818 Brief Update

[Dave Smith]

A lot of people have asked how the 818 sounds. Here's a VERY short clip from our performance and durability testing as well as some miscellaneous pictures.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GQOKxJyWOmI

We will be providing more information on the 818 and production status at our Winter Open House. IF you are on the 818 production schedule, you will get a more detailed e-mail prior to the Winter Open House.

https://www.factoryfive.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/IMG-20130131-01077.jpg

https://www.factoryfive.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/IMG-20130131-01073.jpg

https://www.factoryfive.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/DSC_9351.jpg

https://www.factoryfive.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/DSC_9185.jpg

[Erik W. Treves]

WOW!!! WOW!!! WOW!!! I might have to sell my roadster now!!! DAve I might need 2 kits...a S and a R....2013 is going to be a fun year :D

Thanks to you and your team for all your hard work!

[Mechie3]

Awwww yeah!

[metalmaker12]

**** yea, that was not even all out, I might be getting a second one down the road. I can not get enough. See you at Moochfeast

[WIS89]

Dave-

You may want to have the driver's side rear tire checked on the S model. Something doesn't look quite right. Seems like there is something growing out of the car; odd.

WOW does that car sound amazing, and it looks like it is moving along pretty darn well! I think these cars are going to be extraordinarily successful!! Moochfest will be nice, but product launch and some build threads are going to be even better!

Way to go Factory Five; looks like you have a winner!!

Regards,

Steve

[Silvertop]

Great Sound!! Equal Length Headers???

[Xusia]

I think I can work with that sound! :)

[timmy318]

I think I can work with that sound! :)

Yea..... I think most of us can!

[thestigwins]

These 818 threads are making me sad. I didn't preorder and now won't be able to get one for over a year or more.

[Maximus]

Production rates should increase after it actually starts this summer. A year wait now might be 6 months in 6 months, however parts availability will probably be an issue as stated elsewhere.

[FFR-ADV]

Thank you for sharing this Dave!!!

Looking forward to hearing more....Quite Literally ;)

Congratulations to Jim and the entire 818 development team!

[Andr3w]

Sweet. Wish I held out a little longer and didn't go all out on my car lol. Can't wait to hear more info on this!

[Hayai]

A year wait now might be 6 months in 6 months

Wait a tick. :p


Nice to see the car moving, looks and sounds good!

[Dave Smith]

The car was dyno'd (818R in the brief video) before we left for durability and track testing. It produced 260 rwhp. We will have alot more information at Moochfest and emailed to pre-orders Friday. With respect to the development path, pre-production, production, production ramp up, parts availability and production planning... All I can say is that the company with clear leadership, staffed by a talented and seasoned team, and guided by clear design goals and a directive from me that makes the QUALITY of this new product introduction of paramount importance... I guess I'm saying "don't worry, the project is being managed in a remarkably professional way, distinct from ANY kit car maker and better than anything we've done to date. We've hit EVERY project milestone and promised target date and we'll launch on-time and with the design vetted and ready for sale. The development plan doesn't end with product launch, it merges with it and continues. We've got development partners and customers who will bring the design and build experience to others. Grassroots Motorsports and this very forum among many, will help direct and guide platform derivatives and we can only imagine where it will go globally. We've laid the groundwork with great export partners in Europe, South America, Canada, Malaysia, and Australia. All this work coordinated on a complex but logical pert chart of jobs to be done and tasks dependent on and building on others.

It's late and I can't seem to type in anything but record run-on sentences... I've heard others compare this car to similar offerings from other companies and I just smile and say to myself in my best Jack Nicholson accent as The Joker, "wait till they get a load of me!" We've put more quality thought and engineering into this car than I can describe. I'm so proud of the development team and EVERYONE at FFR. Areas like Operations has made major changes and is ahead of schedule. They've added laser cutting processes in-house, constructed mezzanine space for inventory, established packaging, welding, and composites areas (just in case) and are busy setting up suppliers and Bills of Materials and Pack-Lists, we've set conservative production plans and been working on a million other details, and thats just Ops getting ready... all the while continuing to make and ship the best quality Mk4's, Coupes, Hot Rods and GTMs...

