Seating and Pedal Position - Is there any engine/tran config where this ISN'T offset?

[linenoise]

I swear I spent the last hour trying to search for an answer. This must be a common question, so please forgive me in advance .. I just couldn't find the answer.

I've always wanted to build a Cobra kit car but, until recently, I had never had the opportunity to sit in one. A local exotics dealership got a Backdraft Racing Cobra in on trade, so I went to check it out. I was shocked when I sat down to see how "not square" the seating position was -- all the pedals were crammed into a tiny space that was offset to the left from the steering line center. I couldn't imagine driving in such a contorted position and I had to end the test drive early as my size 12 feet were unable to safely control the pedals.

Questions: For the FFR Kit: Is there an engine/transmission combo that allows the pedals to sit squarely in front of you and not offset to the left? Is it offset by default in the MK4 kit?

Thanks in advance.

[carlewms]

I can relate my own experience ... with a Mk 4

I have a 10.5 shoe size. If you stick to a SBF you can expand the foot box to give you more room. The DS or clutch side in the current Mk4 is expanded and, if using a SBF, you can also expand the accelerator pedal side as well.

[Ray]

There is also a way to bend the pedal arms to gain some additional space between the pedals.

We have a builder that is affectionately known as "Wookie." He's built and driven a few Roadsters. Try reaching out to David Hodgkins and see if he's done anything special to his builds.

Ray

[GoDadGo]

My combo would have easily accommodated a pedal move, but it wasn't an issue for me since I'm only 5'10" with a size 9.5 shoe. The problem is I doubt if you'd want to join the dark side and wack the mounts to install a SBC.

I'd suggest contacting David Hodgkins because he knows how to fit big dudes with big feet in these things.

If you want to come over to the Dark Side, then check out the engine location of Randy Jones' MK-3 at:

www.gpsconnection.com

I used Randy's mount location as my starting point. Here is what things look like if you use his measurements over in the land occupied by The 383 Vader Crew!

https://youtu.be/_wnHDNgnNqs

[phileas_fogg]

I've never noticed the pedals being off center from the steering wheel. What I've always noticed is the seats always pointing outboard towards the headlight. If you're short (like me) and get the low back seats, I "think" you can get the seats to point straight ahead. Anything else and I think you're going to sit a little (or a lot) crab-wise.


John

[David Hodgkins]

Once you are in and driving you will NEVER think about it.

The trans tunnel dictates the "offset" seating position. There are no engine/trans combos to negate the effect. It is after all a very small car with a narrow cockpit stretched around a V8 motor.

Again, I never think about it now that my build is done.

:)

[CDXXVII]

Number 1 thing to start with.

Do not put on your pair of tennis shoes, wide toed dress shoes, or other multi purpose shoes that are designed with a wide platform for better support. I don't care what size shoes you wear, if you drive one of these cars with the wrong shoes you will not be happy.

No need to go out and buy fancy $200 italian racing loafers but a good pair of simple walking shoes similar to Vans or Adidas sneakers will make a world of difference.

I wear a size 11 shoe and I can not drive my roadster with my gym shoes but I have no issues with my Vans sneakers.

With regards to the drive "angle". The Mk4 requires a little angle in the seat placement to get the steering wheel, seats and pedals along the same line. I thought it would bother me but from the first time I drove it I never noticed it. Perhaps it's a bit more pronounces in the Backdraft but it's a non issue in my Mk4.

These will not work:

66068

[scottiec]

For me it's part of the fun. That's how these cars were.

[Dave Howard]

If I'm driving with shorts and sandals, my right sandal typically comes off and I have ultimate pedal feel.

[CraigS]

Once you are in and driving you will NEVER think about it.

The trans tunnel dictates the "offset" seating position. There are no engine/trans combos to negate the effect. It is after all a very small car with a narrow cockpit stretched around a V8 motor.

Again, I never think about it now that my build is done.

:)

This is true. The 302/347 is the smallest engine package in regular use. Using shorty headers and a j-pipe can get you a little more foot room if you mod the aluminum a little but kills hp. The MkIV steering column is positioned further to the left than the older models so it will clear a Coyote engine so that could be modded some to move it closer to the center of the car.

[myjones]

Once you are in and driving you will NEVER think about it.
The trans tunnel dictates the "offset" seating position. There are no engine/trans combos to negate the effect. It is after all a very small car with a narrow cockpit stretched around a V8 motor. Again, I never think about it now that my build is done. :)

David
Remember the 33 FF that Glenn Sommers built with the Corvette donor?
The real issue is the bellhousing vs pedal clearance so Glenn used the entire vette drivetrain and shortened the torque tube. When the torque convertor is
mounted to the transaxle instead of the engine you get a lot more pedal space. That did put a bump and a lot of heat right by the drivers elbow though so
there really is no free lunch. BUT "once you are in and driving you will NEVER think about it" < as some wizened old dude says :D
Dale

[Gumball]

I agree with two points -

1) The seating position is limited by the shape of the trans tunnel and the steering wheel location, meaning that you can tweak the angle of the seat a little bit, bend the pedals some, and expand the footbox, but overall you will have little room for adjustment.

