DIY SolidState Arduino Self Canceling Turn Signals

[skidd]

*edit* current web-site with newest info and photos. https://www.ludicrous-speed.com/hotrodblinkn/main.md
*edit* Newest version starts on post #54 https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?24625-DIY-SolidState-Arduino-Self-Canceling-Turn-Signals&p=331976&viewfull=1#post331976 *edit*

This weekend, I tackled the wiring... including an OpenSource solid state self canceling Turn Signal module that I've been designing and building. This is still in Early Alpha.. .and actually un-street-tested.. but.. I just had to share it none-the-less.

So.. I'm no Electrical Engineer.. I'm a self-taught DIYer. I've built a few etched circuit boards and built a few different circuits. But. .I am a Software Engineer by profession, so the programming of a ATTiny85 Arudino was trivial. Add in a few other simple JellyBean components, and I was pretty sure I could come up with a pretty simple self-canceling turn signal system.

It's powered by a simple ATTin85 arduino chip, with a couple of P-Channel MOSFETs to drive the hight-current loads of the signal lights. The "magic" is an Infrared sensor that can detect the turning of the steering wheel without the need for any mechanical connection. Just a bit of black paint on the steering shaft is all it took.

Anyway.. I had been bench testing my prototype board for weeks.. this weekend I finally got to "install" it and see if it actually does what I expect it to do.. and it does!!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YKZoOmbr4G8

The software for this module will be made full opensource, the circuit board design (it's pretty trivial anyway) will also be made full open source, as well as the PCB layout once I've done re-designing it. I'll also put together a full DIY writeup on my main build site for all to use. I tried to make it such that retro-fitting one of these into an already built car would not be too hard, and require minimal changes to an existing setup. They are still on their way to my house, but I ordered a small PVC mounting box to house the module. It won't be left perched on the frame like that.

Specs:
- Switched 12v and ground power the module. It's can handle 6v to 24v of input. Should be more than fine on a noisy 12v car electrical system.
- The MOSFETs drive each of the left and right 12v+ outputs to the signal lights (should work with LEDs as well as regular incandescent bulbs).
- The signal inputs are driven from a momentary SPDT (on)-off-(on) toggle switch, with all 3 pins wired to inputs on the module.
- The IR sensor has 3 control wires, all plugged directly into the module.
- Includes ability to act as Hazard flasher also ( I simply didn't use this feature and instead kept the hardware Flasher module and Diodes installed )


Here's a pic of the prototype board after I was done soldering it all together
http://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20170520_165948_595.jpg


Temporary Mounted to frame with some tape for Testing.
http://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20170529_164559_595.jpg


The IR Sensor mounted in a piece of angle aluminum
http://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/zp-core/i.php?a=Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal&i=IMG_20170529_170014.jpg&s=595&cw=0&ch=0&q=85&wmk=%21&check=f0205ab183b277a90f9660ce7137d023af119e13
http://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/zp-core/i.php?a=Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal&i=IMG_20170529_170000.jpg&s=595&cw=0&ch=0&q=85&wmk=%21&check=f0205ab183b277a90f9660ce7137d023af119e13


The steering shaft with the black paint applied for the IR Sensor to detect.
http://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20170529_164010_595.jpg


The IR sensor mounted below the steering shaft.
http://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/zp-core/i.php?a=Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal&i=IMG_20170529_170943.jpg&s=595&cw=0&ch=0&q=85&wmk=%21&check=f0205ab183b277a90f9660ce7137d023af119e13


Anyway.. Like I said.. It worked.. couldn't wait to share... so .. voila!! Once I get this car actually driving.. and shake out any bugs.. I'll keep this thread informed.

[Jdav]

Pretty cool!

[phileas_fogg]

Very cool.

[boBQuincy]

I like it! My suggestion is to look at SAE J1113/11 to see just how bad an automotive electrical supply is, a lot worse than we would expect. The circuit is likely to see spikes of far more than 24 V so a filter or isolated DC-DC converter is probably necessary.

[skidd]

I used a OKI-78SR DC-DC voltage regulator to power up the ATTiny85. I miss-spoke.. it's actually capable of handling 7-36v of input. I wonder if a zener diode would be a good idea to add on it's input? I put in a simple small diode just to protect from reverse polarity connection issues... but.. a zener might have been better to use to protect from higher than desired spikes too. There's also a pair of opto-isolators driving the MOSFETs. I'm pretty optimistic it'll survive the noisy 12v car electrical system... (fingers crossed). That's part of the reason I can't wait for this fall, when I expect to have my cobra road-legal.... so I can shake out any bugs in the turn-signal system.

*edit update* Instead of a zener, A TVS Diode is what I'm going to add for my final design. Looks like they are designed just for the purpose of suppressing high voltage spikes.

[stevie.nowonder]

Very cool! I am contemplating something similar but had thought of using accelerometer input for the cancel function--I like your IR sensor approach better. Looking forward to your updates on this!

[DaleG]

Very cool.

I'll say!!!

[92sho16]

I had plans to create something similar to this but no need to now, this is awesome. Do you have any plans to have purpose built pcb made for this ?

[skidd]

Yep. I don't yet know what the rules are on here as far as non-vendors "suggesting" that they (aka me) are planning to build and sell a "thing"... so.. I was kind of being cautious. I'm a member of another forum (no not that forum) where they are uber strict about that sort or thing.. so.. I am just playing it safe.

So.. to any mods reading this.. hope I'm not about to break a rule....

But.. yes.. I plan to make the final PCB schematic OpenSource for DIYers to self-etch and build their own. I had also planned on getting a short run of a handfull of Chineesieum made PCBs to build up and "cough sell them if permitted". Then, provide a link to the same Chineesieum vendor for others to order more PCBs. The initial cost of a PCB being made off-shore is usually the initial tooling cost anyway.. so.. subsequent boards should be affordable. I don't know if I want to.. or am able to... build and sell completed modules. I'm thinking I might.. again... something to consider.

[92sho16]

Yep. I don't yet know what the rules are on here as far as non-vendors "suggesting" that they (aka me) are planning to build and sell a "thing"... so.. I was kind of being cautious. I'm a member of another forum (no not that forum) where they are uber strict about that sort or thing.. so.. I am just playing it safe.

So.. to any mods reading this.. hope I'm not about to break a rule....

