LSx Powered Coupe Build

[nskaats]

My car finally arrived today! I'm anxious to get started to say the least. The next couple days will be spent sorting parts and verifying contents. After a quick look through the car and the packing list I already found I got the wrong springs for the coil overs and at least one of the aluminum panels was ripped off in transport (sheered the self tappers). Once I get everything sorted I'll be able to get to work.

The Plan:
This car will be primarily track oriented with much of it's time spent chasing cones and some occasional road course use. To me everything is a street car no matter how wild, so it's going to be driven as well. It'll be run in local SCCA events, Holley LS Fest, Goodguys Autocross, regional SCCA CAM events, and any other excuse I find to drive it mercilessly. The vast majority of my business is LSx based so I'll be going that route for power. The targets for this build will be under 2,300 lbs and 480-490 rwhp on my Mustang MD1100 chassis dyno.

The Combination:
Gen 3 Coupe Base Kit
LS1 based 347 - Ported 241 castings, hydraulic roller, 12.2:1 compression, flex fuel, 0411 PCM
McLeod or QuarterMaster aluminum mini twin clutch combo
T56 Transmission
3-Link
Moser 8.8
Koni Double Adjustables with R-model springs
Power steering
Windshield wipers (required for some street car events)
Carpet kit
Most likely 18x11 wheels all around to keep it square and allow the best selection of tires for class (200TW required)

The Unknown:
Gauges
Seats
Steering Wheel
Brakes (Leaning toward Wilwood 14" Front and 12.88" Rear)
Wheels (Forgeline is a leading candidate but American has one in their new AR Forged lineup that I really like)
Color (Possibly BMW Santorini Blue)

I'm waiting on a couple more parts before I can fabricate engine mount pedestals for the chassis. Thankfully I kept an old "ventilated" aluminum block I can use for mock up. Once I get those fabricated, find a location to mount some ballast, and add some chassis tie downs for the trailer it's off to powdercoat. I may end up drilling all the rivet holes before going to powder but haven't decided on that for sure. I need to put some thought into that as some panels are going to have rivet nuts and bolts to make for easy track side maintenance. I already got my block and rotating assembly back from the machine shop where everything was cleaned up, honed, and balanced. Assembly on that will begin shortly. Follow along and I'll do my best to update regularly.

[nskaats]

We all have that one friend, right?

[nskaats]

Here's a few pictures I moved over from my intro post. Wiseco 12cc dome pistons to get compression up to a pump gas friendly 12.2:1 that will respond extremely well to E85 when I run that. Rods are Callies Compstars that will easily handle the power level and 8,000 RPM or more. The valve covers are Holley pieces that will give it a bit more of a vintage look. Engine will be full of ARP studs throughout and King Bearings.

[kpeterson]

Nice build plan. I can't say it for sure but have you looked into driveshaft length for a T56 with a live axle? On roadsters I believe it is pretty much a non-player. I don't recall how the coupe's added wheelbase impacts the driveshaft length so maybe it works.

[Jim1855]

Nskaats,

A friend is building a Gen3 Coupe with a Windsor, T56 Magnum and new IRS. The drive shaft will be about 8" between the u-joints. And he's moving the motor forward a bit less than 2 inches. I would expect your drive shaft will be a similar length but I don't know how the solid axle changes the input lengths. Short driveshafts are not a big deal with IRS but are with a solid axle.

I like your build plan. I even like the LSx plan. If Peter Brock can put a LS7/T56 in his Coupe that's good enough for me.

I'm building a Challenge Car with the intention that it will be a streetable track car. I'm more geared to road tracks but may try autocross.

Good luck on your build.

Jim

[nskaats]

The T56 length is always an issue, but I'm planning to move the engine forward a little bit anyway. Partially for that reason, partially for weight distribution.

[nskaats]

I managed to inventory all of my components last night. I'm still missing quite a bit, most importantly the rivet spacing tool. I want to get all of the rivet holes drilled and chassis fabrication done so I can get this thing to powder coating. The other pieces I'll need to move forward are the passenger side engine mount bracket (C6 Corvette piece) and the lower control arms that haven't shipped yet.

[Clover]

Congrats, I am going to follow this build closely as I think an LS in the Coupe should be wicked. The rivet spacing tool has holes drilled ever 3 inches on one side and ever 2 inches on the other side I think. I am guessing you could make your own very easily if you wanted.

[nskaats]

Congrats, I am going to follow this build closely as I think an LS in the Coupe should be wicked. The rivet spacing tool has holes drilled ever 3 inches on one side and ever 2 inches on the other side I think. I am guessing you could make your own very easily if you wanted.

I did not have that info, but I do now. I'm waiting to hear back from Dave. I have plenty to do in the mean time, but if it's going to be a while I can easily make my own.

For those interested in doing the same conversion I do plan to compile a list of parts necessary to build. After taking some measurements this morning I do believe I'm going to convert my T56 to the forward shifter location. I think that would be a much better spot with my longer arms. I'm 6'2" with long arms for my size.

[Mountain-Metalworks]

I did not have that info, but I do now. I'm waiting to hear back from Dave. I have plenty to do in the mean time, but if it's going to be a while I can easily make my own.

