side louvres

[chopthebass]

I have tidied up the FFR cut louver holes, but they are still a fair bit smaller than the template in the manual. Do they need to be as big as the template?

[Jeff Kleiner]

Which louvers are you using? The standard flat "bend 'em yourself" louvers are much larger than the openings so the body cutout isn't critical as long as the lines are straight with parallel sides. If you are using their upgraded pre-formed variety as shown below you need to cut and shape the openings to match them...the FFR cuts are neither the proper angle or size.

http://cdn2.bigcommerce.com/server1500/6661c/products/456/images/654/**********_louvers__50303.1395778678.1280.1280.jpg ?c=2

Cheers,
Jeff

[Gumball]

I used the ********** louvers - see Jeff's pics above - and spent quite a bit of time fitting them to the openings. FFR did the cutouts and left just a slight lip, but I removed that almost completely and then rounded the opening so that it looked more like the original cars' aluminum skin. I also noticed that the cutout shape wasn't quite right - the leading and trailing edges were at different angles - so I did a little massaging to get them to follow the angle of the louver vanes.

Here's a link to my bodywork thread - there are quite a few posts about the louver fitment work....

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?7645-Chris-Bodywork-Thread-Mk3-1&highlight=chris%27+bodywork

[Jeff Kleiner]

Chris and others,
As an FYI, I've used them from both sources and the optional upgraded louvers that FFR now sells are identical to **********'s right down to the packaging. I have a pretty good idea where they get them ;)

Jeff

[mikeinatlanta]

My aero mods required a larger set of louvers similar to the early race cobras. I had a set custom cut by Shane At Vraptor and they are very nice, but different. He can make them any size and shape you like. I chose a mounting that is more secure than most.
52932
52933
52934
52935

[chopthebass]

Some great info here. Are the original bend 'em type no good? I've not even looked at them yet!

[mikeinatlanta]

Like everything else on these cars, they are fine right up until you see the expensive ones you like better.

[Avalanche325]

Like everything else on these cars, they are fine right up until you see the expensive ones you like better.
LOL. That is SOOOOO true.

The ********** ones are MUCH nicer. One thing that I personally think is important, looks-wise. Make sure that the angle of the opening matches the angle of the louvers. I never even opened the FFR ones, but that angle that was marked on my body was different than the ********** louvers. So, decide what you are using before you do final cutting.

[chopthebass]

Think I will order some ********** ones. The look really nice.

[Gumball]

Not the best photo, but this sort of shows the angles and how thin I made the edge.....

http://i845.photobucket.com/albums/ab15/CCRsAC/IMG_20140906_170331100_zps528b3ed3.jpg (http://s845.photobucket.com/user/CCRsAC/media/IMG_20140906_170331100_zps528b3ed3.jpg.html)

[BEAR-AvHistory]

Same units, mine sourced & painted by Whitby. The units are held in with industrial Velcro. Thought the time might come when I need another access point to the engine compartment.

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=13669&pictureid=53548

[chopthebass]

I like the velco idea.

[JC Of NM]

The real question is painted or unpainted?

[Gumball]

Chop - Mine are also removable, but I used body panel adhesive to secure the mounting tabs, then small button head screws to secure the louvers...

JC - The louvers on the original cars by AC were painted, but many elect to do satin or polished finish.

You can see the lower bracket in this pic.....

http://i845.photobucket.com/albums/ab15/CCRsAC/IMG_20140308_153920353_HDR_zps1f5b8462.jpg (http://s845.photobucket.com/user/CCRsAC/media/IMG_20140308_153920353_HDR_zps1f5b8462.jpg.html)

And here is one that shows the button head screws before I hit each of them with a bit of touch-up paint so that they blend in....

http://i845.photobucket.com/albums/ab15/CCRsAC/SideLouverDriver_zpsd7127c3f.jpg (http://s845.photobucket.com/user/CCRsAC/media/SideLouverDriver_zpsd7127c3f.jpg.html)

[BEAR-AvHistory]

Another good removable solution is to bond studs to the body & bolt them in.

[Jeff Kleiner]

Not really a believer in the Velcro method; I've seen louvers fall off after heat from the headers below has softened/melted the adhesive on the strips of Velcro.


Another good removable solution is to bond studs to the body & bolt them in.

That's kind of how I do them. I use a 1/4" elevator bolt bonded to the body...

