Clutch Quadrant Issue

[John4337]

Hi Guys,

I’ve just gotten home from a 7 day road trip totaling a bit over 2,200 miles. That brings my total mileage to a little over 21,000 miles. One of my projects is to replace the standard clutch cable with Ford Racing piece with the adjuster at the clutch fork to hopefully get a bit smoother action and adjust the pedal height down a bit for a more comfortable drive.

I started tonight by disconnecting the cable at the quadrant and found I have some vertical play at the quadrant. There doesn’t seem to be any fore and aft. I also don’t feel any play in the pedal. There is some wear on the cable guide of the quadrant. I think you can see it in the photo. I don’t see any wear on the cable, but I don’t have it all the way it of the car yet.

So, normal? Or do I have an issue brewing.

John



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[michael everson]

There have been a bunch of pedal and quadrant failures with this setup. FFR changed to a setup that has the quadrant above the pedal instead of offset. My guess is the shaft that holds the pedal is worn or bent. Look from in the foot well for evidence.
Mike

[John4337]

Thanks Mike. I was afraid of that, I moved some wiring and got in there a bit better, and found I can wiggle the quadrant in all directions.....what’s the best move? Am I looking at replacing the pedal box? Doesn’t look like fun on a completed car.

[Avalanche325]

John,

OMG, my car is off the road for that EXACT reason. Also, I have 21,000 miles. I was going to change my cable, and found that with the cable off, I could twist the pedal way too much. The holes in the pedal box base plate are ovalized to the point that it was probably going to break before too long. I hope you have a different problem, like a worn or bent shaft. I have been working on mine for a couple weeks and am almost done.

Old on left - new on right.

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Sooooo, a new pedal box. Removal and installation are tedious to put it lightly. You have to disassemble it piece by piece to get it out. Then the really fun part is to assemble the new one up in the foot box. Seat removed, feet on the rollbar, and head in the foot well. Lots of carpet burns on the elbows. Working in there, every step is measured in hours. Like 3 hours just to get the pedals, shafts, washers, and snap rings in place.

I am changing over to hydraulic. I considered the new quadrant, but decided to go with what the pedal box was really designed for. New pedal box, Master cylinder, hydraulic lines, slave cylinder, pushrod, fittings, reservoir, brackets, etc.

If you are going hydraulic and have a CNC reservoir, I found the last place on earth that has triple CNC reservoirs. They had 8 left when I talked to them.

Good luck. Give me a call if you want to discuss the fun.

I was going to start a thread to warn guys that still have the old setup. Here's your warning!!!

[John4337]

Chris, that sucks.... I’m going to get my bore scope in there and see how bad mine is. I didn’t feel like like I could move the pedal, just the quadrant, and not a lot, maybe I caught mine early. I’m considering a swap to hydraulic now, my concern is I tucked my wiper motor in the foot box due to the a/c. Hope I have room for the extra master cylinder.

[John4337]

I spoke to FFR today, they are sending me a new quadrant.....

I looked a bit harder tonight, seem to look like the lower edge of the pedal box is abrading the quadrant, perhaps allowing the movement?

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What looks like a shadow is missing material just about the edge of the box

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Sooo, not sure I'm hot on pulling everything out to just go back to this. Has anyone installed hydraulic on a completed car? If so, any tips, or things to watch out for? I'm running a 306 with a king cobra clutch.

Thanks

John

[CraigS]

Looking at Avalanche's pic, that looks like a terrible design. A steel shaft riding in a cast iron housing w/ no bearing or bushing? Am I missing something? If the design isn't changed the same thing will happen again. I don't know how the hydraulic MC would be set up compared to the cable but, if it still uses the same shaft and housing, it will do the same thing.

[John4337]

I stared tearing things apart, got the bolt with the spacer undone without too much trouble, but the snap rings are a whole other problem. No fun trying to get those off while you're laying on your back in the foot box... anyway I was turning the clutch pivot shaft to get the ring around to a better angle, and this fell out from the area of the pedal. I'm assuming that it used to be round, flat and in one piece at some point, and likely the source of the quadrant movement.

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So, anyone have any secret ways to get those snap rings off?

John

[John4337]

Well, I got time to pull the parts out and fully assess the problem. The good news is that the pedal and box look ok.

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=108626&d=1560124844

Here is the quadrant damage

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=108625&d=1560124806

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=108631&d=1560124970

Here are washers

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=108627&d=1560124866

Gouge in the pivot shaft

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=108630&d=1560124944


As I mentioned, FFR was kind enough to send a new quadrant assembly, including a new quadrant, support piece, pivot shaft and hardware

Old and new pivot shafts. The new is considerably thicker.

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=108632&d=1560124991

And here is the old and new quadrant with the support piece

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=108633&d=1560125841

Just waiting on some bits from Wilwood to start reassembling everything.

[CraigS]

Just so you know your post #9 has no pictures. not even boxes w/ red X's in them.

[John4337]

That’s strange, I can see them...... technology fails me again


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[ChasNMe]

yeah John, I don't see them either . . . wierd

[John4337]

I’ve notified the webmaster....

[Avalanche325]

My conversion to hydraulic is finished up and frankly I love it. Less pedal effort and I actually think it has more feel. I can feel when the clutch fingers roll over, which I could not with cable. My engagement point is also higher which I wanted. I did an autocross yesterday, and all is good.

For snap rings, I have a nice set of Craftsman snap ring pliers with changeable pins. Both straight and angled. I also had a cheap HF pair with changeable heads. They came in handy because they were just smaller. I shifted from going through the footbox top access to having my head in the footwell about a millions times.

If anyone is interested, the place that I found that has CNC triple reservoirs is Kartek offroad. I talked to a guy named Matt. They had 8 left when I talked to them. No doubles (I have one I will probably sell soon).

[John4337]

Thanks Chris. It was just more than I wanted to get into right now, but I foresee changing over at some point

[dpariso]

My pivot pin walked out. When I received the new kit for FFR, I ditched the snap rings and threaded the pivot pin on both sides. Add bolt to each side
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[John4337]

That’s a very interesting idea...wondering if the bolt and ability to add a larger washer would help stabilize things...

[dpariso]

Since I was taking out the clutch pedal to place it with the new quadrant kit, I decided to replace it with the forged one. Looks better BUT, the new pedal is wider and now hits the 1" frame tube. As a result, the pedal does not go to the floor as it used to. Its about 1" less travel now. 1" Does not seem like a lot but it does make a difference.
I also modified the pedal stop in the resting position. That small nut that it supposed to rest on, does not work well.