Is there a quieter exhaust available for the roadster? [Archive]

Skip

11-28-2020, 11:05 AM

I’ve been intending to ask this very question. My MkIII Roadster has been on the road over 10 years now and the exhaust is just straight pipes. Some of the old threads mention products no longer available. I’d like to replace the “muffler” portion of the side pipes rather than a $1,000 + full replacement. Any ideas are appreciated.

rich grsc

11-28-2020, 01:55 PM

http://www.classicchambered.com/classic/products.html#cobra

Skip

11-28-2020, 03:35 PM

I explored Classic Chambered's website. It looks like the muffler for a Cobra replica has a perforated core in a slight spiral shape which is what my FFR sidepipes have. The website also contains a statement: "COBRAPACKS are typically louder than stock mufflers, they may exceed legal noise levels where enforced."

rich grsc

11-28-2020, 04:08 PM

They have two types, one with packing, and one without

Alley Oop

11-28-2020, 04:51 PM

Thanks for the info guys.

cfriedman67

11-28-2020, 05:41 PM

I used the classic chambered exhaust. Nothing scientific but it definitely sounds quieter to me.

KDubU

11-28-2020, 05:43 PM

Gas-N’s are “quieter” but truly they just have a deeper rumble rather than the bark of the FF ones.

Erik W. Treves

11-28-2020, 06:57 PM

classic chambered exhaust... make sure you put them in the correct way as well - they are quieter with "cups" facing the exhaust.. while you are there if you weld the tips so they are facing more downward like 30* - that too will help - in the end you ARE sitting right next to the opening.... the classic chambered exhaust mufflers do take that "bite" out of the sound note... they are absolutely quieter and flow better than the stock FFR pipes.

cnutting

11-28-2020, 06:58 PM

I used the Boig Quiet-er pipes on my 289. Knocked it down about 10dB across the board.

AdamIsAdam

11-28-2020, 11:36 PM

I have a set of these touring pipes on order from Georgie at Gas-N. Note that he makes two different versions. I can't wait because my FFR are at 95dB at idle and easily go over 105 with some revs. It sounds great when you want to absolutely draw attention but I have to wear ear plugs most of the time. I'm hoping to be able to enjoy the car more with these...

https://youtu.be/pbY8D3oWf44

rich grsc

11-29-2020, 09:19 AM

Gas-N’s are “quieter” but truly they just have a deeper rumble rather than the bark of the FF ones.
These sound really nice, but they fit worse than FFR's pipes. I've seen three sets, and everyone fit terrible. They all had to have multiple wedged spacers to get them aligned even close to straight on the car.

AdamIsAdam

11-29-2020, 10:37 AM

Interesting. I know they sell those spacers/wedges. Fortunately for me the shop is local and Georgie said he'll install them for me to get it right. But you're right, my current pipes fit perfectly and have no spacers at all. How does that happen on a true 4 into 1 setup?

138522

138523

Bob Cowan

11-29-2020, 01:17 PM

A few years ago I cut off the FFR mufflers and welded in Classic Chamber Exhaust cobra packs. I used a longer muffler than FFR does, too. That not only improved the sound, but it moved the tip of the turn out closer to rear fender flare. Matching the body lines closer makes for a much smoother transition. I also pointed the tips down 45*.

I also notice that the FFR side pipes were not parallel to the body lines. They tended to stick out a bit further in the back. Welding in new mufflers allowed me to tuck them in better, and be parallel to the body. I was surprised at how much better the profile of the car was. It's one of those things that makes the car look just slightly off, but you can't really identify why until you fix it. Now it really stands out to me when I see it on other cars.

Huge improvement! It certainly made the car quieter. My wife/crew chief said she couldn't hear the car past turn 3, and didn't hear again until turn 8. If it makes a race car quieter at full throttle, you know it's going to make a street car quieter.

Also, the sound from the stock FFR muffler is a bit harsh; kinda "blatty". The new exhaust was smoother, with a very nice rumble.

One of the changes I plan to make on my Backdraft is longer Classic mufflers. But, I won't point the tips down that much. 45* was too far, and tended to kick up way too much dirt and dust in parking lots. I'll try to get them about 25-30* instead.

