Sniper Grounding

[AA-ron]

I'm looking for some advice about grounding my Sniper. I finished my build last summer and I'm really struggling with surging and inconsistent idle and a bit of bumpy performance below 1500 rpm.
I have a Ford Racing crate motor and I've gone through all the tuning exercises I know of to tune it out. I just spent some time on the phone with Holley and they are now fairly certain that I've got a grounding issue with my Sniper.
My battery is in the trunk and I ran a separate 10 gauge ground and power cable to the front specifically for the Sniper. However according to Holley, they said that I will likely need to run a seperate battery ground cable (2 gauge--same size as the primary power cable) to the front and ground to the engine grounding point-- basically, not relying on the chassis as the primary ground. Additionally they are recommending I ground the Sniper throttle body frame directly to the engine grounding point. Lastly, they suggest moving my coil off the top of the engine to the firewall (coil sits near the sniper on the sbf 302).
My question is this: as my setup is a fairly common one (Ford Racing 302 crate w/sniper), have any of you experienced the same type of issues and did you end up going to such extremes from a grounding standpoint to fix the problem? Lastly, moving the coil feels like a real pain!!
The idle problems have progressively gotten worse over the past 1000 miles or so (total of about 3500k on the car) and Holley said they see this often where it's good in the beginning and then gets worse.
Just looking for some thoughts here.
Thanks

[weendoggy]

Sniper is well known for RFI interference. That being said, try to keep as many or all of the Sniper wiring away from coil, alternator, etc. Gounding is good, but that may be over excessive. You have one dedicated Sniper to the battery, run another 2ga or 4ga from the battery to frame as well as one from engine to frame (if that hasn't been done yet). Have you tried running the Sniper in open loop at idle? That will tell you if it's too rich/lean. Also, what does your learn table look like? Is the Sniper controlling spark? What distributor? There are lots of things to look at.

[Norm B]

In addition to moving the coil and coil driver I had to shield the distributor to get the Sniper to work properly.

[CraigS]

I agree that running a new ground same size as a battery cable is crazy. But O would recommend that adding grounds as weendoggy says is a good idea. Also double check all your existing grounds. Start at the neg battery terminal and clean the inside of the terminal as well as the battery post. Where your battery - cable attaches to the frame remove it and clean the end. Wire brush the frame spot so there is nothing but bare metal for the cable to contact. After you bolt it back up w/ a new bolt slather some bearing grease all over or get a spray bottle of battery terminal protector. Any and all additional grounds need the same care. I am not specifically familiar w/ the Sniper but 25 yrs as a Lexus tech I know that a lot of efi sensors run on 5V not on 12V as you might expect. And 5V has no extra power to burn through the smallest bit of corrosion. Something like an air flow meter may output 0V as no flow and 5V as full flow. If there is a bit of resistance in the wiring and it loses .3V then the air flow signal to the ecu is going to be lower than the actual flow across the entire range.

[Norm B]

Disclaimer: My battery is front mounted in my rendition of the Breeze battery box.
My Sniper is wired directly to the battery for both the positive and negative connection. I used the same gauge of wire as the Sniper harness has. Didn’t see the point of running a very heavy gauge wire to connect to a lighter wire in the harness. The positive feed is energized through a relay to isolate it from the ignition switch and any electrical noise associated with it.
The coil is on the driver’s side F panel. This avoids running the coil wires anywhere near the Sniper. The Sniper ECU is poorly shielded and located on the front of the unit, very close to the Ford front mount distributor. I had to shield the distributor to prevent the unit from shutting down and rebooting while I was driving. This is with a Holley hyperspark distributor. A little frustrating when supposedly compatible components from the same company don’t work well together!
That said, once I got everything moved and shielded, the car runs flawlessly.

Hope this helps!
Norm

[Blitzboy54]

Sounds more like the IAC than a bad ground

[i.e.427]

Your "Cobra" air Cleaner housing is over-hanging the distributor cap and causing RFI interference with the ECU which is located inside the throttle body. Either change out the oval air cleaner assembly or find a way to shield the bottom of the air cleaner base. Talk to Mark & Brendan Dougherty. Mark was the first person I know to find the problem and fabricate a solution. We did the same thing when installing our first Sniper and FiTech EFI systems. #10 wires (same size as Holley includes) is enough to run to the back and connect directly to the battery.

Also, Holley instructions are clear: "Power and grounds must be run directly to the battery". If you failed to run a dedicated ground to the battery, just start running one now.

Frank

[john42]

Your "Cobra" air Cleaner housing is over-hanging the distributor cap and causing RFI interference with the ECU which is located inside the throttle body. Either change out the oval air cleaner assembly or find a way to shield the bottom of the air cleaner base. Talk to Mark & Brendan Dougherty. Mark was the first person I know to find the problem and fabricate a solution. We did the same thing when installing our first Sniper and FiTech EFI systems. #10 wires (same size as Holley includes) is enough to run to the back and connect directly to the battery.

Also, Holley instructions are clear: "Power and grounds must be run directly to the battery". If you failed to run a dedicated ground to the battery, just start running one now.

Frank

Mark and Brendan did mine and had me layer the bottom of the oval air cleaner with copper foil tape. Basically make a faraday cage out of it. I'm not 100% convinced my issues have stopped either. I am still having return to idle issue. I have a small round air cleaner that I'm about to swap in and see if my issues go away. Then at least I know.

[Blitzboy54]

I have been struggling with this for years now. The closest I came to solving it was a firmware update. I went 1300 miles without an issue than it came back. I currently have the idle spark off (per their recommendation) and have not had it happen since but I only drove it a little bit. Weather hasn't been very good.

[AA-ron]

Thanks for all the advice! It's nice to know others have struggled with this.
One thing I left out is that when I do a "warm start", in other words, after the car has been driven and then allowed to sit for 30 minutes or so, the idle surges BADLY and almost stalls. If I feather the gas pedal I can smooth it out, but it will do this until I drive it or let it run for about 30 seconds.

Here's what I've done so far since my post yesterday.
I grounded the Sniper throttle body directly to the engine grounding point on the chassis (per Holley's request).
I removed all the ground connections and cleaned reinstalled them.
Verified that the power and ground runs back to the trunk mounted battery are tightly connected at both ends (and cleaned mounting points).
I have NOT moved the coil yet.

After doing this, I've found that the idle is a bit smoother and there seems to be less surging. I haven't been able to drive it as it's been raining-- which is all it ever seems to do here in Maine these past few years.

But I've noticed something else and I'm wondering if this might be part of the problem. When my car is at idle i'm only seeing 12.7 volts, which causes the voltage alert on the sniper screen to highlight yellow. As soon as I touch the gas pedal to raise the RPM just a bit, the voltage jumps to mid 13's--low 14's. I have my idle set at 850.
Could low voltage at idle be part of my problem?

