427w carb choice ?

[ProfessorB]

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I presently run a carb on my 427 Windsor and am thinking of getting a new one. Not interested in EFI. I do have an idea of what I THINK I want....but I am very interested in suggestions from others. Brand, style, CFM, etc. What's everybody run? Thanks.

[cv2065]

Quickfuel 750 Brawler with mech secondaries. Can't beat it!

[Jim1855]

ProSystems https://www.prosystemsracing.com/custom/ Pro Series 4150.
They built a 780cfm 4150 Double Pumper, no choke or horn for me many years ago. Still a great carb.
If I ever get my car done I'll have them build an 850.
427W, AFR 225s, Edelbrock Vic Jr, 1-7/8 headers, 7,000rpm Never ran out of gas.
Jim

[bobl]

What carb do you have now and why are you wanting to replace it? If it were my engine I'd go with no more than 750 CFM with mechanical secondaries and electric choke. No "race" type carb. QF Brawler seems pretty popular. Then again if you have a radical 427 making 600+ HP and chasing every bit then maybe a high end custom race carb is the ticket.

Bob

[StangRacer]

For the money you can't beat the Quickfuel Brawler CV2065 suggested especially if you are good with tuning a carb. They have lots of features, adjustable air bleeds, billet metering blocks, etc... that usually only come with the higher end race carbs. If you want the absolute best carb you can buy then look to Mark Whitener down in Florida, Dale Cubic, or Braswell.

[GoDadGo]

I'm running an Edelbrock AVS 800, because I stink at tuning Holley Style Carbs, on my 383 Dart SBC with Team-G #7530 Single Plane Intake. The Carb sports a dual feed line that loops so that both bowls get equal flow and pressure 100% of the time.

While this is not the normal set up it works and works well plus it is very easy to tune. Metering rods can be changed without disassembly. Jet changes can be done while on the car. You just need to remove the top to get to the jets.

Finally, the AVS-2 has annular primary boosters while mine has the ancient down-leg style set up. The current version has been on the market now for a little over 7 years so that gives you an idea as to how old mine is.

AVS-2 Video
https://youtu.be/3npwfIOdKPc

Edelbrock Installation & Tuning Tips:
https://youtu.be/3NLYuEggiI0

AVS-2 Link / Electric Choke Model
https://www.jegs.com/i/Edelbrock/350/1913/10002/-1

AVS-2 / Manual Choke Model
https://www.jegs.com/i/Edelbrock/350/1912/10002/-1

Dual Feed Fuel Line Link:
https://www.jegs.com/i/Edelbrock/350/8132/10002/-1

NOTE:.. I've thought about upgrading my older AVS 800 to the current AVS-2 800; however, I can't see replacing what works and works well and has for many years.

Hope This Helps!

[CraigS]

On my 408 I ran a QuickFuel SS750AN. I got it because it had a lot of adjustability much like the Brawler described by cv2065. I was retired so spent a lot of enjoyable time tuning it but in the end it ran 95% as well as my wife's 2015 Mustang. The lack of 5% was only because I switched to a manual choke so there was a bit of manual work involved for a cold start.

[GoDadGo]

I got it because it had a lot of adjustability much like the Brawler described by cv2065. .

I wish I had your carb tuning abilities. :cool:

[F500guy]

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?51035-Carb-Sizing-Question

Asked this question a while ago. Good answers. I think the 750 Mechanical is probably the best choice for a moderate build. May not extract every bit of HP, but pretty close. Did the calc on my BPE 427 with cam data and said about 811 CFM, but that would be WOT, maybe drag racing or just dyno stuff. I replaced the BPE provided 870 vacuum with a 670 Vacuum just to get thru some miles while I did the shake down driving. That performed great out of the box, a lot better than the 870 and initial throttle is great with out stumbles, but the shifting was giving some "erratic" secondary operation so I played with the vacuum spring to try and moderate that. Casual driving it is great, but giving up a bit on power. I will be eventually getting a 750 Mechanical Holley or Brawler.

[Mike.Bray]

I wish I had your carb tuning abilities. :cool:

217568

[F500guy]

I am in process of installing an AIM EVO4s data system to tune with and I also have a camera for some video. I will be able to pull AFR, Throttle position and RPM data and even display it on the camera. Life is a Marathon, not a sprint...

[Derald Rice]

OK.....I will be "THAT GUY"....