Hacksaw84

11-30-2020, 11:57 AM

I thought this video by Brian Klecker on the Gas-N Pipes was interesting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pbY8D3oWf44

NAZ

11-30-2020, 12:24 PM

That is night and day difference from my exhaust. My fuel pump is louder than even the standard FFR exhaust. Reminds me of that saying "if it's too loud you're too old".

But then again, I have severe hearing loss. Between small arms and machine gun fire, explosive ordnance, race cars & motorcycles, 45-years of competitive shooting, and three decades working in factories full of punch presses -- it's a wonder I can still hear anything anyway.

Good luck in your quest for silence and remember, damping the sound also affects performance and not all mufflers are the same. https://www.dragzine.com/tech-stories/exhaust/understanding-muffler-design-and-sound-absorption-strategies/

NiceGuyEddie

11-30-2020, 12:51 PM

What ever happened to the round, removable plates that install with a single bolt from the backside of the sidepipe? I think they were from Whitby. Seen them in real life once.

AdamIsAdam

11-30-2020, 03:40 PM

This video talks about augers and GGB inserts:
https://youtu.be/ZZJ1oi9jJxc

by the way, this was my dB reading inside the car holding my phone in front of me using a dB app... 100dB AT IDLE! Driving at 2000 RPM was about 107dB.

138580

Fman

12-01-2020, 12:48 AM

These sound really nice, but they fit worse than FFR's pipes. I've seen three sets, and everyone fit terrible. They all had to have multiple wedged spacers to get them aligned even close to straight on the car.

My painter recommended Levy motor mounts just for this reason especially with a Dart block and FFR headers, apparently the energy suspension mounts are higher causing issues with the Gas 'n pipe fitment. Time will tell but I am optimistic after 800+ Cobras he will get them aligned properly.

KDubU

12-01-2020, 07:37 AM

These sound really nice, but they fit worse than FFR's pipes. I've seen three sets, and everyone fit terrible. They all had to have multiple wedged spacers to get them aligned even close to straight on the car.

So what? Who is looking there anyways and the wedges work great. If you have not purchased and installed them yourself, then it is a bit difficult to truly know how great they sound and look.

rich grsc

12-01-2020, 09:31 AM

So what? Who is looking there anyways and the wedges work great. If you have not purchased and installed them yourself, then it is a bit difficult to truly know how great they sound and look.
So What??? Well after you spend a fair amount of $$$$ for these, then you spend more to buy a bunch of wedges to make them look 'right' on the car. I have 3 friends using them, so I know how they sound, but they look lousy on the cars. You have to wedge one side or the other to get them parallel to car, then one side sets further away from the body. For what they cost, they should be welded straight, and not require you buy a $100 worth of shims to fit correctly. One of my friends sent the first set back they fit so bad, and another is considering something different as well.

AdamIsAdam

12-01-2020, 11:22 AM

I can see how the variables are infinite: engine, motor mounts, heads, headers, even the frame and body construction & assembly. This is why FFR now uses that round adjustable connector. In one of their videos Dave Smith talks about how many problems people have fitting the FFR side pipes which is why they started selling that round adjustable part.

All I'll say is that I'm having mine installed by Georgie himself. He's literally done thousands of them and I know they will be done right. I look forward to posting results in about 4-6 weeks.

Jeff Kleiner

12-01-2020, 12:22 PM

So what? Who is looking there anyways and the wedges work great...

Well...I’ll tell you what the deal is with wedges because I’ve been down this road a bunch of times. Each time you have to add one to adjust the fit (and sometimes it takes 2 or a wedge and spacer) the header to sidepipe flange moves outwards at least 3/8”. Not generally a problem on the passenger side but on the driver’s side this usually puts the top of the flange beyond the body (this is true with both the FFR headers as well as the ones from a well known vendor) which in turn means that the body cutout has to be made large at the top. I’ve told customers that I really don’t want to make the cutout oversized but with the combination of parts they provided me with I’ve had no choice and my hands have been tied.

