John's EZ36R H6 818R Build

[Hobby Racer]

Well I left my tuning computer in the garage and apparently Sub zero temps and I assume condensation destroyed the cooling fan so it shuts down after about 20secs of operation. But I had a brief thought of adjusting your trigger offset in tuner studio by 360 degrees instead of rewiring the coils.

I tried that, didn't work. The firmware only allows a +- 20 degree change for that decoder :mad:

[alpine227]

Geesh haltech gives you 720 degrees of offset if I recall. I bumped your thread on the Ms forums worth keeping it towards the top the more it pops up the more likely it is to get addressed. Especially if someone can test and send logs with a working setup.

[Hobby Racer]

Thanks alpine227!

If anyone following this thread would like to help, please go over to the MS forum and chime in your interest in this motor combination running on MS3. The more interest the more responsive the developers might be.

http://www.msextra.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=131&t=67870

[alpine227]

https://i.imgur.com/eUJ4KmC.jpg
Here is my crank wheel position with #1 tdc. Right side front piston. (Well rod tdc as the piston aren't installed) I shared over on your MS thread as well. Not sure it that's the same position as yours or not.

[Hobby Racer]

Thanks for the pic! I need to compare that to the code.

[Hobby Racer]

Can you check that the timing mark on the front pulley is lined up with the 0 degree timing mark also? Your pic seems to be off one tooth from what the MS code expects.

[alpine227]

My timing covers are off getting painted basically a bear block at the moment, it could move a few degrees either way as it's a bit hard to tell with no piston on the rod if it's at full tdc or not.

[Hobby Racer]

My timing covers are off getting painted basically a bear block at the moment, it could move a few degrees either way as it's a bit hard to tell with no piston on the rod if it's at full tdc or not.

Got it, that may be the difference I'm seeing. When you can get a more accurate TDC, can you take another pic of the crank plate. I think it will help me convince the development team there really is a difference they need to account for ;).

[alpine227]

Sure I can pop a piston in tomorrow late afternoon and snap a picture for you.

[Hobby Racer]

After all the screwing around I finally feel vindicated!

The phase is off 360 degrees as I first thought.

I went into the source code for an older version of MegaSquirt (1.4.0) as it is the latest source available and flipped the phase in the wheel decoder. After a quick re-compile I flashed it to the ECU and reloaded my tune. The motor fired right up with full sequential fueling and and COP ignition! purred like kitten :)

Now I need to get the developers to put in the phase flip code which already exists in other wheel decoders into this one.

[alpine227]

Really deep dive down the rabbit hole! It's a mystery why Subaru had so many changes in wheel trigger patterns and offsets. I ran into a similar problem with my jdm ej205 with avcs the cam angle sensors were 4 tooth wheels where the us and euro are 4-1 wheels. No support for my wheels

[Hobby Racer]

Really deep dive down the rabbit hole! It's a mystery why Subaru had so many changes in wheel trigger patterns and offsets. I ran into a similar problem with my jdm ej205 with avcs the cam angle sensors were 4 tooth wheels where the us and euro are 4-1 wheels. No support for my wheels

Turns out your suggestion on the MS forum of allowing the trigger angle to be 360 degrees or greater would have fixed it! It will most likely be the way they deal with the issue as that code is already in the decoder, they just need to turn it on for the 36-2-2-2 wheels :rolleyes:

[flynntuna]

Great to hear, a major milestone checked off the list. Congrats

[alpine227]

Between the motor swap, ECU, brakes, front fender gaps and oil cooling system you are blazing some new paths for sure.

[Hobby Racer]

Between the motor swap, ECU, brakes, front fender gaps and oil cooling system you are blazing some new paths for sure.

Thanks! I'm only doing what a lot of people do with FFR kits, make them their own :cool:

I hope I can help make other's journey a bit smoother.

[Mitch Wright]

Great news, congratulations.

[Hobby Racer]

I decided I wanted to join the two rear deck lids to have a single rear deck panel. After thinking about the best way to join the two panels I finally decided the easiest and most structurally sound method would be to completely cut off the shelf section from the humps. Then sand the back side smooth so there is no lip left over.

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=78271&d=1514500320

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=78272&d=1514500326

Moving on to the rear deck lid I cut and sanded the mating edge so there was no lip left either. Now the two panels will butt up to each other and be the same thickness. This will make it easier to layup 6 or maybe 8 layers of fiberglass cloth and mat to give strength to the newly formed panel.

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=78273&d=1514500332

After I glass up the back side I can flip it over and fill any crevice left with resin and gel-coat before final sanding in preparation for paint.

[Hobby Racer]

On the R models there are these small flappy winglets on the rear humps that are left over when FFR cuts out for the roll bar. They a quite fragile and make it really difficult to get the hump section on and off the car. So I cut them off!

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=78269&d=1514500309

I made the cut at the location where the TMIC vents are. I plan to glass them in permanently to the side panels.

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=78270&d=1514500314

[Rob T]

Interesting idea on the winglets. On my R, there is a push-lock retainer on the front to hold them down. One of them cracked from working them over the roll bar, so I added some more fiberglass underneath to strengthen the stress point. Works for now. Easier to remove with two people.

[Hobby Racer]

Easier to remove with two people.

Yes, I wanted to be able to easily remove the rear deck lid by myself. The winglets made it difficult to do that.

[Mitch Wright]

Did some thing similar. Thought about riveting to the quarter fender but decided I want to be able to remove it if I needed the space to work on something.
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I don't have a problem removing it by myself.

[Zach34]

You're inspiring me to do the same on my R. My roll cage modification project has spilled over into a body-test-fit project. Very interested to see more detail on the fiberglass work. Thanks for the pictures!!

[Hobby Racer]

Did some thing similar. Thought about riveting to the quarter fender but decided I want to be able to remove it if I needed the space to work on something.
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Mitch, I see what looks like 10-32 button head screws holding the winglet in place. I assume you fabricated some brackets, but where did you mount those too? Any pics?


You're inspiring me to do the same on my R. My roll cage modification project has spilled over into a body-test-fit project. Very interested to see more detail on the fiberglass work. Thanks for the pictures!!

Thanks Zach, I'm very impressed with your door frame mods. You got skills :cool:
I'll try to keep posting pics of the body mods as they happen. There are many more left to do!

[Hobby Racer]

To prepare for laying fiberglass I first taped off the top side with Gorilla Tape to give me a backing in the gap between the panels. Then I secured 6 strips between the two sections to ensure the top surfaces would be aligned correctly. I cut the strips out of the pieces of fiberglass body removed when cutting out the vents in the hood. Good use of scrap material!

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=78496&d=1514852145


After flipping the two panels over, I sanded about 5 inches around the gap to be fiber-glassed. The round black object you see on the right hump is a solid piece of steel I'm using to weigh that side down as the panel is a bit warped. I hope to lay the first round of cloth and mat tomorrow.

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=78495&d=1514852139

[Mitch Wright]

John, The front aluminum bracket is riveted to the door the one by the main hoop is bolted to the hoop. Sorry no pictures. I might be able to get a picture of the rear mount but it will be a week, head out west to do some skiing.

[RetroRacing]

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This is what we did, but it does take two people to remove and install, with the wing on.
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[Hobby Racer]

I previously cut the side vents to make them deeper in hopes of getting more air flow. Now I need to fiberglass up the gap to make the panels look like they were designed that way. I added 1.5 inches depth to each vent, measured approximately half way up the vent. But to get the top to look right I had to cut out the entire top self. This meant I need to create a flat surface I could layup fiberglass against until it cured. I ended up cutting out some wood shapes and clamped / taped them in place while I laid the glass. It made a nice smooth flat surface to work on.


http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=78869&d=1515450169

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=78868&d=1515450164


The bottom was easier since the gap was smaller and the surfaces to be joined were flat. I just used duct tape between the gap laid the glass against that :p Here is the side panel after removing the wood mold and duct tape.

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=78871&d=1515450179

After it cures in a few days I can cut out the middle vent section and bondo any rough spots to make the transitions smooth.

[Hobby Racer]

Earlier I cut openings in the front of the side pods to allow some high pressure air from the front wheel wells to escape thru the hollow side pods and exit into the engine bay. Hopefully adding some cooling back there.

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=76151&d=1509399621


To keep large debris and pieces of rubber from entering, I added some stainless steel mesh I had from a previous project. I secured the mesh with clear silicone. Here its held in place with wire and some welding rod while the silicone cures.

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=78870&d=1515450174

[Scargo]

Nice! Interesting. I refer you to my post (http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?12395-818R-quot-Glynman-Style-quot&p=190165&viewfull=1#post190165) about my bodywork and lightening.

[Zach34]

Nice job on the wood forms.

[Hobby Racer]

Finished the rear wing support today. It will also double as support for the rear fiberglass section.

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=79423&d=1516235525

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=79424&d=1516235531

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=79422&d=1516235519

[Hobby Racer]

Here is a peek of the top exit exhaust with the rear deck laid in place. I have Mechie's "Hump Vents" to cover them.

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=79421&d=1516235512

[Mitch Wright]

Ok your exhaust looks pretty cool.

[AZPete]

Smart design and nice work.

[flynntuna]

looks great! one year in and making great progress.

[lsfourwheeler]

Do you think exhaust fumes in the cabin will be an issue? Looks awesome though. More 918 than 818

[Hobby Racer]

Do you think exhaust fumes in the cabin will be an issue? Looks awesome though. More 918 than 818

Should not be a problem, been through that here. (http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?23199-John-s-EZ36R-H6-818R-Build&p=289414&viewfull=1#post289414)

And yes, the 918 was part of the inspiration!

[longislandwrx]

looks impressive... maybe I can stop by sometime and eat off your floor ;)

cant wait to hear you rev this lady up.

[UnhipPopano]

"cant wait to hear you rev this lady up."

With the exhaust tips right behind your head, you better be wearing so serious noise protection.

[Hobby Racer]

looks impressive... maybe I can stop by sometime and eat off your floor ;)

My brother in-law does say I spend as much time cleaning up the garage as I do working on the car :confused:

[longislandwrx]

are you going to modify the vents?

that exhaust blasting on the fins is going to turn the whole thing into a heat sink and roast that fiberglass.

on the Porsche the whole assembly is inconel or titanium iirc... its also triple walled and has a cooling duct... how are you going to control heat?

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[Hobby Racer]

are you going to modify the vents?

that exhaust blasting on the fins is going to turn the whole thing into a heat sink and roast that fiberglass.

on the Porsche the whole assembly is inconel or titanium iirc... its also triple walled and has a cooling duct... how are you going to control heat?


Well I'm not sure yet. But the Porsche exhaust is quite a bit shorter and the that engine is boosted, putting out way more power/heat than my naturally aspirated EZ36. My pipes should be much cooler at the exit.

If it cooks the fiberglass, I guess I will poke the exhaust pipe out the top about an inch to push the exhaust out past the fins and fiberglass. I'm hoping to not have to do that as it kind of ruins the look I'm going for :cool:

[flynntuna]

So this isn't the look you had in mind?:confused:

[turbomacncheese]

Why am I not surprised to see a Florida plate on that thing (the semi-piped mustang)....

