Fidget Build - Tim - Frisco Texas [Archive]

TDSapp

06-27-2017, 10:51 AM

So I have been working on the car just a bit but figured I would post some of the build here as well. I have been keeping my build site up to date at http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/blog but I will post here at times too.

That way if I get stuck or when y'all see where I am heading next you can point me in the right direction. Here are my current plans.

350 Small Block Chevy (From donor 89 Corvette)
700R4 Transmission (From donor 89 Corvette)
QA1 Shocks
Adjustable Rear Control Arms
4 Link 8.8″ Ford Rear end 3.73 Gears

I was going to start building everything up and then remove it and then go for powder coating or paint on the frame. Noticed though that I was getting surface rust. So I hit the rust with a wire wheel and painted the frame and the front end parts with some primer and paint.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/Primer_Frame.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/20170613_192938.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/Blue_Frame.jpg

Last night I started working on the front suspension. Basically that includes the upper and lower control arms mounted to the frame. Nothing is torqued though, once I know everything is correct I will pull out the torque wrench and do the final work. I got three out of four done when the wife called me in for dinner. Once I hit the AC in the house and had a full stomach that was it for the day.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/20170627_080218.jpg

See the roll around stool on the right side of the photo above? That was a fathers day present from my wife. That really helped my back yesterday.

However, I will say that this (below) is the tool of the day! There is a weld on the inside of the rear mounting tabs for the upper control arm. I had to grind the weld back or it would hit the poly bushing and not let the control arm get into position. At least FFR was consistent because it was exactly the same on both sides.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/20170627_080225.jpg

After the front suspension I am doing the hubs and front brakes. Then petals, master cylinders, front brake lines, firewall, then steering to include the electric steering setup. I figure this list will keep me busy for at least a couple weeks. :cool: If I don't have the shocks and rear end by the time I am done with this list I will finish pulling the motor and trans from the Vette. I have some work I am thinking about doing on the motor (like a new cam) so I am putting it off until I decide what I want to do.

I am working on selling an 1976 Vette. Once that happens I will be ordering the QA1 shocks for front and back, the rear control arms, and the rear end with breaks. I am doing it that way to keep SWMBO happy and not draining the car fund too fast. So if you know someone who would like a great deal on a 1976 Stingray please send them my way.

Tim

RoadRacer

06-27-2017, 10:59 AM

Nice color, I like it! Looking forward to following along

myjones

06-27-2017, 11:51 AM

So I have been working on the car just a bit but figured I would post some of the build here as well.
That way if I get stuck or when y'all see where I am heading next you can point me in the right direction.

Nothing is torqued though, once I know everything is correct I will pull out the torque wrench and do the final work.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/20170627_080218.jpg

However, I will say that this (below) is the tool of the day! There is a weld on the inside of the rear mounting tabs for the upper control arm. I had to grind the weld back or it would hit the poly bushing and not let the control arm get into position. At least FFR was consistent because it was exactly the same on both sides.

Tim
Tim
Before you torque the front bolt on the upper a arm don't forget to put the grille support brackets on. Tip them inboard about 5 degrees and they will be close to right for the rad assembly spacing needed. I trimmed off part of the barrel flange on the Urethane to clear those tab welds, I wasn't
comfortable grinding off that much of the weld on mine. Nice color on the chassis.
Dale
7L Hemi33

TDSapp

06-27-2017, 12:33 PM

Tim
Before you torque the front bolt on the upper a arm don't forget to put the grille support brackets on. Tip them inboard about 5 degrees and they will be close to right for the rad assembly spacing needed. I trimmed off part of the barrel flange on the Urethane to clear those tab welds, I wasn't
comfortable grinding off that much of the weld on mine. Nice color on the chassis.
Dale
7L Hemi33

Dale,

Sorry, can't do that... It's not in the manual that way. :rolleyes: You got me worried though... I had to go back to the manual (I have the PDF manual on a drive here at work) to see if I missed something. And I had... One line of text to put the bolt through the grill mount and then through the upper control arm. No photo, nothing on putting it on the front or back... I'll have to go check out some photos to see how it should go.

Thanks for pointing it out for me.

The welds on the tabs were BIG and I did not think it was going to hurt to grind them off a bit. Worst part now is having to go back and hit it with paint now to cover up the grind. I have plenty of the paint though. After running out of primer while spraying the frame and then having to go to three stores to get enough to do the job I picked up more of the blue as well. After painting the frame and front end parts I still have something like nine cans of it. I am going for the rattle can rod look. :-) At least for now. I may have it all sand blasted off and have everything powder coated someday.

Tim

Edit; Thanks to HVACMan for posting his build thread photos I see how it has to be mounted.

GoDadGo

06-27-2017, 12:59 PM

I will be following youe build very closely.
You are making me think about a possible future project.

https://youtu.be/svZX2BMSDEs

TDSapp

06-27-2017, 01:21 PM

I will be following youe build very closely.
You are making me think about a possible future project.

https://youtu.be/svZX2BMSDEs

GoDadGo your Vette is SO MUCH nicer than mine. Mine probably has less miles than yours but I have not drove it in a while. I was just going to sell it and use the money but the fuel pump went out. I did not want to put more money into it and in it's condition I would probably get less than $5,000 for it. With the cost of a new motor and transmission I figured I might as well strip the motor and trans for the Hot Rod and sell the other parts. I should come out ahead in the long run.

It has an L98 motor in it with the TPI injection the limits the motor to around 4,500 to 5,000 RMP. I had it put on the dyno one time and it only had 240HP at the rear wheels but did hit 309 fp of torque with a 3.07 rear end. Once I move it over I am going with a nice intake and a 650 CFM carb and considering a new cam. Comp Cams suggested an Extreme Energy XR276HP and said that with the heads and block I have that it would give it a great idle ( Not a smooth idle... ) I figure I could get the motor over 300 HP and then with the trans geared the way it is for low end and something that winds a little tighter than a 3.07 that I'll end up with a great ride.

It was going to be either that or drop in the 454 I currently have sitting on the motor stand.

Tim

GoDadGo

06-27-2017, 01:44 PM

GoDadGo your Vette is SO MUCH nicer than mine. Mine probably has less miles than yours but I have not drove it in a while. I was just going to sell it and use the money but the fuel pump went out. I did not want to put more money into it and in it's condition I would probably get less than $5,000 for it. With the cost of a new motor and transmission I figured I might as well strip the motor and trans for the Hot Rod and sell the other parts. I should come out ahead in the long run.

It has an L98 motor in it with the TPI injection the limits the motor to around 4,500 to 5,000 RMP. I had it put on the dyno one time and it only had 240HP at the rear wheels but did hit 309 fp of torque with a 3.07 rear end. Once I move it over I am going with a nice intake and a 650 CFM carb and considering a new cam. Comp Cams suggested an Extreme Energy XR276HP and said that with the heads and block I have that it would give it a great idle ( Not a smooth idle... ) I figure I could get the motor over 300 HP and then with the trans geared the way it is for low end and something that winds a little tighter than a 3.07 that I'll end up with a great ride.

It was going to be either that or drop in the 454 I currently have sitting on the motor stand.

Tim

You can make 325-350 HP all day long with the L-98 mill.

HVACMAN

06-27-2017, 02:20 PM

wrp

06-27-2017, 02:46 PM

Would love to get together with you. You can look mine over and I can show you some of the problems I have encountered

TDSapp

06-27-2017, 03:02 PM

WRP,

Sounds like a great idea. I would love to check out your Hot Rod. I am free tonight, tomorrow night and Friday night. After that it would have to be next week after the 4th.

Tim

wrp

06-27-2017, 03:31 PM

WRP,

Sounds like a great idea. I would love to check out your Hot Rod. I am free tonight, tomorrow night and Friday night. After that it would have to be next week after the 4th.

TimGive me a call 214-793-7598

bakerboerne

06-27-2017, 05:56 PM

Looks like from the pics that the lower control arm rear bushing tabs are facing the wrong direction. The back bushing tabs go toward the back and the front ones go toward the front...

TDSapp

06-28-2017, 10:30 AM

Looks like from the pics that the lower control arm rear bushing tabs are facing the wrong direction. The back bushing tabs go toward the back and the front ones go toward the front...

Bakerboerne,

Is this the part you are talking about? (EDIT) Actually look at the photo in the next post as I think I have it on correctly. I have to pull it apart anyway as I just noticed that I am missing a locking nut on that control arm.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/20170627_080218-1.jpg

If so I will correct that tonight when I get home. Thank you!

Tim

TDSapp

06-28-2017, 10:53 AM

I did get to work on the car more last night. I have been having a ton of fun working on this car. I can't wait until I get to drive it too.

I got the control arms finished, with the exception of the lower control arm mounting tabs being the wrong direction on at least one side of the car. I also got the spindles and the hubs on as well.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/20170627_202454.jpg

Man that center hub is a beast. I have never had a bolt that my torque wrench could not handle (it goes up to 190 ft lbs.) and only once have I needed a bigger socket for a wheel hub. (The 89 Corvette uses a 36mm socket for the rear hubs.) So tonight I have to go buy a 1 3/8 socket and then over to Auto Zone to borrow a torque wrench that gets up to the 235 ft lbs required.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/20170627_202503.jpg

Once I got to this point I went ahead and painted my brake calipers and brackets to get ready to install them tonight.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/20170627_202519.jpg
http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/20170627_202513.jpg

bakerboerne

06-28-2017, 11:29 AM

You got it right - I did not look at your pics close enough - sorry .

Bakerboerne,

Is this the part you are talking about? (EDIT) Actually look at the photo in the next post as I think I have it on correctly. I have to pull it apart anyway as I just noticed that I am missing a locking nut on that control arm.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/20170627_080218-1.jpg

If so I will correct that tonight when I get home. Thank you!

Tim

myjones

06-28-2017, 02:27 PM

I also got the spindles and the hubs on as well.
Man that center hub is a beast. I have never had a bolt that my torque wrench could not handle (it goes up to 190 ft lbs.) and only once have I needed a bigger socket for a wheel hub. (The 89 Corvette uses a 36mm socket for the rear hubs.) So tonight I have to go buy a 1 3/8 socket and then over to Auto Zone to borrow a torque wrench that gets up to the 235 ft lbs required.
http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/20170627_202503.jpg

Be prepared for the back of the car to raise up off of the jackstands when you try to torque the pass side spindle nut. You might need a couple of stout friends to sit on the back of the chassis when you crank that side down. There have been a few posts about that dilemma in the past. At a
minimum remove both orange jackstands and put them clear up at the front of the chassis first.
HTH
Dale Berry
7liter Hemi 33

TDSapp

06-29-2017, 12:47 PM

Be prepared for the back of the car to raise up off of the jackstands when you try to torque the pass side spindle nut. You might need a couple of stout friends to sit on the back of the chassis when you crank that side down.

Dale,

Thanks for the input. I have already found a couple places that the frame start to move around while trying to tighten a bolt or two.

I did not get to work on the car yesterday but I did go and buy the 1 3/8" socket for the hub nut to get home and find out that it did not fit on the nut. So I will head back to Sears to see if I can get one that fits. This time I'll take the nut with me.

I also had the chance to go and meet WRP and his car Ethel. It was great to be able to see a Hot Rod all together and running. Very encouraging to say the least. Then to top it off I was able to sit in it to see how I would fit and he hands me the keys and says "Lets go for a ride!" Sweet! We took it for a trip around one of the toll ways via the service roads and it was great to drive and sounds just as awesome. His videos do not do justice to the actual sound of the car.

We chatted a while after we got back and started talking exhaust. He jacked up the side of his car so I could take a look under it. I have an idea of what I want to do for the exhaust and was not sure if I was going to have room. I think now that I have seen how his looks I will be able to do it. Just a couple more questions before I pull the trigger on that.

So for all you builders that have ran the exhaust out the side of the car, where on the frame does the exhaust have to pass through? I don't have the body yet so I can't set it on there to see where I would run it.

Tim

RoadRacer

06-29-2017, 01:11 PM

I did go and buy the 1 3/8" socket for the hub nut to get home and find out that it did not fit on the nut.

Wow, I'm sorry about that.. I can't explain it because that's what I bought and used.

TDSapp

06-30-2017, 09:51 AM

Wow, I'm sorry about that.. I can't explain it because that's what I bought and used.

Yes I blame you for it all. :rolleyes:

I went back and checked again yesterday to make sure that I was just not asleep when it did not work. But it still did not fit on either side. I think I am going to have to have a 1.5" socket to get it to fit.

Not a problem anyway. The only socket they had that was 1 3/8" was on a 3/4" drive. I hate having to buy something I will only use once and also have to buy a wrench to fit it. I started looking at Amazon this morning for a 1/2" drive socket that they will deliver.

Tim

RoadRacer

06-30-2017, 10:09 AM

Yeah, I had to buy 1 or even 2 adapters for this damn thing!

kraftee

06-30-2017, 05:13 PM

Harbor Freight sells an inexpensive 3/4" drive set with sockets from 7/8" to 2". Plus ratchet, extensions, and breaker bar. That's a 1/2" drive ratchet in the right side for size comparison. I don't use the big set for too much, obviously, but the big sockets are great for driving seals.

wrp

06-30-2017, 07:36 PM

Have you tried to0 rent one from Autozone or Orielly's?
a

RoadRacer

07-04-2017, 07:43 AM

I went back and checked again yesterday to make sure that I was just not asleep when it did not work. But it still did not fit on either side. I think I am going to have to have a 1.5" socket to get it to fit.

I'm still kinda fascinated by this Tim. Such similar build numbers so we should be the same. I checked my socket and it sure is 1 3/8". I had to buy a 1/2 - 3/4 adapter too. I wonder what parts you got that were different from mine?

69805

JOP33

07-04-2017, 08:50 AM

I'm still kinda fascinated by this Tim. Such similar build numbers so we should be the same. I checked my socket and it sure is 1 3/8". I had to buy a 1/2 - 3/4 adapter too. I wonder what parts you got that were different from mine?

69805

I am a little perplexed:confused: myself by FFR's choice of hardware mix (metric & SAE). I am sure it has to do with 3rd party suppliers, but it makes for many trips back and forth to the tool box!

Tampa33Build

07-04-2017, 10:16 AM

I'm interested also in the size also. My 1/2" metric set goes up to 36mm. My 33 should be delivered next week and thought I had all the tools needed. Hate to be in the middle of a task and have to stop to go purchase a tool.

TDSapp

07-05-2017, 10:07 AM

So I had a message typed up and once I hit post it all went away and never showed up.

So I bought the 1 3/8 and it did not fit at all. I figured it must be a 1 1/2 because you don't see many 1 7/16th so over this weekend I got on Amazon and ordered a 38 mm socket as that is used for many hub bolts. It comes to 1.49 so it is just under 1.5". However it is fitting lose. So today when I get home I am going to try and find my 36 mm socket.

So I will give everyone an update once I get home.

Tim

TDSapp

07-05-2017, 10:41 AM

New Update and question

So went to Mom and Dad’s over the 4th of July weekend and got to snooping through the shop. I know that both dad and I have some motors and parts in the shop. I found a Holley Double Pumper and a Weiand intake. I asked dad about them and he said the came off the 383. Dad had already offered me the 383 motor for the hot rod but I don’t want to drop anything in it that I can’t track until I get it registered. I asked him how much he wanted for the intake and carb and he told me to take it.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/20170703_192748.jpg

So now I know what is going to be put on top of the long block that I am pulling from the Vette. The intake is a Weiand 7546 which is part of their X-CELerator line. I am not sure what model of Holley carburetor it is but I hope some of you guys here on the forum will be able to give me that level of detail.

So I have been trying to ID the carb... I did notice that it appears to only have one metering block between the float bowls, just on the primary side. This might be a 3310-1 750 CFM carb.

Tim

wrp

07-05-2017, 01:53 PM

I have a ton of tuning parts for them

RoadRacer

07-05-2017, 02:31 PM

So I bought the 1 3/8 and it did not fit at all. I will give everyone an update once I get home.

Tim

1 3/8 is ~34.925mm so perhaps 35 or 36 is the correct size, as you said. All the mustang forums are full of FUD; some say 35, others 36, others use 1 3/8. I'm putting my money on it actually being 35mm.

TDSapp

07-06-2017, 01:33 PM

so going from 34.925 go 35mm is less than a 10th of a mm. I think that the socket I bought would need to be bigger than a 10th of a mm so I am going with 36mm. I could not find my 36mm yesterday but the 38mm held enough to get the nut torqued to 235. I just about had to jump up and down on the torque wrench to get it to go. While I know it was good to lose the 75 pounds I used to have, I bet it would have been easier when I was 250 pounds. lol.