I am not the right person to ask, but I will tell you that the 818 is our best work together, it represents the technological competence and maturity of a team that is not going to it's first rodeo, is MY PERSONAL commitment to fulfilling the charter that I read at the University of Wisconsin (That a man's reach should exceed his grasp), BUT MOSTLY that this represents the beginning for us at FFR. In so many ways we are just getting started.

Technology and design and connectivity are on the side of small companies like ours. My grasp of reality is firmly in check, and while we are a small company with modest resources, I do believe that we have our best and most exciting years ahead of us. Considering all that we've done together, THAT is a big statement, but for sure the truth. I gotta go to bed and try and fall asleep so that tomorrow comes as fast as possible, there's so much to do and so many great stories to build! Hope to see you guys at Moochfest.

Dave

[Mechie3]

:D

Looking forward to Friday (and not just because it's payday and the day before Saturday!).

[riptide motorsport]

Very nice.....congrats on a job well done.

[shinn497]

I'm curious what the donor car is. 260 whp for a wrx is surprisingly good. It makes me wonder if what i was saying about the shorter exhaust, more ideal intercooler position, and awd--> rwd conversion turned out to be true.

[longislandwrx]

Shinn, iirc the motor was from an 06 and has a stage 2 tune.

[shinn497]

Can you define stage 2? Most places consider that a tune + upipe/downpipe. that would make those numbers make a whole lot more sense. Still wondering what FFR did to the exhuast to both keep it legal and make it fit into the back.

[Mechie3]

That's the R, exhaust may not be legal.

260whp isn't bad (nor out of the ordinary) for a RWD (remember 15% loss vs 22% loss for AWD) stage 2 06 WRX with a safe tune.

[longislandwrx]

Stage 2 on an 06 is just a downpipe and off the shelf tune. the 06's didnt have catted uppipes so swapping the uppipe is not really necessary.

[ursa5000]

Composites ?!? Now this is getting very interesting.. I can only imagine the possiblities that will open up by bringing that tech in-house.

Thanks Dave for the insights into the 818 rollout. FFR will continue to rock the automotive world.... we here on the forum can feel it and see it. The tech revolution allows smart and nimble small companies to play and win in the big leagues.

Da Bear

[Mechie3]

the 06's didnt have catted uppipes so swapping the uppipe is not really necessary.

Not necessary, but still beneficial.

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1942411

http://www.grimmspeed.com/images/product_images/up_pipe_flowbench_results.jpg

Here's a study where they cut apart the OEM pipe and noted internal structures, etc. Scroll through until you see pics, then read those posts.
http://www.iwsti.com/forums/gd-exhaust/101214-stock-up-pipe-more-serious-look.html

[longislandwrx]

correct. meaning necessary to run an OTS stage 2 map on a 06.

better performing parts will always perform better.

[Mechie3]

Yeah. There was just a very pervasive thought a while back on NASIOC that changing the uppipe on an STI or 06+ WRX was a fools errand. Wanted to make sure that didn't continue here.

[David Hodgkins]

Great update Dave! I can't wait to see the first 818s rolling out of FFR.

:)

[Oppenheimer]

I thought a key point Dave mentioned was "Grassroots Motorsports and this very forum among many, will help direct and guide platform derivatives..."

That seems to reinforce the idea that swatch-watch means much more than street, race, and MPG 818 versions. It seems to imply the 818 is intended to be a platform to build many different variants, that haven't been planned out yet. There is so much potential here.

But I think Dave is smart to be foremost concerned with first getting these 2 818's launched and successful.

[RM1SepEx]

Can you define stage 2? Most places consider that a tune + upipe/downpipe. that would make those numbers make a whole lot more sense. Still wondering what FFR did to the exhuast to both keep it legal and make it fit into the back.

So this raises another simple question... to stay legal my plan is to use my header and up pipe from AJW
http://ajwperformanceproducts.com/store/#!/~/product/category=1092003&id=6183879
with a bell mouth adaptor for the offset req for the 818 and the stock downpipe and cat in my 05... perhaps a second cat and small muffler

with a tune can I expect 220-230 hp at the wheels??? That's my goal!