[redbudrr]

Very impressive!!

[Hobby Racer]

I've been thinking about what longislandwrx said about the exhaust heating up the aluminum fins and he has a point. The top 2 fins are right on top of the exhaust exit and will get hot. So what to do about it...

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=80029&d=1517265661

First idea is to remove the top 2 fins and either leave the hole which would allow the exhaust to escape and not heat the aluminum or fiberglass. I could also cover the hole with some stainless steel mesh for looks and to keep large debris out. Here is a mock up of what it might look like.

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=80030&d=1517265665

Second is to leave the vents alone and route the exhaust out the sides of the humps. Take a look at the two black circles outlined in green for a visual of where the exhaust might exit. I could route the exhaust into the center of the humps OR direct them out towards the sides of the car. I would then trim the holes out with some stainless trim rings.

Which way would you go and why?

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=80031&d=1517265672

[lsfourwheeler]

I would think going out to the side would give you the benefit of not encouraging things to fall down the exhaust. Even if you did add mesh, small things may fall down there and in that case how do you remove them? For aesthetics, I think going out to the sides of the hump facing the outside of the car would better than the inside face and it leaves the design of the nice hump vents intact.

[Zach34]

I like the idea of going out the vent, but have a heat shield around the exiting pipe - totally imitating the Porche. I think you'll need a heat shield to keep from burning the surrounding fiberglass and also to make sure the exhaust doesn't collect in the engine compartment, making everything hotter and sooty in there. Maybe not the intricate custom formed sheet metal on the Porche, but something more rudimentary.

By the way, what products did you use to bond the engine cover together? Looks like a gray filler under the fiberbglass cloth? Did you use epoxy or polyester resin? How's the strength/flexibility. I'm going to try to do mine this weekend.

[VicariousJ]

First,this build is amazing and so much fun to watch! Innovative ideas and excellent execution...

Concerning the heat-soak/vents issue...would ceramic coating not work like on the pipes themselves? Another idea that could help save the fiberglass could be a phenolic spacer between the aluminum and 'glass hump. Extension of this idea (kind of extreme), phenolic wafers covering the underside of the top two fins.

Just a couple random thoughts...

Otherwise, my vote would be exit the humps facing centerline...keep the hidden exhaust idea alive. Plus soot trails on the body are less visible.

Whatever you come up with, I look forward to seeing your results. Good luck

[STiPWRD]

Which ever path you take, I would highly discourage obstructing the exhaust with anything (i.e. fins, mesh, etc.). I know you're going for a clean look but anything you place in front of the exhaust gases is going to get very, very hot (especially on a race car) and potentially divert some of the gases into the engine bay. Personally, I would get rid of the fins but retain the openings in the humps then fab up some nice stainless shrouds. It would be a good chance to show off some custom sheet metal work and provide a heat shield over the fiberglass at the same time. Like others have said, it would mimic the 918 but still be unique.

[Hobby Racer]

By the way, what products did you use to bond the engine cover together? Looks like a gray filler under the fiberbglass cloth? Did you use epoxy or polyester resin? How's the strength/flexibility. I'm going to try to do mine this weekend.

I used vinylester resin with alternating fiberglass cloth and mat for total of 6 layers on the back and 2 layers on top. Vinylester is better for heat and chemical resistance than polyester and more flexible than epoxy. The strength / flexibility is excellent, I can lift the deck from the front or rear and cantilever the rest out without stressing the glass.


First,this build is amazing and so much fun to watch! Innovative ideas and excellent execution...

Thank you, its nice to hear. I hope some of my ideas are helpful to others looking to solve some of the same issues.


Personally, I would get rid of the fins but retain the openings in the humps then fab up some nice stainless shrouds. It would be a good chance to show off some custom sheet metal work and provide a heat shield over the fiberglass at the same time. Like others have said, it would mimic the 918 but still be unique.

I think I'm going to try a hybrid. I will remove to the top 2 or 3 fins and come up with some stainless shrouding to bridge the gap between the exhaust and the hump holes. But I will keep the rest of the fins to vent ambient heat out of the engine bay.

Thanks for the input everyone!

[Hobby Racer]

Getting ready for the next big stage in the build, paint! I am lucky enough to have a heated garage large enough to construct a spray booth inside. I have ~ $100 invested in lumber, plastic sheeting, hardware etc.

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=80185&d=1517446188

The door will contain 4 furnace filters to filter incoming air. The window will have 2 filters before 2 box fans to exhaust air out.

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=80186&d=1517446198

[ben1272]

You going to drive the car through the door sideways? :O

Nice paintroom. I assume a wall will come down, or you plan to paint the panels off the car. I always heard that panels should be on or mostly in-place on the car to reduce variations due to spray paint angle of application and metallic particle distribution, etc.

What's your plan stan?

[Hobby Racer]

You going to drive the car through the door sideways? :O

Nice paintroom. I assume a wall will come down, or you plan to paint the panels off the car. I always heard that panels should be on or mostly in-place on the car to reduce variations due to spray paint angle of application and metallic particle distribution, etc.

What's your plan stan?

Panels are coming off the car. I've panel painted 3 cars this way, including my Cobra, and I find it much easier to get at all the the bits when they are off the car. As long as you watch your gun to panel distance, angle, and travel speed, the metallics come out beautiful. The important thing is to paint them in the right orientation. I.E. paint the hood laying flat and not hanging vertical. That way the metallic particles flow out properly.

Since the paint booth is temporary, I wanted to build it as inexpensively as possible and yet meet my needs. Here is a picture of the box fan / filter setup in the window. I will use plastic to seal off the filters to the wall section so my nice white windows don't turn orange!

Hopefully I will be painting later this month. I am still waiting for my rear wing to come so I can mount it and cut the holes in the rear deck.

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[Wayne Presley]

What rear wing are you using?

[Hobby Racer]

What rear wing are you using?

I went with the 67" APR GT-250 single element wing. I felt the GT-1000 was a bit overkill :)

[Sgt.Gator]

DIY at it's best!

[RetroRacing]

I wish I had pics of the 4 different paint booths we built

One, the finished garage of a buddy of mine, taped poly to the ceiling and installed a scroll fan on the floor. ceiling is still Mazda Laguna blue.
second, in his warehouse. Hung tarps from the trusses by standing on the last forklift stage, rigged with pulleys to the ground so we could raise and lower them. Taped cardboard to the floor. Had to wet sand a ton of dust out of the paint....
Third, built a 24x24 scaffold structure in my warehouse. Used a 48" fan, with 8-10" round ducts and filters "down draft" the booth. Used astroturf on the floor, baaaaad idea!
Fourth, bought a big out door tent and erected it in the new warehouse, with cardboard on the floor, two scroll fans in a sealed box with filters. Best one yet, very little color sanding required.

And that is why we vinyl everything now!

[Canadian818]

Old trick is to wet the floors just before painting, or run a hose if there’s good drainage. All the dust and overspray lands in the water and doesn’t get stirred up.

[Larry J W]

Be careful with the wet floors because the 2 stage paint is moisture cure and it really affects the flow and cure. In general the relative humidity should be less than 50%. With wet floors I had a lot of orange peel. Also the over spray sticks to the plastic and just opening or closing a door shacks it loose. Turning on the fan does too. Unfortunately I am an expert of what not to do!
Larry

[Hobby Racer]

Old trick is to wet the floors just before painting, or run a hose if there’s good drainage. All the dust and overspray lands in the water and doesn’t get stirred up.

I tried that once, didn't like the results. The paint and wet floor made a nasty slurry on the floor and made a mess of everything! I like using construction paper on the floor. You get it in 36" rolls at Home Depot in the paint department. Its absorbant and your just fold it up and recycle it when your done and your floors don't get messed up.


Be careful with the wet floors because the 2 stage paint is moisture cure and it really affects the flow and cure. In general the relative humidity should be less than 50%. With wet floors I had a lot of orange peel. Also the over spray sticks to the plastic and just opening or closing a door shacks it loose. Turning on the fan does too. Unfortunately I am an expert of what not to do!
Larry

The humidity issue is also why I like painting in the winter, very low humidity and no bugs to land in the paint! I know what your saying about the over-spray on plastic! It just flakes off and floats into your paint :mad: I try you use paper to mask off anything on the body to avoid that as much as possible.

[RetroRacing]

We did the wet floor thing, not good with base-clear, had to sand out the orange peel. Used the paper on the floor for some body parts we did for our ep cars, and yes, better than cardboard

[Wayne Presley]

My painter uses this stuff
http://like90.net/floor-coatings/pig-grippy-for-like90-particle-control/

[Hobby Racer]

My painter uses this stuff
http://like90.net/floor-coatings/pig-grippy-for-like90-particle-control/

Wow, that looks like a much better solution. Thanks Wayne!

[Hobby Racer]

While I'm waiting for the wing to arrive I sealed off the radiator so all air coming in the grill is forced thru the radiator core.

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=80533&d=1517960307

Started by forming up the bottom then the sides and then the top last.
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Here is a pic through the front grill.
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This shot is from the underside looking toward the front of the car. I reshaped the FFR aluminum piece so that if I need additional cooling I can open up the laser cut vents to get more air from the underside.
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And finally the top. This piece is not riveted, but fastened instead using #10-32 button head bolts so it can easily be removed to get at the radiator.
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[Hobby Racer]

I attached the rear diffuser and pushed it out 4" from the rear bumper
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Next I'll make some panels to seal off the rest of the underside in back.

[flynntuna]

I see you're using an after market radiator. How did you attach it to the frame?

[phil1734]

Holy cow I never realized how comically small the diffuser is. I guess I'll scratch that off the wish-list.

Can I ask how you arrived at leaving it out 4"? With a full race wing it seems like you'd be wanting to move your pressure center as far forward as possible. (Rules permitting of course ;))

Also love the exhaust but don't forget a provision to keep water out when it rains!

[Hobby Racer]

I see you're using an after market radiator. How did you attach it to the frame?

I knew from the start I was going to skip the OEM radiator and go for something better. I found this Griffin double row, dual pass aluminum radiator (http://www.griffinrad.com/load_details10.php?PartID=119&key_id=1-28241-X&year=All&make=Chevy,%20Dodge&model=Racer) fit perfectly. Since I was also using a water to oil engine oil cooler, I needed the extra cooling capacity. Anyway, I mounted it using simple bent strips of metal welded to the lower radiator support and a 3/4" square tube to span between the left and right sides . My radiator sits nearly vertical as opposed to laying at a steep angle to promote better flow through the core. The top is held by a bent piece of aluminum sheet that is secured to the top radiator support.

Here is a close up of the left side and two of the right side.
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[Hobby Racer]

Holy cow I never realized how comically small the diffuser is. I guess I'll scratch that off the wish-list.

Tell me about it. I got it because it was only $100 in the FFR attic sale at the time (scratch and dent).



