Factory five builder

[Hottrodder427]

Am I crazy to think I could build these cars for a job? My build has been an eye opener. I am about two or three weeks from completion. I am sad, the build is my favorite part. I feel like this is a calling. I've noticed the majority of builders are north east, do you think southeast would work??? If I've posted in the wrong spot please tell me where to post

[seagull81]

Hi Rodder,
Here is a good place to post also there is the Central Forum on this site. Also ffcars.com and clubcobra.com. You should be able to find Cobra folks near your area.

[jimgood]

If I'm a buyer, I want to know the credentials of the builder. What makes you an expert and why should I trust you with my life and my hard earned money? Because it comes down to that. How many cars have you built? How many satisfied customers do you have? What are your standards for quality? How do you stand behind your product?

They guys with whom you're competing in this space have been building for years. They have created a reputation. You have built one(?) car.

[wareaglescott]

Seems to me that you can generally buy one of these much cheaper than you can build a comparable one. Seems like it would be hard to make much if any money doing it as a one man operation. I figure drivers of these fall into two groups. 1. Guys like me that want to build it myself. & 2. Guys that just want to have a fun car to drive. There are plenty of those available for sale already.
Probably a small number of potential buyers and then as the previous poster mentioned you would have to somehow establish your reputation as a quality builder.
Lots of obstacles. With that being said if it is something you are passionate about don't let people talk you out of it and give it a go.

[UnhipPopano]

I agree that if building these cars is something you are passionate about, this is something you can pursue, but go into it with your eyes open. Do not give up your day job and develop your street credibility by being involved with shows and events. Cars that you build will only be worth more than the value of the parts if your name on it adds value. Have fun developing relationships with suppliers, as turning the wrench is only one small part of the process. Expect that any payback that you may see will be at least a couple years down the road and do not set unreasonable expectations that selling the cars is easy and takes none of your time.

[Hottrodder427]

Thanks for all the answers, as far as my credentials. I'm just a gear head who has a passion for cars. I've been a trim carpenter for my whole life 28 years. This is the first roadster I've built, but I have taken an 81 c10 step side tore it completely down and rebuilt the whole thing. Rebuilt the engine, turbo 350, rear end meaning set the gears and installed the posi. Welded new floor pans, fixed the windshield pillars with the old doors as sheet metal. And then the stage pearl white paint. My truck is the talk at the local shows. I work 6 days a week, and I will have this car completed befor the three month mark including paint. And all the guys that have been building for years... They started with one cat as well

[dallas_]

If you are asking if you can do it for your primary source of income, well.... that would be difficult at best.
If you are asking if you can make a little bit of money doing it on the side, that is more likely.
Like the others have said, many cars sell for less than the cost of the parts. So sourcing unfinished kits and good quality parts at significant discounts would help you be able to do it at a profit. It can be done but it ain't easy. Just go into it with your eyes open and know the challenges.

[Duke]

You're expenses (material/kit/parts cost) + (hours to complete x your labor rate) = N. Figure how many cars you need to turn a year to make your nut, then figure you need to be able to find however many people each year that will spend 'N' with you to meet your base cost of living. Chances are you will need to turn at least 3-6 cars at 80-100K per car to stay in the black (assuming down time/no work, backlogs/too much work and having to hire help, insurance, marketing, and all your associated business taxes).

[Hottrodder427]

Xtra income for now. But I am planning on restoring cars full time roadster factory five is a bonus

[jimgood]

There are plenty of guys that do this in their spare time. Not saying you can't or shouldn't. Just giving one buyer's perspective.

Hell, I would do it if I had the skills and space. Would be WAY more satisfying than being an IT consultant.

[WIS89]

Hotrodder-

There are probably a number of ways to get started in the type of endeavor, and there are probably a number of options that may work for you. However, my hunch is that a good place to start is to build a car on contract for a specific person. In other words (and painting with a very broad brush here), work with an individual to spec out the car that he/she desires, with all the bells and whistles sorted, with a price and time frame agreed upon. Then build the car, with payments agreed upon per milestone(s) to ensure you have some capital to keep you going. If that all works, you have just started your learning process.

I suspect that finding someone that admires your car and who wishes to have their own won't be hard. Finding someone that has the means and desire to have you build one for them is a bit harder, but not impossible. I suspect there are folks that you can find that this agreement would work for them.

Like I said, there are a number of different ways to make this work, but I think this may present the least risk to you. I am sure there are others that have differing ideas, and some that may violently disagree with my crude assessment. However, I thought I would share a basic idea that can be honed more finely if you desire.

Whatever your decision, please share some pictures of your build so we can see your work. Good luck as you move forward!

Regards,

Steve

[GoDadGo]

I've seen HOTTRODDER's work and he's got the skills and the speed.
He'll likely be painting mine after I finally get it going.

[Jeff Kleiner]

...a good place to start is to build a car on contract for a specific person. In other words (and painting with a very broad brush here), work with an individual to spec out the car that he/she desires, with all the bells and whistles sorted, with a price and time frame agreed upon. Then build the car, with payments agreed upon per milestone(s)...

That's how I operate. I don't build on speculation.