[Mechie3]

What motor? 2.0 or 2.5?

[metalmaker12]

You have a 05 with 227 stock crank hp. This equals 192.95 whp with the 15% reduction. Cobb Accessport if you want do it yourself quick easy reflash. I used them on my stock engine cars for quick power before I used open source tunes. You can get them used from people or new for $600. If you buy used make sure they uninstalled it from the car it was on, or it wont work, unless it got remapped by Cobb.



04-05 Stage 1 15%HP / 20%TQ stage 2 26%HP / 31%TQ Cobb @ crank

261HP/272 TQ 286HP/297TQ Cobb @ crank


So 818 whp/wtq stage 1 221whp/231wtq or stage 2 243whp/252wtq

[RM1SepEx]

so with my header and up pipe 240 RWH is only a tune away...

[AZPete]

My wife just yelled "Knock it off!" after I played the sound of the 818 a few times.
Okay, maybe it was 27 times at full volume. It sounds GREAT but she thinks Amer Idol is more important.
I need a project!
Pete

[flytosail]

My wife just yelled "Knock it off!" after I played the sound of the 818 a few times.
Okay, maybe it was 27 times at full volume. It sounds GREAT but she thinks Amer Idol is more important.
I need a project!
Pete

Got to play it twice before the comment of "guy thing" was mentioned. Considering that when we had a Hobie Cat put she mentioned, "I did not know sailboats could go this fast" in a goood way, makes me wonder how often she will want to boorow this when it is done.

[wallace18]

I was sad there were no 818's to look at on my 2/4/13 visit . But the video is great. Sorry I missed Dave as well. Everyone else was wonderful to meet. I highly recommend you visit FFR sometime. JMO.

[longislandwrx]

15338

with a smaller battery, some elbows and replacing those flex lines with hard pipe it should be pretty easy to get a decent sized storage area up front. very cool.

[rjh2pd]

15338

with a smaller battery, some elbows and replacing those flex lines with hard pipe it should be pretty easy to get a decent sized storage area up front. very cool.
I agree, but if you make it too deep it will be hard to get to since you are going to have to lean over the fenders. It should be good for a medium sized duffle bag.

[Turboguy]

15338

with a smaller battery, some elbows and replacing those flex lines with hard pipe it should be pretty easy to get a decent sized storage area up front. very cool.


What exactly are you planning on storing up there? Backup R-compound tires and your own set of orange cones for the autocross?

[Mechie3]

set of orange cones for the autocross?

This.

Bored at work? Instant autocross!

[longislandwrx]

This.



Exactly... but seriously, a tool bag, lug wrench, small air tank, small bottle jack, extra oil/coolant, fold up canopy, etc... same things I always bring to the track.



forgot to add a cooler full of beer.

[Mechie3]

Check yer email! I see Go pro's attached to those cars!

Project 818 Pre-Order Update #4
February 7, 2013 Update
This weekend's planned Winter Open House has been delayed by a week (new date is Saturday, February 16th) and I was planning on presenting a comprehensive update on where we are with Project 818. I will be sending out an e-mail to everyone 818 pre-order list since not everyone can attend the Open House here in Wareham. You will get this e-mail next week before the Open House.
In the meantime, you should know that we've completed endurance testing and are racing towards production. More information next week. For now, you can check out our web gallery with updated photos from race/endurance testing.
Check out this YouTube video of the sound of the car at speed.
Thanks for your support and if you have any questions, please forward them via e-mail to info@factoryfive.com.
Thanks again!

Dave Smith
President

[RSxx]

wow, they pictures are amazing. Can't wait until they release more testing onboard videos next week. Sounds they are making great progress towards production.
November cant' come fast enough!!! I want my 818 now!!! but i will be patient.

Any idea what size tire does the R have in those pictures.