But.. yes.. I plan to make the final PCB schematic OpenSource for DIYers to self-etch and build their own. I had also planned on getting a short run of a handfull of Chineesieum made PCBs to build up and "cough sell them if permitted". Then, provide a link to the same Chineesieum vendor for others to order more PCBs. The initial cost of a PCB being made off-shore is usually the initial tooling cost anyway.. so.. subsequent boards should be affordable. I don't know if I want to.. or am able to... build and sell completed modules. I'm thinking I might.. again... something to consider.

Cool, I was going to offer to do the layout if needed but sounds like you have what you need.

[skidd]

Since my expertise is in software, I'll be happy to get some help on the electrical side to be sure I'm not making any obvious errors, like Trace thickness. Once I get all ducks in a row, I'll post in here my alpha versions.

[q4stix]

That is pretty slick! I'll be watching your progress for the final configuration and what the PCB looks like

[CobraFan460]

Question: being an IR sensor, I guess it should work just fine when driving at night, right?

[skidd]

Actually.. it should work even better at night. :)
The is the sensor in question is one of these (TCRT5000L).
http://www.voltfun.com/pub/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/700x560/e9c3970ab036de70892d86c6d221abfe/t/c/tcrt5000-reflective-infrared-optical-sensor-front_2.jpg
It has an LED IR at one side that emits an IR light wave.
and an IR sensor beside it, that detects the IR light reflecting/bouncing back off of "something" and back to the sensor.
Hence.. the black and not-black painted parts on the steering shaft. the black paint absorbs and scatters the IR light, so the sensor reads nothing. But, the silver reflects the IR back to the sensor, and thus can be detected by the ATTiny85
:confused: Magic!!

[skidd]

Update:

Found a good box to house this module in.
Ordered two from DigiKey, and after measuring it.. it should be a perfect fit.
What makes this box especially good is that the top just snaps on and off, instead of needing screws like most project boxes seem to use.
https://media.digikey.com/Photos/BUD%20Industries%20Photos/CU-18424-B_sml.jpg
https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/bud-industries/CU-18424-B/377-2277-ND/5291579

Here's my schematic of the board.
68433

So.. I took a run at laying out a PCB that would fit nicely inside that box.
To handle the amps that the lights will pull from the MOSFETs, the short run from Q3 -> P3 and Q4 -> P4, plus the 12v in, I'll solder down some short copper bus bars from a bit of solid core romex wire.
I tried (and succeeded) to keep every trace on one layer, and use thru-hole components. That way, anybody who is going to DIY this will have an easier time of it.
Also.. for wire connection into this box, instead of using screw terminal like my prototype board, I intend to drill large enough holes, and solder lengths of wire directly to the board.
The idea being they would be long enough to reach the places they need to reach, and then the 12v & ground would just need to be spliced in to a switched source.

68434

Any electrical engineers out there that are willing to critique my work.. I'm all ears!!
I'm still months away from driving my car even in go-kart phase, but what ever PCB I come up with.. will end up being road tested in my car and it's software tweaked as needed.
I will most likely make 2 and ask someone with Arduino programming experience to help me road-test it... eventually.

Remember.. all of this stuff is/will be made full OpenSource.. including the software.

[92sho16]

What is the with of the 12V traces? Most hobby pcb shops use 1 oz copper as a base but I would recommend using 2 oz. The calculator below is a good tool to figure out the required trace width in order to keep temps down. Incandescent lamps draw a fair amount of current so I would recommend using a power plane for the 12V. One other tip would be dont have any 90 turns in the traces I would recommend changing all those to 45s.


PCB Calculator (https://www.eeweb.com/toolbox/external-pcb-trace-max-current)

[mcwho]

Skidd,
I am extremely interested in this project. I am an old "IT" guy that has been in the computer and networking business for years. A couple years ago I started to play with the Arduino. I was also interested in the Russ Thompson turn signals.

I taught myself electronics when I was 16 and an avid reader of "popular electronics"

I just recently had the cars alignment done and 4 corner weighting done.

I realized that getting in and out of the car without a removable steering wheel was gonna be an issue. I have decide to put a steering wheel hub in with a quick disconnect.

The russ Thompson has to go.

as of now I have a SPDT switch on the dash for the signals.

was thinking moving that switch to the area around the shifeter would be better.

[skidd]

What is the with of the 12V traces? Most hobby pcb shops use 1 oz copper as a base but I would recommend using 2 oz. The calculator below is a good tool to figure out the required trace width in order to keep temps down. Incandescent lamps draw a fair amount of current so I would recommend using a power plane for the 12V. One other tip would be dont have any 90 turns in the traces I would recommend changing all those to 45s.


PCB Calculator (https://www.eeweb.com/toolbox/external-pcb-trace-max-current)

The copper pdb board I have on hand is indeed only 1oz. Currently, the 12v traces are only 0.04" from the 12v connection to the DC-DC converter, and 0.08" to and from the MOSFETs. I'm pretty sure the 0.04" should be plenty to feed the DC-DC converter and the arduino. I measured it's current consumption on my bench power supply, and it pulled a max of 0.02a of current, most of which was to turn on the red part of the RGB-LED. The traces between the 12v and the MOSFETs though, I tried to keep all those pins close together so I could use short pieces of copper bar or wire to handle the load of the lights. I tried a few different PCB trace width calculators, and even with 2oz boards, I was getting >0.2" traces needed to reach anywhere near 12a. Given my tight size constraints, it was a problem. Hence.. I was going to add the short copper bits. Actually.. what I had planned to do was drill a big enough hole at the 12v in/out points, and have the length of wire pull through far enough to actually reach all the way to the MOSFET pins. Basically, the 14awg wire would be tied right to the MOSFETs, which appear to be rated to a max of about 20a. Seems like a nice clean way to handle the amps.

Like I said.. I tried to keep all my traces on one side.. to make this DIYable. But.. I guess if I really needed to use 2 sides.. so I could create a nice fat 12v plain, It would be doable. But.. with the idea of using the copper bars to handle the load.. I should be good right?

I'll go back and try to round off a few more of those 90 corners in the traces. I guess the IT engineer in me likes sharp corners. :)

Thanks for the feedback. It's much appreciated.

[skidd]

Skidd,
I am extremely interested in this project. I am an old "IT" guy that has been in the computer and networking business for years. A couple years ago I started to play with the Arduino. I was also interested in the Russ Thompson turn signals.

