View Full Version : Byron's HR Build #890
First things first, thank you everyone on this forum and FFR's for all your wisdom, knowledge, passion and love for cars. With out these forums and the people that take their time to post I would not have felt comfortable building this machine. That being said I hope and encourage all to question everything that I am doing, and express their opinion freely so that I can build the best Hot Rod possible. I received the complete kit on March 6th, Stewart shipping was nothing but professional and prompt. Jim from stewart Helped unload and was very friendly. Here is the plan for the car (as of now).
-Ac/Heat
- e-power steering
-IRS
-Wilwood front and rear
- Hard top, No fenders
- Coyote crate w/2.9 whipple
- T-56 Mag
- Infinity wiring??(still debating)
- Boyd tank with A-1000 in tank pump
As of now I have the chassis powder coated, the IRS center section and the pedal assembly bolted in. It seems there is one key piece missing (backordered) from each part of the install so Im kinda winging it everyday. Next I need to figure out front and rear suspension arms as far as coating or plating them, Im thinking I like the brushed/antique nickel plating..... Then I need to get the body back on and set the firewall and find center. Even after reading "Dangerous Curves Ahead" Im still unsure the best way to find center but I'm sure I will work it out. Lastly can someone explain how to post the big pictures instead of the links? Thanks again everyone, Im excited to start this journey.
H R Lucky
03-26-2016, 05:51 PM
Byron,
welcome to the fun & sometime frustration but mostly fun. Congratulations, sounds like you are building a high performance Hot Rod.
Where are you from?
I only know how to post the thumbnails but they do get bigger when you click on them, and that's by clicking on the go advanced button in the lower right, then click on the manage attachments button, here is an example:
Nevin
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Nevin, I live in Los Angeles but I am originally from Utah.
Been working here and there. I have decided to drill and tap all the sheet metal in the floors and trunk area, this takes a little longer but I am in no hurry. I also decided to paint the front and rear suspension parts my self. I originally wanted to get them all plated with brushed nickel finish. After prepping the front arms for platting I realized how much I liked the bare metal look. I did some research and found that almost everyone says the metal will eventually rust underneath the clear coat. I decided I would try it anyway, if it does rust in the future then off they will go to a plater. First I cleaned each piece thoroughly, then to get the look I wanted I used a wire brush. After cleaning them again I put down three coats of adhesion enhancer followed by three coats of clear. I think they turned out awesome.
The rear end has been trying for a few different reasons,
First is every place the suspension arms mount I had to open up, which I have heard people had to do on the front end as well, secondly the holes would not line up. It just seems like every piece has fought me in this area. Then the fun part of realizing that I am missing bolts. So now I am waiting on the bolts to arrive before I can button it up. It is very exciting to stand back and look at the progress though and it ends up all being worth it. I can't wait to see its stance.
Working on installing the fuel tank next. 5403254033540345403654035
David Hodgkins
05-16-2016, 04:31 PM
Byron, a quick tip,
Keep your images below 1900X1900 and you will be able to view them inline instead of attaching them and only getting a link. More info here:
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?18962-How-to-use-the-Image-Gallery-to-embed-pictures-in-posts
That post centers on using the pic galley as part of theis site but if you use a 3rd party site like photobucket you can still use [IMG] tags to embed your images...
