Clutch Pedal Travel/Stop Question

[PMD24]

I've read numerous posts regarding pedal stops and the need for them to avoid damage to the hydraulic throw out bearing. The documentation that came with my setup (McLeod bearing) also makes this clear. I'm using a 3/4" Tilton MC in the willwood pedal box. The MC size aligns with the McLeod recommendation.

I've read here about some folks needing no stop because they came out close to the footbox sheetmetal which provided the stop. Today I went through the process of slowly pressing the clutch pedal while turning the rear wheels. The point at which the clutch appears to fully disenaging the transmission leaves me with approx 2 1/2" from the front side of the pedal arm to the footbox sheetmetal. Repeated the check several times with similar results.

My brake pedal seems to be placed about right, with approx 1/4" between the rear of the arm and the 3/4" cross brace. And the clutch pedal pad sits about 1 1/2" rearward from the brake pad. Also have no preload on the clutch pedal with ~1/4 of play.

So, I'm not surprised to need a stop, but does the 2 1/2" sound ok?

Thanks,

Pat

[Mike.Bray]

I would double check that 3/4" MC size, HRBs usually require a 13/16" bore MC.

I hope you have better luck with that Mcleod HRB than I did. They have a high failure rate. Sorry

[Dondero14]

I would double check that 3/4" MC size, HRBs usually require a 13/16" bore MC.

I hope you have better luck with that Mcleod HRB than I did. They have a high failure rate. Sorry

Manual for the Mcleod throwout bearing actually recommends 3/4" MC. Haha I was stressing out a couple weeks ago reading some of the horror stories people were dealing with with them. Initially after I bled the air out and couldn't get it to actuate I was thinking I had a defect or possibly damaged it by pressing the clutch in too far.

Pat, I've been racking my brain with concern about this most of last week. I played with the pedal adjustment a bit and found the clutch needs to be moved a fair amount towards the rear of the car compared to the brake due to the clutch not being in the fully disengaged position when slightly rear of the brake pedal. Not sure if your pedal setup is the same but my clutch actually hits a 3/4" square tubing piece that is angled inside the footbox before it hits the aluminum. I feel like the MC push rod is already bottomed out when in the fully disengaged position as well, although I have the Wilwood MC that came with the kit and not the Tiltons. I'm planning on putting a stop in the footbox for it regardless to be safer than sorry and to help as a guide. I'll measure the distance forward of the clutch pedal tonight when I get home from work for reference.

[PMD24]

I would double check that 3/4" MC size, HRBs usually require a 13/16" bore MC.

I hope you have better luck with that Mcleod HRB than I did. They have a high failure rate. Sorry

Took another look at the documents that came with the engine/trans and the McLeod instructions do indicate 3/4" with 1" of travel on the MC. It all seems to be working fine (now). Just seems like that 2 1/2" is a lot.

Hopefully, some others with the same setup from Blueprint will weigh in with what their distance was.

[PMD24]

"Pat, I've been racking my brain with concern about this most of last week. I played with the pedal adjustment a bit and found the clutch needs to be moved a fair amount towards the rear of the car compared to the brake due to the clutch not being in the fully disengaged position when slightly rear of the brake pedal. Not sure if your pedal setup is the same but my clutch actually hits a 3/4" square tubing piece that is angled inside the footbox before it hits the aluminum. I feel like the MC push rod is already bottomed out when in the fully disengaged position as well, although I have the Wilwood MC that came with the kit and not the Tiltons. I'm planning on putting a stop in the footbox for it regardless to be safer than sorry and to help as a guide. I'll measure the distance forward of the clutch pedal tonight when I get home from work for reference.[/QUOTE]

Thanks Mark. My pedal hit that tube also and I talked with FFR about it back when I was installing the pedal box. They said some people grind away a little material off the rib of the pedal arm to allow for more travel, but in their experience, there is adequate travel without doing that. I did grind away some material to allow for more travel, but in looking at it today it turns out the interference is right about where my stop needs to be. That tends to bear out what FFR told me.

I'll be interested to hear what your dimension is.

Pat

[rich grsc]

Too much free play at the throwout bearing?

