Dynoed my Gen1 Coyote Roadster

[Hacksaw84]

I got my car on the dyno last weekend at a local event. It put down 448 HP and 358 torque.

Its a Gen1 Coyote with Comp stage 3 cams, cobra jet intake manifold, twin 67mm throttle body, 6 inch velocity stack/MAF housing, 47 lb injectors, running e85, and tuned by Lund.

Here is the video:

https://youtu.be/V1DdaaWi164


180559 181143

[phileas_fogg]

That is so cool.

[Alan_C]

Sweet sound to say the least.

[Hacksaw84]

That is so cool.

Thanks. It was cool but I was a little nervous for some reason. All went well though.

[Hacksaw84]

Sweet sound to say the least.

Yeah I got several complements on how the coyote sounded. It always surprised me with how nice it sounds with the side pipes. Plus it's nice to know the power number too.

[Alan_C]

I can only hope my 2nd Gen Coyote in my current build sounds nearly as good. My build is a 1970 Mustang Mach 1 restomod with a completely different exhaust system.
I continue to participate here because there is far more builders hear using the Coyote than on my Mustang forums.

[Al_C]

I find it interesting that there is such a wide gap between your HP and Torque numbers. I would have expected a higher Torque value. I'm sure it has to do with the nature of the specific cams or other variables of which I know basically nothing! When I had my Gen II dyno'd it came out as 390 HP and 350 torque. That's with a tune, but stock components. I know that others that have higher HP numbers with stock components but different headers. I have the shorty headers which tend to be more restrictive.

In any event, it sounds great!

[Jeff Kleiner]

I find it interesting that there is such a wide gap between your HP and Torque numbers. I would have expected a higher Torque value. I'm sure it has to do with the nature of the specific cams or other variables of which I know basically nothing! When I had my Gen II dyno'd it came out as 390 HP and 350 torque. That's with a tune, but stock components. I know that others that have higher HP numbers with stock components but different headers. I have the shorty headers which tend to be more restrictive.

In any event, it sounds great!

Keep in mind Al, torque is measurable and for lack of a better term "real". Horsepower is simply a mathematical calculation:

HP=Torque X RPM/5252.

Take Michael's as an example. His maximum torque of 358 occurred at 5,540 RPM which equates to 377 HP at that speed--358 X 5,540/5252=377. When RPM was increased to 7,040 RPM torque fell a bit to approximately 335 but due to the increase in RPM calculates to 449 HP--335 X 7,040/5252=449.

If your car has a relatively flat torque curve like Michael's running it up to a higher RPM might have shown a larger HP number...but in the end it's all just math and doesn't make your car more powerful.

Side story along the same lines; back in the old muscle car days when the insurance companies were cracking down and raising rates some of the manufacturers tried to skirt around it and began under reporting outputs by advertising the horsepower not at their peak but rather at lower RPM. For example Chevrolet said that the L88 made 430 HP @ 5,200 which was true. What they didn't say was that peak power of >500 occurred at 6,500 RPM. Chrysler was equally guilty, stating that the 426 Hemi made 425 HP a laughable 5,000 RPM!

Cheers,
Jeff

[Jim1855]

And just to add to the confusion.

There's a wide range configurations and standard settings in the dyno software. Then the way that resistance is applied to the wheels in the case of a chassis dyno or flywheels in engine dynos. While it may look like apples to apples, there are a variety of apples and dynos.

Mustang and DynoJet are two big players in chassis dynos. The DynoJets are probably more popular perhaps due to less cost and higher power numbers. I doubt that there's an exact ratio between the two but it's probably in the 5-15% range with the Mustang reading lower.

A good dyno/tuning operator can minimize the differences run to run and day to day which effectively enhances the benefits of the tuning exercise. Short of having the two dynos sitting side by side and making comparisons of the same car, weather & tune on each it will be hard to build an actual comparison.

So your 400 might be my 350 or perhaps 450.

Jim

[rich grsc]

But Jeff, not many of us drive around at 6500RPM's all the time. :rolleyes: :p I'll take a nice flat torque line anytime.
Jim, so true....different day, different HP. So many people don't realize this.

[Hacksaw84]

I find it interesting that there is such a wide gap between your HP and Torque numbers. I would have expected a higher Torque value. I'm sure it has to do with the nature of the specific cams or other variables of which I know basically nothing! When I had my Gen II dyno'd it came out as 390 HP and 350 torque. That's with a tune, but stock components. I know that others that have higher HP numbers with stock components but different headers. I have the shorty headers which tend to be more restrictive.

In any event, it sounds great!

Yeah the Cobra Jet intake manifold trades off some low end torque for the high RPMs and HP. But in general the coyote is known to be relatively low on torque numbers.

[Hacksaw84]

But Jeff, not many of us drive around at 6500RPM's all the time. :rolleyes: :p I'll take a nice flat torque line anytime.
Jim, so true....different day, different HP. So many people don't realize this.

I dunno about all the time but those high RPMs are fun when you can play with them. Added the sheet to the post above with the curve.