:)
myjones
05-16-2016, 06:59 PM
[QUOTE=BigB;231964 Im still unsure the best way to find center but I'm sure I will work it out..[/QUOTE]
Byron
I used the front and back wall tubing on the passenger compartment to establish chassis center. Measure across the firewall framing on the 1.5" tube that goes all the way across and mark center all the way around with a T square. There is a similar tube at the back of the passenger compartment so do the same there. With the chassis on jack stands and level F-B and S-S, I then used a laser setting on a 6' tall ladder out in front of the chassis and lined it up on those two center lines. That laser line hit the X center of the floor was right on the X under the engine and was within an 1/8" of center of the front tubes at the very front of the chassis. The part that extends behind the passenger compartment is off about 5/16" even though that's a fairly short clip so mark the true chassis center back there so your 8.8 gets lined up with the chassis not that wonky rear clip. I suggest drilling a small hole in both of those locations if you haven't already painted the chassis so you can always come back to it easily. I have also put the laser at different heights in front and behind and marked CL on all sides of the tubes it crosses. The lines will be great for the engine, tranny, rearend, firewall and grille shell but it is almost useless on the fiberglass body parts because most of them are not symmetrical enough to measure anything. The trunk opening is not centered on the glass body, the front of the door openings is very different in height and the rear wheel is not centered in the rear fender regardless of which rearend you use although the IRS is .5" closer than the 3&4 links are. I also found that a 3/16" full length shim on the passenger side tube you climb over to get in helped to level the cowl on mine and since I'm using running boards you don't see the chassis below the body from that adjustment. Aligning most of the body is just about making it look right when all the pieces are in place.
HTH
Dale 7L Hemi33
Niagara Dave
05-16-2016, 07:53 PM
Byron welcome to the madness. Your project will be all consuming. I can speak from experience that it was one of the best projects I have done. It is everything Dave Smith says it is the car handles like it is on rails. Good luck don't get frustrated and just enjoy the ride. Use the forum we are hear to help.
Motor_Freak
06-09-2016, 12:56 AM
Nevin, I live in Los Angeles but I am originally from Utah.
Byron, I am in Los Angeles too, so if you need any help, just let me know!
So it has been awhile since I posted. I have not made much progress but, I am hoping to get things going again. I rough mounted the grill, radiator and fan shroud. I am still thinking about where to put the Overflow tank... I might go with a different stye tank and mount it somewhere else. The one that comes with the kit seems like its such a tight fit.
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Rear suspension is all mocked up.
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Mocked up AC/Heat unit.
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Made a buck for body. I am seriously considering doing the body work and paint. I have zero experience with either one but when I set out on this project I wanted the experience of learning new things and broadening my range of skills. With that being said I have been doing many hours of research on tools and products needed along with the how to articles and videos. I am only planning on hard top with NO fenders, hood or sides. 73329
Lastly, I have boxes of goodies just sitting around waiting for a good home. Waiting on engine now, which is on back order and they dont have a date for me...... not thrilled about that. Was thinking of getting a refund and going another route.. Also waiting on the infinity box. Its been five weeks since I placed the order. Has it been peoples experience to wait that long on the Infinity/Isis system??
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erlihemi
09-06-2017, 07:37 PM
Backorders do get frustrating. I'm going on 10 months for a custom crank (Frankencrank) for another project. Nice shot of the IRS. Looks great! I wish that option was available when I ordered mine. I put a larger overflow on the passenger side back by the firewall under the tubes. I'll see if I have a picture someplace. The FFR version didn't have enough volume for the Heads and I change the whole front anyway. Good Idea to do all your body work while waiting on other parts.
Keep the pics coming!
progmgr1
09-08-2017, 02:53 AM
Byron,
Not sure how I missed your build thread before this? I am (finally) retired and starting to build a '33 out in Simi Valley. I don't know what part of LA you're in, but feel free to reach out if you need help or just an extra set of hands.
Keith
Thats great, and very nice of you to offer your help. Thanks.
erlihemi
09-08-2017, 12:29 PM
Byron,
Here's a shot of where I put the larger overflow. Same style, just larger. Probably a Speedway item.
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Coyote arrived, put it in and mocked up Brake Reservoirs, Fuel Reg and Aircon. Installed McLeod RXT, Aluminium Fly, Quick Time Bell, Tilton TOB and T56.
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This week the Whip should arrive. I also need to get Drive Shaft shortend about an inch and a half. Once that happenes I can start working toward getting it running.
Here is a list of challenges I ran into the last couple weeks...
- Was sent the wrong engine mounts, needed to get exchanged
- When intalling McLeod Rxt a bolt on spacer plate stripped out, McLeod replaced with no arguments. Great customer service.
