New Build

[JohnnyDeere]

Greetings Forum,

I am about to pull the trigger on building one of these starting this fall. I am looking at the MK5 complete kit and my budget is a strict no more than 60 grand. I plan on doing all the body work and paint to save some money in the hopes that I can make the car what I want without having to save a ton of cash for the paint job. I am leaning towards a 302, as neat as it would be to put a 427 in the car it wouldn't necessarily be for me but for the badging and for others to say oh cool a 427. Any other engine suggestions that would be better? I am open to anything; this will not be on the track ever and will be a Sunday driver for me and the wife, but I do want to have it at least sound great and some fun when I open it up a bit. Lastly (for now lol) I live up in Maine and was wondering if anyone knows the car requirements for my state, example windshield wipers etc., and also the registration process.

Thanks everyone and I am sure you will see me again as I jump into this Project.

[gbranham]

Welcome! You'll get a ton of opinions on engines, but $60k is realistic, especially if you're doing your own bodywork and paint. The 302 is a solid platform; lots of folks really enjoy theirs. My first build was a warmed-over 302 that made around 325hp, and I really enjoyed it. FWIW, my MkIV is non-donor, IRS, with many upgrades, and a new Boss 427 with all the fancy schmancy EFI stuff. I'll have around $70k in it before paint and bodywork, so $60k is definitely realistic, and you'll have a very fun car you can be proud of.

Greg

[kcwitt]

If you want something you don't need to tinker with a Coyote would be a good choice.
I have one in my MKIV & other than an initial tune it''s the only thing I've done.
This thing is docile when that's what you want or it can be a beast when you want it to be.
Just my 2 cents

[rponfick]

Welcome, just got my Mk5 2 weeks ago, and currently working on installing the front suspension. Went with a Blueprint 347".
Have a Mk4 with IRS and Wilwoods all around but going more basic on the Mk5. I cannot tell much difference and not sure they are worth the extra funds on a streetcar, but that is just my opinion.
Ralph

[egchewy79]

$60k is definitely doable. My complete kit came in around $30-35k before paint and body work. I was also able to barter for the engine/trans from a buddy of mine. If you can find a cheap 302 block, get it machined and build it up, I could be a pretty good option. Even a crate 302 wouldn't be that bad and still come in under budget.

[BEAR-AvHistory]

Believe with a $60K budget you can do the whole thing including pro-paint.

[JohnnyDeere]

Wow, that would be nice to be able to get a pro to paint it in that budget.

302 vs 347? Which would the group pick? I appreciate all the feedback.

[egchewy79]

I have a 289 HiPo and it has plenty of giddy-up. 347 would be nice but starts to eat into the budget a bit. keep in mind that these cars are super light and too much extra HP is just wasted not to mention dangerous.

[JohnnyDeere]

Any shockers cost or parts wise that caught some of you off guard? Again planning on a complete kit with crate motor. Anything else you wish you knew before jumping into this.

[MaxVmo]

I’m under the $60K mark with a MKIV complete kit, new rear axle setup, power steering, Blueprint 347, standard suspension, FF5 wheels and vintage instruments. This includes my paint budget for Ken Pike on the west coast (should be done soon). I forgot to add the body cutouts option which you may want to consider. Some prefer to do their own as the cutouts may need to be different depending on pipes/engines etc.

I already had most tools necessary but I found I did add up some spending on small items like Breeze parts, fuel lines, fittings, kits (power steering lines), tube flaring tool, engine hoist, etc.

I wish I had done this sooner! What ended up happening for me is at times I would feel totally overwhelmed or stumped by something. These forums are such a great tool with such a great community that most of my problems were solved within a short time.

Also, the build manual can be a bit vague; many pros on this site have excellent tips on things to prioritize during your build.

My only real shock was the cost of quality paint and body work, but it’s an art form I have no experience with. Turnaround time for me on paint is going on eight months, but Ken is a go-to on the west side of the country for very good reason.

[PMD24]

Build School instructors say the 347 is the ideal engine for this car. That was relative to the MK4, but I assume it would apply to the MK5 as well.

Pat

[cv2065]

Someone said to me at a show that a Cobra is so over the top in every way that you can't have anything but a 427 in it. Opinions of course vary, but this is the engine that everyone 'expects' in these cars, even though they know they are replicas. Also adds to the resale. Most of the HP and displacement will only go so far as a car show and get lost in the over the top 'bragging' rights, but to some, that is the entire point.

[GoDadGo]

What engine you put between the frame rails matters not to anyone but you.
It will be a perfect match for you because you are building your dream.

Welcome Aboard & Welcome To The Family!

[ASL67]

Johnnydeere I will be looking forward to your updates, I am also in the same boat as far as budget and planning a build for next year. Running a few numbers on power to weight ratios I would say 370hp is more than enough. The MK5 at 2250lbs advertised with 370hp gives it a .16 pw to wright ratio. A 347 with 415hp (Blueprint) puts it at a .18 and for perspective a 2025 Corvette base weighs in at 3366lbs with 490hp sits at a .14. So based on that alone 370hp would be just fine. Goodluck Andy

[JMD]

I think a big consideration is how to you want to drive it and what kind of power delivery do you enjoy? I've had all kinds of engines and find that for street driving I like to wind it up a bit to get that rush of speed. Others like big hits of instant torque anywhere in the rev range. I opted for a moderately built 302 because it still has lots of torque for such a light car, but not so much power that I'm going to have to be overly careful with the throttle. Just to put it in perspective, a Miata (about the same size and weight as this car) is a fun car with 160hp and most any built 302 is going to have twice as much power and almost 3x's the torque.

One good argument for a bigger engine would be resale, but I built this for me and the driving experience I wanted in my car.

[rich grsc]

2 of my friends had a local builder work up 347's, one made 495 hp, the other with slightly bigger heads made 540 hp. Thats on an engine dyno.

[John4337]

Welcome aboard...be careful here, we are great at spending your money. Alot of your choices will have to do with your intended use. Shows? Cruising? Track? I have a ford x302 crate engine, plenty of power for cruising and travelling which is what we wanted out of ours. Best of luck and keep us posted.

John

[BEAR-AvHistory]

There is a lot of flash on horsepower. More & more + more is "better". Key to remember when you put your backside into the seat the whole package will most likely be under 2500lbs. Power to weight ratios are very interesting when you run the numbers.

Biggest issue with high power is applying that power to the ground.

[JohnnyDeere]

Great stuff guys, I reached out to FFR and it looks about a 5 week lead time right now for kits so I’ll probably be ordering around mid summer. As I get into the order process I am sure more questions will arise. What is the consensus on blue print engines, I have heard good things but also understand there are better builds out there. I like that they are building engines specific to this car which would make my life easier. Again thanks guys.

[gbranham]

Blueprint makes solid stuff, and many on the forum use them and are very happy.

Greg

[TrackDay17]

Greetings Forum,

I am about to pull the trigger on building one of these starting this fall. I am looking at the MK5 complete kit and my budget is a strict no more than 60 grand. I plan on doing all the body work and paint to save some money in the hopes that I can make the car what I want without having to save a ton of cash for the paint job. I am leaning towards a 302, as neat as it would be to put a 427 in the car it wouldn't necessarily be for me but for the badging and for others to say oh cool a 427. Any other engine suggestions that would be better? I am open to anything; this will not be on the track ever and will be a Sunday driver for me and the wife, but I do want to have it at least sound great and some fun when I open it up a bit. Lastly (for now lol) I live up in Maine and was wondering if anyone knows the car requirements for my state, example windshield wipers etc., and also the registration process.

Thanks everyone and I am sure you will see me again as I jump into this Project.


I'm not sure if he's on this forum but there is a guy on Youtube called Random Werks who is in Maine.
His car is definitely a different build but his craftsmanship is top notch.
I believe in one of his videos he covered getting it registered, I'd send him a message if possible and I'm sure he can give you the information.
His exhaust pipe setup is wild, something to see.

Good luck with your build, planning a MK5 order myself this fall to keep me buy this winter !

[JMD]

The only downsides I saw with buying a Blueprint package directly from BP was the price for a full package is a bit high and the wait time was more than I was willing to endure. I think they have a great product, but I had Forte buy a BP engine already in stock at Summit and build it up from there. It was cheaper that way and actually a bit faster. Forte did a great job with my engine package and customized it the way I wanted with TKX mid shift, Sniper 2 and other accessories. I also like his accessory drive system better than what comes on the BP engines...but that's just a matter of preference.

[Rebostar]

I finished my Mk 4 complete kit two moths ago. I built my own 351W based 427, Installed a Ford 9" rear end/w 4 link. Willwoods all around, new FMX transmission. E-Powersteering, Lots of custom touches. I cut no corners and was all in at $72K.
Good luck on the 60K.

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[JohnnyDeere]

Good Afternoon,

Well its getting to be that time for me to order this thing for my winter project. I will list out what I am thinking and if anyone can help me on some of the question Items that would be great!