So there’s your “So what”

Jeff

OSU Cowboy

12-01-2020, 12:25 PM

I was really fortunate to get some of the Flowmaster double-wall stainless mufflers before they were discontinued. Ordered them immediately after first engine start when the FFR's made my ears bleed.

Papa

12-01-2020, 12:27 PM

For those scratching their head about Jeff's comments, here is what it looks like:

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=123263&d=1582751194

KDubU

12-01-2020, 01:08 PM

Well...I’ll tell you what the deal is with wedges because I’ve been down this road a bunch of times. Each time you have to add one to adjust the fit (and sometimes it takes 2 or a wedge and spacer) the header to sidepipe flange moves outwards at least 3/8”. Not generally a problem on the passenger side but on the driver’s side this usually puts the top of the flange beyond the body (this is true with both the FFR headers as well as the ones from a well known vendor) which in turn means that the body cutout has to be made large at the top. I’ve told customers that I really don’t want to make the cutout oversized but with the combination of parts they provided me with I’ve had no choice and my hands have been tied.

So there’s your “So what”

Jeff

Well Jeff I can only speak to my experience and this was not a major issue at all. Don’t know the drivetrain combos involved but I was able to use the wedges and Ron was able to make the cutouts symmetrical or as close as the eye can see. Besides, that is what we pay body guys for right? To make things look good. ;)

KDubU

12-01-2020, 02:08 PM

AdamIsAdam

12-01-2020, 02:13 PM

Here is a pic of my roadster with Gas-N’s and you will see my cutout on drivers side is not rounded at the top like Papa’s. The fact is these bodies are all a bit different and that impacts the fitment as well.

138613

Love the color and the wheel/tire combo. I wish mine had 15's, but at least I don't have 18's. Yuk.

cobrajj

12-01-2020, 06:50 PM

Here's what I installed from Jeff at Whitby's. It reduced the volume and no more setting off alarms.

138619

138620

138621

toadster

12-02-2020, 04:10 PM

What ever happened to the round, removable plates that install with a single bolt from the backside of the sidepipe? I think they were from Whitby. Seen them in real life once.

Supertrapp?

NAZ

12-02-2020, 05:07 PM

Supertrapp is a great choice if you can make them fit as they are not designed to use with a turnout. But if you can make them work, they are easily tunable by adding or subtracting discs. My latest mufflers are 3.5” Supertrapp and I added perforated cones and reversion chambers just before the Supertrapp discs. I run mine 150% open which is loud but I could easily quite them down by removing half the discs. The Supertrapp design allows you to control sound and minimize power robbing backpressure. They come in a variety of sizes and configuration. https://supertrapp.com/amfinder/?find=universal-universal--all-auto-10868

138651138652
(https://supertrapp.com/amfinder/?find=universal-universal--all-auto-10868)

Bob Cowan

12-02-2020, 06:15 PM

What ever happened to the round, removable plates that install with a single bolt from the backside of the sidepipe? I think they were from Whitby. Seen them in real life once.

Supertrapp?

I remember that. It's not a Supertrapp muffler. It was a butterfly valve that you made yourself, and bolted in to the pipe. Some folks used a large washer for this.

Supertrapp is a great choice if you can make them fit as they are not designed to use with a turnout. But if you can make them work, they are easily tunable by adding or subtracting discs. My latest mufflers are 3.5” Supertrapp and I added perforated cones and reversion chambers just before the Supertrapp discs. I run mine 150% open which is loud but I could easily quite them down by removing half the discs. The Supertrapp design allows you to control sound and minimize power robbing backpressure. They come in a variety of sizes and configuration. https://supertrapp.com/amfinder/?find=universal-universal--all-auto-10868

138651138652
(https://supertrapp.com/amfinder/?find=universal-universal--all-auto-10868)

I used one of those perforated cones once. I welded it in to the trumpet exhaust of a turbocharged Harley. Quieted it down a little bit, but not much. I still got a noise ticket.

Papa

12-02-2020, 06:24 PM

I remember that. It's not a Supertrapp muffler. It was a butterfly valve that you made yourself, and bolted in to the pipe. Some folks used a large washer for this.