Tim

TDSapp

07-06-2017, 01:37 PM

So yesterday I did not sleep well so I got up and went to work early… Real early, which means I was able to leave work early and work on the Hot Rod when I got home. I was able to get the front brakes mounted and the steering rack and tie rod ends all mounted. Things are looking good.

First I laid out the parts for the brakes and then put them together off the car. This is so much easier than working with dirty parts directly off a car.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/20170705_161321.jpg

This is after a few hours of work on the car late in the day. Some day I will be able to work on it for an entire weekend day and watch out! Things will happen fast.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/20170705_165509.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/20170705_160408.jpg

So next on my list was to install the petal box and the steering but to really do the steering I need to get the engine in. So I think tonight it is back to pulling the motor from the Vette. This will allow me to mount the electric steering and to get it clocked correctly.

Tim

Tampa33Build

07-06-2017, 06:20 PM

Looking good.

myjones

07-06-2017, 06:55 PM

Things are looking good. This is after a few hours of work on the car late in the day.
http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/20170705_165509.jpg
So next on my list was to install the petal box and the steering but to really do the steering I need to get the engine in.

Tim

Tim
Don't forget to install the grille support brackets on the A-arm bolts before you torque them down. IIRC they tip in about 5* to the middle to
have the right spacing for the radiator shell. Looking good
Dale
7liter Hemi 33

TDSapp

07-06-2017, 10:22 PM

Tim
Don't forget to install the grille support brackets on the A-arm bolts before you torque them down. IIRC they tip in about 5* to the middle to
have the right spacing for the radiator shell. Looking good
Dale
7liter Hemi 33

Thanks Dale, I have had that though about every hour of working on the car.

Ok, to answer the question on everyone's mind

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/20170706_193130.jpg

The 36mm is a perfect fit for the center hub bolts on my car.

Tim

myjones

07-07-2017, 05:35 AM

There are a few different types of spindle nuts that fit our 33. All the same inside but just a bit different on the outside from
what I found with mine. This could be why they take a different socket at times based on which style you have, the washer
designs varied a bit as well as the hex shapes.

When I assembled my front suspension a few years ago the nuts that came with the kit were wiping off the threads once they
were fully engaged and way before they seated to the bearing. I thought maybe they were crimped a bit too much because
even though they started with my fingers and weren't cross-threaded they took off some of the threads while turning easy but
would un-screw just fine once I saw the carnage. They were a Dorman fastener IIRC so I went to the parts store and bought a
new pair that looked the same and sadly acted the same. I pitched all 4 and went to a different store and bought a different
brand with a slightly different style, still same result. I then went to Ford and bought their spindle nut which had a different
type of captured washer and it went on just fine with no drama. The damaged threads are fully outside the nuts so there is
full engagement and no overall concerns about the final product. I was starting to wonder if the spindles weren't properly
hardened but since the final set of nuts tightened properly I don't think that is anything to worry about.
YRMV

Dale

TDSapp

07-07-2017, 08:49 AM

There are a few different types of spindle nuts that fit our 33. All the same inside but just a bit different on the outside from
what I found with mine. This could be why they take a different socket at times based on which style you have, the washer
designs varied a bit as well as the hex shapes.
Dale

I understand why they would do it depending on the supplied parts at the time. But you would think that it would change over time and not so soon. Some of the guys that are using the 1 3/8" socket got their car just a week or so before mine.

When I assembled my front suspension a few years ago the nuts that came with the kit were wiping off the threads once they
were fully engaged and way before they seated to the bearing. I thought maybe they were crimped a bit too much because
even though they started with my fingers and weren't cross-threaded they took off some of the threads while turning easy but
would un-screw just fine once I saw the carnage. They were a Dorman fastener IIRC so I went to the parts store and bought a
new pair that looked the same and sadly acted the same. I pitched all 4 and went to a different store and bought a different
brand with a slightly different style, still same result. I then went to Ford and bought their spindle nut which had a different
type of captured washer and it went on just fine with no drama. The damaged threads are fully outside the nuts so there is
full engagement and no overall concerns about the final product. I was starting to wonder if the spindles weren't properly
hardened but since the final set of nuts tightened properly I don't think that is anything to worry about.
YRMV

Dale

That still happens to this day. When I got the center hub nuts on I saw that it had ate the threads off the spindle. Since I had the nut torqued I did not remove it to see what it looked like.

Tim

TDSapp

07-14-2017, 06:55 PM

So today I had the day off with my son and we both got to work on getting the motor out of the Vette. I got out there this morning and started working before it got to hot. We worked until it got to hot to work out there. Somewhere around 97 degrees was the limit today.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/20170714_131749.jpg

I pulled the valve covers today to allow me to pull the runners off the fuel injection manifold. I was immediately disappointed to find standard rockers. I was under the impression the 89 Vette motors had 1.5 ratio roller rockers. Looks like I may be paying for some upgrades that I was not planning on. At least it is a clean motor.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/20170714_101516.jpg

Tim Sapp

TDSapp

08-14-2017, 11:21 AM

OK, I know that others have said it before but here in Texas... IT IS HOT! When I have a free weekend I find that I can only work out in the garage for a few hours and then have to retreat to the Air Conditioning. There is just something about not wanting to work when the heat index is sitting at 106 and you are just covered in sweat. But this weekend was different. Thanks to some rain and clouds it has been much cooler. If you want to say that a high of 93 is cooler. On both Saturday and Sunday I got to spend a few hours working out in the garage.

I was able to finish pulling the donor motor and transmission from the Vette.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170813_144025.jpg

Once I got it out it was about 3:30p.m. and had hit 93 so I went ahead and called it a day. Today after work I will split the engine and trans and at least get the motor on the stand.

HVACMAN

08-14-2017, 12:58 PM

GoDadGo

08-14-2017, 01:12 PM

My LT-1 has stamped rockers too so don't fret, it's an easy upgrade.
The first SBC to get factory roller rockers was the LT-4 that came in the 1996 C-4.
Just make sure that you get the "Self Aligning / Thin Style Rocker" that are designed to fit the center bolt valve covers.

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/csp-s1001/applications/make/chevrolet?prefilter=1

TDSapp

08-16-2017, 11:21 AM

My LT-1 has stamped rockers too so don't fret, it's an easy upgrade.
The first SBC to get factory roller rockers was the LT-4 that came in the 1996 C-4.
Just make sure that you get the "Self Aligning / Thin Style Rocker" that are designed to fit the center bolt valve covers.

GoDad you might want to edit the link you posted because the ones on the link are not self aligning.

So if I did go with a set of the rollers, do I need to change springs too?

Tim

TDSapp

08-23-2017, 02:30 PM

So I have been pulling the motor apart and checking it out. So far nothing has really jumped out at me as a problem. It turns out that the L98 from an 89 Vette has a 2 bolt main. Not really a problem as I will be staying well below 450 horse power.

One thing that I am wondering about but not really worried about is the wear pattern on the cam. I have not pulled the cam yet as I have to get a broken bolt out of the intake so I can get to the lifters. But with the oil pan off I can see the cam from the bottom of the motor.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170818_201256.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170818_201245.jpg

So to me it looks like a very odd wear pattern considering this should have a roller cam in it. I would think that it would show the wear all the way across the camshaft lobe. What do y'all think. I am fairly sure that I am going to replace the cam anyway but I would like to know what everyone else thinks.

Tim

TDSapp

08-24-2017, 09:22 AM

GRRRR!!!!! Ok GM! Who is their infinite wisdom decided to put steel torx bolts into aluminum heads and NOT put anti seize on them?!?!?!?

The bolt is not hard enough to keep it from rounding out the head. Then when using an extractor the head pops off before it starts to loosen.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170823_165556.jpg

Then the shaft is seized so tight that it breaks the hardened steel extractor when you try it again.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170824_065844.jpg

I have two intake bolts stuck or broken on both sides of the motor. If all four were on one side it would help because I could probably get it off, but both sides and angled bolts... sigh....

Looks like I may have to drill them all down to the head and hope I can get them out of the head. Otherwise I may be looking at 4 Helicoiled bolt holes in the heads.

1932

08-24-2017, 11:53 AM

Put washer over and weld then put bigger nut and weld, let cool then out she comes. Use some penetrating oil when cooling. Or if you get the intake off hopefully the bolts will be high to put nut over and weld.
Good luck.

myjones

08-24-2017, 04:10 PM

If you don't already have them go and buy a set of LH twist drill bits. Any real tool store or machinist supply company
will have them. Most of the time while drilling out enough of a bolt to use an ezy-out the CCW motion of the bit ends up
loosening the busted fastener and it starts walking itself out. Sounds funny but don't knock it until you try it a few times.
Dale

TDSapp

08-25-2017, 11:23 AM

Well I worked on them yesterday and after getting the heads off two more and a bit more drilling I was finally able to get the intake and the heads off.

This is what I ended up with.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170824_180510.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170824_180450.jpg

The worst one though is this one. It had to be drilled down further.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170824_180506.jpg

Today when I get home from work I will be trying to get the bolt shafts out the rest of the way.

Good news on another front though and the wear patterns on the cam shaft I was worried about is a non-issue. The odd patterns are only on the bottom side of the lobes.

TDSapp

08-28-2017, 07:25 AM

So just had a great weekend with great weather. Since the Heat Index was not up at 106 I was able to work on the Hot Rod quite a bit. Here is a list of what I accomplished this weekend and a few photos to follow that up.

Finished pulling motor apart. Left the crank in the block and the valves in the heads.
Put the heads and oil pan back on the block.
Put the SBC motor mount adapters on.
Mounted firewall and DS footpan. (Three holes each and held with Clecos)
Put the motor in the frame.
Measured and marked the Power Steering motor mount holes.
Put valve covers, intake and carburetor onto motor just to take pictures. :-)
Pulled motor
Mounted PS motor
Mounted Tilt Steering Column
Did the steering linkage from steering column to steering rack.
Removed the annoying clutch pedal. (Had to go buy a small set of snap ring pliers.)
Installed petal box.
Installed master cylinders.
Installed break fluid reservoir
Ran break lines from reservoir to master cylinders.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170826_090817.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170826_093447.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170826_112151.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170826_150930.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170826_152914.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170827_151439.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170826_151515.jpg

It appears that I am limited to seven images per message so I will create another message and put the rest of the images there.

TDSapp

08-28-2017, 07:37 AM

Here are the rest of the images from this weekend.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170827_154714.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170827_170102.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170827_170131.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170827_184133.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170827_190643.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170827_202412.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170827_202350.jpg

So before anyone says something... The reservoir top is below the fire wall edge. Since I don't have the body and hood I can't check it for fitment. I know that normally there are hood pins but I don't plan on using them as I will be going with hood pins.

Second, why did I do a bone head thing and run the break line over to the side. After I mounted the reservoir is when I noticed that to drill the hole right under the reservoir I would have had to drill through the frame. Not really an option so this is what I came up with.

wrp

08-28-2017, 09:13 AM

Great Progress

TDSapp

08-29-2017, 09:11 PM

Great Progress

Thanks Bill... Feels good to be able see more progress on it.

So the UPS and FedEx fairies showed up today. I finally have some chrome on the car!

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170830_164400.jpg

erlihemi

08-30-2017, 12:21 PM

Looking good!

TDSapp

08-31-2017, 10:01 AM

Last night I started working on running the break lines. First thing that happened was I made my first bend and then realized that the fitting for the other end was on the wrong side of the bend. Dang! I had to get it back straight enough to get the fitting back to the other end. I then taped it where it needed to be and started over. The left an odd bend in the tube but at least it is covered by the dash and will not be seen.

I also just realized while looking at the picture that where I ran the line for the back brakes will have to change. I have it going where it will be in the way of the floor pan. I might be able to work on it tonight so I will run it into the same hole as the front breaks and then towards the back.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170830_184325.jpg

TDSapp

09-07-2017, 10:25 AM

I fixed my break lines yesterday after work. I thought that I had seen that I had ran the line where the floor pan would have hit it. But after sitting the floor pan in the frame yesterday I found that I was wrong on that assumption. It would have been below it. But I think it was better to have it ran the way it is now.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/20170906_204047.jpg

I do have a couple questions but I will start another post in the specific areas. One is about the transmission mount and the other is about the shocks.

erlihemi

09-07-2017, 11:25 AM

That spot is where I would like to have run my power steering Harness also, but I had already added a 3rd line for the hydraulic clutch, and roll control so I was out of room. And... it didn't occur to me soon enough. Once I get a power tool in my hand something will get cut!!

TDSapp

09-11-2017, 12:38 PM

This weekend I

flipped my shocks,
torqued the front end bolts,
removed the painted the steering rack bracket,
painted and installed the grill brackets,
continued running the break lines

I talked to Dan on Friday and he has shipped my adjustable control arms so I guess I need to go out and buy the rear end so I can get it hung.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/20170909_151111.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/20170909_164638.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/20170909_151106.jpg

wrp

09-11-2017, 12:51 PM

Basically giving up the adjustability?

TDSapp

09-11-2017, 01:20 PM

No it will just be much harder to adjust. I think that I may be able to get to the adjustment knob from the side of the frame. I have not got down there and looked yet.

Tim

wrp

09-11-2017, 05:54 PM

I have the front shocks to put on

TDSapp

09-12-2017, 12:38 PM

I have the front shocks to put on

If you need any help let me know. I am kind of just around the corner from you.

TDSapp

09-12-2017, 12:46 PM

Started working on the fuel system yesterday. Got the tank in place and the mounting holes drilled. Then I slid the sheet metal under the tank and and got the tank mounting holes drilled in it too.

I also dropped in the vent, fuel level sending unit and the fuel pick up.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/17307.jpeg

I am moving along enough that the parts shelf is starting to have a bunch of bare spots on it. I will probably have to start rebuilding the motor soon so I can get the exhaust done before I put in the floor pans and all the sheet metal.

I am still waiting on the adjustable control arms (Due to be delivered tomorrow), the AC Unit (Dan is shipping out today or maybe tomorrow), and the wire harness. I may have found a rear end but am waiting on an email from the guy.

wrp

09-12-2017, 06:55 PM

Be careful on the rear end

TDSapp

10-02-2017, 12:55 PM

Went to the Good Guys car show this weekend and had a great time. Saw two or three FFR Hot Rods and got some good pictures of them. I also went into the the vendor buildings and found a steering wheel and adapter for my hot rod. This will make it much easier to go-cart the car when it comes time. I guess FFR is going to lose a bit more advertising on my car by not sending the steering wheel with the rest of the steering components. The steering wheel cost $125.00 and the adapter was $35.00.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171001_205434.jpg

While I was there I stopped at the Summit Racing trailer and found out that SR was offering 10% off everything in the Arlington TX store. It was the weekend of their grand opening so they were offering the discount. I went buy and ended up buying a scoop for my hot rod. It has to be one of the car items I have always wanted on a car since I was a little kid reading CARToons magazine and going to car shows with my dad. It will look so much better when everything else is on the motor taking up some of that "extra" space.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171001_202720.jpg

When I got home from Good Guys and Summit Racing I found that my wire harness had been delivered.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171001_205603.jpg

So I went out to the garage yesterday and started working. I got the axle and pinion seals removed only to figure out that I have the wrong replacements. The ones that I picked up were way too small. Well, the Pinion seal is the correct one but I could not find any RTV to add to the outside edge of the seal. Looks like I will be making another trip to the parts store tonight after work.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171001_202941.jpg
http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171001_202934.jpg

Dodgeman

10-02-2017, 05:19 PM

Tim,
Has Factory Five stopped using the harness from Ron Francis, and gone with American Autowire?
I went with Infinity wire system.

Bob

TDSapp

10-03-2017, 10:53 AM

Tim,
Has Factory Five stopped using the harness from Ron Francis, and gone with American Autowire?
I went with Infinity wire system.

Bob

I don't know who FFR is going with. I had them remove the harness from my order and ordered it from another vendor who apparently can not be named. That is the harness I got from the vendor and it is designed more for the hot rod and does not include connectors and wires that are for the roadster only.
Apparently it has longer wires as well... I have not started any work on it yet as I want the AC and a couple other things put on before I start the wiring. So it is still in the plastic bags as pictured.

Tim

progmgr1

10-03-2017, 10:18 PM

I understand that Factory Five is still providing the Ron Francis harness. However, like Tim, I wanted more circuits than were available in the standard harness and so I deleted the harness from my order. Ron Francis has suitable wiring kits in their catalog, but there are several other suppliers out there with comparable offerings. I haven't decided yet on which to use.
Keith

10LCobra

10-08-2017, 07:26 AM

Moving along nicely.

bakerboerne

10-08-2017, 01:14 PM

TDSapp

10-08-2017, 07:51 PM

Moving along nicely.