-MK5 Roadster
-Blue Print 427
-I am looking at the hydraulic clutch master cylinder kit. does that make sense or should I stick with the supplied manual clutch release?
-Looking at 4 link, unless you guys sway me to the 3 link? Won't be used on the track at all.
-Can I use the 3 link shock kit with the 4 link? all I see is 3 link and IRS shocks.
-Power steering rack kit, I am assuming its easy to find a pump and bracket or is that something factory five also sells?

I won't get into the entire order but just some of the things I have some questions on. If anyone sees any issues or has better recommendations, I am all ears! I am excited for this build to get underway.

Thanks.

[Rebostar]

Good Afternoon,

Well its getting to be that time for me to order this thing for my winter project. I will list out what I am thinking and if anyone can help me on some of the question Items that would be great!

-MK5 Roadster
-Blue Print 427
-I am looking at the hydraulic clutch master cylinder kit. does that make sense or should I stick with the supplied manual clutch release?
-Looking at 4 link, unless you guys sway me to the 3 link? Won't be used on the track at all.
-Can I use the 3 link shock kit with the 4 link? all I see is 3 link and IRS shocks.
-Power steering rack kit, I am assuming its easy to find a pump and bracket or is that something factory five also sells?

I won't get into the entire order but just some of the things I have some questions on. If anyone sees any issues or has better recommendations, I am all ears! I am excited for this build to get underway.

Thanks.

I went with the 4 link. I installed a Ford 9" with 3.50 gears. I bought a 9 inch housing that was modified to bolt directly into the 8.8 set up from FFR. I've used the trianglulated 4 link with coil overs for several builds and I like the way they preform, and I'm all tooled up for the 9". I did not build for auto cross. I used after market upper and lower double adjustable rear control arms, not the supplied FFR ones. The lowers were set up for sway bar instalation. A lot of folks like the 3 link, but I went with what I know.
I used the FFR supplied rear shocks for my 4 link set up.

Best of luck. Allyn

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[Mike.Bray]

-MK5 Roadster
-Blue Print 427
-I am looking at the hydraulic clutch master cylinder kit. does that make sense or should I stick with the supplied manual clutch release?
-Looking at 4 link, unless you guys sway me to the 3 link? Won't be used on the track at all.
-Can I use the 3 link shock kit with the 4 link? all I see is 3 link and IRS shocks.
-Power steering rack kit, I am assuming its easy to find a pump and bracket or is that something factory five also sells?

Definitely go with the hydraulic clutch. Like definitely. Use a Tilton 13/16" MC and a Tilton hydraulic throwout bearing.

The 4 link gives some strange handling characteristics, it's really not recommended for these cars. The 3 link is much better and is the preferred setup from Factory Five.

Happy building!

[JMD]

If you’re really on a budget and not planning to track the car, I would consider going with the MkIV platform. The MK5 is certainly an improvement, but unless you need the extra room because you’re tall or are planning to wring it out on the track I don’t think the new chassis will make a big difference in your driving experience. I could be wrong, but that’s my take on it. I’m not sorry I got the MKIV as I really don’t see how the new chassis would make it a vastly superior driving experience for me.

So you decided to go with the 427 and are still trying to build it on a budget? Good luck with that! :p

[CW_MI]

I see you chose the 427, is your budget still $60k ? It seems like it will be challenging to stay in that budget.

I originally wanted to stay at $65k....that isn't going to happen.

Complete kit - $35,800
Engine/Trans/EFI (408) - $24,000
Fuel system - $1000
Wheels tires - $2800
Jet Hot sidepipes, and headers - ?
Powder coat roll bars - ?
Interior, want saddle brown leather
seats, door cards, trans tunnel. - ?
Body and paint - $13k-$15k
Misc - ?
Registration/taxes - ?

[Mike.Bray]

I see you chose the 427, is your budget still $60k ? It seems like it will be challenging to stay in that budget.

I originally wanted to stay at $65k....that isn't going to happen.

Complete kit - $35,800
Engine/Trans/EFI (408) - $24,000
Fuel system - $1000
Wheels tires - $2800
Jet Hot sidepipes, and headers - ?
Powder coat roll bars - ?
Interior, want saddle brown leather
seats, door cards, trans tunnel. - ?
Body and paint - $13k-$15k
Misc - ?
Registration/taxes - ?

Body & Paint at $13-15k might be a challenge unless you're doing a lot of the work yourself.

My registration and taxes here in Texas was $104 :D

[CW_MI]

Body & Paint at $13-15k might be a challenge unless you're doing a lot of the work yourself.

My registration and taxes here in Texas was $104 :D

It is what I was quoted from a painter that was recommended from a forum member. He's done many of these cars.

Here in MI, you have to provide the MCO, and all the receipts for the drivetrain, etc., and they tax you on that. Would love it to be as low as yours. Vehicle registration is a bad word at our home this week....the wife just got her first renewal on her EV....$450 !

With the budget on this build steadily increasing, I might have to start an O/F page. Lol

[Mike.Bray]

It is what I was quoted from a painter that was recommended from a forum member. He's done many of these cars.

Here in MI, you have to provide the MCO, and all the receipts for the drivetrain, etc., and they tax you on that. Would love it to be as low as yours. Vehicle registration is a bad word at our home this week....the wife just got her first renewal on her EV....$450 !

With the budget on this build steadily increasing, I might have to start an O/F page. Lol

Having lived in Texas my entire life I have to say I've genuinely been shocked at what other states do with registration fees, taxes, and my favorite, property taxes on cars. I do however understand the high registration fee on an EV, you're not paying tax on gasoline which is typically used for roads.

The rest I feel for you.

[CW_MI]

Having lived in Texas my entire life I have to say I've genuinely been shocked at what other states do with registration fees, taxes, and my favorite, property taxes on cars. I do however understand the high registration fee on an EV, you're not paying tax on gasoline which is typically used for roads.

The rest I feel for you.

We do as well, we just weren't prepared for it, I guess.

[Blitzboy54]

I put a 306 in mine with a T5 and solid rear axle.


It sold in 36 hours... just make it look cool

[CW_MI]

If you’re really on a budget and not planning to track the car, I would consider going with the MkIV platform. The MK5 is certainly an improvement, but unless you need the extra room because you’re tall or are planning to wring it out on the track I don’t think the new chassis will make a big difference in your driving experience. I could be wrong, but that’s my take on it. I’m not sorry I got the MKIV as I really don’t see how the new chassis would make it a vastly superior driving experience for me.

So you decided to go with the 427 and are still trying to build it on a budget? Good luck with that! :p

After seeing how much over my planned budget I will end up being, this thought is slowly starting to cross my mind.
A friend just bought a Mk4 complete kit last week, and had no reservations about it.

[Justin]

Any shockers cost or parts wise that caught some of you off guard? Again planning on a complete kit with crate motor. Anything else you wish you knew before jumping into this.

Paint. Looks like $15k+ for high end and $10k for mid-range.

[Jeff Kleiner]

...I am leaning towards a 302, as neat as it would be to put a 427 in the car it wouldn't necessarily be for me but for the badging and for others to say oh cool a 427. Any other engine suggestions that would be better? I am open to anything; this will not be on the track ever and will be a Sunday driver for me and the wife, but I do want to have it at least sound great and some fun when I open it up a bit...


Good Afternoon,

Well its getting to be that time for me to order this thing for my winter project. I will list out what I am thinking and if anyone can help me on some of the question Items that would be great!

-MK5 Roadster
-Blue Print 427
-I am looking at the hydraulic clutch master cylinder kit. does that make sense or should I stick with the supplied manual clutch release?
-Looking at 4 link, unless you guys sway me to the 3 link? Won't be used on the track at all.
-Can I use the 3 link shock kit with the 4 link? all I see is 3 link and IRS shocks.
-Power steering rack kit, I am assuming its easy to find a pump and bracket or is that something factory five also sells?

I won't get into the entire order but just some of the things I have some questions on. If anyone sees any issues or has better recommendations, I am all ears! I am excited for this build to get underway.

Thanks.

Well, it looks like you gave up on the 302 idea. You've said twice that you don't plan on tracking the car and just want a fun driver. Trust me, a 340-360ish horsepower 302 from Blueprint or Forte will do all that and more! It will also preserve your budget because you can use a new T5-z rather than having to pony up for a TKX. Couple that with a 3.55 rear gear and you'll have more than enough go. The T5 is very happy with a cable clutch and as long as you use a genuine Ford cable the pedal effort will be no more than a hydraulic. If you go Blueprint they can set it up with the front dress and a Ford PS pump. I don't think you can get a 4 link with a Mk5 but even if you can, don't. Just go with the 3 link. Again, trust me ;)

Cheers,
Jeff

[gbranham]

You could save $3000 or more by building your own 427. That's what I did. I started with a Boss 427 shortblock from Summit, and built it up from there. Had it quicker than Blueprint could provide it, and I used what I feel to be better components.

Greg

[Jeff Kleiner]

Paint. Looks like $15k+ for high end and $10k for mid-range.

Due to skyrocketing material costs over the past few years it's getting really hard to come in under 10K when using high quality products except when doing very basic colors. Even the old standby Guardsman Blue is over $1,000/gallon now.

