Wheels/Rear-end Choices

[hmoody98]

Ok so still doing a bit of research here. Currently my plan is to get my running gear from a 1999-2004 GT (possibly a Mach 1 if I can find the right deal).

I would REALLY like the option if at all possible to run 17x10.5 wheels in the rear. From what I understand, that isn't possible without custom wheels using that rear end. So, if I am a stickler to that wheel size, how difficult would it be to get the GT rear end down to the fox width? And would it be cheaper than sourcing a rear end from a fox/doing a 5-lug conversion/disc brake swap/changing gears up to 3.27 or 3.55 (pref.)?

Which brings me to the FFR 3-link rear end. Is it the fox width? My ultimate goal is to have this setup in the rear. So if I have the 4-link from the donor cut down to fox width, would it be just a matter of swapping all the guts from my 4-link into the 3-link?

Thanks in advance guys!

[Jeff Kleiner]

The 3 link is designed for Fox width. Least expensive option is probably going to be to use a Fox or '94-'98 housing (they are the same) along with a pair of axles and caliper relocation brackets.

Jeff

[GoDadGo]

Ok so still doing a bit of research here. Currently my plan is to get my running gear from a 1999-2004 GT (possibly a Mach 1 if I can find the right deal).

I would REALLY like the option if at all possible to run 17x10.5 wheels in the rear. From what I understand, that isn't possible without custom wheels using that rear end. So, if I am a stickler to that wheel size, how difficult would it be to get the GT rear end down to the fox width? And would it be cheaper than sourcing a rear end from a fox/doing a 5-lug conversion/disc brake swap/changing gears up to 3.27 or 3.55 (pref.)?

Which brings me to the FFR 3-link rear end. Is it the fox width? My ultimate goal is to have this setup in the rear. So if I have the 4-link from the donor cut down to fox width, would it be just a matter of swapping all the guts from my 4-link into the 3-link?

Thanks in advance guys!

I've got a Moser TSD-500 rear in my MK-4 and the 3rd link is welded in place.

It is very affordable at $1,900.00, plus the cost of brakes and maybe powder coating, but it is an exact fit from a width perspective.
In addition, you can use Ford Explorer disk brakes, which makes it a snap to install the parking brake cables.
The big issue is that the drive shaft must be shortened by about 1.5" so pinion angle gets even more pronounced when the chassis is unloaded.
While this is not an issue for my project, because my engine has been moved forward few inches, it is an issue that needs to be taken into account.

Good Luck & Have A Great Build!

Steve

PS: It's a Dana 44 Style Case, Not A Ford 8.8.

[CraigS]

I strongly agree w/ your thoughts on 10.5 wheels and on having the correct width axle. This gets you a huge assortment of wheels made for Mustangs so the price is great too. As Jeff says the 94-98 housing is the right width and does give you disc brakes assuming you buy the whole thing. 93 and older are also the right width but have drum brakes and I think most are 4 lug. Depending on finances go w/ the 94-98 axles and brackets as Jeff says. This will get you a running axle that will accept the wheels you want. Gears and limited slips can be done later if you need to delay costs. Be aware that FFR sells the 3 link kit for $599 so you can add that to any axle you buy. I don't see the complete axle listed so not sure about that. Another option is this although Moser says you buy it through FFR
http://www.moserengineering.com/complete-rear-end-assemblies/part-ffr88331-3-8-8-ford-3-link-complete-rear-axle-assembly-for-factory-five-cars.html

[hmoody98]

Ok now in the FFR build manual, it says the 94-98 rear end width is 61.125" vs the 87-93 59.25"...so is that not accurate? Or are you guys just saying that the 94-98 width is still narrow enough to allow for the 10.5" rear wheel width?

I am just trying to plan things out and the more and more I look into this, the more I am thinking going these lines for my build...

Buy a 302 SBF out of a junkyard car and rebuild it (muscle mustangs and fast fords did this exact thing for just a hair over $1,000 by reusing some existing parts and replacing the cam/heads/intake and then doing some trading for a used holley 750...I could possibly do something similar). Buy a rebuilt T-5 or perhaps a 3650 out of a parts car if I can find one in the right situation, and then buy a complete 3-link from FFR/Moser.

[Jeff Kleiner]

Ok now in the FFR build manual, it says the 94-98 rear end width is 61.125" vs the 87-93 59.25"...so is that not accurate? Or are you guys just saying that the 94-98 width is still narrow enough to allow for the 10.5" rear wheel width?



No. Here's the deal; axle flange to axle flange the '94-'98 is wider by about 1 1/2" The housing is the same width as the '93 and earlier Fox body rear ends; all of the extra length is in the axles outside of the housing. Richard Oben at North Racecars can set you up with shorter axle shafts and caliper relocation brackets to bring a '94-'98 rearend to Fox body width which will allow you to use the wider wheels and tires without issues.

http://www.northracecars.com/Brakes.html

The '99 and later rears are wider still and use a different housing that has to be cut, machined and welded then be fitted with the shorter axle shafts and caliper brackets to end up at Fox width which will be significantly more costly.

Rebuild a junkyard 302 with new heads/cam/intake for "a hair over $1,000"? You'll have to sprinkle it with a lot of unicorn tears to make that happen... :rolleyes:

Jeff

[hmoody98]

Ok that makes much more sense, thanks a bunch guys! I was actually just about to ask the question about the housing differences from an older thread I had found.

http://www.mustangandfords.com/how-to/engine/mmfp-0910-building-400hp-into-a-5-0-l-small-block-engine/

That's the article I had read about that rebuilt 302. Not saying I would be able to remotely pull it off that cheap, but even if its under 2 grand that's a lot cheaper than any 302 crate with ~350hp I have found so far.