[Wayne Presley]

I'm the luckiest guy, I was invited to be part of the 818 development team. I've been around since my first FFR roadster in 1997 (20 FFRs ago) and for the last couple of years I've been wrenching/racing some very similar cars to the 818 (NA Elise, SC Elise and turbo Elise). We tested both the R and S versions and both are OMG good. I can't wait for the videos to get posted but even those pale in comparison to looking through the windshield, hearing the flat 4 at full song and the incredible corning forces. Nimble, great brakes, fast with a stock WRX 2.5, corners very flat, I could go on about them for hours but I have to get back to work. I can not wait to get my hands on my 818! Or back in these cars for the next round of testing. But there is a downside to being the luckiest guy, not being able to share with everyone the details of my experience with the testing. Just know that I still have one of those smiles that a crowbar couldn't pull off every time my mind drifts off into one of those memories in the cars...

Here's a pic I took right after we unloaded Monday morning.

http://i213.photobucket.com/albums/cc175/vcpinjectionpb/IMG_8523_zps9455dc9e.jpg

[David]

Congrats Wayne... you are indeed a lucky but also very worthy dude... Its great that you have lots of time in the Lotus cars. That is indeed the benchmark to compare too. If the FFR can match those incredible machines in handling and feel I cant imagine the success they will have.

The racer looks so good with those wheels! I cant wait to see the street car with those, or ones like that! Man they make the car.

David

[Movieman]

I don't like rear engined Japanese powered cars. I'm from the 60's where you stuffed the biggest thing you could find into the lightest car it would fit in BUT Jumping BeJEEEZUS does that 818R just reach out and say "Your backside belongs in me!"
Never thought I'd say that but damn have they got this one right and that sound..You do know that at age 61 I'm not supposed to have those bodily reactions..:D

[philly15]

so i dont suppose anyone knows the wheel/tire size used on both cars here do they??

[Hayai]

This is insane. I'm going to die of anticipation before Moochfest next week!!

[longislandwrx]

so i dont suppose anyone knows the wheel/tire size used on both cars here do they??

just a guess, but they look to be Hoosier A6 tires... if they are trying to maintain the gearing im guessing its a 285/30R18 on a 10" rim

[JeromeS13]

I'm guessing they're smaller than that. From the pictures, the fronts are 205/40/17.

[BrandonDrums]

Looks like a revised front clip on the S! Looks nice, can't wait to see it with paint!!

[philly15]

I'm guessing they're smaller than that. From the pictures, the fronts are 205/40/17.

they look much wider than that

[wleehendrick]

The S looks like it's has the 225/255-18 Toyo Proxes that it was wearing at SEMA. The Hoosiers on the R like wider in the rear, 285 at least, and 225 (or wider) in front.

[boostinsidewayz]

i would love to hear a little more about the brakes if possible. stock pads? what about fade? i would think there would be little to none given the light weight of the car.

[D2W]

Looks like a revised front clip on the S! Looks nice, can't wait to see it with paint!!

What do you see other than the black paint that is different? I compared it to the previous studio gallery shots and can't see a difference.

[D2W]

The S does not have the same tires and wheels it had on at sema. I'm guessing they're stock WRX items.

[metalmaker12]

no there enki 17 in wheels on the s, and i do not like the way they look. The R looks way better, they need to put a nice looking wheel on the S like the R's staggered setup. The black out thing, I have no idea what thats about, but it looks silly and I hope it has no purpose other than for testing.

[Mechie3]

Stock pads are expensive and not so great. Good aftermarket pads are cheaper and perform better.

[thestigwins]

It looks like they uploaded a new video to YouTube


http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=mwrddKiFYBY

[timmy318]

Here's the desktop friendly version:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mwrddKiFYBY

[clintavo]

Did you see how fast it cornered at 1:47!? Looks like an old TV show with the action sped up!

[blueafro]

There is some good footage in there, but do your ears a favor and watch at least the first 2:30 with the sound off.

[JeromeS13]

I spy some sort of anti-roll bar on the S!

[Wayne Presley]

here's a part of the video above's raw footage which has great sound


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r88yLHZZ_4U

[skullandbones]

Can you imagine 20 of those flying by? It would sound like the Indy 500! Pretty cool sound. WEK.