Jeff

[JohnnyDeere]

You could save $3000 or more by building your own 427. That's what I did. I started with a Boss 427 shortblock from Summit, and built it up from there. Had it quicker than Blueprint could provide it, and I used what I feel to be better components.

Greg

I wish I could….and maybe I can, while I am mechanically inclined, I wouldn’t know where to begin on building my own motor and trust I can produce a reliable result…

[cadtdi]

You might consider looking at an already built car that meets your spec...it is a good way to keep it within your budget. The downside is that YOU did not build it...but you certainly can enjoy the ride!

[Mike.Bray]

I wish I could….and maybe I can, while I am mechanically inclined, I wouldn’t know where to begin on building my own motor and trust I can produce a reliable result…

The first step is to call it an engine. Motors are electric;)

[Mike.Bray]

We do as well, we just weren't prepared for it, I guess.

It costs money to save the planet with an EV:rolleyes:

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[Shamilton289]

I just started building a 289 USRRC. It’s based on the MK4 frame and only comes a a ‘complete’ kit. It was around $24k with options, including wheels and tires. Plus $1900 shipping.
Budget-wise I’m around $37k so far, building a warmed up 289 engine myself, and rebuilding a trans and rear end.
I still need about $1,000 for trans rebuild, $900 for carb restore, and then body and paint which I also plan to do.
So right around $40k plus paint.

[JohnnyDeere]

Well, it looks like you gave up on the 302 idea. You've said twice that you don't plan on tracking the car and just want a fun driver. Trust me, a 340-360ish horsepower 302 from Blueprint or Forte will do all that and more! It will also preserve your budget because you can use a new T5-z rather than having to pony up for a TKX. Couple that with a 3.55 rear gear and you'll have more than enough go. The T5 is very happy with a cable clutch and as long as you use a genuine Ford cable the pedal effort will be no more than a hydraulic. If you go Blueprint they can set it up with the front dress and a Ford PS pump. I don't think you can get a 4 link with a Mk5 but even if you can, don't. Just go with the 3 link. Again, trust me ;)

Cheers,
Jeff

Thanks Jeff, certainly didn’t give up on the 302 just had to many external pressures saying I have to go big or go home…..but your input kinda snapped me out of it….

[Jeff Kleiner]

Thanks Jeff, certainly didn’t give up on the 302 just had to many external pressures saying I have to go big or go home…..but your input kinda snapped me out of it….

You know what I've observed in over 20 years of building and owning Factory Fives? This won't be a popular opinion with some but lots of guys want that 427 label for some mystique (even though the 427 Windsors have virtually nothing in common with the original car's FE engine) or for chest thumping at the Saturday morning Cars & Coffee but I've seen it many times...quite often the big engine, ultra high horsepower cars just don't get driven much. One of my customers with a snotty 427 confessed that it really wasn't much fun for "Sunday drive" sort of use and every time he took it out his neighbors would kind of give him the ol' stinkeye because they thought he was being a jerk when in fact he just had to keep it wound up to keep it running at low speed! He sold it and is currently building another, this time with a mild 302 based Windsor. The 302/347 and Coyote cars seem to be the ones that rack up the miles. I've got a few friends who are either beyond or knocking on the door to 100,000 miles. Just what I've observed... :)

Jeff

[JMD]

I’ve finally wrapped up tuning my 302 and was just thinking how I enjoy lugging it around on the backroads at 1600 rpm with no problems as well as ripping it to the redline when the mood hits. The Blueprint 302 with this specific cam is a real joy. Has a bit of old school lope at idle (it sounds like a bigger engine) but it’s not temperamental and incredibly well behaved. It also opens up real nice and makes power all the way to the redline. If you really want more power their 347 should be plenty and I think it’s also well behaved, though I haven’t seen one in person. But for me drivability was key and this engine nails it. I’ve had high strung engines and a supercharged 383 in a classic Camaro that was a beast…but if it’s not easy to drive or well behaved you’re just going to find yourself getting in that driver seat less and less.

Don’t fall victim to the hype. Even better, go see cars that have different engines in person. It’s amazing how a Coyote and pushrod engine have totally different character and sounds. Personally, I like a pushrod engine in a classic car, but others feel differently. Figure out what floats your boat, don’t go by what other people say.

[Reddrig]

I love reading people’s opinions on threads like this. It almost seems like people try and justify decisions by the language they use.
1. Waste of power down right dangerous
2. Blueprint vs Forte
3. Mark V vs Mark lV / Won’t notice much difference in chassis
4. Pro paint vs do it yourself
5. Coyote vs everything else

Here is my advice, I don’t have an opinion to offer. Do what tickles or gives you that little dopamine rush in your head. Wake up everyday excited about your choices. When your sitting on your sofa after spending 8 hours in the garage and you can’t resist the urge to go back out in the garage for another hour, that’s when you know you did it right how ever that looks. Lots of great information from experienced people will help you make educated decisions. Good luck and have fun!

[TrackDay17]

If your budget is a strict 60K I don't see how you can do it for that with a MK5 and 427 from Blueprint.
I'm guessing you might get there without many options like Wilwoods and go aftermarket wheels.

I just ordered a MK5 last week and have a Blueprint 347 fuel injected ordered too.
I did check a lot of options boxes on the MK5 but there's no way I'll be under 60k.
I knew this wasn't going to be a cheap thing going in and cost overruns will be normal to build what I myself want.
If I was trying to build on a tighter budget I might have done a MK4 and a Ford Performance 302 from Forte.

Good luck with your build whatever you decide to build !

[edwardb]

In the ongoing discussion regarding Mk4 vs Mk5 here's my take FWIW: Full disclosure, I haven't priced out the two kits at today's prices so I don't know the actual difference. But having built a couple Mk4's and now well into a Mk5 build, I can only say the difference is significant. It's like Factory Five listed all the common mods that builders make and put those into the Mk5. Maybe that's what they did... The added space is everywhere -- cockpit, foot boxes, engine compartment, transmission tunnel, etc. Even if you don't "need" the extra space, it makes the finished product more versatile for you and any future owners. A factor many don't like to talk about ("I'll own this for life...") but IMO something that should always be considered. The comparisons to the Gen3 Coupe that I did several years ago are valid. I agree for every day street drivers (like me) the added chassis stiffness is maybe not significant. But if it's anything like our Coupe I'll be very happy. Probably the biggest factor, at least in my observation so far, is if Factory Five is able to hold the quality of the Mk5 body to be like the one delivered to me, the cost difference should be more than made up with decreased body and paint cost.

[CraigS]

If going old school V8, I always recommend a 351. It doesn't cost any more and it is more cubes. Advantages; 1- More cubes makes any given HP easier to get to at lower rpms/milder cam so more easily driven. 2- 351 uses different headers and intake, so if you start w/ 351, you already have headers and intake that can be reused if you want to upgrade later to a 408 like I did. Also a 408 requires a kit w/ stroker crank, rods, pistons. 3- There is also a 393(or close to that #) that can be built w/ just a stroker crank but some combination of stock 351/302 rods and pistons. Sorry I forget which is which but these would all be stock parts vs the higher end parts needed for a 408. 4- If you think you would like to learn about V8s, a 351 is an easy rebuild that starts you out w/ a couple more cubes than a stroker kit w/ higher end parts for a 347.

[CW_MI]

It costs money to save the planet with an EV:rolleyes:

218402

Lol, don't get me started. We ended up with one, just because the lease was cheap, and I figured if I'm going to argue with the EV cheerleaders, I might as well have some experience with one.

Funny thing, on another forum I'm on, that has an EV subforum, I made a post with our first couple of months experience with it, which had some positive and negative things. I got lambasted by the EV cheerleaders, everything I thought was a negative was all our fault.

This is definitely a one and done thing. It will be replaced by a full size gas guzzling SUV.

[cadtdi]

Just to add to the sort of "less can be more" vibe about what engine is the 'sweet spot' in a replica -

My car is a Unique built 30 years ago, still has the original Ford SVO crate engine - 351W, 385HP / 375 torque.

It moves the car very well, more power than is needed if I am honest. It is a car I actually drive, 2200 miles so far this year.

I have had a few folks that I run into swear it is an FE engine and I have to open the hood to show them that is is a SBF.

If for no other reason than drivability and bang-for-the-buck, it is hard to beat a nicely warmed over 302/331/347/351..I promise you will still smile every mile!

.chris
.

[JohnnyDeere]

I knew there was a reason I wanted to post this to the forum prior to order. I was convinced that a 302 or 351 engine option was the way to go but to many people talked me out of it and pulled me away from the reason why I am doing this project. So, thanks to you all for getting me back on track.

Wilwood breaks or do the standard break package that comes with the kit do ok?

[Reddrig]

I knew there was a reason I wanted to post this to the forum prior to order. I was convinced that a 302 or 351 engine option was the way to go but to many people talked me out of it and pulled me away from the reason why I am doing this project. So, thanks to you all for getting me back on track.

Wilwood breaks or do the standard break package that comes with the kit do ok?

I think the Wildwoods are more eye candy, if you paint the calipers on the standard brakes they probably look almost as nice. That being said I have the Wildwoods, I didn’t have a choice on my order. But I’m not sure they are needed for street applications.