2) The right shoes make all the difference. I use a pair of inexpensive driving mocs in the car - just soft leather with the rubber button-type sole - and they are great. No way can I drive my car in my favorite off-road hiking gym shoes.

[johnnybgoode]

If I'm driving with shorts and sandals, my right sandal typically comes off and I have ultimate pedal feel.

2X. I like to drive in bare feet. Although my wife bought me some $5 water shoes from Walmart that are the next best thing. Scott

[slaga]

I wear regular old New Balance or Saucony running shoes, size 11, all the time and have no issue with the pedals. The foot box in my car is unaltered and I have the high back Kirkey seats. I guess I just got used to the offset but it has never bothered me in the least.

[linenoise]

Thanks to everybody for your comments. I'm beginning to think that the backdraft racing cobra that I test drove was a more extreme offset example than the factory five or era setup. I'm going to head down to the local Cars and Coffee auto show this weekend and see if anyone brings a FFR cobra with a SBF that I can try to sit in.

[BEAR-AvHistory]

I also ground the edges of the brake & clutch pedal a bit. With the COYOTE footbox mod had enough room to also mount a dead pedal without catching my shoes on them.

Right now I have on lace up loafers. Also have a pair of Sparco race shoes. Work/hiking boots or running shoes will catch on the pedals. My seat offset is pretty slight. Seats are installed after the body is on & you can place the front right close to the tunnel & the rear outside as close to the door latch as you can without interfering wilt the latch.

The size of the seats you use will determine how mush offset you need.

[GoDadGo]

Sperry Top Siders Fit Well Too!

[AC Bill]

I also need to wear narrower shoes, or risk catching two pedals at once. At 6' 2", my biggest issue is that I cannot hold either of my legs straight. The left leg I can stretch a bit more, as I can reach past the clutch pedal.
The right leg, and my right foot are angled opposite one another. My knee rests on the tranny tunnel, and lower leg angles down to the left, with my heel resting just below the brake pedal. My foot is then angled over to the right, so the tip of my shoe can reach the of throttle pedal.

At the start of the driving season my leg gets stiff, and crampy after an hour or so, but after a few cruises, it isn't as bad any longer.

[slaga]

I wear regular old New Balance or Saucony running shoes, size 11, all the time and have no issue with the pedals. The foot box in my car is unaltered and I have the high back Kirkey seats. I guess I just got used to the offset but it has never bothered me in the least.

That said, I do not have a dead pedal, which could be why I do not have as much trouble with my size 11's as others. I kind of rest my left foot on the back of my right heel while cruising.

[edwardb]

Can't add too much to what's already been said, but a couple points of reinforcement. I don't have huge feet (10-1/2 D) but "regular" shoes can be too wide and make it easy to get tangled up in the pedals, hit more than one thing at a time, etc. I found some running shoes (forget the brand) that are relatively narrow and still comfortable. Always wear them for driving and all is OK. Whatever offsets you may notice in a Factory Five are minor IMO and you get used to very quickly. It's just not something you notice. As stated, during the build and with whatever seats chosen you can place them within the constraints of the tunnel and body to what works best for you.

Finally, you mentioned "finding someone with a SBF Factory Five" and checking it out. Unless it's a very recent build, I wouldn't put too much stock in that. There was a time when there were slight differences in the footboxes depending on what engine was installed. But that's no longer the case. All kits are now sold with the same footbox sheet metal that is pretty much maximized and takes all engine types. There is even a bump-out on the outside (LH side of the driver's footbox) with newer kits that provide a little additional space. There are also variations in footboxes and also how/where the pedals are installed. So be careful about drawing conclusions about anything without knowing exactly what you're looking at.

[Bobby Doug]

I drove mine wearing Merrill sz 10 1/2 hiking boots on a cold morning. No issues, but did not try any spirited driving either. I do have the Wilwood pedal pads adjusted to the left for the clutch and in the middle for the brake. My seat is set back as far as it can go and slightly angled. I don't even notice it anymore.

[CraigS]

Sperry Top Siders Fit Well Too! And they are easy to trim the sole on the left side of your right foot. Get the style w/ the 1/4 inch rubber sole sewn to the shoe then remove some of the over hang.
http://www.sperry.com/en/authentic-original-waterloo-boat-shoe/646881375112.html?cid=SEM-G_Shopping_Authentic%20Original%20Waterloo%20Boat% 20Shoe&kpid=25418M-646881375112&gclid=CKDcgOaektMCFVSHswod7IcHXg
There are quite a few color combinations available.