I taught myself electronics when I was 16 and an avid reader of "popular electronics"

I just recently had the cars alignment done and 4 corner weighting done.

I realized that getting in and out of the car without a removable steering wheel was gonna be an issue. I have decide to put a steering wheel hub in with a quick disconnect.

The russ Thompson has to go.

as of now I have a SPDT switch on the dash for the signals.

was thinking moving that switch to the area around the shifeter would be better.

:) Seems to me like you're a prime candidate for a new turn-signal system!!! :)

[DOHCCOBRA]

I have been thinking about something like this for a while. Have you thought about integrating the brake lights into this as well. This way you could set it up as a canceler so you could have both bulbs on each side work as brake and turn signal lights. Ideally you would want the brake lights to work even if the power is off to everything. I am not sure if can get a normally closed mosfet, but you could have the brake lights pass through and be more of a cancel of the brake lights. In doing this you might need some diodes to not back feed when you power the turn signals, but it should all be doable. I do like your optical sensor, the thought I have with that is I am guessing it can't see the direction the column is turning. It would be nice if it could work like most cars where it doesn't cancel until you turn the opposite way to straighten out. Probably a lot harder, but if it could be done it would make the system really cool.

[boBQuincy]

I do like your optical sensor, the thought I have with that is I am guessing it can't see the direction the column is turning. It would be nice if it could work like most cars where it doesn't cancel until you turn the opposite way to straighten out. Probably a lot harder, but if it could be done it would make the system really cool.

Like the electrical system people would say to the IT people, "how hard can it be, it's only software...". ;)
Reading direction *and* speed usually takes two sensors but reading only direction can be done with one. The black stripes around the steering column would form a simple bar code that reads differently depending on direction. The microcontroller can decode the pulses and detect which direction the column is turning. Simple!

Well, not really but the microcontroller should have plenty of time and processing power to do this.

[skidd]

The good news is, my system actually does detect the wheel on its way back. You see, the silver bars pass the sensor at 1/4 turn. I've found that on most (not all) corners we turn the wheel past 1/4 and typically not much more than 3/4 turn.

OK.. So.. What the software does is count 2 passes of the silver bar. Turn on the signal, start your turn, going past 1/4 , 1st pass detected. Start turning back to straight, pass the silver bar again, 2nd pass, turn off the signal. It actually detects the moment the black comes back into view. Edge detection. The only catch is turning the wheel all the around past 3/4 will cancel too. But, I doubt that'll matter...if you turn that far, you are likely done your turn.

I'm sure I'll be able to hammer all this out once I'm on the road. :)

[chmhasy]

Skidd, There is a good online electronic circuit simulation at www.tinkercad.com I have found it problematic on IE but fire fox and chrome work well, It has Arduino boards in its components list

[skidd]

Just a quick update... not that much has changed really.
Playing around with "pretend" driving scenarios in my garage (car is still not road-worth) I realized that the 2 parts of black paint on the shaft were not necessary. I removed the "top" stripe of black paint. There is now only a single strip of black paint facing down towards the sensor when the wheel is straight. Now, the detection is really much more straight forward. The cpu simply watches as the wheel turns for the black stripe to turn silver.. then, back to black again. No longer is there a risk of turning the wheel 1/2 way and having the flashing stop. In hind site, I'm not quite sure why I did that anyway. Once I get my car road-worth (still quite a few months off) I'll be able to better assess the best thickness of the black stripe. I'm hoping to have a very small run of PCBs put together soon too.

[CobraFan460]

Looking forward to one of those PCBs - any idea what you might have to charge?

Todd

[skidd]

No idea what I'll charge.. but.. this is not really a big money making endeavor... just a fun project to help out fellow GearHeads... so.. It'll be reasonable.

[Big Blocker]

I love your idea of using IR for detection. When I built my prototype years ago, I used reed relays and magnets to detect - worked fine except lane changes are NOT detected and the system wouldn't cancel [automatically] with only slight movement off of the straight ahead position. More then likely the fact that the reed relays needed more degrees of separation then IR would need. 1/4 turn is a lot - most [factory] cars only need about 20° to 30° of off-center movement, not 90°. You might want to consider making the "silver" surfaces closer together . . . the down side is that if they are too close together, cancelling comes too quickly, just barely thru your turn. It's a hit-or-miss process to get it right.

Keep up the great work . . .

Doc

[skidd]

Narrowing the black strip will be easy enough to reduce the cancel angle. Which by the way, is done when the black strip returns to the view of the or sensor, so the narrow stripe won't cancel too soon. In other words, cancel is triggered when the IR goes BLACK->SILVER->BLACK.

As for lane changes, I have a hold-for-lane-change mode programmed too. If you hold for 1 second ,it will turn off when released. There is also a 4-way flasher mode, but I opted to keep the hardware flasher and diodes in my build.

[skidd]

Update. Functional Prototype Built!
I found that the layout I came up with for the PCB was pretty easy to translate onto a perf-board. So.. I did just that.
Came out to have less, more direct traces than the original proof-of-concept.

Top View. I soldered the wires directly to the board for added strength.
http://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_6523_595.jpg

Bottom Trace View
http://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_6525_595.jpg

Installed in the mounting box, with some "HotSnot" to keep the vibration from fatiguing the taller components.
http://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_6527_595.jpg

The complete prototype
http://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_6528_595.jpg

Next.. I plan to design an actual functional turn signal lever that will sit behind the wheel at the left side. It won't be just a toggle switch. It'll be an actual metal lever. I have a pretty elegant and simple design in mind.. and I really think it'll look quite trick.

[Big Blocker]

SWEET . . . if these go into production, how is the "black-silver" line part taken care of - some sort of tape or decal for the steering column?
Keep up the great work.

Doc

[skidd]

The black stripe can be pretty much anything. Black Tape, Sharpie, brushed on Paint. Anything that's black. the IR sensor is pretty sensitive, and has little trouble distinguishing between black, and not-black.
The idea of using a good quality decal is a good one. That way, the "cancel" point in the rotation of the wheel can be fine tuned. People with a 3.5 ratio rack, might want a different width black strip compared to a quick ratio 2.0 rack.

Stabbed it in today. Next is the turn lever design. I opted specifically to put it there for easy access to the Arduino chip inside for any required software updates.
http://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20170827_153203_595.jpg

P.S. Yes, the engine-bay harness that hangs down low in that photo will be tied up and secured out of the way.