[JMD]

You can go with standard, they are perfectly functional according to most people. They are a lot cheaper and if you don't like them you can always swap to Wilwoods later. I did Wilwoods because I stayed with manual brakes (no booster) and wanted the extra stopping power. (Wilwoods from Gordon Levy, not FFR.) If you're going with power assist of some sort I think standard brakes will be more than enough. If you're going with manual brakes I think an upgrade would be desirable.

[Jeff Kleiner]

Unless you're doing serious track work the Wilwoods are not necessary (and even then it's debatable). As for "extra stopping power"...unless the tires can overpower the brakes there is none. Use the 13" twin piston Mustang brakes on the front and the 11.65" on the rear with good pads and you'll be able to pop your eyeballs out!

Jeff

[JMD]

Unless you're doing serious track work the Wilwoods are not necessary (and even then it's debatable). As for "extra stopping power"...unless the tires can overpower the brakes there is none. Use the 13" twin piston Mustang brakes on the front and the 11.65" on the rear with good pads and you'll be able to pop your eyeballs out!

Jeff

Jeff, do you think they’re that good even without a booster of some kind?

[Nigel Allen]

Have the standard calipers and no power assist. Once I fitted Hawk HP+ pads all round and tweaked the bias, all is good. I don't feel I need to make any further improvements. I am a decent driver, but not outstanding. I do give my car a fair caning and the brakes keep up.

Brakes- no problem , but I couldn't get by without power steering.

Cheers,
Nige

Only complaints is the amount of brake dust from the HP+ pads and a little bit of squeal when cold.

[Cobraman]

There is a lot of truth on this site as many have said it's yours build like you want, and yes we can really spend your money faster than uncle sam ask me how I know. I've been working on mine for almost a year now and I'm at 42k with almost a running 408 stroker looks like a 427. But if you haven't read the introduction driving a Cobra you should.
A few reminders to all owners & a good read for soon to be's

[JohnnyDeere]

Did some more digging and you gents were right about the MK4 vs 5 price wise. I can get the same package for about 6 grand cheaper. Not completely sold on it yet as I am a bit taller and I understand the body comes in a much better fit with less work required on the MK5.

In terms of engines I am looking at the 347 Stroker. Thoughts?

[gbranham]

Did some more digging and you gents were right about the MK4 vs 5 price wise. I can get the same package for about 6 grand cheaper. Not completely sold on it yet as I am a bit taller and I understand the body comes in a much better fit with less work required on the MK5.

In terms of engines I am looking at the 347 Stroker. Thoughts?

Oh boy...here we go. Get ready for 400 opinions on engines and fuel management. Hah!

The 347 is widely considered the Goldilocks engine for these cars. You'll love it.

Greg

[Mike.Bray]

In terms of engines I am looking at the 347 Stroker. Thoughts?

Four basic choices for engines.

Chevy LS3
Coyote
Short deck SBF
Tall deck SBF

LS3 is a great engine, still pushrod but modern. Millions of them around. Nice compact size so fits well but resale value will take a hit as there's a stigma of putting a Chevy in a British sports car for some reason.

Coyote. Another great modern engine and is DOHC. Millions are out there. IMO it's too big and ugly for a 60's Cobra but people that have stuffed them in love the way they drive. Probably have to pay Lund $$$ for tuning.

Short deck SBF. 302W based, can easily stroke to 347 or even 363. I agree with Greg, the 347 is a super sweet engine for these cars. Enough torque and power to get up and go but not so much every drive scares the hell out of you.

Tall deck SBF. 351W based, can be easily stroked to 393, 408, or a 427 beast. Other than brute torque and power the advantage I see is it's easy to convert one of these to the mythical 427 if ever desired. With the short deck everything in the short block would need to change as well as the headers. You might not want a 427 but the next guy might.

[gbranham]

And Mike and I are the poster children for Fuel Injection vs Carburetors. We're fan boys. Hah!

Greg

[Mike.Bray]

And Mike and I are the poster children for Fuel Injection vs Carburetors. We're fan boys. Hah!

Greg

Haha true! Not everyone has come into the 21st century like we have Greg:D

218455

[JsMoose]

I just finished up (mostly) a rebuild of a 302 out of a 1968 mustang (first year of the 302). Got the block for $500 and after everything I've put into it, I'm at about $5.5k. That includes the machining and all the new parts... about $500 of it was just bolts. I still need fuel injection and front pulleys... so I'll be close to $8k before I'm done. Don't tell my wife. ;)

Still, it was a ton of fun to build and I'm really happy I did it. So many options with the old 302 that will take the price up or down. At the end, I could have bought one for the same cost but that's no fun (but it would have come with a warranty).

Jay

PS. Good luck with the build!

[TrackDay17]

After considering every engine except an LS I decided to order a 347, right down the middle seems like a good choice for many guys here.
I thought I wanted a Coyote but talked myself out of it because I like the sound and looks of the SBF.
I've been privileged to ride in both GBranham's 427 and JMD's 302 powered cars, both of them sound great and put a huge grin on my face and theirs too I'm sure every time they drive them.
Honestly I think you should choose what you want and what fits in your budget.
I almost went with the 302 but the 347 wasn't too much more so I went for it.


On another not on solid axle vs IRS that one of the build instructors brought up at the school I hadn't considered that can save some money.
He said if he was ordering a car now he would choose IRS and search the wrecking yards for a Mustang IRS if he wanted to save money.
His reasoning was kind of two fold.
First, almost every car built over the last number of years other than trucks has IRS so they are easier to find anymore in good shape than a solid axle.
Secondly was there's lots of crashed Mustangs that end up in the junkyard, just go on social media and watch some videos he said, lol.
going that route might save you some cash for other things.

I did read that what to know about driving a Cobra sticky thread and I've referred back to it a couple of times to keep my ego in check !
One of the biggest things I like about these cars is that each person here can build exactly what they want their car to look, sound and perform like.

There are so many great builds here and I agree it sure can be easy for us to spend your money, lol.

[JsMoose]

Congrats! I'm sure you will be happy with the 347. It's a great engine.. just like a 302 but more torque with the extra stroke.

Jay

[CraigS]

RE; brakes. I am sure Wilwoods are nice. But the stock front brakes from FFR and the OE Mustang brakes w/ IRS is a great combination. This is actually a $ advantage that can get you into IRS almost for free. Buy an IRS takeout from a salvage yard that includes the brakes. See, no rear brakes to buy as a separate item. Compare to a 3 link solid axle w/ mostly inadequate brakes and the $s are not that much different especially if you grab a Moser.

[cv2065]

Haha true! Not everyone has come into the 21st century like we have Greg:D

218455


Lol...;)

[MaxVmo]

I ended up with the BP 347. The dyno sheet shows 425hp which is plenty for what I want. I used Breeze for their power steering hose setup. The power steering is super responsive. My kit is fairly straightforward—most of my aftermarket stuff was fairly affordable—mostly from Breeze and interior side panels from Cobra Herb. Ace hardware has been a game changer for nuts and bolts. I picked up many ideas from builders here. Some of the builds are so detailed on these threads it’s like following a build manual. Invaluable!

[Nigel Allen]

Haha true! Not everyone has come into the 21st century like we have Greg:D

218455

21st century?... Did somebody say metric?;)

Cheers,

Nige

[gbranham]

21st century?... Did somebody say metric?;)

Cheers,

Nige

It makes perfect sense to have 12 inches in a foot, and 5280 feet in a mile. Why would we make it easy and do everything in multiples of ten? Hah!

[Mike.Bray]

21st century?... Did somebody say metric?;)

Cheers,

Nige

I'm actually bi-measurement. Grew up with imperial and worked in a machine and fab shop so know all the imperial measurements and decimal equivalents. Been working for an Australian company the past 26 years where everything is metric. I'll admit the metric system is much easier, the tap drill for an M6-1 is an M5. But I still find myself converting millimeters to inches in my head to judge a size:(

[JohnnyDeere]

Well Gents......I ordered the Kit!!

I went with the MK4 as I was able to save a bunch of money on the options I chose, wish I could have gone with the MK5 but I know I will be happy with my purchase. Tomorrow I will reach out to BP and get the engine ordered. Thanks for all the input and I can't wait to keep you all in the loop as things progress.....

Now time to figure out where I am going to put this thing. :)

[gbranham]

Congrats! Its an exciting time for you! Enjoy it.

Greg

[JohnnyDeere]

My state Maine requires cats on cars made after 2001, where does this kit fall and will I be good without them?

[nucjd19]

The fellas have given great responses that I could not add too much to but your forum name reminds me of this band everytime I see it ......

https://youtu.be/Y0ORYHQ-VMA?si=XY9Fk6m4eG5gi5k-

[Aleinsteingenius]

I am going with the Godzilla on our MKV build. I learned riding choppers with straight pipes through town it is great to have tons of torque at really low rpms. I realize there is an extra 100 lbs at the front of the car but with my size there is also an extra hundred pounds at the back of the car lol. If the bias is too far off all I have to do is try to stay on my pizza and beer diet.

[Tooth]

If you're not like me and don't go down every mod rabbit hole, you should be good.

