First engine start...almost. Help!

[ironman16nc]

OK, it's all wired up and ready. When I turn the ignition, I hear the solenoid on the starter click, but the starter does not turn the flywheel. Battery is good, engine will move if I crank on the crank pully. It's a new, rebuilt starter. My thinking is that I have some kind of ground short so that although the starter is getting juice enough to pull in the solenoid, there's not enough current to run the starter motor (due to the short). If I put the key to just run or accessory, everything seems to be OK (lights, gauges, etc.). Ideas how to resolve?

Stats: 4.6L 1997 fuel injection, used FF body/dash wire harness and Ron Francis Telorvek EFI engine system.

[michael everson]

Make sure you have a good ground going from the engine to the chassis. Maybe even connect it to one of the starter bolts.

[ironman16nc]

I have a direct heavy gauge wire from the battery to the starter for both the positive and ground lines. I then have another heavy gauge wire from the block to the frame.

If I hold the ignition key on, the solenoid with click on/off/on/off.

[skullandbones]

I had a problem sort of like yours. I ended up taking a spare battery and cable and directly touching to the positive start post and ground. It was a bad connection in the solenoid wire. I know you are getting a sound from the solenoid but if you go directly to the solenoid, you can see if it is a wiring issue such as ground, low voltage, or a bad solenoid. It should make your starter engage if everything is OK. WEK.

[trichardson]

Have someone read your battery voltage while turning the ignition key. If the scenario you describe is happening, you'll see a significant voltage drop. I would think you'd hear the solenoid click plus the starter trying to engage. If you don't see a voltage drop the solenoid is clicking but the starter isn't being engaged, I think you'd need to replace your starter in that case.

[riptide motorsport]

Check your solenoid , jump over it to see if the starter turns, if so replace the solenoid.

[ironman16nc]

Thanks for all the input - tried lots of the stuff. Turns out I had a great ground on the solenoid - which it didn't like. I guess all the current would flow right back to the battery when the solenoid kicked in, instead of through the starter motor (both the hot and ground lines were getting a bit warm). So now I have battery ground to the frame (4 GA wire), block grounded to the same place (4 GA wire), and no ground to the solenoid - it grounds through the starter and the block. 4 GA hot to the solenoid from the battery. Cranks like a bandit.

Ok now on the crank, but it doesn't start. I've got fuel, but maybe the injectors are not firing. I've primed the fuel lines and even disconnected the return to be sure there was gas. No smell of gas out the exhause though. I guess it's time to find an EFI analyzer.

[tcoon]

Pull a spark plug and hold the side against the block while connected and cranking to be sure you have spark. Check all the efi fuses...you may have blown them with your starter issues. Be sure your efi and tfi have solid grounds preferably to the battery or engine. Do you hear the fuel pump running? Is your EEC plugged in? Enough fuel pressure? Back to basics...fuel, spark, timing. Good luck! We all go through this every time we make a major engine change.

[Someday I Suppose]

How do you have the solenoid and starter wired up? Are you using a remote starter relay firewall mounted as well as the solenoid on the Ford starter? Mine is wired that way, but the ford diagram runs the 12V starter wire from the same side lug on the remote relay to the starter. The switched side of the firewall mounted relay then has a 16ga wire that runs to the solenoid on the starter and triggers that solenoid. I'm just wondering if your running the 12V+ through both the remote relay and the solenoid causing the issue.

-Scott

[ironman16nc]

Had a friend from the local Cobra Club come over with a diagnostic tool (THANKS BRAD!!). No error codes. :confused: We walked through all the basics and found that the coils were not getting voltage once the switch was turned to START. Turns out I had wired the ignition and ACC lines on the ignition key switch backwards (they are really hard to see which terminals are which, especially when your eyes are going bad with age!). Anyway, now it can start!...barely, but not really run. Engine has been sitting since I'm guessing 2006. Very probably I have a blown head gasket. I pulled and checked all the (brand new) plugs. #1 plug was black. I cleaned it up and put it back in. Cranked and ran it for 5 seconds (very rough) and pulled the plug again. It was black again. And lots of smoke out that side of the exhaust.

I've not torn an engine completely down but maybe this will be my first. I'm up for the challenge but don't want to be stupid about it. I know there are special tools and the surfaces have to be perfect. Opinions welcome on what to do. One possibility is to pull the engine and take it to a shop to rebuild. Thoughts?

[tcoon]

Sounds like your timing is way retarded. Try to get a timing light on it enough to get an idea while it's running. Be sure to put the light on cylinder #1 (passenger side front of car for Fords). May take another person to keep giving it gas while you run the light. The combustion should even up once you get the timing correct, assuming the engine was running well previously. Also note you need to set timing on efi engines with the "spout" disconnected. Not sure about the 4.6 mod motor but the Ford 5.0 needs about 12-14 deg static timing for the street.

[tcoon]

Once you get timing set if it still runs poorly do a compression check before tearing it apart. Compression testers can be bought at Sears or any parts store. If you have a blown gasket, etc good to know which cylinder is involved.

[ironman16nc]

I did a compression check: right bank (1-4) are all at 190psi. Cylinders 5-8 are at 180/180/175/190psi. So I'm thinking the head gaskets are OK? Or is 10-15psi enough to be an issue?

Another clue: Right side is getting some burn (exhaust gets hot), but left side is ice cold. Doesn't seem like any of these are firing, I don't get any gas smell out of the exhaust pipe. It does give off a white/gray smoke. I checked the spark on 5-8 and all plugs get a spark. I thought it might be a bad fuel pressure regulator but the fuel pressure is 44psi at the feed point to the rail. I checked to see that the injectors were getting grounded (to open) and they are. If it's bad injectors it seems odd that injectors 1-4 are OK and 5-8 are bad. Maybe still a seal leak (pressures on that side were a little lower)?

[skullandbones]

Ironman,
I would vote for an electrical connection problem. I guess it could be a stopped up fuel rail on the left. It is really odd that all are not working on one side. Did you say they were all dry? When I have taken mine out to check the plugs, they are usually wet if I do it right away (cranking without starting). Also, did you say it is running or is just acting like it wants to run? WEK.

[tcoon]

I recently had the exact same proble of a cold left bank. When I installed the upper intake an injector wire got pinched and grounded out. This blew an efi fuse. I finally removed the upper intake, found the damaged wire and repaired the short, then eventually fell to the blown fuse. Now runs fine.