Thanks... I got even more done this weekend. As I put on my web site, Check out my rear end. ;) It is a rear end out of a 2002 Mustang GT with 3.27 gear set. I replaced all the seals, painted and hung it this week end.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171008_153055.jpg

After that was done it was still a bit early so I went ahead and mounted the fuel pump and the fuel filter.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171008_174059.jpg

TDSapp

10-08-2017, 08:05 PM

Why can't the vender be named ? Factory Five should provide a harness that is made for the 33 and not continue to poor boy off of the cobra wiring harness. I have spent a lot of time removing pieces of the harness to make everything fit under the dash.

Well the vendor is apparently not a supporting vendor and has been suspended on here.

You can probably find a few more details on the wire harness if you check out my build blog linked below.

Svtfreak

10-09-2017, 09:56 AM

Tim,
Has Factory Five stopped using the harness from Ron Francis, and gone with American Autowire?
I went with Infinity wire system.

Bob

Mine has rom Francis emblems all over the harness box.

TDSapp

10-16-2017, 01:21 PM

Another great weekend especially on Sunday when the temperature had a high of only around 75. I started out yesterday by running the hard fuel line, and then putting on the insulated clips on both the fuel lines and the break lines. It's not a major undertaking but it is tedious and has to be done.

Next up was putting the grill, radiator, AC condenser and fan together.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171015_165726.jpg

This is again, was not a hard job but it was one that took time. I did install the horns as well since they needed to be installed before the grill was mounted.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171015_162406.jpg

I was then going to start installing the wiring but then had to stop when I realized that I had nothing to mount it to. Apparently when I had FFR remove the stock wire harness they also removed the sheet metal that the fuse block mounts to. So now I have to figure out how I am going to get it installed.

I do like the wire harness. It has 20 circuits on and the wiring are labeled as to where they go. It should make things much easier to get everything hooked up.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171015_200052.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171015_200101.jpg

As usual if you want more details or pictures you can check out my build thread on my web site.

KW33

10-16-2017, 01:28 PM

Nice pictures. Very helpful!

Awesome scoop too!

TDSapp

10-17-2017, 10:14 AM

Nice pictures. Very helpful!

Awesome scoop too!

I'm glad you like the photos. I used to be a photographer for a living so I am in the habit of taking a ton of photos.

And as to the scoop... I love the scoop. I have always wanted a car that could use the scoop and this car fits the bill.

TDSapp

10-17-2017, 10:26 AM

Yesterday I wanted to start running the wires even though I don't have the mounting for the fuse box. So I cable tied the fuse box into the location I am going to mount it and started to separate out the wires.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171016_212823.jpg

I pulled out the wires that go to the back of the car like the break lights and fuel pump and pulled them into a wire loom. Once the wires were in the loom I pulled over a small strip of heat shrink to hold the wires and to keep the loom from fraying.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171016_212809.jpg

The wire loom I found on Amazon and is 1/2" in diameter and is 25' long for $9.99.
( https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B074LRSL3H/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 )

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171016_212814.jpg

I also was able to mount the evaporator for the AC. This is a unit from Classic Auto Air and is one of their Street Rod Universal units.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171016_212837.jpg

RoadRacer

10-17-2017, 02:04 PM

Gotta love heat shrink. I found some 3x shrink that is so much nicer than the 2x stuff. Bad connections will bite you later if you don't do it right.

TDSapp

10-17-2017, 03:25 PM

Gotta love heat shrink. I found some 3x shrink that is so much nicer than the 2x stuff. Bad connections will bite you later if you don't do it right.

Yeah the heat shrink is being used to hold the wire loom right now. On the connections I am going to solder the connectors on the ends of the wire. That always holds better than just crimping.

Tim

1932

10-17-2017, 04:41 PM

The heat shrink 3x with glue is the best i have used.

HVACMAN

10-17-2017, 06:43 PM

TDSapp

10-18-2017, 10:49 AM

Tim, is there a reason you chose this a/c system vs. the Vintage Air unit?

HVACMAN,

Yes there is... I ordered this along with a new wire harness, and adjustable control arms from a non-supporting vendor who has recently been suspended from this site. I respect his opinion, as do many people on this site, and this is what he sells. He said that it fits better and will also be colder.

Turns out to not be too bad of a deal either. Classic Auto Air is in Coppell TX which is only about a 20 to 30 minute drive from where I live. I just happened to be about 3 minutes from their office this morning so I dropped in to check them out. I bought a bulkhead from them. Even though a bulkhead adds an extra failure point on the system I like the looks much better.

They also told me that when I am ready that they will crimp all my hose connections for free as part of the service of having their system. :D

TDSapp

10-18-2017, 11:51 AM

Last night I went out and kept at the wiring by thinning it out and putting it into the wire loom.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171018_080940.jpg
http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171018_080953.jpg

Then I started the job of drilling the sheet metal. Uggg... What a tedious task, and I am not even close to being done.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171017_204018.jpg

I am going to have to pull the panel from the rear of the cockpit as I forgot to put the silicone between the metal and the frame. I also forgot to spray it with Lizard Skin. Once I am done with the floor pans I will spray all of the sheet metal with Lizard Skin. Once dry I will mount all the sheet metal except for the floor pans. The floor pans will just be set into place and held with Clecos. I am not going to rivet them until at the very last when I no longer need to be under the car or under the dash.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171017_203953.jpg

HVACMAN

10-19-2017, 12:10 PM

HVACMAN,

Yes there is... I ordered this along with a new wire harness, and adjustable control arms from a non-supporting vendor who has recently been suspended from this site. I respect his opinion, as do many people on this site, and this is what he sells. He said that it fits better and will also be colder.
Turns out to not be too bad of a deal either. Classic Auto Air is in Coppell TX which is only about a 20 to 30 minute drive from where I live. I just happened to be about 3 minutes from their office this morning so I dropped in to check them out. I bought a bulkhead from them. Even though a bulkhead adds an extra failure point on the system I like the looks much better.

They also told me that when I am ready that they will crimp all my hose connections for free as part of the service of having their system. :D

Thanks Tim. I agree D.R. Is extremely knowledgeable. I have purchased his adjustable 4 link and QA1 shock and spring set. All are excellent. I am at the point of ordering the a/c system and you have helped me decide which way to go. Thanks again.

TDSapp

10-19-2017, 01:06 PM

Thanks Tim. I agree D.R. Is extremely knowledgeable. I have purchased his adjustable 4 link and QA1 shock and spring set. All are excellent. I am at the point of ordering the a/c system and you have helped me decide which way to go. Thanks again.

Yes he is very knowledgeable and I think it hurts the site more by not having him on here than the money they would get but forcing him to be a sponsored vendor. But that is their decision and not mine.

I can't tell you much more about the AC unit because all I have done is mount the evaporator and nothing else.

Tim

TDSapp

10-23-2017, 12:37 PM

This weekend I was able to work on my motor. I pulled the crank and after looking it over I decided that it would just be easier to buy a new crank than to pay to have this one reworked. OReilly Auto has the referb cranks for $179.00 and it also includes the crankshaft main bearings and the rod bearings that match the journals.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171020_185913.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171022_184744.jpg

The hardest part of getting out the crank shaft was this stripped bolt on the flywheel.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171020_194740.jpg

Once that was taken care of I pulled out the borrowed hone and ran it across all the cylinders.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171022_154925.jpg

Once I finished that I put the block on a dolly and out into the drive way. I cleaned it up with some degreaser and water then dried it with air from the compressor. Really after that I had to use a wire brush and my drill to really get it cleaned up. Once that was done I shot some paint onto the block.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171022_115237.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171022_180551.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171022_184327.jpg

I may have gotten in trouble over this paint though... I have always known that Chevy motors should be painted Chevy Orange. However, once SWMBO saw it she was not thrilled. She thinks that the motor should be painted to match the car, either the frame or the body. So depending on how it looks I may have to paint it again.

TDSapp

10-23-2017, 12:39 PM

BTW, I updated my budget. I am currently at $17,161.42 and that is before getting stage 2 ordered.

That is also before the $453.00 that I am spending on parts I am ordering today.

1932

10-23-2017, 10:46 PM

If the BOSS is not happy nobody is. And this kind of project it is good to have the BOSS happy!

erlihemi

10-24-2017, 03:45 PM

If the BOSS is not happy nobody is. And this kind of project it is good to have the BOSS happy!
Translated means, spend time getting the passenger seat just right!!

TDSapp

11-01-2017, 11:08 AM

I started building the engine for the Hot Rod last night. Makes me ask a question today... Does anyone want to see things like the engine build photos in the build thread on here, or just the items of the hot rod build that is common? When I say common I mean like everyone drops in a motor and a transmission, but not everyone builds their own motor.

I am still going to post them to my build web site (in signature) but if no one wants to see them here I will just post them there and not here. I don't want to waste anyone's time by posting things that no one wants to see.

I also updated my online budget.

erlihemi

11-01-2017, 01:52 PM

I love engines that are Built ... Not Bought!! Its part of your project, post it like crazy.

TDSapp

11-01-2017, 02:48 PM

I love engines that are Built ... Not Bought!! Its part of your project, post it like crazy.

OK, sounds like I would not be wasting my time then...

TDSapp

11-01-2017, 02:51 PM

I started rebuilding the engine yesterday. Got the main bearing and camshaft bearing saddles all cleaned up and then gave the main caps a good cleaning as well. Put in the bearings with a good coating of assembly lube and torqued the first four main caps to 70 ft/lbs. Torqued the last cap to about 15 ft/lbs and then whacked it front and back with a hammer to set it into the thrust bearing and then did the final torque on the cap and redid the others as well.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171031_232314.jpg

After that I grabbed the Cam bearing tool and knocked in the new cam bearings. I then put the cam shaft “freeze plug” and then put the new cam in.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171031_232248.jpg

I think I am going to have to flip that cam retainer over though. The other side is the shiny side that the timing gear rides on.

Once I was done with this I started cleaning the pistons getting them ready for rings. I think that tonight I may be dropping the pistons in.

1932

11-01-2017, 03:29 PM

All pics, always like inside of motors!

RoadRacer

11-01-2017, 05:46 PM

Yes post it all! Built my own 383 for last car and wished I’d taken pics.

TDSapp

11-02-2017, 09:37 AM

OK, I will keep posting the photos.

I don't have any new for today as yesterday all I did was set on a stool and clean pistons. Uggg what a task. I stopped at the Chinese Slave Labor Tool Company (aka Harbor Freight) and picked up a wire wheel for my bench grinder on the way home. I put it on the grinder and spent the next two hours sitting at the wire wheel cleaning piston after piston. Then spent another half hour or so with a broken ring going over all the piston rings to get them clean. Only one piston left and then I can put the new rings on and drop the pistons into the block.

RoadRacer

11-02-2017, 09:54 AM

Good honest grunt work though :) The hidden part of car building.. cleaning crap off stuff. My now-beautiful inlet manifold was caked.. everyone will probably just assume it came brand new out of a box, but I'll know :D

P.S. not many speak of budgets, so thanks. Mine is currently at $15,291 with goodwrench engine nearly ready to run, and donor rear w/3 link. Nothing between motor and rear though..

1932

11-02-2017, 11:32 AM

Ha HA in the end you my need that part!

TDSapp

11-02-2017, 11:46 AM

Good honest grunt work though :) The hidden part of car building.. cleaning crap off stuff. My now-beautiful inlet manifold was caked.. everyone will probably just assume it came brand new out of a box, but I'll know :D

After I get the long block done my next real cleaning chore will be my intake manifold. It has been sitting on a shelf for a few years and looks like it. I will probably end up taking it to a car wash to start on it and then still spend a couple hours with a wire brush or steel wool on it.

P.S. not many speak of budgets, so thanks. Mine is currently at $15,291 with goodwrench engine nearly ready to run, and donor rear w/3 link. Nothing between motor and rear though..

Well by budget is currently sitting at $17,614.38 but that is low because I only picked up Stage 1 first and already had a motor and transmission from the Vette as a donor. If I had to buy a motor and transmission I would probably be at $24K +\- a few hundred. That also does not include new tools that I have bought that I know will be used on other projects and things. Things like the extra pair of jack stands I have now (three sets now), and the sand blasting cabinet. I did add the cam shaft bearing tool to the budget because I don't think I am going to have to reuse that tool for a long time.

Future budget is what is going to get me.

With the things that I KNOW I still have to buy, like the water pump, new alternator, timing set, timing chain cover, more seals and gaskets I still have a few hundred to spend before I get to the body. I'll make it easy and lets say ~ $1,400.00 which puts me at $19,000.00. Stage 2 will be $10,539.00, plus the $1,500 transport fee, and the rag top which adds another $3,549.00 and sets the budget at $34,588.00. Adding another $1,500 for sand paper, filler, epoxy, fiberglass, and other things I will be setting at ~ $36,088.00 before any paint goes on the car.

Looks like I am going to break the planned budget of $35K and I am doing quite a bit of the work myself. If I was having to buy a new motor and transmission I would be at around $43K before paint (assuming $7K for simple motor and transmission). I may end up getting things together and getting it tagged and licensed and then shoot on some primer and paint myself and drive it for a while shaking out any bugs and issues and then getting it into a body shop for a real paint job. Not only will that space the cost out more I will be able to enjoy the car sooner.

TDSapp

11-02-2017, 11:58 AM

Mine is currently at $15,291 with goodwrench engine nearly ready to run, and donor rear w/3 link. Nothing between motor and rear though..

Ha HA in the end you my need that part!

Well if you are willing to go with an automatic that will take a beating I have a Turbo 400 sitting in my garage that I will trade for. :)

It is sitting right next to a Chevy big block 454 but I am not trading that away for anything. I think that will be going into my next project which is a 1923 Model T that my dad has given me.

RoadRacer

11-02-2017, 04:21 PM

Thanks, but i'm still planning on one of these slightly upgraded TKO's http://libertysgears.com/our-products/tremec/

I still think I was lucky with motor ($1450 plus $300 in parts) and rear ($450) but until we're moving under our own steam I'm still just praying :) stage 2 + hard top of course still to come, and I'm not counting tools that I can use again, but still hoping for ~$32-33k

TDSapp

11-03-2017, 09:29 AM

It's killing me... sigh... Yesterday I finished cleaning the pistons and went to put on the rings and put them into the block. Not one of them could I get in. I put them into the ring compressor and when I went to put them in they always stopped at the oil scraper. They all appear to be the same size as the original rings and I can get them into the piston by themselves and they fit with a little bit of gap.

Then to top it off I was pulling one of the rings off the piston and I broke it so now I have to go buy another one.

1932

11-03-2017, 11:37 AM

Yes the small things can be very aggravating, walk away, then come back to find the problem and move forward.

erlihemi

11-03-2017, 04:09 PM

I think you may be fighting with the ring compressor. Assuming ring gaps in the bore are good and clearance in the groove is good I always blame the ring compressor. Many different styles of compressor so it can make a difference in technique and bore chamfer. Use lots of oil on it and get it square on the block. I use a pusher and give it a quick firm shove. Don't tap, hammer or coerce it. Cheap compressors don't keep the high tension oil rings tight as they enter the bore sometimes. This shows up more on larger chamfers. Sometimes you need the really thin style compressor that sits into the chamfer.

bakerboerne

11-05-2017, 12:54 AM

Sometimes the scraper is directional, with a shoulder on top or bottom to make it behave differently on the down stroke.

TDSapp

11-06-2017, 10:32 AM

OK, so maybe I called it the wrong thing... I am not talking about either of the two compression rings. I am talking about the lowest set of rings that has the spring like spacer between the two rings.

I talked to my dad last night and his suggestion was to make sure that the ring gap is cleaned very well and to try again. So I went and bought some small wire brushes and also a small wire wheel that will fit on my drill. I will try them again tonight when I get home from work.

I am thinking that Erljhemi is correct though and I am fighting the ring compressor.

erlihemi

11-06-2017, 06:15 PM

After you check that the oil ring still has a gap in the bore (with it off the piston) and you spiral it back on the spacer make sure the ends of the spacer are butted together and not overlapped. Some have a color code to make that check easy. If the ends overlap you get a "lump" and it wont go in the bore. Also try flipping the compressor over if it is a universal type. If the "squeezer" part is closer to the block it mayl put more tension on the ring.

TDSapp

11-10-2017, 12:24 PM

Well after buying a second type of ring compressor and trying it multiple times,

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171108_204558.jpg

I have decided that the cylinder is just too far out of round to trust. I talked to a machine shop today to arrange to drop off the block tomorrow were they are going to bore and hone the motor. For $185.00 they are going to do what they call a performance prep which also includes the freeze plugs and new cam bearings. I am also going to buy new pistons and rings from them which they are them going to machine the block for the specs of the pistons.