[JohnnyDeere]

The fellas have given great responses that I could not add too much to but your forum name reminds me of this band everytime I see it ......

https://youtu.be/Y0ORYHQ-VMA?si=XY9Fk6m4eG5gi5k-

Hahaha interesting. I do like my tractor.

[JohnnyDeere]

Ok thanks, I would rather not install them just hate to get to registration and inspection time and have issues....

[JohnnyDeere]

Gents, She was delivered today after much wait. Cunningham did an excellent job with the delivery and I have started my inventory. A lot of stuff backordered and from what I have seen so far it could bring me to a halt very quickly if they don't arrive, but it is what it is.

Hmm can't seem to upload the pictures....If anyone could help with that I would love to share, I click the image tab then add the files but when I click upload files the box just disappears and nothing uploads.

[danmas]

Hmm can't seem to upload the pictures....If anyone could help with that I would love to share, I click the image tab then add the files but when I click upload files the box just disappears and nothing uploads.

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?52159-How-to-embed-a-picture-in-your-post

[Jeff Kleiner]

Congrats on the delivery!


A lot of stuff backordered and from what I have seen so far it could bring me to a halt very quickly if they don't arrive...



Unless all of your aluminum is backordered you have plenty of drilling to keep you busy! After that you can put together your coilovers...and windshield...and dash...and lights... Lots can be done ;)

Jeff

[gbranham]

We hear this concern frequently from new builders...fear that backorders will slow them down. As Jeff said, it won't, unless you're planning another 24 hour build like what happened years ago, right Jeff?

[gbranham]

Gents, She was delivered today after much wait. Cunningham did an excellent job with the delivery and I have started my inventory. A lot of stuff backordered and from what I have seen so far it could bring me to a halt very quickly if they don't arrive, but it is what it is.

Hmm can't seem to upload the pictures....If anyone could help with that I would love to share, I click the image tab then add the files but when I click upload files the box just disappears and nothing uploads.

Oh, when you hit the upload button, it does indeed look like nothing is happening. Do only 2 or 3 picture uploads at a time, and give it 10-20 seconds after you hit "upload".

[JohnnyDeere]

How about now….220832220833220834

[CraigS]

That works except the pics are laying on their side. I don't know why that happens but it does it sometimes for me too. I go into the folder where they are saved on my PC and turn them 90 degrees. Then upload them again.

[JohnnyDeere]

Thanks for the help guys.....I am super impressed with what I have received so far with the kit, my only criticism so far is that I guess I was half expecting to receive a printed build manual. Yes I got the digital copy which will work I just enjoy getting the pages dirty and its kind of a history piece when all is said and done. I did go onto staples yesterday 377 bucks for them to make a manual, and Factory five is out of stock. :rolleyes:

[tnt_motorsports]

Thanks for the help guys.....I am super impressed with what I have received so far with the kit, my only criticism so far is that I guess I was half expecting to receive a printed build manual. Yes I got the digital copy which will work I just enjoy getting the pages dirty and its kind of a history piece when all is said and done. I did go onto staples yesterday 377 bucks for them to make a manual, and Factory five is out of stock. :rolleyes:

I hear you about the manual and paper copy. Old habits die hard! FWIW, I bought a $100 tablet and downloaded the manuals to it. I can take it anywhere and it is searchable. I may have graduated to the 21st Century...

[PMD24]

To stop the photos from turning sideways, resize them so that the largest dimension is under 2000. I use 1900. Just save the resized version and you can upload itdirectly from your computer, the cloud, a thumb drive... from essentially anywhere. No need to save to flicker or the Gallery.

Once it loads, click on the blue icon in the menu above (far left). The photo will then appear as a photo instead of the filename.

If you want it bigger, double click on it. A dialogue box ill open and you can choose a bigger size.

EZ PZ

Also, if you load them one at a time, hit return twice to put a space between them. Easier to view that way, and you can type in short descriptors for each one if needed.

Pat

[tundra2050]

Thanks for the help guys.....I am super impressed with what I have received so far with the kit, my only criticism so far is that I guess I was half expecting to receive a printed build manual. Yes I got the digital copy which will work I just enjoy getting the pages dirty and its kind of a history piece when all is said and done. I did go onto staples yesterday 377 bucks for them to make a manual, and Factory five is out of stock. :rolleyes:

Congrats on getting your kit!

Does FF plan on sending the hard copy manual?

[rickster991]

I printed mine on a home color laser printer I had. I used thick stock paper, 32 lb, which costs like $20. I punched holes and put it in a binder. Took a while, but I got the visceral feel I wanted.

220851

[JohnnyDeere]

I printed mine on a home color laser printer I had. I used thick stock paper, 32 lb, which costs like $20. I punched holes and put it in a binder. Took a while, but I got the visceral feel I wanted.

220851

Wow looks nice, I may have to give that a try.....I did use my Ipad yesterday and that works really slick in terms of the table of contents being clickable allowing you to just jump right to the page you want, however I don't think I am going to enjoy that when my hands are covered in whatever part of the car I am in that day.

[JohnnyDeere]

I got the body off the car yesterday and it went fairly smooth. One thing to note was there was lose hardware throughout the car, some parts I could identify as door hinge hardware those were just held on by the duct tape and there are definitely some parts missing but that is an easy fix. Other hardware I am not sure where it's from or what it is to, I will squirl it away and see what it fits later on in the build.

[JohnnyDeere]

No, they don't send them out anymore I guess, you can pay for one, but they are out of stock. They put a scan code on the front of the car to download the manual. I am not sure I understand unless the community said there was no need for them to produce a hardcopy. In terms of the cost of a complete kit it's probably cheaper than the packing boxes they use to ship the parts. Don't want to sound like a complainer though I am very happy with the product they sent me I was just looking forward to opening that crisp manual, had a spot for it any everything.

[Mike.Bray]

The world is going away from paper manuals. My company sells equipment that costs millions of dollars and we stopped shipping hardcopy manuals years ago. Now we ship a USB jump drive.

[gbranham]

Having built two of these cars and used both the hard copy build manual and the electronic version, the e-version is far more helpful. It's in color, and you can search for keywords, which makes finding what you're looking for in a 560 page book much easier. And you'll find at some point (usually after the suspension buildup) that you don't use it page-by-page, but may reference certain sections from time to time. The forum is a far better 'build manual' than what FFR provides. A don't forget there are many supplemental instructions on FFR's website in the 'Parts' section.

Greg

[MaxVmo]

I too printed the manual but in all honesty having the downloaded manual on my iPhone was quicker to reference, especially for color photos. An important lesson I learned from these fine folks is that the build order doesn’t have to follow the steps the manual lays out. I found plenty to do while waiting for parts!

[Nigel Allen]

With the money saved by not printing the whole manual, you can buy a printer and put it on your workbench. Then, just print off the few pages as needed. I reckon I only needed a few pages printed in the end. As Greg said, once you move past brake and suspension, assembly becomes quite straightforward.

Cheers,

Nige.

[PMD24]

I took an old laptop and monitor to my shop. Works perfectly for this and having the large monitor is great when looking at photos for details. It's great for searching the forum as well, when I'm in the middle of something that I need to research a bit. I used a point-to-point wireless bridge that shoots my internet from the house to my shop, about 400 ft away (through walls as well). Best of all its plug and play... and cheap.

Pat

[RobHartley]

Its a heck of a lot cheaper than having Staples print the manual in color - up here in Vancouver BC they wanted to charge me $350 CDN (~$250 USD) and you can make annotations on the PDF! ;)

[edwardb]

All the discussion about printed manuals... At my company before I retired, I was very involved with user documents for all of our applications. We had a saying. Anything printed is immediately uncontrolled and out of date. It's an adjustment to no longer receive a printed manual for these builds. But it's not bad once you get used to it. As already stated, is nice to be able to quickly search, quickly scroll through various sections, etc. I have an old laptop on a widescreen TV in my basement shop (instead of in front of my treadmill, but don't tell anyone :rolleyes:) and often use that as I'm working. I will occasionally print selected pages for reference. Like the hardware lists, aluminum panel exploded diagram, carpet piece diagram, etc. But mostly have transitioned to using the electronic manual all the time. One thing that nobody has mentioned is new versions of build manuals do get released. The Mk5 has had several versions. The latest one contained some pretty significant updates. If you sprung for hundreds of dollars to print a manual, would be a shame because it could be out of date.

[CraigS]

Buy a box of plastic gloves at Advance or AUtoZone. Rip off your mouse hand glove and grab that mouse. I spent 20+ yrs as a dealer tech using these.
https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/microflex-diamond-grip-powder-free-latex-gloves-mfxmf300xl/25981045-P?searchTerm=Gloves
But about 3-4 months ago bought a box of these
https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/autowurks-orange-heavy-duty-nitriledisposable-gloves-8-mil-latex-powder-free-large-100-count-g10100n/12522559-P?searchTerm=Gloves
They are very heavy and have a fine dimple pattern which makes working w/ slippery parts easier. There is always a pair sitting somewhere in the garage and I do 95% of my work w/ gloves on.

