Recommendations for Kit Builders – Especially First-Time

[edwardb]

I’ve noticed a number of forum posts recently for new builds. Especially from new and first-time builders. Maybe especially with the 30th Anniversary kits some have jumped in for the first-time. Again, especially for first-time builders, they come into this process with certain expectations and then are maybe disappointed when they find out it’s different. Hopefully these suggestions will help reduce that. Many of the comments are around kit organization, backorders, missing parts, etc. Thought I would offer my suggestions based on numerous builds. Disclaimer: My experience to date is all prior to the new ERP system Factory Five implemented a year or two ago. I know they made some packaging and marking changes. However, as far as I know the basic organization is still the same. I’ll find out myself in the not-too-distant future as I too will be receiving a 30th Anniversary Roadster. Nothing cast in concrete for these suggestions. But this works. Especially, as I said, for first-time builders.

1. Most including me, can't wait to immediately tear into the kit and start working upon receipt. Resist! A complete and thorough inventory is critical upon receipt of the kit. Obviously, you want to make sure you’re getting what you paid for. But also you want to be able to provide feedback to Factory Five for anything that’s missing, wrong, damaged, etc. The longer you wait to report, the longer it's going to take to get what you need. They are typically generous with the 45-day window to report. But don’t push it.

2. Maybe most importantly of any of these points, use the inventory not just to count and verify parts, but use it to learn about your kit. That means instead of blitzing through it in a couple hours, slow down. Most kit builds are a year or more, so investing hours or even a couple days up front will pay off. Believe me. Many parts are obvious based on the description, what they look like, etc. But many are not. Spend time looking them up in the build manual if necessary. (You did spend time thoroughly reading and understanding the build manual before receipt, right?) Find out where they go, how they fit, etc. Maybe even mocking up a few things as you go. IMO, again especially for first-time builders, you will more than get that time back during the actual build.

3. Don’t assume that the boxes and box numbers correspond to the build sequence, sections in the build manual, whatever. The boxes are loosely based on types of components. But for a given section in the build manual, the parts required could come from multiple boxes. Don’t fight it. Go with it.

4. Highly recommend that as you inventory, put the parts back into the box they came in. Then use the inventory sheets, where you’re checking off as you inventory, as your roadmap to find parts as you need them. I put them all in a notebook. Some tape them to the boxes. Some even scan and put into computer files. Whatever works for you.

5. As backordered and MIK parts are received, put them into the box they were originally supposed to go in. Then mark the inventory list as received. I also mark the items on the backordered list as received so I can keep a running record of the parts Factory Five still owes me.

6. Don’t be in a hurry to tear apart the body/chassis/panels upon receipt. Before pulling the body, spend a little time looking at how it’s mounted, measure heights in the engine compartment to confirm clearances for where you’re planning to mount things (brake reservoirs, overflow tanks, etc.). For any build I might have the body on and off multiple times to check the fit. But some hang the body or even take it off-site. So use this time to your advantage. With the body off, take pictures of the aluminum panels that are mounted. Trace where frame members, rails, etc. are where possible. Then remove them. Final hint, don’t assume the shipping location of the various panels are exact. They are placed in shipping at Factory Five and sometimes aren't exactly aligned. Use the holes and zip screws they use as suggestions only. Confirm the exact locations as you’re mounting all the panels and getting everything exactly aligned.

7. Save big hammers and cutting anything as a last resort. Frequently (and I say this to myself all the time) if something doesn’t seem to be fitting right I’m probably doing something wrong. Stop and dig deeper. While not perfect, these kits are well engineered and it's possible to complete a build without resorting to extreme measures. Obviously, Factory Five support comes in here. Use it as needed. The forum is also a great resource. Learn to search (use Google) or ask. We're happy to help.

