Sniper Grounding... The solution!

[AA-ron]

Hello everyone,
First thanks for all the advice on my original "sniper grounding" post. I figured I'd start a new post with the solution.
I took yesterday and today off to install the Hyperspark system to my existing Holley Sniper, to solve my surging and erratic idle (it was pretty bad and had gotten worse). I installed Holley's distributor, hyperspark coil, and their ignition box. After learning that I needed to switch to a steel distributor gear from the cast unit supplied in the kit (thanks forum!! Saved me big on that one) I swapped gears. Not easy by the way--ended up using it as an excuse to buy a press.
In total it took about 6 hours to make the change, not including the distributor gear swap-- which alone took 3 hours.
I finished the installation this morning and nervously started it up for the first time. I just touched the key and it fired right up and idled better than it ever has! I let it get up to temp, adjusted the IAC and took it for a spin. Holy @#$% it runs nicely! It returns to idle after acceleration in the smoothest way, then holds idle without any surging! Warm and hot starts work perfectly with no difference, it jumps right to a stable idle every time. I have the idle set at 800 and it stays at 800.
I couldn't be happier right now! I put on about 100 miles this morning and all is perfect.
I may never really know what was causing all of my problems before the Hyperspark system, but installing it certainly fixed it. And as you know, it's not a cheap fix-- with the steel gear addition, it totaled about $1000. But right now, its the best $1000 I've ever spent as I've been struggling with this for almost a year now.
I'm still keeping my appointment with a professional tuner next week. I figured it can't hurt to have someone who REALLY knows Snipers to put the final touches on the tune.
I'd keep typing, but I'm hitting the road and taking advantage of this nice warm spring Maine day.

[bobl]

Awesome! Glad you got it sorted out.

[J R Jones]

Ron,
I went back through this thread to see how you acquired the problem. It appears to have been from new, with a Ford crate motor from Forte.
Did the problematic distributor come with the engine from Ford/Forte? Is it an OEM Ford distributor?
Did you add the Sniper that needed the Hyperspark to go with it?
Most surprising is that you spoke to Holley and they did not see the problem. WT?
jim

[Ashaw65]

Congratulations. That for sharing the solution.

[Knochen]

Do you think there is a way short of your $1000 cost to make the Sniper to run smoother? I keep thinking it's a problem with the injectors. I've replaced the inside filter with an external aeromotive fuel pressure regulator/filter, run a 14 AWG ground wire (as per Holley's instruction) from the base of the back of the throttle body to the transmission and it does run smoother, but at acceleration it acts like it wants to activate the secondaries, hesitates, then activates. This is on a GM 355 engine with HEI. I've read about shielding the distributor - how does one go about doing that?

[weendoggy]

...but at acceleration it acts like it wants to activate the secondaries, hesitates, then activates. This is on a GM 355 engine with HEI. I've read about shielding the distributor - how does one go about doing that?

That sounds more like a AE vs TPS ROC or AE Correction vs TPS or a combination of both. Have you taken a datalog and looked what was happening during that period? It should give you some good insight.

[Knochen]

Thanks for the tip, I'll try that. I downloaded the Sniper app of some sort, so I assume it will read the memory card from the monitor. I've never used it because I don't know if I will know what to do with it, or how to navigate into something useful. Blueprint Engines has already sent me a different Sniper unit to replace the one that came with the crate engine and together with the Aeromotive external regulator and filter, it did some better, but the hesitation still persists. This has been an ongoing problem with the Sniper now for at least 9 months trying different things. I'll give the app a go.

[weendoggy]

Thanks for the tip, I'll try that. I downloaded the Sniper app of some sort, so I assume it will read the memory card from the monitor. I've never used it because I don't know if I will know what to do with it, or how to navigate into something useful. Blueprint Engines has already sent me a different Sniper unit to replace the one that came with the crate engine and together with the Aeromotive external regulator and filter, it did some better, but the hesitation still persists. This has been an ongoing problem with the Sniper now for at least 9 months trying different things. I'll give the app a go.

