Read Several Posts and Build Threads - a few questions

[Mat1asBEV&ICE]

Hi everyone. I printed the manual and I'm taking lots of notes in preparation. A few questions I have right now:

What are the #30 drill bits used for? Threads I have read and my tool recommendations thread mentions it, but I don't see where they will be used.
Any steps you would do in a different order than what is in the manual?
Details on how much to trim from the UCA adjustment sleeves. People talk about doing it and I would like more details (how much, etc), please. I did a search but nothing comes up specific to that.
How long of a leveler should I get?


Thank you again. I love the support this community provides and I hope to be able to pay it forward.

I'm going to the Cruise Night event on 8/17, perhaps I'll meet some of you there.

[narly1]

Answers embedded in your original post below.

Earl


Hi everyone. I printed the manual and I'm taking lots of notes in preparation. A few questions I have right now:

What are the #30 drill bits used for? Threads I have read and my tool recommendations thread mentions it, but I don't see where they will be used.
Technically this drill bit makes the correct size hole with a slight amount of clearance for a 1/8" pop rivet, but most get away with standard 1/8" bits.
Any steps you would do in a different order than what is in the manual?
This is a somewhat open ended question, assembly order can take many paths depending on your unique situation in terms of many things such as parts or tools on hand, etc. Just make sure to read ahead and make sure that you are not "painting yourself into a corner per se. AND MAKE SURE THAT YOU DON"T MISS A STEP. Clipping off the corner of the relevant page in the manual as a step is completed is a good reminder.
Details on how much to trim from the UCA adjustment sleeves. People talk about doing it and I would like more details (how much, etc), please. I did a search but nothing comes up specific to that.
How long of a leveler should I get?
The length of level chosen depends the distance that you want to check over and the accuracy required. I would think that a 6" spirit (bubble in liquid type) level would be good for most things. A magnetic base is a nice feature. Later on in your build you will probably be wanting to check pinion angle, you can buy a digital protractor (angle finder) for this or just use an app on your smartphone.


Thank you again. I love the support this community provides and I hope to be able to pay it forward.

I'm going to the Cruise Night event on 8/17, perhaps I'll meet some of you there.

[JohnK]

For #3, the generally recommended procedure is to trim off the smooth round ends off the adjustment sleeve just to where the hexagonal profile starts, and also trim a corresponding amount off the threaded arms.

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=103730&d=1552518477

[egchewy79]

I used 1/8" bits instead of #30 bits.
plan on buying a bunch as they can snap pretty easily. harbor freight sells double sided bits that you can just flip over if one side breaks or gets dull.
You can hop around to a certain degree on the build. Most of my variance from the manual was due to backordered parts.
Don't rivet the trunk panels until you're all buttoned up with the fuel system. Leave the outside of the DS footbox off until you're happy w/ the pedal box, etc.
It's possible, but harder to install the engine with the radiator in the way.
For a leveler, are you talking about one for the engine hoist? Get a quality one or grease the heck out of the HF version to make life easier.

[Mat1asBEV&ICE]

For #3, the generally recommended procedure is to trim off the smooth round ends off the adjustment sleeve just to where the hexagonal profile starts, and also trim a corresponding amount off the threaded arms.

Thank you. So in your picture it would be the arm on the top?

[Mat1asBEV&ICE]

I used 1/8" bits instead of #30 bits.
plan on buying a bunch as they can snap pretty easily. harbor freight sells double sided bits that you can just flip over if one side breaks or gets dull.
You can hop around to a certain degree on the build. Most of my variance from the manual was due to backordered parts.
Don't rivet the trunk panels until you're all buttoned up with the fuel system. Leave the outside of the DS footbox off until you're happy w/ the pedal box, etc.
It's possible, but harder to install the engine with the radiator in the way.
For a leveler, are you talking about one for the engine hoist? Get a quality one or grease the heck out of the HF version to make life easier.
Sorry, I meant a level. And thank you for the other pointers. :)

[gbranham]

Thank you. So in your picture it would be the arm on the top?

From everything I've read, you want to shorten the REAR sleeve and studs that thread into it. The picture above appears to be the front sleeve.

Read here for more info:

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?40330-Front-UCA-alignment&highlight=UCA+adjuster+sleeve

[JohnK]

Thank you. So in your picture it would be the arm on the top?


From everything I've read, you want to shorten the REAR sleeve and studs that thread into it. The picture above appears to be the front sleeve.

Read here for more info:

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?40330-Front-UCA-alignment&highlight=UCA+adjuster+sleeve

The rear sleeve on each arm should be shortened. Apologies if the picture I posted above is confusing. That's the DS upper arm which, when turned over and oriented properly would have the shortened sleeve at the rear of the arm.

