Who is going to Moochfest?

[Red Tag]

Who is going to Moochfest? I am thinking of driving from Detroit to see the 818 in person.

Red Tag

[michael everson]

I will be there.
Mike

[thestigwins]

I am waiting for FFR to build another headquarters on the west coast! :) MA is too far away!

[bil1024]

Me and the family will be there!!!!!!!

[RM1SepEx]

Bad timing, forcing myself to enjoy 77 in Tampa today vs frigid temps in Maine. I don't return until next week...

[metalmaker12]

I was going until the snow ruined that, this Sat I have a prior very important plan, so everyone have fun.

[Grok]

I will be there!-Perry

[Grok]

Funny. Just noticed that I am now a Junior Member. How appropriate.
I was a Charter Member on the previous forum having built a Cobra which I have sold in preparation for the 818...

[Joe Mush]

I will be going. It's always a fun time.

Joe

[Mechie3]

Funny. Just noticed that I am now a Junior Member. How appropriate.
I was a Charter Member on the previous forum having built a Cobra which I have sold in preparation for the 818...

I'm pretty sure it's all based on post count.

[dbjr63]

wish i was going.
please share any 818 updates from Dave.
818 couple?
818 Ford Eco boost?

[Silvertop]

It is. One is only a Junior Member briefly (for 10 or 20 Posts, can't remember exactly), and at 100 posts, you become a Senior Member

[apexanimal]

Fancy

[AJW Performance]

Some of us will be there

[bnr32jason]

Wish I could be there, but it would be a looooooong trip from Japan.

Looking forward to the e-mail update for future 818 owners and also excited to see pictures posted from people who do go.

[RM1SepEx]

Didn't Dave say he was sending out an update to pre-order customers before Moochfest? Since I can't be there I'll be looking for some updated information...

[Red Tag]

12 hour drive from Detroit and can't wait to see the 818 tomorrow!!

[flytosail]

Photos please.

Can someone ask about:
front license plates
S wing option
wipers option


Thanks!

[metalmaker12]

I might get there if it works out that way, but if not I hope i am filled in

[bnr32jason]

Didn't Dave say he was sending out an update to pre-order customers before Moochfest? Since I can't be there I'll be looking for some updated information...

Yeah I was really looking forward to the update too.

[metalmaker12]

I went to moochfeast and talked to the SMG guys and Jim for an hour or more. I got all my questions and concerns answered. Very good stuff.

[RM1SepEx]

I went to moochfeast and talked to the SMG guys and Jim for an hour or more. I got all my questions and concerns answered. Very good stuff.

Share info please...

[metalmaker12]

Ask questions, I don't know were to start

Body material, suspension, wiring, tranny, wheel sizes etc etc

[Mechie3]

Everything. Lol

[RM1SepEx]

just give us a summary

for example progress on the molded plastic panels? Colors? etc
after the open house last year there were tons of posts, after Moochfest.... not a peep!

Dave indicted that we would get an email before Moochfest... delayed by the storm and power problems perhaps???

[metalmaker12]

Body will be gel coat only, front uses rear sway bar. Harness is cut down by like 75 percent and there will be an option to have it cut down or one to actually have as an option. ????

[Stickshift84]

I was also at moochfest and all I can say is that I was even more blown away by the 818 in person. I will also try to answer questions for anybody. As far as the body goes, it does sound like gel-coated fiberglass is the direction they are going. The tires on the R are 205/40R17 Front and 255/35R18 in back. It was stated that the 255/35 is the widest tire that can fit.

[Hayai]

I was there as well. It was great to meet Dave and the team, and check out the cars.

From what I heard, You'll be eliminating a large part of the Subaru harness, and they *may* be looking into creating a whole new harness just for the 818 to eliminate wiring problems and bad connections with the stock harness. I'd say you shouldnt expect this to be a part of the kit though, if it does work out I would expect it to be an optional extra.

[Hayai]

I was also at moochfest and all I can say is that I was even more blown away by the 818 in person. I will also try to answer questions for anybody. As far as the body goes, it does sound like gel-coated fiberglass is the direction they are going. The tires on the R are 205/40R17 Front and 255/35R18 in back. It was stated that the 255/35 is the widest tire that can fit.

I was really surpassed and very happy with the amount of grip they were able to get during the track tests with only a 255 rear tire. This car is going to be incredibly impressive.

[metalmaker12]

Yea to attain a 1.5g with only 255r and 205f is impressive.

[Hayai]

For sure. Speaks VOLUMES about the rigidity of the chassis and the suspension they made with Koni.

[Mechie3]

Were you able to take pics? I threw away my dash beam and in one (old) pic it looks like I needed part of it to hold the steering wheel.