For those interested in doing the same conversion I do plan to compile a list of parts necessary to build. After taking some measurements this morning I do believe I'm going to convert my T56 to the forward shifter location. I think that would be a much better spot with my longer arms. I'm 6'2" with long arms for my size.

Have fun with the LS build! I built a Roadster instead of a Coupe but used a LS3/T56M combo and I LOVE it. The power is amazing, the size is very conducive to the space in a FFR, it's super light, and the aftermarket is endless. I'm thinking '33 next before a Coupe, but follow just about every LS build regardless of model.

Keep up the good work I'll be following along!

-TJ

[nskaats]

Updates!! The parts trickled in from Factory Five along with a couple other vendors over a few weeks so I got a chance to get started on this thing. I'm trying to get any cutting, drilling, or welding done before the chassis gets coated. So everything will be in place but not torqued down yet.

The first order of business was to get rid of the Ford engine mount pedestals since I'll have no use for those. I have to admit it felt kinda good to cut Ford mounts out! The long awaited missing C6 engine mount bracket showed up so I'll be working on getting the engine in place over the next few days. I'll have to build a pedestal for the bushing to sit on that'll be around 2.5-3" up from the frame rail just from eye-balling it. The end goal is to set the engine as low as possible with the drain plug being dead even with the bottom of the chassis.

[nskaats]

The front and rear suspension pieces finally all showed up so I got all of that in along with the Moser 8.8. There won't be a ton of changes made there yet aside from mounting tabs for ballast up front and making the chrome cover go away.

[nskaats]

I also went with a new fuel tank, fuel level sender, and pump assembly. The factory pump got swapped out for a Racetronix 340 LPH pump and heavier wiring. The braided AN line is all E85 compatible and hung using billet P-Clamps that are mounted to the chassis using rivet nuts (I refuse to use self tappers on anything). I'm still working on running it through the tunnel up to the front of the car where I'll hang the regulator.

Progress has been a little slow while parts trickled in, but I'm moving nonetheless.

[GoDadGo]

Bravo Fellow Dark Sider, Bravo!

Steve's Stupid Question:
How long do you think the drive shaft is going to be from U-Joint Centerline to U-Joint Centerline?

Also, this site may be of use to you for headers, or NOT:
http://www.schoenfeldheaders.com/imcaump-modified4.html

Good Luck & Congratulations!

[nskaats]

Bravo Fellow Dark Sider, Bravo!

Steve's Stupid Question:
How long do you think the drive shaft is going to be?

I think when I talked to Dan, he said his LSx coupe driveshaft was pretty short. Something like 8 inches. Being a solid axle car I'm doing a few things to avoid putting the u-joints at a high angle of misalignment. The first will be moving the engine forward a bit to move weight forward and add driveshaft length. Using the standard T56 helps since it's about an inch and a half shorter than the magnum. Running the heavier springs will also avoid excessive travel in the rear end.

[GoDadGo]

I'm 10.5" centerline to centerline (U-Joints) but had to move the engine pretty far forward to make it fit.
Driveline and pinion angle was a mess on my MK-4 so pay close attention to those angles when you mock up your driveline.
For the record, I am so excited to see an LS-powered Coupe with a 3 Link with the correct number of forward spinning gears.
To me the LS is the perfect engine for these cars, bar none.
(Sorry Ford Fans But You All Know How I Am!)

[Bob Cowan]

My suggestion is to get rid of or modify the factory tank. In a hard right turn, the fuel will move to the left side of the tank and uncover the pick up, starving the engine. You need something with a real collector box in it. Or you'll need to install a separate surge tank somewhere.

You might be able to get away with a large Holley Hydromat. But you'll have to remove the stock baffle to use it.

Also, I would use push-lock hose instead of braided. It's a lot easier to work with, and it's cheaper. But - most importantly - it's lighter. Since you're building a race car, adding lightness is a primary goal. You'll save 5-10 pounds on your fuel and oiling system.

[nskaats]

My suggestion is to get rid of or modify the factory tank. In a hard right turn, the fuel will move to the left side of the tank and uncover the pick up, starving the engine. You need something with a real collector box in it. Or you'll need to install a separate surge tank somewhere.

You might be able to get away with a large Holley Hydromat. But you'll have to remove the stock baffle to use it.

Also, I would use push-lock hose instead of braided. It's a lot easier to work with, and it's cheaper. But - most importantly - it's lighter. Since you're building a race car, adding lightness is a primary goal. You'll save 5-10 pounds on your fuel and oiling system.

I appreciate the input! I've actually considered all of the above and ended up going this route mostly for added weight. I'm still estimating a completed weight of around 2,300 lbs which will be 200 lbs light for class. It's difficult to add 200 lbs of ballast so I'm adding a little here and there, but most of it will be in lead form low on the front of the frame.

I plan to run with a full tank at all times on autocross. By the time the car hits a road course it will have a cell in it for sure.

[GoDadGo]

Nick,

How far forward would you have to place the engine in order to get the drive shaft to about 10-12"?