[Mike.Bray]

Buy a box of plastic gloves at Advance or AUtoZone. Rip off your mouse hand glove and grab that mouse. I spent 20+ yrs as a dealer tech using these.
https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/microflex-diamond-grip-powder-free-latex-gloves-mfxmf300xl/25981045-P?searchTerm=Gloves
But about 3-4 months ago bought a box of these
https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/autowurks-orange-heavy-duty-nitriledisposable-gloves-8-mil-latex-powder-free-large-100-count-g10100n/12522559-P?searchTerm=Gloves
They are very heavy and have a fine dimple pattern which makes working w/ slippery parts easier. There is always a pair sitting somewhere in the garage and I do 95% of my work w/ gloves on.

Less expensive at Amazon and you don't have to drive to pick them up. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0013J62NQ?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_fed_asin_title&th=1

[JohnnyDeere]

Well, I got everything inventoried and dug right into the build. I have found that I do enjoy using the iPad for the manual, easy to zoom in and go back and forth, but I probably will print out the manual as well just to have something that I can get dirty and not worry about dropping etc. I got done what I could on the front end which was not much due to most of it being backordered, so I am currently working on the rear. I have enjoyed myself so far. My biggest problem is that what I thought would be a well-organized flowing workspace has been nothing but a pain in my *** since I started.

[tundra2050]

Good luck with your build and enjoy! I just finished painting and rearranging my garage to make more room for my wife's car and the kit. A 2 car garage makes for a tight fit, but I had my Tundra in there and a boat before that. Just need to get a couple of new tools and clean up the bench. F5 says my 289 kit will be completed 11/8. Still gotta build the chassis dolly and body buck.

[gbranham]

Buy a box of plastic gloves at Advance or AUtoZone. Rip off your mouse hand glove and grab that mouse. I spent 20+ yrs as a dealer tech using these.
https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/microflex-diamond-grip-powder-free-latex-gloves-mfxmf300xl/25981045-P?searchTerm=Gloves
But about 3-4 months ago bought a box of these
https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/autowurks-orange-heavy-duty-nitriledisposable-gloves-8-mil-latex-powder-free-large-100-count-g10100n/12522559-P?searchTerm=Gloves
They are very heavy and have a fine dimple pattern which makes working w/ slippery parts easier. There is always a pair sitting somewhere in the garage and I do 95% of my work w/ gloves on.

I've tried to use gloves, but I can't. I find that I can't feel what I'm working with. For me, it's just easier to scrub up with Fast Orange after working.

Greg

[JohnnyDeere]

Did anyone else deal with the crazy frustration of trying to find hardware? I am working on the foot box and it’s telling me to find hardware in boxes that don’t exist. Such as the secondary chassis box, which only has insulated clips and zip ties not the pan head bolts I need. I live an hour from the store so this is starting to bug me a bit. Currently looking for the 2 socket head 1/4 x 1.5 bolts which are supposed to be on the pedal box fastener assembly?

[edwardb]

Did anyone else deal with the crazy frustration of trying to find hardware? I am working on the foot box and it’s telling me to find hardware in boxes that don’t exist. Such as the secondary chassis box, which only has insulated clips and zip ties not the pan head bolts I need. I live an hour from the store so this is starting to bug me a bit. Currently looking for the 2 socket head 1/4 x 1.5 bolts which are supposed to be on the pedal box fastener assembly?

I'm about halfway through a Mk5 build. You should have received a box of hardware. They're all neatly bagged and tagged. There's a list in the build manual of everything that's supposed to be in the box. If you're doing IRS, there's a similar box of IRS hardware and a list in the manual for that too. I've found nearly everything was fine. There are a couple of exceptions but you should find what you need in those boxes. For the most part, not loose in the various larger kit boxes.

[JohnnyDeere]

Gents, I have been slowly plugging away. I have about five different projects going as I seem to be missing a key component to backorder on each step. I am enjoying myself and learning a lot as I go through the process. I was really struggling with the steering today mostly with fitment of the shafts. Finally got to the top one and it wouldn’t even go through the upper bearing so I gave my first call to ff tech support and Dave was great, he had me sand down the nickel finish and after a little elbow grease I got it in.

221119221118221117221120

[Autonut]

There is a lot of flash on horsepower. More & more + more is "better". Key to remember when you put your backside into the seat the whole package will most likely be under 2500lbs. Power to weight ratios are very interesting when you run the numbers.

Biggest issue with high power is applying that power to the ground.

Quoting Carroll Shelby: There is no such thing as too much horsepower, just not enough traction"

I tend to agree. YMMV.

[LSX]

Gents, I have been slowly plugging away. I have about five different projects going as I seem to be missing a key component to backorder on each step. I am enjoying myself and learning a lot as I go through the process. I was really struggling with the steering today mostly with fitment of the shafts. Finally got to the top one and it wouldn’t even go through the upper bearing so I gave my first call to ff tech support and Dave was great, he had me sand down the nickel finish and after a little elbow grease I got it in.

221119221118221117221120

Nice! Just came across your thread. Keep up the good work. Hope your stuff shows up soon.

[JohnnyDeere]

Quick question, I have not received any of the fuel system components due to back order, but as I was looking at my order I am trying to figure out if I goofed. I got the blue print 347 with EFI, I did not order the in tank EFI kit from Factory Five….just assumed whatever came with the complete kit would work. Am I correct in my concern that I need that add on? Or will the standard system work.

Thanks again Gents.

[TrackDay17]

Quick question, I have not received any of the fuel system components due to back order, but as I was looking at my order I am trying to figure out if I goofed. I got the blue print 347 with EFI, I did not order the in tank EFI kit from Factory Five….just assumed whatever came with the complete kit would work. Am I correct in my concern that I need that add on? Or will the standard system work.

Thanks again Gents.

If you ordered a 347 from Blueprint my understanding is it will come with an external fuel pump which I guess can be quite noisy.
At the build school the instructors said they would definitely run an in tank pump.
My Blueprint 347 will be delivered on Monday so I can confirm if the external fuel pump is shipped with it then.
I chose to go with a drop in pump setup from Aeromotive for the Fox body Mustang 340lph model and a fuel pressure regulator.
I don't have my fuel tank yet as that was one of my pol items.

[rich grsc]

Don't get why everyone thinks they need a 1000hp fuel pump? All it ends up doing is constantly recirculating fuel back into the tank, adding heat and aerating fuel.

[Jeff Kleiner]

Don't get why everyone thinks they need a 1000hp fuel pump? All it ends up doing is constantly recirculating fuel back into the tank, adding heat and aerating fuel.

C'mon Rich. You know that we all need to be running race car parts on our street cars ;)

Jeff

[JohnnyDeere]

C'mon Rich. You know that we all need to be running race car parts on our street cars ;)

Jeff

:cool: so from what I am gathering I will be fine with the external pump. I like additional noises tells me things are working…..

[Mike.Bray]

Intank is best, you just don't need that capacity pump. Call Forte, he will fix you up with a drop in pump that is sized correctly.

[PMD24]

Yes, the BP 347 comes with an external pump, 10 micron post filter, 20ft of 3/8 SS flex, and an assortment of fittings. Regarding the hose and fittings, you may want to consider buying a different brand. I needed a couple of different fittings and when I called Blueprint to find out the manufacturer, I was told they couldn't tell me because they buy in bulk and suppliers change based on price and availability. I wasn't comfortable buying other fittings since you aren't supposed to mix hose and fitting manufacturers. I had a few leak issues when testing. Problem seemed to be that a bit more thread was needed on hose nut. It bottomed out before getting adequate tightness on the ferrule. The fittings had no markings as to brand and were rebagged. I'm guessing they were a low cost overseas product.

I looked at Earls Speedflex. Crazy expensive. Then went to Hor Rod Fuel. Great prices and good reviews. Was ready to hit the order button, but they were out of the 3/8 SS hose. Ended up with Fragola.

[CraigS]

Don't get why everyone thinks they need a 1000hp fuel pump? All it ends up doing is constantly recirculating fuel back into the tank, adding heat and aerating fuel.
This is exactly why most oems went to a non recirc fuel system 15-20 years ago.

[Mike.Bray]

This is exactly why most oems went to a non recirc fuel system 15-20 years ago.

With PWM systems. You can do that aftermarket also, just $$$

I'll stick with my tried and true recirc system.

[TrackDay17]

Quick question, I have not received any of the fuel system components due to back order, but as I was looking at my order I am trying to figure out if I goofed. I got the blue print 347 with EFI, I did not order the in tank EFI kit from Factory Five….just assumed whatever came with the complete kit would work. Am I correct in my concern that I need that add on? Or will the standard system work.

Thanks again Gents.

I just got my Blueprint 347 today, I can confirm it comes with an external pump, a single use fuel filter, 20 feet of braided stainless steel ptfe line in 3/8ths and several hose end fittings and clamps to mount everything to the frame.
looks like everything you would need to make it run.
If you ordered a fuel injection kit from FF I'd use that in tank pump if it were me.
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I guess I'll see if I can get it together with no leaks when the time comes, if not I guess I'll do something different.