Gel coated FG: Does that mean it's still paint free, or do they recommend painting it? I know not much about FG gel coats.
Suspension: Did the S indeed have a swaybar?
Seat mounting: I noticed in the gallery one pic where they took out the seat in the S and the bracket didn't look stock. I'm going aftermarket seats and am wondering if I'd need a WRX to seat brand specific adapter, or if a generic adapter for that brand would work.
Wing mount: Available for S?
Any other things of note?

Any under panel pics?

[bnr32jason]

Did you get any info about wheel sizes and offsets that could be run on the 818 S?

[Stickshift84]

Sorry did not take any pics.

Also the S was not available for viewing.

Nothing much else new to see or hear except for the completed R.

I do not know what the mounting options are for the seat. I will be using aftermarket as well and I believe a generic adapter would work.

[Stickshift84]

The rear wheel was 18x9.5 I believe +35 offset. The front I think was 17X8. Subaru offsets will work.

[spaceywilly]

Here's a link to pics I took today. The car looks awesome in person, I can't wait to see them driving around this summer.

http://imgur.com/a/A7eyA

[bnr32jason]

Ok, thanks for that info. Hopefully it's the same, or similar on the S. I'm still going to hold off on buying my wheels though until a few people get their S's built and we find out exactly how much clearance there is in there. I don't wanna buy $2500 wheels and end up having to run crazy negative camber on them because I went too wide or too low offset.

[Mechie3]

The rear wheel was 18x9.5 I believe +35 offset.

Sweet. I believe that's the exact wheel I have. Just need to check the offset.

[thestigwins]

I am looking forward to the 818R final weight. I am most likely going to build an 818R with windshield.

[metalmaker12]

Gel coat does not have to be painted, but they will most likely only come in red. S has a sway bar and it is the rear from the donor, this was confirmed by Jim. They are using a few seat brackets in trial at this point, most likely will be part of th kit. Off coarse the S will have the wing for an option, it is the same frame minus the middle cage section. I have pics, but my computer is full right now so I need to do some delete work. The car is pretty low so it is hard to get underside pics. Smg told me that the harness will most likely be sold as an option, a good option to consider to cut down on build time and mental pain. 18x9 out back 17x8 front 255/205 Plus 35 offset as mentioned by nick. There will be a list of options for this car.

[Mechie3]

Only in red... so not quite paint free, unless you want red then? :( maybe its time to learn to paint. :)

[bnr32jason]

I'm glad the wing is being offered as an option, but I hope they offer something a little lower height. Watching the videos, that wing viewed from the back is freaking gigantic. Great for the track, but a little much for the street. Something about half-height would be perfect for the S in my opinion.

[metalmaker12]

Yea you can do it, just practice on other stuff, that is how you learn. I have been at it for years so i have painted many cars, took me some time to get it right. I have not painted in about 4 months, so it is time to get some practice prior to shooting the 818.

Heres a ruff prep route etc.

Mechie: With most Gel coat preps: 1. Use soap (dawn or other prep soap etc, not soap with wax or anything) and water for initial surface washing, 2. Scuff down with a scuff agent and or comet and a red scuff pad, wash down again blow dry and let dry in sun until dry, make sure to scuff panels completely. 3. pre clean entire surface with pre cleaner and pre cleaner towels. 4 Tack cloth the entire surface and lightly blow down with a air gun. 5. Mix a epoxy sealer/ Vario/primer and apply 1-2 medium wet coats. 6. Mist a light coat of dark base or rattle can as a guide coat after you have applied the the sealer, and let dry 24 hours. 7. Dry DA sand with a soft pad with 400,than 600, than 800 grit over entire surface or you can wet sand with 500-600grit, thing with wet sanding is if your not really practiced in it you may make finger marks. 8. Time to base coat, three medium wet coats, first coat make sure to cover all the edges and than apply over the entire panel, let tack, than tack it, same for second coat let tack than tack it, third coat should be a even coat over the entire panel. Bottom up on all coats helps me keep it even. 9. Clear two medium wet coats, do the edges first and dont put on heavy, or you will mess it up with runs. bake if you have access to a booth or let sit for 24 hours. With my 1.3- 1.4 tip Sata i run 17-20psi's base and clear, and like 25psi with my 3m 1.7 primer gun. I will revise this process if I get any new info on the type of gel coat they use and if more prep sanding will be needed etc. I have some ideas for what paint system to use, so i am going to try to et quality and good price. I love Spices Hecker products, but they cost way to much for me, I used sherwin williams sealer/primer base and clear on a Roadster about 5 years back, it look awesome and has held up on that car very well. It is about middle of the road for price, so it looks to be my route of attack. I am pretty sure some sw products were used on the 818R.