[Dondero14]

I’ve got my brake pedal as far rear as it will go without contacting the crossmember above it. The clutch pedal footpad sits about 2 inches rear of the brake pedal footpad. The forward most point of the clutch pedal rests 5 1/2” away from the front aluminum footbox panel. When I push the clutch and am fully disengaged, the forward most part of the pedal is an 1 1/2” away from the front footbox panel. The while doing this I also measured the MC pushrod from full rest to fully disengaged and it was almost dead nuts 1” of travel which is the “Minimum” needed per the manual.

I may give it another bleed to be sure some of that travel isn’t just air still trapped in the lines. For the most part according to the manual everything seems normal travel wise.

[PMD24]

Too much free play at the throwout bearing?

Rich, can you pass along some additional guidance on your thought? I have a very small amount of play at the MC, maybe 1/16" but I'm guessing that's not what you're referring to. Also, when I bled it, everything came up firm as it should. The whole setup (engine and trans) came fully assembled from Blueprint, so I'm not sure if there's a way for me to check out what you are referring to, but will do it if I can. Thx.

[F500guy]

So, Mcleod does say 3/4 MC, that was what shipped with my BPE. My pedal set up is such that there is no way my clutch will reach the floor, I do not like to have a fully extended leg when depressing. I welded a cross bar in the foot box with nut on it and screwed in allthread with a rubber stopper. This allowed adjustment. But after all that trouble, As i was adjusting it (the touchy feely method until I could just get the transmission in reverse) resulted in pulling the the stop off and I was left with the welded in cross bar and added a piece of butle ruber insulation on the cross bar so it was not metal-metal contact. that seems to be perfect.
227298227299

[PMD24]

I’ve got my brake pedal as far rear as it will go without contacting the crossmember above it. The clutch pedal footpad sits about 2 inches rear of the brake pedal footpad. The forward most point of the clutch pedal rests 5 1/2” away from the front aluminum footbox panel. When I push the clutch and am fully disengaged, the forward most part of the pedal is an 1 1/2” away from the front footbox panel. The while doing this I also measured the MC pushrod from full rest to fully disengaged and it was almost dead nuts 1” of travel which is the “Minimum” needed per the manual.

I may give it another bleed to be sure some of that travel isn’t just air still trapped in the lines. For the most part according to the manual everything seems normal travel wise.

Thanks Mark. Essentially the same as mine. One way or another I'm going to need a stop, so I'll start thinking about it and will ultimately post whatever I do, in my thread.

[PMD24]

So, Mcleod does say 3/4 MC, that was what shipped with my BPE. My pedal set up is such that there is no way my clutch will reach the floor, I do not like to have a fully extended leg when depressing. I welded a cross bar in the foot box with nut on it and screwed in allthread with a rubber stopper. This allowed adjustment. But after all that trouble, As i was adjusting it (the touchy feely method until I could just get the transmission in reverse) resulted in pulling the the stop off and I was left with the welded in cross bar and added a piece of butle ruber insulation on the cross bar so it was not metal-metal contact. that seems to be perfect.
227298227299

Thanks for sharing. Visually it looks like yours came out about where mine will be. Will take a look at installing a stop with your method. Although I'm pretty much an unskilled gob welder so maybe a steel gusset bolted to the tube.

[rponfick]

PDM24, I am going through the same thing with my MK5, same BP engine tranny as yours. There must be some variation in the new set up because I fabbed up a stop and then had to take it out, as my full release was right at the doubled carpeted footwall front. In initial testing, I thought I needed a stop, but over time the full release got closer to the firewall. Not to first start yet, so not sure.
The back of my pedal support aluminum shaft is about 3" from the firewall, versus the 5 1/2" mentioned above, but we could be measuring from different places. I guess what I am trying to say is I have about 3" of pedal movement to the firewall, and this is about right for full clutch disengagement.
Ralph

[PMD24]

Thanks for sharing Ralph. Yours is very different than what Mark and I are experiencing. Both of us will definitely need a stop. I'm guessing you're right that it has to do with the difference in the MK5 setup.