[Norm B]

Don’t think 12.7 volts will cause a problem. We might be blaming the Sniper for another issue. Have you thoroughly checked for a vacuum or exhaust leak. What does the IAC reading do while the engine is surging?
You may also have a bad or sticky IAC.

[burchfieldb]

I had similar issues with my MSD Atomic 2. If I place a piece of plastic for the air cleaner bottom and take out the screw, there are no issues. The long metal screw sticking out of the throttle body also acts as an antenna, so if you can thread a small stud into the throttle body, then thread a plastic rod onto that, and then use a short screw to thread through the cap into the rod, that should help. You could do the screw mod and turn your air cleaner 90 degress to try to narrow it down. If you can recreate it at idle, remove the air cleaner and screw, and see if it stops. I was able to do that on mine to pin point the problem. I spent over an hour on tech support to figure it out, grounding distributor, foil hat over the distributor, and none of those helped. Ended up being the air cleaner. I am likley going to mold an offset drop base oval air cleaner bottom out of urethane plastic to solve this issue and to get more hood clearance. If there is enough interest, I could see about creating a kit to sell.

[zanman]

Norm - how did you shield your distributor? I still have a similar situation where my efi, and subsequently the entire engine just 100% shuts off at a specific place I drive it through on my driveway. It’s very strange. Spoke to Forte this week and he suggested I check my grounds. But I think trying the shielding would be another step in troubleshooting here.

Mike suggested I go from battery ground terminal to engine block and then from engine block to chassis ground bolt. I am currently setup in reverse of this right now. I think I’m also gonna just run my sniper ground directly to battery ground terminal. I currently have it on the chassis ground bolt. Hoping that also helps.

[Norm B]

Try wrapping the distributor with aluminum foil to se if that helps. If it does then make a permanent shield out of light aluminum sheeting. I covered that with a Cobra distributor cover I got off eBay.

Norm

[Alan_C]

I'm looking for some advice about grounding my Sniper. I finished my build last summer and I'm really struggling with surging and inconsistent idle and a bit of bumpy performance below 1500 rpm.
I have a Ford Racing crate motor and I've gone through all the tuning exercises I know of to tune it out. I just spent some time on the phone with Holley and they are now fairly certain that I've got a grounding issue with my Sniper.
My battery is in the trunk and I ran a separate 10 gauge ground and power cable to the front specifically for the Sniper. However according to Holley, they said that I will likely need to run a seperate battery ground cable (2 gauge--same size as the primary power cable) to the front and ground to the engine grounding point-- basically, not relying on the chassis as the primary ground. Additionally they are recommending I ground the Sniper throttle body frame directly to the engine grounding point. Lastly, they suggest moving my coil off the top of the engine to the firewall (coil sits near the sniper on the sbf 302).
My question is this: as my setup is a fairly common one (Ford Racing 302 crate w/sniper), have any of you experienced the same type of issues and did you end up going to such extremes from a grounding standpoint to fix the problem? Lastly, moving the coil feels like a real pain!!
The idle problems have progressively gotten worse over the past 1000 miles or so (total of about 3500k on the car) and Holley said they see this often where it's good in the beginning and then gets worse.
Just looking for some thoughts here.
Thanks
As much as you may not want to make the changes suggested, resistance is futile. Just do it and bury the gremlins for once and for all. There is a Sniper forum, join, read and you will see that you are not alone as Holley tech support has already told you.
Using the frame as a ground is not the problem, it is the connections from the battery to and from the engine to the frame that are the issues. I am a retired electrical engineer with 2 degree in EE and there is no shortcut to good grounding.
First, the cable from the battery to the frame must be the same size or larger than the positive battery cable. The same goes for the cable from the frame to the engine block. The return path is MORE important that the positive side. Make these 2 changes first and see what happens. It goes without saying that the connection points on the frame must be clean, without paint and rust free. Running a number of smaller ground wires results in what are termed ground loops. Ground loops are simply the return currents searching for the best way back to the battery negative post. This is why you must have a SINGLE point ground to your frame at both ends of the ground path. Do anything else and success is much less likely.
With your ground path fixed, if you are still having issues, as said in other posts, you have a radio frequency interference issue. One way to deal with an RFI issue is to shield all the wiring going into/out of the ECU. Use some good wire braid and sleeve those wires. Ground at only one end as that is all that is needed. Grounding the shield at both ends is problematic as you can, again, introduce a ground loop with signals (NOISE) now flowing through the shield. If this is not enough, then the RFI source is too close to the ECU and the shield cannot reject a sufficient amount of the noise. As Holley suggested, you will then need to increase the distance from the source, as in the coil, to the ECU. You then work through all the possible sources one by one until you have a sufficient solution as it is impossible to eliminate all the noise.
Good luck, but do not resist making changes because they are a pain, as your problems, to some degree, will continue until you do. I worked Satellite programs for Boeing in their test and engineering department. It was our job to test all the satellite systems to guarantee all was working before launch. You don't get those failed satellites back to fix'em once launched, so we had to get it right before they left the factory. As part of my test equipment design efforts, I made cables for our test systems and they had to be flight "like" as in working exactly as the cabling would perform inside the satellite. I learned a lot about grounding and the single ended ground shield was probably the most significant. We used a lot of shielded twisted pair wire. Both the shield and the twisting of the wire pair would both contribute to noise rejection. So the best solution for a sensitive wire bundle is to twist the individual wire pairs, signal and return, and then put a shield around the entire bundle. Nothing else works as well, period, other than distance, which is not an option within the satellite and at times under the hood.

[Nigel Allen]

X2 on Alan C's recommendations. Also consider some ferrite rings around cables if RFI is an issue.