As for a wing, they might offer some other options but there will be endless ideas we can come up with and fab up,. We will have to fab a wing support and cut through the deck lid, no biggy.

[07FIREBLADE]

Is it going to be gel coat only now. Or just for the time being?

[metalmaker12]

From JIM, the plastic just does not look like the quality that they had hoped and is not going to be used.

[metalmaker12]

Heres some pics of me and nick in 818r and other cars
1548215483154841548515486154871548815489[/ATTACH]15490[/ATTACH]

Any design haters, etc blah blah; your all dead wrong, because this car looks killer!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[metalmaker12]

1549215493

[GUNS]

Not too happy about the gel coat issue, that was one of the major selling points for me. So I guess they can't claim $15k completed now. What process doe the ultimate gtr and rcr slc use? Those both use gel coat in multiple colors.

[wallace18]

IMO you will have to paint the car. Gelcoat fiberglass from FFR in the past needs body work. Unless they have made super progress it will need tweeking. That means sanding and such. IMO this will allow for mods to body for each person easier. I personally prefer the fiberglass. But I understand how the no paint was a big deal for cost and ease of building for some.

[bnr32jason]

I'm just going to do basic prep work and then take the body panels all to Maaco. The local Maaco I have back home is one of the better ones as far as quality goes. I'm not going to be entering any concourse shows or anything, haha, so a $400 Maaco job will be fine for me.

[GUNS]

Who' s got info on vinyl wrapping?

[bnr32jason]

With how simple the body lines are and how easily removable the panels are, you could probably get a friend and a $50 heat gun and wrap it yourself without much difficulty. I may go that route as well.

[07FIREBLADE]

Ya most likely going to wrap my 818. Unless they can make some improvements by the time I order. Or I might plasti dip the car. Easier results than wrapping and easier to remove.

[Stickshift84]

Chris, thanks for the pics of me in the car. And like he said the car looks killer!!! As for the body being fiberglass. I would wait to see what the final word is from Dave. The quality of the fiberglass has inproved greatly as has the gel coat finish. Also there are no seams to contend with which should minimize or prevent any necessary bodywork.

[PhyrraM]

The body is still multiple panels. This still means no parting lines. No parting lines means no paint required.

I would expect more colors to be phased in at, or shortly after, launch.

All the other FFR cars have parting lines, which need bodywork attention - that, in-turn, requires paint to cover up. If the car now requires paint, why offer anything but the standard red? Take away the parting lines and everything changes.

[Mechie3]

Who's going to be the first to CF vinyl wrap it. :lol:

I was afraid it would be too ricy, but apparently it's ok for Ferrari's to do that.
http://kkwu.wordpress.com/2010/10/25/%E2%80%9Cdinoc%E2%80%9D-wrapped-ferrari-f40/


Well....crap....this is simply amazing. 3m Matt Blue metallic wrap:

http://superiorautodesign.com/2012/10/sadesign-and-lashway-motorsports-wegohard/

[Kalstar]

As I have said from the beginning....vinyl is the best option for this car. Change your mind at will and $500 later you have a whole new look. Not disappointed in the gel coat only one bit.

[Mechie3]

If they're doing fiberglass, maybe CF from the same molds would be an option too. :D

This makes me wonder. If the surface finish/look of the plastic is the problem, maybe they would/could still sell the plastic pieces for those that want to do a wrap (or use them as plugs to make their own molds). This assumes, of course, the plastic parts are cheaper. If I'm going to wrap it, I couldn't care less if the plastic finish looks cheap as it will be hidden. If I plan to paint, I'd go gelcoat.

Wishing we had some official updates simply because I'm too excited every time I see a new pic!

[apexanimal]

205/40-17 aren't available in all performance tires out there... :(

I wonder if the speed sensors are front or rear mounted...?

[JeromeS13]

205/40-17 aren't available in all performance tires out there... :(

I wonder if the speed sensors are front or rear mounted...?

Speed sensor is tranny mounted. So, the fronts will not change the speedo at all.

[metalmaker12]

Mechie, From what I gathered the plastic might be cheaper, but that only if they went that route 100%. Another plastic problem noted was that not all the panels would come out of the mold perfect, and there would be defects in the body shape. JIM, said small parts yea, big panels, not going to happen with what they have for a setup. CF might be an option, but it will run you more since carbon fiber cost more than glass fiber. Another thing is carbon is more rigid and prone to cracking easier. This is why dry carbon fiber and titanium fiber are used in high dollar cars now, also why they cost like 300k.

