351 Windsor

[Sailor]

So..... I hit up the boneyard and picked up a 351 windsor. Scrap yard guy says it's from an early 90s van.... not sure exactly. plugs were out of it, open to the elements etc. I've got the intake manifold off and the heads off. the cylinder walls are rusty and I'd guess the pistons are seized. I'll pour some diesel in there and see if that loosens it up enough to get it to turn. The plan is to bore it .040" over, stroke it to 427, put a carb instead of EFI and generally hot rod it. Of course the plan is to put it in a roadster. I'll go to the shop and see if I can pull any codes off the block.
I have only begun to disassemble the engine. In the lifter valley I came across the code 351 WCP20 I can't find anywhere what this code is. 351 is the block of course...... W for windsor? what's the CP20 mean? The casting code on the side of the block was E4AE-6015-FA-20. Just below it was 8D18. I think it's the date code and translates to the 18th of April 88? From what I can find online and in my books, E4AE decodes to E=1980s, 4 is the year so 1984, A is for Ford E is for the engineering department. 6015 is the part code, engine block. FA-20.... not sure about that one. Anybody know? I've perused a few of the engine forums and can't seem to find anything there..... I admit I'm a MOPAR man and know their systems better than the blue oval stuff. I'm sure I'd never hear the end of it if I put a 440+6 or a Hemi in a roadster so I opted for a 351W. Can anybody help me out with decoding my engine. Also, the code seems to decode to a 1984 engine but it had the lower half of an EFI intake manifold on it.... Did they make EFI in 84? There's still alot of cleaning up to do before I really know this block. Mabye the first letter in the date code was really an F which would make it a 1994 rather than 1984........ Looks pretty clearly like an E though making it an '84...... HMMM More sleuthing is required I think.
Anybody know much about these engines that could help me with the rebuild process?
http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d722b3127ccefe5326350ec000000030O00AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

Thanks for the help guys.
Daniel

[Sailor]

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d722b3127ccefe53fa448fef00000030O00AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

That's it on the trailer the day I picked it up. I have yet to get it off the trailer. Neighbour will loan me a chain fall so I can lift it. The barn has beams that will hold it no problem so once I have his falls, I'll get it on a stand, until then, I've been slowly taking it appart, got the heads and manifold off already.

[Mustang Man]

Sailor, I'd think twice about a 427 in a stock Windsor block. It's a bad rod ratio and you can end up with hotspots from the overbore. Most people go to a 392 or 408 stroker max in a stock block, leaving the 427 size for an aftermarket block that can take a 4.125 bore without issue. Don't worry, at 408ci with good heads and a nice roller cam, you'll never miss that 19ci of displacement and it'll still make an honest 450+ hp...

Good luck with the build...
Mark

[charles roybal]

Agree w/ Mark..my 408w made 530 hp 535 lbs tk

[Sailor]

OK thanks.
I was in the shop working on it again today as time permitted. A little guy who'll be 4 in November doesn't allow much time to work on this. I do get him to help when I can though. Now that it's on a stand I don't really want him too close to it though. I managed to learn a bit about the engine today. I think possibly the gasket was on backwards on the passenger side bank. Number 3 piston seems destroyed on the top. The outermost edge of it seems rusted away. I took a screw driver and chipped off a little bit since the corrosion was above the level of the rest of the piston. It showed broken metal underneath. There is quite a bit of damage to the piston though. Here's number 3 piston:


http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d725b3127ccefe5c271de49b00000030O00AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/




And number 5 piston that appears intact for comparison:


http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d725b3127ccefe5c4e4c255600000030O00AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/


Here's the passenger side bank of cylinders:



http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d725b3127ccefe5c35a3651c00000030O00AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

You can just make out the damaged #3 in there. It's nearest TDC.



And this is my helper:

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d725b3127ccefe5ce989655800000030O00AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

This was the night we got the engine home. He's removing the screw on the hose clamp for the lower rad hose.

[Sailor]

Got a wrench on her and discovered after a little back and forth work and some time that she's NOT seized. Great. I can turn the crank all the way around however there is quite a bit of resistance. I have the water pump off now but broke a couple of bolts in the process. I tried an "easy out" type extractor. Broke it off too. What now? I could continue to drill it out with progressively larger drills but I'm worried that I'm not on center and I'll be removing threads from the block. That would not be the intended result. Any thoughts on getting it out? Heat maybe? Here's the code I found in the lifter valley:


http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d725b3127ccefe5c4628253600000040O00AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/


I take it nobody is intimate enough with the 351W to help with the codes? Do most of you get crates? Or have them built by others? Am I rare in wanting to build this thing myself? I hope not.