Once I got the block ready last night I went ahead and started working on other things.

Got the floor pans drilled and ready to have the lizard skin shot onto it.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171109_194345.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171109_194359.jpg

I also sand blasted some parts and painted a few of them.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171107_073649.jpg

(And yes, that is the old seal in the timing chain cover. I did not want the seat for the seal painted so I left the old one in.)

TDSapp

11-14-2017, 04:00 PM

Here is the bock being dropped off at the machine shop on Saturday.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171111_091127.jpg

they said it would probably be today or tomorrow before they started on it. It should take four days or less so I will probably have it back this weekend.

RoadRacer

11-14-2017, 05:38 PM

Exciting stuff!

TDSapp

11-16-2017, 10:01 AM

It's like Christmas around here, so get ready for a little bit of engine porn as most of the pictures here have a nude motor in it. ;)

So yesterday I got the call that my engine was finished at the machine shop and could pick it up at any time. So on the way home from work I stopped by and picked it up. I paid and they loaded it up into the trunk of my car. It was all wrapped in plastic and card board like a special Christmas present. I used my cherry picker to get it out of the car and over to my engine stand.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171115_170851.jpg

I unwrapped it and low and behold all of my orange paint was gone and replaced with black... Ugg All that work I did... Plus I have all the other parts painted orange as well.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171115_172532.jpg

So I had dropped off the engine to be bored and honed, have the freeze plugs replaced and the cam bearings replaced. It's called a Performance Prep at City Motor Supply here in Dallas. Turns out they do a lot more than just that. So when dropping off the block on Saturday I found out that they also mill the head surface and when they hone the cylinders they also do the lifter holes as well. Extra cool... Only concern was the VIN number stamp on the front edge of the head surface at the front of the motor. I have to be able to show the DMV where I got the motor from and they use that stamp. But we had them put the serial number\VIN on the order form, and on the invoice. That and several pictures of it should have me covered.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171115_171533.jpg

When I went to pick it up I found that they do even more than what I was told on Saturday. They start off by pulling all the extra parts off the block, like the oil filter insert, the fuel pump block off plate, the freeze plugs, and the oil channel plugs. They then put it in the soaker all night. We used to call that dropping it into a heated vat. In the morning they wash it off then sand blast the block with a peening media. They magna-flux the block to make sure there are no cracks and then paint the block, and insert the freeze plugs and oil plugs. Next in line was to bore the cylinders then they mill the head surface. After all that they finally get to honing the cylinders and the lifter holes. I figured after that they would just knock in the cam bearings and be done with it but it looks like they honed the bearing seats for the cam and the crank shaft. Then they knocked in the cam bearings and covered them with a good helping of assembly lube.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171115_172522.jpg

As I said, all of this was part of the Performance Prep and City Motor Supply only charges $185.00 for it. If you are in the DFW area, or the San Antonio area I would highly suggest you get your work there.

Now for the disappointing part... when I got the block unwrapped I noticed a couple issues. First the oil filter insert was no where to be found.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171115_172613.jpg

Same goes for the Fuel Pump block off plate .

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171115_171644.jpg

If you look at the second picture you will also see that all of the main caps are in with standard bolts. Which means that three of the bolts were replaced and I no longer had the long bolts that hold the main caps and the windage tray. There was also one bolt that was missing from the area that the main seal has.

I can happily report that this morning I stopped by City Motor supply and not only did they replace everything that was missing they even opened a half hour early for me. So I am still 100% happy with everything they did. (Except the black paint... but that is nothing major... Black and brass is not to bad of a look for a block.)

TDSapp

11-16-2017, 10:18 AM

So to continue with Christmas from yesterday (and the fact that I hit submit post way too early) I have more. (But wait... There's more!)

Since I had them bore the motor .030 over I knew I was going to have to buy new pistons and rings. I asked them about it and they sell them as well. So I picked up a set of 30 over Federal pistons and a set of Hastings rings. What is nice at CMS is when the bore the motor and they know what pistons and rings are being used they do the work according to the specs of the parts. So I have the parts that exactly match the bore and they only cost me $90.00 for the pistons and $30.00 for the rings.

The unwrapping continues...

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171115_173529.jpg

I wanted to get the compression ratio a bit closer to 10.0:1 so I went with a set of flat top pistons that have the standard four valve reliefs.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171115_173608.jpg

These pistons are so much cleaner than the stock pistons.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171115_173554.jpg

The stock ones were dished and had a rough surface in the valve reliefs. The smoother surface should also help with preventing detonation from hot spots. Plus being flat topped and the head surface being milled it should help with the compression ratio.

TDSapp

11-16-2017, 10:40 AM

So since I had everything I started work on putting the motor back together. I had the crank and cam standing in the garage and I have been worried about them falling over and getting dinged. So I went ahead and put them in the block. I did not torque the main caps as I want the three bolts that hold the windage tray to be torqued at the same time. Now that I have the replacement bolts I will torque the main caps down tonight when I get home.

I also knocked the timing gear onto the crank and put on the cam shaft timing gear and chain.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171115_190721.jpg

As you can see this is a double roller timing chain and because of this I had to "slightly modify" the bolts that hold the cam retention plate. I had to grind down the heads of the bolts on the retention plate so the timing gear set would clear. This was noted in the timing set paper work so I knew I would have to do it.

After picking up the block and pistons I stopped at the Chinese Slave Labor Tool company (Harbor Freight) and picked up a press. After the work above I put the press together and pressed out the wrist pins from the connecting rods. Once I got it together and started working on getting to the rods I for some reason did not take any photos. I did get the pistons off all eight rods and they are sitting on the bench waiting for the new pistons.

I did learn two things while doing this. One, a Craftsman 6" extension from a 1/2" drive is the perfect ram for the wrist pin. Second. the 12,000 pound press from the Chinese Slave Labor Tool company is crap. I know they don't have a great reputation for tools but normally you can use them for their intended purposes for a while before they break. Not with this press. I did get the 8 pins out but not with out some real work. Once I started putting any pressure on the ram the entire body of the press would start to shift and bind. Once I figured out how to resolve it I was able to press out the last six pins but not without a special dance. I would have to stand up and place a foot on the right hand side of the base of the stand, then a hand on the top right hand side of the frame. As I would pump the jack to put pressure on the ram I would have to push the top of the frame over to the left. Once some pressure was applied I would then have to life the arbor surface on the right hand side to keep the part level.

Trust me when I say that I had all the bolts on the frame right and level. I even used a 4' bubble level to make sure the uprights were level. I am going to be returning this press as I don't think there is anything that I would be able to use it with.

erlihemi

11-16-2017, 04:39 PM

Looks like you can say your engine is built, not bought!! I picked up the Harbor Fake 20 ton press on sale with a coupon so I might be able to do 10 ton jobs with it. So far so good. I used to have one of those drill presses that worked like a radial arm saw. Too many angles and dangles. It lasted quite awhile doing wood work and light metal work until I tried playing with a cylinder head one day and the bed broke off and I had 75lbs of cylinder head on my foot. You can shoot some VHT primer and chevy orange over that black and make it look pretty.

Enjoy

TDSapp

11-27-2017, 01:16 PM

Looks like you can say your engine is built, not bought!!

You are correct... My entire car including the motor will be built not bought. :-)

And if it's not one thing its another... Was sitting down to work on building a jig to press in the wrist pins into the pistons and connecting rods and noticed that it appears that I have a couple bent rods. I guess it happened while I was using the good ole HF press before I figured out how to hold my mouth while removing them. So I called City Motor Supply and they have Rods for $19.00 each and will even press on the pistons for $10 a rod. So I went ahead and dropped them off this morning to get done. They said they would be ready by noon today. I'll probably get a chance to pick them up tomorrow morning on my way into the office so I hope I can get them in tomorrow night.

In the mean time I went ahead and re-painted the block orange since I also had other parts that were orange already. I taped up the top of the motor and then put the timing chain cover and oil pan on. I also coated the freeze plugs with some Vaseline and shot the paint. The Vaseline allowed me to paint the block and then just wipe off the freeze plugs with a paper towel.

I also wire brushed the out sides of the heads to clean them up.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171124_153120.jpg

I also took my dirty old intake and threw it into the sand blaster.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171124_124903.jpg

I would say that it cleaned up rather nice.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171124_143528.jpg

Had some family coming over so I put the carb and scoop on the intake to complete the look for them.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171121_222422.jpg

If that was not enough I cleaned up the corner of the garage where my lathe resides and I turned a new pen for my wife.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171126_114447.jpg

I am just learning how to turn pens so i still have more to go but it was a nice break from everything else going on.

RoadRacer

11-27-2017, 01:40 PM

Dang, I never knew that vaseline trick! Clever and so much nicer than trying to tape.. learned something today!

erlihemi

11-27-2017, 05:10 PM

Orange Engines with shiny stuff on top run better!!

TDSapp

11-29-2017, 01:36 PM

So I have more engine porn for y'all. Yesterday on the way to work I stopped at City Motor Supply and picked up the connecting rods and pistons. Just made sure there were 8 of them and that the pistons moved on a couple and put them into the car.

Was surprised when I got home with them to find out that they were referb rods. Looks like the bearing surfaces have been honed and new bolts were pressed in. I guess that is what you get for $19.00 each.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171128_084747.jpg

I pulled the end caps off with the help of my wife. They had the caps torqued on so tight I had to have my wife hold the pistons and rods with a 12" crescent wrench and I broke the nuts lose using a 18" break over bar. I am not sure what they used to put them on but they were WAY to tight.

I then put all the rings on the pistons, put the rod bearings in place and greased them up with assembly lube. I then grabbed the ring compressor and put all the pistons in place. I flipped the motor over and torqued them all to 45 ft pounds. I was able to get all but three of the bolts torqued and then had to turn the crank to get to the last three.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171128_213945.jpg

When I tried to turn the crank there was no joy. It would not turn to save my life. So I loosened up all the connecting rod bolts and it would spin again. Checked to make sure I was torquing them to the connect setting and started it again.

I was trying to turn it again to get to the last few bolts and found once again that I was unable to turn the crank. After a bit more checking I found that if all of them are torqued except piston #5 it will turn. But if I torque #5 I again am unable to turn the crank. pulled the cap and checked the bearings and there are no marks on either of them, and it looks like the crank is clean as well.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171128_230751.jpg

I added more assembly lube and tried again. Still no joy. Tonight I may end up pulling the piston completely to see if I can see anything odd with it.

It's just odd as because if I break the torque it spins and as soon as I hit 45 on both nuts it is locked tight.

So after doing some reading I am also going to check the bearing clearance with some plastigauge. Maybe something is weird there.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171128_230758.jpg

erlihemi

11-29-2017, 02:07 PM

TDSapp

11-29-2017, 02:16 PM

Tim, Check bearing backs on #5 for dirt etc. Also check they aren't "select fit" .001" undersize. Plastigage all bearings including mains for appropriate clearance. usually around .002", but follow your bearing type spec. I'll bet the rods were slightly "over honed" at the parting line. If that's the case I'm sure the shop will just hone the bore a little more. Also check that you have the chamfer the correct orientation so the bearing isn't against the fillet.

Good luck

The rod and main bearings came with the crank as a matched set.

If they honed it too much would it have not caused a lose fit for the bearing vs being too tight.

When you say chamfer the correct orientation do you mean the bearing key/keyway? I did check that on the cap and rod and they are in the correct place, and the cap is on in the same direction.

erlihemi

11-29-2017, 06:52 PM

The first step in the rod work is to take material off the cap at the parting line. This reduces the diameter and then it is honed to make it round again. if you loosen the rod bolt and the crank turns you either have too much crush or possibly the rod is flipped and the chamfer is facing the other rod vice the crank fillet. look at the orientation of the bearing and rod relative to the crank journal fillet. The only other common issue is foreign material between the shell and rod.

Arrowhead

11-30-2017, 08:45 AM

As mentioned above, the rod must orientated correctly on the journal or interference can occur. Depending on your engine, there should be a relief on one side of the rod to accommodate the fillet on the side of the crank journal.

http://d23c3kq2pqf30j.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/Fillet_sm1.jpg

http://d23c3kq2pqf30j.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/rodchamfer_sm.jpg

TDSapp

11-30-2017, 10:50 AM

Thanks for the input guys, I got the issue resolved last night.

So most of the time I was doing one piston at a time and one side at a time. But for some reason I thought I would get things faster if I prepped more than one piston\rod at a time. I ended up having the rod caps swapped for cylinders #5 and #7. When Erlihemi reminded me how they referb the caps I started to think back to how I installed them. I went and checked the rod cap and it just did not look right. Took a look at #7 and it did not match right either.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171129_194551.jpg

Swapped the caps, torqued them down and low and behold I was able to turn the motor. So I put the first gasket onto the motor, put sealer on the head bolts and bolted the heads onto the block.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/20171129_231600.jpg

Now for my next problem....

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/Intake_Seat.jpg

See the lip at the top of the head where the valve covers set. I discovered last night that when I set the intake on to cover up all the holes that it was not fitting right. I put the intake gaskets on the heads and set the intake back on. The lips on the heads keep one side of the intake lifted up. It creates over a 1/8" gap where it should be sitting on the block. Tonight I will see if I can slide the intake from the front to the back under the lip. If not I may either try to trim down the edges of the intake or buy a different intake that fits.

TDSapp

12-04-2017, 11:27 AM

Had a great weekend and got some things completed.

First as I posted above I figured out the connecting rod issue. After that was done I was able to get the heads on.

So on Saturday I was able to get the new Oil pump and windage tray all bolted on and flipped the motor over.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/20171201_155854.jpg

Got the Rear main seal bolted on as well too.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/20171201_155840.jpg

I then dropped in the lifters... I decided to do a clean up on all the rockers and nuts and that took a while but it was worth it. I got the push rods set to zero lash and a half turn.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/20171201_185205.jpg

As for the intake problem I reported last week. If you take a look at the picture below you can see where the aluminum of the intake come out from the edge of the runners. I tool a flat file to that area and just had to trim off a little bit at all four edges. Once I did that the intake dropped right into place. I added a bead of gasket maker to the top of the block and bolted the intake into place.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/20171202_213954.jpg

After that it was coating the timing chain with some oil and bolting the timing chain cover on. Right before I did that I noticed that I still had the old seal in the cover and don't have a replacement for it in all the boxes of gaskets and stuff that I have. So I knocked it out and bolted on the cover.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/20171202_214001.jpg

On the way home tonight I will pick up a new seal for it and tonight should be able to get the seal and harmonic balancer on. Then I will bolt on the oil pan and the flywheel and will be done with the motor until after it gets put into the frame. All I need to get it into the frame is to get the transmission mounted, the torque converter bolted up and everything on the lift. I hope to have the engine in before this weekend.

HVACMAN

12-04-2017, 01:39 PM

Great job Tim. That engine is looking awesome!!! I can't wait to hear it run. Be sure to post a video of the first start.

TDSapp

12-05-2017, 01:39 PM

Great job Tim. That engine is looking awesome!!! I can't wait to hear it run. Be sure to post a video of the first start.

Yes first start will have a video to go with it. It's be a few weeks before I get to the first start though. I have started the wiring but will have to complete some of it before I even think about starting it. I also don't have any gauges yet since they all come with stage 2.

Yesterday I did get the seal and the flywheel bolts on the way home so buttoned up the motor last night. Got everything done and it is on the stand ready to be dropped into the frame.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/20171204_215156.jpg

Yesterday I ordered tall chrome valve covers and a gallon of the Lizard Skin Ceramic Heat shielding from Jegs and
they are scheduled to be delivered tomorrow. The chrome thermostat housing should be delivered today before I get home from work. On another good note... The wife and I talked this weekend and it looks like we will be ordering stage 2 in either Jan Or Feb. It all depends on how far along I get with everything else to be ready for it.

RoadRacer

12-05-2017, 03:09 PM

On another good note... The wife and I talked this weekend and it looks like we will be ordering stage 2 in either Jan Or Feb. It all depends on how far along I get with everything else to be ready for it.

congrats! my conversations about that have been.. er.. let's say, "inconclusive" :) Not much left to put together from stage 1..

TDSapp

12-06-2017, 11:59 AM

They say a picture is worth 1,000 words, so I am going to shut up and post about 7,000 words.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/20171205_201904.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/20171205_202209.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/20171205_205913.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/20171205_211838.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/20171206_080540.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/20171206_080549.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/20171205_212006.jpg

The new tall chrome valve covers are currently on the FexEx truck and out for delivery. So tonight I may be able to at least set them on the motor to see what they look like. I also got the new distributor and thermostat housing yesterday but I may be waiting to stab the distributor until I am closer to starting it.