I know the T56 is longer than the ZF 6-Speed that I'm running, but my wheelbase is 5" shorter than the Daytona and my differential (Dana-44 Style) is longer in the snoot by about 1.5" than the 8.8 Ford style pumpkin. What worked for my MK-4 (SBC) was to align the exhaust with side pipe exit location on the body. It gave me enough room to get the driveshaft length and pinion angle taken care of.

How far can you scoot your driveline forward compared to the stock location for the Ford power plants?

Steve

PS: I just sent you a PM.

[nskaats]

I can't really say since any evidence of the Ford mounts are long gone. I can't really use headers for reference either since I'm fabricating from scratch on those.

[nskaats]

Playing around with engine location a bit tonight. If I convert to the forward shifter location, this location puts the shifter right in the center of the hole. The primary target of sitting the oil pan level with the bottom of the frame should be easy for mockup, them move it up maybe 1/8" just for good measure. I'm still playing around with a few things. I plan to build some adjustability into the mounts so I can adjust driveline angles, etc.

[GoDadGo]

Nick,

Mock that baby up with the T-56 attached and you can figure out how long that pesky drive shaft needs to be.
If the driveshaft is 10-to-14" then it will greatly reduce the angles at full droop and you can likely end up with no bind as well.
Also, look at your pinion angle of your pumpkin (differential) to figure out at what angle you want your engine and transmission to sit at.
Sorry to be a pain in the back of your front, but this drove me nuts because my pumpkin pointed down 2.0 degrees and my engine 2.0 degrees up.
In the end I reworked a few things, shortened my lower control arms to 16 7/8" and moved the upper shocks back a bit to get all the angles perfect.
My other ulterior motive was to better center the wheel within the wheel arch since the MK-4 rear wheel sits a bit aft of the wheel arch center-line.

Steve

Good Luck & Can't Wait To See Your Dream Come Together!

[Bob Cowan]

For a street car, the T56 is about the best transmission you can get. Good gear spread, smooth, strong, and inexpensive.

But for a race car, not so much. It's big and bulky, and it's heavy. Even on the race track, you rarely use 5th, and never use 6th. You should really consider using a version of the T5. Smaller, lighter, and only 5 gears.

Next winter, I'd like to pull the T56 out of my track car and replace it with a built T5 from Gordon. It will be smaller, and save me about 50-60 pounds. And I'll get a 5th gear that I can actually use.

I know you want to add weight to meet a class requirement. But you can add as much ballast as you need, that's not hard at all. And you can add it wherever you want to get the balance of the car exactly where you want it. Got a little oversteer? Shift some weight to the rear. 53% on the right? Shift some weight to the left. It's an enviable problem to have.

[nskaats]

Nick,

Mock that baby up with the T-56 attached and you can figure out how long that pesky drive shaft needs to be.
If the driveshaft is 10-to-14" then it will greatly reduce the angles at full droop and you can likely end up with no bind as well.
Also, look at your pinion angle of your pumpkin (differential) to figure out at what angle you want your engine and transmission to sit at.
Sorry to be a pain in the back of your front, but this drove me nuts because my pumpkin pointed down 2.0 degrees and my engine 2.0 degrees up.
In the end I reworked a few things, shortened my lower control arms to 16 7/8" and moved the upper shocks back a bit to get all the angles perfect.
My other ulterior motive was to better center the wheel within the wheel arch since the MK-4 rear wheel sits a bit aft of the wheel arch center-line.

Steve

Good Luck & Can't Wait To See Your Dream Come Together!

This was an initial mockup based on measurements alone so I could order materials I need to make the pedestals. The trans will go in with it next time so I can finalize everything. Based on initial measurements I'll be around 10" from tailshaft to pinion flange. I may move it further forward and see what happens.


For a street car, the T56 is about the best transmission you can get. Good gear spread, smooth, strong, and inexpensive.

But for a race car, not so much. It's big and bulky, and it's heavy. Even on the race track, you rarely use 5th, and never use 6th. You should really consider using a version of the T5. Smaller, lighter, and only 5 gears.

Next winter, I'd like to pull the T56 out of my track car and replace it with a built T5 from Gordon. It will be smaller, and save me about 50-60 pounds. And I'll get a 5th gear that I can actually use.

I know you want to add weight to meet a class requirement. But you can add as much ballast as you need, that's not hard at all. And you can add it wherever you want to get the balance of the car exactly where you want it. Got a little oversteer? Shift some weight to the rear. 53% on the right? Shift some weight to the left. It's an enviable problem to have.

I would consider something like a TKO600, but already have the T56 and I've built so many of them over the years it's nice to have some extra parts. Even being a racecar it's going to get some street miles including the possibility of doing One Lap of America. My other "racecar" is a 14.1:1 compression LS combo that sees street miles too. To me they're all street cars. So while being more of an afterthought, the overdrives wouldn't be a bad thing to retain since I'm not worried about losing weight.

[GoDadGo]

Thanks for the reply and I can't wait to see how you lay this sucker out.

[nskaats]

It's been a few months since I've updated. Now that LS Fest is over and the rush on everyone else's projects, I've been able to get back on this beast. The pedal assemblies are in place and I managed to get a mockup trans to hang everything and fab some pedestals for the engine mounts. With the engine in place, I can put a straight edge across the frame rails and just barely contact the lowest point. It's as low as possible.