Can I ask how you arrived at leaving it out 4"? With a full race wing it seems like you'd be wanting to move your pressure center as far forward as possible. (Rules permitting of course ;))

I pushed it out the max I could and still have it close to the lower bodywork when clearing the lower bumper. Nothing scientific I'm afraid! And yes I will be moving the center of pressure just forward of the rear wheels by adding additional under body trays that meet up with the CF diffusor. I'm still making those, but I'll post pics of the completed under-tray when they are done.




Also love the exhaust but don't forget a provision to keep water out when it rains!

Other than a car cover I have not thought about the rain issue. Although I never leave the car outside, and if its raining I'm not driving ;)

[Mitch Wright]

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Mine is also moved out 4 inches, I found that it started to fit goofy any more than that.

[Hobby Racer]

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Mine is also moved out 4 inches, I found that it started to fit goofy any more than that.

Goofy, yah, that's the technical term I was looking for! Since I got my diffusor in the scratch and dent it did not come with strakes. Were there any placement instructions with yours? And roughly how long and deep are they?

[Mitch Wright]

No instructions that I saw on strake placement but to be fair I didn't go to the manual much. I just measured equal distance from center. I will take some measurements off the strakes tonight and post what I find.

[Mitch Wright]

The FFR strakes are 20” long
12.5 from flush to 2.75”
Will up load photos when I get in the house and have a WiFi connection.
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[Hobby Racer]

I was always planning to put in a transaxle cooler to help preserve the Subaru 5MT. So here is my version.

First I removed the temperature sensor (https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?23199-John-s-EZ36R-H6-818R-Build&p=294114&viewfull=1#post294114) that I fitted into the transaxle drain plug and replaced it with a tee fitting. That allowed me to reinstall the temperature sensor and have an outlet for the oil that goes to the inline screen filter. From the filter we go to the oil pump. I welded on a couple small tabs so I could easily mount the pump to the chassis. I used a cheap oil/fuel scavenge pump I found on ebay. The pump pushes the oil up and through an oil cooler I had laying around from a previous car I had built. Finally the oil is returned to the rear of the transaxle through the block off plate supplied by FFR. Doing it this way I did not have to modify the transaxle fill tube to return the oil and I still get to use the dipstick. ;)

The pump will be controlled by the Megasquirt ECU. It will turn on at 180oF and turns off once the temperature drops to 175oF. I plan to direct air from one of the side scoops to the bottom of the cooler.

All in all it was a very simple fabrication that I hope will pay dividends in the form of a longer lasting 5MT.

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[Hobby Racer]

The FFR diffusor stops way short of were it needs to so you have to fabricate your own under tray panels to fill the gaps for a smooth flat undertray.

I wanted to be able to access the section under the engine quickly and easily for general maintenance, oil changes etc. So instead of bolting the panel in place, I used some quarter turn dzus fasteners and a slot. If you look at the 3rd picture you will see 2 pieces of aluminum angle iron riveted to the frame with a small gap that forms a 0.040" slot. The under tray slides smugly into that slot and is held firmly across the entire section without any fasteners. In the 4th picture you can see the quarter turn fasteners welded to the opposite side of the chassis. 5 quarter turn fasteners is all that you need to undo to get full access to the underside of the engine for maintenance. :)


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[Wayne Presley]

Really, really nice!

[turbomacncheese]

With that temp sensor sticking out from the transmission, how hot do you think the transmission will get before the sensor sees 185? And I just might copy that under-tray! Beautiful!

[aquillen]

agreed - mind if I copy that?
Regarding the trans cooler - send details on that pump please if you can. And have you measured amp draw on the pump running? I'm using a smaller (Geo Prism) alternator and although I'm interested in a trans cooler, I also have to watch my power distribution closely.
Thanks for sharing !

[Hobby Racer]

With that temp sensor sticking out from the transmission, how hot do you think the transmission will get before the sensor sees 185? And I just might copy that under-tray! Beautiful!

The temp sensor should be very accurate. The probe extends far inside the tee, just under the trans drain hole so it will be in contact with the main case's fluid.


agreed - mind if I copy that?
Regarding the trans cooler - send details on that pump please if you can. And have you measured amp draw on the pump running? I'm using a smaller (Geo Prism) alternator and although I'm interested in a trans cooler, I also have to watch my power distribution closely.
Thanks for sharing !

The pump can be found on ebay by searching for "oil scavenge pump", here is an example (https://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Heavy-Duty-Rear-Mount-Oil-Gear-Pump-12v-3-7GPM-Scavenge-Replace-STS-US-STOCK/231357370990?hash=item35ddf9526e:g:UcQAAOSwDEtaCVG l&vxp=mtr). I have not measured the current draw, but it lists 5.0 amps on the label.

As far as the undertray, copy away! If I can help with any other details let me know.

[Mitch Wright]

I like it

[Hobby Racer]

Update on the trans cooler. The pump actually flows TOO much. Who would have thought the cheap Chinese pump would perform too well!

Since the trans is a splash oiling design, there needs to be a pool of oil in the case for the gears to sling around. But in about 16-18 seconds the pump totally evacuates the trans housing of oil. I can hear a pitch change in the motor as it starts sucking air. The returning oil has not had enough time to return to the drain area. When the oil is hot and less viscous it will flow back to the drain faster, but the pump will also move more oil, so no help there.

Maybe I can drop the input voltage to slow the pump or I could introduce a flow restriction. A flow restriction would make the pump work harder and draw more amps though. For reference the pump draws between 11.5 ~ 12 amps when pumping cold Redline 75w90.

Any other ideas to reduce the flow

[RetroRacing]

I would overfill by 1.5 times the volume of the cooler (to make up for the oil in the lines) and install a one way valve on the feed line to the pump to make sure it doesn't flow back into the trans, assuming the cooler is above the trans oil level.

[STiPWRD]

You could use a stock Subaru fuel controller to deliver 12V modulated power to the oil pump and control duty cycle with a 0-5V signal line. The stock Subaru fuel pump draws about 9A @ 90 psi so if you dial down the controller on the oil pump to 75% or lower, you should be fine. Adding more trans fluid would probably help as well.

[UnhipPopano]

In principle, I agree with Retro. If the pump is a gear pump, the check valve may not be needed.

Is it possible to move the line into the transmission from the rear plate to the top over the gears? From what I know, there is a small opening between the chamber that held the deferential that was removed and the gears. This way create a situation where that chamber would fill up, pressure then would go up to the point that the oil flow through the opening was the same as the pump. If you drill the opening larger than the fitting into the rear plate, then this would not happen, but then you would need to consider the metal shavings.

[Hobby Racer]

I would overfill by 1.5 times the volume of the cooler (to make up for the oil in the lines) and install a one way valve on the feed line to the pump to make sure it doesn't flow back into the trans, assuming the cooler is above the trans oil level.

I'm using a gear pump so back flow is not much of an issue. I already added additional fluid to account for the lines and cooler. The pump moves the oil to the back of the transmission faster than gravity can move it back to the front. It piles up in the rear section where the center differential used to be. I may do a test, pumping the oil back to the fill tube to see the results.


You could use a stock Subaru fuel controller to deliver 12V modulated power to the oil pump and control duty cycle with a 0-5V signal line. The stock Subaru fuel pump draws about 9A @ 90 psi so if you dial down the controller on the oil pump to 75% or lower, you should be fine. Adding more trans fluid would probably help as well.

I was thinking the same thing, except I was going to use a solid state relay controlled by the Megasquirt ECU. I can then adjust the PWM signal to get the motor RPM needed to produce the correct flow rate.


In principle, I agree with Retro. If the pump is a gear pump, the check valve may not be needed.

Is it possible to move the line into the transmission from the rear plate to the top over the gears? From what I know, there is a small opening between the chamber that held the deferential that was removed and the gears. This way create a situation where that chamber would fill up, pressure then would go up to the point that the oil flow through the opening was the same as the pump. If you drill the opening larger than the fitting into the rear plate, then this would not happen, but then you would need to consider the metal shavings.

Other than the fill tube, there is no other easy place to return the fluid to the transmission. I did drill two small holes between the chambers back when I rebuilt the transmission, but they are not large enough to equal the diameter of the return line and I don't want to pull that apart again. :(

[turbomacncheese]

Tee the dipstick tube? Drill a hole and weld on a nipple or something, so you don't change the length. Or just remove the right amount of dipstick for the size of the tee....

[Sgt.Gator]

On my LGT 5MT the oil cooler return is thru the unused VSS (Speedo) sensor hole. LGTs didn't use the VSS in the tranny, they had VSS on a wheel ABS. I'm not sure if you can do that on a WRX tranny, or what mods it would take. I know there is an aftermarket VSS you could use, MapDCCD Wheel speed sensor; http://mapdccd.com/vss.html.

[Hobby Racer]

On my LGT 5MT the oil cooler return is thru the unused VSS (Speedo) sensor hole.

I am using the VSS sensor.

[RetroRacing]

We feed it back through the dipstick hole, as it's really not needed anymore. we use a gear pump as well, so we don't need the one way valve. I wrongly assumed you were using the diaphragm type.

[RetroRacing]

We also run a filter on the feed side of the pump.80964

[DanielsDM]

Any other ideas to reduce the flow

You could use an intermittent wiper switch to adjust the duty cycle on the pump. Might have to use it to trigger a relay if it can't handle the current draw of the pump. Also don't know about the longevity since it would be in intermittent mode all the time. Maybe worth trying?

[Hobby Racer]

I'm going with a Solid State Relay and will use the ECU to control the PWM signal to the relay. I should be able to control the pump RPM to start out slow at low temps ~170 and speed up to the speed I need as the temps rise. I'll post info after it done.

Thank you everyone for the input!

[RetroRacing]

If you are going to go that way, why not dial it in with a rheostat? cheap, easy to adjust and effective, we use one for power steering in the Saker to lighten the effort when coming into the pits.

[Hobby Racer]

If you are going to go that way, why not dial it in with a rheostat? cheap, easy to adjust and effective, we use one for power steering in the Saker to lighten the effort when coming into the pits.

It is slightly more complicated to wire up, but there are a few benefits to doing it using PWM.


Less heat generated
Less current draw
Variable pump speed based on trans temp

[Wayne Presley]

You could do a dual return, one in the rear case and one in the VSS or dipstick holes.

[Hobby Racer]

You could do a dual return, one in the rear case and one in the VSS or dipstick holes.

I am using the VSS sensor so the only other spot would be the dipstick tube. I am hoping to keep the dipstick tube clear so I can use the dipstick. I'm thinking of running a tube from the back cover directly into the main case, bypassing the the chamber that formerly held the center differential. That should prevent the pooling of fluid back there.

But in any case I am still going to PWM the motor to slow down the pump. At about 3 GPM, its too much volume, I need more like 1 GPM.

81221

[Canadian818]

Couldn’t you just remove the Center diff housing and tap a hole on top of the gears?

[Hobby Racer]

Couldn’t you just remove the Center diff housing and tap a hole on top of the gears?

I don't think there is room up top. Plus I would have to disassemble the transmission and I don't want to do that again :p Taking off the back cover is easy and not too messy, but once you remove the tail section it gets involved.