[WIS89]

Skidd-

Pretty cool mod, and I admire the way you have gone about getting it sorted!

I look forward to seeing how it works when you get to optest it. Also excited to see your plans once completed.

Well done, and thank you for sharing your work!

Regards,

Steve

[axle_dem0n]

awesome idea using Arduino! how has the IR sensor been, any issues? I wonder if magnet for hall effect would be easier.

[Big Blocker]

See post #27 above - magnets have been tried with some success - about 70-30 with respect to cancelling. Doesn't work well with only slight wheel deflection, like lane changes.
But . . . That being said, go for it, I'd love to see a mechanical solution to cancelling . . . unless skidd puts his prototype into production, then sign me up.

Doc

[skidd]

I'm still a few months away from proper road testing, but so far the ir sensor is working fine in driveway tests. I really expect it to work pretty well. I've had good success with these sensor in various projects, including a HamsterWheel sensor I built for my daughter. Using software, I included a simple DeBounce to the detection algorithm too.

As for a production version... If this thing works out as well as I expect, I can't imagine not wanting to make it available to all.

[skidd]

Installed my "turn" lever today.. and it works perfectly! In fact, it might be better than I expected. It's very smooth, easy to reach, and dead simple to operate. The best part, over-the counter parts and it's a very simple install.

The 3 extra holes you see are a failed first attempt. I'm just going to cover the back with some aluminum, and fill the minor depression with some filler.
http://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20170916_111208_595.jpg

A view from behind with the 3 control wires connected.
http://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20170916_111156_595.jpg

The lever has a built in centering spring to keep it positioned between the switches. Switches are mounted to a piece of 3/4" oak I had. These switches are only $8 for 5 on Amazon.
http://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20170916_110816_595.jpg

The main parts for the lever mechanism.
http://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20170916_092751_595.jpg


A Gold star for who ever can figure out where the handle came from? My kids think it's the funnies thing.

[boBQuincy]

Korky! I like it, can the arduino play a flushing sound when the lever is actuated? ;)

[Papa]

Installed my "turn" lever today.. and it works perfectly! In fact, it might be better than I expected. It's very smooth, easy to reach, and dead simple to operate. The best part, over-the counter parts and it's a very simple install.

The 3 extra holes you see are a failed first attempt. I'm just going to cover the back with some aluminum, and fill the minor depression with some filler.
http://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20170916_111208_595.jpg

A view from behind with the 3 control wires connected.
http://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20170916_111156_595.jpg

The lever has a built in centering spring to keep it positioned between the switches. Switches are mounted to a piece of 3/4" oak I had. These switches are only $8 for 5 on Amazon.
http://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20170916_110816_595.jpg

The main parts for the lever mechanism.
http://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20170916_092751_595.jpg


A Gold star for who ever can figure out where the handle came from? My kids think it's the funnies thing.

Is the handle for a toilet?

[chmhasy]

toilet

[skidd]

lol.. won't need the arduino to do that... the Carburetor already makes that sound when I press the skinny-pedal!

[skidd]

Update: The dash is "in" and wired up. Loves me some SpeedHut gauges. Found a small issue with the wiring. Not serious, but made me scratch my head for a bit. So I have my 4-way flashers wired in with the flasher module that came with the wiring harness. I did make the turn-signal-module capable of also doing 4-way flashing, but chose not to employ it. Basically, I figure I just want 4-ways to work in the most dead simple way possible, and eliminate any risk of them not working when I need them to. So.. it was easy enough to in-line a pair of 10A diodes after the 4-way toggle switch to feed each of the left&right signal wires of the car. Worked perfectly.. but.. get this. When the 4-way is turned on, every time the lights flashed on, the whole car powered on, and then back off in sync with the flashers. D'Oh! Somehow, power from the flashers is bleeding back into the main circuit. In the end, it was easy enough to find, the 2 mosfets I use to send 12v to each left and right light circuit, are not capable of blocking the electricity from bleeding back through them from the 4-way, back into the main power circuit. I just didn't even think to try and test for that when I was bench-testing the module. In this install, the fix was pretty trivial, I just inlined a nice big 10A diode to the main power feed to the control module. Now, the 12v can't bleed back into the main circuit. Worked perfectly. Hopefully, there is something I can do with the mosfets to keep them from flowing backwards.

http://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/TheBuild/IMG_20170924_161030_595.jpg

[jwsnake56]

Nice work. Is the big red button a push to start switch?
John S.
#8866
Blueprint 306, T5z, Forte hydraulic clutch, 3-link w3.55 & Moser axles, PS

[skidd]

Yep.. S2000 push-button. I'm using a DEI 2102t PKE system to prevent unauthorized access.

[JRD56]

Very cool. I am an electrical engineer (retired) and love stuff like this, including the programming part. Please us informed.

[skidd]

Update. Wired in the headlights, turn and tail lights today. First official complete test with everything installed and working. And... Worked perfectly!! Drove around the neighborhood a while, and it all worked as expected. Self cancelled as it was supposed to on turns. Easy to activate and manually cancel as needed. I'm really happy with how this is turning out.

[TexasAviator]

Very well done. I too am not an electrical engineer but I have a background in electronics. So relaxing to trace boards and work in the shop on circuits.

One thing around here, I love about the mods in this community, is the ingenuity that people have.

It might take months to happen, lol, but you all impress me.

[skidd]

Update. My car became street legal a couple days ago... So I've been putting on a bunch of around town miles. Good tests for the module... Which is working perfectly!!! The self cancel had not once yet missed a turn. Its performing every bit as good as I hoped it would.

I have 2 prototype boards on hand, one in my car. I plan to pack up the minimal parts needed to retrofit it into someone's car with an existing toggle switch setup, and sell the extra one for the cost of the parts. Mounting box, module and IR sensor. I figure 2 cars on road should be a fair test bed/proof of concept. I still need to get title, inspection and final reg, but after that, I'll make the 2nd one available.

[TXdad]

Super cool, definitely interested if you decide to sell these.

[cgundermann]

Interested as well...

Chris

[Fixit]

But is it from a "Furguson".... ?

