Sniper EFI fuel pump, regulator, lines - Breeze setup - Edelbrock pro flo 4?

[Fman]

I am beginning to get my Sniper EFI fuel system ordered up. I am considering going with the Breeze setup linked below along with the Breeze 255 LPH fuel pump. I like how the return line comes off the regulator eliminating a long run to the sniper which makes it only necessary to have one long fuel line ran into the Sniper.

Has anyone here used this system? Would be great to hear feedback on this. I really like Mark, his products seem to be well made and he is always willing to answer his phone to help you out.

https://www.breezeautomotive.com/shop/fuel-filter-regulator-and-single-line-kit-for-sniper-in-roadster-remote-mount/

https://www.breezeautomotive.com/shop/255-lph-in-tank-fuel-pump-assembly-with-3-8-outlet/

https://www.breezeautomotive.com/shop/fuel-line-assembly-efi-pump-to-filter-3-8-3-8-quick-connect/

https://www.breezeautomotive.com/shop/fuel-line-assembly-gm-filter-regulator-to-breeze-high-flow-fuel-return/

[TMartinLVNV]

Mark's products at Breeze are great. I have ordered quite a bit from him and have been happy with every purchase. However...

Holley recommends a 3/8" return line in their installation instructions. Also, Holley has the regulator in their throttle body and is set up to have the return line also coming from the throttle body.

I don't know how it would work to regulate the fuel pressure externally then have the return line going back to the tank when the Holley was not designed to be operated that way.

Running one long line versus two long lines is not really a big deal IMHO. It is just a matter of running two clamps instead of one to mount the lines along the frame. There is plenty of room.

[BradCraig]

Mark's products at Breeze are great. I have ordered quite a bit from him and have been happy with every purchase. However...

Holley recommends a 3/8" return line in their installation instructions. Also, Holley has the regulator in their throttle body and is set up to have the return line also coming from the throttle body.

I don't know how it would work to regulate the fuel pressure externally then have the return line going back to the tank when the Holley was not designed to be operated that way.

Running one long line versus two long lines is not really a big deal IMHO. It is just a matter of running two clamps instead of one to mount the lines along the frame. There is plenty of room.

Looks like the breeze kit includes the external regulator set at 58PSI. Would just pull out the Sniper regulator disc and plug the return. I personally prefer the return as is keeps the fuel circulating and cool and keeps you in a better position from a Holly support standpoint.

[FF33rod]

Holley recommends a 3/8" return line in their installation instructions. Also, Holley has the regulator in their throttle body and is set up to have the return line also coming from the throttle body.

I don't know how it would work to regulate the fuel pressure externally...

The Sniper instructions also detail this very situation, an external regulator with no return from the Sniper. So you can actually go either way.

Additional edit - This shows up more specifically if you start looking at the software parameters. If you don't use the internal regulator, you need to enter what the external regulator is set to. There isn't a lot of conversation in the manuals on this aspect so you have to go looking for it like doing a search in the PC programming tool manual for "regulator"

Steve

[TMartinLVNV]

The Sniper instructions also detail this very situation, an external regulator with no return from the Sniper. So you can actually go either way.

Interesting. I don't remember seeing that option. Thanks for clarifying.

[Chopper]

I think returnless EFI systems are becoming more common. I just installed an Edelbrock Pro-flo 4, which comes out of the box expecting to be fed from an external regulator. However, they have a provision to allow flow through plumbing if one so chooses (which I did, but only because I was already setup for this)

Good tip about keeping the fuel cooler!

[D Stand]

I like the full return as well.

[Fman]

Appreciate the info, I am just learning about the EFI setup, so please bare with me on more questions. I want to do my homework and make sure I buy the best system for my build. If anyone does have a recommended fuel pump/regulator/fuel line setup please let me know.

What about the 255 LPH in tank fuel pump? Does this seem to be a good quality pump?

How does a return line help cool the fuel?

Thanks...

[BB767]

Hi Travis. You are making great progress!

FYI, I am running the Sniper with an external Aeromotive fuel pressure regulator and gauge. Works great. Set the regulator to 58.5 psi, use any two of the three inlet ports on the sniper, (one as inlet, the other as return), plug the return port (where the Sniper regulator is located) with one of the plugs you removed from the inlet port , and you are good to go.