205/40-17 are too narrow, it was all they could get for the r6 in a 17. Jim said a 215-225 would work well, even a 235

Yes the sensor is in the tranny

Kalstar (AKA Jim) is wrapping, which I might do as well, I might just make him vinyl my car if I do teardown rebuild stuff for him etc.

[GUNS]

here's an interesting approach to wraps. I'm sure it's expensive, but it may not be so bad considering the 818 doesn't have that much surface area:
http://www.flxpaint.com/welcome.htm

[Silvertop]

Gel coat does not have to be painted, but they will most likely only come in red. ..........

Did someone at FFR actually announce a red-only gelcoat at Moochfest, or are we making assumptions based on the fact that other FFR cars come only in a red gelcoat?

If they have given up (for now) on the thermoplastics option, that does not automatically mean they are returning to their conventional red gelcoat, (which was never meant to be a finish coat), as the way forward. Can you clarify specifically what your heard? Or better yet, perhaps FFR will clarify what we are likely to get?

I think most of us will not be terribly disappointed if we don't get thermoplastic panels. Some will likely be happier with the known qualities of Fiberglass. But if the no-paint-required feature disappears, or if it is only offered in one color, there are likely to be a lot of disappointed folks.

What exactly did you hear?

[spaceywilly]

If they're doing fiberglass, maybe CF from the same molds would be an option too. :D

This makes me wonder. If the surface finish/look of the plastic is the problem, maybe they would/could still sell the plastic pieces for those that want to do a wrap (or use them as plugs to make their own molds). This assumes, of course, the plastic parts are cheaper. If I'm going to wrap it, I couldn't care less if the plastic finish looks cheap as it will be hidden. If I plan to paint, I'd go gelcoat.

Wishing we had some official updates simply because I'm too excited every time I see a new pic!

Dave talked about CF during the tour and said that even though they have done one off pieces for customers in the past it is too expensive and the defect rate too high to consider selling it on a large scale.

[Stickshift84]

Just to clarify, all that was said was that they were going with fiberglass in lieu of plastic. No mention as to the final finish of the panels.

[metalmaker12]

I took what was told from Jim, Fred from SMG and FFR Tony Zullo in the right context, Tony has also written emails to me on it. It was a clear message it is going to be fiberglass gelcoat at this point and for some time. Plastic might not be 100% dead, but it will take more R&D for them to feel it will be high enough quality, so no time soon guys. Gel Coat does not need paint, you can buff it and it looks great. You would have to paint/wrap only if you want a different color. I am only the postman. I would like paint free too if offered

It maybe offered in other gelcoat colors at launch or soon after, but that was not available info from Jim etc an is only someones assumption. I was told red

[Kalstar]

Mechie, From what I gathered the plastic might be cheaper, but that only if they went that route 100%. Another plastic problem noted was that not all the panels would come out of the mold perfect, and there would be defects in the body shape. JIM, said small parts yea, big panels, not going to happen with what they have for a setup. CF might be an option, but it will run you more since carbon fiber cost more than glass fiber. Another thing is carbon is more rigid and prone to cracking easier. This is why dry carbon fiber and titanium fiber are used in high dollar cars now, also why they cost like 300k.

205/40-17 are too narrow, it was all they could get for the r6 in a 17. Jim said a 215-225 would work well, even a 235

Yes the sensor is in the tranny

Kalstar (AKA Jim) is wrapping, which I might do as well, I might just make him vinyl my car if I do teardown rebuild stuff for him etc.

We'll wrap your car togeather. You help me squeeze as much power out of the 2.0 engine and I will turn your car whatever color you want. Sounds like a good trade off to me.

My the way, I have seen the finished panels, there truely look like they are already painted.

[metalmaker12]

No prob, we will get it done

[philly15]

I was also at moochfest and all I can say is that I was even more blown away by the 818 in person. I will also try to answer questions for anybody. As far as the body goes, it does sound like gel-coated fiberglass is the direction they are going. The tires on the R are 205/40R17 Front and 255/35R18 in back. It was stated that the 255/35 is the widest tire that can fit.

this is kind of disappointing as far as tire size looks like im running slicks on the street or tuning the power way down from my goal and now adding vinyl wrapping into the cost :/

[Kalstar]

this is kind of disappointing as far as tire size looks like im running slicks on the street or tuning the power way down from my goal and now adding vinyl wrapping into the cost :/

Don't be so sure on tire issues. Kempo gave me a ride in his Atom. It hooked and went, with same or maybe one size down that the 818 is currently running. Hopefully he will jump in on this post. This thing was scary fast. In fact before I rode in Kempo's car I was thinking 300whp "would have to due" after riding in the Atom, I am concerned that there are forum members that truely do not understand what this car will be like in stock form, to some it may be a rolling coffin. I have owned and still own many fast cars but I have to say that the Atom was by far the most brutal acceleration I have ever felt. My cars are "boys among men". Inexperienced drivers will be in real trouble with this car. My advice to everyone, including people like me, that have owned fast cars (I currently own several 500hp+ cars) , this will be nothing like you have ever experienced, start safe and grow into it.