[GoDadGo]

When Form Follows Function Things Just Seem To Turn Our Great!
Looks Extremely Good & Extremely Simple!
Told You I'd Be Watching!
Good Luck!

[TheBabyBadger]

Should be fun to watch. Subscribed.

[nskaats]

Quick pic drop! Sheet metal mockup and drilling has begun. The engine bay and front end sheet metal are almost all complete. The cockpit is almost complete as well. I'll try to get more pics up soon.

I've found one major PITA is the self tappers that were used to attach the sheet metal for shipping. Some areas won't be seen, which is fine. Others are very visible and really screw up my spacing (OCD trigger) so I get out the TIG to fill the hole in the aluminum and the chassis before re-drilling for a rivet.

[GoDadGo]

Glad you suffer from the OCD Gene because your car will turn out amazing because of it.
Also, please keep posting pics so that I can muster up the courage to build one of these down the road.
Until then, it's back writing tuition checks for Baby Go-Dad and swinging wrenches on my 85% completed Dark Side Dart MK-4.

https://youtu.be/pI1y9UvANEM

[nskaats]

If you only knew how much I hate welding thin gauge aluminum. Most of my day to day fab work is chassis parts, turbo piping in stainless and aluminum, exhaust...things like that. I just don't practice sheet metal much so I don't have the patience for it.

[GoDadGo]

Nick,

How well do you think a BBC with a Power Glide would fit?
It could be the ultimate Street Drag Car that comes in a box.

Steve

[nskaats]

Nick,

How well do you think a BBC with a Power Glide would fit?
It could be the ultimate Street Drag Car that comes in a box.

Steve

Not sure how well that would fit with a big block. It would be tight, but I'm sure it can be done. I'm not afraid to fab!

That actually brings up a potential future project I've been considering. I think this chassis would make a great heads up drag car and I'm strongly considering doing it for some small tire class racing. I have in mind a small cubic inch single turbo lsx combo with a glide behind it. I could make 1,200-1,500 hp with ease. With my resources it wouldn't be an issue at all to get it down the track.

[GoDadGo]

I big inch SBC (Dart) and a Glide or Turbo 400 or maybe a Clutch-Assist G-Force 5-Speed would be a "Less Scary Option" for those of us who don't want to go that fast.

While I'm 99% sure that I'll easily hit the 11's with my 383 MK-4, I'm equally sure that Gulfport Dragway will send me home since they abide by the IHRA rulebook.

The Type-65 would keep those pesky safety folks off our collective backs which is why my old car was fitted with a 6 point bar.

Good luck and I can't wait to see the other solid axel 6-Speed Factory Five hit the road.

Just know that your car will be Way, Way, Way faster than mine will ever be.

https://www.gforcetransmissions.com/productoverview.asp

Good Luck Fellow Dark Sider!

[nskaats]

I've been extra busy on customer projects and haven't had much time to update in here. While the heat in the shop is getting fixed, I figured now would be a good time to sit in the office and catch up on a few things. Most of the interior sheet metal is finished and we hung the body so I could start working things around that. I'd like to start fabricating headers soon as time allows (I even bought a new band saw at PRI for that job). I've also decided not to use the FFR side pipes as the pipe fitment in the flange is absolutely awful. I can only imagine how much power those would kill.

A couple things I decided to change were brake lines and I modified the radiator duct. I decided to go with black coated AN hoses and bulkhead fittings for clutch and brake lines. All hung with billet P-clamps of course. I'll get pics of those later. The radiator duct I opened up holes to allow access to the control arm bolts so they can be serviced without removing any sheet metal. They interfered and wouldn't allow the sheet metal to sit flat anyway, so it seemed like a good idea. I'm still tossing around the idea of pitching the FFR radiator too. I'm not sure who produces it, but the quality leaves a lot to be desired.

I think the next big step is going to be getting everything disassembled and getting the chassis to powder coat.

I also started blocking some seams on the hood just to see how bad that would be. Thankfully not as bad as it looked. Though some of the panel alignment on the main body shell is so bad it'll require a lot of buildup and working to be respectable.

[GoDadGo]

Fellow Dark Sider,

How Long Did Your Driveshaft End Up Being?

Steve

[P100DHG]

The birds eye view of the panels and the body sitting on the car is so helpful. It’s exactly what I’ve been looking for. Thank you for that shot!

Why do you suspect FFR didn’t continue the panels down and cover the frame structure under the hood. Air flow? I am thinking about continueing and covering the frame structure entirely under the hood and extending the panels. What’s your thoughts?

[nskaats]

Fellow Dark Sider,

How Long Did Your Driveshaft End Up Being?

Steve

I'm not sure off hand. I'll have to check for you but I think the length from tailshaft to flange is around 16.5-17"


The birds eye view of the panels and the body sitting on the car is so helpful. It’s exactly what I’ve been looking for. Thank you for that shot!

Why do you suspect FFR didn’t continue the panels down and cover the frame structure under the hood. Air flow? I am thinking about continueing and covering the frame structure entirely under the hood and extending the panels. What’s your thoughts?