[burchfieldb]

As much as you may not want to make the changes suggested, resistance is futile. Just do it and bury the gremlins for once and for all. There is a Sniper forum, join, read and you will see that you are not alone as Holley tech support has already told you.
Using the frame as a ground is not the problem, it is the connections from the battery to and from the engine to the frame that are the issues. I am a retired electrical engineer with 2 degree in EE and there is no short cut to good grounding.
First, the cable from the battery to the frame must be the same size or larger than the positive battery cable. The same goes for the cable from the frame to the engine block. The return path is MORE important that the positive side. Make these 2 changes first and see what happens. It goes without saying that the connection points on the frame must be clean, without paint and rust free. Running a number of smaller ground wires results in what are termed ground loops. Ground loops are simply the return currents searching for the best way back to the battery negative post. This is why you must have a SINGLE point ground to your frame at both ends of the ground path. Do anything else and success is much less likely.
With your ground path fixed, if you are still having issues, as said in other posts, you have a radio frequency interference issue. One way to deal with an RFI issue is to shield all the wiring going into/out of the ECU. Use some good wire braid and sleeve those wires. Ground at only one end as that is all that is needed. Grounding the shield at both ends is problematic as you can, again, introduce a ground loop with signals (NOISE) now flowing through the shield. If this is not enough, then the RFI source is too close to the ECU and the shield cannot reject a sufficient amount of the noise. As Holley suggested, you will then need to increase the distance from the source, as in the coil, to the ECU. You then work through all the possible sources one by one until you have a sufficient solution as it is impossible to eliminate all the noise.
Good luck, but do not resist making changes because they are a pain, as your problems, to some degree, will continue until you do. I worked Satellite programs for Boeing in their test and engineering department. It was our job to test all the satellite systems to guarantee all was working before launch. You don't get those failed satellites back to fix'em once launched, so we had to get it right before they left the factory. As part of my test equipment design efforts, I made cables for our test systems and they had to be flight "like" as in working exactly as the cabling would perform inside the satellite. I learned a lot about grounding and the single ended ground shield was probably the most significant. We used a lot of shielded twisted pair wire. Both the shield and the twisting of the wire pair would both contribute to noise rejection. So the best solution for a sensitive wire bundle is to twist the individual wire pairs, signal and return, and then put a shield around the entire bundle. Nothing else works as well, period, other than distance, which is not an option within the satellite and at times under the hood.

What are your thoughts on using this stuff for shielding?
https://www.wirecare.com/category/braided-sleeving/metal-shielding-sleeving/flexo-anti-stat/cnn0-50bk-flexo-anti-stat-1-2-black-10-ft-cuts

Brent

[john42]

Try wrapping the distributor with aluminum foil to se if that helps. If it does then make a permanent shield out of light aluminum sheeting. I covered that with a Cobra distributor cover I got off eBay.

Norm

I used Copper foil tape on the inside of my water shroud for the distributor and also covering the bottom on the air cleaner.

Nice Alan_C !! I see we both are doing similar things. You likely have some of the stuff my group makes at MIT/LL.

[AA-ron]

I can't thank you all enough for the advice. I've spent a good part of the weekend working on each of these possible solutions and I'm still not seeing any difference in performance (badly surging idle after engine is warm and erratic performance below 1500 RPM).
Here's what I've done so far:
Ran a 2 gauge ground cable from the trunk mounted battery to the engine grounding point on the chassis.
Cleaned all ground connections.
Grounded the Sniper throttle body directly to the same engine grounding point on the chassis (this is in addition to Sniper power and ground leads going directly to the battery).
Compared performance with and without the "Cobra" air cleaner (hangs over distributor) and see no difference.
Opened up my wire looms and temporarily and systematically separated wires relating to the Sniper, coil, etc... and no difference in performance.
Exhaustive experimentation with the IAC-- set it lower to center around 3% and gradually brought it up to the 7 to 10% recommended and no difference.
Fuel pressure is measured and is perfect at 58 psi.

Next step is to move the coil-- ordered an E-core style coil and will install it on the "F" panel.
I picked up some dielectric grease and will put a dab on each spark plug connection.
I'll fab a copper or aluminum shroud to cover the distributor (I used to work in the electronics industry and we had better results from copper).
I've posted data logs on the Holley forum to see if EM interference seems likely. For the life of me and I can't seem to decipher and understand these logs.
I posted them here as well ("0010" is surging idle and "0011" is after idle settled). After the idle settles (takes about 20 seconds) if I bump the throttle it goes back to surging.

Lastly, I'd like to give Alan_C a shout out and thank him for reminding me that this is a process and for his detailed post.

[Nigel Allen]

I'm not expert on any of the old school stuff, as I run a coyote. As it is affected by heat, could it potentially a problem that is mechanical. I.E.
- Do you have a vacuum assisted brake booster?
- could you have a vacuum leak in the intake? Re torque manifold.
- valve / valve train issue?
- bad plug leads?
Check timing stability Maybe distributor advance issue.

Hope you track it down soon.

Cheers,
Nige

[Norm B]

Here are pictures of my distributor shield and cosmetic cover. Aluminum seems to be working fine for me and was easy to get. The picture of the shield is of its interior. I covered the outside with black hockey tape ( being Canadian it seemed appropriate ) to camouflage it until the cover showed up. I ran a ground wire from the shield to the frame. You electrical guys are probably laughing at me but, it works.🤪

HTH

Norm

[Norm B]

AA-ron, is the IAC reading steady while the engine is surging? If it is, then I would look very carefully for a vacuum leak. Engine speed cannot change without a change in airflow or ignition timing.

[AA-ron]

Hockey tape! Love it. Here in Maine it would grey duct tape.
Quick question. I think I see in your picture that you ran the coil wire along top of valve cover. I was concerned about that because of its proximity to the sniper. It would certainly make my wire routing easier if I could do that. My alternative is to run the wire directly from the F panel (where I'm thinking of putting my coil) to the distributor. I prefer your method, but what are your thoughts?
Thanks!!

[Norm B]

The coil wire runs directly to the F panel. The loom you see running down the valley is a shield cover for the wires for oil pressure, coolant temp (x2), and distributor.

[Blitzboy54]

To Norms point I would seriously look at my IAC behavior before going too deep down the grounding or RF rabbit hole.

[AA-ron]

AA-ron, is the IAC reading steady while the engine is surging? If it is, then I would look very carefully for a vacuum leak. Engine speed cannot change without a change in airflow or ignition timing.

According to my data log, the IAC is all over the place, radical jumps up and down corresponding with the surges.
I hate show my newbie stripes here, but where would I look for a vacuum leak?

[FF33rod]

There are some very knowledgeable people on the Sniper forums that are great at giving advice once you post config and log files if you haven't tried that (and I definitely would do that before going crazy with wiring and grounding which seems to be the go to advice people give for the Sniper, sometimes justified but not always)

[john42]

Another issue I had was with my spark plugs. I originally was going carb instead of EFI and didn't have resister type plugs. It was causing all sorta of idle surge and havoc. Pug some NGK-7373 in and it helped a ton.

[Kbl7td]

I’m not going to go through all the posts but I assume you’ve taken off the covers to the injectors, and check the plugs? There was a known issues with those plugs coming loose.

Start at 12:36 mark

https://youtu.be/GQlVPJfN8gw?si=26yjrTLiIi52shYf

[Alan_C]

You are going though the troubleshooting in a very orderly and methodical way. Sorry it has not resolved the issue, but sounds like you have a very good ground system now. Unfortunately we sometimes make our cars better but do not solve the issue at hand. Patience is tough at times, the story about a guy trouble shooting a Coyote crate engine for months and months comes to mind. In his case, bad injectors straight from Ford. So consider just because something is new, does not mean it works. The possibility that the problem could be a vacuum leak is interesting. You can spray something volatile like starter fluid around the most obvious places where leaks occur and watch for RPM changes and the idle settling down.
It all takes time and please post the source of the issue when done. I have often wished we would have a database of problems and solutions for others to reference shortcutting their troubleshooting processes.

