would be higher than the static loads of the car just sitting on the roll bar;

3. The compressive analysis assumes that the forces would be perpendicular to the bolts but in a real rollover they would be on all three axes and would change as the car rolled; and,

4. I am not sure that this a proper way to look at the static loads but assuming a car weight of around 2300 pounds ... a 3/8" or 7/16" diameter Grade 8 or 5 bolt should give about a 3:1 margin to potential collapse. A 5/16" diameter bolt is also close.

Assuming you all agree I think that I would be safe with a 3/8" diameter bolt in all three legs.

[boat737]

Wow. That's pretty detailed. Just for grins, you don't happen to have figures for 304 and/or 316 stainless bolts that you could add to your graph and table do you? (It would be interesting to see the comparison between them all.) I'll keep quiet now...

[carlewms]

Boat,

Sorry for the slow reply ... my postings were interrupted by a some health issues.

I will get the additional materials added ... so far Grade 2 and 304 SS are almost the same and lower than Grade 5 and 8.

Carl

[carlewms]

Boat,

Here are the updated table and charts showing Grade 2 (mild carbon steel) and Stainless Steel strengths.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93793945428/small/1516447984/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93793945427/medium/1516447984/enhance

These are for single shear only ... and please see the notes on the table for other caveats or conditions.

The bottom line is that Grade 5 and Grade 8 bolts are clearly much stronger in shear than the equivalent 304 SS or Grade 2 mild steel bolts.

[CraigS]

I never thought about the fact that the bolt would need to shear in two spots. So if shear in the table is listed at 10060# does that mean it would actually hold twice that? I was going to say that a 3/8 G8 would be fine at the 10060 as it is approx 4 times car weight. If the real shear would be 20120 than it is really enough. This seems to say that is correct. The roll bar is in double shear.
https://sciencing.com/calculate-shear-stress-bolts-5925603.html

[carlewms]

Craig,

The shear strength calculated is for one location. I will do some calculations based on the actual locations and areas and post them.

I do believe each location where a bolt goes through the material is in single shear.

Thanks,

Carl

[boat737]

Very interesting. Good stuff. Who knew... Thanks Carl.

[Boydster]

Single shear is simply 2 pieces wanting to move in different directions... there's a single fail point on the hardware. Double shear would be like a clevis with a center attachment... 2 hardware fail points with 3 pieces applying pressure.

In this case, we are applying single shear in 2 spots.

[carlewms]

Boydster,

Agree completely ... The discussion/analysis started to determine whether a bolt through the entire tube set is stronger than two bolts on one side of the roll bar attachment. Some have used two bolts, or more properly screws, where the inner tube is drilled and tapped to accept the thread of the screw.

My intellectual curiosity and the fact that health issues prevent me from getting back building the car ... drove me to see if I could figure out ground truth.

What I believe it comes down to:

1. Because of the ultimate tensile strength and shear strength of the roll over bar materials (304 SS) ... the point of failure is the bolt;
2. The shank of the bolt is stronger than the threaded portion of the bolt;
3. That during a roll over the forces and direction of application to the roll over bar will vary considerably during the actual roll and will therefore not be axially down the roll bar tube;
3. The larger the diameter of the bolt ... the greater its shear strength is; and,
4. More bolts connecting the tubes assuming the tube integrity remains the same ... increases the shear strength of the assembly.

Do you agree?

Clearly in some ways this is just mental gymnastics ... but kind of fun mental gymnastics for this old mechanical engineer.

Carl

[Boydster]

Hey Carl,
Sorry you're not feeling well.

Nothing wrong with working stuff out, especially if you're stuck indoors. I think all of your thinking is correct, but I had to think about the last one. Base thought is that if you're increasing the area of the yield material, it will handle higher forces... a 3/8 gr8 is stronger than a 1/4 gr8. So 2ea 3/8 gr8 is even better. In our thinking on a rollbar, there are 2 places of single shear, so the area of the failure material is increased and the shear event becomes higher in pressure. But... I dont think the increased shear pressure would be proportionate. At 10k, both parts are starting to shear and I dont think it would last to 20k. But thats just my mind.... no evidence to back it up.

I have no real engineering background... just a beat up airline mechanic. ;)

[boat737]

And how 'bout this...

If one side of the bolt were to shear before the other (such as one hole was a snug fit, and the other a bigger hole with a loose fit, or a slightly crooked set of holes, or a transverse load pushing sideways on the bar causing one end of the bolt to take the initial force and start to shear first), then once the one end of the bolt began to shear, the other would be back to a single shear, that is two distinct single shear events rather than one dual shear event. You would be back to the (in the example above) 10k pound fail point and not the 20k pound. Does that make sense?

[j.miller]

I remember this from high school ,,,,only they used trains leaving New York and Florida at different times traveling at different speeds....

[carlewms]

I remember this from high school ,,,,only they used trains leaving New York and Florida at different times traveling at different speeds....

I hated those kind of problems ...

[carlewms]

With still more time on my hands should be allowed ...

Since some folks have used a threaded connection and Craig S had pointed out that the shear strength of the threaded connection ... I decided to look at both options for a single shear case using Grade 8 bolts or another way of looking at it is:

Assume that the forces are such that the load is not spread over both bolts or both sides of the bolt in a through bolt application. like was discussed in the last posts. I think this is the conservative way of looking at it because it probably is somewhere between the two cases. Other constraints:

1. Threaded Connections: The strength of the connection in shear is dependent on the diameter of the bolt (which is slight smaller than that of the shank), threads per inch (fine is stronger than course) and thread engagement (how much of the threads in the bolt and the nut (or wall in this case are engaged;

2. Thread Engagement: The strength is found in the first 4-5 threaded of the engagement ... meaning that just increasing thread engagement without increasing the diameter and number of threads does not really buy that much additional strength;

3. Adding More Bolts: Meaning either adding more threaded bolts or having one bolt go through the entire tube adds strength but is very dependent on the failure mode or forces on the roll bar as you tumble sideways down the road or track. Based on the theory and that the forces would be applied equally across each location ... yes you would gain strength; but do you want to bet your noggin on that?;

4. Maximum Thread Engagement: Several sources cite that there is no added strength above 1.5 times the diameter of the bolt threaded area;

5. Maximum Roll Over Force: 4 x the weight of the car or about 10,000 lb; and,

6. In this analysis no additional design margin was used but typically I have seen 2-3 used in other analysis. Just for the heck of it I increased the Force in the stress computation ... a threaded connection would always fail and at least 7/16" Grade 8 bolt would keep the joint from failing.


https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93798305429/medium/1516619280/enhance

Conclusions:

1. If you want to use a threaded connection where the inner tube it drilled and tapped the bolt diameter should be 7/16" or greater but beware that because the wall of the tubes is about .125" thick only about 3 fine threads will be engaged when at ideally you would want just over 15 fine threads per inch to maximize the strength;

2. Fine Threads add more strength because of the increased thread engagement and the slightly larger nominal diameter. If the tube is unmodified the wall thickness is 1/8" or 0.125". To maximize holding power you would ideally want that to be about 0.84". Boat your coupler idea does that by the way;

4. Taking account #4 above regarding maximum thread engagement you have very few threads engaged unless you weld in a coupler or a plug to the inner tube to increase its thickness; and,

5. If you want to use a shank connection where the shank is engaged on all surfaces of the hole of the tube the bolt diameter should be 3/8" or greater.

