Registration (Wisconsin as an example)

[jontallon]

I was researching last night how I would go about registering the 818 in Wisconsin, and I'm a bit concerned that it might not be possible - wondering if other people have researched this or not. In Wisconsin we are supposed to have one of the easiest registration processes due to the 'Hobbyist' plate type.

Here's the Department of Motor Vehicles website link:

http://www.dot.wisconsin.gov/drivers/vehicles/personal/special/hobbyist.htm#reconstructed

This works great for thinks like the '33 or the '65 coupe - you can see that any replica vehicle must be based on an original that is at least 20 years old. In the case of the 818, obviously that's not true. The 'Reconstructed Vehicle' category is what we have, but again the donor must be 20 years old. The 'Motorized Homemade Vehicle' seems like it can't use a donor...

So - has anybody figured out whether or not it is going to be possible to register the 818 in Wisconsin? I'm assuming other states have similar challenges.

Thanks!

[Ray]

Lots of good information has already been collected by SEMA so I'd start here: http://www.bipac.net/page.asp?content=tag_title_toolbox&g=SEMAGA.

Ray

PS: Just a fast glance looks like the 818 would be classified as a "Motorized homemade vehicle"

[shim2]

Best thing to do would be to call the DMV and ask them.

[slopoke]

you might check with some of the guys on the GTM forum ... I think there's a couple of them around Milwaukee

[Xusia]

Once you find the answer, please post it here: http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?4393-DMV-Vehicle-Registration-Information-Thread&highlight=vehicle+registration+thread

[jontallon]

Thanks for the responses. I sent an e-mail to the DMV e-mail address. Will post their response if I get one.

[Evan78]

Looks like homemade to me. Take my opinion with a grain of salt, but the Wisconsin Statutes 341.268 that are referenced in jontallon's DOT link have this:


(b) "Homemade vehicle" means any of the following:
1. A motor vehicle that has been constructed or assembled from new or used parts or both using a body and frame not originating from and not resembling any previously manufactured motor vehicle.
2. A motorcycle that is a reproduction of a vehicle originally made by another manufacturer and that consists of a reproduction body that is combined with a new, used, or replica frame and drivetrain.
They only mention that the body and frame are not originating from or resembling any previously manufactured vehicle. 818 should fall within that description.

[StatGSR]

Looks like homemade to me. Take my opinion with a grain of salt, but the Wisconsin Statutes 341.268 that are referenced in jontallon's DOT link have this:


They only mention that the body and frame are not originating from or resembling any previously manufactured vehicle. 818 should fall within that description.

that would be my interpretation as well. but as mentioned, if your serious about it, just call the DMV, i know its something i would wont to know 100% before dropping any coin.

[Smitty911]

Looks like we need to find a 1960's early 1970's, Prototype or Concept Car from Any manufacture, showing it at the worlds fair and all that, with some history attached.

That way we could say it was loosely based on XXX, but it never went into production. HA

Some Photoshop skills and a few Wikipedia links and it could be done. Ugh.

Smitty

PS - I do not support or condone any illegal activites that may or may not be used to defaud the Government, like they do to us.

[jontallon]

Looks like homemade to me. Take my opinion with a grain of salt, but the Wisconsin Statutes 341.268 that are referenced in jontallon's DOT link have this:


They only mention that the body and frame are not originating from or resembling any previously manufactured vehicle. 818 should fall within that description.

Aah - excellent. THANK YOU! The summary at the top of the link says:

"Vehicle must have been constructed from new or used parts not originating from or resembling a previously manufactured motor vehicle."

But the document linked to says:

"A motor vehicle that has been constructed or assembled from new or used parts or both using a body and frame not originating from and not resembling any previously manufactured motor vehicle."

That missing 'body and frame' is a fairly big change in the meaning of the sentence. Thank you for finding the difference!

[Evan78]

No problem. I would be surprised if the whole dang thing has to be built from scratch.

Like others have said, it'd be good to get confirmation from an official source and check with other groups in the same situation (GTM) to see what their experience has been.


