New Garage Questions

[Functional]

Morning everyone!

Been lurking here for about 8 years, I believe next year I should be able to finally put in my order for a Coupe. 2 kids, moving and trying to advance at work took priority for a bit!

Talking all of this over with my wife, she surprised me and said we should build a detached garage for the coupe build as well as giving us some flexibility in other areas of our house. Long story short, a garage with some storage area will give us a LOT of bang for our buck in our overall living space. So here we are...

Looking at a 24x32 1.5 story stick built or a 26x40 metal garage, preference goes to the 1.5 story but will be final price dependent. I will be planning a 4" slab except a 10' wide strip in the area I'd hope to put a lift (possibly and if its a 2 post), which I plan to have done 6" thickness. A little more than needed, but Id rather not risk an anchor stud ripping out or cracking concrete. Which brings me to a few questions for you all.

1) Garage ceiling height, particularly with the 1.5 story since the metal garage will give me a lot more. I had planned to go with a 10' ceiling height, with a little general calculation this should put my wifes vehicle and even my own tundra at least chest height (I'm 5'7) at the wheel hub. Aside from building the coupe, I envision sitting on my stubby stool on wheels if any work is done under these vehicles like oil/transmission/diff fluid changes, etc. For those who have working experience in similar sized spaces are there any major regrets not going to 12'? If cost is minimal I plan to do 12' but wanted to know my minimum if I had to save a bit in some areas.

2) Garage doors, kind of wanted one large 20' door or (2) 10'x8' but have read conflicting information that 20's may sag over time due to size? Anyone have a wide door with years of experience to confirm or deny? Any good reason to do 2? I plan to have the door(s) with a direct drive opener to maximize ceiling space.

3) What are some nice to haves in your garage? I planned to plumb air to a few spots in the garage and the back half will be home to my lathe, good sturdy work bench and tool boxes. Planning to have good lighting, either a set I can dim or string a few on a separate switch if/when I need less light. I'm also going to be putting in a small mini split to at least condition the space to manageable (live in eastern NC, heat and humidity can be rough). Havent had the opportunity to really set up a garage yet and wanted to see if I missed anything.

4)Lifts, 4 post or 2 post? I had planned for a 2 post but my father in law has a 4 and has made some decent cases for a 4 post. With this garage I wont necessarily need the storage space underneath for anything (and I'd hate to clear it out before being able to take down whatever is on it). I also like the overall small profile of a 2 post. Any strong cases for one or the other? Any features I should be looking for with either style?


I might end up thinking of more questions but these are the main ones floating around in my head right now. I appreciate any input you all might have!

[gbranham]

I'd make the ceiling as high as you can afford, just to maximize your working space under a lifted vehicle. Been there, done that. 11 feet is a minimum, in my opinion. Lots of opinions on 2 vs 4 post. Both have advantages and disadvantages. I'm in the 4 post club. 2 post will need reinforced concrete floor, or at least a stronger concrete, so choose your lift before you quote the garage build.

Being in the real estate biz, I'd suggest a detached garage that matches your home's exterior styling and color palette vs a metal Morton Building; it's worth more when/if you resell your home. Probably more cost up front, but better for resale.

Mini split is essential for year-round comfort. For the price, it's a no-brainer. I put a Mr Cool 36k BTU in my 30x30 shop myself. Bought it on Amazon for $2400. Very easy one-weekend installation with pre-charged line set, so no HVAC technician needed.

Several of my neighbors have put in Morton-style shops recently, and for 30x50 ish size, they're in the $80k range with flatwork.

High-lift the garage doors so they hug the ceiling, and use jack shaft openers.

Greg

219957

[Papa]

Congrats on your future projects! I've had two garage shops built over the years and I have some opinions on certain features that I can share.

First, if you go with a two-post lift, seriously consider a minimum of 12' ceilings. A couple of inches more may be required depending on the lift you select.

Second, I had a single 16' door on my fist shop (30×40), and for my second shop, I did two 10' tall x 12' wide doors. I like being able to drive in on either side without concern for what is on the other. A single 20' door will accomplish the same, but will be heavy!

My first shop was frame on full foundation with footers, and my new shop is a steel (Morton) building. There really aren't any significant advantages I can cite for one or the other in terms of function. Long-term may tell a different story.