Here's the engine with the bolts out for the water pump:

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d725b3127ccefe5c04b7258800000030O10AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D1/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/


And the water pump off:

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d725b3127ccefe5d3a66050a00000030O10AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D1/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

Once I figure out the bolts that are stuck in the timing cover (you can just make it out on the top left), I'll have that off too. Really interesting tearing into this thing. Wish I knew more about engines at this point. I have no trouble building a canoe.... an engine is a whole different beast. Great fun so far though. Thanks for the input guys.

That's the state of affairs at this point.

Cheers,

Daniel

[Sailor]

OK, I've been looking around for a good 351 windsor forum. I can't find anything. Lots of threads that either go on for ever about other things or are only a few posts long and don't really help much. Does anybody know of a good one? Or at least a good build thread that might help a newbie like myself get his bearings?
Cheers
Daniel

[luvaz]

Sailor, Have you tried posting this (or searching the archives) on www.ffcars.com ?
A lot of guys have built their own 351W-based stroker and you should be able to find what you need there.
HTH,
Will

[mike forte]

Hi Daniel,
The engine had a problem and that's why it's out of the truck. You need to have the block professionally inspected for cracks and warpage before you purchase any parts. Making sure you have a worthy rebuildable core is very important.

[CraigS]

I'd also be real worried about those bolts that snapped and then he easy-out that snapped.VERY difficult to get them out. So,I'd agree get it to a pro for a diagnosis before you go too far.OTOH, I think a 351W based motor is the perfect one for an FFR. A bunch more easily obtained power compared to a 302 w/ a stronger base block and fasteners already there.

[Sailor]

So from the reasearch I'm doing, I guess this ISN'T a roller block being an '84 vintage. Conversion to roller? better to toss it and get a newer one? Or just go with a non roller setup?

[Sailor]

I was planing on getting it to a pro to check it out. I don't know nearly enough to diagnose any problems or potential issues. I do know enough to know that I don't know and will have a pro check the stuff that needs checking. Mabye a small grinder to carefully take out the remaining material then tap it? Or just drill out the bolt, then fill the hole with weld and re tap it? Or is there a trick that I need to learn about? Don't want this engine build to stall (pardon the pun). Bolts aren't supposed to break like that though...... As for the engine coming out of the truck because it's broken, I agree. It has some damage to the piston face on the #3 piston. Don't plan on reusing them anyway. Want to beef them up a bit. Not for racing but for the odd lap around a track, maybe a pass at the strip and surely a stoplight against a local porshe or corvette. Anyway, I'll keep reading and working on this thing and maybe I'll manage to learn something into this skull of mine. Thanks guys.
Daniel

[turbonut48]

Get the block and crank mounts thoroughly checked for cracks.
When you do the boring, go for the minimum that will clean the clylinders. Gives you some fudge factor incase you ever need to rebore.
Keep the compression resonable. If you could run Regular grade gas it would save a few bucks on fuel. You ll have cubic inches to make up for lower compression.
For the cam, go for a high lift short duration cam, sort of like in an RV. Gobs of low end torgue.
A 408 stroker should still rev to 6000+ and could make 450 hp.

Have the shop that checks the block, remove the broken bolts. They ve done that stuff before and will be good at it.

A couple things Ive learned, some the hard way.

Good Luck. Have fun.

The Nut

[Sailor]

As it stands now, I still have those broken bolts in. If I take the block as is to a shop to check it over, The rotating assembly is still in there. I would have prefered to have that out before I take it to them. I could remove the pistons. I have the block upside down with the oil pan/oil pump and pickup tube removed. Obviously the rods are exposed and could be removed meaning I could remove the pistons. I cannot remove the crank until the timing cover bolts are out and the timing cover comes off. Should I go ahead and remove the pistons and rods before taking it to the shop? Or should I just leave it and let them do it? I wanted to do as much of this myself as possible. The block is really dirty as well. Lots of dirty, sludgy, greasy, grime all over it. I'd like to clean this off before I have them look at it or they'll just get pissed trying to get through all the dirt that I could have cleaned off. I presume I'll be charged for them to clean it up if I don't so I'd like to know... Can I just hose it down and scrub it with wire brush/steel wool/green scrubbies and degreaser etc. then a light coating of WD40 for rust protection and bring it to the shop? Or is there something else I should be considering?