You're welcome. If you need any specific shots let me know and I'll try to get them. As far as the design side you'd have to talk to someone at FFR for that part.

[smithtlw]

Awesome work. Thanks for sharing - I have an LS1/T56 slated for my genII coupe so I am watching closely. That corvette engine mount seems like a great way to go. It really simplifies the measuring.

Todd

[GoDadGo]

I'll have to check for you but I think the length from tailshaft to flange is around 16.5-17"

The lower control arms are 17 5/8" so your in and out movement of the yoke will be nearly non-existent!

[Logan]

Nick - build is looking great so far. I’m in the planning stages for my Gen3 Coupe R build, which will see serious autocross and track time while still being street legal and driven on the road VERY often.

I’m not brand loyal, and I’ve owned GM and Ford products both. Current daily driver is a 2017 Mustang GT Performance Pack which run in CAM-C several times a month pretty much all year long other than out 2-3 month “winter” break we take here in the south. I love the Coyote now that I’ve owned it, and had expected to build one for the Coupe R.....but I’m really thinking hard about the LS now too. Mostly due to lighter weight, smaller package, and cheaper. My favorite thing about the Coyote is the rev ceiling. Tuned, and with the known issues of Oil Pump Gears and Crank Sprocket Parts upgraded to billet steel variants, I’m revving to 8,000rpm. I love the idea of better torque curve at lower RPM which the LS can provide, but I don’t want to lose the high RPM ceiling if I can help it. I’ve heard of taking an LS to 8k (or beyond) but I don’t know what it requires.....yet. I’ll be watching, and researching, and thinking more on all this.

Great work, keep it up!

[nskaats]

Nick - build is looking great so far. I’m in the planning stages for my Gen3 Coupe R build, which will see serious autocross and track time while still being street legal and driven on the road VERY often.

I’m not brand loyal, and I’ve owned GM and Ford products both. Current daily driver is a 2017 Mustang GT Performance Pack which run in CAM-C several times a month pretty much all year long other than out 2-3 month “winter” break we take here in the south. I love the Coyote now that I’ve owned it, and had expected to build one for the Coupe R.....but I’m really thinking hard about the LS now too. Mostly due to lighter weight, smaller package, and cheaper. My favorite thing about the Coyote is the rev ceiling. Tuned, and with the known issues of Oil Pump Gears and Crank Sprocket Parts upgraded to billet steel variants, I’m revving to 8,000rpm. I love the idea of better torque curve at lower RPM which the LS can provide, but I don’t want to lose the high RPM ceiling if I can help it. I’ve heard of taking an LS to 8k (or beyond) but I don’t know what it requires.....yet. I’ll be watching, and researching, and thinking more on all this.

Great work, keep it up!

I totally missed your comment until now, sorry for the delayed response. I've been working non stop and had some on/off health issues keeping me occupied.

I'm not exactly a brand loyal guy either. I like what I like and certain manufacturers appealed to me more during certain time periods (early 60s Mopars anyone?). I briefly considered a Coyote for this build. It really is a great engine for what it is. Previous modulars have always been a bit of a joke in the performance engine building industry. The only selling point that seemed to keep them alive is you can cram them full of boost, which makes it a sturdy engine but not a great one. Ford finally got it right with with Coyote. Some great heads a few more cubic inches made a world of difference (though the bore spacing is still lacking). I felt the LS was a much better fit for my goals with this chassis. From your comment, I think it would be a better fit for yours as well. It's physically smaller, a little lighter, lower center of gravity, easier to work on, cheaper to modify and maintain, has greater displacement potential, dead reliable, more user-friendly factory PCM, and it'll make more power per dollar every time.

As far as RPM, it's very easy to turn the same kind of RPM as the Coyote. The engine in my Formula is a 376 cubic inch LS with a hydraulic roller cam and stock rockers that regularly sees 8,500 RPM. Nothing super expensive or fancy in it, all off-the-shelf parts that I use and sell every day. I'd be happy to guide you through the parts selection process if you're looking for reliable RPM and power.

[nskaats]

Some updates after a bit of a hiatus:

The chassis took about 7 weeks at powder coat. Sometimes you get put on the back burner but I'm ok with that. Within a couple days of coming back from powder coat, I started moving my business anyway....into the building my powder coater was using. They moved across the street so I took over their old space which works very well for both of us. Moving all the lifts, dyno, equipment, parts, etc took up quite a bit of time and energy. I'm fairly certain I never want to do any of it again.

The chassis got blasted, primer, base, and clear. So it should be pretty durable. Color is Bronze Chrome with a high gloss clear. Pictures don't do it justice. The color looks amazing in the sunlight.

I also started on the engine blueprinting and assembly. The cylinder heads are assembled and ready to go on once I get the short block together.

[Tree]

Congratulations on the new place. I think the powder coat looks phenomenal. You can see the color pop along some of the larger pieces in the photo like the roll bars. Can't wait to see it start to come together.

[plschulten]

LS2 crate motor in my coupe, did 408/410 HP/Torque at the tire. 32K miles on it now runs great burns NO oil, just lots of power! I get 28 MPG@ 90 in 6th gear! Super flat torque curve. Gen II weighs 2373 lbs.