I plumbed air in both, but have a mini-split (heat pump and AC) in the new shop, which is a game changer. Don't skimp on lighting! Make it a key part of your plan from the start. Be sure to plan for plenty of 20 amp outlets and whatever 220v drops you might need (lift, compressor, HVAC, welder, etc.).

On the lift, that can/will create a lot of debate. Do your research and decide what meets your needs best. I've had both two and four post lifts, and for me, the four post meets my needs better than the two-post.

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=219960&d=1760043880

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=219959&d=1760043880

Hope this helps, but keep the questions coming if you need more info.

Dave

[Nigel Allen]

As a sparky, I can testify that it is not worth wiring up multiple circuits for lighting. The LED lighting that is available today is so cheap to run that you will never pay off all the extra wiring and switches required. Also, as you get older you will appreciate all of that light.
I do recommend one small light fitting on a sensor that provides enough illumination so that you can walk through your workshop when the other lighting is switched off. Is very handy when you just need to pop in there, Or getting in and out of a vehicle.

My preference is to put my air compressor outside of the workshop in a lean to. I have the switch for this compressor alongside my light switches to remind me to turn it off. I also have a neon illumination to remind me that it is on.

Split system AC is also awesome.

As it is a new build, you could also run a conduit in the concrete floor to provide power for your hoist.

Cheers,

Nige

[PNWTim]

Having built my shop 16 years ago I have had time to mull over those items I coulda, shoulda, woulda.

Go as high and tall as you can afford
Put 220v on every wall
If you go with a lower (10') ceiling you will be using a non-clear floor lift which will probably require at least 6" concrete to raise your Tundra safely
Mini-split for sure
Desk and computer with wifi. I spend a lot of time looking stuff up and it's convenient to have a space to do so without going inside.

I have two 20' doors with no sagging but I also have a 20" glulam header. I like the big open doors just because I don't want a post in the middle. Really think about where you want your manway door - it matters. Consider jackshaft garage door openers - it's nice not to have the bar and chain in the way for whatever reason.

If your shop is more than 50' from your house consider a bathroom or at least a spot outside to take a leak. If I had to do it over I would've built a bump out alcove on the back of my shop for my dust collector and compressor.

Probably more but that's all I can think of off the top of my head.

[Functional]

I appreciate all of the input to so far! Definitely helps and reinforces some of my thinking.

Lights: I was planning on HO LED light strips. I already have some on my work bench and put some in my fathers barn. My goal is to have it as bright as a paint booth and have them dimmable or sets put on a few switches so I can tone it down when/if needed. My dad always beat in me that its easier to turn lights off than install new ones if its not bright.

Garage Doors: I'm kind of leaning towards (2) 10x9s. I was initially wanting one to have no obstacles other than the walls to back into. Thinking it through now I wondering if having 1 opened to take something out or even opened for a bit would keep some of the conditioning in better. One large door I can see dumping all the conditioned air out really quick.

Garage Door Openers: I think we are all on the same page, High lift, jack shaft/direct drive to give the most clearance and removes the center track and motor.

Man doors: I planned to have it closest to the house and as close to the garage doors as I can. This should give me the most undisturbed wall space the length of the garage. If I do the 26x40 I'd have a 2nd at the back. Plan would be to box off a section for storage and this way it can have an easy in/out without dragging Christmas decorations, boxes, etc. through a work shop and past cars. If its a 1.5 story I'm going to have them put the stairs on the outside and have a single door to enter at the top.

Power: My plan is to have an electrician run a stub up into the garage and install a 150amp (possibly 200) panel and leave it at that. The rest I'll run separate once I start loading in work benches and tools boxes. I want outlets easily accessible, not buried behind things and where I need them.

WiFi: good point here, should be easy to get a repeater for the garage or move the point in my house closer to the side of the house with the garage. The garage will only be 5-10 feet from the house so not a far distance. Might actually mount a small TV in there for reading manuals, youtubes, etc. Also brings to mind a few speakers for music. Minor things, but good to keep in mind during setup.

Lift: Jury is still out...going to prep the pad for either and then decide. Might have it for the coupe build or it might be a "future" thing.