HVACMAN

12-06-2017, 04:42 PM

HVACMAN

12-06-2017, 04:45 PM

Oh. I forgot. I'm not sure if it's me, but I can't see any of your pictures on the current page of you thread. Previous pages are fine.

TDSapp

12-07-2017, 09:09 AM

Thanks again Tim for the heads up on the thermostat housing. I have one on the way. Are you having any issues with UPS? My fuel tank from Boyd's shipped on 11/27 and arrived in Houston on 11/28 and sat in their depot until 12/4. Then two more days in Beaumont. I have my fingers crossed that it will arrive today. This seems a little excessive even for the holiday season.

I have actually been impressed with FexEx and UPS recently. All of the stuff I have ordered has gotten here much quicker than I expected. My valve covers got here in two days from Ohio and the Summit stuff got here in one day.

Oh. I forgot. I'm not sure if it's me, but I can't see any of your pictures on the current page of you thread. Previous pages are fine.

I will have to let someone else post if they can't see them. I have been doing the same thing to put the pictures on here as usual. They are all hosted at the site in my signature and nothing has changed there recently. Check out my build site and let me know if you can't see the pictures there.

erlihemi

12-07-2017, 08:49 PM

Pics are looking good!! Different browsers and being signed in or not affect viewing.

TDSapp

12-08-2017, 12:44 PM

Glad to hear the photos are working for most... Here are some more.

The Tall chrome valve covers were delivered the other day. When I went to put them on to see how they looked I found that there was some flash material at the mold lines of the bolt holes. The first one worked fine but out of 8 bolt holes 7 of them had extra metal that had to be knocked out. The first one that I thought was fine had the metal as well and fortunately when I removed the valve cover to fix the other three I saw the metal that had dropped into my head.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/20171206_164724.jpg

This is what I found in the head.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/20171206_164832.jpg

I got that resolved and the valve covers on and took a few pictures... I like how they are going to look on the motor.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/20171206_170206.jpg

After this is when I found the next fun issue to resolve. The 700r4 transmission that I am using came from the same 1989 Corvette that the motor came from. Turns out that GM uses a different tail housing and a different trans mount. Not only is it shorter, it expects a solid mounting point. So now I am going to have to find a piece of metal to weld into the frame to allow the transmission to be bolted in. (The FFR bracket is just there to hold the transmission tail up... It will not stay there.)

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/20171206_194947.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/20171206_190722.jpg

The drive shaft will not be standard either since it has the shorter tail housing. I measured from the end of the housing (not the output shaft) to the flange on the differential and found it is just a bit over 39 inches. So now I need to measure the drive shaft on the Vette and see if I can use it to be cut down to size.

HVACMAN

12-08-2017, 07:56 PM

Oh. I forgot. I'm not sure if it's me, but I can't see any of your pictures on the current page of you thread. Previous pages are fine.

I can see the pictures on explorer but not on Chrome on your web page I can see them on both browsers so its definitely a problem with my laptop. The engine looks amazing!

TDSapp

12-19-2017, 11:03 AM

The engine looks amazing!

So I have to agree with you on this... :-) I smile every time I walk through the garage and see the motor sitting there in the frame.

So my work time on the Hot Rod had been put on hold a few more days. I have been doing some wood turning for Christmas presents and I was also way behind on the maintenance of my big fish tank. With the holidays right around the corner I will probably not get back to my build for another week or so.

(Oh Yeah, I also had an issue where work blocked this forum. So I missed a couple weeks of getting to check it out during the day. But after installing Opera and turning on the free VPN I am back!.)

TDSapp

12-28-2017, 10:36 AM

So everyone in the family decided to give me money for Christmas instead of trying to figure out what I wanted.

So I used the first of it to get a new tool. So there you have it… My first welder! I picked up a MIG\Wire welder at the Chinese Slave labor Tool Company (Harbor Freight). It’s a 170 Amp unit and requires a 240 volt outlet. I am going to pick up the required items to wire my garage for 240 volts. I think I am going to put two outlets in the garage. One for the welder and the other for maybe a bigger air compressor.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/20171227_181724.jpg

My son, Erick, bought me the welding helmet. It is a solar powered auto darkening helmet that has some really good reviews on Amazon. The only dings it got in the reviews is the knob on the side for keeping the helmet in place when up. I put it on and acted like Darth Vader for a few minutes and did not notice any issues with it up or down.

While I was at my parents place up in OKC for Christmas I went into the shop and not only found some scrap metal that I will be using for my transmission mount, I also picked up some scrap to practice my welding skills.

I also had to order some new tools last night. One is a vice for my bench top. I have really needed a big vice for a while and finally broke down and ordered one. Thank God for Summit Racing having free shipping on them… I also ordered a new cutting tool for cutting braided lines and a tool to put into the vice for putting the ends on the braided lines. So JOP33 when it comes time for you to build some AN -6 braided lines give me a yell.

As for work on the car... I did use the grinder to clear the mounts on the rear end for the shocks and got them back on the car. Nothing major since the holidays took so much of my time. I should be able to get back to doing more this weekend.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/20171227_181632.jpg

RoadRacer

12-28-2017, 11:53 AM

New tools are always fun!! Surprised you didn't get the vice cheap at HF.. I got a nice large one there and bolted to my bench and it works fine.

BTW, this is supposed to be a no-weld project :)

TDSapp

12-28-2017, 12:22 PM

New tools are always fun!! Surprised you didn't get the vice cheap at HF.. I got a nice large one there and bolted to my bench and it works fine.

Well, I read the reviews and honestly in this case HF was not the cheapest for a big vice. I went with a 6" vice that is heavy duty and has some pipe jaws under the head. There are somethings that I don't mind going cheap on but I want a vice that will last and not break when beat on.

BTW, this is supposed to be a no-weld project :)

Yeah if I went the stock way and bought a new transmission with the correct mounts. My transmission not only is shorter than the other 700R4s out there it has a totally different mounting method. Anyway, I have always wanted to learn to weld and when I saw this one on sale for $159.xx it was hard to pass up. It has some really good reviews and should be great for learning with.

dallas_

12-28-2017, 12:51 PM

Nice.
Eastfield College has a Saturday continuing education welding class that is worth checking into.

progmgr1

12-28-2017, 07:29 PM

So I used the first of it to get a new tool. So there you have it… My first welder! I picked up a MIG\Wire welder at the Chinese Slave labor Tool Company (Harbor Freight). It’s a 170 Amp unit and requires a 240 volt outlet. I am going to pick up the required items to wire my garage for 240 volts. I think I am going to put two outlets in the garage. One for the welder and the other for maybe a bigger air compressor.

I had a 30 A 240 V outlet in the garage that was intended for an electric dryer. I was able to get the correct mating plugs and 10 AWG flexible armored cable at HD / Lowes and just made up a giant "extension cord" so I could move the welder anywhere in the garage. New outlets are good, but this was a whole lot less expensive...

wrp

12-30-2017, 05:37 PM

Looking great

TDSapp

01-03-2018, 11:35 AM

Nice.
Eastfield College has a Saturday continuing education welding class that is worth checking into.

I may have to look into that. I may also check Collin College since they are so close.

I had a 30 A 240 V outlet in the garage that was intended for an electric dryer. I was able to get the correct mating plugs and 10 AWG flexible armored cable at HD / Lowes and just made up a giant "extension cord" so I could move the welder anywhere in the garage. New outlets are good, but this was a whole lot less expensive...

I was starting to do my wiring and have ran into the issue of only having a 6' cord on the welder. So really no place that I can put an outlet and run the welder in the middle of the garage. So I wired up the outlet in the lose box and was putting the wires directly to the breaker. I wild my wife that for now I was just going to run it like an extension cord and when not in use I was going to pull the breaker. I may do this for a little while until I find that I am using my welder enough to require a full time outlet.

Looking great

Thanks! Yours is too... Can't wait to see yours once it comes out of the paint booth.

TDSapp

01-03-2018, 11:43 AM

Once I got the correct tools I put the ends on some braided lines and made some transmission lines and a fuel line. Here is how the transmission lines turned out.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/20171228_162111.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/20171228_162143.jpg

I think they turned out well.

---

I am also posting a picture of the best tool I have in the garage right now.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/20180102_120102.jpg

With it being 26 degrees while I was out working in the garage yesterday this was wonderful. I have had it for several years and it has never failed me. (Unless it runs out of propane when you are trying to sleep in the back of a U-haul in the middle of the Black Rock desert and it's 20 degrees....)

Yesterday I was doing some grinding on a transmission mount plate and it was hot enough that I kept moving it further back. I also tried to pull my coat off but the flying metal from the grinder kept landing on my arms so I had to put it back on.

TDSapp

01-16-2018, 01:08 PM

I started to work on the transmission mount over the weekend. I got the plate cut and shaped from 1/4" plate steel and ground off the paint where it needs to go. I grabbed my c-clamps and now have it in place.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/20180114_180117.jpg

Now I just need to find someone that can weld the plate in for me. I have a welder now but I don't want to mess up the transmission mount by learning how to weld on the car.

TDSapp

01-22-2018, 12:31 PM

Wow, it's been a rough couple weeks around here. My dad ended up in the hospital from a fall and had a stroke while in the Hospital. I was up there for a week as we thought we were going to lose him. Then he started to get a bit better and has been moved home with Hospice care. I came home and ended up getting the flu (Inf-A) which took me out of service for almost two weeks.

Then last week I went to update my build site and found that GoDaddy had decided to migrate my web site to a new set of servers. They blew up my site big time. Almost all my files were gone and half the tables out of my database were gone as well. I got them to restore my files and then started rebuilding my data base. When I got on the site today they were just not working. Turns out they screwed up the DNS change as well. So I got that fixed and while *****ing at them about migrating without user notification I decided to really bug them. I started giving them crap about my data base and how much time I was spending to fix it. They ended up finding a good backup of my data base from a couple weeks ago and restored it for me.

So now things are slowly getting back to normal. I did work on the car last night but after 30 minutes I was so worn out I had to call it quits and come in. Here is my latest update.

I was searching on the web for a good price on rear brakes and came across a deal I could not pass up. I was originally thinking about going with O’reilly’s Auto because they had calipers for about $62.00 each. But there was a $50.00 core charge with each one and I don’t have anything to give them as a core. So that would come to $224.00 for the pair and I would still have to buy the rotor and the pads.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/20180122_071037.jpg

What I found instead was a kit from Power Stop on the Summit Racing web site. This one included the calipers, brackets, rotors and the pads. Everything but the bolts and I had them from where I bought the rear end. They were priced at $237.00 so it was already cheaper that going the Oreilly route.

The calipers and brackets are powder coated red and look great. They also came with the crush washers, bleeder valves and an additional set of boots.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/20180122_071058.jpg

I did a quick Google on the part number and found that Rock Auto had them even cheaper. I chatted with a CSR at summit and they matched their price plus their shipping cost. So I ended up getting the brakes for both sides of the Hot Rod for $208.88.

And don’t lecture me on how I should buy local. I live in the North Dallas area and Summit Racing is a local. :-) It's only about a 25 minute drive from where I work.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/20180122_071049.jpg

wrp

01-22-2018, 12:58 PM

Looks really good

RoadRacer

01-22-2018, 01:12 PM

Very nice! I bought the exact same thing from summit, rotors and pads set but without the calipers. Just wire brushed my donor ones clean. :)

HVACMAN

01-22-2018, 04:39 PM

The brakes look awesome Tim. I hate to hear about your Dad, and that you had the Flu. I've only had the Flu once. It was bad enough that I don't ever want it again.

TDSapp

01-23-2018, 09:21 AM

The brakes look awesome Tim. I hate to hear about your Dad, and that you had the Flu. I've only had the Flu once. It was bad enough that I don't ever want it again.

My dad has been fighting prostate cancer for about 10 years now, but three years ago it went stage four and spread all over. Then they found a different cancer in his lymph nodes around the neck. So they went the chemo and radiation route. Since they knew that doing the radiation around his neck would keep him from eating they went in and put a tube into his stomach. It was during that surgery that my dad had his first two small strokes. Then about a year later he had another small one, and then fell and broke his hip. He was recovering well from that surgery and last month fell and hurt his leg. He was taken to have a CT scan and was able to use his legs and arms to get over onto the gurney. When he got back it was discovered that he had a big stroke while getting the scan. Oh yeah and while all that was going on my Mom was in a freak accident and was ran over by her golf cart. That broke her arm and kept her from being able to take care of dad like she was. Needless to say, we were happy to see 2017 go away.

My biggest rush on the Hot Rod was to have it built so I can take my dad for a ride. He is the one that got me into cars as a kid and he has been watching the build via my web site and photos the entire time. I am not sure I will be able to get it going fast enough now.

TDSapp

01-23-2018, 09:47 AM

Last night I pulled out the welder and gave welding a shot. It's not a great looking weld but it is holding and should work great. After letting it cool and wire brushing it I gave it a few good whacks with a hammer. It is a solid weld and I can't hear any changes in the sound of the mount while going around the edge with the hammer.

I also filled the hole that was in the metal but that was really just because I was there with the welder and could do it. I figured it would look better.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/20180122_181535_Close.jpg

So now I have put the transmission back into place to make sure everything is going to fit correctly and also so I can mark where the bolt holes need to go. Once marked the transmission will come out again so I can drill the holes and then wire wheel the mounting plate and get it covered in some primer and paint.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/20180122_181547.jpg

TDSapp

01-30-2018, 12:08 PM

On Sunday I started feeling well enough to get back to work on the Hot Rod. I marked where the bolts needed to be and moved the transmission over and drilled them out. I got them wrong the first time and had to open up the bolt holes to get them right. Finally got them in and it looks centered but I still need to pull out the laser and do a final check on it. If I do have to adjust it, there should not be much of a change. So I went ahead and painted the transmission mount to keep the rust off of it.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/20180128_191044.jpg

Once I got that in place I put the floor pans back on the frame and finished drilling all the holes. I still have about six left to drill. Four of them are right by the end of the transmission. I did not drill them so I would not get metal shavings in the wet paint. The other holes are up in the front and currently the AC unit is in the way of getting the holes drilled.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/20180128_191112.jpg

Next I am going to start working on getting the motor ready to start. I need to add the parts to the front of the motor and then digging more into the wiring.

erlihemi

01-30-2018, 05:12 PM

TDSapp

01-31-2018, 09:49 AM

While you have the welder warm consider this. I lost track of which seats you are using, but something I wished I did was take about an inch out of the top of those 2 tunnel brackets and narrow the tunnel between the seats. It requires slicing the aluminum and the back of the fiberglass, but you gain seat width and some travel if you use a slider. I did put 1/8" aluminum plate inside those brackets just to make me think the U-joint grenade would slow down. but mine is back further than yours also. Its just your knees after all. Some guys are reinforcing the tunnel area more. .090" steel works also.

So if I cut the top of the bracket (I only have one there.... Where is the second one you mention?) would it really help with the seat since the bottom of the bracket would still be in the same spot. I guess it would help up higher where the cushion is wider but not sure about the bottom of it.

I was thinking about adding some metal sheets on the inside of the drive shaft tunnel. I could do that with out welding though by bolting them to the afore mentioned bracket and the bracket under the battery area.

wrp

01-31-2018, 10:24 AM

jayguy

01-31-2018, 06:22 PM

I like that, gives a bit more room for the seat backs.

erlihemi

01-31-2018, 08:46 PM

Second bracket is under the aluminum in the back of the cab. That would be a great solution. If you want to stop by and look closely at the fitment issues with the brackets as you are showing you can clearly see his excellent idea. It is only about 1-2 inches of the tunnel height that creates the bind with the seat wings.

8012480126

This has to be tailored to the seat style you plan to use, leg length, etc. I would narrow it towards the shifter more if there is room. I also like the idea of putting the E-Brake up on the tunnel, but that takes more fab time. Bolting the shields inside the brackets is what I did so I can remove them as needed. Don't go too far behind the rear bracket or you will struggle with drive shaft installation. Many options, much Fun to be had...

wrp

01-31-2018, 09:11 PM

This has to be tailored to the seat style you plan to use, leg length, etc. I would narrow it towards the shifter more if there is room. I also like the idea of putting the E-Brake up on the tunnel, but that takes more fab time. Bolting the shields inside the brackets is what I did so I can remove them as needed. Don't go too far behind the rear bracket or you will struggle with drive shaft installation. Many options, much Fun to be had...In the fitment shown I used the stock brackets at the stock height with the standard short seats sent with the kit. The intent was to show where the wings hit and therefore approximate about how far the contact with the seat was. One of my constraints was the console I bought that was fitted to the front loop

erlihemi

02-01-2018, 12:55 PM

We had someone on the forum take that all out and just put a metal tube in its place. Others have made safety hoops. Keep in mind the IRS rear needs different allowances to get the driveshaft in and out. My tranny sits back further than some so I was limited on how narrow I could go. Wider Kirkey seats don't fit without narrowing that area. Putting the E-brake on top means leaving it high and toward the passenger side unless you go with a different E-brake design than FFR's. If FFR still has the "Big n Tall" seats that another factor.