[LSXConcepts]

any updates on this? looking to do a similar build so I am quite interested in your experience on this

[Logan]

Pinging @nskaats...

The forum demands updates!

[nskaats]

Sorry for the delays. It's been a busy few months. I'm done traveling for the year (minus the PRI show), so I'm back on the coupe! The front and rear suspensions are all bolted in and torqued down. Fuel tank is in place and lines run up to the front. I'm very happy with the titanium finish fittings and hardware that Deatschwerks sent me. I also used them on one of my other cars over the summer. They look great and hold up very nicely.

Saturday we started putting some cockpit sheet metal in place. I need to figure out a color for the engine bay sheet metal and we'll get that in this week hopefully.

[nskaats]

Few more pics

[edwardb]

Nice progress. Have some bad news unfortunately. You've fallen victim to the upside down upper ball joint mount error. Has happened on a number of builds, so don't take it too personally. The UCA's of that vintage (they've changed again recently...) come out of the box upside down and have to be dissassembled and the ball joint mounts flipped over. The upper ball joint has to point out, like this picture from the manual. You won't get the proper front end geometry or alignment with it the way you have it now. Sorry about that.

https://i867.photobucket.com/albums/ab234/edwardb123/Factory%20Five%20Daytona%20Coupe/Misc%20Pics/UCA_zpsr4cycmg7.jpg (https://s867.photobucket.com/user/edwardb123/media/Factory%20Five%20Daytona%20Coupe/Misc%20Pics/UCA_zpsr4cycmg7.jpg.html)

[nskaats]

Excellent catch, Edward! I actually didn't even notice. I took for granted that they were previously assembled. I'll get that straightened out this evening. My assistant will be less than thrilled. It took all 34 lbs of him to torque those bolts down lol

[edwardb]

Excellent catch, Edward! I actually didn't even notice. I took for granted that they were previously assembled. I'll get that straightened out this evening. My assistant will be less than thrilled. It took all 34 lbs of him to torque those bolts down lol

I saw the pic. Cute. No issue with torquing those particular bolts down. But FYI, in case you haven't gotten that far yet, those bolts have to be loosened for the front end alignment. So you'll be back to them. To correct the ball joint issue, I hope you realize it's a little more complicated than those particular bolts. The ball joint has to come out of the spindle, removed, then flip the plate over, then all back together again. The simplest way to flip, once you get to that point, is to remove the two pivot lock bolts (the same ones you mentioned) back by the cross shaft pivots. Then flip the whole assembly over.

[nskaats]

That was the plan to flip the whole assembly. Path of least resistance.

I know the bolts will have to be loosened up. I want everything tight for now. My alignment guy will handle that.

[nskaats]

Update: The engine is together! I made some time to get the short block blueprinted and assembled and finish up the engine a couple weeks ago. The engine is down at my shop now waiting on the transmission. I took advantage of the Black Friday sale from Stainless Works and ordered my header kit as well. 1 7/8" primaries with a 3.5" collector.

I've also decided it makes more sense for me to go stand alone engine management on this one. For what it would cost to buy a stock PCM, harness, and all of my gauges I can buy a Holley Terminator X system with the 12.3" Pro Dash and have far more functionality.

I still need to pull that from the other car and freshen it up. Thankfully a T56 is pretty quick and easy to go through. So that's next on the list.

[nskaats]

Few more pics of the engine and the header kit

[nskaats]

More lost time in the hospital, but back to work catching up and was at least able to set the engine in place for more mock up and possibly header fabrication soon.

[nskaats]

Foot box and engine bay panels came back from powder coating. They were done in anodized silver so they still look fairly natural while being protected. I went ahead and mocked them up because I wanted to see them and I'm impatient.

[nskaats]

It's been months since I've updated here, but things have been total chaos. I had a feeling our business would slow down during all the pandemic nonsense, but we've been slammed at the shop.

Updates:
-My son and I started permanently mounting some aluminum panels in the cockpit and engine bay
-Pulled my T56 and disassembled to figure out what it needed before putting it in the car. Everything appeared to be solid with the exception of a twisted mainshaft, so that's getting replaced during the rebuild. It's also getting an upgrade package from The Gear Box
-I decided to compromise a bit on the clutch in the name of street manners. I went with a Spec 10.5" Stage 2+ clutch kit with aluminum flywheel and billet aluminum pressure plate. The 1" smaller diameter and aluminum combo is good for a 20 lb weight savings over stock while still maintaining street manners. I did get a chance to order a second one and install it in a friend's Corvette and I'm extremely pleased with the engagement and feel of the clutch.
-I opted to go with a Holley TerminatorX EFI system for this car instead of the stock ECU combination. For almost the exact same price as it would cost me to go stock, I have far more capabilities with this system and I have a few surprises in store for this. The system is here and I'm working on the install now.

Rebuilding the trans will be the next step. Once that's done it can go in the car and everything is mounted in it's proper position. From there, headers can be fabricated. Once the headers are fabricated I'm really just a few hours of work from getting the engine fired up for the first time.

I'll post pictures soon as time allows.

On a side note I have surgery this Thursday and hoping to get my heart straightened out so I can get back to a somewhat normal life...which means more wrench time!