5) Whats the thoughts on windows? I had originally planned on no windows except one up top if a 1.5 story structure. I was thinking no windows would maximize the amount of wall space for storage, etc. without having to dodge a window. Anyone regret windows or found it frustrating at times ?

[gbranham]

I have 4 windows in mine...one on the back wall two on the west wall, and one on the east wall. I open them on breezy days often. Really like the breeze through the shop.

[PNWTim]

5) Whats the thoughts on windows? I had originally planned on no windows except one up top if a 1.5 story structure. I was thinking no windows would maximize the amount of wall space for storage, etc. without having to dodge a window. Anyone regret windows or found it frustrating at times ?

I installed 6 clerestory windows in mine and glad I did. I like the natural light and they match the look of our house which was important.

[Jeff Kleiner]

Several of my neighbors have put in Morton-style shops recently, and for 30x50 ish size, they're in the $80k range with flatwork.

219957

Dayum Greg! I did my 30X50 post frame with 12 foot ceiling, 2 10X10 doors and a bathroom for under 30K. I did it all though, framing, metal, electric and plumbing and only paid for the labor to pour and finish the slab. It's nothing fancy but 80K is :eek:

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=203942&d=1725972847

Jeff

[gbranham]

Yep, $80k for a turnkey solution. Prices have gone absolutely bananas in recent years.

[Papa]

Would you believe my 30x40 Morton building with 8x40 porch and their insulation package (9" in the walls, commercial doors with commercial openers, 18" ceiling insulation) was $101k and another $11k for concrete.

[gbranham]

Yep, its nutty these days.

Greg

[Papa]

I couldn't find a contractor that could start a stick-built garage build in less than a year, and they couldn't give me a firm cost until they were ready to start work. My 30x40 building in Colorado was $48k including concrete. That was about 15 years ago.

[BornWestUSA]

27X34 toy garage here. 8X10 and 8X12 foot roll up doors.

My biggest regret is having low (8 1/2 foot) ceilings. I originally built it to hold a crew cab dually pick up and my ski boat, not thinking about a lift because I had 10 of them at work!

So go big, check with the lift manufacturer for height, and go at least a foot taller than the top of a good two post lift, so 13 ish feet.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9u-e3okXpsI&t=73s

[Functional]

I really appreciate the advice from you all!

Confirmed with the HOA (its a very relaxed one) that a metal garage should be fine as long as it matches the flavor of the house. Going to dig a bit harder now. I've received 2 quotes so far for stick built 1.5 story and it was $97.5K ( :eek: ) and $66k (66 used metal siding only, oddly enough). Very far apart but included everything soup to nuts. Getting general costs for metal it looks like I'll be in the $35 to $40k range but need to finalize details more to get a final cost. Going to try and get 2 more quotes for stick built and send a few examples of the metal building concepts to the HOA to get 100% approval.

At the very least this has helped me decide on minimum 12' ceilings, (2) 10' garage doors, a sprinkling of windows and at least a 150amp panel. The rest I can install myself and would honestly like to.

[luvaz]

Lots of great info here!

As far as the lift question goes, Which type of lift to buy can be better answered once you've identified what you're looking to do w/it.
Having owned 3 different types of lifts- a 4 post, a mid rise scissor lift, and now a 2 post, I can tell you there's pluses & minuses w/each.

So, the 4 post may be a better choice if you are looking to store a vehicle (I stored a classic car during the winter when I lived in NH. It let me turn a 2 car garage into a 3 car. During the 3 other seasons, it was a service lift & was great for oil changes. Doing brakes & rotating tires (probably the 2nd biggest service use next to oil & filter changes) was another story. You need a sliding bridge jack and even then you're lifting either the front or back, not both (unless you get 2 bridge jack set ups $$)!

I'll move on to the 2 post now as you didn't ask about the mid rise scissor lift.
First off, I no longer need to have any winter storage as i moved back to Scottsdale.
Knowing that my top 3 uses are oil changes, tire rotation, and brake jobs; I opted for the 2 post. This type of lift provides the easiest access to my 'top 3'.
No bridge jack like on the 4 post, so front to back tire rotations are much quicker & easier on the 2 post.

Hopefully that helps you make an educated decision between 2 or 4 post!

Will