[Wayne Presley]

I don't think there is room up top. Plus I would have to disassemble the transmission and I don't want to do that again :p Taking off the back cover is easy and not too messy, but once you remove the tail section it gets involved.

can you remove the dip stick tube and weld a return to it and replace it in the trans?

[Hobby Racer]

can you remove the dip stick tube and weld a return to it and replace it in the trans?

I'll look into that. I think its pressed into the case. If I remove it, it may not fit back very snugly, but its worth a look.

[RetroRacing]

We just welded it in the car, used a steel male -6.

[Hobby Racer]

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=81417&d=1519252179

Now that the front of the radiator is sealed off, it was time to seal off the back of the radiator to the under side of the hood. I started by fabricating some aluminum sheeting to fit the opening available. This proved much more intricate than sealing off the radiator intake. The outlet of my aftermarket radiator is angled toward the center of the car. This made routing the hose easy but now makes it harder to create the shroud as it needs to jog out and then back to fit around the hose.

81426

After many failed attempts I ended up with a nice fit. Best part is its easily installed/removed with only 3 #10-32 button head screws! I attached the bottom using the plastic U shaped edging FFR provided. It clamps the bottom nicely and does not require any fasteners, just push it on.

Here is a close up of the edging used to secure the bottom panel to the radiator bottom.

81421

Here are the panels that make up the rear shroud.

81427 81424 81425

And here are some finished pics of the shroud installed.

81423 81422 81420

[AZPete]

Wow. Very nice work!

[flynntuna]

I gotta agree, I think this will be the best 818 built to date.

[DanielsDM]

Very nice work.

[Mitch Wright]

Nice job

[Sgt.Gator]

Good looking and functional work!

[ben1272]

I like the radiator shroud and you have inspired me to do something similar with my own. Very nice clean work. I also like the dual hump exhaust and will watch yours closely.....it is originally how I wanted to proceed as well, but I am leaning towards putting the hardtop on this car, and that would require some machinations to make work.....like a targa conversion a la the Porsche Carrera GT itself.

[Hobby Racer]

Thanks everyone for the kind words.

My wing finally came in and I am starting the process of mounting it to the chassis platform I made earlier. I am thinking of positioning the wing as far forward as I can without cutting into the humps. My logic is that by positioning it farther forward it will apply the downforce closer to the rear axles creating less of a moment arm that will need to be countered by the front splitter. I will also position it ~3in. higher than the roll bar to get it into cleaner air.

[C.Plavan]

Just an FYI I did not use the VSS on my car (Legacy GT trans). Disabled with a Cobb. No issues. My Datalogger provided speed.

[phil1734]

My wing finally came in and I am starting the process of mounting it to the chassis platform I made earlier. I am thinking of positioning the wing as far forward as I can without cutting into the humps. My logic is that by positioning it farther forward it will apply the downforce closer to the rear axles creating less of a moment arm that will need to be countered by the front splitter. I will also position it ~3in. higher than the roll bar to get it into cleaner air.

You should always mount it as far back and as high as possible. Unless you somehow get the wing forward of the rear axle, all of its downforce will be on the rear (and creating lift on the front.) By moving it up you will get cleaner air, and by moving it back you can run a smaller angle of attack to get the same amount of downforce at the rear tire, which will decrease drag. E.g., Overall downforce is the same, but less drag = more efficient.

ed: Another thing to consider with your design is the exhaust. If it's dumping right underneath your wing you're going to make it nearly useless at WOT.

[Hobby Racer]

You should always mount it as far back and as high as possible. Unless you somehow get the wing forward of the rear axle, all of its downforce will be on the rear (and creating lift on the front.) By moving it up you will get cleaner air, and by moving it back you can run a smaller angle of attack to get the same amount of downforce at the rear tire, which will decrease drag. E.g., Overall downforce is the same, but less drag = more efficient.

ed: Another thing to consider with your design is the exhaust. If it's dumping right underneath your wing you're going to make it nearly useless at WOT.

Mounting the wing farther back does not allow you to use a smaller angle of attack. The downforce generated by the wing is constant for a given air speed, no matter where its mounted (assuming the wing is in clean air). Mounting the wing closer to the axle center line will however reduce the amount of lift created on the front axles. Reduced front lift translates into less downforce needed from the splitter to counter balance the rear. Less front splitter stickout means less drag = more efficient.

The exhaust may interfere with the center section of the wing. I am not able to run any CFD analysis without a CAD model of the 818R and wind tunnel testing is way beyond my budget. The exhaust is over a foot below the bottom of the wing so I'm hopeful it will not cause too much disruption if any.

[phil1734]

Downforce at the wing is the same yes, but the reaction through the chassis to the contact patch is a much different story. You need to consider the entire car as an assembly. There is plenty of literature out there on the subject.

Tufts on the underside of the wing and a go-pro work great should you hit the track and find yourself with rear grip issues under power, though I'm not sure what the solution would be at that point. If you do ever tuft it, make sure to do your decklid as well to make sure the wing isn't creating lift on that.

Either way you should still build the car you want!

[EODTech87]

Phil your missing the point that he’s trying to reduce front lift. He’s not trying to maximize the rear downforce but trying to balance the car a little better.

[RetroRacing]

Moving the wing back, creates more leverage at the same load, and will increase front lift slightly (simple lever arm, rear wheels are the fulcrum). Lowering the front ride height, increasing the splitter depth, taping up some air intakes (grill), flat bottoming the car, raising rear ride height (and adjusting the wing accordingly to maintain attack angle) and/or increasing rear spring rate will all decrease front lift. We had a wicked power on understeer in the car, that we seemed to have dialed out by lowering the front of the car (changing to 15" wheels up front) and installing an LSD. Not sure if the LSD had an effect, just us being stupid by changing more than one thing at a time.

[Hobby Racer]

I finished creating the wing mount today and test fit the rear deck to be sure everything fits well before finishing the bodywork.

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=81803&d=1519771523

Here are some other pics of the wing installed. You can see my Dad in the background "helping" i.e. supervising and wondering when we are going to lunch ;)

81809 81811 81812 81813

[Hobby Racer]

When we last left my trans cooler setup, the pump was pumping too much volume and the oil was pooling up in the center diff section of the case, causing the pump to suck the case dry and scavenge air.

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=81808&d=1519771556

I am addressing the pump volume by PWMing the pump power supply to reduce the RPM and thus the volume pumped. To address the pooling issue I attached a short aluminum tube to the the 90 degree bulkhead adapter that goes through the rear block off plate. This deposits the oil just past the center differential chamber, directly into the main case chamber. I had to drill an additional hole into the rear plate as the first one was too high. As an added bonus I now have an inspection hole! If you follow the red arrow in the last picture you can see the tube as it enters the main chamber.

81816 81815 81818

[flynntuna]

Hope this mod solves the issue with trans cooler. John, what tires and sizes are you using?

[RetroRacing]

Check your wing height, looks like ours did when we tried to use those mounts. the wing is in the "shadow" of the roll cage and will lose significant downforce. Check out the https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xOCYSTQx3E and you can see how chopped up the air is at the wing, from the roll cage. We are over 2" above with ours.

[Hobby Racer]

Hope this mod solves the issue with trans cooler. John, what tires and sizes are you using?

I am starting out with the FFR rims (they were free at the time) and the recommend sizes of 215x40x17 fronts and 255x35x18 rears in Dunlop Direzza ZII Star Spec. I figure I can burn thru these while I'm sorting out the suspension, engine, aero etc. Once I have it dialed in I plan to change to 17" Team Dynamics on all four corners and will decide on the appropriate sized slicks or D.O.T. R compounds at that point.


Check your wing height, looks like ours did when we tried to use those mounts. the wing is in the "shadow" of the roll cage and will lose significant downforce. Check out the https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xOCYSTQx3E and you can see how chopped up the air is at the wing, from the roll cage. We are over 2" above with ours.

Mine is 1.5" above the bar, but I also plan to encase the bar in a streamlined airfoil (https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?23199-John-s-EZ36R-H6-818R-Build&p=299279&viewfull=1#post299279) to smooth out the flow.

[RetroRacing]

Good call, couldn't tell in the picture. We are looking into doing the same, but are looking for an existing extrusion die so we don't have to re-invent the wheel.

[Mitch Wright]

Might want to think about slotting the rear deck to allow removal with out taking off the wing. Just a thought.81856

Enjoying following your build.

[Hobby Racer]

Might want to think about slotting the rear deck to allow removal with out taking off the wing. Just a thought.81856

Enjoying following your build.

My plan is to use quick release pins for fast wing removal so I can get the deck off quickly. I did not want to cut the deck through to the edge as it would really weaken the panel and give rise to stress cracking at the other end of the slot.

[C.Plavan]

My plan is to use quick release pins for fast wing removal so I can get the deck off quickly. I did not want to cut the deck through to the edge as it would really weaken the panel and give rise to stress cracking at the other end of the slot.

That is all you need to do. It worked great on my old car.

[Mitch Wright]

Sounds like a plan and have done the same thing but the wing is one more thing to take off if just doing a quick check or service. Just a different thought process.

[Hobby Racer]

Decided to do something different today. I have been wanting to seal off the front wheel wells better than the supplied FFR pieces allow. So I made some aluminum panels to block off the remaining openings the best I could. The top near the hood will get some of the rubber bulb stripping FFR supplies to close off the gap where it joins the hood. The red arrows point to the panels I made. On the R's at least there are huge gaps, especially where the anti-roll bar comes through. I know from past experience that tons of track rubber, dirt, stones and debris will collect in the front compartment if its not blocked off. I made sure the design allowed for easy access to the grease fittings.

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=81903&d=1519941782

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=81904&d=1519941791

[Hobby Racer]

That is all you need to do. It worked great on my old car.

What type did you use? Did the vibrations cause any issues? Rubbing on the paint/body maybe?

[aquillen]

Sealing off the front wheel wells -

Nice work there and thanks for sharing pix of the planning - that stuff takes time and thinking. I've been expecting I'll want to do this too - your sharing will help a lot.

[Bob_n_Cincy]

John,
Nice job on the front end aluminum splash panels.

I have not put any panels in yet. (our car has been drivable for 3 years). Drive it in the rain a lot.
The panels are not on the top of my list.

What is the pros and cons of not installing the panes or wheel wells????
Bob

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=81935&d=1519966330

[Hobby Racer]

John,
What is the pros and cons of not installing the panes or wheel wells????
Bob

Here are my thoughts about installing and improving the splash panels (kind of the opposite list of what you asked for ;)).

Pros:

Cleaner front compartment, cockpit, and engine compartment
Less corrosion on parts and fasteners from exposure to water, dirt, etc.
Possible aero advantage (but I'm just guessing here)



Cons:

Access to components for maintenance and repair can be more difficult if not planned carefully
Added weight, but not really much, the aluminum panels are very light
Takes longer to get the car finished and ready to drive



In the end I guess its just that I like a more OEM fit and finish, I can be quite particular about things. It does slow my progress down quite often though.