Bottom Line: Subject to constraints above, the amount of design margin and the actually forces either method of attaching would work but for most builders using the largest through bolt is the most practical.

Thoughts ...

I hope to get cleared by my cardiologist tomorrow so I can get back to real work.

Carl

[carlewms]

Hey Carl,
Sorry you're not feeling well.


Thanks ... I was having a heart cauterization done to check on my aortic stenosis and to see if I had any blockages. This is normally a routine procedure done on an outpatient basis. In my case it turned out slight less routine ... while it can happen that the heart stops when the catheter touches the wall of the heart, the heart normally starts right up when the catheter is removed.

In my case it did not and for 2 minutes my heart was stopped until the CPR and drugs got it restarted. It was a bit surreal since I was only sedated and not under general anesthesia so I was aware I passed out but also came to with them pounding on my chest and barking orders to put in those heart starting drugs.

Carl

[carlewms]

I have Richard Oben's excellent plenum to install ... and here is my supposed challenge:

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93798334294/medium/1516624381/enhance

I was planning on using surface mounted studs to install the plenum on the underside of the body but it looks like these would interfere with seal of the firewall.

Does anyone have photos of the actual installation on a Mk 4 or can post ideas about the best location and manner to install this thing?

Thanks,

Carl

[JoeAIII]

<...>
3. Adding More Bolts: Meaning either adding more threaded bolts or having one bolt go through the entire tube adds strength but is very dependent on the failure mode or forces on the roll bar as you tumble sideways down the road or track. Based on the theory and that the forces would be applied equally across each location ... yes you would gain strength; but do you want to bet your noggin on that?;
<...>
Carl

Another consideration with multiple bolts is that it is unlikely all bolts would see shear forces at the same time - they would all have to be centered in their holes exactly the same "at rest" - unlikely. slight misalignment of the holes in the bar and sleeve would cause one of the bolts to take the weight and begin to shear before any tohers. A similar behavior can be seen in pin-tumbler locks, the pins will typically bind one at a time due to slight imperfections in machining and assembly.

I may have missed it in the previous analysis, but have you looked at the strength of the roll bar itself? I wonder if they may fail before the hardware.

[Jeff Kleiner]

I used that plenum on one car and permanently glassed it to the underside of the cowl. Not a whole lot of flexibility in it's location so measure and mark carefully. Be sure that the right side doesn't hit the heater box which will force the cowl upward---I had to cut and reshape that side of the plenum. I'll look but don't think I have any photos.

Jeff

[Boydster]

Thanks ... I was having a heart cauterization done to check on my aortic stenosis and to see if I had any blockages. This is normally a routine procedure done on an outpatient basis. In my case it turned out slight less routine ... while it can happen that the heart stops when the catheter touches the wall of the heart, the heart normally starts right up when the catheter is removed.

In my case it did not and for 2 minutes my heart was stopped until the CPR and drugs got it restarted. It was a bit surreal since I was only sedated and not under general anesthesia so I was aware I passed out but also came to with them pounding on my chest and barking orders to put in those heart starting drugs.

Carl

Holy smokes. Glad you're still with us. Whew.

[carlewms]

Another consideration with multiple bolts is that it is unlikely all bolts would see shear forces at the same time - they would all have to be centered in their holes exactly the same "at rest" - unlikely. slight misalignment of the holes in the bar and sleeve would cause one of the bolts to take the weight and begin to shear before any tohers. A similar behavior can be seen in pin-tumbler locks, the pins will typically bind one at a time due to slight imperfections in machining and assembly.

I may have missed it in the previous analysis, but have you looked at the strength of the roll bar itself? I wonder if they may fail before the hardware.

Joe,

Yes I have and it looks like the weak link is the bolts. The strength of the roll bar would be an issue if the holes were too close to the edge and the force was in tension vice compression.

[Straversi]

Holy smokes. Glad you're still with us. Whew.

Wow, puts everything else in perspective. Hope your recovery is speedy and complete.
-Steve

[carlewms]

I used that plenum on one car and permanently glassed it to the underside of the cowl. Not a whole lot of flexibility in it's location so measure and mark carefully. Be sure that the right side doesn't hit the heater box which will force the cowl upward---I had to cut and reshape that side of the plenum. I'll look but don't think I have any photos.

Jeff

Jeff,

Thanks ... I had to reshape the PS end as well ...

Cut and ready for glassing. I cut the end off and reused it again after sectioning off the excess.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93798708873/medium/1516645371/enhance

After some resin and mat

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93798713912/medium/1516645581/enhance

A trick my brother told me about (which I am sure the pros here already know about) is using heavy plastic (like freezer bag) wherever you don't want the fiberglass to stick or to help get a slicker surface when finished. The resin will not stick to the plastic.

Thanks for all your help ...

Carl

[carlewms]

Holy smokes. Glad you're still with us. Whew.

Me Too ... not to steal a slogan from the women ... I will say that after the stent I feel much much better.

Carl

[carlewms]

I know that I will be adding a soft top in the future ... but right now I have got the body belly side up so I was wondering if there are any areas that could benefit from reinforcement for the soft top installation.

I would love to get the premium top from FFR but would likely get a less expensive version from Whitby ...

Thanks in advance for your help.

Carl

[carlewms]

With the saw bones imposed limitations on what I am allowed to do ... I did managed to get some time on the car over the last few days. With the body on its back I wanted to get all the items either installed or mocked up for installation after painting before applying the bed liner to the inside of the body.

Side Louvers. The louvers that FFR used to ship with the kits were basically a flat piece of aluminum cut out so that you could expand out parts to create the louvers ... I purchased **********'s version which are made from a thicker gage aluminum and are preassembled.

Following in the footsteps of others ... I decided to avoid using velcro or adhesive to mount the louvers and instead went with the surface mounted studs like i used to secure the electrical wiring on the four corners of the car.

Here is the hardware used ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93791969067/medium/1516400648/enhance

The louvers come with two brackets for the top and the bottom ... these require the surface mount on the studs to be trimmed so as not to be seen through the hole for the louvers. I decided to go a different route by fabricating new "L" brackets where the base of the "L" was wide enough to move the surface mounts clear of the hole. While either method works ... this one allows full engagement of the surface mount on the body wall.