[GFX2043mtu]

I’ve been tuning cars and bikes for a good number of years and I can say all dynamometers read differently. As Jim said the only common market trend is Mustang ones read low and Dynojets read high. They are only a tool to measure before and after comparisons and should be done so on a percentage basis. My 461ci 645 hp 655 ft/lb craft racing dyno certified motor only made 480 rwhp on a mustang dyno when fully tuned. And that was 60 hp more than it made out of the box from craft racing. I’m sure on a Dynojet it would make 550+ rwhp. So take it for what it is. They are a calibration tool and I prefer them over road tuning for obvious reasons. But the numbers are exactly that, a number. It’s like having five different length sticks marked with 10 even marks. Any of which can be used to see if something grew but none of which can directly compare their measurement to another stick. Beyond that they aren’t worth much. And one should be weary of numbers as any drum correction factor can be manipulated to make high or low numbers. I’ve done 180 hp race bikes that ran from so called 200+ hp bikes and the same is true for cars. I almost hate showing people numbers as they always have some internet number in there head and I often use equipment that reads low but in fact the car is faster then some so call internet car. The critical point is to make the combination run as efficiently as possible. Any combination will only make so much torque and run so smoothly. But if you want to feel good a usual safe bet is run a Dynojet or DYNOmite.

[AA-ron]

Love your car-- beautiful build!

[Hoooper]

Not many of us drive around making 400 lb ft at 2000 RPM all the time either. Trading more peak tq in a place you arent going to use it for more tq at higher RPM where you are going to use it just makes sense. Even with variable cam timing and lift there is only so far you can go on stock cams before flat torque curve is just code for less peak power.

[GFX2043mtu]

Mine makes over 500 ft/lbs at 3k and goes up from there, and I can assure you in second I can put it all the power my motor makes to the ground if applied correctly. Call it what you will I’m a big fan of of the hammer approach. But for the smaller displacement motors like the coyote you need to spin them up to make power no matter what cam or vvt system you have. With out boost that’s thats the only mathematical way to do it as there isn’t the displacement to make big torque. Like the gt350 motor I would trade some torque for hp and drive it accordingly knowing it needs to be up in the RPM band to make power. My s1000rr m race bike doest start pulling hard till 8k - 14k rpm and I track it accordingly knowing this. But I do appreciate the big torque Ducati’s as it’s hard to pull on one coming off a corner. My point is it’s all irrelevant as long as the car is set up for it and driven accordingly. Beyond that is like ice cream flavors some like vanilla some like chocolate.

[Hacksaw84]

I’ve been tuning cars and bikes for a good number of years and I can say all dynamometers read differently. As Jim said the only common market trend is Mustang ones read low and Dynojets read high. They are only a tool to measure before and after comparisons and should be done so on a percentage basis. My 461ci 645 hp 655 ft/lb craft racing dyno certified motor only made 480 rwhp on a mustang dyno when fully tuned. And that was 60 hp more than it made out of the box from craft racing. I’m sure on a Dynojet it would make 550+ rwhp. So take it for what it is. They are a calibration tool and I prefer them over road tuning for obvious reasons. But the numbers are exactly that, a number. It’s like having five different length sticks marked with 10 even marks. Any of which can be used to see if something grew but none of which can directly compare their measurement to another stick. Beyond that they aren’t worth much. And one should be weary of numbers as any drum correction factor can be manipulated to make high or low numbers. I’ve done 180 hp race bikes that ran from so called 200+ hp bikes and the same is true for cars. I almost hate showing people numbers as they always have some internet number in there head and I often use equipment that reads low but in fact the car is faster then some so call internet car. The critical point is to make the combination run as efficiently as possible. Any combination will only make so much torque and run so smoothly. But if you want to feel good a usual safe bet is run a Dynojet or DYNOmite.

Yeah I know the dyno's are just tools with lots of variables. Just was for fun mostly. Car runs well, keeps up with some fast cars and is a lot of fun to drive.

I am willing to throw a blower on it if you are offering btw :cool:

[Hacksaw84]

Love your car-- beautiful build!

Thank you, very much appreciate it.

[GFX2043mtu]

Lol, I’m currently doing the blower option myself. Now my goal knowing the car and how it acts now is now is to make around mid 700’s on the same mustang dyno (6-8lbs). That’s probably going to make it traction limited in the first 3 gears due the torque from having 461 ci’s. I encourage you when you get used to the car and wanting more go the blower route. The coyote makes respectable torque and good power with low boost (6-7 lbs). Sure would make it fun.

[Hacksaw84]

Lol, I’m currently doing the blower option myself. Now my goal knowing the car and how it acts now is now is to make around mid 700’s on the same mustang dyno (6-8lbs). That’s probably going to make it traction limited in the first 3 gears due the torque from having 461 ci’s. I encourage you when you get used to the car and wanting more go the blower route. The coyote makes respectable torque and good power with low boost (6-7 lbs). Sure would make it fun.

Yeah I have debated it and I look from time to time. I was thinking a Roush take off kit where somebody upgraded would be a good deal. Seeing as how I don't really want to add a bunch of boost like you said.

[rx7922]

man, i love your car. its exactly what i want to do for mine, any tips or tricks?