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Here are my thoughts about installing and improving the splash panels (kind of the opposite list of what you asked for ;)).
Pros:

Cleaner front compartment, cockpit, and engine compartment
Less corrosion on parts and fasteners from exposure to water, dirt, etc.
Possible aero advantage (but I'm just guessing here)



Cons:

Access to components for maintenance and repair can be more difficult if not planned carefully
Added weight, but not really much, the aluminum panels are very light
Takes longer to get the car finished and ready to drive



In the end I guess its just that I like a more OEM fit and finish, I can be quite particular about things. It does slow my progress down quite often though.

Thanks John,
I had to install the shields between the front tires and doors to keep from getting covered with rubber dust.
I do have to clean the gravel out of the side sails after each track weekend.
Bob

[RetroRacing]

we have not done anything on that yet, will probably only do one in the front of the tire, as our light box was full of rubber....not a little, but FULL, after only a few sessions. Need to get the car back from the engine builder first....11k later:(

[Hobby Racer]

Need to get the car back from the engine builder first....11k later:(

Ouch! been there done that. never a good thing.

[Hobby Racer]

After more than 3 months of hounding the MS3 developers, they finally emailed me a beta firmware containing the software fix I wrote for the ECU and it works! Now I can actually start tuning the motor, that is after I get the body painted :rolleyes:

[Mitch Wright]

Congratulations

[JB91710]

If you like the Exhaust Note, try this.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qssbthwIb4s&index=30&list=FLFsNbu_AalilSMdtgmxsiPA&t=0s

[Hobby Racer]

I've been busy sanding and sanding and sanding, and then sanding some more. It just never seems to end. But I'm seeing the light through the dust cloud. I'm hoping to shoot the first coat of primer next week. Found lots of voids between the gel-coat and the fiberglass, mostly on the sharp corners where its hard to get the glass to tuck in tight. I also cut off nearly 1/2" from the driver side front fender, at the nose where the fender joins the front fascia piece. They are not made symmetrical from FFR and look funny if you don't correct it. The body work is definitely the most daunting part of the project in my opinion.

My temporary paint booth is saving the rest of my garage from being covered in gel-coat and body filler dust.

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=82874&d=1521584542

82875 82876

[Hobby Racer]

Now that paint work is nearing I have to settle on a paint color. I think I want to go with a burnt copper orange for the body. Accented with a gloss black center for the hood, covering the radiator exits, and gloss black humps on the rear deck. Here are some samples of the body colors I've found and like so far.

2005 Dodge Viper Copper Head Orange
82877

Mercedes-Benz AMG GT3 Battlefield 1 Burnt Copper Orange
82878

I like the Mercedes color better but I can not find any information on the paint codes anywhere! If anybody has any information on this or a similar color let me know!

[lance corsi]

I like your color choice. Check out House of Colors they have a very similar shade.

[RetroRacing]

3m 1080 vinyl!

[ben1272]

I purchased the optional K-tuned FFR aluminum shifter from another forum member and really love the looks and operation, it really is art. However, the forward facing cable layout FFR uses leaves much to be desired. After reading many MR2 shifter conversion threads, I decided to do my own rear facing cable conversion using my FFR aluminum shifter. Initially I was going to turn the shifter backwards and go from there, but I decided to leave it facing forward. Either way would require dual bell cranks to change the direction of throw for the forward and side motion so the transmission shift pattern would be normal.

I then cut the front of the shifter off to make room for my Wilwood brake adjuster; made a new base plate and started fitting the bell cranks. Each bell crank has three adjustment locations for the cable and shifter connection allowing a large amount of adjustment for shift throw. The final cable routing allows for an almost straight shot back to the transmission. I am also using Mechie's rear bell crank to eliminate the large loop for the twisting motion of the shift shaft. My new cables will only need to be 70" total length!


http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=64660&d=1488669800

The bell cranks are made from 1/4" aluminum plate with 5/16" Oilite bronze bushings pressed into the pivot for smooth operation.

64663 64665 64666

I like this. Lance Corsi has a nice solution as well, but he has a front mount fuel tank to make his approach possible. I have the K-tuned shifter and making these parts should be doable. Too bad the shifter cables cant be readily shortened.

[bbjones121]

I can't find it it was mentioned. How is your new configuration shifter feel compared to the aluminum FFR shifter going out front?

[Hobby Racer]

I can't find it it was mentioned. How is your new configuration shifter feel compared to the aluminum FFR shifter going out front?

Excellent. The shifts are crisp and there is no slop to make it hard to tell what gear your in. You can actually feel the shifter detents in the trans when rowing the gears. One thing I will change is to make the throws longer. I have them so close now you can hit 5th when shifting from 2nd to 3rd if you push side ways too hard. Luckily the side to side and front to back throws are adjustable.

[C.Plavan]

What type did you use? Did the vibrations cause any issues? Rubbing on the paint/body maybe?

Any size you want. You could get the "T" handle ones if you wanted. If you are worried about scratches, a little clear bra vinyl on the spots would alleviate that concern. https://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-quick-release-pins/=1ca4nya

[C.Plavan]

3m 1080 vinyl!

Yes! You will thank yourself. It is by far the easiest Vinyl Wrap I have used.

[Pineapplehead]

Definitely looking forward to this one coming together!

[Hobby Racer]

Paint arrives on Friday! Hoping to paint next week. Pics to follow if everything goes well.

[Hobby Racer]

I had hoped to have all the painting completed by the weekend, but as usual life had other plans. I did manage to get the more difficult two tone pieces painted though. Plus a few black only bits that are not shown here.

For those painting your own cars or just looking for good paint at a reasonable price, check out The Coating Store (https://www.thecoatingstore.com/). My friend who is into street rods turned me on to it instead of the local paint supply shop. Saved almost a grand over what the local shop wanted to charge for similar materials! So far the quality seems excellent.

This is Copper Pearl and Jet Black

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=84015&d=1523567207

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=84016&d=1523567212

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=84017&d=1523567218

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=84018&d=1523567223

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=84014&d=1523567202

[Scargo]

Looks great and nice "booth" you built. As a painter I can appreciate the work. Congrats.

[flynntuna]

Wow. This is going to look really nice.

[Aero STI]

Very nice! What did your fan setup look like for the booth? How clean was the air?

I made a wedding tent paint booth (examples on youtube) when I painted mine. I used 8 box fans with filters as the supply, then let it pressure vent through filters. I would have liked to add a fan to suck out as well but didn't have an explosion proof fan.

[Hobby Racer]

Very nice! What did your fan setup look like for the booth? How clean was the air?


Not very clean with all the overspray in the air. I think I'm going to paint in smaller batches to cut down on the overspray in the air. These panels will need to be wet sanded and buffed out, but I did lay down a lot of clear so I should be fine.

I just used two box fans and pleated furnace filters before the fans venting right out the window.

84034

I know... don't blow yourself up... I've used this method on three previous cars and it worked fine.

[Hobby Racer]

Finally painted the last of the panels. I was going to color sand and buff everything but my first track day is in a month and I still need to finish up a bunch of items. Most importantly I need to get it on a dyno and tune the motor. So I think I will skip the cut and polish for now and do it later this summer.

Anyway, here are some pics of the last panels.

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=84299&d=1524051031

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=84300&d=1524051037

[Wayne Presley]

Looks great

[flynntuna]

It does look great. I'm not sure if I'm going to show the pics of your car to my wife now, this color is one of her favorites and I was not planning to paint my car. :).

[lsfourwheeler]

That looks awesome! How many hours do you think you put into painting it yourself?

[Hobby Racer]

The pics do not do it justice, in the sun light it looks amazing!

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=84341&d=1524093218




That looks awesome! How many hours do you think you put into painting it yourself?

The actual painting is really quick, about 8-10 hours. The real time suck is the prep work, maybe 200 hours. That does not count the body work to change the fiberglass.

[Sgt.Gator]

Looks great!

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Very Nice!!!!!

[aquillen]

Beautiful. One of my favorite colors. I gave my wife one decision on my project, the color. So white it will be... at least (it will eventually) look clean the longest. Actually saw 2016 white factory Subaru (diamond metal fleck in it I think), that looks real nice for white, and hey that would be the right "donor" stuff.

[Zach34]

Looks great! I really like how the enlarged side vents turned out. Good to see another R coming together.

[RetroRacing]

Very nice!!!!

[Hobby Racer]

Drove the car around my neighborhood for the first time today!

Only a short punch list now.


Install headlights & taillights
Align and corner balance
Create a front splitter
Fabricate an airbox
Chase the gremlins!




https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=84831&d=1524507723

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=84832&d=1524507729

[flynntuna]

That's absolutely awesome! It's beautiful, thanks so much for sharing your build with us. You've helped me quite a bit with my build just by posting your progress. Thank you.
How does it sound? What's your impression of the way you routed the exhaust?

[Hobby Racer]

That's absolutely awesome! It's beautiful, thanks so much for sharing your build with us. You've helped me quite a bit with my build just by posting your progress. Thank you.
How does it sound? What's your impression of the way you routed the exhaust?

Glad you enjoyed the build. The engine sound is amazing, I'll post up a video with sound as soon as I get it tuned. I have only blipped the throttle lightly and only up to ~ 3000 RPM's as its running pretty lean right now. The exhaust is great so far. No heat issues on the surrounding fiberglass, but as I said I have not ran the engine hard yet. Its quiet at idle but has a nice Porsche 911 like sound when revved. Not sure how loud it will be at full song though.

I was not going to put in the wheel liners but after my short trip around the block I had gravel and debris everywhere! I am now installing the liners ;)

Put it on the scales real quick and it's 1,970 lbs wet with ~ 5 gallons of gas.

[Hobby Racer]

The thing about splitters is that you need to treat them like disposable parts as they get busted up often when running on curbing, taking off track excursions, loading onto trailers etc... The FFR piece is nice, but at $549 it is definitely not disposable! My solution is to use cheap, readily available materials to make a simple splitter that is easy to put on and take off.

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=85068&d=1524844148

I used a 1/4" thick 4'x8' sheet utility panel (basically sanded plywood) for the splitter. I then riveted 1/16" thick 1"x1" aluminum angle to the back for support. Since the splitter is completely flat (unlike the FFR piece) there is an opening below the nose piece that needed to be blocked off. I added another 1/16" thick 1"x1" aluminum angle to both block air and strengthen the front section. I am waiting on the splitter support rods to come so I can add support to the front edge. When its all done I plan to cover the wood with some resin and mat to waterproof it and add some additional rigidity followed by some black paint.

I'm into this for less than $75, including the support rods! replacement splitters will cost around $30 since I should be able to reuse the hardware.

85093850948509585096

[Samiam1017]

looks awesome

[Hobby Racer]

Finished joining the front splitter to the rest of the under-body. Now I have a completely flat under tray front to rear. I made the panel between the splitter and the under-body easy to remove much like I did in the rear to join the diffusor and the under-body. A channel holds the front lip and 4 #10-32 button heads hold the rear of the panel.