The assembled louvers were used to position the surface mounted studs to the body. To prevent the 3M HSRF from bonding the bottom of the brackets to the body I temporarily installed nuts on each stud to stand the brackets away from the body.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93819937237/medium/1517710254/enhance

Between the wing nut and the temporary nut the studs are adjusted to make sure they were flat on the body ... another lesson learned from the first installation on the PS.

This photo shows the louvers on the body ... ready removal and application of the HSRF

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93819937448/medium/1517710264/enhance

After everything was ready including preparing the surface ... I applied HSRF to the bottoms of the surface mounts ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93819932254/medium/1517710073/enhance

Note: The HSRF was really only used to "glue" the louver brackets in place so that I could later apply two layers of fiberglass cloth to provide the strength to the bond. This is before the cloth was applied.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93819932303/medium/1517710075/enhance

After cloth was applied ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93819932476/medium/1517710273/enhance

On the first side I had to do a lot of clean up of resin on the post threads and around the bottom of the posts. On both sides used a burr and 45 grit wheel to clean up and smooth out the fiberglass as needed.

[Jeff Kleiner]

That's the same methods and similar to how I do the side vents.

Sorry, I haven't checked in for a while but see that you asked about joining the tube to the plenum. When I did it I rummaged around my "hell box" to see what hit me and came up with a PVC conduit connector. Just happen to have one handy right now and snapped a pic:

http://www.ffcars.com/photopost/uploads/689/conduit_connector.JPG

After cutting the appropriate sized hole in the plenum what I ended up doing was cutting back the male threads so that they were just long enough to come through the nut after it was installed in the plenum. I also cut the other end back to about 1/2" and glued a short piece of PVC pipe into it to serve as a nipple of sorts to couple the flex tubing. Before bonding the plenum to the underside of the cowl I screwed it together and clamped it down tight. Although I didn't I suppose you could ooze some HSRF on the connector &/or nut if you had concerns about it ever loosening. As you install the body for the final time you'll need to connect and clamp the flex hose before dropping the tail all the way down. Not necessarily my most elegant solution to some of the challenges we face but it was effective and workable.

Hey! PM me with a phone number---I'm making a whirlwind trip to Manassas in a couple of weeks. No guarantees since my days will probably be pretty full but if I can find a couple of hours to break away I'd love to visit!

Jeff

[carlewms]

Herb put his door cards on sale in January ... the first 20 buyers got a nice discount but one would be drawn for a set of free door cards ...

I got lucky ... and got these for free. Thanks Herb ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93826131790/medium/1518060992/enhance

Carl

[carlewms]

After grinding down the surface where the louvers were mounted I found I still had some gaps between the body and the louvers.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93819932355/large/1517710271/enhance

You can see a small gap between the rear of the louver and the body.

The fix was pretty simple ... I elongated the holes on the bracket holding the louver so that I could move the louver in to eliminate the gap.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93820614007/large/1518055897/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93820613941/medium/1518055889/enhance

The other part of the positioning ... the top edge (or in this case the bottom edge) is even with the opening making the lower edge of the louvers slightly below the hole.

The outline of the louvers was marked to make sure I do not put any bed liner in the area of the louvers.

Exterior photos ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93819937924/large/1518055889/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93819937943/large/1518055892/enhance

After input from Dan ... these will be cleaned up and powder coated in the car color if I can match it or in clear or chrome.

Carl

[carlewms]

After finishing up the side louvers, it was time to come up with the final solution for the plenum connection to the heater box. Three issues became apparent once I started trying to fit the plenum:

The plenum was too long and interfered with the top of the heater box on the Passenger Side.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93826185751/large/1518063341/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93784154313/medium/1518063341/enhance

The original "T" assembled on the blast gate was too tall for the space behind the dash. I could have made it fit closer to the heater box but it would have made access to some of the electrical connections difficult if no impossible.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93826198693/medium/1518063934/enhance

The fore and aft flanges of the plenum interfered with the dash and the bulb seal on the firewall.

In the original design I had the blast gate attached via some bolts to the flange of the plenum which interfered with the plenum laying flat on the body.

So now I had to come up with Plan B and, after getting some feedback from Jeff K, I had to cut some of the plenum off, I need to move the blast gate and "T" connection to a location that would not interfere with items behind the dash. I decided to make my own "T" from PVC and a Vintage Air hose coupler while maintaining the blast gate in the system.

Plenum: The plenum shortened by about 5 in to clear the heater box and the old hold and drill outs were filled in with mat and vinyl ester resin.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93825985141/large/1518055876/enhance

?T? Connection: I don't like the ?plastic? look of the PVC in particular so I filled in the connection with body filler putty to make it look like this was one piece (later to be painted).

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93826207355/large/1518064471/enhance

The 2" hoses fit over the ends of the top of the "T" and will be clamped. The leg of the "T" is drilled to match the holes on the blast gate and attached with self taping screws to attach it to the valve.

I modified one set of brackets and made a modified bracket so that they would sit on the angled wall of the plenum instead of the flange.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93826207363/large/1518064471/enhance

The edge of the blast gate nose on the inside of the plenum was trimmed down to allow more air flow to the the defroster vents. The rubber gasket, seen here through the fiberglass, was made and installed to prevent air from escaping between the blast gate and the plenum.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93825984491/medium/1518064468/enhance

The modification gave me about 1 1/8" more room; now it fits in place. More in Part Two

[carlewms]

A close up of the plenum side of the blast gate and attachment points.The front flange was left as is but the rear flange was trimmed to make sure it did not interfere with the dash.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93825984526/medium/1518064474/enhance

It was now ready to mock up on the body ...

Before removing the body I marked the location of the firewall on the under side of the cowl. This was the limit for forward location of the plenum. The side to side location was reference to the cut out for the DS window post; the DS edge of the plenum is position 5? from the hole which matches to the outside of the mounting location on the frame.Two 1/4?-20 1/2? surface mounted studs were bonded and fiberglassed to attach each end of the plenum to the body. The holes on the plenum were drilled out oversized to allow some adjustment later on when fitting the body back on the car.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93825990565/medium/1518055932/enhance

The outlines were made to show areas where I do not want to put the black truck bed liner.

[AC Bill]

So what's the point of having a T there, Carl?

Does your heater only have two outlets, so your using one for the footbox on the drivers side, and the other will feed the defog plenum, and the passenger footbox?

[carlewms]

Bill ... thanks for the question

Since I am using my heater box as both a source of hot air when cold and "cool" air when it is hot out, i wanted to maximize the amount of flow to the cockpit.