[skidd]

Just a friendly update.. I've been getting a few PMs from people interested in this little project of mine... which I'll admit makes me :) knowing people have found value in this.
I'm happy to say, I'm still actively working on this.. but.. I'll admit.. at a pretty slow pace. My car is currently on the road, and it's starting to get pretty hot here in S.Texas, so I don't spend a lot of time in my garage as of late.
At present, I have 1600 miles on my GelCoat roadster with the 1st prototype, and it's still working flawlessly.
That said.. I'm actually in the middle of a minor redesign to the circuitry to do a little better job of some of it's intended features.
Namely, the ability to easily retrofit into an existing car.
I really want it to be as easy as possible for both existing, and new builds to use this.
Also to easily include the ability to run the modules built in 4-way flasher system, or an existing already configured one.
I like the idea of using this modules 4-way system, because it will also allow me to swtich all of my lights to LEDs. The existing 4-way flasher module I currently have is one of those old-school ones that come with the kit, that requires an incandesant to work. It also flashes too fast for my 3-4-wire trailer brake signal converter I used to keep my brakes and turn signals separate. Again, forcing me to use a solid-state 4-way flasher. Just turned into a few too many moving parts for my taste.
Once I'm done with the circuit re-design (almost done), I'll most likly spinn off a few bare PCBs. Then I really want to retrofit the new module into my car to .. once again.. shake out any bugs and problems.
I just don't yet know when I'll get to putting it into my car.. since the current prototype forced me to make a few wiring changes to account for a few design flaws (inline 10A diodes).
I'd like to reverse these wiring changes, and that'll be much easier with the body off. Something I don't plan to do any time really soon.
But.. I doubt I'll be able to wait that long, so I suspect I'll just bite-the-bullet and pop off the body and install it.

So.. in short.. I'm sorry I'm moving at something of a snales pace on this, but I promise I'm still moving on it.

[skidd]

So.. here is part of the reason this project is talking so long to get moving forward... I was looking for an easy way to produce "on-demand" PCBs. Easier than the Laser-Printer&Iron method. Recently bought myself an Anet A8 3D Printer. I modded it to accept a Sharpie Pen, so Now I can draw PCB trace masks directly to pieces of Copper PCB boards.
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2956622

Hers is the outcome after learning to use FlatCAM.
https://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20180624_105124_595.jpg

A short video of the PCB being drawn.
https://www.youtube.com/edit?o=U&video_id=C9f2XlPntug

So.. another step closer to getting a small handful of modules ready to go out.

[skidd]

Finally got the hang of FlatCAM and using Isolation Routing to make the etch mask on the PCBs I have. Worked out really well. The mask was way cleaner than using a Sharpe.
This is a photo of my 3D printer, using a piece of sharp steel rod to scrape away the copper for etching.
https://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20180705_153931_595.jpg


Just a finished the 1st of 2 proper prototypes with actual PCBs instead of a bread-board.
https://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20180708_141837_595.jpg

Another step closer to having at least 1 to sell (the other goes in my car) to someone willing to do some testing with a initial release version.
I'm doing some final tweeks to the box design, and will be using my 3D printer to create them... in what ever color I want!!

[skidd]

Done! Well.. in that the 1st proper prototype is done.
With the recent purchase of a 3D printer, I can now print a purpose built bracket and box. the IR sensor bracket is designed specifically to screw to the 3/4" square tube just under the steering shaft. The circuit board box can now be printed in any color (I have on hand, Red, Blue, Gray, Black, GlowInTheDark.. etc).
I'm pretty pleased with how it turned out. I'm going to try and get this prototype installed in my car in the next little bit.. and start assembly of prototype #2.. which I'll sell to someone here if interested. Someone willing to attempt an install of a Beta Ready product and help a brother out with some constructive feedback.

P.S. I came up with a name for this little Pet Project of mine.
HotRodBlinkin
:cool:

https://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20180712_150223_595.jpg


https://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20180712_150244_595.jpg

[SSNK4US]

WOW!!!
Give me the pieces and I could build it. But the theory behind the electronics of it makes me lost in space lol
Just about ready to take the body off our build so it’ll be a while before I’ll need one. But it appears my plan
of a RT turn signal switch and a quick release steering wheel is not feasible? If that’s the case count me in!!!
So basically your “flusher” hits a left or right microswitch to activate the system? You mentioned you can cancel
it too? Just hit the flusher again to cancel? Your retrofit is thinking of using the momentary toggle? Do you think
if you go to some type of production, I know small scale, someone could get the microswitch version too?
My brain is more mechanical so my wheels are already spinning on a different version of the flusher lol Picturing a
model A or T? throttle stalk thing? TBD LOL! Also it looks like you have some kind of chime/buzzer on that board too?
I can’t wait to see where this goes! In any case I will want to buy or build (just tell me what the goodies are lol) a
HotRodBlinkin! I’m thinking that kinda came from the song? If so I wonder how many out here know that song lol
Ok I’m done rambling.....

Kurt

[SSNK4US]

I watched the video,... I get the canceling now.
So awesome!!!

Kurt

[CobraFan460]

Hey Skidd, you have really brought this project a long way forward. Very professional looking! Looking forward to adding this to my car...

Todd

[skidd]

Long overdue update. As I'm in the final stretch of final assembly of my car, I pulled out the original prototype, and installed the 1st official production ready variant.
The first prototype never once failed me the whole year of 2018 and 2800 miles.
I've yet to drive the new module on the road, but it basically works the exact same as the first prototype, just with a few much needed improvements.
- Proper Hazard light flashing, with no more bleed-over of the 12v power from the normal signals. And no need for any isolation diodes.
- A little piezo speaker to make the good-ol Tck-tck sound. Not that I expect to be able to hear it over the side-pipes.
- Ability (though still un-tested) to run LED bulbs in all corners due to the switching being fully solid-state.
- Simplified wiring. Switched 12v; Ground; Hazard 12v; Left+, Right+. Single plug-harnes for the IR sensor and the left-right switches.

My car should be back on the road in amount 2 months. After which, I'll finally be able to make a handful of these for any interested parties.

Oh yeah.. I came up with a name for this thing too.
Hot Rod Blinkin.


The new main brain box mounted where the original was. (I need to move the left mounting hole lower)
https://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20190324_134034_595.jpg

The IR sensor aimed at the steering shaft. You can see the black paint.
https://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20190324_153439_595.jpg

Top view of the IR sensor.
https://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20190324_153451_595.jpg

[Higgybulin]

Very nice job!! Got yourself a winner.
Higgy

[snowdave]

Excellent thread! I too fell into the Arduino/vehicle rabbit hole (including the use of the same 3d printer). I never got to the PCB stage, but packaged the breadboard well enough for my needs. My arduino calculates gear position, fuel level and temperature in a way that my cheap Chinese speedometer can understand (for a motorcycle).