8. Last thing I’ll recommend. Don't ever forget this is a custom build. The good news is Factory Five provides a kit that will work with many different part combinations. Probably a nearly endless number. The bad news is there's no one configuration and not everything will be addressed in the build manual or even work without some research, effort, or work on your side. This isn't Lego or IKEA. Seems like a cliche, but clearly some expect that.

That’s enough. Probably others will have some suggestions too. Or disagree with the ones I’ve made. That’s OK. This is supposed to be an enjoyable and positive experience. Do what works for you.

Keep the end in mind. It will be worth it! :o

P.S. Adding this after the original post just for grins. I've read through my points several times and this occurred to me. Many of you know because I've posted about it that I've spent the last couple of years doing an airplane build. Something I've always wanted to do. From a relatively new but highly regarded manufacturer. Looking back, literally every single point that I made about building a Factory Five kit also could apply to my airplane kit. Had some backorders, had some missing parts, staying organized was a huge plus, tech support required a few times, the build manuals while impressive didn't cover every little detail, etc. About the only difference was every single part was bagged and tagged and they were grouped together by assembly. I'm sure some would welcome that to Factory Five kits. But the added effort and cost would be substantial. The airplane kit had just a slightly different cost structure. Today's understatement.

[OSU Cowboy]

You clearly put a lot of thought into this document, and it's sure to help new builders going into this project. I'd add one couple item to it as follows ...

9. In the event that you do not consider yourself a master mechanic ... think about attending the Build School. If you have spent a lot of time doing serious work on cars that goes beyond carwashes and oil changes, you are probably OK to dive in with manual and forum support. Otherwise, one should give Build School serious consideration. There are important - yet - subtle things that can be learned in Build School that will save you hours and heartache.

10.

[egchewy79]

All great advice, Paul.
I found it helpful to find other build threads and read through them. Lets you know where the pressure points are during the build and some of the mistakes in the manual. I'm sure they're constantly making revisions to the manual, but not fast enough for most of us, and sometimes not at all.
This also gives you ideas of modifications you'll want to make on your individual build.

[Jeff Kleiner]

Thanks Paul! I think both you and I have said the following many times...


...This isn't Lego or IKEA. Seems like a cliche, but clearly some expect that.



My buddy Jeff Miller summed it up well when he said "There's a difference between BUILDING a car and ASSEMBLING a car.

Carry on.

Jeff

[Stangrob]

Thanks guys for some excellent advice. I'm one of those 'new builders', with my kit coming in October. I have been building and working on cars for a long time though, so from that perspective it's not my first rodeo. Just the fulfillment of a long dream.

BTW I saw the Build School mentioned above. Although I am pretty handy, I was still thinking of taking the class with the goal of picking up some tips and practices that would help my build (and avoid any newbie mistakes). Any thoughts there?

Thanks!

Rob

[JeffP]

All great advice Paul! And yes, Google is your best friend even on this site. If you're not already familiar with it, this is how to use google to search the forums directly:

Goto www.google.com and use this syntax for your search "site://thefactoryfiveforum.com build threads" (replace build threads with whatever you're looking for)

Don't waste time on the search box on the forum.

[gbranham]

Great info. I'd add that, when tired or frustrated with your build, walk away. Nothing good comes from working on a car capable of supercar levels of performance when you're not fresh, engaged, etc.

Also, you'll find that you rely on the build manual heavily at first, generally through suspension buildup, and then you'll realize one day that you haven't cracked the book in weeks. This forum is your research and planning tool. For me, I loved the rhythm of planning a project during the week, getting it sorted in my head, getting parts ready, etc, then executing on the weekends. That was my life for 2 years while I was building my 2nd. I miss that rhythm now that my car is essentially complete. My first build took me 4 months. Savor the build!!! It's as fun as driving the car...maybe even more fun!