[JohnnyDeere]

I just got my Blueprint 347 today, I can confirm it comes with an external pump, a single use fuel filter, 20 feet of braided stainless steel ptfe line in 3/8ths and several hose end fittings and clamps to mount everything to the frame.
looks like everything you would need to make it run.
If you ordered a fuel injection kit from FF I'd use that in tank pump if it were me.
221677
I guess I'll see if I can get it together with no leaks when the time comes, if not I guess I'll do something different.

Let me know how it goes, so from what I am gathering you're going to try the external supplied pump?

How long did it take to get your engine from Blueprint? I was told 60 days by them, but that date has come and gone, I am in no rush but just curious.

[wheelindex]

I was missing a few nuts here and there. If the nuts and bolts are not in your "part box", check your hardware box as edwardb stated. Sometimes though its a quick trip to ACE Hardware instead of fretting about it.

[TrackDay17]

Let me know how it goes, so from what I am gathering you're going to try the external supplied pump?

How long did it take to get your engine from Blueprint? I was told 60 days by them, but that date has come and gone, I am in no rush but just curious.

I'm using an in tank Aeromotive pump.
As far as delivery from Blueprint goes I ordered it the third week of August at the build school and was told about 60 days at that time.
I had heard they usually take longer to deliver so I wasn't really worried about it.
I received my engine Monday, I could have had it delivered sooner but I was just leaving for a 5 day trip when they informed me it was ready.
I ordered mine with fuel injection and a mid shift option TKX and the taller .68 overdrive 5th gear.

[JohnnyDeere]

Just tinkering waiting for parts and I am confused about the drivers side foot box. I am not installing this right now but just looking at fitment and the right side of the box sheet metal coming into the center tunnel sticks out really weird. It came this way and I am not sure what to do, should I trim this piece flush or am I missing something.

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[gbranham]

That piece of aluminum is wonky, and many have this issue. Some cut it, and some force it into place. I forced mine into place, held it, drilled one rivet hole, and slammed in a cleco. That held it in place so I could wrestle the rest of the rivet holes. Or, just cut it.

Greg

[rich grsc]

Looks to me like they forgot to make a bend??

[JohnnyDeere]

Ok straight up, will the blue print external fuel pump work, will I run into any issues besides the extra noise? I don’t really want to spent extra money replacing it with an in tank system if it’s going to work perfectly fine. This is a BP 347.

Thanks guys, made great progress this week now that parts have started to arrive!

[cv2065]

Ok straight up, will the blue print external fuel pump work, will I run into any issues besides the extra noise? I don’t really want to spent extra money replacing it with an in tank system if it’s going to work perfectly fine. This is a BP 347.

Thanks guys, made great progress this week now that parts have started to arrive!

Sure it will work. But in tank pumps are more quiet and run cooler. Now’s the time to do it if you decide to do so.

[danmas]

Sure it will work. But in tank pumps are more quiet and run cooler. Now’s the time to do it if you decide to do so.

Agree with this. I was going external originally and trying to fit everything became a challenge. Spoke with a few folks (thanks Frank) and popped in the internal pump. Easier, quieter, and arguably substantially better. What’s not to like? I would make the change to internal.

[ProfessorB]

.
Just another option to consider if cost is a factor as it was for me:
.
I'm just a working class slob and drove a truck my whole life. I made a decent middle-class living at it but that's it (long hours, too). I have played with cars and motorcycles my whole life. With the exception of paint, I have done all my own work, including engine rebuilding. I have wanted to build my own Cobra for decades and planned on doing so when I retired. When I finally got around to building one I discovered I could not afford it. EVERYTHING costs more. Paint especially. I delayed my project to save some money but didn't feel this approach was getting any closer to my goal as the cost of life itself continued to rise. (It's called "inflation")
THIS WAS MY SOLUTION: I ended up buying a completed car. I looked at lots of 'em before pulling the trigger. Finally I found one that I just could NOT walk away from. It's a Mark II, but VERY low miles. It's a very high-quality build. Not high-tech, it's carbureted (which I prefer). BEAUTIFUL paint. Beautiful interior. Low-mileage 427 Windsor. Power steering. Power brakes. Paint-matched APE top. The only thing it's missing (on my ideal wish list) is IRS. Price? 45K. I'd be lucky to build this car for 70K.
THE DOWNSIDE: There are several downsides. First, since I did not build it, I do not know it intimately. I AM getting to know it as I work on it. Secondly, I do not have that feeling of accomplishment that I felt after building other cars that I HAD built. When someone at the gas station asks about it, I tell them I didn't build it....I do wish I could say I had. Thirdly, I missed out on the JOY of building my own. Some of my best memories in lmy life are shop memories....the coffee pot, the good background music, the solitude, the satisfaction of surmounting a problem. I missed out on all that and that's the best part. I just couldn't afford to do it.
It's not ALL bad. As I have owned this over time, I have steadily worked on the car.... fixing things that crop up, changing things I didn't like, upgrading front end and suspension (so necessary on the Mark II) making it my own. The more I work on it the more I enjoy it. I can never say "I built this" as so many of you can with pride. To you guys, I salute you and,,,yes...envy you. But if I waited until I could afford to build one I would still be waiting. That's just the way it is.
I have been offered 65K for this car. I actually thought about selling it to build my own....for the JOY of it. But I doubt I could build anything close to this car for that price, especially with a 427W. So I'm keeping it and someday I'll have that IRS as well. :)

[JohnnyDeere]

I really am enjoying this build so far, I get frustrated when a spacer is to large or a bolt hole is to small and realize that’s what keeps this build exciting and it’s not just a simple bolt together project.

I have ordered an in tank fuel pump from breeze, is there anything else I should get for the fuel system besides what comes with the ff complete kit? I see guys talking about fuel filters and regulators and am wondering at what point does what I already have work.

Thanks.

[JohnnyDeere]

Ok, these set screws are kicking my ***. I have just stripped another one this time on the Steering shaft flange bearing. There are two set screws there and I forgot to put Loctite on them, so I pulled them out and had a chat with myself about not stripping them and the first one bam stripped. I can't find a replacement flange bearing and not sure what to do. The good thing is these two set screws seem to keep any steering shaft movement happening within the bearing and that's it; would it be ok with just one set screw?

[edwardb]

Ok, these set screws are kicking my ***. I have just stripped another one this time on the Steering shaft flange bearing. There are two set screws there and I forgot to put Loctite on them, so I pulled them out and had a chat with myself about not stripping them and the first one bam stripped. I can't find a replacement flange bearing and not sure what to do. The good thing is these two set screws seem to keep any steering shaft movement happening within the bearing and that's it; would it be ok with just one set screw?

Steering is right up there with brakes as the most important safety aspect of your build. I personally wouldn't be happy with anything not exactly as designed for the steering. Including every set screw. Certainly not going to get me to say it's OK to not have all of them. I have to ask, how much are you tightening down on those? I just finalized all the steering parts on my Mk5 build last night. I got them good and tight (with blue Loctite) and no hint of any stripping. Are you positive the threads are stripping? If you you use the wrong size Allen wrench you can strip either the set screw or the key. Been there done both. Especially on smaller sizes. If they really are stripping, can you tell which part is failing? The set screw or the bushing? If the bushing and you can't find replacements, it wouldn't be that hard to drill and tap new holes.

[JohnnyDeere]

Steering is right up there with brakes as the most important safety aspect of your build. I personally wouldn't be happy with anything not exactly as designed for the steering. Including every set screw. Certainly not going to get me to say it's OK to not have all of them. I have to ask, how much are you tightening down on those? I just finalized all the steering parts on my Mk5 build last night. I got them good and tight (with blue Loctite) and no hint of any stripping. Are you positive the threads are stripping? If you you use the wrong size Allen wrench you can strip either the set screw or the key. Been there done both. Especially on smaller sizes. If they really are stripping, can you tell which part is failing? The set screw or the bushing? If the bushing and you can't find replacements, it wouldn't be that hard to drill and tap new holes.

Yah I figured that was the right answer. The threads on the female end are stripped happened on the accelerator pedal as well, I will look at buying a kit to see about re drilling those threads I guess..hate to have to pull everything apart, but your right.

[LSX]

Ok, these set screws are kicking my ***. I have just stripped another one this time on the Steering shaft flange bearing. There are two set screws there and I forgot to put Loctite on them, so I pulled them out and had a chat with myself about not stripping them and the first one bam stripped. I can't find a replacement flange bearing and not sure what to do. The good thing is these two set screws seem to keep any steering shaft movement happening within the bearing and that's it; would it be ok with just one set screw?

I ordered a new flange bearing on amazon. Way faster than trying to get a new one from FFR fyi.

As for the panels, mine was the same way in that corner. If you push the bottom of the box in to hug the steering and pedal box frame it matches up, but then you will have to do the drill and cleco trick to get it to hold and rivet one at a time. Its a pain but probably the only way of making it fit without cutting.

[JohnnyDeere]

I ordered a new flange bearing on amazon. Way faster than trying to get a new one from FFR fyi.

As for the panels, mine was the same way in that corner. If you push the bottom of the box in to hug the steering and pedal box frame it matches up, but then you will have to do the drill and cleco trick to get it to hold and rivet one at a time. Its a pain but probably the only way of making it fit without cutting.

