General tech question for the masses

[mikeinatlanta]

This issue is on a bike, but would apply to anything gas powered.

Was siphoning the gas out of my Motus to take the tank off for access. My siphon hose is clear, and I noticed a fibrous material in the gas. Grabbed a coffee filter and captured some of it. It is a white fibrous very fine material ranging from very short to 1/2" long. It breaks down completely when handled, so not fiberglass.

I got a total of maybe 2cc of this material out of a five gallon tank. It's definitely not the tank material or filter breaking down. There was some of it in the pump inlet but the filter was clean. I'm cleaning the tank, replacing the filter, and moving on, but would sure like to know what happened.

I put this stuff under the microscope and I'm pretty sure it's asbestos.

How the heck would asbestos get into gas? Never hear of such a thing. If not asbestos, what else could it be? Lots of varied knowledge here and curious what you guys think.

Three photos are attached. Some of it in the tank, under a microscope at 150X and again at 1200x.

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[JohnK]

If the last photo is your tank, it looks like it's a plastic material of some sort. Is it possible that the tank material is impregnated with whatever that is, and is somehow degrading and releasing it into the gas? Can you scratch the inside of the tank with a fingernail and see if you get more of those fibers off?

[mikeinatlanta]

If the last photo is your tank, it looks like it's a plastic material of some sort. Is it possible that the tank material is impregnated with whatever that is, and is somehow degrading and releasing it into the gas? Can you scratch the inside of the tank with a fingernail and see if you get more of those fibers off?

That was the first thought. Definitely not the tank. This stuff wipes right off and the plastic is perfect under it. Bike is only four years old. I have the exact same tank on a six year old Motus and it's perfect.

[drewr]

If it breaks down very easily, it is possibly a crystal of some sort. Like maybe a dissolved shellac that crystalized. Gasket shellac? dissolved plastic? Paint? Gasket material? Impurities in the gas? Fuel stabilizer? Asbestos would not break down easily.

[Al_C]

Did you get the gas from a pump or a storage can? I'm wondering if it's impurities in the gas station's tank or the refining / distribution processes. As John and Drew suggest, I believe it's something that came off a prior storage medium.

I'm also wondering if you have access to a lab that could analyze it. I'm guessing you might since you have access to a pretty powerful microscope. I don't know if it's important enough to find out as that could prove costly, but it would be interesting to know.

[mikeinatlanta]

I'm about 95% certain it's asbestos. It had to have come from the fuel but I know of nothing in the infrastructure that uses asbestos, or anything remotely resembling asbestos. The tank is only four years old and has never been fed anything but top tier or race gas.
Here are two photos from the internet. One is natural asbestos fibers and the other is under a microscope. Compare them to the photos I took.

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[Larry J W]

Once completely dry will it burn? Plastic will burn, glass or asbestos obviously will not.
Larry

[mikeinatlanta]

Once completely dry will it burn? Plastic will burn, glass or asbestos obviously will not.
Larry

Well don't I feel stupid for not thinking to test that. So I tested the remaining sample and some glass fiber. Both readily melt (almost instant) with a basic lighter flame. A little internet searching shows that a lighter burns way hotter than is needed to melt either. Nothing conclusive with the burn test.

[Larry J W]

You might get a little more information by putting it on a hot plate or metal and monitor temperature to see what the melting point is. Most polyesters will have a tar residue.

[JohnK]

Is the fuel filter close enough to the tank that it could have broken down and backflushed particles back into the tank? Is there a sock on the fuel outlet that could be breaking down? It seems to me that it has to be something in the fuel flow path that's deteriorated and releasing those particles.

[lance corsi]

Could this be the beginning formation of corrosion? Waiting to clog your idle jet?

[mikeinatlanta]

You might get a little more information by putting it on a hot plate or metal and monitor temperature to see what the melting point is. Most polyesters will have a tar residue. That was the last of my material. Would try that if I had any more. Didn't realize that that a lighter flame was that hot until too late.


Is the fuel filter close enough to the tank that it could have broken down and backflushed particles back into the tank? Is there a sock on the fuel outlet that could be breaking down? It seems to me that it has to be something in the fuel flow path that's deteriorated and releasing those particles. Fuel filter is a Mahle. Cut it open with the lathe and it was perfect. It's a return type system with the return being post filter, so a broken down filter could have been an issue. That leaves the brass inlet screen, bosch pump, and about 6" of tubing. The rest is all billet aluminum.


Could this be the beginning formation of corrosion? Waiting to clog your idle jet? Plastic tank, pump, billet aluminum housing and plate so noting to corrode.

[JohnK]

I have no idea if gas stations have filters in their delivery system, but it's possible the gas was contaminated when you put it in the tank. If you filled up recently, perhaps go back to that same station and pump a bit of gas into a glass container and see if it has similar particles.