85111 85112

[flynntuna]

I like your idea,. I have the FFR one, and was going to use it as a mold to make a copy but your meathod looks to be cheaper. Or should I say less expensive. ;)

[C.Plavan]

To save even more money, spend some more time and make it 3 piece. Two corner skids and a center section. Makes changing much easier, and you do not have to replace the whole thing when one corner gets BOOOOYAAAA'd. :)

[DSR-3]

If you do the wet layup on a prepped sheet of melamine or glass, with the first layer of CF (or S-glass and a little black pigment- aka round 2) you can get a pretty-nice part.
*Your car is looking absolutely great! Thanks for posting.

[Hobby Racer]

To save even more money, spend some more time and make it 3 piece. Two corner skids and a center section. Makes changing much easier, and you do not have to replace the whole thing when one corner gets BOOOOYAAAA'd. :)

Great idea! For the next version I'm going to try that, because I know that this one may last 3 months tops...


If you do the wet layup on a prepped sheet of melamine or glass, with the first layer of CF (or S-glass and a little black pigment- aka round 2) you can get a pretty-nice part.
*Your car is looking absolutely great! Thanks for posting.

I originally was going to make this via wet layup but I have never done that from scratch and I need to get this done ASAP as I have my first HPDE on May 20th. But I may try to lay one up over the summer. I have an old sliding glass door that would be perfect for the flat layup surface.

Thanks for the kind words, I really like the way it has turned out myself.

[RetroRacing]

Put some graphite powder in the mix as well, makes it last twice as long, super hard and slides over the pavement.

[Hobby Racer]

Heading to the chassis dyno Monday morning! Hope I can get a decent tune on this thing.

[Hobby Racer]

Well made it to dyno yesterday. It took them about an hour to figure out how to rig up the exhaust venting to work with my vertical exit exhaust pipes. I was able to transfer about 90% of the factory ECU parameters and tables to my Megasquirt ECU so the tune was not far off to start with. In the end I did not change much of the tune. It made 226hp and 207ft/lbs of torque. It was still pulling hard at 6000 rpm, but that was where we stopped the pulls.

I'll be doing more tuning at the track using my datalogs.

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=85529&d=1525775290

[Scargo]

Here is a picture of the new mount plates tack welded together to hold their relative position so I can pour in liquid polyurethane to create the new lowered mount.

71722

Notice how much closer the top and bottom plates are as compared to the first picture. The OEM mount has 1 1/4" of rubber, and my new mount has 3/8", so I took out about 7/8".

Here is the completed mount next to an OEM STI Group-N mount.

71949
Just came across this. I have been trying to source shorter engine mounts for my '07 STi that I am using a tall NA intake on. It is causing me hood interference issues. Since I used to do a lot of urethane casting this would be a no-brainer for me! Just needed your idea to turn on the light bulb! Do you remember the durometer and whose material you used? 90A? Did you use any primer for urethanes or just the bare bead-blasted surface? Has it held up?

[Hobby Racer]

Just came across this. I have been trying to source shorter engine mounts for my '07 STi that I am using a tall NA intake on. It is causing me hood interference issues. Since I used to do a lot of urethane casting this would be a no-brainer for me! Just needed your idea to turn on the light bulb! Do you remember the durometer and whose material you used? 90A? Did you use any primer for urethanes or just the bare bead-blasted surface? Has it held up?

I thought I posted that information earlier in my thread, but I could not find it either :confused:
Here is a picture of the can the urethane came in and a pic just after I was done pouring it into my mount. They have easy instructions and its very simple. No primers needed, just clean bead blasted surface so it can bite.

85560 85561

I purchased the urethane here. http://www.suspension.com/diymmi
I used the 80A but you can get it in other ratings.

Forgot to mention, its holding up well from the dyno sessions, but I have not tracked it yet. I will report back if there are any issues next week after my first couple of track days.

[lsfourwheeler]

With a significantly thinner than stock mount, do you think bottoming it out will be an issue? I wouldn't think that would cause any damage but it might cause a clunk or other noise.

[Hobby Racer]

I do not believe it will bottom out, the 80A durameter urethane is very hard.

[Hobby Racer]

Went to Watkins Glen today and drove the car for the first time. I am very impressed with how it turned out. It still needs to be sorted, aero and suspension settings need to be optimized, but a very solid track car.

Steering felt very crisp and responsive but not twitchy. Those Cadillac brakes are so impressive, I can not tell you how well they work. The engine ran well but still needs some tuning to get the AFR's where they need to be. The sound from the vertical pipes is great. I do need ear plugs in addition to my helmet though :p

The temps were perfect. I have not gone over the log files yet but I was keeping an eye on the gauges throughout the day. More on the that after I review the engine logs.

I bought a 4K action camera to get some video and as fate would have it, it will arrive tomorrow, just after I finish my track sessions! Next time I will have video to post, I promise.

[Mitch Wright]

Congratulations and nice work.

[Zach34]

Great news, glad it ran well!

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Hobby Racer, That is great news,
For you to have that much success on your first time out says a lot about your skills and decision making.
I may follow in you footsteps with the Cadillac brakes on my second car.
Bob

[longislandwrx]

Beautiful!!! Next time I head up to Canandaigua i'd love to see this irl.

[Hobby Racer]

We'll start with the good.


Had a great time at the track.
Everyone loved the car (only one person knew what it was).
Was happy with the results considering it was my first time driving the car.
Brought the car home in one piece and still running, always a good thing.
Put over 130 miles of hard laps on the car, decent shake down I think.


The bad.

Lost electronic throttle control on the first lap out. I had to reset the ECU on track in traffic! Back in the pits I noticed I had configured one of the safety parameters incorrectly so it was an easy fix.
No video to share.
Second day we got rained out :(
My DIY LCD digital dash is really hard to read in direct sunlight. I am now retrofitting the WRX gauges into the dash.
The straight pipe exhaust is apparently very load. Sounded great to me but some friends commented that from the stands it was one of the loudest cars going by.


The ugly.


Upon inspection at home found that some of my welds on the collectors cracked! The one on the left cracked 3/4 of the way around!
Now I have to grind off some of the expensive ceramic coating and fix it.
Since I'm doing exhaust work, I think I'll put on some mufflers :rolleyes:


https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=86229&d=1527208136

[bbjones121]

Sorry to hear. Hopefully it should be easily fixed since it is still held together?

[RetroRacing]

Why did they crack? Heat? Load on them? vibration?
Before you fix, I would want to know why they both cracked at the same location when all of your other welds held up fine.

[Hobby Racer]

Why did they crack? Heat? Load on them? vibration?
Before you fix, I would want to know why they both cracked at the same location when all of your other welds held up fine.

I know exactly why they cracked. I only welded them on the outside and not the inside so they were not as strong as they should have been to start with. In addition I ground them down smooth for appearance sake, mistake number two, it left the weld metal too thin.

Live and learn, that's what car building is all about. The repair will be plenty strong although not as pretty.

[Zach34]

No affiliation with this guy, but pretty good video that addresses what may be your exact situation:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MIHKZBf7rwA

[TheBabyBadger]

Righteous build! Love it! Makes me wanna do one next, or just for a track car!

[RetroRacing]

Well, that answers that! :p

[Hobby Racer]

Finally got some time to weld up the cracks in my header collectors. Turns out its really hard to weld down inside a small tube :p

Here is a shot looking down into the collector to see the weld I put in.
87214

Here is a pic from the outside showing the weld penetration. Man that ceramic coating is tough, didn't blister or peel! I did end up grinding it off to weld the crack from the outside as well.
87213

[Zach34]

Did you MIG or TIG that? I'm guessing MIG?

The weld bead looks very nice, but I don't think you got good penetration. In this case it's kind of a blessing, since if you got full penetration, you would have pulled in the ceramic coating from the outside into the bead, which would have contaminated it and weakened it.

Here's a link to a professional welder who's been publishing welding advice on the web for years. The bottom of the page gives some pointers on penetration.

http://www.weldingtipsandtricks.com/Mig-welding-tips.html

[Hobby Racer]

Did you MIG or TIG that? I'm guessing MIG?

MIG, I could not fit the TIG torch down into the hole!

[Hobby Racer]

Well the first time I had the car on track at Watkins Glen I did not have video for you guys. But as promised I have video for my second track outing. This was my first time at the New York Safety Track (http://nyst.com/) so you'll have to excuse my terrible lines and timid driving ;)

The track is primarily a motorcycle track so its tight and twisty. I like that it is very technical with 18 turns, 16 of which are BLIND! I will definitely be returning.


https://youtu.be/vcKgSacXWNs

[Hobby Racer]

There are a few things that still need to be addressed with my car before I can call it done.


I have not gotten the Variable Valve Timing working yet so I'm losing some mid to top end power
The aero needs to be sorted
The suspension settings need to be sorted
The trans mount needs to be redesigned



During the second session at NYST I broke the rear transmission mount. The polyurethane separated from the top plate and it made a clunking noise every time the engine/trans shifted weight front to back. This ended my 3rd session early. But the track marshal and I came up with a nice temporary fix. I took a ratchet strap and looped it around the tail of the transmission and the frame section below the mount and tightened it down. It held the transmission snug against the mount for the rest of the day! Now I need to think of a more permanent solution.

[flynntuna]

That engine sings beautifully:cool:

[STiPWRD]

Great video, thanks for sharing!

[Mitch Wright]

Car sounds great, enjoy the sorting and chassis tuning. I found the car responds really well to chassis changes.

[Hobby Racer]

It was real hot, around 95F with a feels like temp of 102F. I looked at the logs and max temps were great except for the intake air temp. I need to make a duct to grab air from one of the side scoops as it is just sucking engine bay air at the moment.



Coolant: 192F
Oil: 215F
Trans: 205F
Air: 104F



Really pleased with all the plumbing and cooling stuff I put in.

[Mitch Wright]

I am using the right side scoop to draw intake air and is working well for my car.
88264
88265

[Samiam1017]

why do you think the trans mount separated? did you use there primer? was there a profile on the metal to help? car looks and sounds great!

[lsfourwheeler]

During the second session at NYST I broke the rear transmission mount. The polyurethane separated from the top plate and it made a clunking noise every time the engine/trans shifted weight front to back.

What engine mounts are you running? It's possible that since you made a stiffer trans mount, if the engine mounts are stock or not stiff enough then more load will be carried by the trans mount (until it breaks of course). I don't know if that's the case for you, but if it is maybe look into matching the stiffness and range of motion for both the engine and trans mount so the load is balanced.

Car looks great on track!

[Hobby Racer]

Here is the separated trans mount.

88273 88274


why do you think the trans mount separated? did you use there primer? was there a profile on the metal to help?

No primer (instructions didn't call for it) and not really much profile for it to bite into, just media blasted. I think its not really meant to be used in tension.

88275


What engine mounts are you running? It's possible that since you made a stiffer trans mount, if the engine mounts are stock or not stiff enough then more load will be carried by the trans mount (until it breaks of course). I don't know if that's the case for you, but if it is maybe look into matching the stiffness and range of motion for both the engine and trans mount so the load is balanced.

Using Subaru STI Group N motor mounts with custom top plates. They're plenty stiff but provide no real forward / back support. That is supposed to be handled by either the front dog bone, the trans mount, or both.