Greg

[J R Jones]

I have worked for large OEMs building transportation and recreation products. Early on the (vertically integrated) companies had inspection departments to assure parts and assemblies going to the line were specification compliant and trouble free.
One assembly type company put the onus on the suppliers for part quality, no incoming inspection. Good luck with that.
Perfect quality did not always work in any of those companies requiring a hospital area at the end of the line and a service/warranty department.
In this product build process, the buyer/owner/assembler is also the inspection department. Every part fitment, every fastener, and every sub assembly must be evaluated for correctness and reworked or replaced as required. Trust and verify.
jim

[edwardb]

I have worked for large OEMs building transportation and recreation products. Early on the (vertically integrated) companies had inspection departments to assure parts and assemblies going to the line were specification compliant and trouble free.
One assembly type company put the onus on the suppliers for part quality, no incoming inspection. Good luck with that.
Perfect quality did not always work in any of those companies requiring a hospital area at the end of the line and a service/warranty department.
In this product build process, the buyer/owner/assembler is also the inspection department. Every part fitment, every fastener, and every sub assembly must be evaluated for correctness and reworked or replaced as required. Trust and verify.
jim

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[Namrups]

Use the resources available to you! The build manual, YouTube videos, Factory Five videos, Factory Five Forums and any local owners/builders/club members that will jump at the chance to help.

[narly1]

An "adapt, improvise, overcome" attitude is needed to take on one of these vehicles.

Earl

[Tango]

For me, this “project” at its core is a series of roadblocks. I knew that going in. Each one is a challenge and a learning opportunity. That is what I signed up for and for sure that is what I got. Frustrating…..Frustrating……Frustrating…..then reward when you figure it out. I do have walk away moments and probably more than I would like. Even when I am not working on the car I am working on a problem with the car in my head. It really is a challenge and a blast.

[JimStone]

Involve your significant other and children in the build. It makes it less likely they'll resent you for spending 1,000+ hours in the garage!

[Fixit]

During the build, think about the next guy (who will probably be you...) that is going to have to fix something. Build with serviceability in mind!

With the body off and the car "naked" it is very easy to attach parts, clips, brackets, etc. Think about these parts with the body in your way when determining routing, mounting etc.!
Can you get to the fasteners? Will this be blocked when the sheetmetal is final riveted? Can I remove this component through the access hatches, from under the car, from under the dash?
Hmmm... could I get a wrench on the nut for this bolt, or should I drill & tap and thread in?

[Skuzzy]

Before you get the kit off the truck. Grab a flash light and check the body and hood before it is unloaded. Look for areas of missing fiberglass and weak spots around the edges. Do not assume it is done properly. Mine certainly was not and I regret accepting the shipment as it was. Cover your bases from the start.

Do not assume Factory Five will make good on bad fiberglass work. For the most part they seem to get it right, but it can go wrong.

[FLPBFoot]

BTW I saw the Build School mentioned above. Although I am pretty handy, I was still thinking of taking the class with the goal of picking up some tips and practices that would help my build (and avoid any newbie mistakes). Any thoughts there?

Rob

I too have been working on cars, tractors, farm equipment, heavy equipment, semi-trucks, etc throughout my life. I went to build school to get an idea of any special tools needed and learn tips and tricks. Both of those were well covered as well as a great deal of insight into non FFR supplied upgrades, aftermarket parts available from various vendors here on the Forum. Also info on places to source small parts and pieces you may want or need. An example is Aircraft Spruce. All kinds of high quality parts. Gave me great info on what I might want to add to my build and what parts were less function and more just nice-to-have upgrades. There are many aftermarket parts out there and you can spend a great deal of $$. Details from the build school teachers was invaluable. For us, my wife bult the car with me, it helped her to visualize how we were going to go through this, and she was another set of eyes and ears during school writing notes and turning wrenches. Numerous times during our first build she would say, "remember they went through this in school". If you have the time, its well worth it.
Steve

[Jeff Kleiner]

RE: Build School. I was invited to attend and sit in as a guest 2 or 3 years ago---this was after having put together dozens of roadsters. I have to say that they do a great job and it would be invaluable for anyone considering building who may have reservations about their abilities...or even those who don't!