Here is a diagram of the way I hope it will work ...

https://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a6d711b3127cceed69fd0d9ce900000030O09AaOGbRo2bA9 vPhg/cC/f%3D0/ls%3D00006064438420160930102505186.JPG/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D720/ry%3D480/

Here are the notes from the drawing since they are a little hard to read ...

Installation Notes

1. Red = 2" ducting.
2. Blue = 3" ducting for Outside Air
3. F = Forward Facing Round Louver
4. D = Down Facing Round Louver
5. 2"BG = 2" Aluminum Blast Gate controlled cockpit
6. 3"BG = 3" Plastic Blast Gate controlled from Heater Fan Control Knob

Operations Notes

1. Heat: Maximize heating by closing both blast gates...no cold air in from the front of the car and no air to the defroster.
2. Defrost: Maximize defrost by opening 2" blast gate and close louvers...all hot air going to defroster.
3. Cooling: Maximize cooling by keeping electronic HCV shut during warmest months and opening 3" blast gate.

Since all the air goes through the fan on the heater ... you also can control the flow with the 3 positions on the fan motor.

When it is all together and operational ... we will see how well it all works.

Thanks,

Carl

[Jeff Kleiner]

Carl,
You didn't ask but if you had I would have told you that getting provisions in place for a defroster (whether plenum or individual boots) is a pain in the a$$. I'm sure you realize that now!

Jeff

[Straversi]

That's great work. Your passengers will NEVER understand the mental energy spent, just trying to get heat down to their toes.
-Steve

[carlewms]

Carl,
You didn't ask but if you had I would have told you that getting provisions in place for a defroster (whether plenum or individual boots) is a pain in the a$$. I'm sure you realize that now!

Jeff

That is a big YES SIR ... I thought putting the pumpkin for the old IRS was painful ... other than the strain on my arms with the pumpkin ... this was far more mentally fatiguing.

Asking probably would not have stopped me anyway ... I guess I just like the pain LoL.

Of course I had double the fun since my first design did not work.

Carl

[dallas_]

Carl,
Really like the thought and effort you are putting in your build. Hope SOMEDAY you get it done and bring it to San Marcos. :)

John

[carlewms]

In my haste to get the body ready I almost for got the need to reinforce the area on the body where the Trunk Prop Rod attaches to the body.

I shaped a piece of wood to serve as the foundation ...After using a dab of Gorilla Glue to hold it in place it was covered with a layers of mat and cloth and allowed to cure over night.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93825968385/medium/1518486374/enhance

After further sanding of the area surronding the installed wooden block, the area was prepared for some filler ... more Rage Ultra.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93833352486/medium/1518486376/enhance

Here are the details:In my goal to have a more finished look certain areas accessible to view are going to be painted with aluminum paint. The underside of the trunk lid, the hood and the viewable sections are going to be painted with Eastwood Aluma Blast Aerosol Paint 12 oz. (#10109Z). The area marked with the green tape is just outside the vertical walls of the trunk.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93833352487/medium/1518486376/enhance

In order to make it look a bit more like metal instead of fiberglass, Rage Ultra was applied to the area to smooth it out a bit.The DS of the underside of the trunk ...I ran out of Rage Ultra so the job is halted until I can pick up another gallon in the morning.

I am not striving for a perfect surface ... the aluminum isn?t perfect either ... so a few ?dings? are perfectly acceptable (to me at least).

Thursday and continuing into Friday I kept applying and sanding Rage to the areas accessible inside the trunk. While I had originally planned to duplicate a 427 SC that goal has rapidly evaporated ...

So I have compromised a bit ... Ok a whole bunch. Basically all areas of the fiberglass which are visible and not covered with bed liner are getting the ?smoothie? treatment so that they at least feel like aluminum under the paint.

Sanding in progress ... by the way the ultra is a whole lot easier to sand than the rage. As seen below I basically used Rage Ultra (until I ran out) and then Rage Gold to take that fiberglass look and feel out of the accessible areas around the inside of the trunk.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93833373973/medium/1518487143/enhance

The Rage Gold ... is the ?golden? color and the Rage Ultra is the off white. I would have preferred Rage Ultra but my local supplier was out and I did not want to wait.Me ... sanding away ...

Here are the final results ...The Finish Line Trunk Prop Rod base - Top view

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93833387508/medium/1518487510/enhance

The Finish Line Trunk Prop Rod base - Side view

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93833387506/medium/1518487510/enhance

The area ready for primer ... its not perfect; just like raw aluminum is not perfect.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93833387500/medium/1518487509/enhance

The darn dust is everywhere including the front cockpit cowl making it look like there is Rage applied in those spots ...It is just dust

It is supposed to be very warm ... in the 70's Thursday so I want to drag the body outside and give it one very good cleaning in preparation for the application of the bed liner on Friday.

Any recommendations ...

[dallas_]

I want to drag the body outside and give it one very good cleaning in preparation for the application of the bed liner on Friday.

Any recommendations ...

Bed liner sticks to everything. Just try to get it off your clothes if you get any on you. I'd just blow it off thoroughly with compressed air.

[carlewms]

Dallas,

Thanks ... that would save a lot of time ...

Carl

[carlewms]

The Breeze Roll Bar after welding the rear leg to the hoop has 4 parts ...

The 1,75? roll bar and 3 tubes the transition the roll bar to the 1.5? OD stub tubes on the frame. Two of the tubes are shorter for the front two legs with longer tube for the rear support leg. The roll bar material is 304 SS; I am not sure about the material of the transition pieces.

After the long analysis with heavy emphasis on the **anal** I [U]initially[U] chose 1/2?-13 Grade 8 bolts, nuts and lock washers to connect all the parts.The shorter ones connect the transition tubes to the stub tubes; the longer ones connect the transition tubes to the roll bar.

After finding the Grade 8 Nyloc Nuts I had picked up form McMaster Carr I substituted these eliminating some of the lock washers. I also ended up installing one 7/16" diameter bolt to save room on a joint near the body.

Some notes:

1. I drilled 1/8? pilot holes and assembled the roll bar before drilling the 1/2? holes for the hardware;
2. Nails were used to keep holes aligned as the mock-up proceeded;
3. A little oil on the tubes made the mock-up assembly a lot easier;
4. I sanded/smoothed the out side of the transition tube to the rear leg in particular to make moving into place easier;
5. Before removing the body I had marked the roll bar where it transitions the top of the body, and, at Craig?s suggestion, he marked about an inch of the tube to cut to make sure it cleared the body. After several versions of ?on/off? I now realize that was not really necessary ... but only after making the cut;
6. Where possible I used the drill press ... I drilled the transition tubes before drilling the holes in the stub tubes on the frame with the hand drill. In each case oil was used to cool and lubricate all drilling;

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93833667402/medium/1518503053/enhance

7. With the exception of the connection between the angled leg and the transition tube i have at least 3/4? from the edge of the end of the tube and the hole; and,
8. The holes need to be located so both sides are accessible with the body on the frame; made more complicated because I had already installed the wall for the cubby in the forward section of the trunk.