Thanks man you are a lifesaver!, you mind sending me a link to that bearing?

[rich grsc]

Two things, why are you tightening a setscrew so much that it stripped, and why are you putting loc-tite on a setscrew? In over 60 years of wrenching on equipment, cars, trucks, even motorcycles I've never had to tighten one till it stripped the threads, they are small, no need to go crazy on them.:rolleyes:

[LSX]

Thanks man you are a lifesaver!, you mind sending me a link to that bearing?

Here you go bud!

https://a.co/d/c05rcAM

[JohnnyDeere]

Two things, why are you tightening a setscrew so much that it stripped, and why are you putting loc-tite on a setscrew? In over 60 years of wrenching on equipment, cars, trucks, even motorcycles I've never had to tighten one till it stripped the threads, they are small, no need to go crazy on them.:rolleyes:

Well I obviously know now that it was too tight, and in terms of the Loctite I was just following the directions in the manual….as a recently retired army aviator I broke more things in my career then I care to admit and had the best teams to fix my screw ups……now it’s just me and the internet….ahhh.

[JohnnyDeere]

I feel like a broken record but I don’t know what the hell is going on with these companies! I called BP this summer to figure out timelines for an engine and they said 6 weeks, so I ordered it in October. I gave them a call December 5th to get an update they told me it should be done in a week, fast forward to today almost another 6 weeks after months of waiting and they said that do to back ordered parts it’s still being built. Wtf!

[RobHartley]

I had Mike Forte build my engine (great guy), it started as a BP 347, added his front dress, Edelbrock ProFlo 4 and he put a TKX on it. I ordered it at the top of November and it arrived (here in Vancouver BC Canada) mid December. I am only picking up my kit tomorrow in Blaine WA

[TrackDay17]

Bummer on the engine not being ready. Like I mentioned earlier I ordered mine from Blueprint at the build school in August and received it in the middle of November.
I had heard they can be tardy on their delivery times so I figured I'd jump on ordering early, I was honestly surprised when I got the email it was done and ready to ship.
I'm guessing they are at the mercy of their parts suppliers sometimes like every one else.

Are you to the point you need your engine to install yet ?
Hopefully you'll get it soon.

[JohnnyDeere]

Bummer on the engine not being ready. Like I mentioned earlier I ordered mine from Blueprint at the build school in August and received it in the middle of November.
I had heard they can be tardy on their delivery times so I figured I'd jump on ordering early, I was honestly surprised when I got the email it was done and ready to ship.
I'm guessing they are at the mercy of their parts suppliers sometimes like every one else.

Are you to the point you need your engine to install yet ?
Hopefully you'll get it soon.

Yah I don’t have a problem with supply issues and long lead times as long as companies are honest about it, I would have just ordered it sooner. I am not ready to install the engine yet but I am ready for the accessories like fuel flow regulator etc etc and also as I start installing lines getting an idea where things are connecting etc.

[Cobraman]

It took 4 months for my builder to get all the parts for my engine not my builders fault I ordered a custom ground camshaft that really took 2 months to get then a couple days of assembly to get it all ready for me to pick it up. But oh so worthwhile.

[PMD24]

I feel like a broken record but I don’t know what the hell is going on with these companies! I called BP this summer to figure out timelines for an engine and they said 6 weeks, so I ordered it in October. I gave them a call December 5th to get an update they told me it should be done in a week, fast forward to today almost another 6 weeks after months of waiting and they said that do to back ordered parts it’s still being built. Wtf!

Sorry to hear this Johnny. That's what they did to me, repeatedly. 6 weeks turned out to be 7 months. I didn't need the engine, but they never communicated a single time on missed commitments. Not once. I followed up on THEIR dates every time. And when I finally pointed out that I was tired of following up on their dates, they were very apologetic about the delays and completely missed the point about simply proactively communicating that they were not able to meet their commitments. The engine looks great, documentation is great, questions response has been great, and I assume it will start and run great... but I won't buy from them again. It's too bad, because it's so easy to simply keep your customers informed.

Pat

[JohnnyDeere]

Gents, I have arrived at my most dreaded part of this project being wiring. Just unpacked everything and marked my harness hole locations in the dash aluminum. My question is, I am running an EFI setup with the sniper 2 on the 347BP which I still have not received and they won't call me back. Is the EFI harness part of the FF supplied harness or will this come with the engine? or was it something that I should have ordered separately. I am super ignorant to this part of the project so I could just be overlooking it somewhere in these boxes.

Thanks again.

[PMD24]

EFI harness comes with the engine. Instructions for the EFI tie-in will be included.

First step on the electrical is to lay out your harness sections on the floor and match up every connector. Then check every wire coming and going from each side for color match. Ron Francis has QC issues and a history of wires being crossed. Mine had the issue. Just recently read about one being discovered.

Next step is to think through anything you need to add or change. For example, the RF harness has no provisions for reverse lights, or a trunk light, or seat heaters, or USB ports, or neutral switch, etc. The Sniper2 has its own relay and wiring to go to the fuel pump, so you will need to decide on how you want to tie that in (run their wire or use wire from RF harness). Likewise for radiator fan control.

Many posts here on what people have done with their wiring. I'm detailing mine in my thread as well. Read up on wiring here and sort through it circuit by circuit. You'll find that it's not too bad. And when you get stuck there's plenty of help here.

Pat

[Mike.Bray]

Time to order a bottle of this.

224945

[rich grsc]

Mike, mine was empty when I opened it. :rolleyes: Should I have gotten the 'negative' earth instead??

[JohnnyDeere]

EFI harness comes with the engine. Instructions for the EFI tie-in will be included.

First step on the electrical is to lay out your harness sections on the floor and match up every connector. Then check every wire coming and going from each side for color match. Ron Francis has QC issues and a history of wires being crossed. Mine had the issue. Just recently read about one being discovered.

Next step is to think through anything you need to add or change. For example, the RF harness has no provisions for reverse lights, or a trunk light, or seat heaters, or USB ports, or neutral switch, etc. The Sniper2 has its own relay and wiring to go to the fuel pump, so you will need to decide on how you want to tie that in (run their wire or use wire from RF harness). Likewise for radiator fan control.

Many posts here on what people have done with their wiring. I'm detailing mine in my thread as well. Read up on wiring here and sort through it circuit by circuit. You'll find that it's not too bad. And when you get stuck there's plenty of help here.

Pat

Thanks Pat! Started the process today no crazy surprises yet but we shall see.

[JohnnyDeere]

Gents, got the engine in the car yesterday, went pretty smooth overall especially considering I did it by myself. Only a few oh **** moments but nothing got hurt car or human!

226963226964

[Mike.Bray]

Gents, got the engine in the car yesterday

226963

You'll find it goes easier with the car horizontal rather than on its side:rolleyes:

[JohnnyDeere]

You'll find it goes easier with the car horizontal rather than on its side:rolleyes:

lol…….wtf I even rotated the pictures this time and it’s still sideways…

[CW_MI]

lol…….wtf I even rotated the pictures this time and it’s still sideways…

What works for me is to just rotate, then resize them, just slightly and they should upload in the correct orientation.

[CW_MI]

Gents, I have arrived at my most dreaded part of this project being wiring. Just unpacked everything and marked my harness hole locations in the dash aluminum. My question is, I am running an EFI setup with the sniper 2 on the 347BP which I still have not received and they won't call me back. Is the EFI harness part of the FF supplied harness or will this come with the engine? or was it something that I should have ordered separately. I am super ignorant to this part of the project so I could just be overlooking it somewhere in these boxes.

Thanks again.

You've got a harness ??? Lol.
My dreaded part of the build, so I thought, was going to be running brake lines. So far, it's been kind of fun. I'm looking forward to the harness install, it should be fun. Mine is a pretty basic install though, no heat or air. Just EFI, and I want to add seat heaters, ambient lighting in the footboxes, back up lights, and a trunk light.

[JohnnyDeere]

You've got a harness ??? Lol.
My dreaded part of the build, so I thought, was going to be running brake lines. So far, it's been kind of fun. I'm looking forward to the harness install, it should be fun. Mine is a pretty basic install though, no heat or air. Just EFI, and I want to add seat heaters, ambient lighting in the footboxes, back up lights, and a trunk light.

Actually, putting in the harness was fairly easy and straight forward, after that depending on what you are installing in the car the directions get vague on what's next which is understandable with the many variations of car build but that is my struggle now.

The only things still on backorder is my rollbars and wheels and tires.....would like to get the wheels at some point soon so I can start figuring out alignment and ride height.

[Pete&Scott]

You'll find it goes easier with the car horizontal rather than on its side:rolleyes:

The picture looks fine on my laptop!!!
226984

[JohnnyDeere]

The picture looks fine on my laptop!!!
226984

You guys are to much….maybe I will post them upside down next time and see what kind of great advice I get!:D

[PMD24]

Open your pics in whatever software your computer uses. Find "resize" and change the largest pixel dimension to a number below 2000, like 1900. Save it and use that. It will orient properly. .