Jeff

[KayzDad]

+1 on the build school. And if you go take lots of pictures and record some videos. I had a 6-year gap between attending the build school and receiving my kit; being able to refer to the photos and videos was a huge help in jogging my memory.

Don't cheap out on tools. I started my build with the attitude that I wasn't going to spend $$ on things I might only use once or twice, which was really dumb. I now buy what is needed, and usually find I use it many more times than I expected.

[rthomas98]

Paul, That is great list, would like to add one. Do not treat this as a singular project it will get overwhelming quick if you do that. Think of it as multiple projects and break it up and take your small victories as you move forward. This forum can seem daunting by it looks like the big accomplishments are "engine Start", "Go Kart", "Gel Coat runner" then finished car. When really it is right front suspension mounted and torqued, Left front suspension mounted and torqued, steering installed so on and so forth. Take your small victories remember how to eat an elephant: "one bite at a time". This will keep you moving forward (or at least it did for me).

Finally don't be afraid to reach out directly for help to people on here. Lord knows I had my therapy sessions with Paul (thank you once again for those) as well Dave and others. In the words of Joe Dirt "Keep on Keeping on" and enjoy the expierence building it.

[TrackDay17]

Thanks guys for some excellent advice. I'm one of those 'new builders', with my kit coming in October. I have been building and working on cars for a long time though, so from that perspective it's not my first rodeo. Just the fulfillment of a long dream.

BTW I saw the Build School mentioned above. Although I am pretty handy, I was still thinking of taking the class with the goal of picking up some tips and practices that would help my build (and avoid any newbie mistakes). Any thoughts there?

Thanks!

Rob

Stangrob, I'm attending the build school that starts August 22, seems like a good way to avoid possibly making a costly mistake and to get hands on experience.
After the build school I'm placing my MK5 order and most likely a Gen4 Coyote from Forte.
Several spots open for that date, maybe I'll see you there.

EdwardB, Jeff Kleiner, thanks for all of your tips and insights, they are invaluable to us newbies.

[Stangrob]

Guys,

Fixit made a REALLY good point about looking down the road, post-build, and having to fix something on your car. I generally try to think about that with my projects, but as they say, "you don't know what you don't know".

So, what tweaks did you make to your car so that when you need to go back and do some maintenance, you're not taking half of the car apart, or drilling out a dozen rivets? Thanks!!!

Rob

[lonestar]

Good recommendations - thanks. In my case I haven't got a paper manual and the FFR sales person I'm dealing with told me they stopped supplying paper manuals with the kits a while ago. To me that sounds cheap and cheesy: I paid $40k+ for the complete kit and they save $10-15 on the paper manual? :confused: Anyways: my main concern is that the PDF manual (Rev. 5L as of Aug-2024) I'm using is not complete as I constantly compare it with the pictures of the paper manual builders post here in their threads and to me seems the paper version has way more details and steps documented. One of the example is that I constantly searching for the right part (a fastener mostly) trying to match its part number and shape with the the very limited info in the PDF. Takes a lot of time and causes tons of frustration :mad:
And I totally get the "it's not IKEA or LEGO" and I have no problem with that, but oftentimes it seems like I would be just better off paying a visit to nearby HW store and purchase a proper size nut or bolt rather than looking through the unmarked plastic pouches with what seemingly looks like the one I need for that or another build step. Why after 30+ years of making those kits they can't come up with the simple approach of labeling everything and matching every part with the build step it is used in?