[edwardb]

I'm going to disagree with several of these posts and recommend using #30 drill bits for your 1/8" rivets. There are just enough oversize (.1285 vs .125) to make assembly a bit easier, alignment a little less critical, and rivets will almost always go in without additional match drilling. Worth it in the long run IMO. Same could also be said to have a couple #12 bits for 3/16" rivet holes (.1890 vs .1875) as there are some of that size in the build as well. Index drills are not hard to find although not typically in your big box stores. Harbor Freight has them as part of sets. I find the quality to be OK for occasional use. But not for the hundreds of holes you need to build. Buying high quality bits will make life easier. You have a bunch of drilling ahead, and many aluminum + steel, and nothing worse than doing that with a dull bit. I get cobalt bits from Aircraft Spruce. But there are other quality sources as well. If you're careful and also use a little lubrication, no reason to only go through a few during a build. Number one reason they break in my experience? Drilling into a weld. Will snap a bit in a heartbeat. (Ask me how I know.) So laying out where you place your rivets is important.

[Mat1asBEV&ICE]

From everything I've read, you want to shorten the REAR sleeve and studs that thread into it. The picture above appears to be the front sleeve.

Read here for more info:

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?40330-Front-UCA-alignment&highlight=UCA+adjuster+sleeve
Oh, excellent point. I understand now that I read through that thread. Thank you!

[Mat1asBEV&ICE]

The rear sleeve on each arm should be shortened. Apologies if the picture I posted above is confusing. That's the DS upper arm which, when turned over and oriented properly would have the shortened sleeve at the rear of the arm.
Thank you, John. I will now read through your build thread as well. :)

[Mat1asBEV&ICE]

I'm going to disagree with several of these posts and recommend using #30 drill bits for your 1/8" rivets. There are just enough oversize (.1285 vs .125) to make assembly a bit easier, alignment a little less critical, and rivets will almost always go in without additional match drilling. Worth it in the long run IMO. Same could also be said to have a couple #12 bits for 3/16" rivet holes (.1890 vs .1875) as there are some of that size in the build as well. Index drills are not hard to find although not typically in your big box stores. Harbor Freight has them as part of sets. I find the quality to be OK for occasional use. But not for the hundreds of holes you need to build. Buying high quality bits will make life easier. You have a bunch of drilling ahead, and many aluminum + steel, and nothing worse than doing that with a dull bit. I get cobalt bits from Aircraft Spruce. But there are other quality sources as well. If you're careful and also use a little lubrication, no reason to only go through a few during a build. Number one reason they break in my experience? Drilling into a weld. Will snap a bit in a heartbeat. (Ask me how I know.) So laying out where you place your rivets is important.
Thank you for your insight, Paul. That's a good explanation and will go with the #30 and #12. I'll make sure to keep an eye on welds.

[MB750]

I don't disagree on the #30 bits, but buying #30 bits in bulk is $$$, whereas 1/8" are a dime a dozen. I used the 1/8" and then after the hole punched thru I "wobbled" the drill in a conical fashion to wallow out the hole a bit. Close enough, rivet slides right in every time.

Yes, I broke a few bits.

[Jeff Kleiner]

#30 bits. Also get a Drill Doctor and touch them up frequently. Unless you break it a single bit will last until it's too short to fit into the machine any more (applies to all bits, not just #30s). Adding to Paul's comment about breaking bits --the other #1 reason for breaking bits...let's call them #1A and #1B ;)... is trying to force a dull bit to cut (refer back to my Drill Doctor recommendation).

Jeff

[gbranham]

I bought 12 #30 bits from Amazon for $9. Worked just fine. This isn't an area where I felt I needed to spend extravagantly

[rich grsc]

#30 bits cost the same as 1/8" bits. Buy good quality bits and two will drill the whole car if you pay attention, don't hurry or force them.
DON"T buy drill bits from Harbor Freight, they are the most expensive you can buy, THEY break on the first hole as they are so dull you can barely drill aluminum

[Mat1asBEV&ICE]

Thank you everyone for your input. I had been looking at a cobalt set on Amazon that's well reviewed and rated for hard metals (M42). The Drill Doctor is on my "to purchase" list.

[Jeff Kleiner]

Thank you everyone for your input. I had been looking at a cobalt set on Amazon that's well reviewed and rated for hard metals (M42). The Drill Doctor is on my "to purchase" list.

For what it's worth plain ol' black oxide bits have served me well for dozens of cars and thousands of holes. We're drilling aluminum and steel, both of which are "soft".

Jeff

[egchewy79]

7 pack of double ended 1/8” bits from HF is only $5. Just saying.

[Papa]

A set of these served me well during the build.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0046ASHIW/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Not required, but keeps the drill chuck from hitting things as you drill.

[Mastertech5]

That's funny my manual says #10 bits not #12s. Thats what I used and #30s. Got them from Breeze Automotive.

[edwardb]

That's funny my manual says #10 bits not #12s. Thats what I used and #30s. Got them from Breeze Automotive.

Interesting. #10's are .194" compared to .189" for #12. Pretty large for a .1875" rivet. I've used #12's for all my builds and now also on my airplane build (not that that matters...). Just the right amount of slack for a 3/16" rivet in my experience. I got that recommendation from documentation back when I started. Haven't seen #10's in Factory Five build manuals. The ones I have only list fractional bits. Do see that on Breeze's website though. Still recommend the #12. But not a hill I'd die on. This part of the discussion is already more than it's probably worth. And I'm not helping. :(