Front-sump or Rear-sump preferred on Ford-Racing 427W in 33 HotRod?

[bradle10]

I'm about to order a Ford-Racing 427W. Does anyone know know which oil pan (Front-sump or Rear-sump) will work best in a 33 Hot Rod?

For extra credit:
Do the FFR 289/302 Shorty Headers fit the "351"W block with Ford's "Z-code" aluminum heads?

Any recommendations for cowl-mounted windshield washers?

Any help at all may prevent expensive trial & error research.
Thanx,
Bob

[stang_killer]

I have 351W in mine. I went with set of BBK shorty headers. They hook up just fine to FFR pipes. You can probably do either front or rear sump pan. I am runnining rear sump canton pan. The front is tight on the cross braces on frame but clears ok. Also are you planning on power steering? That will make a difference. you may have to modify pan to clear.

[Brian Z]

You can run a front or rear sump oil pan in the 33'. The pan should not be deeper than the stock oil pan depth. The 351 oil pan will not allow you to use the power steering option without modification. The "Z" heads require special headers.

Best regards,

[mike forte]

Hi Bob,
About a year ago I sold a 427-W engine package & TKO-600 with a front sump oil pan. The customer informed to me the front sump did NOT fit when he was assembling his car. I then sent him a complete rear sump oil pan to convert his engine to rear sump.
I sell the BBK or MAC headers for this combo with good results.
If you still haven't ordered a 427-W, I can dropship it to you freight free and sales tax free. I also have everything in stock to finish assemble it to turnkey with better pricing or at least competitive to mail order.
Mike Forte
508 875 0016

[DonMc]

I ordered the Ford Racing Product 427W racing engine from Mike Forte, and had him install the front dress, intake, PJIII for my '33, as he has a really good reputation on this and the other forum. When I went to install the engine, the pan WILL NOT clear the front cross brace, there is at least 2-3" of interference. To Mike's credit, he quickly dropped shipped a rear sump pan, a rear sump oil pick up, gaskets and sealant.

The ceramic coated header part number for this engine is M-9430 Z 7993C, these are what was used on my engine with the Z heads.

I see that there are others here saying that a front pan will clear, but I can tell you that the front sump supplied from Ford WILL NOT work, go with the rear sump and it glides right in.

As a side note, I also had Forte perform a dyno on the engine, as I wanted everything set up, checked out and ready to go. Long story miserable, the engine was passing so much oil after I installed it that it was literally dripping out the rear exhaust, not to mention the smoking. I had to pull the engine, crate it up and sent it back to Ford where the valve guides/seals were replaced. I'm was truly disappointed with both having to deal with the incorrect pan being ordered on the engine and this oil issue that should have been identified before sending the engine to me!:(5624562556265627

[Striptease]

Hello DonMc--long time no see. You never reported back to me on how you got your engine stuffed under the hood--how about an update? Regarding the front/rear sump clearance problem, I heeded your advice (complete with pictures) that the front sump won't clear. Yet others (including Brian with FF) say either will work. Is it possible that the confusion comes from the fact that the crate engines from Ford Racing have an oversize oil pan/sump that is kind of square? Maybe other sump configurations will clear either way and that explains it.
Regarding Mike Forte, I'm surprised he didn't discover your oil leak problem when he had your engine on the dyno. He contacted me a few months back as he did bradle10 in this thread and gave me a price for a Ford crate along with distributor, intake, etc. and I asked him for a breakdown on precisely what he was including and itemized prices and never heard back from him. I was uneasy and dropped it with him after that; does he still enjoy a good reputation with you? Other on-line drop shippers discount the 302/363 I'm going to buy a few hundred bucks and I became suspicious when he wouldn't itemize what he was including in the package deal he was offering along with itemized prices.

[DonMc]

Hey Striptease, I have the Victor Jr intake with the PJIII, using the Ford air breather filter and had to use the hood from FFR that has the "bulge" in it to get it all to clear. Other than that, it fit with no problems. I do think that there are different styles of oil pans, and some different configurations may fit, but for sure the pan that Ford installs on this crate engine has the large square portion attached to give it a 7 quart oil capacity.

Regarding Forte, probably if a client was buying locally and could handle issues in person, it may would be beneficial, however, if you live away from his shop in a different state as I do, I feel I could have gotten at least the same, or maybe even better, response from any of the mail order companies (Summit, Jegs, etc). With my engine issues, I ended up handling the entire issue with Ford warranty myself, no real assistance from Mike. I also purchased my Quicktime bellhousing from him, the starter bolts had been machined incorrectly and the bell housing needed to be replaced. While initially Mike was apologetic and offered help, when I called for assistance with the return, I was told by a person at his location that it was my problem and I needed to handle this directly Quicktime that it was my problem, again I see absolutely no advantage not to order this stuff directly from one of the mail order firms. After getting the response from his place that it was my problem, that ended any potential future business from me, and I don't recommend him.

I'm sure there will be many who come to Mike's defense, and as I noted earlier, I gave him my business because of his reputation here, but wanted to share my experiance for others to consider when making the purchase decision.

[Striptease]

Thanks DonMc. Mike Forte quoted a crate engine and a package of other parts to me and I was ready to pull the trigger with him since he seemed to support FF builds but changed my mind when he wouldn't tell me exactly what he was including in the package. fordracingparts.com discounts the 363 a few hundred anyway; not a lot on a $8,500 engine but at least they answer my questions. I'll post more on the oil pan question after I drop the rear sump Ford 363 into the frame. Post some pictures if you're done with paint and body work on your build.