[rthomas98]

Good recommendations - thanks. In my case I haven't got a paper manual and the FFR sales person I'm dealing with told me they stopped supplying paper manuals with the kits a while ago. To me that sounds cheap and cheesy: I paid $40k+ for the complete kit and they save $10-15 on the paper manual? :confused: Anyways: my main concern is that the PDF manual (Rev. 5L as of Aug-2024) I'm using is not complete as I constantly compare it with the pictures of the paper manual builders post here in their threads and to me seems the paper version has way more details and steps documented. One of the example is that I constantly searching for the right part (a fastener mostly) trying to match its part number and shape with the the very limited info in the PDF. Takes a lot of time and causes tons of frustration :mad:

Nope I own both and they are identical. The extra docs you are probably seeing are the supplements that are on the Factory five parts site. So additional tip in addition to the manual go to https://www.factoryfiveparts.com/ there is additional instructions and diagrams in additon to the manual there. I got tripped on it as well as I was going crazy thinking I was missing sections of the build manual.

[Kbl7td]

I hope this isn’t taken the wrong way and I know it will be. But factory five, as amazing as they are, is why these cars get that “kit car” stigma. Countless posts of people saying bolt xyz is missing rather than just measuring and going to the hardware store themselves. You’ll spend less and have a solution quicker. Lots of people expecting a Lego set, and props to FFR for having the infrastructure to support and produce these, it is impressive.

Buy any GT40 kit or RCR if you want a true “component car” experience.

[rthomas98]

I hope this isn’t taken the wrong way and I know it will be. But factory five, as amazing as they are, is why these cars get that “kit car” stigma. Countless posts of people saying bolt xyz is missing rather than just measuring and going to the hardware store themselves. You’ll spend less and have a solution quicker. Lots of people expecting a Lego set, and props to FFR for having the infrastructure to support and produce these, it is impressive.

Buy any GT40 kit or RCR if you want a true “component car” experience.

I really recommend to not just go to hardware store to buy the missing bolt. Especially when you are talking suspension fastners. Hardware stores will not have a lot of the hardness/shiring requirements and you could be creating a very dangerous situation down the road. At minimum I would recommend going to mcmaster and ensure you are getting a fastner at or better then the F5 design level. Which still circle backs on understanding the fastner you are looking for in the first place.

[gbranham]

I hope this isn’t taken the wrong way and I know it will be. But factory five, as amazing as they are, is why these cars get that “kit car” stigma. Countless posts of people saying bolt xyz is missing rather than just measuring and going to the hardware store themselves. You’ll spend less and have a solution quicker. Lots of people expecting a Lego set, and props to FFR for having the infrastructure to support and produce these, it is impressive.

Buy any GT40 kit or RCR if you want a true “component car” experience.

Many of the bolts that ship with the kit simply aren't available at your local big box hardware store in the proper grade. This is just bad advice for some of our new folks, or those uneducated in fasteners. And the 'you'll spend less' comment doesn't make sense...if someone is missing a kit bolt they already paid for, FFR will send it free of charge. I don't see how even the cheapest bolt at HD or Lowe's is cheaper than free.

[gbranham]

Good recommendations - thanks. In my case I haven't got a paper manual and the FFR sales person I'm dealing with told me they stopped supplying paper manuals with the kits a while ago. To me that sounds cheap and cheesy: I paid $40k+ for the complete kit and they save $10-15 on the paper manual?

The electronic version of the manual is a far better solution...it's in color, and you can search for what you're looking for. Load it up on a laptop and put it on your workbench. At some point, you'll realize you've stopped looking at the manual, anyway.

[Jphoenix]

My two cents is regarding the build manual. Read it closely and read every sentence. I have extensive experience as a mechanic, machinist and fabricator and one of the things I realized is that the build manual has a sequence of assembly laid out. While it's OK to hop around a bit in the sequence (like assembling the front shocks before the rear shocks) be very careful and read the manual closely or else you will have to disassemble something because something else needed to go in first. Even with my millions of years of experience and good looks, I got caught out a couple of times.