And here is my temporary fix as I need to be ready for the next track event at Watkins Glen in 2 weeks. Who knows, if it holds up well it could be my permanent fix ;)
88276

[turbomacncheese]

one of the engine mounts I made did the same thing when I tightened it to the frame, but the top and bottom plates weren't exactly parallel, so torqueing the nut down pulled the lower plate away. I'm pondering that problem, too, and wondering if the others are problems waiting to happen. I kinda like your fix for the trans mount, though. Can still squish together, but not stretch apart. Actually, I kinda REALLY like it.

[longislandwrx]

what about screwing a whole bunch of hex head screws into the top plate before pouring your urathane to really give it something to grab on to.

[Sgt.Gator]

Are you logging oil pressure? The oil control problem in the H6 is the main thing stopping me from jumping in with one.

[Samiam1017]

i like the new solution for the trans mount. how about welding it solid and using a small piece of rubber under the mount for a little compliance? i have to run a thinner poured mount like yourself and have chosen the later. hopefully its not too stiff.

[Hobby Racer]

what about screwing a whole bunch of hex head screws into the top plate before pouring your urathane to really give it something to grab on to.

That might work but its still a lot to ask putting an adhesive in tension and shock loading. I think my quick fix may turn out to be the easiest and best. I'll know for sure in two weeks when I track it again. ;)


i like the new solution for the trans mount. how about welding it solid and using a small piece of rubber under the mount for a little compliance? i have to run a thinner poured mount like yourself and have chosen the later. hopefully its not too stiff.

If I was starting from scratch with the knowledge I have now I would most likely do that.

[Hobby Racer]

Are you logging oil pressure? The oil control problem in the H6 is the main thing stopping me from jumping in with one.

No oil pressure issues pulling up to 1.6G is the sweepers! I am logging pressure both before and after the accusump so I know for sure if / when the oil moves away from the pickup. But I only have two full track days so far. I'll report back after two more days at Watkins Glen. That is a very fast, high G track.

You know you want to join the H6 club :p

[Hobby Racer]

Here is a scatter plot of the oil pressures during a 15 min track session with lateral G's in the 1.5 range. This plot shows the pre oil pressure (that's from the pump to the accusump) on the X axis and the post oil pressure (that's after the accusump to the motor galleys) on the Y axis. The color denotes RPM.

When hot, the pressures range from about 25 psi around idle to a max of 88 psi. That must be the internal pressure relief as you can see an abrupt cut off in pressure rise on the right side.

Everything looks pretty normal.

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=88331&d=1530650382

[Sgt.Gator]

Interesting graph. I'm probably not reading it correctly because it looks to me like you have a lot of high rpm (Orange and Red dots) between 24 psi and 45 psi. I wouldn't think you should ever have a high rpm colored dot at such low pressures. And how do you tell a Pre Oil from a Post oil dot?

Can you do a straight oil pressure vs G graph all at a single rpm, like 5,500? Or eliminate the G and do a oil pressure vs time with a rpm overlaid? Like this:

https://uorg4w.by.files.1drv.com/y4mFtI8YlTmQ3mIwSg7-7FLARZqnKnn-xPDiSoJPRZJryoh4cyrf3coHZOUAJKnq7ZfCNGspFlpQKdGAp2-ywnJPljrif1h0INoiOJ-HwTDJ5YfPfXQEK65oApWG-hEa8S1BCkWNZb_Ikbcgzt1RWdgDiJMg_ESWzobEQjpCJUAjSo7 Q4dzdYrQQMMOQgMUdFR-JcVcppyLpeLgp38MZadh6w?width=1024&height=544&cropmode=none

[Zach34]

Also interested in what Gator pointed out.

I'm unfamiliar with accusumps, but my eyebrow raised at what appears to be somewhere around a 33% oil pressure drop at the higher pressure ranges across the accusump. Is this a known tradeoff with those things?

[Hobby Racer]

Interesting graph. I'm probably not reading it correctly because it looks to me like you have a lot of high rpm (Orange and Red dots) between 24 psi and 45 psi. I wouldn't think you should ever have a high rpm colored dot at such low pressures. And how do you tell a Pre Oil from a Post oil dot?

Can you do a straight oil pressure vs G graph all at a single rpm, like 5,500? Or eliminate the G and do a oil pressure vs time with a rpm overlaid? Like this:


You can't tell a pre dot from a post dot without hovering over it with the mouse pointer. I just use the scatter plot to get an overall picture of the entire log file all at once. This way I don't have to scan through a huge log if I'm just looking for say a large dip in oil pressure.

Here is a line graph like what you asked for, but as I mentioned its just a small time frame in the log. It does point out some things.


You can see the red pre pressure trace bouncing off the pressure relief spring (that's why its top is flat at about 88 psi).
The green post pressure trace is more evened out, that's the effect the accusump has evening out highs and lows.
The green post trace also exhibits a pressure drop due to the cooler and additional plumbing.




https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=88344&d=1530704053


Also interested in what Gator pointed out.

I'm unfamiliar with accusumps, but my eyebrow raised at what appears to be somewhere around a 33% oil pressure drop at the higher pressure ranges across the accusump. Is this a known tradeoff with those things?

The accusump combined with the cooler and extra plumbing cause a pressure drop, this happens in all systems, its not unique to the accusump. Most people only log one oil pressure so they don't see the pressure drop in their system.

[Sgt.Gator]

The next time you go out if you can log one flying lap then you can compare your oil pressures and RPM to particular corners and see if any of them are causing an issue.

[Hobby Racer]

Yeah, I'm trying to figure out how to get my ECU data and my telemetry data into one system so I can do easy direct comparisons. Have not found any way as yet, but I'm still trying.

[Hobby Racer]

Well, still working out the kinks. Day one I broke the shifter cable that controls forward and backward motion. We cobbled it back together so we could salvage day two. Then on day two the oil catch can filled up and spewed oil everywhere, and I do mean everywhere! That ended day two early.

But I do have a lap from day 2 before the the oil bath. Enjoy :D


https://youtu.be/tC7SOhYpDUc

[Sgt.Gator]

"Then on day two the oil catch can filled up and spewed oil everywhere, and I do mean everywhere! That ended day two early."

Classic Subaru track day!

[DetactGarageMech]

"But I do have a lap from day 2 before the the oil bath. "

Nice lap...aren't oil baths only good for the Tin Man?

"trying to figure out how to get my ECU data and my telemetry data into one system so I can do easy direct comparisons" --- can the 2 be run off a master clock, if so then post processing based upon time stamps would be possible.

[Hobby Racer]

"trying to figure out how to get my ECU data and my telemetry data into one system so I can do easy direct comparisons" --- can the 2 be run off a master clock, if so then post processing based upon time stamps would be possible.

They can't be run off the same clock. The GPS lap timer get time from GPS satellites and the ECU only records seconds since data logging began, its internal clock is only used to time stamp the log files it creates so inside the files there is no full time field.

[Matt Ries]

Just finished reading your build from first post to last, thanks for taking us along! Very nice work both on the car and documenting the build and sharing with everybody. Two thumbs up, Makes me want to build one! Thanks again for a very enjoyable couple hrs:)

[Hobby Racer]

In the short time I've been running my 818R on the track, I have noticed that the step from 4th to 5th gear is too large. The car falls on its face when going down the long straights after shifting into 5th.

The 06 WRX 5MT (and all USDM WRX 5MT's I think) have a 0.738 ratio 5th gear set. This is great for highway cruising and gas mileage but not so good for road racing. So I started looking for a shorter 5th gear set. My research uncovered that the 08-09 Outback with an EJ253 had a 5th gear ratio of 0.825. This close ratio 5th should be much better for the car.

Having rebuilt the 5MT once before I think I can replace the current 5th gear set with the transmission still in the car, only removing the center differential section. That's the section right behind the FFR block off plate.

I'll post pics when I do the conversion and let you know how it goes.

If anyone else is interested, the Subaru part number for the 5th gear set is 32315AA390. It is a special order part with limited quantities remaining so get them while they last!

90636

[taco20]

In the short time I've been running my 818R on the track, I have noticed that the step from 4th to 5th gear is too large. The car falls on its face when going down the long straights after shifting into 5th.

The 06 WRX 5MT (and all USDM WRX 5MT's I think) have a 0.738 ratio 5th gear set. This is great for highway cruising and gas mileage but not so good for road racing. So I started looking for a shorter 5th gear set. My research uncovered that the 08-09 Outback with an EJ253 had a 5th gear ratio of 0.825. This close ratio 5th should be much better for the car.

Having rebuilt the 5MT once before I think I can replace the current 5th gear set with the transmission still in the car, only removing the center differential section. That's the section right behind the FFR block off plate.

I'll post pics when I do the conversion and let you know how it goes.

If anyone else is interested, the Subaru part number for the 5th gear set is 32315AA390. It is a special order part with limited quantities remaining so get them while they last!

90636


Hey yes you can do the converion in the car. You will need a thin wall socket to get one of the nuts off. Plus the upper gear is pressed on so I just cut a slot in the top gear and cracked the gear to get it off. The nut will push it back in place. I tried the .871 5th gear and ran into the rpm limiter at around 140 mph with my 4.11 final drive trans. I installed the .78 5th gear in mine to stay off the limiter and still push me over 150. Depending on tire size and if you have the 3.90 final ratio you should be happy with your choice. The rpms don’t drop much when you shift into 5th now so I find myself double checking that I shifted.

[Hobby Racer]

Hey yes you can do the converion in the car. You will need a thin wall socket to get one of the nuts off. Plus the upper gear is pressed on so I just cut a slot in the top gear and cracked the gear to get it off. The nut will push it back in place. I tried the .871 5th gear and ran into the rpm limiter at around 140 mph with my 4.11 final drive trans. I installed the .78 5th gear in mine to stay off the limiter and still push me over 150. Depending on tire size and if you have the 3.90 final ratio you should be happy with your choice. The rpms don’t drop much when you shift into 5th now so I find myself double checking that I shifted.

With the top gear, do you think it will be possible to get a gear puller in there to pull it off?

I have the tallest final drive ratio, 3.70 so I think the shorter 0.825 will work great for me. Here is a chart showing the gear spreads.

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=90643&d=1533259199

[taco20]

With the top gear, do you think it will be possible to get a gear puller in there to pull it off?

I have the tallest final drive ratio, 3.70 so I think the shorter 0.825 will work great for me. Here is a chart showing the gear spreads.

https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=90643&d=1533259199



90646
90647

It is actually the lower gear that is pressed on. As you can see from my pics there is no real room to put a gear puller behind the gear. Plus with the shaft in the way it makes things even more difficult. Cutting the gear sucks but you have decided not to use the gear set anyway. With your short tire and tall final drive I think you will like the .825 ratio just fine.

[Hobby Racer]

It is actually the lower gear that is pressed on. As you can see from my pics there is no real room to put a gear puller behind the gear. Plus with the shaft in the way it makes things even more difficult. Cutting the gear sucks but you have decided not to use the gear set anyway. With your short tire and tall final drive I think you will like the .825 ratio just fine.