[Chip997]

This ebay store sells reconditioned mustang rear ends for FFR cars. You can choose your gearing and also 28 or 31 spline.
http://stores.ebay.com/MPSAUTOSALVAGE/_i.html?_nkw=factory+five&submit=Search&_sid=306688170

On the idea of getting a used 302 and thinking you can build it for under $1k. That thinking worked for me until I took it to the local hot rod machine shop to have them check the block for cracks. While it was there I figured I should have it bored .30 over, machine the crank and install all new bearings, pistons etc. Plus check the new used heads i got off ebay. I think I spent over $1400 there and that didn't include intake, carb or any other accessories. I guess it depends on how much work you can do yourself to save $$.

[CraigS]

Here is my idea of a better engine more or less cheaply. Find a 351 after researching which years would be the best and that way you have the basis for very easy upgrades. The stock crank and rods are easily good for 500 hp because they are one size up from the 302 internals as are all the bolts and nuts. The 351 headers and intake are different from a 302, so, if you start w/ 351 you will be ahead of the game at the start and also later on.

[jloehlein]

If you do end up buying a 99-04 car, another option is to get someone to narrow your housing and order fox-length axles. I did this with my '95 rear axle in order to keep ABS - we narrowed the housing 3/4" on each side and ordered fox-length axles with ABS rings on them. Drag racers do this all the time and I think I paid $150 + the cost of axles. Something to consider.

[hmoody98]

The idea of going the mps route is interesting. That's $3500 for a full engine/new clutch/rebuilt t5....it wouldn't take a whole lot fo money to turn that 225hp 302 into something closer to the 300hp range/convert to carbed. Although I have concerns personally about a T5 holding up. They were only intended to hold right at 300 fl-lbs and thats what the 302 had in it in stock form. While it won't ever see a drag strip, I do intend to autocross/hpde/etc the car and don't want to be replacing the transmission 2 months into the completed car.

I had initially thought that going the donor route would be best but I am starting to think otherwise. I already have to run FFR's front control arms to fit the 17x9's in the front, and the FFR 3-link with 3.55's is a hard deal to pass up during the 50/50 sales. So maybe just trying to find an engine/transmission combo I can get myself happy with, then doing the complete kit is really the way to go.

[cgundermann]

I had my rear end built up by MPS Autosalvage; good people. They powder coated my axle in silver vein, converted to 5 lug, Cobra discs, 3:55 gears installed and Boss differential cover. Very happy with their buildup and customer service.

[hmoody98]

I have ended up going with a 98 GT that had a complete 98 Cobra drivetrain swap (minus the cobra brakes...which I may upgrade. I ran across a deal I didn't really think I could pass up. If I change my mind, I definitely may use MPS for the rear end (the car as it sits would need axles/brake caliper relocation kit from North Racecars...it has 4.10s which I am not a huge fan of but it'll get me on the road...the rear end also has less than 50k miles on it).

[CraigS]

You are right 410s is way too much. But, OTOH, to leave a stop light just let out the clutch. I will also run 5th gear down to about 40 mph. All the talk about rear gears is fine for when you decide to swap them but for now it will get you rolling.

[6t8dart]

If you do end up buying a 99-04 car, another option is to get someone to narrow your housing and order fox-length axles. I did this with my '95 rear axle in order to keep ABS - we narrowed the housing 3/4" on each side and ordered fox-length axles with ABS rings on them. Drag racers do this all the time and I think I paid $150 + the cost of axles. Something to consider.

I like this option because I am running a 95 Rear end with then ABS, so I wanted to keep the rings. I have also found a source for Halibrand style wheels, 18 x 9.5" with a +38 (6.8" BS) that makes up the difference in axle width and allowing me to run an 18" tire. I plan on 255's front and 285's rear.

[GoDadGo]

Purchased My Wheels From:

WWW.OEWHEELSLLC.COM

> Front wheels are 17 x 9's up front with 17 x 10's out back.
> Front back spacing 6.0"
> Rear back spacing is 6.25"
> Tires Are Nitto 555's
> 245-45-17 front
> 285-40-17 rear

I'm not looking for a real aggressive stance, so that's the reason for staying a bit smaller on the rear than most fellows.

[hmoody98]

You guys running 9" wheels up front, are you guys running the FFR tubular control arms?

[GoDadGo]

I am running the tubular A-arms and the Factory Five Spindle.
Front brakes are stock Mustang, rear is a Moser 3 Link set up with Explorer disks.
I ordered a complete kit since I had no Mustang to pillage.

[feadam]

If the housing length is the same for the 87-95 housings are there any advantages to any year housings. If you are going to start with an empty housing can you just add the same brake bracket and axles for disc brakes as you would use in the 94-95 housings

[CraigS]

You can easily run 9x17s up front w/ full Fox donor LCAs and spindle. I know, because I have. The inside edge of the wheel will contact the outer lower lip of the LCA at the front when steering is full lock. Either bang the crap out of it w/ a sledge hammer or grind some metal away. Those LCAs are way over built for an FFR so you can't really hurt them. There are two disadvantages. 1- you don't have the best current suspension geometry and 2- upgrading to the FFR LCAs is a simple bolt-on process. But upgrading to the SN95 or FFR spindles requires replacing all the brakes too. Not hard to do just expensive.