Jeff

[Hottrodder427]

That's how I wanted to start, I have a guy that is intrested in mine now. I going to try and contract one for him

[Gumball]

You should speak with a qualified attorney and insurance agent before being paid by someone to build a car they will operate.

Since I began my build, I've had two people inquire (quite seriously) as to whether I would build one for them - in both instances the answer was an emphatic "no."

[Hottrodder427]

As far as liability? For them crashing the car?

[GoDadGo]

He's talking about assembly defects and legal ramifications that could place you at financial risk.
If you go down this path, then it is advisable to set up a separate L.L.C. if you decide to create another business.

[WIS89]

As far as liability? For them crashing the car?

Yes and no. Chris' point, and I hope he forgives me for trying to speak on his behalf, is that if something should happen -- a mechanical failure perhaps, that the liability could come back to you! This situation could be an absolute disaster for you financially!

A good attorney, with insight from an insurance agent could help you structure a contract to help you limit your liability in case something should happen to someone operating a vehicle you built. There are a number of ways to structure this type of document to indemnify you, and you should research this carefully before you take on a project. Structuring a company the right way can also shield you from liability to an extent as well. Again, the right attorney can help with this!

If someone gets in an accident that had nothing to do with the way the car was built, you should have nothing to worry about. That may not stop someone from trying to reach out to you for liability, it just means they shouldn't be successful. Once again, a good attorney will ensure you are protected here.

I don't think anyone is trying to scare you away from taking this on (most of us anyway). I think most of us just want to ensure you are careful about how you proceed.

Good luck!

Regards,

Steve

[Hottrodder427]

I appreciate all the advice for sure. I'm still wanting to go for the gold. I'm going to look at a 65 thunderbird with a factory 390 today

[Hottrodder427]

i just added photos on my build thread

[unrealmach1]

I have always wanted to something like that too, but I know I could never cut it with mine own shop. I don't think I could turn enough cars to make a living, but lots of people have done it and been successful. I guess you never know until you try, but do your research and be prepared and persistent.

How was the T-bird?

[Hottrodder427]

Rescheduled for tomorrow,too much rain this afternoon. The wife wants it so it will prob be a new project

[unrealmach1]

I have always liked that style T-Bird, especially in convertible.

[AC Bill]

You should call and have a chat with Mark Dougherty, about the various considerations needed for doing that type of work. He has been travelling around the country for a number of years, building or help with building, FFR's. He seems to be in constant demand, but then he's been working on cars for 30 years.
http://www.thetravelingbuilder.com/wordpress/


There are also few who build them and sell them, as a source of income. To do that, you would need to buy everything at wholesale, and not expect a large dollar per hour wage. If you could turn over enough cars a year, you could probably do it for a living. Least you'd be doing something you like..

[BEAR-AvHistory]

Think shopping for partially assembled, abandoned kits might be the best shot you have at getting inexpensive parts. Very few one off cars sell for more than the retail cost of the parts. At auction this week mid/upper $30K looks like a sweet spot for used ones. Outside of finish & paint engine choice is a very big cost variable in assembling one of these cars.

If a partial build is without a motor a clean low end crate engine, with a factory warranty from FORD, might be better time wise & as a selling feature over a junk yard version that needs to be cleaned, dressed & possibly repaired.

[David Hodgkins]

I'm looking to be able to do this as well, but strictly for California folks on a contract-to-build basis only. Not on spec. Best of luck to you if you decide to go for it.

:)

[mikeinatlanta]

Two things to consider.

I have the facility, equipment, and capability and would not even consider it. I have visited enough of the builders and see just how hard they have to work for the $$ and just don't see it as being worth it. Even the most established builders aren't getting rich doing this. Part of the issue being that within this industry, the FFR isn't considered at the high end of the spectrum and commands less money than other kits. Problem being that parts are parts and this perception will come right off your bottom line. Not saying the FFR is less a car, but they do command less $$ than several others.

Next issue: I used to race mountain bikes. Everyone was always having me build their bikes, wheels, etc. I decided to open up a bike shop and it about ruined my hobby for me. Many of my "friends" couldn't seem to remember that I was in business to support my family and wanted constant freebies in the form of field repairs and hours, and hours, and hours of free advice. Next was that nobody wants their crap fixed when times are slow, everyone waited until the sun was shining and it was time to go ride. I missed many group rides and trips because I was too busy repairing and building bikes for the very people I used to go with.

Anyone considering this should go to Gordon's shop, sit with him for a while, and listen to how many phone calls he takes giving advice to people who will ultimately spend their money somewhere else to save a penny. I couldn't do it.

[GoDadGo]

Donnie,

You are already self employed and have proven that you more than capable of feeding yourself, your family and your kid's friends through your own brains and brawn, so I say why not try.

My recommendation is to build a car that you like, but don't go overboard on customization or off beat power plants, then sell it for a profit. Once you get to the point of having two completed cars in your stable (Paid In Full Of Course) then don't build another until one has been sold.

While a full time living wage may not be possible, a for profit hobby is more than within your reach. From a Banker's point of view, having income from multiple sources is always a plus.

Steve

[Hottrodder427]

Thanks godadgo, I am going to make it a hobby/income thing