OK, now that that's out of the way, here are some pics of what I've got done because I know, no pics didn't happen. First off, I got the pullley off the front. Came off pretty easily:

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d731b3127ccefe40444ecea500000030O10AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D1/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/



I removed this little fitting. Not sure what it is, it's just above and forward of the oil filter mounting position though. Anybody tell me exactly what it is? Some sort of remote routing piece or something? Anyway here it is:

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d731b3127ccefe40c8f4ce5900000030O00AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/



Next I flipped the block over and got at the oilpan:

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d731b3127ccefe40daa04f3400000030O00AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/


I noticed as I removed the bolts that the ones on the driver's side were considerably looser then the passenger side bolts. Not sure why that was but they all came out pretty easily. No problems there.


Here's a quick shot of one of the heads. I plan to replace them with aluminum aftermarket heads. These seemed to have some coolant passages that were at least partially blocked:
http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d731b3127ccefe41e58b2fd400000030O00AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/
http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d731b3127ccefe404e43cead00000030O00AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/
This one is partially blocked but some were pretty much covered over. That's what leads me to think that the number 3 piston melted due to lack of cooling. The damage to the piston looks to be melted. Should I be looking in the exhaust ports on the heads for bits of metal from it if that's the case?

[Sailor]

Got the oilpan off and this is what I found:
http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d731b3127ccefe403cccce1b00000030O10AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D1/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

On the bottom of the oil pickup there's a little lump of something.....
http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d731b3127ccefe4160956f1000000030O10AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D1/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

"Something" turned out to be a june bug. There were others in there as well. If you look at the screen on the oil pickup you'll see lots of debris. Some of it was rubbery. I am fairly certain it was part of the gasket material used when the engine was assembled. Quite a few things telling me the last build of this engine was not really done that well.

Freeze plugs are out now. It's quite fascinating taking this thing appart. I still don't know if I'll be capable of reassembling it as a functioning street motor but I'm loving the teardown so far. For a guy who ate with a knife and fork at the age of two so as not to get his hands dirty, this is fun.

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d731b3127ccefe411886ee0f00000030O00AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

At first this hole on the front of the block bothered me:

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d731b3127ccefe411c1d6fa600000030O00AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

It's jagged, irregular and just doesn't look like it was supposed to be there. I've googled around, looked in my books etc and have come to the conclusion that it does indeed belong there. Now.... What is it for? Oil return of some sort? Anybody able to tell me? If it is an oil return, I suppose oil drops out of it from inside the block into the lifter valley. Would there be any benefit to easing the edges? Opening it up further. I recall seeing a thread where the holes in the bottom of the lifter valley were opened up into slots a few inches long presumably to allow oil to flow down more readily. Would this be advisable or not advised for an engine like this? The one I saw was a 351C rather than 351W like this one if that makes any difference.

That's it for now. I think I'll have one more go with the extractors to get those bolts out. I'll use the neighbours O/A torch for heat and see where it leads me. If not, I guess it's off to the machine shop. I think I'm leaning towards removing the pistons and rods first though, unless you guys convince me that it's a bad idea to get them out before I have the timing chains off.
Cheers,
Daniel

[riptide motorsport]

the hexigonal thing you removed is the oil sender extension.,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,it allows you to screw on a fat electric oil pressure sender.

If your using all new rotating assembly, go ahead and just take it all apart. If your reusing all the good stuff, the caps and rods and pistons need to be marked.