[Alan_C]

I picked up some dielectric grease and will put a dab on each spark plug connection.

I am not sure what you intended to cure with the dielectric grease? A dielectric is a non-conductor so you would be in effect insulating the connection anywhere you do not have direct contact.
I would suggest that you should be trying to improve the electrical contact, not try to reduce it. If anything, I would clean all the spark plug and wire contact points as best you can and move on.

[AA-ron]

I am not sure what you intended to cure with the dielectric grease? A dielectric is a non-conductor so you would be in effect insulating the connection anywhere you do not have direct contact.
I would suggest that you should be trying to improve the electrical contact, not try to reduce it. If anything, I would clean all the spark plug and wire contact points as best you can and move on.

I was told by Holley and another engine builder to put dielectric grease on the spark plug boots to help reduce RF escaping at the connection. And yes, I'd never put it on the actual electrical connection.

[AA-ron]

There are some very knowledgeable people on the Sniper forums that are great at giving advice once you post config and log files if you haven't tried that (and I definitely would do that before going crazy with wiring and grounding which seems to be the go to advice people give for the Sniper, sometimes justified but not always)

I was able to get Holley to look at my datalogs yesterday and they feel its RF as it's primarily showing up on my IAC signal in the log-- which apparently one of the places RF is first noticed. And yes, the Holley forum has been a great resource!

[Nigel Allen]

Try some clip on ferrite RFI suppressors.

https://palomar-engineers.com/antenna-products/1-1-balun-kits/how-many-chokes-do-i-need

[Railroad]

Not the experienced tuner here, but surprised the wide band O2 sensor has not been, replaced, tested, removed, relocated, etc.

[bobl]

Looking at your data log of the surging idle it looks like the 02 sensor has failed. It shows really lean and then closed loop throws a ton of fuel at it and it goes rich, and starts a cycle. The fuel pressure fluctuating wildly could cause this but not too likely. You could try taking it out of closed loop and see if that helps it, but the base fuel table my have been corrupted so it won't work either. Oddly I don't see any rpm in the data logs, but I'm guessing that just has to do with how the files were created. Maybe RFI is causing the 02 sensor to read incorrectly? I've never seen it happen but I guess anything is possible. If you have a good backup global file you could load it and turn off closed loop so it doesn't get corrupted to see if that corrects it. My money is on a failing 02 sensor. If you could post a copy of your global file I'd be glad to take a look at it.

Bob

[ggunter]

While I love the concept of a bolt on throttle body fuel injection unit, which is the reason I put one on my car, I thought it was going to be great. The You Tube videos made it look so easy. Heck, self-learning, that's cool. It was for about 1200 miles, then the gremlins moved in, and the oxygen sensor failed, first tow bill, not a biggy. New sensor and we were up and running. Then, asking the car to idle correctly was too much to ask. Silly me. Whenever it felt like it, it would idle up to around 2000 rpm and sometimes comes back down, other times I had to put it in gear and let the clutch out to bring it down. Checked with Holley and did all their hocus pocus. To no avail. Then one day it all stopped.... After I bolted on a Holley 750 Double Pumper. My point being, you paid good money for a so-called bolt on product that is supposed to give good drivability, starting and performance. You shouldn't have to go on forums and take well intentioned advice to make the unit operate as it should out of the box. Next, they will have you wrapping your head in a tinfoil cone with a ground strap because your head is giving off EMF. I say most of this in jest and there are many who have had zero problems. I'm sure....I hope you get it straightened out. I personally think Holley needs a little more R&D on this one. Mine is sitting in a box if anyone wants it.

[Mike.Bray]

While I love the concept of a bolt on throttle body fuel injection unit, which is the reason I put one on my car, I thought it was going to be great. The You Tube videos made it look so easy. Heck, self-learning, that's cool. It was for about 1200 miles, then the gremlins moved in, and the oxygen sensor failed, first tow bill, not a biggy. New sensor and we were up and running. Then, asking the car to idle correctly was too much to ask. Silly me. Whenever it felt like it, it would idle up to around 2000 rpm and sometimes comes back down, other times I had to put it in gear and let the clutch out to bring it down. Checked with Holley and did all their hocus pocus. To no avail. Then one day it all stopped.... After I bolted on a Holley 750 Double Pumper. My point being, you paid good money for a so-called bolt on product that is supposed to give good drivability, starting and performance. You shouldn't have to go on forums and take well intentioned advice to make the unit operate as it should out of the box. Next, they will have you wrapping your head in a tinfoil cone with a ground strap because your head is giving off EMF. I say most of this in jest and there are many who have had zero problems. I'm sure....I hope you get it straightened out. I personally think Holley needs a little more R&D on this one. Mine is sitting in a box if anyone wants it.

There's nothing wrong with EFI, there's a reason you haven't been able to buy a new car without it for several decades. And I'd love any of you carb guys to help me get my leaf blower started:) EFI is far superior to a mechanical device invented in the 1800's in every way. The issue is you get what you pay for. A $1k Sniper is never going to perform like a $3-4K port injected system. From what I understand the Sniper 2 has a lot of improvements over the original version but it's still a low cost rudimentary system with limited capabilities. To me the Sniper, like the Fast EZ systems give EFI a bad name.

[rich grsc]

Mike, anyone buying a Fast EZ is going to wish they had your leaf blower carb. :rolleyes::( Pure cr-p.

[bobl]

The main problem with FAST EZ is that there is no way to interface with a computer so you can't tune it beyond what's preset. The Sniper is light years better simply because you have access with a laptop. A tuner can fix most any problem. I've tuned several Snipers remotely by them sending me data logs and the config files, just like the higher end systems.

Bob

[Mike.Bray]

Mike, anyone buying a Fast EZ is going to wish they had your leaf blower carb. :rolleyes::( Pure cr-p.

Could not agree more Rich! I have the Sportsman and I'm very impressed with it on my Borla stack system.

[AA-ron]

Looking at your data log of the surging idle it looks like the 02 sensor has failed. It shows really lean and then closed loop throws a ton of fuel at it and it goes rich, and starts a cycle. The fuel pressure fluctuating wildly could cause this but not too likely. You could try taking it out of closed loop and see if that helps it, but the base fuel table my have been corrupted so it won't work either. Oddly I don't see any rpm in the data logs, but I'm guessing that just has to do with how the files were created. Maybe RFI is causing the 02 sensor to read incorrectly? I've never seen it happen but I guess anything is possible. If you have a good backup global file you could load it and turn off closed loop so it doesn't get corrupted to see if that corrects it. My money is on a failing 02 sensor. If you could post a copy of your global file I'd be glad to take a look at it.

