What's up with my (power) steering alignment?

[CptMorgan]

I've clearly screwed something up.

The manual says "center-to-center distance for the top of the outer Tie Rod End stud should be 53 1/16."

I'm at 52" c/c. My tie rods are bottomed out. It looks like I need another full inch of toe in. I can only get that by timing the steering shafts, but I don't see that in the manual.

It also looks like I have too much positive camber, and I'm just about bottomed out on the upper arm too.

Where did I go wrong?
196962
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[BUDFIVE]

Your picture #1 shows measuring from the center of the tie rod end. This should be about where the zerk fitting is.
Your picture #3 shows you have the tape beginning at the tie rod end’s jam nut, NOT the center of the tie rod end joint.
Measuring Jam nut to Jam nut would be result in a much shorter measurement.
What do you measure from tie rod zerk to zerk?
If you still have toe out, I bet the measurement is > 53-1/16.
If your tie rods are bottomed out and you have toe out you may have to shorten the rack tie rods.
I have read numerous threads on the forum where this is required. Here’s a recent one:
https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?47995-Tie-Rods-Too-Long

[JJK]

I agree with BUDFIVE in that you are not measuring from the correct reference points, use the zerk fittings not the nuts. Also, for power steering you will most likely need to trim both ends of the rear sleeves about 1/4" to set proper caster. Where the flat hex portion transitions to the curve is typically where people trim the sleeves. You need to trim both ends on each of the rear sleeves, the front sleeves are fine as is.

[CptMorgan]

Okay. I'll measure Zerk to Zerk this afternoon. I measured center to center of the tie rod top nut. (That picture with the tape measure was to show how much I could trim off the tie-road sleave. )

JJK: You are saying to trim this outer leave 1/4" at each end?

196994

[Jeff Kleiner]

I've clearly screwed something up.

The manual says "center-to-center distance for the top of the outer Tie Rod End stud should be 53 1/16."

I'm at 52" c/c. My tie rods are bottomed out. It looks like I need another full inch of toe in. I can only get that by timing the steering shafts, but I don't see that in the manual.

It also looks like I have too much positive camber, and I'm just about bottomed out on the upper arm too.

Where did I go wrong?


Wait, wait...something isn't jiving here. If your goal is 53 1/16" and you're currently at 52" you need to mace the center to center distance longer by backing threads OUT of the tie rod ends, not screwing more in which will make the C-C distance even less.

Regarding camber, here is my recommendation for a rough initial power steering setting to achieve approximately 7-8 degrees of positive caster and about .5 degree negative camber. As has been mentioned many times to get there you'll most likely need to cut back the rear sleeves about 1/4" and also cut a similar amount from the male stubs that they engage otherwise they'll bottom out internally. After you set these you can then adjust toe; I recommend 1/16-3/32" toe in (not out).

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=189078&d=1666032431

Good luck,
Jeff

[JJK]

What Jeff said. if you look at the sleeve with the 8.5" measurement you can see where the ends are trimmed.

[CptMorgan]

Okay. Jeff. I've matched your number. 9.75" front. 8.5" rear. I think my upper control arm is correct. Pic:
197026

My toe looks a bit better...
But... I think my camber is off....
I'm sitting at +12deg of camber on each side!! It looks hilarious.

197027197029

Something is really off. I must have really messed up something. It's like my lower control arms are short.

Are they supposed to be 12.5" long A-arms?

197030

Does anyone see what I've done wrong? I must have put something upside down or backward.

[Jeff Kleiner]

You have pin drive lower arms as evidenced by the gusset location. Looks like you’re going to have to contact FFR to get the correct standard width arms.

Jeff

[CptMorgan]

You have pin drive lower arms as evidenced by the gusset location. Looks like you’re going to have to contact FFR to get the correct standard width arms.

Jeff

Thanks Jeff. That explains it. I'll call FFR in the morning. I'm sure glad I didn't start trimming the steering shafts.

[CptMorgan]

Followup.

A huge thank you Jeff. I've been hitting my head against the wall. I can now see that FFR shipped me 12508 Pin Drive Width lower arms, although the order and packing slip shows 12066 standard lower arms. That explains everything. My lower arms are 2" short...

Cheers,
-Morgan

[rponfick]

Wait, wait...something isn't jiving here. If your goal is 53 1/16" and you're currently at 52" you need to mace the center to center distance longer by backing threads OUT of the tie rod ends, not screwing more in which will make the C-C distance even less.

Regarding camber, here is my recommendation for a rough initial power steering setting to achieve approximately 7-8 degrees of positive caster and about .5 degree negative camber. As has been mentioned many times to get there you'll most likely need to cut back the rear sleeves about 1/4" and also cut a similar amount from the male stubs that they engage otherwise they'll bottom out internally. After you set these you can then adjust toe; I recommend 1/16-3/32" toe in (not out).

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=189078&d=1666032431

Good luck,
Jeff

Jeff, are these numbers good for the MK5 also. If so, I need to adjust.
As always, thanks for your guidance.

[Jeff Kleiner]

Jeff, are these numbers good for the MK5 also. If so, I need to adjust.
As always, thanks for your guidance.

The geometry is the same so this is what I used for the initial setup on mine but I haven't done a full blown 4 wheel alignment yet.

Jeff

[CraigS]

Guys, all those tape measure numbers are simply guides for initial assembly to get you in the ballpark when you get to doing an alignment. They are not a specification or a goal.