[Mechie3]

this is kind of disappointing as far as tire size looks like im running slicks on the street or tuning the power way down from my goal and now adding vinyl wrapping into the cost :/

The new BFG's and Dunlop ZII are supposed to be extremely close to slicks and wear well. I'll be getting one of the other pending wet road tests. I know they'll never be like r-comps/slicks, but they provide incredible grip.


In fact before I rode in Kempo's car I was thinking 300whp "would have to due" after riding in the Atom, I am concerned that there are forum members that truely do not understand what this car will be like in stock form, to some it may be a rolling coffin.

I'm with you there. I'm starting stock turbo. My WRX was relatively fast with that motor/turbo and I can't imagine cutting almost 50% of the weight.

[philly15]

Don't be so sure on tire issues. Kempo gave me a ride in his Atom. It hooked and went, with same or maybe one size down that the 818 is currently running. Hopefully he will jump in on this post. This thing was scary fast. In fact before I rode in Kempo's car I was thinking 300whp "would have to due" after riding in the Atom, I am concerned that there are forum members that truely do not understand what this car will be like in stock form, to some it may be a rolling coffin. I have owned and still own many fast cars but I have to say that the Atom was by far the most brutal acceleration I have ever felt. My cars are "boys among men". Inexperienced drivers will be in real trouble with this car. My advice to everyone, including people like me, that have owned fast cars (I currently own several 500hp+ cars) , this will be nothing like you have ever experienced, start safe and grow into it.

what you need to understand is i understand completely what this will be and i will be willing to risk it on another note im psyched to see the reviews on the BFG's sounds very promising from what ive heard so far

[metalmaker12]

After talking to Jim and Fred, they both stated the 818R with 260whp was nutty fast out of the hole and scary fast around corners, but gripped very good. It is to be respected. They both felt much more than 300whp will be too much power

[Kempo]

Don't be so sure on tire issues. Kempo gave me a ride in his Atom. It hooked and went, with same or maybe one size down that the 818 is currently running. Hopefully he will jump in on this post. This thing was scary fast. In fact before I rode in Kempo's car I was thinking 300whp "would have to due" after riding in the Atom, I am concerned that there are forum members that truely do not understand what this car will be like in stock form, to some it may be a rolling coffin. I have owned and still own many fast cars but I have to say that the Atom was by far the most brutal acceleration I have ever felt. My cars are "boys among men". Inexperienced drivers will be in real trouble with this car. My advice to everyone, including people like me, that have owned fast cars (I currently own several 500hp+ cars) , this will be nothing like you have ever experienced, start safe and grow into it.

As Jim stated I'm running thinner tires on my Atom at least at the rear. Fronts are 205 and 225 rears. For the track I run Hankook Z214. The car accelerates,turns and brakes like a go kart. For street tires you can run some Toyo R888,RA1 or similar compound tires. Those should be more than enough with 235 or 255 rear wheels. With the 818 being as light as it is It won't need a huge contact patch to turn or accelerate without loosing traction.

I must agree with Jim about growing into the car. Starting with 400+WHP in a car this light can be dangerous. Once you get to a power to weight ratio below 5.5-5.0:1 things happen really fast. my advise if someone wants an 818 with 350+WHP is to go ahead and build your engine for the desired WHP but get a boost controller. Start with a low boost level and dial it up as you get to know the way your car behaves. If you have never raced on track before get some driving training like a PCA driving school or similar event. Another helpful addition in a car this light would be a boost by gear feature.

[bnr32jason]

Some people get so caught up with power numbers and I'll never understand why. If 255's on a 1800lb car aren't enough I'm assuming you are going for 400+ hp. A Veyron has 1hp for every 4.1lbs. Assuming 400hp (flywheel) in a 818 we are looking at 4.5lb per hp which is significantly better than a Lamborghini Aventador. So we've got all that power but no traction control or other electronic aids. I think most people won't be able to handle 300hp on the track, much less 400+. Maybe if you are just concerned with drag racing or being a red-light hero, but I think you should reconsider what car you are purchasing if that is your goal. To each his own of course, but seems like a waste to just use this car for cruising and straight line pulls.