Most of the time, you'll be OK varying the build sequence, but there are a couple of gotcha's if you don't watch out. But hey, we're human, like the Ol' 2 Stroker YouTuber says - "We do it nice because we do it twice" :rolleyes:

Unless you plan to remove a nut or bolt later - torque it now. I use Torque Stripe on all the bolts and nuts - only to show that I torqued it already. If for some reason, I did not torque the bolt or nut because I'd have to remove it again for some reason (suspension alignment, etc.) then I can clearly see what is torqued and done, and what is not. Lots of torque-stripe, viz-torq and other torque pen products on Amazon.

When doing inventory, not only count the parts but make sure you have a left hand and a right of the part - I ended up with 2 left hand parts that I found out very late in the build because I didn't pay attention to the bracket shape - I just counted 2 and good to go. 2 lefts do not make a right.

Above all enjoy the build and if you're trying to decide which kit to buy - I'm going to push the Coupe, it's a hoot to drive! And keep it light if you can.

[Kbl7td]

Many of the bolts that ship with the kit simply aren't available at your local big box hardware store in the proper grade. This is just bad advice for some of our new folks, or those uneducated in fasteners. And the 'you'll spend less' comment doesn't make sense...if someone is missing a kit bolt they already paid for, FFR will send it free of charge. I don't see how even the cheapest bolt at HD or Lowe's is cheaper than free.

Well there’s your problem. Never go to a big box for bolts. An actual hardware store, think mom and pop supplied by ACE, will have more than you can imagine. I’m not waiting a week for a bolt when I can take a short drive and have it immediately. You’ll bend a control arm before a bolt ever shears in these cars.

With that being said I don’t think I had anything missing, in fact I have an absolute ton of left over hardware mostly because I did some things different. And a stack of unused extra items like others including seats, headlights, gauges and a ton of other stuff.

[JimStone]

Well there’s your problem. Never go to a big box for bolts. An actual hardware store, think mom and pop supplied by ACE, will have more than you can imagine. I’m not waiting a week for a bolt when I can take a short drive and have it immediately. You’ll bend a control arm before a bolt ever shears in these cars.


That being said. Factory Five is EXCELLENT at correcting any deficiencies

Like others have said. Do a thorough, bolt-by-bolt inventory when the kit arrives and let FFR know if something is missing. They'll have your missing parts to your door within a few business days.

I had very few things missing and I got everything I paid for

[Blitzboy54]

Don't forget this is fun. If it stops being fun, stop doing it until it's fun again.

Don't be afraid to do your own thing

Everything you "mess up" can be fixed. EVERYTHING.

Don't be afraid to start over.

If you build a by the book install manual replica or your own Frankenbeast it will be the most fun thing you've ever driven. The basic donor build handles like a 90's super car and has enough power to give any kid in a WRX a run for his money.

Be careful about over powering your car. 600 hp sounds awesome until it kills you.

In defense of the hardware store. Lowes/HD are useless. I have a local ACE with a nut and bolt isle. 8% of my car was purchased from that place. Obviously if your not sure what grade of bolt you need, go to FFR instead.

[gbranham]

Well there’s your problem. Never go to a big box for bolts. An actual hardware store, think mom and pop supplied by ACE, will have more than you can imagine. I’m not waiting a week for a bolt when I can take a short drive and have it immediately. You’ll bend a control arm before a bolt ever shears in these cars.

With that being said I don’t think I had anything missing, in fact I have an absolute ton of left over hardware mostly because I did some things different. And a stack of unused extra items like others including seats, headlights, gauges and a ton of other stuff.

If you had nothing missing, then why are you even part of this thread, or poo pooing FFR as a lesser kit car than, say, RCR? You seem to be simply argumentative.

[GoDadGo]

I got some great advice during my build from Paul B, Jeff K and Henry R.

My two cents is to read the manual a few times before you start.
That helped me greatly when doing the inventory process.
The inventory process then helped me during the build.
Seeing the parts and then touching them gave me great familiarization.

If you check out Paul's build threads they will help all future builders.

[UpNorth]

This thread should be a sticky.