My directions show no option for a "returnless" operation, don't think that would work, but have never tried.

I am sure you are aware of the fuel pick up many here (me included) use (http://www.promracing.com/fuel-supply/pro-m-racing-individual-fuel-parts/high-flow-fuel-pump-hanger-for-1986-1997-mustangs.html), I highly recommend it. It's a quality product and seems like a good design.

Take care, Brien

Well, disregard all of the above! After looking around I found that Holley has totally redesigned the Sniper since I bought mine! What you said is correct and it appears there is no longer a built in regulator, and a single (split) feed is standard.

[BB767]

How does a return line help cool the fuel?

Thanks...

With a feed only system, only the fuel actually needed by the engine runs through the fuel line to the engine. Fuel runs relatively slowly from the tank to the engine because the engine does not use it quickly. This fuel, traveling slowly from the tank to the engine, may get heated in the line by ambient air, engine heat, or exhaust heat.

With a return system, a large amount of fuel is running through the lines relatively quickly because much of it is bypassing the engine and being returned to the tank. Since the fuel is moving through the lines quicker it does not have as much time to be heated up by external heat sources, therefor, you have cooler fuel actually going into the engine.

[BradCraig]

Hi Travis. You are making great progress!

FYI, I am running the Sniper with an external Aeromotive fuel pressure regulator and gauge. Works great. Set the regulator to 58.5 psi, use any two of the three inlet ports on the sniper, (one as inlet, the other as return), plug the return port (where the Sniper regulator is located) with one of the plugs you removed from the inlet port , and you are good to go.

My directions show no option for a "returnless" operation, don't think that would work, but have never tried.

I am sure you are aware of the fuel pick up many here (me included) use (http://www.promracing.com/fuel-supply/pro-m-racing-individual-fuel-parts/high-flow-fuel-pump-hanger-for-1986-1997-mustangs.html), I highly recommend it. It's a quality product and seems like a good design.

Take care, Brien

Well, disregard all of the above! After looking around I found that Holley has totally redesigned the Sniper since I bought mine! What you said is correct and it appears there is no longer a built in regulator, and a single (split) feed is standard.

Where did you see it has changed? I've had my Sniper for about a year and it has built in regulator, just looked up install manual and seems to have not changed. The cheap internal regulators have been problematic for a lot of folks, definitely not a bad idea to use an external.

[GTBradley]

I have this in the 190 From Breeze and love it. It’s good up to 470hp and my Coyote is est at 450. Very easy to instal, the in-tank pump is quiet and the filter is one unit with the regulator. The fuel heat is a non issue in my opinion. Any heat you build in the fuel with a long return style setup gets returned to the gas tank and warms it there, thereby raising all your fuel’s temperature. With high horsepower at the drag strip, sometimes you’ll see water draining off the back of the car because they have ice bags on the fuel tank. Plus, if you need cool fuel for more hp you’re running hard and even a single fuel line will be bringing in fuel fast enough to keep the line cool. I trust Marks opinion on this stuff.

[Bobby Doug]

Hi Travis. You are making great progress!

FYI, I am running the Sniper with an external Aeromotive fuel pressure regulator and gauge. Works great. Set the regulator to 58.5 psi, use any two of the three inlet ports on the sniper, (one as inlet, the other as return), plug the return port (where the Sniper regulator is located) with one of the plugs you removed from the inlet port , and you are good to go.

My directions show no option for a "returnless" operation, don't think that would work, but have never tried.

I am sure you are aware of the fuel pick up many here (me included) use (http://www.promracing.com/fuel-supply/pro-m-racing-individual-fuel-parts/high-flow-fuel-pump-hanger-for-1986-1997-mustangs.html), I highly recommend it. It's a quality product and seems like a good design.

Take care, Brien

Well, disregard all of the above! After looking around I found that Holley has totally redesigned the Sniper since I bought mine! What you said is correct and it appears there is no longer a built in regulator, and a single (split) feed is standard.
I just bought Sniper system from Breeze back in February. It came direct from Holley and the return fuel line is used. No big deal to run 2 lines from / to the tank. Just make sure you install the recommended fuel filters.

