Engine choice

[TFD III]

I know you guys have debated this numerous times but I'm new to FFR and would appreciate your collective input as to what the perfect engine would be...conservative 302? Seems like there's a lot of 351 engine chosen but why not go for the cubes with a 427 or 460? Is there a big weight difference or does one engine offer better handling?

[LewPoberezny]

I'm am old school guy went with a alumnum ****** block stroked to 482. It is a Forte stump puller and is very impressive whenever I open the hood and they see the FE expansion tank, turkey pan and remote oil filter.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3543/5826040912_2e333a746f.jpg

[riptide motorsport]

Anything with around 450 HP and torque

[Bob Cowan]

A lot depends on what you plan to do with the car, and how deep your wallet is. You could probably build two (and maybe 3) conservative 302's for what Lew spent on his engine.

The big blocks look and sound great, they are period correct, parts are readily available these days but are not cheap. But they're heavy (unless you ponu up the big bux for an alum block and light weight crank), and take up a lot of room. Some parts are very difficult if not impossible to find off the shelf - like motor mounts and headers. And you'll have to pony up for heavier parts in the rest of the drive train - clutch, trans, diff, etc. And don't forget about other stressed parts, like cooling system, shocks & springs, etc. Certainly not insurmountable problems - just considerations in putting the package together.

The small blocks don't look as impressive, sound differant, but are cheaper to build good power levels, handle better, and are easier to work on. Good off the shelf parts are a phone call away. Tech help is a key board away - if you have a problem there's thousands of SBF guys right here.

Stroker small blocks - like 427, 454, and 460 - are between a big and a small block. Readily available but not always cheap parts, light weight, easy to work on, excellent power levels. IMO, they're the best of both worlds.

I'v also seen a Buick V6 turbo, an in-line 6, BBC's, and SBC's. I'v heard people consider diesels, but don't know if that's been done. And there are electric Roadsters around, too (which I think is very cool).

The bottom line is, there's no wrong choice here. If you like it and can make it work, go for it.

[mattmc]

Don't forget about the 4.6L, 320hp stock and can do 450hp easy with the right internals and a super charger. plus they get better mpg's than the big blocks if you plan on driving it more than on the weekends.

http://i218.photobucket.com/albums/cc41/mattmc46/June%202011/100_1847.jpg

[LuckyWinner]

I went thru the same thing and finally got a 393. I like the sound better and the engine block is a little stronger than a 347. Im in Afghanistan now but going back to Fort Polk in less than 3 months. Did you buy your kit yet? There are two guys in West Monroe that have kits, one is just starting and the other is finished. They are good guys and very helpful. Good luck.

[efnfast]

I have a 500rwhp 351w stroker and am happy with that.

Honestly, if I were doing a big block and had the added weight it would have to be mega cubes ( > 600) and a fair bit more hp ( > 800RWhp)

My 502cid small block LS should be making around 800RWhp @ 6500rpm, so big block gotta top that.

[OttawaFFRer]

Ive got a 351w stroker under way, going 408. It will make over 450hp easy.

I started with a 302, but when I consider that a rebuild costs about the same for the 351 why not... I picked up a very nice 94 roller block for $300.

[Gumball]

There are as many answers to this question as there is builders. Personally, I used a 302 out of a '94 SVT Mustang Cobra and built it into a 347 stroker for around $3k in parts and machine work (my build labor was free). If I had to spend much more money, I probably would have looked hard at one of the many crate motors that Ford Motorsport offers, in particular the iron block / aluminum head 427 small block (bored/stroked Boss 351 block) for around $9k from a couple of the vendors here.

[TFD III]

very, very helpful - thanks

[TFD III]

Thanks - I have not ordered the kit yet - was thinking about attending the school first. I'm in Houston but moving to Lake Charles next week

[TFD III]

Are some blocks more desirable than others (your reference to '94)? I'm sure everyone lese knows this but I'm going to ask anyway - at what point do the cars have to have cataytic converters and other anti-polution devices? Is this determined by the year of engine? Year of car?

[TFD III]

great input - I'm now in the camp of small block stroker.

[riptide motorsport]

small block stroker is an excellent choice, the emmisions issue is a state requirement situation. Nothing here in Florida, diferent for every state....HTH .....STeven

[Gumball]

I used the '94 because I wanted some of the SVT donor parts (bigger brakes, stouter trans, etc...) and ended up using very few donor parts - and refurbishing all of those, too. If emissions is an issue where you live (or where you're moving to), you may want to use an early block as the starting point if your locality ties emissions requirements to the year of the engine. Here in IL, I'm just inside the border of the emissions testing area, but state law here ties emissions testing to the year of the vehicle, requiring only '68 and up cars to be tested. Since I'll be able to title mine as a '65 due to the "substantial replica rule", I'll be able to avoid testing.