Bob

I've questioned my O2 sensor a few times with Holley and they doO2n't feel as if it's likely the problem as the engine runs nicely during acceleration. The problems all exist under 1500 RPM, where it's a little rough and of course my surging idle. Id love to get your take on their assumption. Could a bad O2 cause these problems but otherwise perform nicely in all other areas?

[AA-ron]

Looking at your data log of the surging idle it looks like the 02 sensor has failed. It shows really lean and then closed loop throws a ton of fuel at it and it goes rich, and starts a cycle. The fuel pressure fluctuating wildly could cause this but not too likely. You could try taking it out of closed loop and see if that helps it, but the base fuel table my have been corrupted so it won't work either. Oddly I don't see any rpm in the data logs, but I'm guessing that just has to do with how the files were created. Maybe RFI is causing the 02 sensor to read incorrectly? I've never seen it happen but I guess anything is possible. If you have a good backup global file you could load it and turn off closed loop so it doesn't get corrupted to see if that corrects it. My money is on a failing 02 sensor. If you could post a copy of your global file I'd be glad to take a look at it.

BobI've attached my global config file-- it's a pretty straightforward tune from what I understand. Mike Forte built the motor and loaded the tune.

[AA-ron]

Not the experienced tuner here, but surprised the wide band O2 sensor has not been, replaced, tested, removed, relocated, etc.

Holley doesn't think it's the O2 sensor because everthing looks ok except for the surging idle and somewhat rough performance below 1500 RPM. They believe that if the O2 sensor had failed, it would be affecting performance across the entire spectrum. I'd love to get anyone else's read on that-- can a O2 sensor fail where it only affects these two problems I'm having? Is it truely an all or nothing with this sensor?

[bobl]

Is this the tune the car is running on or the base that Forte loaded? The learn table is all 0. Did someone transfer the learn table to base fuel? The data log shows learn is occurring so there should be data in that table.

[AA-ron]

Is this the tune the car is running on or the base that Forte loaded? The learn table is all 0. Did someone transfer the learn table to base fuel? The data log shows learn is occurring so there should be data in that table.

So here's where my newbie stripes are going to show.
I downloaded this tune to my ECU following Forte's instructions. After speaking with Holley and making all these grounding changes, they suggested I reload the tune so that it starts learning with the new parameters, basically starting from a clean slate. If I remember correctly this data log was after driving the car for only about 30 minutes with the tune reloaded.
I hope this answers your question.
I'll also send you a personal message.
Thanks!

[ggunter]

I think some have missed my point. The concept of the bolt on throttle body injection is wonderful and Holley's set up wizard couldn't be easier, and the setting of the basic parameters is easy as well. That being said, it should function correctly after that. I see many guys on this forum who have issues and if you go on the Holley forum there are tons of guys having issues with this product. I have talked to engine tuners who will not work on the Sniper product because of its inability to stay reliable. I think if it's an out of the box product, it should work out of the box.

[bobl]

That explains the learn table then. Thanks.

[Mike.Bray]

Mike, anyone buying a Fast EZ is going to wish they had your leaf blower carb. :rolleyes::( Pure cr-p.

There is an advantage to the EZ, it uses the same harness as the Sportsman so it's easy to swap out!

[rich grsc]

There is an advantage to the EZ, it uses the same harness as the Sportsman so it's easy to swap out!
So true, and if you complain to the right person, they do the swap for free. :o

[john42]

The main problem with FAST EZ is that there is no way to interface with a computer so you can't tune it beyond what's preset. The Sniper is light years better simply because you have access with a laptop. A tuner can fix most any problem. I've tuned several Snipers remotely by them sending me data logs and the config files, just like the higher end systems.

Bob

I gotta admit tho my Sniper 2 is still giving me grief. Been with a professional tuner going back and forth several times now. On the dyno and driving around. We think we've nailed it, runs great and then the next morning it won't idle again. Now instead of dying every time I stop it either yo-yo idles between 500rpm and 2k or just sticks at 2k. 2 days ago it was idling and returning to idle perfectly. uggggg.

[john42]

I've attached my global config file-- it's a pretty straightforward tune from what I understand. Mike Forte built the motor and loaded the tune.

Interesting I'm having the same issues and mine is also from Forte. However, The Traveling Builder did my initial tune file and now I'm with a local dyno tuner. Brenden only had about 2 hours tuning it to be fair before we loaded up and got down the road home. So it was a very basic, "it's running!" setup. With my local tuner (Horsepower Farm) we had it on the dyno for a solid day and out driving for another 4 hours. I was under the impression that it "shouldn't be this hard", but alas apparently it is. Horsepower Farm is confident that I'm not having RFI issues. I'm at a loss and just want to get back to cruising and racing instead of fiddling with idle issues at every stop light.

[weendoggy]

I gotta admit tho my Sniper 2 is still giving me grief. Been with a professional tuner going back and forth several times now. On the dyno and driving around. We think we've nailed it, runs great and then the next morning it won't idle again. Now instead of dying every time I stop it either yo-yo idles between 500rpm and 2k or just sticks at 2k. 2 days ago it was idling and returning to idle perfectly. uggggg.

If it's pretty much correct, I'd be looking at your Idle Ramp Down settings. Depending on how that's set, you could be in the "sweet spot" of having it take control, which will hang the RPM.

[rich grsc]

I have a Fast Sportsman system, not much experience working with a Sniper. The Fast has one quirk that I just live with. At startup I need to turn the key to the run position for about 10 seconds before cranking to start. If you just key straight to cranking, the engine just doest run quite right, almost the same symptoms you guys are talking about. Next time it happens, just pull over, turn off the engine then restart using the 10 second pause. Maybe it'll make a change?