What happens in January out there? The application form has this statement toward the end: "Vehicles with Hobbyist plates cannot be operated during the month of January unless a special temporary plate is purchased. These special temporary plates are available for $5 for fi ve consecutive days or $30 for the month of January only; complete form MV2750."

[jontallon]

I think the idea was that hobbyist cars shouldn't be daily drivers. So in the past they used to only be allowed to be driven for 6 months of the year or something like that. A while back they opened it up a bit to just say you can't drive them in January...

[Xusia]

LOL - the crazy ideas some lawmakers come up with! :D

[DMC7492]

Hi, It Might also be due to the fact the temperature here in appleton is -13 degrees farenheight!! Yes MINUS 13:D

[philly15]

Hi, It Might also be due to the fact the temperature here in appleton is -13 degrees farenheight!! Yes MINUS 13:D

haha yea it is, i got to unload my 818 today in this wonderful weather :) -35 to -40 with wind chill! I am also from Appleton, and we have a state trooper who comes into my work once a month to do the state vehicle inspections for reconstructed vehicles. He is a pretty big car enthusiast and said he teaches the class that goes through this kinda thing. I talked to him for a couple hours at work one day. Basically for us it would fall under a homemade build. so in order for it to be titled, it has to meet the requirements of a new vehicle manufacturer of the year you finish the car. So in this case, you have to meet the requirements set by the government for a new vehicle in 2014. So TPMS, emissions, air bags, etc. etc. It would then go for inspection to whomever is the inspector for your area. It really kinda sucks, but not totally out of the question. The key would be to get a hold of all the requirements and go from there to see if it is something worth doing.

[DennisL]

Just finished my 818S this fall. Now working on registration aspect. Looks like this will NOT be possible in Wisconsin. I have gone to 3 separate motor vehicle inspection sites going over the whole process with receipts , pictures, manual and certificate of origin. Unequivocal answer by all "NO WAY". Since it is not considered a replicar I will have to have all standards required by new cars including air bags, ABS, emissions etc.
I offered to drive to inspection site and they stated would have to ticket me if I did and impound car if I could not have it trailered back. One inspector even asked why I would do such a stupid thing as to try to build one of these cars since they would be a "deathtrap". Not a happy ending to about 1200 hours of work and $12,000 cash investment. Car is too large to use as paperweight or doorstop.

I have a daughter who lives in Minnesota, will see if it can be licensed there. Funny thing is that 60% of the cars in a typical Wal-Mart parking lot have no plates, registration or are not road worthy or able to pass inspection. Go Figure. Warning to people interested in building; Make sure it can be licensed in your locale.

Going to ease my pain by buying a Mini Cooper S which I hope can be licensed in Wisconsin.

[wleehendrick]

Dennis, that's a major bummer, but it's been discussed before, one option would be to try to home-brew some body panels with close enough resemblance to a vintage car to be considered a replica (the law doesn't say it has to be pretty or 100% accurate does it?). With the dimensions of the 818, I'm thinking Lotus Europa or Lancia Stratos :confused:

[Hindsight]

Agree - I'm thinking some decal graphics you can add on. The bottom line is this: YOU built the car. YOU can build the car to "approximate" whatever historic vehicle you want. I mean, I could buy a FF Coupe and modify it to look like the Ferrari it competed against in the 60's without too much difficulty. It would then become a Ferrari replica. Just because the manufacturer of the kit (that serves as your starting canvas) didn't intend for it to end up as a Ferrari or Lotus or whatever doesn't mean you can't make it one. Think of all the Porsche Speedsters that many companies put out there which are built off a VW Bug floor pan. Same thing. You start with one thing, and make it what you want. Throw some decals on there and make it what you want. Remember all the Fiero based kit cars of the 80's? Same thing.