HVACMAN

02-06-2018, 05:01 PM

Have you started on the A/C yet Tim?

TDSapp

02-09-2018, 10:10 AM

Have you started on the A/C yet Tim?

Besides mounting the evaporator on the frame I have done nothing else. But I have not been working on the car much the last two or three weeks while trying to get rid of the Flu.

HVACMAN

02-12-2018, 05:06 PM

Besides mounting the evaporator on the frame I have done nothing else. But I have not been working on the car much the last two or three weeks while trying to get rid of the Flu.

Man. I hate to hear that you've been sick. The flu is not something to take lightly. Get well soon. I have been trying to decide how high vertically to mount the evaporator/blower assembly. Any pictures would really help.

TDSapp

02-13-2018, 12:21 PM

Man. I hate to hear that you've been sick. The flu is not something to take lightly. Get well soon. I have been trying to decide how high vertically to mount the evaporator/blower assembly. Any pictures would really help.

Well I thought I was over with it a week or so again and ended up back in bed for two or three days last week. This flu really sucks this year.

So I bought my AC unit from he who shall not be named (Hwsnbn), and it is from Classic Auto Air. Hwsnbn did some work and configuration on the unit before it was sent to me. One thing that he did was to mount a sheet of aluminum on the back of the unit with some holes pre-drilled on it. I could not get the holes to line up correctly so I drilled a couple of my own. The aluminum sheet still sits on the frame rail and then I have it riveted to the frame.

Here is a photo of the sheet on the frame.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/20180210_131628.jpg

Here it is mounted

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171016_212841.jpg

TDSapp

02-13-2018, 12:39 PM

So as you can see below I have the engine and transmission in and it appears to be lined up right where it needs to be.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/20180210_131628.jpg

I have also found some spark plug wire looms that I like and that fit a center bolt valve cover. I installed them on Sunday, stabbed the distributor and started cutting and routing the spark plug wires to length

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/20180211_164502.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/20180211_164448.jpg

I finished putting the ends on the plug wires and then put the pulley on the harmonic balancer and the water pump. I then started digging through all the parts I pulled off the motor before it was rebuilt. I was looking for the brackets for the alternator but I could not find them. I stated looking at the photos I took during the tear down and discovered that the alternator does not have any brackets and uses the bracket from the power steering pump, which is not being used, and the air pump. Which is also not being used. sigh....

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/20180212_072736.jpg

I am going to pull the power steering pump from the bracket and see if I can cut it down. I think i will be able to cut it down to only what the alternator needs for mounting and polish it up as well. After that I have to figure out what I can use for the upper bracket. I think it is going to be a pain in the butt to get working.

Now the bracket for the AC compressor is going to be quite the job. It's big and UGLY. Currently I don't even know if the smaller Sanden compressor will bolt up to it at all.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/20180212_072722.jpg

HVACMAN

02-13-2018, 03:26 PM

Well I thought I was over with it a week or so again and ended up back in bed for two or three days last week. This flu really sucks this year.

So I bought my AC unit from he who shall not be named (Hwsnbn), and it is from Classic Auto Air. Hwsnbn did some work and configuration on the unit before it was sent to me. One thing that he did was to mount a sheet of aluminum on the back of the unit with some holes pre-drilled on it. I could not get the holes to line up correctly so I drilled a couple of my own. The aluminum sheet still sits on the frame rail and then I have it riveted to the frame.

Here is a photo of the sheet on the frame.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/20180210_131628.jpg

Here it is mounted

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/20171016_212841.jpg

Thanks for the photos Tim. I purchased the Classic Auto Air System also but not from a certain person. Thanks again.

TDSapp

02-13-2018, 03:47 PM

Thanks for the photos Tim. I purchased the Classic Auto Air System also but not from a certain person. Thanks again.

Well if you have any questions for Classic Auto Air and can't get ahold of them let me know. They are in the DFW area and I can stop by. I stopped by and visited with them a few months back... Nice guys. Even said that when I was ready they would crimp all my lines for free since I have one of their systems.

TDSapp

02-26-2018, 12:45 PM

So I had a delay in working on the car for the last week and a half. My Father and mentor passed away last week on Valentines day. I had been working hard on getting the car going so I could take him for a ride. I had also been trying to get him to come down for a visit and to help me work on it but neither will be able to happen now.

I did do some work on the car and started to have some trouble in turning the motor over and my thought was to call dad and ask him what he though. I guess I will have to depend on you guys from now on. Thats a far cry from just calling dad up but I guess it will have to do. :)

So yesterday I got to install the Summit Racing headers that came in. I also installed the pugs and plug wires to see how everything was going to look.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/20180225_203158.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/20180225_203210.jpg

I bought the black non-High temp painted headers because the ones that are powder coated lost their warranty if used for breaking in a motor. I figured that for $119.00 I could break in the motor and then take them to be powder coated. Or I might find out that I hate them and have a set made for me.

My biggest problem now is after I took the pictures I decided that I was going to redo the lash for the rocker arms. I think they were way to tight the way I had done it. So I pulled the distributor, the plug wires, plugs and the valve covers and started to loosen up the rocker bolts. I could get all but three lose and went to turn the motor over so I could get the other three and then get the pistons into place to start setting the valve lash. No joy... I put the socket on the crankshaft bolt and even with an 18" break over and a cheater bar all I could do was tighten up the bolt. The motor would not turn. This was when I thought to call dad but then I got depressed and just cleaned up and went inside.

I think I may have figured it out though. So tonight I will give it a try and see if I found the issue. I'll update later if I have it fixed.

wrp

02-26-2018, 01:15 PM

Are you trying to turn the engine with the plugs installed? I had a terrible problem getting mine done, wasted a camshaft and two lifters in the process.

TDSapp

02-26-2018, 01:24 PM

Are you trying to turn the engine with the plugs installed? I had a terrible problem getting mine done, wasted a camshaft and two lifters in the process.

Nope... Pulled the plugs as well.

When I woke up at about 3 a.m. this morning I started thinking about it and I did not have any problems until I put the transmission on the back of the motor. So I think what I did was to mate them up with the Torque Converter not seated all the way back and is probably pressing up against the fly wheel.

Arrowhead

02-26-2018, 01:47 PM

Wow, sorry to hear you lost your father. Thoughts and prayers for you and your family.

Sounds like you might be on the right track with the TQ not seated, hopefully no damage.

TxMike64

02-26-2018, 01:48 PM

Sorry to hear of your Dad's passing. I've found even after 16 years I still find myself thinking "I should ask Mom about that..." I've come to cherish those moments as reminders of just how important they were/are to me, and could never be forgotten or replaced.

RoadRacer

02-27-2018, 05:59 PM

Just checking out your website and found the budget page - hey now where's the money for engine block and transmission? No fair using "parts I found in my garage" ;)

TDSapp

02-28-2018, 09:37 AM

Just checking out your website and found the budget page - hey now where's the money for engine block and transmission? No fair using "parts I found in my garage" ;)

But I did just find it in the garage.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170813_142717.jpg

I was going to sell the Vette for $4,000 or $5,000 dollars and started looking at buying a motor and transmission and figured it would be cheaper to strip the Vette and use what I can on it. So the motor and trans are going into the Hot Rod and the rear end is going into my next project. My Dad gave me his Model T that has been sitting as parts for years. It uses a Vette rear end but the one that came with it is shot. So the rear end is going into it and I start it once I get the Hot Rod done.

If you go to the very last company in my budget page you will find the cost where I had the engine prepped. I also bought a new cam and lifters from Summit Racing.

TDSapp

02-28-2018, 10:37 AM

One Step Forward, Twelve Steps Back!

So on Sunday the motor was in and the headers on and everything was looking good until I tried to turn the crank. It would not move. I figured it was the torque converter (TC) not being seated and started to pull the motor again. So, I had to pull the headers, the distributor, and put the hoist on the motor again. I started the trans bolts coming out and as I loosened the bolts the motor was being pressed forward so yeah, it was the TC causing the problems.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/20180227_203704.jpg

Go the motor on the stand and the motor turns with the break over on the crank bolt.

Got it onto the stand and the lash set as required.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/20180227_221912.jpg

Notice the oil spot on the floor? That is because I put the oil in and dropped in the pre-oiler and gave it a good spin with my drill. Oil came shooting out of the hole for the oil pressure sending unit that I had forgotten to put in. Got that put in and gave it another spin. I am now a bit concerned because no oil made it up to the rockers through the push rods. I may need to press down more to make sure the oiler is sealing well. But I don't recall having to do that the last time. But then again I was using an old distributer that had the cam gear ground off of it.

This is the one I am using.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00AZJYEZS/

HVACMAN

02-28-2018, 12:21 PM

But I did just find it in the garage.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/20170813_142717.jpg

I was going to sell the Vette for $4,000 or $5,000 dollars and started looking at buying a motor and transmission and figured it would be cheaper to strip the Vette and use what I can on it. So the motor and trans are going into the Hot Rod and the rear end is going into my next project. My Dad gave me his Model T that has been sitting as parts for years. It uses a Vette rear end but the one that came with it is shot. So the rear end is going into it and I start it once I get the Hot Rod done.

If you go to the very last company in my budget page you will find the cost where I had the engine prepped. I also bought a new cam and lifters from Summit Racing.

I have a file cabinet in the shop which has all of my receipts, instructions, warranties, etc... but I'm pretty sure I don't want to know how much I've spent and I'm absolutely sure I don't want the wife to know. lol

TDSapp

02-28-2018, 03:16 PM

I have a file cabinet in the shop which has all of my receipts, instructions, warranties, etc... but I'm pretty sure I don't want to know how much I've spent and I'm absolutely sure I don't want the wife to know. lol

I also have that drawer with all the receipts. Biggest problem is my wife is a 25 year teacher with 22 years of it being a math teacher. So she wants to see numbers. She is all for me building the hot rod though.

I mostly do it though so I remember what I have spent already and try and spread it out. I mean that almost 20K has all been in that last 7 or 8 months. It probably would have not hurt to spread it out a bit... But we can afford it right now so why not.

Xander

02-28-2018, 03:44 PM

TDSapp

03-01-2018, 09:51 AM

Thanks for all your work so far on this thread. I am just doing my homework on a future build at this point, but threads like this really help paint a clear picture of what things will be like when I get into this on my own.

X...

I am glad it is helping someone.

Make sure you take a look at the budget at http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/budget/ as I keep it up-to date with everything I spend on the car. Now mind you, not everything I have bought gets added. Mostly tools and such that I know I will use on other projects, like my sand blasting cabinet and a 16mm wrench. I have not really had to buy many tools as I had most of them.

I am currently at $19,474.07 and I only bought stage 1 to start with. I also have not bought my wheels and tires and I know I am going to need a few other things when I get stage 2. As I revise my future budget it creeps a bit higher than I expected but not by much.

$20,000.00 Stage 1 and Drive Train
$10,000.00 Stage 2
$ 4,000.00 Wheels and Tires
$ 5,000.00 Paint (This may be a little low but I plan on doing most work myself)
$ 2,000.00 Misc things I am going to need. (Sanding paper, filler, epoxy and glass.)

So, at least $42,000.00 and that does not include the cost of a motor and transmission. I already had them but did have to pay to get the block machined, but a new basic motor and transmission would probably add around $6,000.00 to $7,000.00 to the cost.

hutchjc1

03-01-2018, 04:08 PM

Tim I just got through you build thread and offer my condolences, it sounds as though you and your father had a great relationship. Cherish the memories and know he will always be riding with you.
Sincerely,
Jim

erlihemi

03-01-2018, 04:30 PM

One Step Forward, Twelve Steps Back!

Notice the oil spot on the floor? That is because I put the oil in and dropped in the pre-oiler and gave it a good spin with my drill. Oil came shooting out of the hole for the oil pressure sending unit that I had forgotten to put in. Got that put in and gave it another spin. I am now a bit concerned because no oil made it up to the rockers through the push rods. I may need to press down more to make sure the oiler is sealing well. But I don't recall having to do that the last time. But then again I was using an old distributer that had the cam gear ground off of it.

This is the one I am using.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00AZJYEZS/

Did you figure out the priming issue? I can't remember if the SBC needs the crank turned to get the oil hole alignment for the lifter passages. Some engines need the crank turned over while priming to get oil flow. Some don't. Some feed through the Cam also.

NAZ

03-01-2018, 06:02 PM

Tim, go to the Summit Racing website and order the following part number: CCA-320 (CCA-324 for SBF). I never build a V-8 engine without one of these crank turning devices. On high compression engines you can actually twist off the damper retaining bolt and don't even try turning the motor backwards. With these devices you can go either direction and never hurt the damper retaining bolt. Thank me later.

hutchjc1

03-02-2018, 09:02 AM

TDSapp

03-02-2018, 10:41 AM

I was looking at your trans mount plate, just want to check that you are making some accommodations to be able to pull the trans without having to pull the motor, and to make sure that you can actually pull and install the motor and trans assembly with the body in place. It looks like with the plate hard mounted you may not be able to get the angle needed to get the trans and motor installed with the body etc. in place. I now know with my car I cannot pull the transmission with out at the very least moving the motor forward. With the motor in place I cannot move the trans back far enough for the input shaft to clear the bell, I need to rebuild the throw out bearing which should not be that big a deal, but ended turning into something much more involved.
Just wanted to make sure you thought of future maintenance....
Jim

Well unfortunately with the way the transmission mounts I will not be able to pull it out without pulling the trans cover or the motor. I do know that while working on the trans mount I could not drop the trans out the bottom because of how long the tail shaft is. So I wrapped it with the ratcheting tie down straps and was able to lift it out, but once it is assembled it will require the trans cover to be removed. For now I am going to continue on and will just have to plan on pulling the motor if I need the trans out.

NAZ

03-02-2018, 11:38 AM

81941

Pulling the engine and trans is not that difficult in the 33HR compared to many other cars I've pulled engines on. I've had mine out a few times now during the build process. With the right tools can be a one-man job. In the photo you can see the articulating lifting adapter I use and this make it so that one person can R&R the engine & trans. Mine has to come out for SFI cert every two-years which is way more than most folks will need. You'll spend more time & money modifying the chassis to make it so you can pull the trans without the engine. And there is the engineering & design work necessary to ensure you don't compromise the chassis' structural integrity.

HVACMAN

03-02-2018, 03:43 PM

wrp

03-02-2018, 07:57 PM

Drink a gallon of coffee, invite a friend, and :) Enjoy

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ClffREDI4IM&t=23s

wrp

03-02-2018, 08:00 PM

Another view

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CPIoIGhVT-k

NAZ

03-03-2018, 08:26 AM

Wow you guys work fast! I had to set down and have a beer after that. wrp and crew can install an engine in a bit over a minute. HVACMAN can do it in an hour. It takes me three beers to pull or install an engine -- not sure in hours and minutes but I can reference the time it takes in beers.

All kidding aside, it's not that hard in the Hot Rod. My tip to others is to use Weather Pack connectors on the lights to make it easy to pull the grill / radiator assembly and get it out of your way. I've found it to be easier to install the motor/trans assembly through the front rather than the side but whatever works best for you is how you should manage the job. For my build I had a clean sheet of paper when designing my new chassis. I could have easily incorporated removable cross members to facilitate removing the trans through the bottom but I prefer to remove the engine & trans as a unit rather than fight getting my fat hands in the close space around the bell housing and firewall. And it wasn't worth the extra weight to make removable cross members anyway.

wrp

03-03-2018, 11:00 AM

The key to it is to promise a 17 year old you will let him drive it if he helps. That gets all the beneath the car work done as well as the tight spaces on the bell housing. Plus they like sugar drinks as boost, leaving more coffee for the old timers

RoadRacer

03-03-2018, 11:49 AM

TDSapp

03-06-2018, 10:57 AM

Well my oldest son is 27 and lives in Oklahoma with his wife and daughter so he is not much help to me. My youngest is 24 but he has no interest in cars unless I was to ask him to program something on a RPi to put in the car. I could probably get a couple kids from next door to help but they are young.