104375

[skidd]

FYI update...
I've put a decent amount of miles on the car with the new control module design.
It's working perfectly.. as hoped.
So.. I finally got off my butt.. and ordered a set of 15 PCBs from China (should be here in 2-3 weeks).. so.. I'll finally be able to make a few modules for anybody who will be interested.
This project will be OpenSource too.. so.. once I'm finally done making a few modules, and the DIY web-site is done.. I'll post it all here.

@snowdave.. hey.. have you found those screw-terminals hold up just fine on a motorcycle? The screw terminals I've used for this module seem to hold the wire just fine.. but.. it's the one part I wonder about.

[Walt]

Skidd, when you get some ready i would be interested in a unit!
Thanks
Walt

[SerpantFL]

Skidd, VERY impressive thought process and work. This might be related of sorts, but does this unit allow the turn signal stalk to be used as a high beam flasher? I wonder if the reason for the floor mounted switch is the amperage, or is it just personal choice? I don't like to move my feet too far from the clutch when driving, so the stalk would be a winner for me. Anthony

[skidd]

This module has no provision for controlling the headlights.. but.. I also don't have it setup with a "proper" stalk either. It's just a make-shift momentary toggle switch of sorts. I mean. lol.. I made it out of a toilet flusher handle. that said.. this module will work with any sort of momentary toggle switch you can think of, so a modified stalk could easily be made to work .. with a bit of fiddling.

[SerpantFL]

Love the resourcefulness, I will stay tuned...

[JIMOCO]

I very much like this device. I have the Russ Thompson turn signal. My thought is to remove the auto-cancelling components of the RT turn signal making it a momentary switch and install the Hot Rod Blinkin system. Nothing about the appearance changes but I think it will be more reliable moving from a mechanical to an electronic system. I am using the button on the end of the stalk for my horn. I do not plan to make any changes to that portion. I would think that if you can make the stalk a momentary switch for the turn signals only and leave the wiring and mechanical function for the high beam as is, it will continue to function as it does now.

[chmhasy]

In case some people are looking to make some PCBs
I have tried and like the free version of autodesk's eagle cad https://www.autodesk.com/products/eagle/overview
and to have the PCB made for a low price at oshpark https://oshpark.com/

[ChasNMe]

did I read correctly that you are planning on making a few of these? what might you be looking to get for one? thanks, jake

[skidd]

You read correctly.. I ordered a small batch of bare PCBs from China... and will building a few to "share" ;) with my fellow F5 owners. I think I'll have to build a few to get an idea of the effort for their worth.. but.. I'm not planning to do these for profit making reasons. So, they won't be expensive. Once I have a few on hand, I'll have a better idea. Plus.. I need to finish the "How To" website too.

[skidd]

PCBs arrived in the mail today. I need to order a couple more small parts... then.. time to start putting a few together.
https://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20190710_185535_595.jpg

[SSNK4US]

Awesome!!!!!!

[Mark K]

Just a note to compliment you on your great work on this. I can't use it, because I already have the RT turn signal installed, using the button to activate cruise control. That said, you've got a brilliant design here.

- m

[skidd]

Thanks for the props guys....
.. one down... First official production ready unit. Going to 3d print a new case for it now, and install it in my car this weekend.
https://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20190711_201435_595.jpg

[TXdad]

Sign me up coach!

[skidd]

New "Branded" case. HotRodBlinkin'. I'm about 75% done with the "How To / Instructions" web site too.

https://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20190712_074959_595.jpg

https://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20190712_110142_595.jpg

[skidd]

Production unit 0001 Installed and working perfectly!!

https://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20190714_145640_595.jpg

https://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20190714_145718_595.jpg

https://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20190714_145738_595.jpg

[David]

Production unit 0001 Installed and working perfectly!!

https://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20190714_145640_595.jpg

https://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20190714_145718_595.jpg

https://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/cache/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/IMG_20190714_145738_595.jpg

Congrats and nice work on this project! Are you still offering this design open source?

David

[skidd]

I do still plan to open source this project. But... Thanks to the help of a fellow forum member... Who is officially running production unit 0002... A few minor issues were uncovered. We managed to work them out, and now I have to do a slight design update. Hopefully after that.

[paynerc]

As a software engineer and electronics hobbyist myself, I freaking love this. I am only a month into my build, but I am definitely interested in adding this to my roadster when I get there. I’ll be keeping my eyes on this post!

Thanks!

Ryan

[Jim1855]

I am interested as well. I'll need a system that works with the quick release steering wheel. This seems to be an effective system.
Jim

[skidd]

Thanks guys... Hopefully it won't be too long before I get the fixes in and ready to make a few ReadyForProduction units.

[RonS]

Hello Skidd- What is status of your project? I’d like to use this set up in my build.

[skidd]

Thanks to a member here, a few minor bugs were exposed and worked out. Turns out the "solid state" mosfets for switching are not reliable enough. They work perfect in my car (and still do), but for some reason, they kept cooking themselves in the other guys car. It was easy enough to retrofit to use a pair of standard automotive relays. The new design now uses standard automotive relays, simply due to the increased reliability.

That said.. I recently started a new job.. so.. my pet side-projects were sorta put on hold for a bit. No excuses now ... time to get this back to production ready!!

I'll try this weekend to start to built out a prototype with the new relay based outputs. Should be pretty straight forward... Not sure if I'm going to try and retrofit my car with the prototype.. or offer it up to someone here to prove it out. (hint hint)

I'll post up in here once I get the updated prototype done.