[bnr32jason]

Been staring at my Gmail account waiting for the 818 pre-order update. Nothing yet :(

[shinn497]

Any word on the lap times and comparison to other cars at that track?

Or better yet, wayne presley, can you provide your thoughts compared to other rides you've driven??

[0100]

^+1 THIS!!!






http://i213.photobucket.com/albums/cc175/vcpinjectionpb/IMG_8523_zps9455dc9e.jpg

Looks badass!!! Just needs 2" spacers (or proper offset wheels) on the front though.

[Rodster]

Dave -
Thanks for the update. I have been watching the progress of this new project very closely....... But I have to finish my Coupe first.

See you in sunny Huntington Beach - soon!

-wayne

[bromikl]

Is anyone familiar with that track? I bet we could get an approximate lap time from the video and compare it to other cars on that track.

[Wayne Presley]

For testing the lap times were irrelevant. We were testing the cars handling, durability, ergonomics, and overall package. None of the drivers had been to the track before, it was very cool to cold outside, and we were not pushing the cars all the way around to get a fast lap.

[Mike N]

Is anyone familiar with that track?

Could be mistaken but I think it's this place. http://nccar.us/

[Wayne Presley]

Any word on the lap times and comparison to other cars at that track?

Or better yet, wayne presley, can you provide your thoughts compared to other rides you've driven??

I've driven quite a few cars at the track (FFR challenge car, Type 65 Coupe, 2009 Z06, Porsche GT3, turbo Lotus Elise, BMW 135, SC elise, stock Elise). I started at the track roadracing motorcycles when I was 18 and did that for 6 years including 3+ years working at the California Superbike School. The last 2 years I've raced a fairly stock Lotus Elise in the SCCA Touring 2 division. The 818 is good, really good. By the end of the second day of testing I would hop in either the 818R or 818S for a race. Both were fast and well balanced. You are all going to be so impressed when you get behind the wheel of your own 818.

[boostinsidewayz]

hey wayne, how was the braking. did you guys do any 60-0 or 100-0 tests? not looking for actual distances, but did you get that brain coming through your eyes feeling?
with my z06, when i'm on my A6s and hawk pads, its an incredible feeling. i really hope i get that some rush from the 818

[Wayne Presley]

hey wayne, how was the braking. did you guys do any 60-0 or 100-0 tests? not looking for actual distances, but did you get that brain coming through your eyes feeling?
with my z06, when i'm on my A6s and hawk pads, its an incredible feeling. i really hope i get that some rush from the 818

S car had the stock pedal box/master cylinder modified for manual brakes, R had Wilwood dual master cylinder pedal box. Both set ups had great feel and you could lock the tires up if wanted so they have plenty of raw braking power. With A6's on the 818, it should stop shorter than your Z06. I routinely out brake everything in my Elise at the track and the 818 feels like it has the same braking ability.

[Mechie3]

Modified for manual brakes: Does that mean you just capped off the booster?

[Wayne Presley]

From what I remember, Jim said he moved the push rod attachment point up on the pedal arm to get more mechanical leverage. Both cars had great brake modulation without excessive pedal effort.

[boostinsidewayz]

With A6's on the 818, it should stop shorter than your Z06. I routinely out brake everything in my Elise at the track and the 818 feels like it has the same braking ability.

Thats exactly what i wanted to hear :D

Thanks

[shinn497]

If both could lock the brakes, I suppose you get more precision with the will wood kit then. Which is of course desirable since brake locking isn't the most ideal way of stopping the car (tires have significantly less dynamic COF).

The Elise comparison is what i expected. I feel like its weight and dimensions make it very comparable. However, I don't know how well the Konis would compare to the Elise's suspension. In addition, I'm not sure of the Elise's weight distribution. In particular, the COG. One would think the lower cog due to the boxer would benefit it. Any opinions on this?

I'm also extremely curious of how capable the S is relative to the R. With a decent tire swap, or even a set of purpose track tires, and possibly a rear wing, could it reach that 1.5 figure? If it had upgraded brakes and more power, could it hang with an Ariel Atom? I'm so curious....