But really though... How could a guy not want to work on something that looks like this. It gets me excited every time I look at it.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/20180304_144942.jpg

I did get to work on the car on Sunday. After putting the motor in and pulling it twice I finally got the torque converter (TC) to seat. I finally got the motor in, transmission in, TC bolted to the flywheel, and the motor brought to TDC on #1 and the distributor stabbed. I also mounted the headers and the down pipes. I am getting closer and closer to that fabled first start.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/20180304_193643.jpg

Now I have to pull the distributor and put the gear break in lube on the drive gear. I may just tape the lube to the cap though and not do it until I am about to start it. I don't want the lube to drip off of the gear while doing everything else to get it started.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/20180304_193652.jpg

RoadRacer

03-06-2018, 12:29 PM

I agree, that motor looks awesome. Proper old school grunt. Getting close to start!

NAZ

03-06-2018, 04:32 PM

Yes, a SBC looks great in one of these cars.

TDSapp

03-22-2018, 11:45 AM

After Dad passed away I have found it hard to go out and work on the hot rod. I was trying to get it going so I could take him for a ride before he passed. I got depressed after trying to work on it and had a problem. My first thought was to call dad and ask him what he thought.

But it has been over a month and I went back to work on the car last weekend. The head lights and buckets were delivered so I went ahead and mounted them to see how they will look. They are 7.5 inch light buckets that are polished stainless steel and the head lights are H4 Halogen bulbs with 6 LEDs across the bottom for the turn signals.

I have to pull them again to do the wiring but it only takes a single nut to drop them from the car. I will also have to turn the bulbs to make sure that the LEDs are at the bottom so they look correct.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/20180317_122515.jpg

I also put the carb back on along with the spark plugs, wires, loom and headers. I also started on the wiring harness so I can start the wiring.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/20180316_165441.jpg

AJT '33

03-22-2018, 12:23 PM

Hey Tim, my condolences on the loss of your dad, I am sure he would have wanted you to get this done regardless! I lost mine a little over a year ago and still hear him telling me how to do things on the car even though he was a sailboat builder. Using all the knowledge he instilled on me for everything fiberglass as that boats were fabricated in fiberglass, you could say I was born with fiberglass diapers! It does feel good to know he would have been there all the time to tell me what to do and not just suggest things!!

I see you mounted your headlights and would appreciate it if you could take a picture(s) on how you mounted it to the brackets in behind/beside the drill. I'm trying to work out how I can have them permanently mounted along with the side marker lights i need to have without having the side covers. Want to make it look good but functional as well. cutting the fiberglass panels and reglassing them to have good tight joints is not an issue for me. any additional pics would be appreciated to see. TY!

TDSapp

03-22-2018, 02:30 PM

I see you mounted your headlights and would appreciate it if you could take a picture(s) on how you mounted it to the brackets in behind/beside the drill. I'm trying to work out how I can have them permanently mounted along with the side marker lights i need to have without having the side covers. Want to make it look good but functional as well. cutting the fiberglass panels and reglassing them to have good tight joints is not an issue for me. any additional pics would be appreciated to see. TY!

I will take some pictures when I get home tonight but I just mounted them to the lower headlight hole on the grill support.

TDSapp

03-29-2018, 01:10 PM

So AJT, I have not gotten the photos of how the lights are mounted because I took them off so I can start the wiring on them.

With that said I have started the wiring of this beast. What a blur of colors... At least American Autowire has a good diagram of the wires and each wire is labeled. After reading a thread here on the site I mounted my fuse panel on the petal box frame to the left of the steering wheel. I may have to move it back some as I think it might be to far back and not allow the body to slide on.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/24687.jpeg

One thing I think makes this a bit easier is the control unit I got with my Dakota Digital Gauges. It lets me run all the gauge wires to this unit and then only a single Cat-5 cable from the unit to the gauge cluster. It's nice and compact that way. Now I need to figure out where I am going to mount it and the control unit for the power steering.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/24683.jpeg

I am now working on the ignition switch, I just want to solder the wires to the connectors before I put them into the connector. I also wired up the light switch, which is just seen on the lower left of this picture.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/24682.jpeg

TDSapp

04-16-2018, 02:06 PM

So back to a bit of working on the Hot Rod. I bought March alternator and AC compressor brackets and they both finally got delivered. I got them put on and found a couple issues with them but I can make them work.

First problem is the adjuster bar on the alternator bracket is way too short. It puts the alternator way too far out the side of the motor.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/20180415_150736.jpg

I found that I can buy another adjusting rod for not to much that will bring the alternator closer to the valve covers. Kind of fitting better like the AC compressor fits.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/20180415_150743.jpg

This one did not fit quite right but it is working OK for me. I had to move the adjustment rod over to the water pump though.

The biggest problem is that the two pulleys no longer line up with the water pump and crank shaft pulleys. I called March and talked to them and got them to tell me the matching Crank pulley. They also tried to give me the part number for the correct water pump but I need a smooth water pump pulley and they gave me one that has the grooves for the serpentine belt. I think I found the one that I need but there are no measurements or demotions on any of the web sites I have looked at. It is the March 6271 for the crank and I think it is the March 4312 for the water pump.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/20180415_150747.jpg

TDSapp

05-24-2018, 01:00 PM

Finally got to work on the Hot Rod again. This time I started with converting and rebuilding the carburetor. The carb I got from my Dad is a Holley 4160 which uses a metering plate to control the fuel flow to the secondaries. I found that there is a conversion kit that changes the 4160 to a 4150, which includes a new metering block which allows jets to be changed for the secondaries.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/20180521_203816.jpg

I also have pulled some of the sheet metal and drilled some of the holes for the AC hoses.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/20180520_153837.jpg

I am starting to pull most of the sheet metal and am taping them up and getting them ready to spray on some lizard skin.

If you really want to get more details on the carb rebuild please click on the link below. I did not want to type everything over here as well as there.

TDSapp

07-11-2018, 01:22 PM

Work Work Work... Seems like that is all I get to do. But here and there are some good times with the Hot Rod. I just have to work around some of this HOT weather that we have been having.

I just got to spray the Lizard Skin Sound Control (SC) onto the sheet metal over the last weekend. I was going to spray the top side of the floor pans but there has been some summer time thunderstorms around here keeping me from doing it after work.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/20180708_161930.jpg

I know it is hard to tell but there is tape where the frame sits that will be removed before mounting the floor pans. That way they will sit flush on the frame. I am going to be spraying the Ceramic Insulation (CI) from lizard skin as well. Will probably try and shoot the final SC layer tonight and the CI over the weekend.

I also got the wiring done for the head lights and got them mounted. None of the wires matched what the wire harness has so I had to re-wire them. I then had to pull out the grinder and modify the headlight cans because they would not let the headlights sit flush and it put the LEDs at a wonky angle. But after a few hours of working slow in 95 degree weather I got them done and mounted.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/20180710_075246.jpg

Since I am not going with fenders or side covers I was able to mount them directly to the radiator supports.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/20180710_075259.jpg

More good news is that we ordered Stage two about four weeks ago and it is scheduled to be completed on July 28th. Jolene at ST said that they are scheduled to pick up on July 30th to Aug 3rd and that it would be around 7 to 10 days for delivery. So hopefully if everything goes well, around the middle of Aug I will have the rest of the kit here at the house.

RoadRacer

07-12-2018, 08:40 PM

More good news is that we ordered Stage two about four weeks ago and it is scheduled to be completed on July 28th. Jolene at ST said that they are scheduled to pick up on July 30th to Aug 3rd and that it would be around 7 to 10 days for delivery. So hopefully if everything goes well, around the middle of Aug I will have the rest of the kit here at the house.

Congratulations! I was getting close and then lost my job.. but got a new one now so start building up savings again ;)

TDSapp

07-23-2018, 09:55 AM

I had to get up early early on Sunday morning, up at like 5 a.m., so the crew could get here and replace a failed AC unit at the house. So I went outside and worked in the garage since it was just as hot inside. (It was up to 82 in the morning when we got there at 6a.m.) I was able to shoot the ceramic insulation on my sheet metal on one side. I hope that soon I will be able to shoot it onto the inside of the floor pans.

No pictures today because the ceramic insulation looks almost identical to the sound control except it is a little closer to black.

My biggest problem working on the car right now is the heat. I will normally work on the car and then call it a day when it reaches 95 degrees. Yesterday that meant I went inside at 10:30 a.m.! It reached a high of 109 yesterday and that is just too hot to be outside. Makes me want to put an AC in the garage but after spending $5,000 to have the one on the house replaced I realize that I don't want to spend that much on the garage.

After cleaning up the Lizard Skin sprayer I did get to play with the new pressure washer. Washed the daily driver and then used it to clean up part of the driveway. It was normally priced at $225.00 but I got it on Amazon prime day for $112.00. It is going to really speed up some of the clean up jobs around here. I figure that after sanding the body of the hot rod that the pressure washer will really clean out the nooks and crannies better than just a garden hose and nozzle.

JOP33

07-23-2018, 01:29 PM

Echo to that from the Westside Tim! 114 over here yesterday, which translates to 125 in the shop (even the portacool doesn't help at that temp). Hate to see weekends go by with not much work getting done. Focused on heatshielding and some wiring cleanup, so sweating like a pig doesn't seem to help things along.

TxMike64

07-23-2018, 02:06 PM

There's a bit of irony in working on heatshielding when it's 120*

TDSapp

07-23-2018, 02:56 PM

There's a bit of irony in working on heatshielding when it's 120*

Exactly! I was tempted to spray the garage walls with it but I don't have enough. :-)

HVACMAN

07-23-2018, 03:07 PM

Texas is definitely hot this time of year. Being this close to the Gulf kept us at a balmy 97 yesterday. However, it was time to do maintenance on the privacy fence and decks, so I spent five hours Saturday and three hours yesterday on the pressure washer. I sure was glad to go to work today!

TDSapp

08-03-2018, 11:45 AM

Good News! Good News!

I got an email from Tony Z. at FFR and my stage 2 is on the truck. It will probably be delivered in 4 to 5 days.

I think I have also trimmed down my tire and wheel decision. I have to say it was rough to find a set of rims that had sizes that were both narrow enough for the front and wide enough for the rears. At least finding rims that I like and will fit.

I am still waiting on an email from Dan Ruth about being able to use 30" tall tires when using the adjustable control arms. If that is true then I am finally down to two options. The final decision will be made by SWMBO as she controls the budget for me. (Not doing much of a good job... I just updated the budget on my build blog... OUCH!) There is an $800 difference in the two options but I could live with both of them.

Option 1
Mickey Thompson 29" X 18" on 20" X 15" Rims

Option 2
Mickey Thompson 30" X 12" on 18" Rims

Both options will have the same front tires

Mickey Thompson 26" X 8" on 18" X 7" Rims

Here are the rims I am planning on going with.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/Custom-Burnout-Wheels.jpg

I just got the email from Dan and he said that I can run 30" tires but that I would have to alter the shock mounts. Not sure what that entails since he said it was in the instructions sent with the adjustable control arms. The instructions are at home so I will have to wait and see what it takes.

RoadRacer

08-05-2018, 01:43 PM

nice wheels!

TDSapp

08-07-2018, 12:26 PM

So have been getting ready for my stage 2 delivery which is coming tomorrow! WooHoo!

I started off my weekend by grabbing the floor panels that have been sitting for a couple weeks letting the Sound Control and Ceramic insulation from Lizard Skin dry. Not that it needed that time, I was just able to get to them. I was worried that I might not be able to get the tape off where the frames sit because they sat so long but it was not a problem. Find a corner of the tape and it all just peeled off with sharp lines.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/20180805_110041.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/20180805_112829.jpg

Before setting them on the car I went ahead and took the time to install the shifter and get it set. I've had the shifter for a couple months now and finally felt like getting it going. It is a Lokar Nostalgic shifter kit for the 700R4. It has a LONG shifter arm that I might have to replace. I wanted something old school with a bit of the Rat Fink feel to it but at 24" this one might be to long. I will know when the body gets here if I need to change it. It might be over the top of the windshield.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/20180805_135318.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/20180805_143812.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/20180805_143806.jpg

Once the shifter was in place I went ahead and set the floor pans into place. None of them are riveted in place yet as I want to be able to remove them to install the exhaust which shows up tomorrow with stage 2. ( Worst idea ever was to have the exhaust in stage 2! )

As up can see from this picture the shifter is quite a bit higher than the fire wall and steering wheel.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/20180805_184251.jpg

TxMike64

08-07-2018, 12:46 PM

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/20180805_184251.jpg

What wheel is that? I like!

TDSapp

08-07-2018, 01:39 PM

What wheel is that? I like!

That is a wheel I bought from the booth for Affordable Rod Parts at the Good guys car show in Dallas. I wish I could tell you what part number it is but if you call the guy at ARP and send him the photo he will be able to tell you. According to my budget page it did cost me $125.00 with an additional $35 for the adapter to get it to fit the IDidit steering column. They had a huge selection of steering wheels in more colors than you want to think about.

Another item I bought because FFR decided to put it in Stage 2 and not stage 1 where it belongs.

myjones

08-08-2018, 07:01 AM

TDSapp

08-09-2018, 10:40 AM

Tim
I have a fairly long shift rod on my 47RH tranny combo and it did flex a little in use giving a bit of a mushy feel.
I slid a length of steel fuel line tubing over the all-thread and it firmed up the feel, it also takes away any possible
chafing of wires should they get too close to that area. HTH

Dale

Thanks for the tip, so far it has not felt soft or mushy. But then again, without a drive shaft and wheels it's not like I have had a chance to drive it. I may follow your suggestion anyway so I don't have to climb under the car later when it is running.

TDSapp

08-09-2018, 10:51 AM

Wow!

What a difference a day makes!

Yesterday I got a delivery for the Hot Rod. I caught the truck while it was here so I could post the required picture.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/truck_Small.jpg

I got everything into the driveway with the help of Perkster029 (Ryan). Once the truck left Ryan and I pulled the doors, waterfall and trunk lid off the body and set it onto the frame. I have not bolted anything down yet but wanted it where I could take some measurements.

So in just one day it went to this...

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/20180808_154111.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/20180808_152027.jpg

After Ryan left I emptied a couple of the boxes and tossed the seats into place.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/20180808_153343.jpg

Since I am not going to run a hood or side panels the front of the car does not change its looks much.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/20180809_082550.jpg

TDSapp

08-10-2018, 09:33 AM

So I did my inventory last night and what a joy... There was nothing missing except for one part, the transmission tunnel. A few items on back order but nothing major. There are even a few on back order that I received. :-)

What I did find were a ton of extra parts. Yeah go figure.

I asked for them to delete the head lights and they did... But only the head lights. I still ended up with the headlight cans, mounting and wiring.

I asked them to delete the hood and they did, along with the hood hinge assembly. But I still received the hood hinge assembly, and the gas piston, and prop rod and ends, the firewall pins and a bag with a ton of hood bolts.

In one of the bags I got the following two parts... Both are the same but while going through the inventory I could not figure out what they are. I am sure someone here can tell me right quick without having to go through each page of the manual.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/20180809_183126.jpg

Just sitting here looking at the photo I am starting to think they are the bulkheads where the cable should be going through the firewall. Maybe....

TxMike64

08-10-2018, 10:15 AM

Those look like conduit fittings.... Did they accidentally grab the electricians parts stash...?

JOP33

08-10-2018, 11:30 AM

CVOBill

08-10-2018, 11:34 AM

Those are for the hood pins, they go in the fire wall. But if your not running a hood you won't need them.

TDSapp

08-10-2018, 12:41 PM

Thanks guys... I knew someone would know exactly what they were.

Perkster029

08-12-2018, 06:16 PM

Lookin' good, Tim!!

TDSapp

08-13-2018, 11:31 AM

With the weather finally cooperating I was able to get quite a bit done on the car this weekend. Since stage 2 had been delivered I finally had some parts that I had been waiting on. I started Saturday morning and got all the exhaust put on.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/20180811_153459.jpg

I originally put the passenger side on with the muffler upside down so the tip stuck out way to far. I went back and flipped it over so the tip was where I wanted it.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/20180811_144200.jpg

Just looking at how close the muffler is to the floor board I have decided that I am going to wrap the pipes and the muffler to try and keep some of the heat out. I have lizard skin for sound and heat on the floor panels but I don't think that it would be enough. I am planning on this being a driver and not a show car so I don't think wrapping it is going to be a problem for me.

I also pulled part of the shifter mount and was able to put the shifter rod and knob back on. I pulled it worried that it would be in the way getting the body on but it was not. But once the body was on I was unable to screw the shifter back on because it hit the dash. Now that it is back on I can shift without hitting anything.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/20180811_153711.jpg

Now I am wondering if I am going to be able to reach the shifter knob when buckled into the seat. I have head that some folks have trouble reaching the dash when buckled in and this is really up there.