Day One

Since it seemed like the third leg ... the angled one ... would be harder to configure, so naturally I started with that one. This was also the one with the first mistake ...

Stub to Transition Tube: The pilot holes were drilled so that the bolt will be parallel to the centerline of the car but perpendicular to the tubing.

Day Two

The initial drilling was done with a 1/8? drill bit with nails used to hold everything in place.The third or rear leg

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93833664539/medium/1518502628/enhance

After doing two legs I found that I could hold both parts with the vice by putting pressure on the larger diameter pipe.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93833664548/medium/1518502629/enhance

Here are the results

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93833664549/medium/1518502629/enhance

The nails also helped verify that the positions for the bolts would work ... meaning they were accessible.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93833664559/medium/1518502631/enhance

The last leg to get pinned was the DS roll bar to transition tube. I called it a night; wanting to tackle the 1/2? drilling with a fresh body and mind.

[carlewms]

I continued the installation of the roll bar ... the very messy installation of the darn roll bar.

With all but one pilot hole drilled I decided to go ahead and drill the 1/2” diameter holes for the hardware and finish the last hole (PS transition to stub tube) after everything else was secured to the frame with the 1/2” hardware.

As it turned out and somewhat anticipated, it was a long job. Each set of holes took around 30 minutes to drill. With the exception of the stub tubes all the drilling was done with a drill press set to its lowest speed (344 rpm). I tried various combinations of bits but the best was to expand the 1/8” pilot hole with a 1/4” diameter bit working my way up to the 1/2”. The other ingredient ... lots of oil!

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93833679348/medium/1518504682/enhance

This is the setup on the drill press ... used for all drilling except the stubs.

One change ... I could not get the fit I wanted on the transition to roll bar tube with 1/2” hardware ... 7/16” worked better and gave more room between the end of the roll bar and the mounting hole.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93833679344/medium/1518504681/enhance

I need to buy the right length of 7/16” to fit so that the shank is carrying all the load.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93833685171/medium/1518505218/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93833685115/medium/1518505210/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93833685152/medium/1518505215/enhance

[carlewms]

After a long day yesterday drilling the holes for the roll bar, today left the clean up and the trimming of the hardware to a better fit.

The front legs required an additional washer on the top bolt. In the photo below the nut cannot fully compress the lock washer because of the solid shank is slightly proud of the surface of the tube.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93833664615/medium/1518505227/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93833664625/medium/1518505231/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93833664649/medium/1518505240/enhance

I found some 1/2”-13 Grade 8 NyLoc Nuts one of which I installed on the rear leg. I replaced all the plain nuts with these.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93833692077/medium/1518506339/enhance

In hindsight I could have made the cubby a little deeper and installed the bolts parallel to the longitudinal axis which would have made access to the bolt head and nut a little easier.

The area is accessed from the cockpit.

I checked tool access ... Front Legs

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93833661147/medium/1518502464/enhance

Rear Leg

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93833661148/medium/1518502464/enhance

I will likely have to do some adjusting when the body goes back on ... I am hoping that if it’s close it will be under the bezel ... we will just see.

What remains to be done ...

1. Cleaning;
2. Polishing; and,
3. Final Installation.

[WIS89]

Carl-

Nicely done! Thanks for the step-by-step instructions as well.

Regards,

Steve

[AC Bill]

[QUOTE=carlewms;313151]I continued the installation of the roll bar ... the very messy installation of the darn roll bar.[QUOTE]

It does look like quit an undertaking..
So what, if any, is the advantage of using these bars, vs the FFR supplied ones? Certainly they aren't saving you any labor, so is there some additional safety, or is it mainly for the stainless steel look, vs chrome look?:confused:

[carlewms]

Bill,

From an installation perspective they are more difficult to install for 2 reasons in my view:

1. The rear leg must be welded.
2. The added transition tubes mean drilling an extra set of holes.

The advantages are:

1. A lower profile roll bar with a slight rake to the rear that looks better and is more original looking.
2. No frankenstein connection.

I am not sure they would pass the “broomstick” test but I don’t plan to track the car that much.

One of my goals in the placement of the bolts is to be able to substitute the FFR version if need be. I have the powder coated version of the FFR ... so I plan on trial fitting them to see if if it’s doable before the body goes back on.

Carl

[carlewms]

After masking the body up in preparation for applying the bed liner and then by early afternoon I was ready to apply. The weather was great 70+ degrees (F) so I was able to open the garage doors and make sure plenty of air was circulating.

Here is what comes with the Dupli-Color Bed Armor Kit:

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93838037575/medium/1518814129/enhance

The paint tray is pretty flimsy and, on the second coat, I used one of my own small hard plastic trays which was plenty stout. This was the only negative about the kit ... the biggest positive was that being water-based it was virtually without smell and easy to clean up. Thanks Jeff Kleiner and others for the recommendation.

Other items used but not pictured:

3M Painter’s Tape: My experience with the “generic” versions of the tape are not good so I used 3M versions in the 1” and 2” sizes.

Wet Rag and Bucket of Hot Water ... came in real handy for dealing with spills, drips or spots where the stuff got on the body where it was unintended.

Flat washers on the 4 surface mounted studs to keep the bedliner away from the threads.

Eye protection.Preparations: Compressed air was used to blow out all the dust and other debris from the body interior

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93838037613/medium/1518814132/enhance

Yesterday I had scrubbed the interior with water and degreaser and started the masking process which was finished today.PS rear cockpit edgeThe area around the trunk ... the area filled with Rage will be painted.Work in Progress ...Completed maskingAll masking completed ... sorry photo with all the shadows.

After two coats in most locations and additional coats in the areas of the wheels. I used about 2/3 gal so far.

Rear View

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93838037686/medium/1518814136/enhance

Front View

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93838037701/medium/1518814137/enhance

The areas around the trunk, front cockpit and the front fenders will be painted with aluminum paint or the body color ... just not sure yet.

Lessons Learned:

1. Clean up any messes, drips, runs with water before they dry otherwise its time to break out the sand paper;

2. There are only a few places on the body that the roller really works (at least for me);

3. Keep the material stirred up ... even in the tray ... so that the rubber is in suspension; otherwise your just applying a heavy back paint;

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93838037626/medium/1518814133/enhance

4. As others have said ... where clothes you plan on getting rid of ... this stuff gets all over the place;

5. I used the 3M blue painter’s tape. It did not ... or I did not get the tape fully sealed on to the rough fiberglass so I had some places where the bed liner snuck up under the tape. It is not really that big of a deal for an area not to be normally seen when the car is together; and,

6. Per the instructions ... do not remove the masking tape for at least 2 hours. I got eager to remove it and took some of the bed liner with it!