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj43/jkleiner/Fred%20J/100_5310.jpg

...and a 90 degree bracket riveted to the top of the louvers:

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj43/jkleiner/Fred%20J/100_5313.jpg

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj43/jkleiner/Fred%20J/100_5317.jpg

I bond a full length 90 degree "shelf" below:

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj43/jkleiner/Fred%20J/100_5307.jpg

To install the louvers the bottom gets a bead of silicone and the top gets a nut and washer to hold it to the bolt. Some I have painted body color and others stay raw or get polished---owner's choice.

Jeff

[chopthebass]

What materials do you need to bond aluminum to fiberglass? Can you just use the resin and overlap some matting?

[mikeinatlanta]

3m 08115 panel bonding adhesive (epoxy) is very good, but I prefer 3m 08273 (Urethane). The epoxy theoretically gives a stronger bond, but the urethane is more flexible and as a result has greater resistance to vibration and flex causing a disbond. Either will be so far beyond just resin or JB weld that they are not comparable.

[Jeff Kleiner]

Mike is the expert on composites but I use 3M HSRF.

Jeff

[Gumball]

I used Norton Speedgrip adhesive - it's a two-part product that is applied using their gun and a mixing tip....

http://i845.photobucket.com/albums/ab15/CCRsAC/IMG_20130712_0753581_zps293900bd.jpg (http://s845.photobucket.com/user/CCRsAC/media/IMG_20130712_0753581_zps293900bd.jpg.html)

[mikeinatlanta]

Mike is the expert on composites but I use 3M HSRF.

Jeff

HSRF is fine for things like perforated base studs, but has poor bond strength to aluminum, and poor flexibility if the aluminum is the least bit flexible.


I used Norton Speedgrip adhesive - it's a two-part product that is applied using their gun and a mixing tip....

http://i845.photobucket.com/albums/ab15/CCRsAC/IMG_20130712_0753581_zps293900bd.jpg (http://s845.photobucket.com/user/CCRsAC/media/IMG_20130712_0753581_zps293900bd.jpg.html)

Most likely that is a urethane, but would need to see the tube numbers to know for sure. Urethane is ideal when bonding metal parts to fiberglass. Only real drawbacks are that they can't take huge heat (neither can the vinylester), and urethane doesn't take paint well.

[chopthebass]

3m 08115 panel bonding adhesive (epoxy) is very good, but I prefer 3m 08273 (Urethane). The epoxy theoretically gives a stronger bond, but the urethane is more flexible and as a result has greater resistance to vibration and flex causing a disbond. Either will be so far beyond just resin or JB weld that they are not comparable.

Thanks. So you would just apply the 3M to the aluminum bracket, and hold in place with tape?

[mikeinatlanta]

Yep, except I would suggest lightly clamped rather than tape. Not to be picky, but that tape is some evil stuff. It waits until you aren't looking then moves. When you come back it sits there all innocent looking while your part is permanently in the wrong position. Don't buy into the idea of duck tape being your friend either, they're all in it together.

[chopthebass]

ha ha! Thanks Mike.

[Gumball]

I made a pair of clamps out of a cut-up yard stick and a long bolt with a wing nut. Drill a hole in each piece at an angle that allows the bolt to pass through the louvers and then attach the brackets to the louvers, apply goo, and clamp in place. When done, you can remove the louvers for the rest of the bodywork and paint, then easily reassemble.

http://i845.photobucket.com/albums/ab15/CCRsAC/IMG_20130618_220516_zps4624e834.jpg (http://s845.photobucket.com/user/CCRsAC/media/IMG_20130618_220516_zps4624e834.jpg.html)

http://i845.photobucket.com/albums/ab15/CCRsAC/Installed1_zpsa95a250c.jpg (http://s845.photobucket.com/user/CCRsAC/media/Installed1_zpsa95a250c.jpg.html)

[rmiller64]

Used bonding studs from McMaster Carr and HSRF on the ********** brand which is the same ones FFR sells

530405304153042

[BEAR-AvHistory]

Have not gotten around to install them yet but my studs look like this:

http://www.sdproducts.co.uk/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/500x500/d54a3cdb12bdf826d7d15d26d584ea15/t/h/threaded-stud-on-octagonal-base-plate.jpg

[WIS89]

Yep, except I would suggest lightly clamped rather than tape. Not to be picky, but that tape is some evil stuff. It waits until you aren't looking then moves. When you come back it sits there all innocent looking while your part is permanently in the wrong position. Don't buy into the idea of duck tape being your friend either, they're all in it together.

I hope I am not derailing the thread too badly, but Mike, that is some funny stuff right there!!

Too funny!

Regards,

Steve

[Ronin]

This is awesome!