2 quick questions - alternator and grounding best practice

[mmklaxer]

I'm shoehorning the coyote into the roadster next weekend, and I'm buttoning up the last couple items in prep. Run the hydraulic line and clamp that in place out of the way, rivet the rear harness in transmission tunnel that has been cleco'd for months, etc.

Question #1 - instructions say to leave alternator off until the engine is installed. Obviously it would be easier to do that prior to install and run the belt. I've seen other gen coyotes install with everything attached (looking at you Paul) but didn't know why the instructions clearly say to wait. am I safe to install?

Question #2 - rather than connecting the ground wires of the front and rear lights to the harness ground and running all the way back to the front of the car, is it best to just terminate the ground coming out of the lights to a grounding point on the 4 corners of the car?

[RBachman]

Not sure on the 1st question as I used a different engine. But on the second, my "rule-of-thumb" is to generally avoid component to body/frame grounds where possible to help avoid potential future issues.

Some other thoughts:

*Use quality crimpers, dielectric grease, terminal blocks, and wire looms as appropriate to help to maintain reliability and avoid future issues. I generally use heat shrink tubing at the loom ends to further protect where wires exit the loom.
*Consider using Delphi Weather Pack (or similar) connectors for chassis to body connections and where beneficial.
*End connectors supplied with many components are often not that great. Consider using adhesive heat shrink connectors instead. This helps keep the wires from pulling out of the connector and provides additional protection against corrosion and breakage.
*Grounding straps are your very good friend. Use them frequently and often. (Battery to frame, frame to engine, and engine to battery, a trifecta.) Make sure use a secure attachment method (bolts and lock washers), make clean connections and remove any paint/rust/grease/etc. Treat afterward to prevent rust. I use just a Thuin film of dielectric grease between the frame and connector, then spray with an antirust sealer/paint.
*Consider using relays for switches and circuits with a heavy current draw.

Most of this is not required to get things working. But it helps extend and maintain the reliability, life and quality of electrical systems.

[Mike.Bray]

General notes that have served me well for many many years of doing electrical work.

Groundliness is next to Godliness.

Don't ever let the smoke out of the wires.

When using crimp terminals, especially with automotive, use good quality solder heat shrink terminals like these. https://www.mcmaster.com/products/electrical-connectors/solder-loaded-heat-shrink-ring-terminals. And high quality crimpers like these (https://www.mcmaster.com/products/crimping-pliers/terminal-and-splice-ratchet-crimpers-7/) or these (https://www.mcmaster.com/products/crimping-pliers/terminal-and-splice-crimpers-6/).

Use Weather Pack connectors where useful or needed. And invest in the appropriate quality crimpers (about $100).

[Flip Smiley]

Regarding Question #2
Many years ago many MKII builders used dieted donor wire harnesses. My dieted Mustang harness provided ground wires at all 4 corners for lights.

[rich grsc]

Yes, you can use the frame as a ground.

[Bryan Rogers]

For big power/ground wires, I put the ring terminal in a vise with the wire terminal up, then I carefully heat it with a torch and start filling the terminal with solder. Once it's nearly full of liquid solder, I put the wire in and let it cool. Then I lay the connector flat on the top of the vise and hammer the terminal down a little bit.

[edwardb]

1. I've had no issue with installing the Coyote into a Roadster with the alternator installed. As can be seen from the picture below, the alternator is tucked in and not as wide as the heads. Which are a tighter fit. You do have to swing the steering column out of the way. As also seen in this picture. Not visible, and I know some have suggested otherwise, but I didn't have the starter in place. It's easy enough to add once the engine is in.

https://hosting.photobucket.com/albums/ab234/edwardb123/Factory%20Five%2020th%20Anniversary%20Mark%204%20R oadster/Coyote%20Engine/.highres/IMG_0466_zps08uru0sf.jpg?width=960&height=720&fit=bounds (https://hosting.photobucket.com/albums/ab234/edwardb123/Factory%20Five%2020th%20Anniversary%20Mark%204%20R oadster/Coyote%20Engine/.highres/IMG_0466_zps08uru0sf.jpg?width=960&height=720&fit=bounds)

2. Not 100% following your second question. The RF front harness has the grounds for the front lights (and cooling fan, and horns) already installed. Just use them. They're connected to the main ground to the chassis back at the fuse panel. Older RF harnesses had a weaker ground wiring setup and it was common to add grounds at the four corners. I did on a couple builds. You could still do that if you want. Just branch a wire off the grounds in the front harness. Gives another path. But I personally haven't found it necessary with the current version. Somewhat unrelated, but don't forget you also need engine grounds. Rock solid is especially important for EFI engines like the Coyote. I do two: One under one of the starter bolts to the chassis. A second on the other side from an unused threaded boss on the engine (there are several to choose from) to the chassis. Any chassis ground, as already mentioned, has to be to 100% cleaned bare metal. Remove powder coat, grease, etc. and make sure the ground lug is making full contact.