You need to connect a laptop and use the software to fine tune the setup. The 3.5LCD screen can't accomplish that. You have two ways to do it: 1) use your SD card with tune, take to computer, make changes, try; or; much better way, 2)connect laptop to the system and make changes 'live' and test. This can be done on the fly. If you feel this is too much, reach out to someone who knows Holley EFI. Their systems say "self tuning" but in reality they don't tune it all.

[john42]

Holley’s “self” in self tuning is “yourself”. :-)

[John Ibele]

AA-ron got his problem solved in April, but since this thread was dug up again I have to correct the record on one item related to distributor gears that's been kicking around for a long time. I'm going to leave it buried in this thread rather than start a new one, because there's no need to create a firestorm on the forum.

There are plenty of posts on this forum and elsewhere about having to swap out the 'cast iron' gear on the Holley distributor. I had that gear shipped on my distributor as well as everyone else did, and it didn't seem right to me that Holley would put a gear on which shouldn't have been used by virtually their entire customer base for the product. So I started asking questions.

I started with my engine builder, who has a sterling reputation locally in both the cruising / rodding and racing communities. He said I would not have a problem using the stock gear with the camshaft he had selected. I called the camshaft manufacturer and got the same answer.

I continued by reading every online article I could find. Confusing, contradictory, filled with cautious knowledgeable folks using dry language drowned about by absolutely certain blowhards ... the usual romp through the internet :p. Holley was sloppy in their use of language calling it a 'cast iron' gear. Even experienced folks like Jeff Smith couldn't get the language completely right, and he cancelled out his almost perfect clarity in one article with one unfortunately misleading table (which got copied and reused by folks at Summit and elsewhere...).

I read up on the metallurgy involved, and dug through the fine print in Holley's materials. And finally things started to become clear. And my conclusion was ...

When people use the term 'cast iron', that used to be unambiguous: it was gray iron, or gray cast iron. It's strong suit was strength, but that didn't extend to toughness, and so it's something you really don't want your distributor gear made of today. It'll get chewed up and spit out by your camshaft. But that's not what Holley ships as their stock gear.

Holley's stock gear is austempered ductile iron, which happens to be cast, then tempered with a controlled cooling in a salt bath. It has toughness and durability (wear resistance) in its favor, and it's a common choice for gears and other wear items. And it's a perfect material match for my austempered ductile iron cam, which many others also have in their cars. If your camshaft is another material, say steel, then you need a different gear (unless your ductile iron gear is melonized, which means surface hardened and therefore compatible with some steel camshafts, but I'll walk by that rabbit hole for this post...). Again, Holley used sloppy language by calling it 'cast iron'. It happens to be cast, and their fine print on the gear clearly states it is ductile iron.

There's a good explanation of the processing and material differences between the iron types in this link (https://www.urick.net/blog/ductile-iron-vs-cast-iron-whats-the-difference).

I'm glad AA-ron solved his drivability issues! And got to call something related to the Sniper 'perfect' :rolleyes:. But, felt I had to chime in with what I found regarding the much maligned Holley 'cast iron' gear. Only 2000 miles in so far, but no indication that my gear has any sort of problem, and I'm completely comfortable that I've got the right match of components for my car. Based on my own reading, but mostly based on multiple experienced folks giving me the same answer. For any forum users with this choice ahead of them, not knowing anything about your crankshaft material, you may indeed need to do a gear swap. But based on my research, many who've made the swap didn't need to.

[John Ibele]

Holley’s “self” in self tuning is “yourself”. :-)

Now that's more like it! If only more folks understood that. It does one thing: adjust the fuel table. You do everything else. I've had fun - laptop, CAN bus, data logs, overlays - probably just a way to have fun with the car now that the building part is done. But for those who don't think that's fun and just want to drive, pay for a professional tune. You'll get a better answer, and much, much faster.