[AA-ron]

Interesting I'm having the same issues and mine is also from Forte. However, The Traveling Builder did my initial tune file and now I'm with a local dyno tuner. Brenden only had about 2 hours tuning it to be fair before we loaded up and got down the road home. So it was a very basic, "it's running!" setup. With my local tuner (Horsepower Farm) we had it on the dyno for a solid day and out driving for another 4 hours. I was under the impression that it "shouldn't be this hard", but alas apparently it is. Horsepower Farm is confident that I'm not having RFI issues. I'm at a loss and just want to get back to cruising and racing instead of fiddling with idle issues at every stop light.
Yep, sounds like your problem is very similar to mine-- slight hang at 2k rpm, bumpy and surging idle, and add to that temperamental low RPM performance (under 1500).
Here's where I'm at in the process-- which is basically throwing everything I can at the problem until I figure it out. By the way, I know virtually nothing about tuning so I'm attacking what I can and then seeking assistance with the tuning. I also just ordered another O2 sensor so I can rule that out-- $100 is somewhat of an expensive experiment, but one I feel I need to do.
I took Monday off to completely rewire the front of the car.
I moved all wires except the water temp, oil pressure and O2 sensor wires from on top of the engine (no options there as they go directly to the Sniper.
I moved the coil to the F panel and ran coil wires to run along the side of the engine bay and the sent the wires directly to the distributor keeping them away from the Sniper.
Ran a 2ga ground cable from the trunk mounted battery directly to the engine grounding point on the chassis (probably overkill, but Sniper suggested it)
Ran a ground cable directly from the throttle body of the sniper to the same engine ground point on the chassis.
Exhaustive IAC and Rampdown experimentation.
None of this seem to make much of a difference. I say "much of a difference" but I do feel that its running slightly better after having done what's listed above.

Last hurdle is to shield the distributor, but truthfully, I'm waiting on the new O2 sensor to give that a try first (due in today).

Like I said, I'm throwing everything I have at this--figuring I'll eventually and probably accidentally figure it out :)

[john42]

Yep, sounds like your problem is very similar to mine-- slight hang at 2k rpm, bumpy and surging idle, and add to that temperamental low RPM performance (under 1500).
Here's where I'm at in the process-- which is basically throwing everything I can at the problem until I figure it out. By the way, I know virtually nothing about tuning so I'm attacking what I can and then seeking assistance with the tuning. I also just ordered another O2 sensor so I can rule that out-- $100 is somewhat of an expensive experiment, but one I feel I need to do.
I took Monday off to completely rewire the front of the car.
I moved all wires except the water temp, oil pressure and O2 sensor wires from on top of the engine (no options there as they go directly to the Sniper.
I moved the coil to the F panel and ran coil wires to run along the side of the engine bay and the sent the wires directly to the distributor keeping them away from the Sniper.
Ran a 2ga ground cable from the trunk mounted battery directly to the engine grounding point on the chassis (probably overkill, but Sniper suggested it)
Ran a ground cable directly from the throttle body of the sniper to the same engine ground point on the chassis.
Exhaustive IAC and Rampdown experimentation.
None of this seem to make much of a difference. I say "much of a difference" but I do feel that its running slightly better after having done what's listed above.

Last hurdle is to shield the distributor, but truthfully, I'm waiting on the new O2 sensor to give that a try first (due in today).

Like I said, I'm throwing everything I have at this--figuring I'll eventually and probably accidentally figure it out :)


I've done everything you've done above and I've shielded my distributer. I have not tried a new O2 sensor. I expect delivery today of a package of 50 varies sizes of ferrite RFI snapons as I'm doing that next.

[Alan_C]

Like I said, I'm throwing everything I have at this--figuring I'll eventually and probably accidentally figure it out :)
In a nutshell, you summed up every troubleshooting effort. You try everything until you find the issue. It hurts that you spend all that time "fixing" everything you have tried so far only to find out nothing has changed. Troubleshooting is eliminating the possibilities ultimately leaving you with the issue. Frustrating and time consuming sure, but in the end rewarding once you finally fix it!

[Kbl7td]

Not sure who you’re using as tuners but I highly suggest Andrew. projectgattago@gmail.com

He nailed my former terminator X tune with lots of extra inputs, outputs, custom tables etc. I have no idea if sniper has similar controls but worth a shot. This guys is all over the LS and Holley forums.

[john42]

Not sure who you’re using as tuners but I highly suggest Andrew. projectgattago@gmail.com

He nailed my former terminator X tune with lots of extra inputs, outputs, custom tables etc. I have no idea if sniper has similar controls but worth a shot. This guys is all over the LS and Holley forums.

From what I understand the SBF rev up and down so fast it makes it a tricky beast to get the return to idle right. The idle drops so fast and the sniper has to be just right to catch it. LS on the other had has a naturally slower ramp back to idle and takes less fiddling with the sniper to catch it.

I've been going to Horsepower Farm in Loudon, NH. They've got a very good rep around NH.

[bobl]

AA-ron, looking at your data log I don't think it is a RFI problem. It's going very lean and the engine starts losing rpm, then the ecu reacts and adds fuel opens the IAC and adds timing trying stabilize it. Those are the correct responses. So the question is why is it going lean. Bad 02 sensor or a real fuel supply issue? My point is you can see what is happening, now to figure out why. Weendoggy is sharp on tuning, do you have any thoughts, looking at the data log?

Bob

[john42]

If it's pretty much correct, I'd be looking at your Idle Ramp Down settings. Depending on how that's set, you could be in the "sweet spot" of having it take control, which will hang the RPM.


Ya if I blip the throttle it will settle to the desired idle. It loves to always be stuck. Do you adjust the "RPM Above Idle to Start Ramp" to be above or more below that spot. That other issue is with the engine always trying to race to about 2200 RPM when casual driving the car always wants to accelerate. Fighting the car with brakes is not good. Reminds me of a certain youtube video....


My current settings:

198357198358198359

[bobl]

Ya if I blip the throttle it will settle to the desired idle. It loves to always be stuck. Do you adjust the "RPM Above Idle to Start Ramp" to be above or more below that spot. That other issue is with the engine always trying to race to about 2200 RPM when casual driving the car always wants to accelerate. Fighting the car with brakes is not good. Reminds me of a certain youtube video....


My current settings:

198357198358198359

Get a data log when at fast idle. Sounds like the throttle blades are hanging open a bit. Sometimes the secondaries will not close completely causing a hung idle.

[TD Performance]

Would suggest asking Holley to upgrade you the Sniper 2. The RFI has been addressed with the 2nd generation. Just scanning through your original post, would definitely look at the IAC Reading. Very important to keep in the 0-5% range. Of course grounding very important too!!

[weendoggy]

Ya if I blip the throttle it will settle to the desired idle. It loves to always be stuck. Do you adjust the "RPM Above Idle to Start Ramp" to be above or more below that spot. That other issue is with the engine always trying to race to about 2200 RPM when casual driving the car always wants to accelerate. Fighting the car with brakes is not good. Reminds me of a certain youtube video....


My current settings:

198357198358198359

Looking at those settings, I'd say your Ramp Down is set too low. This means your idle will start ramp down at 1550rpm's with 0 TPS setting. So, if you have your foot resting on the throttle at say 2 and running at 1500rpm, it won't do anything, but stay where it is, which is what I'm gathering from your post. The TPS should be at 0 or maybe 1 in order for that to work correctly. Is it doing that when you have it hang? Only way to know is a datalog or you're watching it as it happens. Also check what Bob says about the throttle plates. I just got through checking my Terminator after having some similar issues recently and had to re-center the secondaries. I don't have any Sniper I've done set as low as you do on Ramp Down, but each engine is different.