[BB767]

Ok, now I feel stupid. I was looking at the manual for the Sniper Stealth EFI, not the standard Sniper most of us have. Good part is, my original comments were correct.:confused:

[Fman]

I met Steve (@FFR3099) at the Elk Grove meet up yesterday, he is running the Edelbrock pro flo 4 system on his 347. It looks like a very nice setup, anyone else here using the Edelbrock Pro flo 4 system?
https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=129997&d=1592231863

[JohnK]

FWIW - Holley also sells a return-less filter/pump setup that can be used with the Sniper, so clearly the system is designed to be able to be run this way.

https://www.holley.com/products/fuel_systems/fuel_injection/sniper_efi/sniper_4bbl_tbi_kits/sniper_4bbl_tbi_master_kits_with_fuel_system/parts/550-510D

[js65cobra]

Also, one thing to note... I'm using the Sniper Stealth 4150, it does NOT include a fuel pressure regulator, so you are required to use the external type or a returnless pump.

130056

[Joe Campbell]

I'm running the Proflo4 on my 427W in my Fox Mustang, very impressed, much more plug-and-play than Fitech. I may sell the Fitech and put one of these on the 347 in the FFR as well, it's that much better and cleaner running with the port injection.

[GoDadGo]

I can't comment about the EFI system because I'm running a carburetor; however, I do know that many of these systems like 112-114 degrees of lobe separation.
With that said may want to also go a little conservative with the camshaft grind because a profile with a lot of overlap can cause tuning issues too with some E.F.I.'s.
Be sure your engine builder knows that you will be going down the E.F.I. path prior to him building your engine because the camshaft is a big part of the equation.
O-2 Sensor locations need to be considered as well so you need to consult the manufacturer as to where the bungs need to be placed.
If you are using a Throttle Body wet feed system, then a single plane intake often works a bit better than a dual-plane style.
A carb is dripping/leaking fuel while the throttle body sprays it so a dual-plane intake can cause fuel distribution issues.

Hope This Helps & Good Luck From The Dark Dart Side!

[Fman]

I'm running the Proflo4 on my 427W in my Fox Mustang, very impressed, much more plug-and-play than Fitech. I may sell the Fitech and put one of these on the 347 in the FFR as well, it's that much better and cleaner running with the port injection.

Joe C, this is the same response I got from the owner I met last week running Pro 4, but he had only had his Pro flo 4 on for about six weeks. There must be a little bit of a difference running port injection (pro flo 4) vs throttle body (sniper)? How long have you been running the pro flo 4? I know this system is more expensive than the Sniper but it also comes with intake manifold and distributor, so in the end it almost seems like a wash between the two. What fuel pump and hanger are you using?

[Fman]

I can't comment about the EFI system because I'm running a carburetor; however, I do know that many of these systems like 112-114 degrees of lobe separation.
With that said may want to also go a little conservative with the camshaft grind because a profile with a lot of overlap can cause tuning issues too with some E.F.I.'s.
Be sure your engine builder knows that you will be going down the E.F.I. path prior to him building your engine because the camshaft is a big part of the equation.
O-2 Sensor locations need to be considered as well so you need to consult the manufacturer as to where the bungs need to be placed.
If you are using a Throttle Body wet feed system, then a single plane intake often works a bit better than a dual-plane style.
A carb is dripping/leaking fuel while the throttle body sprays it so a dual-plane intake can cause fuel distribution issues.

Hope This Helps & Good Luck From The Dark Dart Side!

DS, after talking with multiple engine builders I ended up going with a local engine builder for my build. I felt much better about having him 30 mins away if something went wrong or I needed help, he also mentioned he would come over and help me with installing the engine. Parts have been ordered, the engine is starting to move forward in this process.

He also assured me the 427 will be "driveable" and mentioned a milder cam he will be using. I feel very confident with this builder he actually built Superformance Cobras for about seven years in the bay area and has been building engines for about 25 years now. You mentioned carburetor, that is his preference as well with all his engines, he likes the simplicity of the carb but is aware I want to do fuel injection. He has done multiple Sniper/Fi Tech installs but has never done the Pro flo 4 system. Still debating which way to go but I am starting to really think port injection might even be a better option.