I used one of those perforated cones once. I welded it in to the trumpet exhaust of a turbocharged Harley. Quieted it down a little bit, but not much. I still got a noise ticket.

Bob,

Who owns the "nearly silent" Cobra in MHCC? I was shocked at how quiet that car is. I think it is the gray one on the far right of this photo:

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=135894&d=1601778787

Dave

NiceGuyEddie

12-02-2020, 06:35 PM

Here's what I installed from Jeff at Whitby's. It reduced the volume and no more setting off alarms.

138619

138620

138621

The one I saw from Whitby's was just like this and installed like this, except it was a single plate that looked more like a mason jar cap.

VAHokie

12-02-2020, 09:31 PM

I have Boig's quiet pipes and have only just completed first start, but comparing them to the FFR pipes and they are a little more subdued in comparison.

Bob Cowan

12-02-2020, 10:24 PM

Bob,

Who owns the "nearly silent" Cobra in MHCC? I was shocked at how quiet that car is. I think it is the gray one on the far right of this photo:

Dave

TBH, I don't exactly remember who was driving that, but I think it was Gus Wade. That's a pretty common color combo for a Superformance. That's Gus in the back ground wearing a large straw hat, near the rear tire of the red Cobra.

IIRC correctly, the car has a fairly stock 351W, and stock Superformance pipes. But don't quote me on that.

https://i.imgur.com/R0TTUjb.png

Papa

12-02-2020, 11:09 PM

TBH, I don't exactly remember who was driving that, but I think it was Gus Wade. That's a pretty common color combo for a Superformance. That's Gus in the back ground wearing a large straw hat, near the rear tire of the red Cobra.

IIRC correctly, the car has a fairly stock 351W, and stock Superformance pipes. But don't quote me on that.

https://i.imgur.com/R0TTUjb.png

I need to pay more attention to names, which I'm horrible with. I just recall there was one car on that drive that was really quiet, at least at low RPM.

Thanks,
Dave

AdamIsAdam

12-03-2020, 09:18 AM

I need to pay more attention to names, which I'm horrible with. I just recall there was one car on that drive that was really quiet, at least at low RPM.

Thanks,
Dave

Yea, I've always been bad with names, especially on forums where there are TWO names to remember (handles and names)! Do you know how long it took me to realize that you were the person who not only sold me the sun visors when I first got my car? lol But what I did not forget was what a stand up guy you were (are) when the hardware included was incorrect (not your fault, FFR's fault) and you immediately contacted FFR and had the correct parts sent to me. That's why I love the automotive communities.

Here's one more cool forum story to brighten your day: I was removing the heads on my GTO to send them out for a rebuild. Forum folks suggested different methods of doing this without breaking your back when a forum member mentioned he made a simple tool, a handle made from some metal that bolts to the heads making it SUPER easy to remove those 50lb hunks of metal without scratching my pristine paint. He promptly put them in the mail to me for use and return when done. No strings attached. Hell, he wouldn't even take money for shipping. (btw, the install job using these simple handles was SUPER easy, making aligning the heads and not destroying the gaskets while reaching all the way over the fender easy.)

But I digress. Sorry. Oh, btw, the burgundy Cobra in the above pic is sweet. Post more pics!

Paul2STL

12-03-2020, 01:04 PM

These sound really nice, but they fit worse than FFR's pipes. I've seen three sets, and everyone fit terrible. They all had to have multiple wedged spacers to get them aligned even close to straight on the car.

I would have to disagree with you Rich. I have a Coyote with FFR headers with Gas N Pipes, they fit great and sound awesome. Of course every combo is different and there is adjustability in engine mounts and the shape of the body cut outs. And that is first hand experience but with the new ball flanges from FFR fitment really shouldn't be a issue with newer builds. I don't have the newer ball flanges BTW.

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=102366&d=1550537411

rich grsc

12-03-2020, 02:57 PM

You can disagree all you want. I'll just say you got lucky and received a set that was welded straight. I have seen three sets on members in our club, they do not fit well. It is very obvious they got welded up crooked, one set was returned it fit so poorly. They sound very good, just the three I have personally looked at, has convinced me to not buy a set.