Coyote won't start...drat.

[CalR80]

Hello guys,

I have my Mk4 to the "should start" phase and was all ready to post a triumphant start video.....alas, not so fast.:(

With the key turned to "on" I hear the fuel pump go on and I have 60+ lbs of pressure to the regulator. The "PCM" and "fuel pump" lights come on and when I turn to start the "start" light comes on the PCM. The engine cranks over quickly but does not want to start.

I have double checked the following:

The Neutral Safety Switch (blue/yellow) is well grounded.
The coyote 12v start/run (red/green) and (red/blue) wires are properly wired.
The blue clutch safety switch wires are connected together.
The coyote harness ground wire is run directly to the battery.
The gas pedal, MAF and O2 plugs are all on tight.
The battery is fully charged.

Any ideas or suggestions are welcome,

Thanks,

Dave

[johngeorge]

What year control pack?

[wareaglescott]

I have a 2015 coyote. From your description of the start light on the pcm I assume you have the earlier version so I would think this would still apply but not positive.
I was having an issue and Ford Racing tech support asked me to verify power was getting to the coils and injectors when the key was turned.
They said check one of the blue wires on the injectors which was found under the fuel rail and one of the violet wires on the ignition coil. If power is not getting there when the key is turned they said it was either a problem with the ignition switch or the switch was not wired properly.

My issue was the engine would crank but not fire. Sounds similar to yours. Hope that helps.

[walt mckenna]

Hello guys,

I have my Mk4 to the "should start" phase and was all ready to post a triumphant start video.....alas, not so fast.:(

With the key turned to "on" I hear the fuel pump go on and I have 60+ lbs of pressure to the regulator. The "PCM" and "fuel pump" lights come on and when I turn to start the "start" light comes on the PCM. The engine cranks over quickly but does not want to start.

I have double checked the following:

The Neutral Safety Switch (blue/yellow) is well grounded.
The coyote 12v start/run (red/green) and (red/blue) wires are properly wired.
The blue clutch safety switch wires are connected together.
The coyote harness ground wire is run directly to the battery.
The gas pedal, MAF and O2 plugs are all on tight.
The battery is fully charged.

Any ideas or suggestions are welcome,

Thanks,

Dave

As you progress with troubleshooting, keep in mind that the injectors have voltage on them all the time and the ECU switches the ground to fire the injector (at least it's that way on my Mach 1 engine). So, proper grounding of all components is essential. Check each grounding connection for continuity.

[johngeorge]

I have a 2015 coyote. From your description of the start light on the pcm I assume you have the earlier version so I would think this would still apply but not positive.
I was having an issue and Ford Racing tech support asked me to verify power was getting to the coils and injectors when the key was turned.
They said check one of the blue wires on the injectors which was found under the fuel rail and one of the violet wires on the ignition coil. If power is not getting there when the key is turned they said it was either a problem with the ignition switch or the switch was not wired properly.

My issue was the engine would crank but not fire. Sounds similar to yours. Hope that helps.

My problem was the engine would try to start then die. I had the MAF backwards in the spectre housing.. turned it around so it would actually sample air and that fixed my issue.

It sounds like yours isnt even trying to start.

[CalR80]

It is a new control pack (M-6017-A504A) for the 2011-2014 engines. I have a 2012.

[Railroad]

You might look into buying a noid light. You can hold it over an electrical device and get a response if it is getting current. I know there are a lot of flaws in that description, but hopefully it makes sense. I tried to find a link for the one that looks like a screw driver with a small flyswat on the end. You hold it over the device and it flashes if it gets a signal. The other kits you have to remove the feed wire and plug the light into each device.
Good luck,

I found a link to one, http://www.plusquip.com.au/products/test/eqp-016-ignition-quick-probe/

[mikepward]

Does the fuel rail on the coyote have a Schrader valve? IF so grab a paper towel to keep from making a mess, but ensure that you have fuel pressure in the rail. (If you hooked up your supply and return lines wrong, then you might have pressure at the pump, but not the rails)

I am a big fan of using starting fluid as a diagnostic tool on EFI engines. If it fires right off on ether, then you know you have a fuel supply problem. If nothing happens then you know you have a spark problem.

Just my 2 cents. I'm sure someone else will tell me if I am wrong.

[BEAR-AvHistory]

Be sure the ignition switch is wired properly. Run wire might be one terminal off. Happened to me :o

[CalR80]

As you progress with troubleshooting, keep in mind that the injectors have voltage on them all the time and the ECU switches the ground to fire the injector (at least it's that way on my Mach 1 engine). So, proper grounding of all components is essential. Check each grounding connection for continuity.

That you all for your suggestions, this forum is amazing.

I do in fact have fuel to the injector rail (thanks Mikepward) and after a dose of starting fluid it sounded like it caught for a 1/2 a second.