After that was all done I went back to wiring. I finished most of the wiring up in the grill area. The headlights, high beam, turn signals, and parking lights are all done. I also did the electric fan and the horn is mostly done. Looks like I am going to have to pull the grill to plug in the horns. I just can't get my hands in there enough to plug them in. I mounted the starter into place and was able to wire the 1-wire alternator to it. I have the battery wire and the solenoid left to do and the starter will be ready. After that I only have the water temp sending unit, oil pressure sending unit and two wires to the dizzy left and I will be done with the wiring in front of the firewall.

Not bad for a weekend of work while watching movies on the TV.

HVACMAN

08-13-2018, 01:40 PM

It's looking good Tim. You made a lot of progress this weekend.

1932

08-14-2018, 09:48 AM

When you have the seats in you should be may bend the shifter (in vice with protection) so it fits to you.

JOP33

08-14-2018, 12:21 PM

TDSapp

09-05-2018, 02:39 PM

Well by the grace of God and permission from SWMBO I ordered the tires for the Hot Rod today. Both Jegs and Summit Racing had rebates on Mickey Thompson tires and they both had Special Promos on orders over a certain amount. I could have ordered them from Jegs and been done with it but I called Summit and asked them to price match. They are great at price matching and even though the sub total at Summit was less they have to charge Sales Tax because we are both in Texas. So they lowered the price of the tires to be able to beat Jegs.

After matching it to get the final price down below Jegs I ended up with the following Mickey Thompson Tires.

Sportsman S/R, LT 29 X 18 R20s
Regular Price $428.75 each
Matched Price $386.25 each

Sportsman S/R, LT 26 X 8 R18s
Regular Price $229.65 each
Matched Price $190.15 each.

SWMBO and I are going to pick them up tonight.

Now I just need the wheels to put them on.

TDSapp

09-06-2018, 12:20 PM

SWMBO and I went to Summit Racing yesterday and picked up the tires. Good thing I took the Durango as I don't think that the rear tires would have fit anywhere in my Challenger.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/20180905_194002.jpg

I was worried at one time that the 8" wide tires for the front were too big and would not give that fat and skinny look that I want. But after seeing them next to each other I don't think that is a problem. The problem I have now is seeing them every time I walk in the garage and have to wait to get the wheels that I want.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/20180905_215101.jpg

It has been over a year since the Hot Rod was delivered and I still don't have a roller. :D

TDSapp

09-06-2018, 12:38 PM

So besides the new tires I did work on the Hot Rod over the long weekend. I received the transmission tunnel from FFR last Friday and I had finished spraying the sound control and heat control on the floor pans. So I put them and the transmission tunnel into place to see how it was going to fit. I found that once I put in the exhaust I had to put in a spacer under the tail shaft of the transmission. That raised the transmission enough to put up into the passenger side floor pan and transmission tunnel some.

So I am going to have to trim for that and also trim the center of the transmission tunnel to clear the shifter. It was just a bit to narrow to clear it close to the base.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/20180903_125650.jpg

As you can see from this picture I also got back to wiring. When I set the body on I saw right away that I was going to have to move my fuse panel. The body sat on it where it was mounted and was also showing under the dash too much. So I pulled it out and not it is setting on the floor board. I am going to have to figure out how to mount it. I went with a 3rd party wire harness from American Auto Wire and when I had FFR remove the wire harness they also removed the aluminum plate that the fuse panel mounted to.

I have most of the engine, front lights, horn and sensors wired up in front. Just a couple things left on the front, like the tach connection. I also have the ignition, dimmer switch, light switch, and gauge wiring done.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/20180904_081357.jpg

I will finish the engine next and then start on the AC wiring.

Now for the question for everyone.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/20180903_125658.jpg

See the blue wire bundle that is running towards the back, kind of between the transmission cover and the seat. That has the wires for the stuff in the back of the car, things like the lights, turn signals, fuel pump and gas gauge. Most people are running this under the car around the transmission and drive shaft. Does anyone see an issue with running it along the inside next to the transmission tunnel and back to the rear cabin bulkhead and then through a grommet? It would be under the carpet so it's not like it would be seen or anything. Why run it under the car?

HVACMAN

09-07-2018, 09:12 AM

TDSapp

09-07-2018, 09:55 AM

Congratulations on the new tires Tim. What wheels are you planning for the rear to accommodate those 18" wides on the rear. I have only briefly looked at tires and wheels. I love the look, but once you go wider than 10" the wheel prices seem to go through the roof.

Yes they do go up in price. Which is why I currently do not have the wheels yet, trying to keep SWMBO happy for the most part. At the moment I am going with a pair of Custom Burnouts from American Racing. They are actually one of the few companies that I have found that will do up to a 15" wide rim and also have a matching 7" wide rim for the front. Seems like most companies that will do a small rim stop at 12" wide rim. I have started to notice that most cars that have really wide tires in back have different rims front and back and that is not something I want to do.

This one is also the cheapest. Most of the 15" wide rims I found have been over $1,000 each. The Burnouts are around $800.00, give or take a few bucks.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/Custom-Burnout-Wheels.jpg

TxMike64

09-07-2018, 10:33 AM

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/20180903_125658.jpg

See the blue wire bundle that is running towards the back, kind of between the transmission cover and the seat. That has the wires for the stuff in the back of the car, things like the lights, turn signals, fuel pump and gas gauge. Most people are running this under the car around the transmission and drive shaft. Does anyone see an issue with running it along the inside next to the transmission tunnel and back to the rear cabin bulkhead and then through a grommet? It would be under the carpet so it's not like it would be seen or anything. Why run it under the car?

Seems logical, I'd like to know if it works, if the carpet will lay down right.

Those tires and wheels are going to look badass!

TDSapp

09-10-2018, 10:19 AM

Seems logical, I'd like to know if it works, if the carpet will lay down right.

Those tires and wheels are going to look badass!

Well, the way I figure it, I have the sound and heat kit from FFR. From what I have seen the heat kit is blocks\sheets of foam that are glued to the transmission cover and I thought the floor. (Apparently there is nothing for the floor.) I though that if there is foam on the transmission cover that I could just trim it a bit and the wires would run right at the joint of the foam and the floor. Should be easy to get the carpet to lay flat after that.

TDSapp

09-10-2018, 02:40 PM

This weekend the weather was awesome and was in the mid to high 80s , versus being 98 or higher. I was able to get into the garage and work on the Hot Rod both Saturday and Sunday for quite a while.

The first thing I worked on was the wiring and figuring out where to mount it. A quick trip to Lowes got me some sheet metal that I was able to cut to size and then bend using my vice. I mounted the fuse panel and then cut another piece out and mounted it over the top of the fuse box mount.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/20180908_173252.jpg

I am using that spot to mount the control until for the Dakota Digital gauge cluster. I have to go in and cut and reconnect all the sensor leads as the wires are way too long now. I don't want a rats nest of wires under the dash.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/20180908_182408.jpg

Once I got to this point I pulled the transmission cover and passenger side floor pan so I could trim them. I needed to trim the floor pan where it hits the transmission. The transmission cover had to be trimmed to clear the shifter where it comes out. I also noticed that I am going to have to pull it again because the bolt that connects to the shifter on the side of the transmission is dragging on the cover. I am going to have to flip the bolt around so the head is closer to the cover.

With the floor pan off I was again able to do more work on the exhaust. I had put the exhaust on a while back but I never did the exhaust hangers that connect to the frame. I know that the manual says to drill holes and bolt of on but I don't like the idea of drilling holes in the frame. So I pulled out the wire welder and did an ugly job of welding the exhaust hangers onto the frame. There are also welds on the top of the mount as well. It's ugly but it stands up to some good whacks with the hammer so I think it will work ok.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/20180909_190327.jpg

I am going to have to do this on the other side of the car as well. So I am not quite ready to rivet in the floor pans just yet.

While this was cooling I grabbed my riveter and put the rivets into the sheet metal on the back of the cab. I still have to rivet in the "access panel" to the back of the cab. Since I am planning on putting my battery in the trunk I don't need to worry about pulling that panel back off, so it will be riveted in. I also finished the riveting of the sheet metal under the fuel tank.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/20180909_190610.jpg

I then pulled the sheet metal for the trunk area and tacked it into place with some clecos. This let me start drilling rivet holes in that metal to get it ready to eventually go in.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/20180909_190601.jpg

I also cleaned up the garage some and cleared out some room on the storage loft and moved the tires up and out of the way. At one time I was worried that I was not going with small enough tires for the front. I was thinking that I was not going to get the fat\skinny look that I want. I don't think I am going to have a problem with that. :cool:

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/20180909_184055.jpg

Now I am going to complete the wiring, mount and wire the power steering control unit, wire the AC unit, and run the AC lines out to the front of the firewall. Once done with that I can start getting ready to put the body on. (and off, and on, and off, and on)

JOP33

09-11-2018, 05:34 AM

Nice job Tim...Coming along nicely!

HVACMAN

09-12-2018, 10:18 AM

Looks great Tim. I am running my wiring inside the car also between the transmission tunnel and console.

wrp

09-12-2018, 12:40 PM

TDSapp

09-12-2018, 01:15 PM

See the brass/gold ish colored nuts? I used them instead of the nuts supplied with the kit.

9309693097

Thanks for the photos but since I am going to be hood less I will not be using them.

TDSapp

09-17-2018, 02:41 PM

I got a little closer to completing the wiring under the dash. The ignition, light switch, dimmer petal, and gauge control unit are all done now.

I think the only thing I have left under the dash is the AC unit and the brake switch.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/20180914_193526.jpg

I did get the control unit mounted to the metal above the fuse panel. I ran the wires and tire wrapped them to the frame and then cut them to the correct length for the control unit. Some I ran under the unit and the others were right to the side. I left a little extra in the wires in case I do have to move it at a later time.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/20180914_193519.jpg

I drilled a couple holes in the transmission tunnel as well. This would be so I can run the wires out from under the dash out to the front of the car. Only problem with that was the holes are to small for the heads of the wires. I could not find a hole saw that was big enough so I still don't have the transmission tunnel back in place.

TDSapp

11-28-2018, 01:50 PM

So it has been a while since I have done an update. Work is still going on slowly, but surly.

I pulled the body off the saw horses in the yard and put it onto the frame.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/20181106_195756.jpg

I just set the waterfall in and put the seats into place.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/20181106_195026.jpg

I clamped the body and firewall.

Drivers side
http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/20181107_213407.jpg

Passenger side
http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/20181106_195116.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/20181107_213427.jpg

I measured the body to set the back at 45.5" inches and then put the spacers between the frame and wheel wells.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/20181107_183425.jpg

There is a limit of 7 photos per post so I will continue on the next post.

TDSapp

11-28-2018, 01:53 PM

Setting up the body has allowed me to measure the wheel well spaces for the required backspace.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/20181107_203220.jpg

The front of the wheel well has a section that comes out and makes it narrow. I still think I have room for the tires I have. :-)

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/20181107_202936.jpg

TDSapp

11-28-2018, 02:01 PM

Once I got the measurements I needed for the wheels I went back to the wiring. Since I have moved the battery to the trunk the supplied power line from the starter to the battery would not work. So I bought a power kill switch, mounted it and then ran the positive power through it.

I had to mount it so a small piece of sheet metal and then riveted that onto the body work behind the seats and under the waterfall.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/20181120_202842.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/20181121_165228.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/20181121_170616.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/20181121_170846.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/20181121_174521.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/20181121_174503.jpg

TDSapp

11-28-2018, 02:15 PM

Now it looks like I am going to have to pull the motor and transmission to allow me to finish off the firewall, and to also move the engine and transmission back at least a 1/2 inch. The brackets and pulleys that I bought are just not working. So I am going to have to buy a set of brackets and pulleys that are going to work. I think I am going to go with the v-belt set from Billet Specialties.

http://www.billetspecialties.com/v-trac-v-belt-systems/v-trac-pulley-systems/v-trac/

According to their specs the crank pulley comes out 6.25" from the face of the block. Problem with that is the steering rack is 6" from the face of the block. So I have to move the engine back at least a 1/2 inch to be able to clear the steering rack.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/20181127_081818.jpg

AJT '33

11-28-2018, 04:20 PM

Once I got the measurements I needed for the wheels I went back to the wiring. Since I have moved the battery to the trunk the supplied power line from the starter to the battery would not work. So I bought a power kill switch, mounted it and then ran the positive power through it.

I had to mount it so a small piece of sheet metal and then riveted that onto the body work behind the seats and under the waterfall.

Will the waterfall interfere with the switch when its installed as it sits forward of the rear panel? Or will you be able to drill a simple hole in it so it just peeks through? I haven't decided where to place mine yet and ran into that issue when i tried it in that location and realized If i place any type of arm rest storage there it will be inside of it.

TDSapp

11-29-2018, 10:33 AM

Will the waterfall interfere with the switch when its installed as it sits forward of the rear panel? Or will you be able to drill a simple hole in it so it just peeks through? I haven't decided where to place mine yet and ran into that issue when i tried it in that location and realized If i place any type of arm rest storage there it will be inside of it.

AJT,

Actually it sits below the waterfall. As you can see from this picture that waterfall does not come all the way down to the drive shaft cover. Thats the reason I put the waterfall and seats in before I figured out where I wanted it. I had also saw someone else had out it there.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/20181121_170620.jpg

TDSapp

12-12-2018, 10:38 AM

Well, my final delivery has been made. I received my last backorder box from FFR and opened it up yesterday. It was the interior upholstery box and contained the waterfall cover, the door panels, arm rest, and the center arm rest.

I was impressed with the upholstery job on the parts. They look great.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/20181211_202639.jpg

HVACMAN

12-13-2018, 04:00 PM

Tim, did you get a tracking number. I received an email on 12/6 that said mine shipped that day and I would receive a tracking number. Nothing yet.

HVACMAN

12-14-2018, 09:57 AM

Tim, did you get a tracking number. I received an email on 12/6 that said mine shipped that day and I would receive a tracking number. Nothing yet.

Never mind.... It was waiting for me when I got home from work.

TDSapp

12-14-2018, 03:00 PM

Never mind.... It was waiting for me when I got home from work.

The tracking number was there or the parts were there?

HVACMAN

12-14-2018, 04:15 PM

The tracking number was there or the parts were there?

The parts. Thanks Tim.

TDSapp

01-09-2019, 12:18 PM

I have still been working on the Hot Rod but have not updated the thread recently. It seems that I get a few steps forward and then have to take even more steps back.

The brackets and pulleys I bought for putting the accessories on the front of the engine are just not working out. They either don't line up or I can't find the correct part. So I started looking into the accessory package for the 350 SBC. When measuring I found that I was going to have to move the engine back a half inch so the pulleys can clear the steering rack. So last week I ended up pulling the engine and transmission once again. I had actually not though about how far along I was. It took quite a while to disconnect everything and get it ready to be pulled.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/20190105_192906.jpg

This at least gave me an easier time in drilling and riveting in the firewall and foot box panels. I will also put the steering linkage and everything back together before the engine goes back in.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/20190105_192848.jpg

Since I had the exhaust disconnected from the headers I pulled it as well. This way it will be easier to wrap the exhaust pipes and mufflers. I got the muffler and pipe wraps for Christmas so I was going to have to pull it anyway.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/20190105_192913.jpg

HVACMAN

01-09-2019, 03:36 PM

You might check CVF Racing. That's where I got mine. They were very reasonable and excellent quality.

TDSapp

01-10-2019, 04:28 PM

Happy Happy Joy Joy! FedEx made a delivery today.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/20190110_122304.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/20190110_122409.jpg

I added the coke can to give some scale.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/20190110_122733.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/20190110_123017.jpg

I was not sure what was going to show through once mounted but I am happy with how it looks.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/20190110_124425.jpg

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/20190110_125632.jpg

I am happy with the fat and skinny look with the size difference.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/20190110_125612.jpg

Now I have a new problem! One that I have never had before. The lug nuts fits down in a "tunnel". They are so narrow that I can't get a socket down onto the lug nuts to tighten them. I could probably buy a thin wall socket to get them in, but I would be worried about getting them tourqued. Any one have any ideas?

AJT '33

01-10-2019, 04:52 PM

Happy Happy Joy Joy! FedEx made a delivery today.

http://hotrod.sapp-family.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/20190110_125612.jpg

Now I have a new problem! One that I have never had before. The lug nuts fits down in a "tunnel". They are so narrow that I can't get a socket down onto the lug nuts to tighten them. I could probably buy a thin wall socket to get them in, but I would be worried about getting them torqued. Any one have any ideas?

I used a splined nut on my wheels, did two things, looks good, easy to install and hard to steal wheels! Well, that's three, your local wheel place should have them.
100402 100403 my tire wheel supplier also gave me the socket that goes with it when I got the nuts.
Also, you should look into hidden valve stems!
100404 this is with the valve stem on
100405 valve stem remove and cover on (look at the bottom portion of the rim)