[GoDadGo]

Sounds like you've got things well under control.
Wrench On Brother, Wrench On!

[tkafitz]

I am curious to know if anyone has used the internal fuel pump from Holley with a factory five tank? Does it drop in are modifications necessary?
Thanks

[Fman]

I'm running the Proflo4 on my 427W in my Fox Mustang, very impressed, much more plug-and-play than Fitech. I may sell the Fitech and put one of these on the 347 in the FFR as well, it's that much better and cleaner running with the port injection.

Do you think the Pro Flo 4 intake manifold will allow the oval air cleaner to be used without hood clearance issues?

[canuck1]

Fman,

if the intake and throttle body are the same as previous Pro-Flo versions (?), you can run a Cobra oval air cleaner with a 2 3/8” filter. You’ll need energy suspension (or similar) mounts to get engine down and it’s close, but I’ve been running that combo with MK IV body and MK III.

Sean

[Fman]

Fman,

if the intake and throttle body are the same as previous Pro-Flo versions (?), you can run a Cobra oval air cleaner with a 2 3/8” filter. You’ll need energy suspension (or similar) mounts to get engine down and it’s close, but I’ve been running that combo with MK IV body and MK III.

Sean

Awesome, those are the exact mounts I am using! I was hoping the oval would fit;)

[wby300]

Hello I am looking at running the pro flo 4 SBF 363 with a Super Victor EFI Intake. Was wondering which intake manifold you are running since it’s clearing for you.

[Fman]

Hello I am looking at running the pro flo 4 SBF 363 with a Super Victor EFI Intake. Was wondering which intake manifold you are running since it’s clearing for you.

I'm not in the clear yet, I take my car to my painter this week for fitment. I could do a lower profile air cleaner if needed. One thing I did do was run Gordon Levy motor mounts which lower the engine down more than the energy suspension mounts. They also are supposed to make pipe alignment easier, especially with a Dart block and FFR adjustable headers.

My intake manifold is just the one that came with the Pro Flo 4 setup along with the distributor they provide. Not sure on what model they give you. So far I am liking the set up, very limited use but everything seems to be working good. I also like how you can adjust base and advanced timing from the tablet. Set up was simple and the tablet is very well thought out and easy to navigate, even for a non tech person like myself.

I will keep you posted on how the clearance ends up working out, fingers crossed.

[Joe Campbell]

Sorry, I fell way behind on this thread. Had a lot happen since June but I am indeed swapping the ProFlo4 in place of the Fitech on the 347 - I'll know tomorrow after I drop in the distributor if the Cobra oval intakes will clear, but it looks promising. It comes with what looks like the regular Victor Jr. intake, w/ the injector bungs. The Super Victor is about .85 inch taller if I remember right, so there should be even less worry.

Having gotten even more miles w/ ProFlo4 on the 427, I'm even more impressed with its OEM-like driveability and throttle response, it's easily on par with the Coyote in the wifey's Mustang GT.

[wby300]

Thank you. I haven’t gotten it yet, Was just talking to the engine builder last night about the build. I can’t wait. Currently have a roller and all aluminum drilled so far.

[ggunter]

I have a question on the Holley Sniper EFI. I am not happy with the carburetor that came on my 347 so I bought the Holley kit and it should be here this week. My question is, can I use the fuel pump wiring that is already there and running the carb through the FFR relay or does the fuel pump wiring from Holley have to be used because the ECU in the unit controls fuel pump cut off? I'm thinking I'll have to use the Holley wiring and relay. Just trying not to have to run more wires to the back now that the trans is in and space is limited.

[rich grsc]

The wire running back to the pump is fine, no need to change it. Just make the connection to the ECU wire behind the dash.

[Papa]

I simply did as Rich recommends and used the Holley EFI wiring and wired the ECU fuel pump control wire directly to the fuel pump + wire (not using the RF relay). If you remove the Holley relay, your ECU will provide negative control vs. positive control as an output, so if you remove the Holley relay, you'll want to to wire the ECU to the ground side of the RF relay.

[ggunter]

Will do , thanks!