Carb choice on a Cobra should always be WEBERS

[Mike.Bray]

Carb choice on a Cobra should always be WEBERS

Of course, why have regular pain when you can have serious pain!

[Derald Rice]

Of course, why have regular pain when you can have serious pain!

In the movie Roadhouse, Dalton said "Pain Don't Hurt"

[Mike.Bray]

In the movie Roadhouse, Dalton said "Pain Don't Hurt"

Could throw in a points distributor, a generator, drum brakes, and bias ply tires while we're at it. If you're going to go back to 1965 do it right! :D

[Derald Rice]

Could throw in a points distributor, a generator, drum brakes, and bias ply tires while we're at it. If you're going to go back to 1965 do it right! :D

I have thought about going back to the 60's many times...

Life was a lot less complicated.

But I don't have a time machine.

[ProfessorB]

I really appreciate all the input. I didn't say much about the carb I presently have or the carb that I want is because I didn't want to skew the input. I will say that I don't know much....I was just a kid who played with (and street raced) muscle cars in the early Seventies....(when they were dirt cheap). I DID learn that ANY carb could be made to run well. Besides Holley, there were also Carter AFB's and Rochester Quadrojets. ALL could be good with the right expertise.
I chose Holley because they were the most popular and, to me with my youthful inexperience, easiest for me to understand. I always ran double pumper, mechanical secondaries , and mechanical choke. Because I mostly had small blocks, I didn't go bonkers on size...usually a 650 or 700 cfm. And since I drove my car to high school every day, I found low end streetabilty and getting it to idle properly was better. And the car was faster than with too big of a carb. Bigger is not always better. Back to the subject of chokes....I grew up in New England where chokes are important., but I now live in South Carolina and I'm not convinced I even need a choke....I think a couple of pumps on the pedal prior to starting might be all I need. If I do get a choke, I like mechanical because it's simpler. I'm kind of thinking of 750 cfm range.... but still interested in EVERY opinion.

[cv2065]

Could throw in a points distributor, a generator, drum brakes, and bias ply tires while we're at it. If you're going to go back to 1965 do it right! :D

You should have built this Mike! NO pain! :p

https://www.bing.com/videos/riverview/relatedvideo?q=cobra+ev+build&mid=404BBA236A6E1B8E10B3404BBA236A6E1B8E10B3&FORM=VIRE

[Mike.Bray]

You should have built this Mike! NO pain! :p

https://www.bing.com/videos/riverview/relatedvideo?q=cobra+ev+build&mid=404BBA236A6E1B8E10B3404BBA236A6E1B8E10B3&FORM=VIRE

Uh, no. I'm keeping my man card.

[cv2065]

Uh, no. I'm keeping my man card.

LOL. I hear that!

[CraigS]

I used a version of this from 15yrs ago.
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/inn-38370
At the time the ability to remember data and then go home and display on my PC was fantastic. I am sure this newer version is better. OP your experience mirrors mine. Yes carbs can be too big. It's fun to have a rush above 3000 but when it sputters around at 1500 that kills it for me. I started w/ a vac secondary carb, did all the tricks to get the secondary open asap. But the mechanical secondary carb felt like I gained 40hp in the 2000-4000 range. You might be OK in SC w/o a choke. I had one in suburban DC since I lived on a street w/ small lots and close houses. The ability to get it to immediately smoothly idle at 1100-1200 and ease down the street was important. A constant noise is a lot less annoying than a blipping throttle to keep it going. I actually drilled a bunch of holes in the choke plate so I could have the idle cam where it needed to be w/o the thing going rich 2 min later. I talked to QF tech support once and the guy was super helpful. I didn't have the Innovate at that point and he spent some time explaining how far up the rev range the idle circuit actually affects mixture. 2500? Yep. He suggested testing by adjusting the idle mix screws. Of course you mess up the idle itself but, if you help in the 1500-2000 range, that tells you something. BTW I have a couple similar to these, w/ the compartments divided in half, to hold my jets.
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Anvil-12-in-13-Compartment-Storage-Bin-Small-Parts-Organizer-THD2015-06/321084128
BTW2, this was a multi year endeavor that I really enjoyed. Had to kind of start over when I built a 408 to replace my 351. A year after that I found out that I could buy a 750 main body to upgrade my 650 so started over again.