[john42]

Looking at those settings, I'd say your Ramp Down is set too low. This means your idle will start ramp down at 1550rpm's with 0 TPS setting. So, if you have your foot resting on the throttle at say 2 and running at 1500rpm, it won't do anything, but stay where it is, which is what I'm gathering from your post. The TPS should be at 0 or maybe 1 in order for that to work correctly. Is it doing that when you have it hang? Only way to know is a datalog or you're watching it as it happens. Also check what Bob says about the throttle plates. I just got through checking my Terminator after having some similar issues recently and had to re-center the secondaries. I don't have any Sniper I've done set as low as you do on Ramp Down, but each engine is different.

I've checked and rechecked the secondaries. I've also been very aware of making sure my foot is 100% not touching the gas peddle. My TPS is at 0, but I'm now tempted to go through the entire check process again! HA!

[weendoggy]

I've checked and rechecked the secondaries. I've also been very aware of making sure my foot is 100% not touching the gas peddle. My TPS is at 0, but I'm now tempted to go through the entire check process again! HA!

Sounds good, take a new datalog showing this happening. Much easier to see than guess, not suggesting your accuracy either. Mechanically the throttle should always go back to 0 under operation and if it is the datalog will show that, plus seeing the rpm where it hangs.

[john42]

Sounds good, take a new datalog showing this happening. Much easier to see than guess, not suggesting your accuracy either. Mechanically the throttle should always go back to 0 under operation and if it is the datalog will show that, plus seeing the rpm where it hangs.

Will do. Soon as it stops raining...

[AA-ron]

Yep, sounds like your problem is very similar to mine-- slight hang at 2k rpm, bumpy and surging idle, and add to that temperamental low RPM performance (under 1500).
Here's where I'm at in the process-- which is basically throwing everything I can at the problem until I figure it out. By the way, I know virtually nothing about tuning so I'm attacking what I can and then seeking assistance with the tuning. I also just ordered another O2 sensor so I can rule that out-- $100 is somewhat of an expensive experiment, but one I feel I need to do.
I took Monday off to completely rewire the front of the car.
I moved all wires except the water temp, oil pressure and O2 sensor wires from on top of the engine (no options there as they go directly to the Sniper.
I moved the coil to the F panel and ran coil wires to run along the side of the engine bay and the sent the wires directly to the distributor keeping them away from the Sniper.
Ran a 2ga ground cable from the trunk mounted battery directly to the engine grounding point on the chassis (probably overkill, but Sniper suggested it)
Ran a ground cable directly from the throttle body of the sniper to the same engine ground point on the chassis.
Exhaustive IAC and Rampdown experimentation.
None of this seem to make much of a difference. I say "much of a difference" but I do feel that its running slightly better after having done what's listed above.

Last hurdle is to shield the distributor, but truthfully, I'm waiting on the new O2 sensor to give that a try first (due in today).

Like I said, I'm throwing everything I have at this--figuring I'll eventually and probably accidentally figure it out :)

Here's an update:
I replaced the O2 sensor to see if that made any difference and it unfortunately did not. So I can add O2 sensor to my above list and check that off (and now I have a spare O2 sensor :).
I was able to drive it about 20 miles yesterday and noticed a slight improvement in it returning to steady idle after being on the throttle, but only a slight improvement-- and even after saying that, I'm not completely sure. However, after driving it and letting it sit for 20 minutes, and restarting it, it still surges like crazy. It drops to 200 rpm, then ramps up to 1000, and it does this over and over for the first 30 seconds. Cold and hot starts are absolutely perfect by the way. And the bumpy below 1500 RPM still exists.

This weekend we have some good weather on the way, so I intend on spending lots of time (once again) going through my IAC settings. I checked my fuel pressure again yesterday and it's still holding tight at 59, so that looks good.

While this is frustrating, I do feel better about how I've rewired the engine bay, and I'm continuing to learn more about my Sniper. I might also try giving the Wizard tune a shot, instead of the tune that came from Forte. I don't hold out much hope for that approach, but who knows...
Here's hoping soom time this weekend will shed some light on my problem!!

[Norm B]

Have you tried wrapping the distributor with aluminum foil? If not do that and reboot the Sniper from the handheld. Any data stored or learned in the ECU could be corrupted. This was one of the first things the Holley tech had me do!

Norm

[weendoggy]

Here's an update:
I replaced the O2 sensor to see if that made any difference and it unfortunately did not. So I can add O2 sensor to my above list and check that off (and now I have a spare O2 sensor :).
I was able to drive it about 20 miles yesterday and noticed a slight improvement in it returning to steady idle after being on the throttle, but only a slight improvement-- and even after saying that, I'm not completely sure. However, after driving it and letting it sit for 20 minutes, and restarting it, it still surges like crazy. It drops to 200 rpm, then ramps up to 1000, and it does this over and over for the first 30 seconds. Cold and hot starts are absolutely perfect by the way. And the bumpy below 1500 RPM still exists.

This weekend we have some good weather on the way, so I intend on spending lots of time (once again) going through my IAC settings. I checked my fuel pressure again yesterday and it's still holding tight at 59, so that looks good.

While this is frustrating, I do feel better about how I've rewired the engine bay, and I'm continuing to learn more about my Sniper. I might also try giving the Wizard tune a shot, instead of the tune that came from Forte. I don't hold out much hope for that approach, but who knows...
Here's hoping soom time this weekend will shed some light on my problem!!

Simple advice, don't start changing multiple items without doing a datalog to backup your change. You can make several changes and make it worse, or better, without knowing what the cause is. Ex: if it drives good and data shows good, file that tune away. If it then starts as you say and stumbles, that's when you want to start a datalog (prior to starting) and let it capture what's happening. You may find it's simpler than you think. Yes, a lot of time taken, but you find out what is causing it and you can target the area in question. If the engine is "hunting" I'd shut it down, clear the Learn Table (you already saved the tune) and then start up again and let it collect data while logging. Also, running a bad tune will make your LT look bad and you should never transfer that data becaues you'll skew your Base Fuel and really make your head spin.

On a warmed up engine and it's stumbling like you say, put it in Open Loop, start a datalog and watch fuel via the LT. Let it go through its quirks, and be sure to stop the datalog before you turn the engine off or you'll lose the log. btw: the Wizard tunes aren't the greatest either. jmo

[Railroad]

I doubt this will help, but might jog someone's memory and the solutions.
All your issues are identical to the hot rodding of the Ford 5.0 push rod engine of the late 80's and 90's.
It's crazy the problems and descriptions are the same.
Problems began when the air filter system and or intake were changed. A cam really upset the cart.
Those who could tune the ECU's were in high demand.
Ford had a plate with adjustable air bleeds that went between the throttle body and the intake to smooth out some of the hunting idle issues.
On the TPS's the Ford's target numbers were .89 or .99. Tuners recommended the lower number, due to .99 going over 1.0 when things warmed up and moved around slightly.
I thought the EFI in question was a Sniper II. I am surprised anyone bothers with the problems of the Sniper.