Let's assume with the higher flowing exhaust and intake we get with the kit that the stock 2002 WRX engine will make about 240hp without any additional modifications. So we're looking at 7.5lb per hp which is better than a lot of sports cars out there.

[UBE Man]

Any mention as to if the Automatic tranny install will definitely be part of the build manual with the 818 kit, in addition to the 5 speed MT? I know I've seen other posts talking about if the Auto would work, but couldn't find one with confirmation yet from FFR. Thanks.

[Flamshackle]

Heres some pics of me and nick in 818r and other cars
15482


NEED to know??? how tall are you??? Do you see height as a problem over 6.2?

[Erik W. Treves]

NEED to know??? how tall are you??? Do you see height as a problem over 6.2?

... you'll be fine.

[Wayne Presley]

I must agree with Jim about growing into the car. Starting with 400+WHP in a car this light can be dangerous. Once you get to a power to weight ratio below 5.5-5.0:1 things happen really fast. my advise if someone wants an 818 with 350+WHP is to go ahead and build your engine for the desired WHP but get a boost controller. Start with a low boost level and dial it up as you get to know the way your car behaves. If you have never raced on track before get some driving training like a PCA driving school or similar event. Another helpful addition in a car this light would be a boost by gear feature.

Very good advice. I have a customer ( also a SCCA racer) with a turbo Elise that had 270 RWHP and weighs 1941. I upgraded the turbo to a GT2871R and made 338 RWHP and it was soooo much faster. I tuned to 18 psi (365 RWHP) but gave it back to him at 14 psi. 4 months later it's still at 14 psi as it lights up the rear tires in second gear if it's cool out. I've done overkill in the HP department with the FFR roadster and while it's a novelty to roast the tires at 90 mph, it's not that practical. My 818 will have about 310-325 RWHP

[Nuul]

Well....crap....this is simply amazing. 3m Matt Blue metallic wrap:

http://i.imgur.com/m6WYDD0.jpg



I concur, that's simply beautiful. Looks like vinyl is going to be the way to go if you're wanting to finish under $15K.

[longislandwrx]

There's an sti around my way with that wrap. looks even darker in real life. VERY nice.

[GUNS]

Does anyone have a rough guess what it would cost to vinyl wrap the 818?

[07FIREBLADE]

I would say about $500ish for materials if you were to do it yourself. That's how much it vost to wrap my friends s2k in 3m matte black dinoc

[carbon fiber]

plan on paint if you want the car to look good. they probably put more time into the molds for the 818, and they are individual panels, maybe they could be sanded and buffed. there's no way you could just buff out the panels on the gtm. i'm just not a fan of the wraps myself, to each his own.

[Nuul]

I'm just not a fan of the wraps myself, to each his own.

I know what you mean. I wasn't really a fan of them but they seem to have come a long way as of late. The only real downside as far as I can tell is that you shouldn't park it in direct sunlight. That will be an issue for me since I'd like my 818C to be a daily. There's no shaded parking at work - I'm not sure what to do about that really.

[carbon fiber]

my biggest problem with it is you can't fix chips or scratches. you have to re-wrap the panel. a lot of people are scared of paint, but once you learn, it's easy to repair. real easy if it only chips the clearcoat. as far as the cf, it has to be done with vacuum infusion or autoclaved with pre-peg to get the desired results. ($) rcr slc bodies are nice enough to be sanded/buffed gelcoat. the parting lines on the gtm are bad and require filler to correct. i hope the 818 panels are this good, for you guys. i'm just dissapointed that they didn't take the time to do that with the gen II gtm, at twice the kit price.

[GUNS]

I posted this earlier, but here it is again: http://www.flxpaint.com/welcome.htm. I'm not a huge fan of the matte vinyl (although that blue z06 looks pretty good) and this seems like a good alternative. It installs just like any other wrap, but it is actually paint with clear coat. If it's cheaper than painting, it may be a good option.

[timmy318]

I posted this earlier, but here it is again: http://www.flxpaint.com/welcome.htm. I'm not a huge fan of the matte vinyl (although that blue z06 looks pretty good) and this seems like a good alternative. It installs just like any other wrap, but it is actually paint with clear coat. If it's cheaper than painting, it may be a good option.

I was looking at that earlier. I emailed them about a quote on how much it would be to "wrap" the 818. I used an Honda S2000 since the 818 and 2000 seem to be simliar in size. Hope to hear a nice number from them!!!!

[GUNS]

I e-mailed them too using a Lotus Elise. It will be nice to compare the S2000 and elise and see how close the estimate is. I'm guessing it's going to be $3k-$5k, hopefully the former.