[JIMOCO]

Hi. I'm JIMOCO and I am the member Skidd mentions in his most recent post. I volunteered to be a test site for his turn signal system and am vary happy I did. My roadster is a complete build with few mods. I used the Ron Francis wiring harness installed according to the manual and also installed the Russ Thompson self canceling turn signals. I am very happy with the Russ Thompson system but, after five years on the road, I began to notice that it would not stay latched in the on position for a right turn. I think, because it's a mechanical system, over time the latches wear and begin to fail. This is certainly not Russ's fault and he was more than willing to correct the issue. I simply liked the Skidd approach and I continue to recommend Russ's product. Since I was in need of some modification, I contacted Skidd and volunteered to purchase his system and be a test site. I began by modifying the Russ Thompson system by removing the latching system. I left the spring return component in as is. By doing this, I converted the device into a momentary switch. Installation of the Skidd system was easy. He provided a wiring diagram to follow but basically, all I had to do was mount the device under the dash, connect the three leads from the column to the device (the Russ Thomson system has five leads two of which can be used for another purpose. I used them for the horn and that has not changed), connect the leads from the lights and connect to a power supply. The steering position detection uses a black stripe on the steering column that activates a sensor mounted near the shaft. The width of the stripe determines when the cancellation will occur. Since I was unsure how wide to make the stripe, I printed several stripes of varying width on label paper and experimented until I found a position that worked well for me. So far the Skidd devise is working great. Turn signals work flawlessly and I now have the added feature of a lane change signal by holding the switch down for more than a second the signal cancels when the switch is released. Four way flashers are also functioning through the system. Like Skidd said, there were some initial issues with some of the electronics but now that he is using different relays there has not been any issues. I have a few hundred miles of local driving and have had no problems.

[toadster]

very cool - subscribing!

[skidd]

Just wanted to update everyone on the progress today.
Made 2 prototype boards with the new relay based output design.
I'll admit, it's not quite as "sexy" having to use a pair of automotive relays.. as it was when it was just a pair of high-power MOSFETs... but.. It's far more reliable now.
I didn't use those standard big box relays, but instead a pair of those new smaller automotive relays that are found under the hood of almost all modern cars.
2 are about the same footprint as 1 regular relay, but are still good for 30A each.

I still need to make a pair of sensor harnesses, and a pair of housings.
After which.. I'll be ready to sell these to anybody looking to not only have self-canceling turn signals.. but.. also like JIMOCO above, help out and make sure I did indeed work all the bugs out this time. (pretty sure I did)
Then.. I'll get a run of proper circuit board blanks made up. Ready for anybody else who might be in the market.

[RonS]

skidd- I’m definitely interested in a set up however my car is not on the road yet so won’t be able to provide testing feedback at this time.

[GTBradley]

Hey Skidd, nice work! I’ve been thinking about this very subject for a while. I currently use the toggle switch and have trained myself to turn it off manually, but I still forget on an occasion. I’m a Pi tinkerer myself and have been thinking of doing the same thing, but you seem to have figured it all out already, so why reinvent the wheel, right? Let me know if you’d like another tester. I would like to stick with my toggle switch, but would change it to a momentary style for this purpose.

Bradley

[skidd]

GTBradley.. once I get these 2 prototypes finished.... I'd love to sell you one!! Your car would be a fantastic example of a retrofit based install. So many of us use what you have, a simple toggle switch.
As for the other one.. who ever wants it.. fine with me. I thought about putting it into my car.. but my 1st gen prototype is still working just fine.
Hopefully I'll have these 2 done by next week some time. I also need to finish building my TestBench.. it's just a simple plug-and-play module with 4 standard automotive lights in it.. meant to mimic an install into a car.
I did manually test both of these modules, and they work fine... just need a more streamline way to test them if I ever end up making a whole bunch of these.

[RonS]

Skidd- I would really like to buy the second one. I’m setting mine up with momentary lit push buttons.

[skidd]

Just wondering... is there any interest in me designing and making versions of this module, that include a lever actuated signal arm? Like the one I built for my car? Which I really quite like personally.
https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?24625-DIY-SolidState-Arduino-Self-Canceling-Turn-Signals&p=294338&viewfull=1#post294338

I don't think it would be very hard for me to design something that would be easier to install than mine. Something that would obviously require a single through-hole mounting spot on the dash.
and because it already has a built in return sprint, I'd still use one of the many variations of .. lol.. toilet handles!!
finally.. a behind-the-dash switch mount that would mount/locate with the plastic threaded locking nut, and could be affixed with some simple double-sided tape to lock it in place.
Thoughts?

[skidd]

Prototype Design #2, prototypes 2a and 2b built tested (you can see my makeshift test bench behind them) and ready to go!

124109

[ydousurf]

This is really cool idea, skidd! I know I'm a pretty long way from this stage, but I would be interested in going this route on my build. I'm following along and will have to no doubt contact you in the future for one. However, you might want to investigate this as being possibly a patentable idea?! I know I'll definitely pay you the appropriate amount of buxs for one too! You'll have to come up with a clever name? I'm thinking... The SKIDD! Signal Killing Interruption Digital Device or something like that. Awesome work!

Dj

[skidd]

^ ha!!! Love it!!
Actually.. I've already come up with name.... a play on an old classes song.. "Hot Rod Blinkin'"
<-- such a dork!!

[skidd]

Another update.. Prototypes 2A and 2B are going out today.. i'm hopeful I'll get some good .. and positive feed back.
If they work as well as I expect/hope.. I'll be getting a round of professional PCBs made.
Then, I should be able to provide at least a handful more of these to any interested parties.

[Stallion351]

Another update.. Prototypes 2A and 2B are going out today.. i'm hopeful I'll get some good .. and positive feed back.
If they work as well as I expect/hope.. I'll be getting a round of professional PCBs made.
Then, I should be able to provide at least a handful more of these to any interested parties.


I am absolutely interested in one of these, please message me with info and I look forward to doing business with you sir.

[skidd]

D'Oh! My original design has been working so well for me, I frequently forget about this project. :)

I need to get off my butt and get the pcb finalized and have a small batch of professional ones made.
The one thing I have been trying to accomplish was having the relays be on-board. I was looking and looking for an off-the-shelf solution to doing a clean on-board mount of them.
I still hope to find something that will allow that, but, truthfully it's not a show-stopper having the relays be a separate wired-in module. It would just be so much cleaner if they were on board.
Let me get back at looking for an on-board solution and shore-up the PCB design... and get this ball rolling again.

[chmhasy]

check www.mouser.com you should be able to get a PCB mount relay from them

[skidd]

Friendly update... a batch of 10 production-ready modules arrived this week. :)
Installed one of them into my car yesterday, and so far it's working perfectly!
https://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/albums/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/PXL_20220720_004226251.NIGHT.jpg

[SSNK4US]

Omg it even has HotRodBlinkn’ on the board. I love it!!!!
So is that just the control unit to operate a couple of “sexy” relays or does that eliminate them?