[mmklaxer]

1. I've had no issue with installing the Coyote into a Roadster with the alternator installed. As can be seen from the picture below, the alternator is tucked in and not as wide as the heads. Which are a tighter fit. You do have to swing the steering column out of the way. As also seen in this picture. Not visible, and I know some have suggested otherwise, but I didn't have the starter in place. It's easy enough to add once the engine is in.

https://hosting.photobucket.com/albums/ab234/edwardb123/Factory%20Five%2020th%20Anniversary%20Mark%204%20R oadster/Coyote%20Engine/.highres/IMG_0466_zps08uru0sf.jpg?width=960&height=720&fit=bounds (https://hosting.photobucket.com/albums/ab234/edwardb123/Factory%20Five%2020th%20Anniversary%20Mark%204%20R oadster/Coyote%20Engine/.highres/IMG_0466_zps08uru0sf.jpg?width=960&height=720&fit=bounds)

2. Not 100% following your second question. The RF front harness has the grounds for the front lights (and cooling fan, and horns) already installed. Just use them. They're connected to the main ground to the chassis back at the fuse panel. Older RF harnesses had a weaker ground wiring setup and it was common to add grounds at the four corners. I did on a couple builds. You could still do that if you want. Just branch a wire off the grounds in the front harness. Gives another path. But I personally haven't found it necessary with the current version. Somewhat unrelated, but don't forget you also need engine grounds. Rock solid is especially important for EFI engines like the Coyote. I do two: One under one of the starter bolts to the chassis. A second on the other side from an unused threaded boss on the engine (there are several to choose from) to the chassis. Any chassis ground, as already mentioned, has to be to 100% cleaned bare metal. Remove powder coat, grease, etc. and make sure the ground lug is making full contact.

Answered it perfectly, thanks. the ground question was regarding older build threads where people added grounds at the corners. good to know that the current harness is more robust.

[i.e.427]

Numerous Coyote installs and we've never removed the alternator on a crate engine.

As far as grounds go. We weld a stud in the front of the car to ground the engine, we weld a stud behind the dash to ground the chassis harness and all of the grounds behind the dash and we weld a ground stud at the battery location. All grounds go to a ground stud. We don't want a car coming back for a ground issue.

[BrewCityCobra]

Well this has been informative. I actually went out of my way to ground the headlights to the front of the chassis based on some photos I saw in build threads - Oops. I had no idea using the ground wires included in the harness were preferred over grounding to the frame itself. Good to know going forward.

[Fixit]

#1 - The Coyote will go in there with all accessories attached, but (isn't there always a "but") I had to remove the plug on the passenger side of the oil pan (Moroso). Believe it or not, that little protruberance was snagging me up. Take a look here (https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?27544-9365-and-the-quot-New-quot-40-Watt-Garage!&p=349898&viewfull=1#post349898)
A side note to #1, the exhaust header studs/bolts. You may want to take a look here (https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?27544-9365-and-the-quot-New-quot-40-Watt-Garage!&p=351955&viewfull=1#post351955)

#2 - Grounding. I'll fathom a guess that 99% of the automotive electrical issues posted on here are related to grounding. Everyone seems to forget about "the other half" of the circuit! Just remember that plastic doesn't conduct, paint doesn't conduct, powder coat doesn't conduct, oil & grease don't conduct, and wrapping bare wire around a screw-head and tightening does not constitute a "good ground".

[edwardb]

Well this has been informative. I actually went out of my way to ground the headlights to the front of the chassis based on some photos I saw in build threads - Oops. I had no idea using the ground wires included in the harness were preferred over grounding to the frame itself. Good to know going forward.

Adding grounds doesn't hurt a thing. Assuming you pigtailed the grounds you added for the headlights to the existing RF ground wires, you actually added redundancy to the entire harness. And that's a good thing. Hope it wasn't something I said that suggested harness grounds are preferred over ground to the frame. Ground is ground no matter where attached if to the frame and a good connection.

[rich grsc]

Anyone who has done a donor build, and stripped a Mustang for parts, know that all grounds used the body as the main ground source.

[RBachman]

Completely agree that body grounds are sufficient for older full steel vehicles without modern electronics susceptible to ground loop induced electromagnetic noise. But I'm not a fan of most conventional body grounds on vehicles with composite bodies, dissimilar metals in the construction, modern electronics, resto-mods, etc.. Body grounds like to induce ground loops, frequently suffer from long-term reliability, and cause problems with modern aftermarket electronics that were not a concern with older vehicles.