Emissions in Atlanta Metro area?

[Kelly]

Hi. I am in the dreaming, planning and research stage. The kids are finally on their own and I am about to retire from the Army in a couple of years. We just purchased a home in the Atlanta Metro area which brings me to my question. How are those that live in the 13 counties requiring emissions around the Atlanta area getting licensed? I am new to the forums and have used the search features. I have searched the internet, and have read the Official Code of Georgia from the SEMA site. I have played out my build in my head many times, and have a pretty good idea of the components that I want. The engine setup is the sticking point. If I read the code correctly I will not be able to register the vehicle due to emissions unless, I am to go with the newest of engines and all emission components, ie currently the Coyote 5.0 and CAT converters. While I would love the HP, it is not the way I want to go. I would prefer to do a more traditional appearing engine, even though I will probably go with EFI such as what is offered from Breeze. The information that I have been able to find has been conflicting at best. One person will say that they got it licensed very easy and the next says that he couldn’t at all. This morning I sent off an email to the county vehicle registration office asking much the same as here. Now, weather I get a response is debatable. Being stationed in Germany precludes me from just going down there and talking to them directly.

My goal is to start my build in a couple of years once I have retired and get back to Georgia and get to work again. So, I have time to figure this out before I start shelling money for parts and a kit. It is sometimes painful to be one that dreams and sees the reality of the situation at the same time, however it can also save you pain in your wallet down the road.

Kelly

[ClemsonS197]

I've been going through this recently. Here is what I've read, and been told by my local inspector. I am in one of the emissions counties.

1. All new kits will be the model year they are registered. So If I finish my car today, the state will call it a 2012 "1965 Cobra." No more antique tags.
2. All new cars get a 3 years pass until they have to get emissions. So, I don't need cats today, but in 3 years when I pass emissions, I will.
3. New cars need to have an OBD port for the emissions place to read. If you go with an older EFI motor, will it have an OBD port? If it doesn't, you'll need to talk to the state to see if your car would be able to use a roller test.

I'm using a Coyote, and going to have to build cats to support emissions. FFR has no plans to offer Coyote cats. They do offer 4.6L and old 5.0L cats though.

[Kelly]

Believe it or not, I have had several email's today with the Henry County vehicle registration office. I honestly didnt expect a reply. She sent me information that of course I had already read. So I kind of cornered her about the regulations being subject to interpretation depending on the office you go to and the person you talk to. She has sent my messages to her contact at the clean air authority. When I finally get some kind of answer I will post the email's here. Maybe wearing the uniform might be the push to get better service, some standard, and some leverage for all of the Georgia residents here.

[Kelly]

Ma'am,
I am a service member currently stationed in Germany, and just recently purchased a home in McDonough. I am researching information about building a replica of a 1965 Shelby Cobra as a hobby car when I return from the military. I have read as much information about the titling and registration of these kinds of vehicles as I can find, and to be honest the Official Code of Georgia is confusing and lengthy and seems to go in circles. I am hoping that I could get some clarification before I spend a good portion of money to start this project.

Vehicle information:

1. Manufacture of the replica is Factory Five Racing.

2. The vehicle will be assembled by me replicating as closely as possible a 1965 Shelby Cobra.

3. The vehicle will be assembled using a combination of new and refurbished parts.

Questions:

1. I understand that the vehicle must be titled as the year it was completed. As the vehicle is a replica of a 1965 vehicle, is it required to pass the completed year emissions standards? Example: Assembly completion date 1 Feb 2013. Would that require 2013 Emissions standards?

2. If I use an engine that is as close to the original vehicle as possible when in 1965 there were not emission standards, are there exceptions for the emissions for this type of vehicle?

3. If I use a engine from a 1994 Ford Mustang for example in this replica, does it have to conform to the year the engine was manufactured or the completed date of the replica as mentioned in question 1?

Thank you for taking the time to help me to understand this.

Respectfully,
Kelly

To me:
I just saw this email and I will get back with you on all the required forms and titling process. Simple process and can be done.
Sincerely,


To me:
Will this vehicle be built from a kit or are you purchasing an original car that you are going to restore?



Ma'am,
It will be from a kit Purchased from Factory Five Racing. I would be required to source the engine, transmission, and rear end from either a donor vehicle such as a mustang, or separately from other sources like Summit Racing, just down the street from you.

BTW, thank you for the fast reply. I wasn't sure if I would even get one as I am sure you are very busy.

Respectfully,

Kelly Bentz


To me:
I will get back with you shortly. I’m going to make copies of what is needed for you to look at.



To a state emissions representative:
If a customer uses a motor from a year that does not require emission in a kit vehicle, will it still be required to have emission since the kit vehicle year model will be the year model of completion? But if the customer was to use a 1994 model I can safely assume it does need to pass emission. IF not correct please let me know.

Sincerely,


To me:
I hope this will help. She will contact you.



Reply from state emissions representative:
The car will need an emissions if the model year (according to the title) is a 1988 to 2009 for 2012.

If this is considered a Kit Car and the motorist has proof it may qualify for non-conforming status, it still has to be tested just under a different criteria. If you provide the motorist contact information I will reach out to him.

Ma'am,
Thank You. I have read this and the information below is what I mean about talking in circles and I don't understand. Please bear with me:

The information you sent keeps referring to a "rebuilder" and the repair of a vehicle. Are you considering this as a rebuilt vehicle? I personally don't care if that is what it is considered as I would not be selling this vehicle, but it also opens up questions.

1. This "kit" comes in two forms, one to use parts from a donor Mustang, and the other a more complete kit that the parts can be sourced from any auto parts store like Summit and no Mustang required. How does that work when there is no donor vehicle to get the VIN from for the parts as required on the T-129?