[Sailor]

I know I can't reuse the pistons. One is damaged big time. It's melted on the top face. Big hole in it on one side. I'm a little nervouse about the cylinder wall on that number 3 piston. Besides, a stroker kit bored over pretty much means I replace the entire rotating assembly so I guess I'll just start removing what I can, clean up the block as best I can and have a shop remove the timing cover etc. I'm starting to think of having a short block that's strong enough that I can supercharge it at a later date. I mean, if the 'Cos can have a supersnake with twin paxtons, I can have one too right? :D

Got back out there today in the afternoon.
Here's the lifter valley a little cleaner that I left it last time:

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d731b3127ccefe4144276fb000000030O00AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d731b3127ccefe402c18cec700000030O10AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D1/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

Then I flipped her over again and cleaned up the block a bit. Here's the casting code cleaner than it's been in a long time I'm sure.:

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d731b3127ccefe40490b0f4e00000030O00AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

and a wider view of the cleaning so far:

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d731b3127ccefe4029270f5200000030O10AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D1/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

And a shot of the little guy helping daddy. He loves this stuff. It's great to see him enjoy it. Wish I'd have gotten into it a long time ago.

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d731b3127ccefe40ebb80fac00000030O10AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D1/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

[Sailor]

So, if I'm going to stroke the motor and will therefore need a new crank, rods, pistons etc., does that mean the caps and bolts etc. will need to be replaced or do I still reuse them assuming they're not toasted somehow? Or is it more my call? I do want it strong enough to Supercharge later and want to start with a healthy 450/450 HP/TQ. Does this mean I should replace the whole shooting match? Don't want to waste money on things I dont' need but if a few extra bucks on a stronger crank or caps or bolts etc will save me the heartache of tearing it down with only 10 000 on it, I think I'd rather spend the money now. It's cheaper to build a more expensive block that to build two cheap ones in a row.

[Sailor]

And...... that oil sender extention.... Something to keep an eye on or is it specific to the engine's last life as a truck motor? I kept it aside for now but won't be keeping parts lying around that I don't need or want. Speaking of which, anybody in the area need a set of stock iron heads? I can pull casting codes etc. off them and post pics if anyone is interested.

[blueoval_bowtie_guy]

I have a 408W in my FFR. It's been on the road since June '06 and is approaching 10K miles on it. I can't EVER imagine wanting to put a blower on it. If you really think you want to do that - then buy a new super strong block and be prepared to spend really big bucks building the block. It's hard enough with a nicely built 408 to keep the tires from ripping loose from ground.

Replace all the bolts. ARP is a great source. You'll be putting in a new crank, rods, pistons plus lots of machine work. Don't skimp and reuse fasteners.

As others here have said - you'll need to get your block hot tanked, pressure tested and magnafluxed. Only if it passes with flying colors would I use it for a normally aspirated 408.

HTH,
Steve

[Tpa65cpe]

Sailor, you could either use a main girdle or splayed main caps 2,3,4 and have the block line bored this will help with strength!! In a supercharged app I would go with an aftermarket block that was o-ringed these are much stronge!!! IMHO is worth the extra money spent!!

[DVANSLEEN]

I hope you didn't pay too much for this motor. There are good ones(not locked up,etc) available at the junk yards for
reasonable money. Check it over good and have fun!

[Sailor]

Only paid $80 for it. All I will be reusing at this point is the block and the main caps. I'll replace everything else due to the nature of the build (stroker).

So today I removed the pistons.

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d730b3127ccefe429e14178e00000030O00AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

This is that #3 piston I mentioned earlier. Looks melted on top to me. Seems to confirm my suspisions. Anyway, I pulled all the pisons. My helper acted as "piston catcher" as I tapped them out from above the upside down block.

Got all eight of them out and lined up in order to be inspected:

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d730b3127ccefe43dca1375600000030O00AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

As I figured, plenty of copper showing on just about every bearing:

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d730b3127ccefe42bcdd175600000030O10AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D1/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

The casting code on the crank wasn't one I've heard about. It's a 7MA:

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d730b3127ccefe425bb1d6e100000030O00AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

Does anybody know what that is. The books I have talk about crank codes up to 5M........... 7MA...... HMMMMM More research I guess.


Here's the other code I found cast into it. Date ties in with the block. Must be the original crank.