Shop around for deals on stroker motors if that's the route you decide to go - there are many good engines out there, including from Ford Motorsport and many of the vendors here can provide you with great deals and service.

[Bob Cowan]

That all depends on local requirements. Find a state smog office in your area, and go in to talk with them. When I built my car, it was smogged according to the year the engine represents. Not the actual year of the engine, just waht it represents. I have 8 stack EFI, and it looks like webers. I wanted to use a distributerless ignition system. But I used a distributer, and the car was smogged as a '65.

[PaulW]

Maybe a little late but this is what I have ordered. 302 with Edelbrock heads and manifold, custom cam, 365hp and 360 ft/lbs of torque. For me that is plenty.

[Someday I Suppose]

Lots of great info here already, as stated emissions are state by state, newer blocks though come roller ready which is a small plus, easy enough to but a roller cam into an older block.

I think the biggest thing in building one of these cars though is to decide what you want out of the car, and then plan to that goal. I wanted a weekend street cruiser, I wanted it to have some torque and power, but knew it would not be a track car, knew it wouldn't be a daily driver and was pretty sure I wasn't going to be a 100,000 mile road warrior. With that in mind I also liked the idea of a carb in the car, just a perior correct thing, and originally planned to go with a 351W at around 400 HP. Because of emission laws in NJ I needed to find a seasoned block, and in talking to the engine builder we decided that since we would put a new crank in it, it made sense to kick it up to a 408. Only a few miles so far, but so far very happy with the decision, but again if I were planning a lot of track days, or high miles, I would have gone in a different direction.

_Scott

[Fifty-Two]

The big blocks look and sound great, they are period correct, parts are readily available these days but are not cheap. But they're heavy (unless you ponu up the big bux for an alum block and light weight crank), and take up a lot of room. Some parts are very difficult if not impossible to find off the shelf - like motor mounts and headers. And you'll have to pony up for heavier parts in the rest of the drive train - clutch, trans, diff, etc. And don't forget about other stressed parts, like cooling system, shocks & springs, etc. Certainly not insurmountable problems - just considerations in putting the package together.

Sorry Bob ... Just wanted to defend the FE big blocks a little bit ... ;)

When it comes to the FE motors, the weight and size truly isn't much different than a 351W. An iron block FE with aluminum intake and heads, will weigh in within 75-100lbs of a 351W. From a size standpoint, the FE big blocks aren't nearly the size of the 460 big block motors or even the newer mod motors actually. The FE's fit in the FFR engine bay nearly as easily as the 302/351 blocks.

Overall cost can definitely be more than a small block, but it can be kept reasonable. A mild performance build on an FE can be done for probably around $4k if you have a good pull-out motor to start with (solid block, crank, and rods). You can also spend a boat-load (i.e. $15-20k) on a full aluminum stroker FE with forged everything. The same holds true with really any motor family though.

For things like motor-mounts and headers, both are available directly from FFR - either included with the kits, or separately if needs be. Not hard to source at all.

The rest of the drivetrain will need to be able to support any motor with extra power - big block or small block. If you keep things within reason from a power standpoint, the only real weak link would probably be a standard T-5 transmission. Either an upgrade to a TKO-500/600 or a Levy T-5 would be a prudent choice.

HTH!
- John

[Bobasaurus]

I went supercharged 302. I drive the car as much as possible and l like the economy of the EFI-302 combo. When I really want to go I just let her drift above 3000 RPMs and the Vortech goes to work in a hurry.

Bobby

[Sailor]

How about a MOPAR 440 6 pack setup? Big bucks would keep me from that but a 318 could be built to 400+ hp pretty cheaply. Put on a pistol grip shifter from a 70 Challenger and an air grabber hood scoop from a 70 Roadrunner...... Now that would be a different build. IRS of course.

[Bob Cowan]

Sorry Bob ... Just wanted to defend the FE big blocks a little bit ... ;)



No need to defend the FE motors at all. For a lot of reasons, it's a great choice. Like everything else, it's full of trade offs. but it's a great choice for a lot of people.

[Jethrow]

LS3 is the go :)

All aluminium block, plenty of cubes, compact in size, lots a power out of the box.

What's not to like?

[efnfast]

LS3 is the go :)

All aluminium block, plenty of cubes, compact in size, lots a power out of the box.

What's not to like?

Doesn't sound as good as an SBF or BBF though ... that be the problem =(

[Todd Buttrick]

I'd recommend the same as Wayne Presley had in another thread here;

351w
AFR 185 heads
Comp XE274HR cam
Edelbrock Air Gap RPM manifold

Great balance of price/performance/mpg.

[3kcarbon]

I have the 340HP Ford Racing 306 and its enough for me... What is enough for you may be different. No need in buying more than you want to live with or can use. If money isn't a issue the sky is the limit on choices.