2. That brings back the question of emissions, which I am waiting to hear from Ms. XXXX. If I do use the donor option, should this vehicle only have to conform to the emissions for the donor vehicle, and not the more stringent current?

Honestly this could be simple or it could be very complex, because the regulations don't specifically address these situations. I truly am not trying to be difficult, and I know from people on forums of others doing the same thing in the Metro Area that they are having the same questions without answers. It appears that the regulation is subject to interpretation depending on which licensing office you go to. The answers to these questions will determine weather I can build this car for around $25000, or $45000. That is honestly the approximate price difference due to title and emissions. Any additional help would be greatly appreciated.

Pg 100

"The year model of this vehicle will be the year that the vehicle was built. Year model of the donor "Mustang" (1994)or of the production date on the MSO(2011) or the completion date of the entire car(2013)? The make of this vehicle will be the trade name of the kit vehicle(i.e. Bradley GT, Gazelle, ect. (Factory Five Racing I presume)). The model name of the vehicle will be the model shown on the manufacturer's statement of origin (MSO) for the kit (i.e. Replica of a 1929 Mercedes Benz (1965 Shelby Cobra))"

The car will need an emissions if the model year (according to the title)(of the donor car or the kit?) is a 1988 to 2009 for 2012


Respectfully,

Kelly

To me:
I going to see if I can’t get someone to personally assist you from the state that processes this type of vehicle titles in the salvage department. I sorry, but I don’t want to lead you in the wrong direction.

[ClemsonS197]

Kelly,

This is what I found and my local inspector pointed to:


Kit cars that did not receive Non-Conforming Status by December 31, 1998, or those registered in one of the 13 covered counties after December 31, 1998, must have all the required emission control systems for the model year shown on the registration card.

http://www.cleanairforce.com/motorists/otherexemptions.php

Here are bunch of excerpts from the Sema GA literature and I was sent basically the same thing by my inspector:

First, what's the model year of the kit:


(7) For kit cars, the model of the vehicle shall be deemed to be the model year of the
vehicle as established in the vehicle registration database maintained by the Georgia
Department of Motor Vehicle Safety.

So, if I complete my car this year, it will be a 2012 "1965 Cobra"

Second, do I need emissions:


Emissions inspections are required for vehicles registered in Cherokee, Clayton, Cobb, Coweta, DeKalb,
Douglas, Fayette, Forsyth, Fulton, Gwinnett, Henry, Paulding and Rockdale Counties and are tested at the
time that the vehicle is registered or re-registered. All 1996 and newer vehicles receive a three-part
inspection, including an OBD test, a gas cap integrity test, and a visual inspection of the catalytic
converter to check for tampering or removal.

I'm in one of the 13 counties, so yes I do since 2012 is newer than 1996.

But, I do get a 3 year exemption, like all new cars:


1. New vehicles for the newest three (3) MYs

I don't think we can get non-conforming status since it's only open to vehicles registered in 1998 and older.

This is what I'm reading from:

http://www.bipac.net/semaga/TagTitleToolbox_GA.pdf

Click that link and call the guy listed for Henry county. He's the one that will be doing the inspection. Remember NO body work can be started until he's been out to do the inspection. Right now my build is on hold until FFR finishes the Coyote J-pipes. Ugh.

[Kelly]

I read the same information that you are referring to with the Clean Air Force, and SEMA. I also feel that what you have done with going with the coyote is probably the only way to get one on the road in the Metro area. I had to at least try. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results. So, unless I can find a way to title it in a different state that is a bit more receptive, I am going to have to follow your tracks. I do have a bit of time before I can start on this journey. The end result is to build my dream. I will keep watching and learning from those that post here and the other site. Thanks to all of you that post here.

Kelly

[ClemsonS197]

I read the same information that you are referring to with the Clean Air Force, and SEMA. I also feel that what you have done with going with the coyote is probably the only way to get one on the road in the Metro area.

You can use an older motor, you'll just need cats for it. FFR offers 302 cats. It's not too difficult to add cats to any of their j-pipes so whatever set up you want can be accommodated with a little work on your end.

[Kelly]

Ok I'm a bit confused now. If I use an older engine, say for example the Exlorer 5.0, it has to meet current model year emission standards, and not the standards for a 1998-2001 Explorer, correct? Even using the EFI from an aftermarket supplier (Breeze for example), Cats, and O2 sensors, would it meet the "current year" standards? I guess this is what I'm confused about. I dont have a problem with having to have emission equipment if that is what I have to have, not that I want it on this car, but you do what you got to do.

[ClemsonS197]

Ok I'm a bit confused now. If I use an older engine, say for example the Exlorer 5.0, it has to meet current model year emission standards, and not the standards for a 1998-2001 Explorer, correct? CORRECT Even using the EFI from an aftermarket supplier (Breeze for example), Cats, and O2 sensors, would it meet the "current year" standards? I guess this is what I'm confused about. I dont have a problem with having to have emission equipment if that is what I have to have, not that I want it on this car, but you do what you got to do.

The way I was read and it was told about it, is based on this:


(6) For vehicles which do not have the original engine, the model year of the chassis will
be considered the model year of the vehicle.

So your 2000 Explorer engine is not the "original" engine and there for the model year of the chassis is considered the model year of the vehicle.

For a kit car, the model year is the year the car was built:


The year model of this vehicle will be the year that the vehicle was built.

So if you finish you kit in 2012, your car is a 2012 regardless of what motor it has.

The emissions test is 3 part:


All 1996 and newer vehicles receive a three-part
inspection, including an OBD test, a gas cap integrity test, and a visual inspection of the catalytic
converter to check for tampering or removal.

So cats and an OBD port and you're good to go, IMHO. Again, call your Henry County inspector and see what he says. But that's the way the Cobb inspector and I see it.