I have found that I have power to the coil packs but no power to the injectors (checked with a noid light). The Ford Racing guy has said the next step it to double check the grounds (thanks Walt McKenna). He said there should be a ground wire near the passenger front of the engine but I can't find one anywhere. I have two engine bay grounds that I know of. One is the black wire on the control pack wiring harness. I also have ground from the driver's side rear engine block to the FFR frame.
Can someone tell be about this passenger side front ground wire? My 2012 engine was a pull out and I am starting to wonder is a wire got pulled from the engine harness???

[Abgar]

To check if it's a groundwire issue make a wire between your engine and your batterie?
Perhaps you can read your OBDII?

[BEAR-AvHistory]

That you all for your suggestions, this forum is amazing.

I do in fact have fuel to the injector rail (thanks Mikepward) and after a dose of starting fluid it sounded like it caught for a 1/2 a second.

I have found that I have power to the coil packs but no power to the injectors (checked with a noid light). The Ford Racing guy has said the next step it to double check the grounds (thanks Walt McKenna). He said there should be a ground wire near the passenger front of the engine but I can't find one anywhere. I have two engine bay grounds that I know of. One is the black wire on the control pack wiring harness. I also have ground from the driver's side rear engine block to the FFR frame.
Can someone tell be about this passenger side front ground wire? My 2012 engine was a pull out and I am starting to wonder is a wire got pulled from the engine harness???

I have one of those wide ribbon type ground wires running straight down from an unused bolt hole on the front PS of the block to the main front chassis cross tube.

IIRC there was a pair of these wires was in the kit.

[Jazzman]

I have double checked the following:

The Neutral Safety Switch (blue/yellow) is well grounded.
The coyote 12v start/run (red/green) and (red/blue) wires are properly wired.
The blue clutch safety switch wires are connected together.
The coyote harness ground wire is run directly to the battery.
The gas pedal, MAF and O2 plugs are all on tight.
The battery is fully charged.


Just a thought on the clutch switches. There are two of them, a fully depressed clutch signal and a fully engaged clutch signal. Do you have them both hooked up, both adjusted to give the right signal, and is the switch that senses that the clutch is fully depressed getting to the bottom of it's stroke? If you just wired the two blue RF clutch sensor wires together in an attempt to bypass the clutch safety switch, I think the PCM will not allow the engine to start. Others may have greater depth of knowledge on this issue.

*** EDIT *** Upon re-reading your thread, it doesn't sound like this is the issue because your engine does turn over. Not a bad Idea to check it just in case though.

[Railroad]

I have used jumper leads for temporary grounds. I am still trying to find out why my juke box plays better when an electrical board is swung out of its mount. You might make up a batch and double up the ECU, engine, frame and battery grounds.
Good luck,
Might also check the pins on the F inj harness.

[CalR80]

I've been looking at some pictures of some coyote engine harnesses on eBay in search of my missing ground. There are a couple of pictures showing a wire coming out of the harness near the front right corner of the engine. It has a square terminal end on it. Can someone confirm that is a ground wire?

[H R Lucky]

Cal,
I have a 2011 Coyote pulled from a wrecked Mustang (saw a video of it running before they pulled it) I has the same symptoms as you are having, I had power to the injectors but no grounds were being sent from the PCM. This whole chain of events is kicked off by the crank trigger (magnetic sensor on back of crank, access through bell housing)
After replacing my crank position sensor, (Ford p/n BR3Z-6C315-A) it still didn't fire the injectors, my problem was a bunch of broken wires in the 70 pin connector (engine wiring harness) I think they used a crow bar or similar to remove the engine & punctured the harness, after removing the wrapping I could see the broken wires, soldered the wires and heat shrinked them, reconnected the 70 pin connector & it started on the first turn of the key. I would guess that your problem is a defective crankshaft position sensor or a busted wire in the harness.
I tried to attach the the pin out for connector C175E the crankshaft position sensor is pin 13 - yellow/violet wire, but the attachment is too large, send me your email and i will send it to you..

here's a link to my build page/wire problem - http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?9383-Lucky-s-33-Hot-Rod-build-524&p=200206&viewfull=1#post200206

Nevin

[FFinisher]

I've been looking at some pictures of some coyote engine harnesses on eBay in search of my missing ground. There are a couple of pictures showing a wire coming out of the harness near the front right corner of the engine. It has a square terminal end on it. Can someone confirm that is a ground wire?

Yes this is a ground wire.

[ckrueger]

That was a ground on my Coyote. Mine was the previous version, not the 2015.

[CalR80]

That was a ground on my Coyote. Mine was the previous version, not the 2015.

Thanks FFinisher and ckureger, I suspected as much. Now to just figure out where it WAS in the engine harness and graft one back in.

To H R Lucky, I think my harness was manhandled a bit too when they pulled the engine out of the 2012 Mustang. I will check the 70 pin connector also. My email is: r80tm@yah**.com

[clancypm]

I had the same problem. I have a 96 4.6 4V. My engine has both a cam sensor and a crank shaft sensor. The cam sensor was connected but the crank sensor was not. Once I connected both sensors I had spark and it started right up.Make sure that both are connected.

[FFinisher]

This ground would be part of the new Harness in the Ford Control Pack. If I recall it would be about 8 inches from the connectors for the PCM.