Talking with the DMV about your options is not likely to produce a good outcome, only because they are used to dealing with the 99.9% of the population who goes out, buys a factory built car, and titles it. This is what they are trained for. Kit cars come up so rarely that they just don't know the answers. Your best option is to go get with the local kit/custom car community and ask them what to do. Do you have a "coffee and cars" type event anywhere around you? Maybe some car clubs of some sort? These are the people who are going to know what to do.

[Jaime]

My friend built a Factory Five Roadster back in the '90s. He sent his paperwork to some guy in North Dakota (I think). The guy bought the car from him, titled it, and sold it back to him for a few hundred more than he bought it for. Does anyone offer this type of service any more?

[flynntuna]

Have you seen the SEMA page on registering specialty vehicles?

http://www.bipac.net/semaga/TagTitleToolbox_WI_16-Apr-14.pdf

http://www.bipac.net/page.asp?content=tag_title_toolbox&g=SEMAGA

[904svo]

Its a homemade vehicle, emission my be a problem as engine is odb2 equipped.

[edwardb]

My friend built a Factory Five Roadster back in the '90s. He sent his paperwork to some guy in North Dakota (I think). The guy bought the car from him, titled it, and sold it back to him for a few hundred more than he bought it for. Does anyone offer this type of service any more?

Be very very careful with this kind of "service." The states and DMV's are wise to this maneuver, and you can put your whole title transfer and registration process in some jeopardy. Personally, I'd stay away.

[wleehendrick]

Be very very careful with this kind of "service." The states and DMV's are wise to this maneuver, and you can put your whole title transfer and registration process in some jeopardy. Personally, I'd stay away.

Agreed... I was talking to a friend of a friend recently at an Xmas party. He has a Backdraft Cobra replica that his builder (drivetrain installer) registered for him (around 10 years ago). Turns out the builder had an insider at the DMV and was issuing VINs from old, scrapped vehicles. He was ignorant of it all, but got caught... In the end, he was able to go through the CA SB100 process and get it legal with no impound, etc... but had to pay plenty in fees and fines. The builder left town and the DMV insider went to jail. He wasn't really bitter about it, and never pursued legal action; he just loves driving it too much to dwell on the past. However, the take-away is definitely to do your homework, as every state is different.

[JeromeS13]

You can also refer to:

http://www.dot.state.wi.us/drivers/vehicles/personal/special/hobbyist.htm

[tebriel]

I wonder if this can be used to bypass some new requirements of "new" vehicles if you use a donor car that is a little older.

Trans 131.03(12)
(12) RECONSTRUCTED AND HOMEMADE VEHICLES. Any nonexempt vehicle registered as reconstructed
or homemade under s. 341.268, Stats., shall be inspected for compliance with requirements applicable to
the model year of the vehicle as indicated on the vehicle's registration documents, unless the owner both
requests that the vehicle be inspected by engine year and provides a completed MV2588, exchanged
engine certification form, to the waiver investigator. In addition, the vehicle owner shall locate the engine
number on the engine for purposes of engine year verification by the waiver investigator.

Also I wonder how you become "exempt". From what I have been reading the requirements include, emissions testing via obd2, safety inspection so you need airbags, wipers, headlights, mirrors, brakes, etc.

[tebriel]

There's also mention of a "special design vehicle" and that you need a special driver's license for this... but no description of what a special design vehicle is.

[tebriel]

Anyone register in WI since this thread was last updated? :)

[Nordicskier]

Bump to the Wisconsin Registration questions. Has anyone registered an 818 in WI?

I'm stuck, the plan of registering with Wisconsin hobbiest would work so long as the safety inspector agrees to a replica vehicle. Without a replica vehicle, the airbag requirement stands; installing airbags in a car not designed around them is generally frowned upon. The closest vintage replica car seems to be a 1976 Ferrari 512 BB, but the coupe shape, mid engine layout and round rear lights is not enough for the safety inspector, they say it needs to look like it rolled of the manufacture's assembly line. Has anyone found a reasonable replica vehicle that would push safety inspection to pre 1991 surface transportation act where air bags were phased in?

Thanks!135996