[cadtdi]

I just put a Holley 4150 750 cfm with mechanical secondaries and manual choke on my 351W (Ford SVO crate motor from 1994, 385 HP) the 4150 replaced the original 4010 (from Summit) that was on the motor when I bought the car. Much better carb for the motor than the 4010 which was not a good choice even when the motor was new.

I am only barely knowledgeable here - I thought about an Edelbrock AVS-2, these are less tunable but tend to work well out of the box. Also considered Quick Fuel. If I recall, Quick Fuel was started by some Holley engineers to develop a very tunable carb for street/track use. Holley bought QT a few years later. The hotrod shop that I took my Cobra to for a carb issue was split on what carb to recommend...the shop manager likes Edelbrock for simplicity, the tech likes Holley and Quck Fuel for their tunability. I went with the tech's suggestion so I could stick with Holley.

So far, the new carb is working out fine.

[Mike.Bray]

You should have built this Mike! NO pain! :p

https://www.bing.com/videos/riverview/relatedvideo?q=cobra+ev+build&mid=404BBA236A6E1B8E10B3404BBA236A6E1B8E10B3&FORM=VIRE

Last year at the Dallas Autorama there was a Cobra with an electric motor. My wife and I stood back and just observed for awhile, people would come up and say Look, a Cobra! but as soon as they saw that electric motor under the hood they would walk away. It was quite interesting observing car people's reactions which were 99% negative.

If someone steals your Tesla does that make it an Edison?

[bobl]

On the subject of vacuum secondaries. I’ve dyno’d several engines recently with VS carbs. None of them would open the secondaries fully. I tried all the different springs and it made no difference. I finally removed the spring completely and got them to open. Attached is the dyno results from removing the spring. This is a mild 302 build with 600 CFM Holley. I only run mechanical secondary carbs on my builds for this reason.

The one on the right was before removing the spring.

Bob

[ProfessorB]

Last year at the Dallas Autorama there was a Cobra with an electric motor. My wife and I stood back and just observed for awhile, people would come up and say Look, a Cobra! but as soon as they saw that electric motor under the hood they would walk away. It was quite interesting observing car people's reactions which were 99% negative.

If someone steals your Tesla does that make it an Edison?

.
Along those same lines, there is a "new and improved" all electric Dodge Charger Daytona. It does the quarter mile in a little over 11 seconds.
GET THIS: It has electric speakers which simulate the sound of a performance gas V-8. What's the world coming to? How lame can you get? IT'S A BRAVE NEW WORLD.

[Redstang69]

Surprised nobody has mentioned FST. Affordable option I'm running a 650, mechanical secondaries and electric choke on a 351W. It's a very snappy carb, no hesitation when hitting the throttle. I've struggled to get the idle leaned out enough but I think I need to do the drill holes in the butterflys trick because of my cam.
I also have a 600 street avenger vacuum secondaries on a stock 302. Very dependable carb but have yet to be able to get the hesitation worked out when you roll off idle, need to try changing the accelerator pump cam.
Good luck

[ProfessorB]

I pulled the trigger and bought a Holley 750 double pumper, mechanical secondaries, no choke. Holley is running a sale thru September 14th. My budget is shot for the month now (still need wideband air/fuel meter, regulator, hose and fittings) and I'll have to wait for all of that but the carb decision is a done deal. Thanks for all the input.

[ggunter]

A carb is nothing more than a glorified windex bottle. It takes a liquid and somewhat atomizes it, and the intake and runners do the rest. Growing up in the 60's and 70's there was nothing but carbs. (except for the Rochester fuel injection on a Vette and that was from another world. If you found someone who knew how to work on them, you better take heaps of cash as an offering). Taking auto shop in high school, our teacher went through every circuit in all the carbs of the day and explained how they all worked. We would disassemble the carb and take drinking straws and blow through the holes where fuel traveled and show us how each circuit was affected by vacuum and how it pulled the gas up and out into the venturi. They are quite simple really. Back in the day we would read plugs to find the mixture and timing on our engines. Today with an air fuel meter it takes all the guess work out as you can read all that while you're driving. There are many you tube videos on carb tuning and a lot of them are quite good. Of course, there are both sides of the coin on EFI or Carbs and I've had my run in with EFI which is why I run a carb. If there is a carb related breakdown I know i'm getting home. Can't say that with EFI.