What tool did you use to cut the gear and in what location. It looks very close to the case so cutting in the teeth gullet seems risky. Also, how did you lock the gear set up to apply the torque to the nuts?

[taco20]

What tool did you use to cut the gear and in what location. It looks very close to the case so cutting in the teeth gullet seems risky. Also, how did you lock the gear set up to apply the torque to the nuts?

I just used a cutting wheel at an angle. I nicked the plate holding it in but not going to hurt anything.
Since it is still hooked to the motor just shove one of the shift levers in and put it in gear. Then use an impac wrench to take the nuts off. The aren't super tight. The big nut needs to be a thin wall sock other wise you have to grind down the tip of the socket until it fits. I believe it is a 35mm. I bought a cheap one form Autozone that worked fine.

[Hobby Racer]

@taco20

How did you get the big 50mm nut off? I have a 50MM socket but its no where near deep enough!

91462

[taco20]

91473

I bought a 50mm socket off the tool truck in 3/4 drive that just fits. Might find a 2" socket that is deep enough to do the job?
I could always mail you mine but shipping might cost more then a socket being shipped back and forth.

[Hobby Racer]

Ahh yes, the answer to most mechanical problems...buy more tools ;)

[Hobby Racer]

Here is my tale of transmission upgrade failure. It began simple enough. I wanted a shorter 5th gear as the step from 4th to 5th was too large and the car has trouble building speed down the long straights. No problem, Subaru's are like Lego's, all the pieces from different cars seem to fit together. So I did my research and found that a 2009 Outback when equipped with an EJ253 and a manual has a 5th gear ratio that will suit my needs. Great, I order the gear set and begin tearing my transmission apart. Initially it looked like I could just slide both the drive and driven gear off their shafts and replace them without removing the transmission from the car or splitting the case apart. A fellow builder has even done it this way. There is one catch, one of the gears is pressed on and needs to be cut and cracked in half to get it off. This seemed difficult but doable so I proceeded.

While I was waiting for the parts and tools I needed to arrive I thought I would try a different approach. I cut two slots in the gear teeth perpendicular to the shaft to allow me to get a gear puller attached to the gear.

92278 92279

Then I made a tools that fits over the tail shaft to give the puller something to push against (you can't push against the pinion shaft, you will ruin it).

92280 92281

Everything seemed to be working well. But after many attempts that darn gear would not budge. So now it looks like I will have to pull the suspension, remove the transmission, split the case do this the hard/right way :rolleyes:

[taco20]

Here is my tale of transmission upgrade failure. It began simple enough. I wanted a shorter 5th gear as the step from 4th to 5th was too large and the car has trouble building speed down the long straights. No problem, Subaru's are like Lego's, all the pieces from different cars seem to fit together. So I did my research and found that a 2009 Outback when equipped with an EJ253 and a manual has a 5th gear ratio that will suit my needs. Great, I order the gear set and begin tearing my transmission apart. Initially it looked like I could just slide both the drive and driven gear off their shafts and replace them without removing the transmission from the car or splitting the case apart. A fellow builder has even done it this way. There is one catch, one of the gears is pressed on and needs to be cut and cracked in half to get it off. This seemed difficult but doable so I proceeded.

While I was waiting for the parts and tools I needed to arrive I thought I would try a different approach. I cut two slots in the gear teeth perpendicular to the shaft to allow me to get a gear puller attached to the gear.

92278 92279

Then I made a tools that fits over the tail shaft to give the puller something to push against (you can't push against the pinion shaft, you will ruin it).

92280 92281

Everything seemed to be working well. But after many attempts that darn gear would not budge. So now it looks like I will have to pull the suspension, remove the transmission, split the case do this the hard/right way :rolleyes:



You have already used the cutting wheel on the gear so it is trash. Just turn the wheel to an angle and cut the gear. Once you get it cut and cracked your puller should take the gear off easy. So much wasted time and energy to remove the trans when 5 minutes of cutting and your done. More chances of something going wrong taking the trans apart then the effort to finish cutting it off.

[Hobby Racer]

You have already used the cutting wheel on the gear so it is trash. Just turn the wheel to an angle and cut the gear. Once you get it cut and cracked your puller should take the gear off easy. So much wasted time and energy to remove the trans when 5 minutes of cutting and your done. More chances of something going wrong taking the trans apart then the effort to finish cutting it off.

Did you use a cut off wheel like the one I used or did you use a small Dremel tool? It seems that the larger wheel I was using would be difficult to get close enough to the back of the gear without cutting into the bearing race. How deep did you go? I assume you left a bit of material on the gear when you got close the the shaft.

Also, how did you crack the gear? Did you use a small pry bar and twist. I don't think it would be good to hit it with anything, might damage the bearing.

[taco20]

Did you use a cut off wheel like the one I used or did you use a small Dremel tool? It seems that the larger wheel I was using would be difficult to get close enough to the back of the gear without cutting into the bearing race. How deep did you go? I assume you left a bit of material on the gear when you got close the the shaft.

Also, how did you crack the gear? Did you use a small pry bar and twist. I don't think it would be good to hit it with anything, might damage the bearing.


I used a cutter just like that one. I just cut at an angle, I did nick a few spots but nothing to worry about.
Use whatever you have that will cut it. A smaller wheel might help.

I used a chisel and hammer to hit the cut area to crack it. Might need to make several cuts to weaken the gear.
Could use an air hammer if you have one. I didn’t worry about the bearing and have had no issues since.

[Hobby Racer]

So the gear is finally off. I ended up cutting it vertically so I could get a good angle on it with my die grinder. This way I was able to cut nearly all the way through without gouging any other parts.

92493 92492

@taco20 How did you clean out all the grinding grit from the bearing behind the pressed on gear? The bearing is also pressed on so I can't simply remove it for cleaning.

[taco20]

So the gear is finally off. I ended up cutting it vertically so I could get a good angle on it with my die grinder. This way I was able to cut nearly all the way through without gouging any other parts.

92493 92492

@taco20 How did you clean out all the grinding grit from the bearing behind the pressed on gear? The bearing is also pressed on so I can't simply remove it for cleaning.


Great job I knew you could do it. Wasn’t that bad and saved all the time of pulling the trans apart.

I just used an air gun to blow all the stuff off. You could use cleaner and then blow through the bearing also. Then maybe add some fluid in the case and then drain it out if you are worried about the metal.

Once you get the gear started good on the shaft the nut should pull it the rest of the way up.
Then put it back together and hit the track. I am excited to hear about your results.

[Hobby Racer]

Cleaned up the bearing and got the pressed on gear installed! Tomorrow I'll put everything back together.

92625

@taco20 - did you try torquing the 50mm nut to 194 ft-lb or did you just seat the gear with the impact gun and nut and call it good?

[taco20]

Cleaned up the bearing and got the pressed on gear installed! Tomorrow I'll put everything back together.

92625

@taco20 - did you try torquing the 50mm nut to 194 ft-lb or did you just seat the gear with the impact gun and nut and call it good?



I just set the nut with the impact gun. I think I went until the same spots to be staked lined up.

[Hobby Racer]

Hah, I did the same thing. Its all back together now and ready for my next event at Watkins Glen at the end of the month. I'm really looking forward to see how the shorter gearing does on the long straights.

[Hobby Racer]

Thought I would post an update to let you know how the new close ratio 5th is working out. In a word, fantastic! The car now pulls hard all the way down the long straights at Watkins Glen. No bog when shifting from 4th to 5th. The RPM's drop ~1200 which is perfect to stay in the power band when pushing through the air at 120+ mph.

Definitely worth the effort :cool:

[bbjones121]

Nice to hear that it paid off. Any idea what the Subaru part numbers were for the mod? Thanks, Paul

[Hobby Racer]

Nice to hear that it paid off. Any idea what the Subaru part numbers were for the mod? Thanks, Paul

Yup, Subaru part #32315AA390. I posted details back on this post. Shorter 5th gear needed in the 5MT! (https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?23199-John-s-EZ36R-H6-818R-Build&p=334594&viewfull=1#post334594)

The part is no longer being made and is in short supply so get it before inventory runs out!

[Mitch Wright]

John what final drive are you using (4:44) and rear tire size? With the 3:90 ratio I am close to 135 in 4th at 6800. (04 WRX trans)
So far I have rarely had to use 5th but if I make a trip to someplace like Atlanta it would be useful.

[Hobby Racer]

I have the tallest final drive ratio (3.70) it came in the 06 WRX for one year only. I am running a 255x35x18 tire in the rear (~24.5" tall). I need to shift into 5th at around 120 MPH. I shift at ~6k right now as I am still fine tuning the ECU and not sure how far I can push it on stock internals. At 6K rpm in 5th I could hit 143 MPH theoretically, if I could push that much wind :D

[Mitch Wright]

I went back and looked at my data, at 7000 I see 134mph. The difference is the extra 1000rpm with the .972 4th gear.

[Sgt.Gator]

At Spokane Raceway in my Legacy GT Wagon I was hitting 150 mph at the end of the main straight. I expect The Ridge, PIR with no chicane, and Pacific to be close to that too in the 818R, so a taller 5th gear is needed around here.

[turbomacncheese]

At Spokane Raceway in my Legacy GT Wagon I was hitting 150 mph at the end of the main straight. I expect The Ridge, PIR with no chicane, and Pacific to be close to that too in the 818R, so a taller 5th gear is needed around here.

You're going 150 in a wagon? Where did I go wrong with my life choices?

[Sgt.Gator]

You're going 150 in a wagon? Where did I go wrong with my life choices?

It was built by the Subaru Road Race Team in 2006 for the Grand Am Cup. After I got it I modded it to make it faster...:

https://7qgvfa.by.files.1drv.com/y4mT-ggd0GHd1zBdM1FM8oa7pK4R32NfxxQAkPuFvJ-my15UfONqd8xQXcJsPTGn7dZlP0h0wa_fDVrS_oH1nd1h1lajg b2V0X5fevlm0mxJ2Aw-AfHNnv-jzKDOJm4xGLdxYYiXFZdZfFQgVQLbQJYX_gDAsBd1py-furyW4jKIzqhPP3xMlBTUIeWu2MfXZ90CdMdbA0KVQW5jif2mN cnIQ?width=965&height=682&cropmode=none

https://iidgpw.by.files.1drv.com/y4m3yQGIMZVSavFmfZmjnK2nhM_brWtLs65YnkFlOdOx06oZZZ vtC3wdqyz9fGCySuPtq_ha8xSOFu4-sv8eUbahlJc7br3Czvz-2Zh586PFAhWabc-NtFEWUAA5l6dQDiXQqTR0TH99aXjot9EKEGTj574f4xCcnToGu wUsQmStXbgyYzfbux-2rLWcqCe4XsbauUflX3Ca_-CJOPUmsPm1Q?width=1024&height=731&cropmode=none

There's a few "Race Wagons" now in the NW doing HPDE days. A couple are faster than this one because they have bigger turbos and no cage weight to slow them down.

[turbomacncheese]

just....nasty. And cool. Very cool.