engine install tips/hints

[broku518]

Hello.
Just wondering here. I am about to drop dart347/tko600 in. I am curious to know what should I pay attention to.
1)I guess the engine should be leveled.
2)When looking from below, all components ( rear end/drive shaft/ tranny/ engine) should form a straight line.
3)When looking from the side, is it acceptable to have some degree of variations? Or angle before start using spacers.

Thanks
Martin

[NAZ]

Typically an engine / trans sits at an angle of a couple degrees or so (angled down at the trans output end). If you have a carb then you will probably notice that the mating surface where the carb sets on the manifold is also angled a couple degrees down in front so that the carb sits level. As for the lateral alignment -- in a perfect world the center-line of the crankshaft should be aligned with the rear end pinion shaft. Some engines are offset to one side or the other and will only pose a problem if this offset results in the driveshaft angled excessively and the shorter the driveshaft the less offset that can be tolerated. However, the crankshaft plane must be parallel to the pinion shaft plane or you will be setting yourself up for out of phase vibration.

Search the forums for "pinion angle" to get a better understanding of why the angle of the pinion shaft must match the angle of the crankshaft. It has to do with phasing of the u-joints and is true for vertical as well as horizontal.

[Joee]

I have found the best way to get it in is to have the front end lower than the back end of the car. So jack up the rear or put rear tires on blocks or ramps. It will just line itself up; motor on motor mounts and trans tail shaft on trans mount. I find it easiest to install tans A frame and mount after the motor and trans are in. Then go under and install A frame. With respect to everything lining up that you may need to work on once motor n trans are in. You may or may not need to shim the trans mount to raise the tail shaft then next is the pinion angle adjustments.

[GoDadGo]

Ditto / Lift The Rear & Slide It In:
https://youtu.be/3f1Q4aS5SG4

Ottid / Lift The Rear & Slide It Out:
https://youtu.be/Vhbftk4AP4k

[phileas_fogg]

In contrast to JoeE, I prefer to have the transmission A-frame in place before installing the engine-transmission assembly. I don't believe there's any compelling argument either way; it's just a matter of which pros outweigh the other cons. If you're doing the job alone, then you're probably better off installing the A-frame like JoeE - after the engine-transmission assembly is in place.

Either way you do it, however, be sure to test fit the A-frame BEFORE getting anything in the air. My A-frame required significant grinding on the forward legs before it would fit.


John

P.S. I found this thread http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?22594-Driveline-Setup-(aka-Pinion-Angle) to be extremely helpful in understanding the pinion angle adjustments.

[Jeff Kleiner]

Get the chassis as high as is practical (make sure your jackstand placement won't interfere with the hoist legs as you roll it into position) with the nose down and tail up. An engine leveler is invaluable and makes it a 10 minute one man job.

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj43/jkleiner/Mk4%207276/100_1942.jpg

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj43/jkleiner/Mk4%207276/100_1943.jpg

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj43/jkleiner/Mk4%207276/100_1948.jpg

I always do 'em with the A frame out. Good luck!

Jeff

[Papa]

I just did this, and the advice you are getting is the same I received and it was definitely easier than I expected. I installed mine with the A-Frame in place and had no issues, but this seems to be one area that there is disagreement over. I think you'll be fine either way.

Get the back of the car up and be sure that your engine stand will still fit under the front (I had to raise the front of the car a few inches).

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4465/38016013611_8ec8d92bd6_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/ZVm1ox)

Get the engine angled to clear the front of the chassis where the radiator mounts to.

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4464/37317405224_ba9488e8de_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/YRBssm)

Use lots of friends and take your time. Angle the engine and lower a bit, adjust the angle, push back a bit and lower a bit more, repeat until the mounts are properly sitting on the frame, and admire your work!

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4496/26250462499_3c945c6820_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/FZEtX2)

Things to watch for:

I had someone guiding the trans in from under the car.
Remove the yoke from the trans if it's installed. Remember that your FFR drive line has a yoke installed already.
Be sure the engine and trans mounts are in place before you start.
Have a jack handy incase you need it.
Have the beer on ice for when the job is done!

[Itchief]

I installed the shifter after installing the motor and transmission it made it easier to work through this the tunnel

I also filled the transmission through the shifter until the oil ran out of the fill plug

Rick

[Scotty's65]

I'll second Papa, it is much easier with the rear up in the air a little bit and I think as far as the driveshaft is concerned it is better to have a slight angle either left or right or up and down as the u joints work better, are quieter and last longer with a slight angle so the bearings are engaged as opposed to dead straight where they will be "floating"

My .02

Scott

[broku518]

Great info, Thanks! I was mostly confused about the driveshaft angles. Now it is clear, from reading info above.
I will raise the car up and will have A-frame in place.

Will get some rest tonight...tomorrow should be cozy 12F with couple inches of snow, here in Chicago area.

Will post pictures when done.

Thanks.
Martin

[Papa]

Regarding drive line and pinion angle settings, this video posted a wile back by GoDadGo cleared up the confusion for me.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Idk3BVDVHq4&feature=youtu.be

[broku518]

ok, engine is in! It wasn't that difficult. We raised the car up, left the A-frame in place. I was using the lift plate, so no need for engine leveler.
Very easy to tilt or swivel in any direction.
One thing left to figure it: I noticed the end of the tko600 was touching the round frame member. I will need to use a spacer. Any idea where I can get those?

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4737/38610341514_5d8e41c9f9_c.jpg

[url=https://flic.kr/p/HXHSi4]https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4596/27541203549_8fd95cb256_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/21PS6nm)

[Papa]

ok, engine is in! It wasn't that difficult. We raised the car up, left the A-frame in place. I was using the lift plate, so no need for engine leveler.
Very easy to tilt or swivel in any direction.
One thing left to figure it: I noticed the end of the tko600 was touching the round frame member. I will need to use a spacer. Any idea where I can get those?

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4737/38610341514_5d8e41c9f9_c.jpg

[url=https://flic.kr/p/HXHSi4]https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4596/27541203549_8fd95cb256_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/21PS6nm)

Congratulations! As a fellow first-timer, I know how good it feels to get the engine in.

Dave

[Boydster]

Trans tail shaft spacers: I used a stack of washers until i can get the pinion angle all set, then I'll order spacers from McMaster or Ace and modify as needed. My TKO 600 also sat on the frame crossmember.

[jrcuz]

Great work. When we dropped mine in back in August I was surprised how easy and fast it went in. I used aluminum bar stock from Mcmaster-Carr to make the transmission spacer. Also don't forget to get longer bolts when you figure out the thickness of the spacer.
JR

[GoDadGo]

Congratulations!

That's A Good Looking Go-Kart Paw Paw!

[phileas_fogg]

Trans tail shaft spacers: I used a stack of washers until i can get the pinion angle all set, then I'll order spacers from McMaster or Ace and modify as needed. My TKO 600 also sat on the frame crossmember.

For sure start with a stack of washers until you get the height figured out; it's easy & cheap (probably free as I bet you've got a bunch laying about). Or use scrap bar stock if you have any.

Congratulations!


John

[broku518]

Thank you ALL for your valuable feedback. I feel very fortunate to lean on this community.

Thanks
Martin