[Railroad]

I have a throttle body fuel injection, Holley, that the injectors would leak, after a hot engine shut off.
When I would try to restart after a short time the engine would be flooded.
I wonder if you can bleed the fuel pressure off, after shutting down the hot engine. You should have a schrader valve somewhere. If so, you can wrap a rag around it and bleed off the line pressure.
My theory is, fuel is building up in the intake, creating a rich condition and the O2's are responding to this condition.
Just shooting in the dark, hoping it helps.
good luck,

[Blitzboy54]

Ron,

Do yourself a favor and disable the "Idle Spark". Then take your car out for a drive and see if it improves. If it doesn't then it cost you nothing, put it back and carry on. If it does then you have a very similar IAC setup (or design bug) as me and you can then beat up Holly to figure out why.

[AA-ron]

Thanks everyone! It feels good to have some ideas to run with! I'll drop you all a note after a weekend of driving and testing.

[bobl]

Post data logs and global files. With a bunch of eyeballs on it I bet we can find something.

Bob

[Kbl7td]

Ya man you’re just wasting your time here, no offense to anyone. Send the log to a reputable tuner. Email Andrew like I suggested the tune and just see if he thinks he can figure it out first. No cost to you probably, the guy will then do a remote login to your computer and tune from there in real time while on the phone with you.

[john42]

Ron,

Do yourself a favor and disable the "Idle Spark". Then take your car out for a drive and see if it improves. If it doesn't then it cost you nothing, put it back and carry on. If it does then you have a very similar IAC setup (or design bug) as me and you can then beat up Holly to figure out why.

OMG!! This ^^^^^^^. I disabled that for today's drive and YES YES and more YES!

[AA-ron]

I disabled the Idle Spark and it didn't make any difference (actually ran worse I think), so I'm officially throwing in the towel.
I stopped into a local speed shop (EFI Motorsport in Somersworth NH) to have a chat with them, and was please to find them working on several cars with Snipers. After a conversation he STRONGLY suggested I buy the full Hyperspark Ignition system including the distributor. I was on the fence about that, but he said, and I quote, "I have never had a car that I couldn't fix when the Sniper and the Hyperspark Ignition system are installed". And I guess it makes sense, I've come this far with the car (new kit, new crate motor...etc) to not take it that one step further.
I'm going to be installing the new system this week and then bring it to them early next week for a tune!
Oh, and it's worth noting that he wasn't trying to sell my a Hyperspark system... :)

With any luck, my next post will be nothing but happy face emojis.

[john42]

I disabled the Idle Spark and it didn't make any difference (actually ran worse I think), so I'm officially throwing in the towel.
I stopped into a local speed shop (EFI Motorsport in Somersworth NH) to have a chat with them, and was please to find them working on several cars with Snipers. After a conversation he STRONGLY suggested I buy the full Hyperspark Ignition system including the distributor. I was on the fence about that, but he said, and I quote, "I have never had a car that I couldn't fix when the Sniper and the Hyperspark Ignition system are installed". And I guess it makes sense, I've come this far with the car (new kit, new crate motor...etc) to not take it that one step further.
I'm going to be installing the new system this week and then bring it to them early next week for a tune!
Oh, and it's worth noting that he wasn't trying to sell my a Hyperspark system... :)

With any luck, my next post will be nothing but happy face emojis.

Ahhh. I have the Hyperspark on mine. I've no idea how much it's helped or hindered in my quest for a good running engine.

[FF33rod]

I disabled the Idle Spark and it didn't make any difference (actually ran worse I think), so I'm officially throwing in the towel.
I stopped into a local speed shop (EFI Motorsport in Somersworth NH) to have a chat with them, and was please to find them working on several cars with Snipers. After a conversation he STRONGLY suggested I buy the full Hyperspark Ignition system including the distributor. I was on the fence about that, but he said, and I quote, "I have never had a car that I couldn't fix when the Sniper and the Hyperspark Ignition system are installed". And I guess it makes sense, I've come this far with the car (new kit, new crate motor...etc) to not take it that one step further.
I'm going to be installing the new system this week and then bring it to them early next week for a tune!
Oh, and it's worth noting that he wasn't trying to sell my a Hyperspark system... :)

With any luck, my next post will be nothing but happy face emojis.

Make sure the hyperspark distributor has the correct gear on it, I had to change it for my hydraulic roller cam setup...

Steve

[Blitzboy54]

Make sure the hyperspark distributor has the correct gear on it, I had to change it for my hydraulic roller cam setup...

Steve

The Duel Spark has the correct gear if you need steel. It is the same as the hyperspark if you get the adaptor. It's what Holley will tell you to buy unless you want to change the gear on the hyperspark. The duelspark distributor is less expensive than modifying the gear.


Also I'm sorry my advice assumed you had the sniper running your timing. I should have asked more questions.

[AA-ron]

The Duel Spark has the correct gear if you need steel. It is the same as the hyperspark if you get the adaptor. It's what Holley will tell you to buy unless you want to change the gear on the hyperspark. The duelspark distributor is less expensive than modifying the gear.


Also I'm sorry my advice assumed you had the sniper running your timing. I should have asked more questions.

Steve, you saved me A LOT of headache! I ordered my Hyperspark system and spoke directly to Holley on this and told them I'm running a Ford Racing crate motor with roller cams and they never mentioned anything about incompatibility! After seeing your post, I called them back and they said "oh boy, yep, this would have very bad to have installed this distributor with the gear we sent you". They are overnighting me a replacement.
Thank you for your note!!

[burchfieldb]

When I switched my gear on the Hyperspark, I had to heat the gear to get it to grow in size in order to slide/press it on. I used a height gauge to make sure it was set to the correct position.

[bobl]

You'll need a press to change the gear. Most any shop can do it, but follow the instructions exactly.

[JJK]

I don't want to hijack the thread, but I have had my car rev up to 2000 rpm twice now when I pull into a parking lot off of a main street after I take my food off the accelerator. Both times I had been driving for about 30 minutes and things were stable beforehand. Both times I turned the car off, and when I started it again things were fine. I think I recall reading there is a setting in the Sniper to help with this, but not sure what it is or what it should be set to.

Sniper with BPE 347, sniper is not controlling the timing and I am using the tune Blueprint supplied (assuming they changed anything from the stock settings).

Thanks
JJ