[smithtlw]

Thanks for updating. I am glad to see you using the Holley solution. I've been thinking Fitech with the LS Ultimate stand-alone because I don't want to be tied to someone to tune it nor mess with the whole HP tuners thing. Seems Holley is a better option than Fitech based on the research I've done.

Good luck with your surgery. Hope all goes well.

Todd

[nskaats]

Thanks for updating. I am glad to see you using the Holley solution. I've been thinking Fitech with the LS Ultimate stand-alone because I don't want to be tied to someone to tune it nor mess with the whole HP tuners thing. Seems Holley is a better option than Fitech based on the research I've done.

Good luck with your surgery. Hope all goes well.

Todd

Without a doubt, do NOT use FiTech. The product is lackluster at best and their service is nonexistent. We're at a point where we won't let a FiTech car in the shop anymore. Many shops and tuners in this industry are going the same route. Granted a lot of the issues we've seen are likely installer error on the customer end, but every single car I've seen with a FiTech system has been a trainwreck. The Holley systems are similar in price and exponentially more capable.

The stock ECU can do everything I need to do for my project, and I can tune them in my sleep as I do it all day most days, but for the same money it just made sense to go with a more capable system with more features for me to take advantage of.

Appreciate the well wishes. Hopefully I can be back in the shop within a few days!

[nskaats]

Main body shell went back on so we could roll it around for our open house back in June. I really needed it on so I could fabricated the headers once the trans is mounted.

[nskaats]

Spec 10.5" Stage 2+ clutch kit with aluminum flywheel and billet aluminum pressure plate. A stock clutch and flywheel assembly is 51-52 lbs, so the weight savings is great for a perfectly drivable clutch. Aside from the 20+ lbs removed from the back of the crankshaft, having a flywheel and pressure plate with wear surfaces that can be easily replaced is a bonus. No more machining or replacing flywheels and pressure plates, just replace wear surface which is much cheaper.

[nskaats]

The T56 came in and got torn down. The twisted mainshaft is always an unwelcome surprise, but easily replaced. I just media blasted the case components and getting ready to order the rebuild kit so I can get this in place soon.

[nskaats]

Holley Terminator X system came in. I'll get some install pics soon.

[LSXConcepts]

Good choice on choosing to go with the Terminator X, if you need some help with tuning one of my dealers tunes these on a daily basis and he can tune remotely if you ever need any help with it

[nskaats]

Good choice on choosing to go with the Terminator X, if you need some help with tuning one of my dealers tunes these on a daily basis and he can tune remotely if you ever need any help with it

Thanks. I feel it was an excellent choice. I actually tune these and others all day every day. I spend most of my days on the dyno anymore.

[nskaats]

I finished the T56 on Saturday and it's ready to go into the car this weekend. That ended up being way more hassle than it's worth. Realistically I could have bought a new trans for what it cost to go through that one. Plus the wait time for parts. The mainshaft was twisted, 2nd gear had damaged teeth on the synchronizer side, 3rd gear had similar issues, and a few other odds and ends.

So I ended up ordering the Stage II upgrade kit from the gear box, along with a complete bearing kit, new inner and outer 1-2 synchro rings, new mainshaft, and some miscellaneous hardware to replace. Hopefully it'll work! I haven't built one of these things in a decade and it isn't exactly like riding bike.

My trans mount should be here tomorrow. I'm not sure about the AN line for the clutch hydraulics or my remote bleeder fittings. Those were ordered directly from Holley over the weekend and haven't shipped yet. One way or another the trans is going in this weekend so I can start fabricating headers. Even if I have to pull the trans back out to change the slave cylinder fittings later.

[nskaats]

Updates:

The Spec aluminum flywheel, 10.5" 2+ clutch disch, billet pressure plate and bellhousing went in smooth as can be. Measured for installed height and it fell right into the acceptable range without and shims necessary so that's nice. I also installed the AN adapter and remote bleeder setup before the trans went in. The trans went in from the bottom with a little maneuvering but not as bad as I expected.

[nskaats]

Next up we started on headers. I used a header kit from Stainless Works with 1 7/8" primaries and a 3.5" collector. Headers were designed with spark plug access and room for plug wires in mind. I like easy maintenance! They're attached to a Vibrant 3.5" 90 degree bend via Vibrant V-bands and dump into a Vibrant merge collector flipped backwards to split it back into dual 3 inch pipes to maintain the correct look for the car.

I'm planning on running a set of auger style muffler inserts on each side for sound. They are a bit restrictive which I why I stepped up in diameter a bit to gain back some exhaust flow. They will be removable just in case I decide to swap them out for something else or run wide open at certain tracks.

[nskaats]

Passenger side header went together about the same as the driver's side. Just a bit quicker since I had more room to play with. Next step is to finish weld all of the primaries, set them back in place, tack them to the flange and begin the process of finish welding.

[ProJoe]

everything is looking great Nick. love the header work.

Question on your engine placement, how did you decide where it would sit forward/rear in the chassis? also what's your approximate driveshaft length looking like?

Thanks man! great work again.

[nskaats]

everything is looking great Nick. love the header work.