[AC Bill]

Curious as to why you spread it over the entire underside of the body, rather than just in the wheel well areas? Is it not mainly used as protection from stones?

I painted the entire underside of my body with a black epoxy paint, as a sealer, and only brushed the bed-liner in the wheel well areas. After the car was complete, I also used undercoating on the body and aluminum areas in the wheel wells. It is a better dampener from pebble impact, then the bed liner.

[j.miller]

Funny how they all look the same when you turn them upside down......WHAT ! Oh, that's right.....thought that sounded familiar.....Well done sir !...da Bat

[carlewms]

Curious as to why you spread it over the entire underside of the body, rather than just in the wheel well areas? Is it not mainly used as protection from stones?

I painted the entire underside of my body with a black epoxy paint, as a sealer, and only brushed the bed-liner in the wheel well areas. After the car was complete, I also used undercoating on the body and aluminum areas in the wheel wells. It is a better dampener from pebble impact, then the bed liner.

Bill,

To be fair ... I looked at some others where it was applied to most of the body so I did the same. I also think it adds another layer of protection to the other areas. I do have undercoating on all the exposed aluminum panels.

Carl

[carlewms]

just knew I was due for an OCD attack ... so here are the results.

When the bed liner was applied a lip of about 1" was left at all edges of the body shell except the openings for the brake cooling, oil cooler and radiator. Additionally I had applied filler to certain areas to smooth out the rough fiberglass like the "ceiling" of the trunk and around the exhaust openings.

Now here is where the OCD set in ... I decided that these areas should look like aluminum. Here is the basic procedure I followed:

1. Sanding and grinding ... actually done before the filler and bed liner was applied;
2. Fill ... I ended up using a combination of fillers but the goal was not perfection; the aluminum on the originals was not perfect from what I can see in photos;
3. Brush on the primer ... The primer was brushed on to assist in creating a grain in the "aluminum";
4. Brush on the aluminum ... After the last coast was applied a stiff bristle brush was used to further the grain; and,
5. Trim the bed liner just over the edge of the aluminum to create the appearance that the bed liner was laid over the aluminum body.

This also served the purpose of completely sealing the inside of the shell.

The "grain" and patina ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93842599245/medium/1519068893/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93842599278/medium/1519068895/enhance

The overlapped bed liner ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93842599438/medium/1519068901/enhance

Here is the "ceiling" of the trunk area ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93842599444/medium/1519068901/enhance

If I had known that I was going to do the aluminum paint ... I could have painted it first then masked it off and then painted the bedliner.

The hardware for retaining the wiring for the lights at the four corners of the body installed.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93842599410/medium/1519068899/enhance

My plan is to now mask everything off once it has dried for a couple of days and flip the body right side up for the application of Slick Sand.

The Olde Goat Went Crazy on this one ...

[AC Bill]

I really like that aluminum look, Carl.
Will you do the underside of the trunk lid and hood, like that as well? I bet that would look pretty authentic.

[carlewms]

Bill,

The underside of the trunk lid and the hood will get the same treatment ...

Thanks ...

Carl

[carlewms]

The updates are going to get out of order ...

After getting the inside of the shell completed I flipped the body over on the buck to finish the masking and start applying the Slick Sand to the exterior.

With the space limitations I decided to apply to the front part of the car (the door posts forward) and then do the rear section. All was fine until the second application ... I got interrupted during the preparation of the SS and forgot one key ingredient ... the catalyst.

Of course I did not realize this until I went back to the bench after applying about 13 oz of the stuff on the car ... mainly the front end, the lower parts of the body when where it curves under the body and a few other choice spots.

After some quick internet searches and consultation with Jeff Kliener ... there was only one solution available. Strip all the SS off the areas where the non catalyzed material had been applied.

The challenge is getting this gooey soft stuff off the car. Even after about 5 hours the stuff was still soft.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93852007242/medium/1519613769/enhance

It just clogs up any sandpaper and just rolls up ... so I broke out the paint scrappers, scotch pads and acetone. The final step was a DA sander with 80 grit sand paper (which I still went through a bunch of disks). After my wife and I worked for about 3 hours we got most of the bad stuff off the car. I still need to take care of a few spots under the radiator opening, the PS door jamb and lights. This was about midway through the process.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93852007173/medium/1519613767/enhance

After scraping ....

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93852007228/medium/1519613768/enhance

The a different surface after sanding ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93852007226/medium/1519613768/enhance

I did manage to correctly mix and apply SS to the rear part of the car ... started guide coat sanding.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93852007302/medium/1519613771/enhance

Carl

[AC Bill]

What's the latest Carl? You taking a break?

[carlewms]

After a medically mandated break that started March 7th and finally ended last week ...

For the first time since the beginning of March I actually did some work on the Cobra ... after getting medical and Commander in Chief clearance to do so

Since I am not quite ready to tackle the remaining body work and painting, I went back to the frame to work the punch list of items needed to be done before the body goes back on for the final time.

First up ... electrical

Since when I last had the car running in October 2016 I had made some modifications/improvements behind the dash which required requiring the bulkhead connector.

All the sensor wiring for the gauges, the controls for the electric heater control valve, wiper motor as well as starter and EFI related wiring.

Here are photos of the work in progress:

I first connected the pins on the dash side using my "cheat sheet" ... which was modified to make the assignments a little easier to understand.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94009992087/medium/1528207959/enhance

The dash side and the "cheat sheet" was used to connect up the pins to the engine side connector

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94009972295/medium/1528207251/enhance

I finished up the in dash side of the bulkhead connector and started on the engine side. I found one error in my original engine side drawing which I had to correct but left the pins in the same spots.

I am taking the engine side slowly to make sure I have the correct pin connections ...

Other than testing ... I have finished the bulkhead connector with the new wiring. Here is the new diagram:

Here are two views of the installation:

Engine Side. A cover will be installed over the connection and attached to the firewall via the three 1/4”x20 screws through the three rivnuts shown surrounding the connector.Basically all the unbraided wires will not be visible after the cover is installed.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93994327153/medium/1527432698/enhance

The connector inside the dash ... the temporary wire wraps will be removed and cleaned up once the dash is removed (one last time I hope).

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/93994327152/medium/1527432699/enhance

In hindsight I would have taken a different approach to getting the wiring through the bulkhead. In the early stages I was thinking that if I ever had to remove the engine I would have only one disconnect inside the compartment to remove. As the wiring through the bulkhead expanded to include other stuff that design goal was abandoned.

At least now I feel like I am starting to move forward ...