[Xusia]

For difference in price from $500 (wrap) to $3000 (paint), I can afford to re-wrap a lot of panels. Just sayin'...

Also, wouldn't the wrap actually provide some additional protection? I know it does on my bike, on my phone, on my tablet, etc..

[wleehendrick]

That will be an issue for me since I'd like my 818C to be a daily. There's no shaded parking at work - I'm not sure what to do about that really.

Car cover? That's my plan for parking at work.

[GUNS]

For difference in price from $500 (wrap) to $3000 (paint), I can afford to re-wrap a lot of panels. Just sayin'...

Also, wouldn't the wrap actually provide some additional protection? I know it does on my bike, on my phone, on my tablet, etc..

Agreed, however the paint "wrap" could be a good option for someone who doesn't like vinyl and can't afford to paint.

[Nuul]

Car cover? That's my plan for parking at work.

That's an option. I'd never hear the end of it from the doctors that drive Ferraris & Porsches to work though.

[Mechie3]

That's an option. I'd never hear the end of it from the doctors that drive Ferraris & Porsches to work though.

You can't hear them if they can't keep up. :D

Mine will just be parked outside. I've considered making a bikini type top that will clip to the windshield top and the roll bar just to keep the sun off the interior somewhat, bird poop off the seats, and keep the honest man honest with not trying to touch things.

[metalmaker12]

I am painting, i got a good price on paint and use of a booth, sorry Kalstar, well maybe we can do vinyl graphics etc

[metalmaker12]

It looks good from the pic, but in person we don't know, I have seen some wraps up close, and some look great, but others are kind of ah ok,depends on the installer and product, much like paint, thing with paint is that you can repair it and it holds up in direct sunlight and last longer than 5-7 years. Your right about the 15k thing though. I am painting if I can get a good price on booth rental.

Btw 5'9, and yea 6.2 should be fine, the seat could go back further. I do say over 6.5 would be tricky

[07FIREBLADE]

I got quotes of 1500-2500 to wrap my friends s2k. Thats why we decided to try it ourselves. For the price you cant really beat it. Its jusg a pain if you mess up or if you want to change colors. This is the only reason why I'm thinking about using Plasti dip kits.

http://m.youtube.com/results?q=plasti%20dip#/watch?v=rNY9Dx617N8

Here's a link to a short video on the subject. Various color options available. The finish holds up pretty well to. I've dipped a few sets of wheels this way to.

[metalmaker12]

Nice, good way to ruin a s4, sorry dude as a ex- auto body tech this is not a thing to do.

[07FIREBLADE]

It peels right off just like a sticker. If it's just going to be red gel coat is not something that's gonna hurt the finish since most will be wanting different colors. Most will prant or wrap. This is just another alternative to the issue.

[Benji]

Nice, good way to ruin a s4, sorry dude as a ex- auto body tech this is not a thing to do.

Ruin? Don't be silly, do a little more research.

[metalmaker12]

I know it peals off etc, I meant ruined in the sense it looked bad and cheap to me. He covered an Audi which has Spices Hecker high quality finish with $200 dollar flat black rubber spray.I am trying to be optimistic, but It is just hard for me. I have to see it in action and see the finish quality and durability etc, but I am pretty sure it will not impress me, and I doubt I will respect it. It is my opinion and that only. I understand we are all a bit uneasy with the hand we have been dealt, but to me finish is what makes a car, and I find it hard to not take it as serious as the rest of the build. I don't want to make anyone feel that this is not an option, I just can't see it as something I could ever do. I would wrap a car, but for such an investment I feel good old fashion paint is the way to go. Trust me I am innovative as can be, but this just seems like a weak way out guys.

[bnr32jason]

If he likes the look of it, and it offers protection to the factory paint, I don't really see a problem. So in two or three years time when he's ready to sell/trade-in the car he can peel that crap off and have essentially perfect showroom new paint.

[metalmaker12]

It is not a problem, to each there own, and it is a cool idea, but just hard for a guy that knows true body work/ paint quality etc. It is so bad to me I could barely watch the video lol, like I got paint prep 101 ocd.

[07FIREBLADE]

It was also a bad example on my part he does a better job in other videos. He also sells the stuff and has a buisness. Just check out his other videos.

[Benji]

Yep, not the only colour available, it was purely an example. There are lots of colours and even the option of gloss and metallic finishes.

It won't peal off or rather it will only peal off just as easily as a wrap will if done properly, they put a car through a car wash and jet washed it with the high pressure nozzle right next to the paint and it was fine.