Kurt

[Rdone585]

I can't believe I'm just now seeing this. I'm in. I've often thought about diving in and doing just what you've already accomplished. I think I know, but I'm curious how to wire it into my setup. Currently use LEDs, but all I have is a 3 position switch for left, off, right. I often leave them on for much longer than I should. If I change the 3 position switch to a momentary, does that get me part way there? If you can send me details maybe I can get one of these for my very own.

[skidd]

@ssnk4us: Originally I was using SolidState switching. I had a couple of high-current MOSFETs. It worked 100% flawlessly in my car. I had a few fellow members helping me work out some of the kinks with prototypes of their own, and found that it was a little too easy to "kill" the module by accident. Narrowed it down to the MOSFETs, and I'm sure a design flaw I never quite figured out. So, I converted it to a solid-state control box, that yes, runs a simple pair of automotive relays. Not quite as sexy, but should be infinity more reliable. Plus, you can actually just hear the good 'ol "Click click" sound.

https://www.ludicrous-speed.com/zp/albums/Shanes%20Cobra/SelfCancelingTurnSignal/PXL_20220720_032506390.NIGHT.jpg

@Rdone585: Yes, if you change your switch to an (on)-off-(on) momentary, you'll be most of the way there. I've designed this to be as easy to retrofit as possible. Today I was working on a decent "Installation Manual". It's not quite ready, but close.
After a good shake-down of this current module design, I'll see what I need to do to get the rest of them "For Sale". I absolutely want to make these easily available to F5 roadster builders like myself, but I don't want to break/bend any forum rules either.

[skidd]

A web-page I threw up with at least a bit of info about how this all works. Including a WorkInProgress installation manual.
https://www.ludicrous-speed.com/hotrod-blinkn/

[csmith]

I’d be interested in one of these.

[GTBradley]

Long time happy customer here! I have one of the prototypes and it has never let me down.

[JIMOCO]

I too am a prototype customer. Some of the early issues mentioned by Skidd happened with my unit and he quickly resolved the problem. Like GT Bradley, I am a long time customer and the unit has not let me down. I originally installed the Ron Francis wiring harness and the Russ Thompson self-canceling turn signal system. This worked great but over time the latching mechanism on the Russ Thompson unit wore out and began to fail. Russ was great to work with and replaced the unit. Since any mechanical device can wear and eventually fail, I was interested in an electronic unit. I purchased a prototype from Skidd and am happy I did. I continued to use the Ron Francis harness and modified the Russ Thompson switch by removing the latching mechanism and converting it to a momentary switch. My turn signals operate without fail and self cancel as expected. An added bonus is the Skidd unit provides a lane change feature that is very convenient. I am happy to have a nice steering column mounted switch supported by an electronic self canceling system. Best of both worlds.

[Jhinkemeyer]

So cool, definitely interested in either a whole unit or taking a stab at using what you created if you still decide to share the code!

I daydream about doing stuff like this, but somehow never find the time to learn or execute, so cool you've taken it this far!

[CobraKrazy]

Hi skidd.
I to would be interested in one units.

[steno]

VERY cool my friend!

[skidd]

Handed over the the 1st of this batch of 10 units today ! I have 9 more ready to go. :)

[cc2Arider]

Nice work! I like your initiative and enthusiasm :D

I just noticed this thread and wondered if you found out why your MOSFETs were failing?

My experience has been that you really need a diode to handle the back EMF from any inductive device. Theory from my University classes and practical experience from a poorly-sourced set of relays for one of my production-based motorcycles. Essentially, the magnetic field from a relay or a lamp has to dissipate after being energized, and this manifests itself as a back voltage that must be dissipated in the electrical circuit. The solution is to place a diode right at the inductive device's voltage terminals.

I suspect that your latest design works because the diode is located directly inside the typically-used automotive relays...

Craig

[cc2Arider]

Here's a rough sketch:

173253

Craig

P.S.: not sure why this got rotated 90 deg :rolleyes:

[flyingfarley]

Speedway motors makes a little module that is self cancelling. I have used on many cars I have built. Just needs a momentary on -off-on toggle switch and is relatively easy to use.
Part number is 910-64070. Last one I bought was 105.00. Very small self contained module with wires coming out of it.

[skidd]

@cc2Arider
I never did figure out the issue with the mosfets. They worked 100% flawlessly in my car, yet died daily in one of the 2 initial alpha testers cars. I'll have to dig up my original PCB design, but you know, I actually don't think I did include a flyback diode in the original design. I'd say that is a pretty good guess. I know that lights do have a small back EMF, but perhaps I underestimated it. I really did want to stay with 100% solid-state. But, one thing that I noticed that made me realize that a small relay-block is still a smart move... my modern truck still uses relays. The turn signal in my truck is semi-solid state, but still uses relays to drive the bulbs. I figured if relays are still good enough for OEMs, why not trust the reliability of them for this project. I still might actually investigate another "test" run of MOSFET only powered modules, and see if anybody wants to do a "swap-out" with their relay based modules as an experiment. But.. we'll see how this all plays out first. And yes.. you're correct, the relays I used do indeed include their own flyback diode.

@flyingfarley. Yeah.. I've seen those modules too. Pretty simple, and pretty clean. They are timer based though. I know they tie into the brake-pedal to handle stop-lights and what not. But I was adamant that I wanted a true self-canceling system of some type for my car.

[Wcj]

Handed over the the 1st of this batch of 10 units today ! I have 9 more ready to go. :)

Do you still have any units left?

[skidd]

You bet!

[Wcj]

You bet!

Msged

[Joey A]

Hi Skidd, I've been looking at this tread for quite sometime. I'm getting to the point where I forget to turn my signals off. Do you still have any units to sell?

[skidd]

Yep.. PM inbound.

[cdurbin328]

Skidd,
Interested in a unit as well.
Thanks!

[Wizbangdoodle]

Skidd, were you still planning on making this information open source? Or are you into production of your system? Either way, I'm interested in one.

[skidd]

Honestly... I still haven't quite decided on that one. Not exactly a complex system I've built to be honest. The software itself it pretty simple. There is still a chance of open sourceing it one day. Just.. not sure totally sure on it yet.
I still have 2 of the original batch of 10 ready to go.