[carlewms]

I got one more item on the punch list completed: Replacement of the wimpy sounding FFR horns with a mini air horn by Trombe-Stebel. At 139 dB I think it will be plenty loud and more appropriate than the “beep” from the Factory Five Racing Version.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94009957732/medium/1528206950/enhance

A new bracket was fabricated from some spare aluminum to use the same holes that the mounts for the FFR “Road runner” sounding horn. The kit didn’t have the bracket; it did have the nut and bolt to attach the horn to a bracket. Although the kit comes with a relay, it was not used because the circuit from the POWERCELL is rated at 25 amps.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94009947939/medium/1528206437/enhance

I may paint or powder coat the bracket in the future.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94009947937/medium/1528206437/enhance

From the bottom ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94009947918/medium/1528206436/enhance

[carlewms]

Folks,

I go karted the build back in the Summer of 2016 ... now I am at the stage of re starting the engine in preparation for finally getting this thing finished.

Here is my dilemma ... at least I think it is:

1. Distilled Water was used in the coolant system with no anti freeze for the "first" first start and go kart. Should I drain all the coolant now and refill with the appropriate coolant anti freeze mix? (BTW no coolant leaks over the last 2 years);
2. Gas ... there is a about 1/4 of a tank ... should I drain and refill with fresh gas?
3. Oil ... original oil in the engine with no leaks over the last two years ... can I still use it as is?

If there is anything else to consider please post ...

Carl

[Fixit]

1. Distilled Water was used in the coolant system with no anti freeze for the "first" first start and go kart. Should I drain all the coolant now and refill with the appropriate coolant anti freeze mix? (BTW no coolant leaks over the last 2 years);
2. Gas ... there is a about 1/4 of a tank ... should I drain and refill with fresh gas?
3. Oil ... original oil in the engine with no leaks over the last two years ... can I still use it as is?

#1 - Drain out the plain water, maybe flush the system to get any crud out that may have broken loose. Fill with 50/50 premix and go with it.
#2 - YES. Today's gas is crap. Drain the tank into a few cans and run it through the lawnmower. I wouldn't "refill" it, maybe 5 or so gallons (in case there's a problem... you know Mr. Murphy? He'll show up with a tank problem as soon as it's filled.)
#3 - Spin on a new filter, top off the oil and run it. Your original go-kart run would've trapped whatever crud was in the system. Consider an oil change after the first 1000 miles.

[John Ibele]

Folks,

I go karted the build back in the Summer of 2016 ... now I am at the stage of re starting the engine in preparation for finally getting this thing finished.

Here is my dilemma ... at least I think it is:

1. Distilled Water was used in the coolant system with no anti freeze for the "first" first start and go kart. Should I drain all the coolant now and refill with the appropriate coolant anti freeze mix? (BTW no coolant leaks over the last 2 years);
2. Gas ... there is a about 1/4 of a tank ... should I drain and refill with fresh gas?
3. Oil ... original oil in the engine with no leaks over the last two years ... can I still use it as is?

If there is anything else to consider please post ...

Carl


Looks like you overcame a few bumps in the road with your persistence - I'm sure it'll feel great to hear the rumble again! Congrats on the progress, Carl.

[Jazzman]

I have considered replacing the stock horn. How did you decide upon this particular mini air horn? I looked into these for my motorcycle several years ago. I found the sound to be disappointing, and the quality very poor. I will look forward to hearing your impressions.

[Gromit]

#1 - Drain out the plain water, maybe flush the system to get any crud out that may have broken loose. Fill with 50/50 premix and go with it.
#2 - YES. Today's gas is crap. Drain the tank into a few cans and run it through the lawnmower. I wouldn't "refill" it, maybe 5 or so gallons (in case there's a problem... you know Mr. Murphy? He'll show up with a tank problem as soon as it's filled.)
#3 - Spin on a new filter, top off the oil and run it. Your original go-kart run would've trapped whatever crud was in the system. Consider an oil change after the first 1000 miles.


2X on the gas, but I don't burn it off in my small engines, I mix it into a full tank on my high usage DD. If the gas is questionable your going to create a headache in a small engine. but mix small amounts into a full tank of 10 - 32 gallons ( my pickup only gets 13 MPG) I can make 5 gallons of questionable gas go away pretty quick and never notice that it wasn't "fresh"
I would strongly suggest fuel stabilizer for the next gas that goes into the tank. some brands claim to keep gas fresh for 2 years. but I only go 1 on my seldom used power tools. ( Generator etc )

good luck on your Second First start.

Chris AKA Gromit

[carlewms]

I have considered replacing the stock horn. How did you decide upon this particular mini air horn? I looked into these for my motorcycle several years ago. I found the sound to be disappointing, and the quality very poor. I will look forward to hearing your impressions.

I bought it so long ago ... I cannot remember why I picked it over others at this point. I have only heard the sound from posts on the internet so I am not sure exactly what it will sound like mounted in the car. When looking for additional information on the installation process I did see very mixed reviews on the mini horn ... so I am a little worried that I may ultimately be disappointed.

What horn did you use on your motorcycle after replacing mini air horn?

Carl

Carl

[carlewms]

Thanks for the help on the getting it restarted issues ...

Yesterday I drained and flushed the coolant system, pumped out the gas tank via the fuel level sender access and checked the oil.

I did get a bunch of brown water out of the coolant system flush. Pumping out the gas turned out to be a bit tedious since I was using a cheap HF hand pump ... luckily I had much less in the tank than I originally thought ...

The oil looks just about the same as when I originally put it in and the levels are good.

Thanks again,

Carl

[Cabbess]

I’ve picked up some great tips on this thread, thanks all...best one is the Cleco’s so far! Also like it as build is for Carl and that’s also my name :)

My Mk4 roadster arrived yesterday, I ordered the complete kit and already have, with a little help, the body off, panels off and mounted the first two engine bay F panels. I’m waiting on front lower arms as they were on backorder. I’d like to follow the build manual in sequence to avoid missing a step; however the question I have is:

Any reason I can’t place and mount all the panels while I wait for parts? Not sure what others do?

Exciting times, can’t wait to make some progress on it :)
Carl

[jrcuz]

Hi Carl, I wouldn't attach any panels before they are call for in the build manual. Also start your own build thread so you don't hijack Carl's. Think about putting info about your build in your signature line.
JR

[carlewms]

I decided to get three coats of Slick Sand applied to the body ... working in the early morning to avoid the heat.

I pulled the body out on the driveway and set the front up higher to get better access to the openings in the cowl. After sanding to 80 grit and cleaning with degreaser and then blowing everything down with compressed air I got three good coats with just a few bugs and bits of dust included.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94068150468/medium/1531164709/enhance

In addition to those pests I also managed to hit the body with the gun or hose in some spots which will require some additional attention. On the positive side I did manage only one area with a run. A few things I learned ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94068150515/medium/1531164757/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94068150518/medium/1531164709/enhance

1. Once the body is essentially the same color the imperfections seem to pop out. Some of these I just plain missed but others are a lot more subtle.
- One that should have been obvious- Here is one that was a lot harder to see until I blocked sanded with 120 grit.

