Replacing Roadster Rag Joint

[SonofaRoadster]

Hello! First-time poster, here:
I've got a mk4 Roadster that needs a new rag joint. I ordered a kit but the diagram is confusing and I'm not sure I have all the parts I need. I've attached photos to illustrate.

I have some experience with old cars (I also own a '61 Falcon) but am by no means an expert mechanic. I know this should be a pretty straight forward endeavor, but given how crucial it is to, you know, survival, I'd love some advice.

I did not build this car — I inherited it from my father when he passed a few years ago. Just want to get it road worthy/safe — and I can't think of a better way to stay socially-distant than to cruise down a country road in this beast!

Any info would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks!

[David Hodgkins]

Welcome to the forum!

I've never seen a rag joint. Looks like it connects the steering rack to the steering shaft. Is that correct? Is this a donor build? I see you used the mustang lower control arms...Do you know what "Mark" the car is? If not, do you know when it was manufactured? This info may help with recommendations for replacement.

BTW I upgraded your account to get rid of all the newbie restrictions; feel free to update your profile and use the Pic gallery, if you are so inclined. Here's a link on using the gallery:
https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?18962-How-to-use-the-Image-Gallery-to-embed-pictures-in-posts

:)

[edwardb]

It's a little hard to tell from your pictures. But think what I'm seeing is the front X-frame. And looks like the tubing is square vs. round. That would mean it's not a Mk4. That plus the patina is appears a little old. To the best of my knowledge, Factory Five hasn't used a rag joint on the steering column for a long time. Well before my involvement. I'd recommend upgrading to a universal joint which is what they've been using for some time.

[rich grsc]

Not a Mk4. The instructions are pretty straight forward

[Jeff Kleiner]

Rag joints haven’t been used since the Mk2 days.

Jeff

[Badfish]

Welcome, and glad to see you keeping the car in the family. Here’s what I used on my MKII, rather than the rag joint: https://www.breezeautomotive.com/shop/lower-universal-steering-shaft-for-manual-rack/

[David Williamson]

I have a 16 year old Mkll that was a Mustang donnor build and the rag joint looks just like what you have (but intact) If I were you I would replace it with the "U" joint system from Breeze. In the old days the cars without power steering took out the rag joints, mine has power steering so it works OK. It's great you are getting it back on the road.
David W

[weendoggy]

Agree with above. Just replaced an owners MKII "rag joint" (he didn't know why the steering was sloppy) with a Flaming River replacement kit. If you have a PS rack, it is a 36 spline on that end of the u-joint.

[SonofaRoadster]

Thanks for the replies! I don't know how to reply individually, so I'll lump my questions here:

Okay, so looks like it's a mkII, not mkIV. Good to know. Like I said, I'm just gleaning what I can from what my dad left behind. No Chilton's for this thing, as you know!

@David W., are you suggesting the same part that Badfish linked to? Anything I should know about installation? Looks probably even more straight forward than the rag joint, but I've never messed around with steering on any car, so I don't know what I don't know.

@weendoggy, a Flaming River RAG JOINT replacement, not U-Joint, correct? Which do you suggest? No power steering. Is the Flaming River installation easy to understand? I'm no engineer/mechanic, but I do have a few good brain cells and I can't make head nor tails of the diagram that came with the kit I bought!

Thanks again!

[SonofaRoadster]

Can anyone see my previous reply? I definitely posted it, but don't see it now.

At the risk of repeating myself:

Thanks for the replies! mk2, not mk4 — got it.

@David W, you mean the same part Badfish linked to?

@weendoggy, you're talking about a new rag joint, not u-joint, correct?

Thanks!

[Rdone585]

I never installed the rag joint in my MK2, used the Flaming River kit already identified. Nobody I know that has built a FFR has used one.

[luvaz]

Welcome to the forum!

So the rag joint replacement is pretty straightforward. Simply think about it this way- say you are looking down the steering shaft at the rag joint. The end coming from the steering wheel should be 90 degrees from the other end that is attached to the steering rack. So if one is vertical, make the other one horizontal. The holes on the new rag joint will now line up with the steering system holes.

Others have mentioned replacing the rag joint and it is a good idea, but I noticed you already have the replacement rag joint and will resist the temptation to spend your money, LOL.

HTH,
Will

[SonofaRoadster]

Thanks, luvaz! That makes perfect sense. The Flaming River kits appear pre-assembled and the one I got was separate parts and seemingly incomplete, so I think getting the wrong part might have been the initial main problem. I don't mind spending money, just don't want to waste (more of) it!

Since it sounds like buying another part is in the cards: Why is there seemingly a strong preference with you all to go with the u-joint over a rag joint replacement?

Thanks!

[Rdone585]

The rag joint is in the mustang to smooth out some of the steering experience, or at least that was the way it was explained to me. With our cars it can make the steering feel a little sloppy. The u-joint makes the steering feel more firm and assertive. Assertive steering is one of the things you might expect in a performance car.

[SonofaRoadster]

Badfish,
Given the pics I posted, would this be everything I need to swap it out?
Thanks!

[Badfish]

It’s been a while, but I think the Breeze unit is all you need, replaces everything from the shaft to the rack. Note there is different part number for the manual and power racks. Call Mark at Breeze, he will take care of you.

[Papa]

If I were repairing a steering issue and could upgrade to a more modern system, I would go that route. Here are a couple of pics of what the newer setup looks like:

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=84525&d=1524419877

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=84523&d=1524419859

Like you said in an earlier post, you really don't want to guess with something as critical as steering.

Dave

[SonofaRoadster]

Thanks for the advice, everybody! Very much appreciated.

I'll talk to Mark at Breeze, but that manual kit seems to be the way to go.

[CraigS]

I know the rag joint isn't the ultimate best but it will work just fine. Since you already own it, I'd install it and think about upgrading later.