Question on your engine placement, how did you decide where it would sit forward/rear in the chassis? also what's your approximate driveshaft length looking like?

Thanks man! great work again.

Thanks Joe! Engine placement had various factors since I'm using an LS, a T56, and a solid axle instead of the usual options. Shifter placement was a factor as well as making sure I have enough driveshaft length. Being a solid axle I wanted to be careful not to have it too short and end up with any extreme u-joint angles as the rear suspension moves. Even though there won't be too much rear suspension movement it still had to be taken into consideration. I also wanted the engine a bit forward to help move some weight over the front tires.

[nskaats]

Almost ready for the first test fire. Over the past couple weeks, I finished header fabrication, the accessory drive system, finished the fuel system, collected a few more parts, and did some temporary wiring for the Holley EFI system. This morning I finished a few fittings, fluids, made plug wires, loaded my base calibration into the Holley ECU, and gave everything a good once over. It's ready to start for the first time once I add fuel. I called it quits for the day since my friend Dean wasn't there. He's got plenty of hours in this thing and quite frankly a lot of the motivation when I've not been feeling it due to health issues and stress from work. So I'm going to wait to start it until tomorrow when he's able to be there with me. I'll get some more pictures uploaded soon.

[nskaats]

First Start Video (https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=2714455542142511&id=1811991432388931)

The engine came to life today! My son Austin got to light it off for the first time. He's been telling everyone ever since. Thankfully I've done so many of these Holley systems I was able to get pretty close on the base file and it fired with ease as soon as we got fuel in it. Found one fuel leak at a bad fitting, but no major issues.

[bspaulsen]

Congrats on the fire, those headers look great. Have you decided on an intake system? - I'm digging the look of the dual CAI for my LS (https://www.lsxceleration.com/holley-intech-cold-air-intake-for-2008-2013-6-2l-ls3-corvette-c6-223-07/)3 if I can make it fit.

[nskaats]

I haven't really decided yet. It will depend on where everything else ends up. A lot of that is still up in the air. As much as I want to do carbon fiber or aluminum, I may end up using stainless just to add some weight over the nose of the car

[ProJoe]

congrats on the first start!

[nskaats]

I knew I was bad at keeping this updated...but damn, it's been over a year. So after the first start we've done some work, but with the current state of the world most of my focus has been on running the businesses and family.

I stumbled on the right deal on a set of CCW Race Classics in 18x11 that I'm going to use. Temporarily it has a set of take off BFG Rival S tires on it in 315s for mockup. The interior panels are permanently mounted and sealed now. The powder coated engine bay panels had a mishap with brake parts cleaner, so they got pulled out and redone in matte black this time. The rivets and titanium fittings offer a nice contrast against the black and this coating should be a bit more durable, so I'm good with it.

The RF harness had all the unnecessary stuff removed. My Holley EFI harness was then integrated to the fuse panel to allow them to work together instead of everything running separate and wiring all over the place. The ECU was mounted to a simple bracket I made that fits under the passenger side of the dash. The diagnostic LEDs should be easily visible without having to remove anything. I also added wiring for backup lights which I'll add when body work is done. The aluminum panel for the top of the trans tunnel was cut and a removable panel installed to accommodate the shifter location as well as allowing access to the shifter without pulling the trans. The Holley 12.3" Pro Dash was mocked up so we could get everything wired in place as well.

I used an ICT Billet battery tray to mount that up front along with a marine battery. They usually have thicker plates which are less susceptible to vibration damage plus a great reserve capacity and studs for connecting the ECU or accessories. The coolant pipes were made of 308 stainless and TIG welded. I used a Canton reservoir for a fill point on the cooling system and mounted that up higher in the chassis to make bleeding the system a bit easier. For the intake tube I used a single 4" diameter 90 degree carbon fiber tube and a K&N air filter.

[nskaats]

More Pics

Video from today: https://fb.watch/auPLx-yR2s/

[q4stix]

Great to see a progress update!

I saw the video on FB this morning but glad to see more of the steps along the way too. Sounds mean for sure! Are you going to do anything to quiet it down from the current state?

[nskaats]

Great to see a progress update!

I saw the video on FB this morning but glad to see more of the steps along the way too. Sounds mean for sure! Are you going to do anything to quiet it down from the current state?

I definitely have to quiet it down to get past the SCCA noise police, among others at various tracks. It's not terribly loud right now but I think at wide open there's not way I'll get through. Since I've V-banded my side pipes I think I'm going to go ahead and make two pair of pipes. One for normal use and one for the venues that give us grief over noise.

[jdm65]

Looks great!! Wheels look excellent too, CCWs always a great choice :)

Really big fan of your coolant pipes and ECU location. I'm also planning to mount my Link ECU there

[nskaats]

Bringing this thread back up. Life has thrown quite a few curveballs since I last posted this. Between two businesses, kids, customer cars, managing a Jr Dragster for one kid and about to buy another...I lost focus. I've started back on the car. Currently working on getting the Holley 12.3" Pro Dash mounted in the car, then on to tidy up the wiring and moving forward. I'll try to get more pictures up soon.

[Namrups]

Glad to see your back at it!!