2. Applying the SS helped me understand the ups and downs of applying future layers like the base and clear coats. Some examples include:
- Keeping the hose away from the body;
- Paint from the inside out ... meaning lean over the car and the inside horizontal surfaces like in front of the cockpit, around the hood seating surface and front of the the trunk before painting the fenders and sides;
- The rollovers in the cockpit front and rear standing inside the cockpit;
- Painting the body where it rolls over the frame under the car; and,
- Practice a lot on the trash cans and other surfaces before attempting to put pain on the body.

I ended up using one gallon of Slick Sand to cover the body with 3 layers of sanding primer.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94068150427/medium/1531164732/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94068150463/medium/1531164707/enhance

Next ... a lot of block sanding with guide coat.

[jrcuz]

Looking good Carl. You are getting there!
JR

[AC Bill]

Carl, I'm glad to see your feeling good enough to get back to work on the roadster.

Can you not use a bit of spot putty on some of those tiny holes, and maybe even that scratch on the door sill, on top of the slick sand? Your going to be spraying a final sealer primer anyways.

[carlewms]

Bill,

I've not researched it yet but I believe that I can go over the spots with putty. As I progress through the grits from 120 to 160 I have found a few more places to fix.

Carl

[carlewms]

After 3 coats of Slick Sand I started the process of taking it off ...

I used the longest Dura-Block I have ... 16 inches with 120 grit sandpaper and guide coat for the larger sections and the softer foam blocks for other areas where the Dura-Block's would not fit well.

After applying the guide coat the long Dura Block was used on the larger open surfaces criss crossing the sanding patterns.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94084915247/medium/1532166221/enhance

I found some low spots in front of the DS door opening. These blocks are harder or stiffer than the foam blocks and, at least for me, worked better to highlight the low spots.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94084915722/medium/1532166399/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94084915711/medium/1532166327/enhance

I used a carpenter ‘s pencil to mark areas for further repair or filling (I figured that is better than tape or a marker ... I hope I am right).

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94084915224/medium/1532166218/enhance

A couple of low spots (circled using the pencil).

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94084915229/medium/1532166320/enhance

I also found some low spots on the surfaces between the rear cockpit edge and the trunk ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94084915629/medium/1532166258/enhance

Questions:

1. Should I continue with the 180 grit to see the full extent of the areas to be repaired or fix the low spots first?

2. Should I fix the low spots with Rage Gold or Slick Sand? I am thinking Rage Gold but I want to make sure there are no issues with going over the guide coat and Slick Sand.

Any other recommendations/suggestions would be appreciated.

[carlewms]

In addition to the Dura Blocks I am using the closed cell foam blocks which are more pliable or bendable ... but ...

https://cdn.eastwood.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/412x/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/p/1/p15839.jpg

After multiple uses the sandpaper just will not stick to them for very long and I end up using a lot more paper than needed.

Is there a trick to cleaning these foam blocks so that the paper sticks longer/better?

Carl

PS Using 3M or Mirka Paper

[Jeff Kleiner]

Try a little acetone or lacquer thinner to clean 'em up. I have to do it to my DA pad every so often. The adhesive residue builds up, collects dust and then the discs don't stick well---ever get hit right between the eyes with a 40 grit disc that's been flung off at full speed? IT SUCKS!

Jeff

[carlewms]

Jeff,

Thanks ... I will give that a try ... 40 grit in the kisser would not be fun but in my case it might make some improvements in my looks.

Carl

[carlewms]

Folks,

It has been a while since I have been able to work on the car or post up any progress. A lot has happened to the this Olde Goat ... pacemaker installation and aortic valve replacement were the big ones. The recovery has gone well so I finally was able to get back in the garage.

Folks,

This is a very overdue post ... the work was actually done at the beginning of the month.

While I am spending most of my time in NC on the project of rebuilding our home on the coast ... I did get a chance to finish the Slick Sand sanding to 180 grit before coming back down to continue work. This mean that I have applied at least three coats of Slick Sand and sanded it to shape on the body, doors, trunk lid and hood.

Here are some photos:

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94310314594/medium/1542547666/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94310314677/medium/1542547669/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94310316140/medium/1542547728/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94310316288/medium/1542547734/enhance

As I sanded and inspected the body I continue to find areas to fix ... here are a few of the minor but irritating ones ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94310318590/medium/1542547812/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94310318526/medium/1542547811/enhance

Of course here is the worst or most scary part of the work ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94250483526/medium/1540382883/enhance

I will be fully dressed out for the painting of the really bad stuff ...

Carl

[cgundermann]

Folks,

It has been a while since I have been able to work on the car or post up any progress. A lot has happened to the this Olde Goat ... pacemaker installation and aortic valve replacement were the big ones. The recovery has gone well so I finally was able to get back in the garage.

Folks,

This is a very overdue post ... the work was actually done at the beginning of the month.

While I am spending most of my time in NC on the project of rebuilding our home on the coast ... I did get a chance to finish the Slick Sand sanding to 180 grit before coming back down to continue work. This mean that I have applied at least three coats of Slick Sand and sanded it to shape on the body, doors, trunk lid and hood.

Here are some photos:

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94310314594/medium/1542547666/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94310314677/medium/1542547669/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94310316140/medium/1542547728/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94310316288/medium/1542547734/enhance

As I sanded and inspected the body I continue to find areas to fix ... here are a few of the minor but irritating ones ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94310318590/medium/1542547812/enhance

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94310318526/medium/1542547811/enhance

Of course here is the worst or most scary part of the work ...

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/services/mediarender/THISLIFE/000060644384/media/94250483526/medium/1540382883/enhance

I will be fully dressed out for the painting of the really bad stuff ...

Carl

Welcome back to the game Carl!

May the “The Force” be with you.

Chris

[jrcuz]

Wow Carl, glad to see you are back at it. Looking good.
JR

[AC Bill]

Where's Carl these days? No updates for quite awhile..Pray all is well with him.

[jrcuz]

I was just thinking the same thing. I saw he liked a post on FB a few days ago
JR

[carlewms]

Thanks for asking folks ... After the health challenges of 2018, I have been spending most of the time keeping healthy, getting caught up on work around and outside the house and getting back into the work routine.

With respect to the build ... I will post some photos here shortly ... but my goal is to get the car ready for the road by Spring 2020.

Carl

[AC Bill]

Glad to hear Carl. Yes, health comes first.
The Heart has to handle all the excitement one gets, every time you buckle yourself in to the roadster seat.:)