We know wraps can fade but we don't know how plasti-dip will hold up yet, if a wrap gets scratched/knicked then it can't be repaired whereas plasti-dip can.

Ultimately though, painting it like you suggest will be the best finish.

[timmy318]

Still don't know what I'll be going with. Love the plastic-dip but with the ease that guy pulled it off I'm just not seeing it being that durable in real life (rock chips, etc...). Most likely going to paint it......

[Xusia]

Keep in mind he peeled it off almost immediately. I'm willing to bet that's a bit harder once it's fully dry and sealed (or whatever)...

[Flamshackle]

Btw 5'9, and yea 6.2 should be fine, the seat could go back further. I do say over 6.5 would be tricky

I am almost 6.5 so I am keen to see someone around my height in it. You fit awesome in there!

[Nuul]

You can't hear them if they can't keep up. :D

Heh, I'm sure they would make the trip to IT just to rib me about it. They are pretty good guys for the most part though. One time I had to go help one of them because a watch auction site (chrono24.com) wasn't loading for him on his laptop. After I got it fixed he showed me a $24K watch he was looking at buying. I'm thinking "wow, I could buy an 818 with a built 2.34 from MPS for that." They really do live in a different world than the rest of us. This is one of the reasons I'm very thankful that FFR is making a car I can afford. It may not be as polished as a Porsche, but it will be every bit as fun to drive if not more so because I built it with my own two hands.

[Wayne Presley]

It may not be as polished as a Porsche, but it will be every bit as fun to drive if not more so because I built it with my own two hands.
Add one more to the group that gets it :D

[Xusia]

+1. And don't forget, they aren't just fun to drive - they are very competitive from a performance standpoint as well!

[flytosail]

Add one more to the group that gets it :D

Add two. While it is not a carbon fiber boat, I know every inch of it.

http://i241.photobucket.com/albums/ff124/flytosail/2cc51fc6c5c4e9a11b071dfdc20adee8.jpg

[metalmaker12]

I give you guys merit for the dipping option, I been researching even more it and it could catch on, and it will improve over time as wraps have, but I am a little oldschool ya know, and paint has been the finish on cars for like 120 years, so I am sticking with it.

+1

[flytosail]

I give you guys merit for the dipping option, I been researching even more it and it could catch on, and it will improve over time as wraps have, but I am a little oldschool ya know, and paint has been the finish on cars for like 120 years, so I am sticking with it.

+1

Sure beats varnishing. But, most likely the same amount of sanding.

[Benji]

Yup, I'm not going to lie, you have skills if you can do it yourself.

Even if I could learn it, I doubt I'd have the patience!

[metalmaker12]

This Hobby, Craft, Job is all about extreme patience, but It is attainable for almost anyone if they work hard at it.

[thestigwins]

I was checking out AJW's 818 donor blog and I noticed a mention of hard top.


We learned that the idea of thermo plastic with color options at time of production would not be able to happen based of the variation in quality of the larger pieces. It will come in a red fiberglass that you have the option to paint, vinyl wrap or plastidip. Another thing, the car wont be released until the hardtop is 100% dialed. Dave wants to ensure that this add on is good to go before these cars go for sale to prevent any disappointments. Some additional improvements are being made to the 818 body.

I was not aware of a hard top. I assumed we were talking about soft tops??

[Nuul]

I was not aware of a hard top. I assumed we were talking about soft tops??

Nor was I. Hardtop, targa, soft top, etc has been discussed to death on this forum but I don't think we've ever seen anything official saying what is going to be offered.

[JeromeS13]

I'll reserve all speculation for after an official announcement from Dave.

[flynntuna]

The stated goal of a "swatch watch" approach hasn't been changed. It's just going to take longer than any of us would like. Issues have come up, thermoformed panels ect. FFR is commited to putting out a quality product, and it might be years before a hardtop will be added to the line. They have to get these two initial models right first, get a return on this huge investment before other models can be started. I have no doubt FFR will accomplish their goals and make a big mark in the automotive world.

[Mechie3]

My guess is soft top. He's talked quite a bit about a softtop being available at launch.

[Joe Scott]

Hey Everybody. nothing has been set in stone for a top. trust me once something is decided and brought out to the public, everyone will know.. very fast

Joe@FFRTECH

[thestigwins]

Hey Everybody. nothing has been set in stone for a top. trust me once something is decided and brought out to the public, everyone will know.. very fast

Joe@FFRTECH

Thanks for the quick response.

[Mechie3]

Hey Everybody. nothing has been set in stone for a top. trust me once something is decided and brought out to the public, everyone will know.. very fast

Joe@FFRTECH

How fast? 1.5 G's fast?

:D Sorry, had to.