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d730b3127ccefe43048ab62100000030O00AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

[Sailor]

Now that I have the codes I started pulling it appart. My neighbour came by and helped out a bit. He used a BFH and a couple of slot screwdrivers to pry open the timing cover I had been having difficulty with. Working closer and closer to the broken bolts at one end he pried the whole thing off. Eventually the bolts were showing quite well between the block and the broken aluminum timing cover. BFH to the cover a few times and it came away from the block in pieces. Perfect, now I can get at the timing set and remove it. I did manage to remove both those bolts and I did it with my bare fingers. All that hammering must have broken them loose, I didn't even try to put a pari of vise grips on them, they just twisted right out pretty as you please. Problem was I didn't have the harmonic balancer off. No puller either. The wrenches we had didn't do it either. Need air tools for that. There's simply not enough play in the chain to allow you to slide one sproket off without the other coming as well so I was stuck. Until I remembered I had a special situation type timing chain removing tool upstairs in the boatshop. 45 seconds later I came back with it. 15 seconds after that the chain was off:

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d730b3127ccefe42db5dd64d00000030O10AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D1/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/
:D

Then I was able to remove the sproket and loosen the bolts holding the crank in place. Got them all out and took out the crank. It's bearings were also showing lots of copper:

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d730b3127ccefe42502c96e100000030O10AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D1/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

I pushed the lifters out from the inside as they had no intention of giving up they're tight little homes without a fight. A few taps and they fell away though..... Had to spin the cam for a few of them of course but they came out. Next the cam retainer was removed and I slid the camshaft out. That was interesting. The experience will come in handy when it comes time to insert the new bumpier one. Once that was out, I laid it all out on the side for inspection. Quite a few parts there. I'll put the main caps back on soon. I know which way they came out and I know where each goes. Of course they're numbered as well.

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d730b3127ccefe436363f66300000030O10AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D1/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

The bottom end berift of parts:

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d730b3127ccefe42497b571200000030O20AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D2/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

And the top end:

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1d730b3127ccefe434882b60f00000030O10AcM2LJm1aN2 YPbz4C/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D1/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

There's nothing left in the block except a few screw in plugs. I'll take the block to a shop and have it checked over, cleaned etc. If it is serviceable for the kind of horsepower and torque I hope to make, I'll have them go ahead and bore it thirty over, line hone for the crank etc. Then I'll measure everything and start saving my pennies for the kits I'll need to stuff this thing full of horsepower. Stroker kit, Cam kit, heads, intake manifold etc.
I'll be leaning on you guys to help me choose some kits that will be streetable. I don't plan to run on the drag strip though a pass or two just to see might happen. Nor do I plan to road race or ralley race the car. Though, once again, I might take it to a track just to see how she does.
I want streetable reliable power. Torque. I hope for 450 of each but if I hit 500 or more and maintain the street reliability, that's perfectly fine by me.
I'm thinking aftermarket aluminum heads for lots of breathing, an Edelbrock vic jr dual plane aluminum intake, a bumpier cam that is on the floor next to it now but nothing too wild. Retrofit rollers. I figure about 700 cfm carb on top, a high flow oil pump and a high flow water pump. I'd like to run power steering, and maybe A/C not sure about that yet. Can I do it with what I mentioned without breaking the bank? Not wanting to go cheap on anything as mentioned, I'll get new bolts/studs for everything and use pretty much new parts but I'd rather not have $15k in an engine that's built on an older block.
Feel free to critique guys. I value the input, as I said, I know nothing about engines and would be happy to learn. I hope this also helps some other newb trying this out for the first time. Thanks again and cheers,
Daniel

[riptide motorsport]

Looks like your having a "boatload" of fun!!!!:D

[Sailor]

I am. :D

[KC Wildcat]

Check on ffcars.com - There is almost a set formula for stroking a 351 to 408. 450HP? That is a reasonable straight 351 build. If you can not get north of 500 HP/TQ you are doing something wrong. Most are 525-550. That is normally aspirated...no need to blow/turbo to get that power. If you want to blow it, you would do your bottom end completely different. Even so, I would go with a stronger aftermarket block if I were going that route (Dart or World Products). The key to a build like this is matching the heads to the cam (intake runner volume). I have heard people perferring the AFR 185 over the AFT 225 - to keep the intake charge speed up.

To get ideas, I would go online and look at what parts are used on various crate 408s....look at Engine Factory, Smedding, Levy racing, keith craft, etc.

[Sailor]

Do they readily give out their secrets like that? I will if they do. Nort of 500 eh? I like that.

[turbonut48]

Remember that "Nort" of 500 hp means a lopey cam, and high compression into a "loose" exhaust.

The Nut

[Sailor]

If NORTH of 500 sacrifices much streetability I'm not so interested in it. I want reliable streetable primarily. Torque and Horsepower only if it remains driveable. Like, to the point of ALMOST (but not quite) daily driver.