- Spent a whole day getting Trans mated to engine, The snout of T56 did not go into pilot bearing...... Got a great workout though.
- I ordered the wrong part number for tilton TOB so had to wait for turn around time on that, Summit is fantastic to work with.
Yesterday I was mocking up the A/C compressor on the engine and it will not fit becuase of A arm, is the solution to hack off the boss on the compressor? or is there another solution?
As always if you guys have comments or suggestions to anything I am always open for them.
myjones
10-23-2017, 05:40 AM
Byron
good looking build so far;
The brake reservoirs look great but they look like they will interfere with the hood latch pins.
Are you changing that or leaving the hood off ?
Dale
CVOBill
10-24-2017, 09:23 AM
BigB, yes you have to cut the mounting boss, its detailed in the A/C instructions.
Hmm, I must have overlooked that part in the instructions. Hacked it off yesterday though and it fits like a charm. Now I am trying to figure out a way to run the lines that will not only be aesthetically pleasing but functional. With no sides or hood to hide things is tough. Everything, to me, should not go outside the frame in order to not look like shoddy work. If anyone has some inspiration photos of the way they routed their lines please feel free to share or direct me.
From my build7585475855
But will have full fenders & hood.
Tom, I see you have two Low side ports(blue), is there a reason for that? I think I will try to go down and under the engine mount as you did.
CVOBill
10-24-2017, 02:06 PM
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BigB- I had to get some more parts to to make fit and did not think i could use the one in front. But remember that i have changed a lot of things so things fit different.
Tom,
Saying that you have changed a lot of things is no understatement. I have, and still do follow your build. Thanks for blogging your build, it has been fun to watch.
769307693176932Got the supercharger and valve covers on this weekend. Before that I mocked up the E-Stopp system and tested it out, works great. Also hooked the electric steer to power to see how much of a difference it makes, and it does. This week will be finishing hoses and odds and ends, on the whip, then figuring out how to mount and route the alternator. Still waiting on Infinity box to show up before I start wiring. Here are some glamor shots of all the shininess
Dam that looks good! What power are you looking for?
erlihemi
11-20-2017, 07:47 PM
Nice packaging on that Whipple. You should be able to see where your right front corner is headed anyway. Leave room for lots of rubber on the rear!
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I have always loved the wow factor on my dads 72 Pinto growing up, everyone would just stare at the motor for minutes on end. I guess I am trying to recreate that a little. Like they say the apple does not fall far from the tree.
Tom, from all the literature I read on these s/c crate engines and the Whipple supercharger combo, I gather the crate engine is good to about 1000 crank HP. The Whipple can get it there, but will probably need the help of race fuel or good ole American corn. But I am guessing with a good conservative tune for the street it will make around 700HP to the tire.
Speaking of tires, yes there will be some nice size rubber in the rear. Not this much 76979 but close...
A big horsepower build -- I like it. Wait until you get around to the headers. The only way to get an adequate size exhaust on that beast is to exit out the side of the engine bay. That's a real shortcoming of the hot rod design.
774647746577466Well I found a spot for the Alternator, made up some mounts. I will be refining the mounts during final assembly. This car always amazes me in how much stuff you can crame into tight spaces. Next up is the hoses and wiring. Should be recieving all my chassis wiring by the end of the week. Can not wait to hear this thing come alive.
AJT '33
12-06-2017, 09:40 AM
In your post #15 there is a plate that bolts on the top of the engine, did you make this or did you purchase it from somewhere? We are battling on how to pickup the engine and when I saw this its a nice clean solution. TY!
I believe i got it from one of the mustang shops, LMR, CJ pony or American Muscle. It was not cheap but if you take the engine in and out several times its worth it.
7747377474774757747677477Finished all the hoses for heater and A/C. Still Need to make mounting clips for hoses and then crimp them put basic layout is done.
AJT 33, here is link.
https://lmr.com/item/LRS-50LP/motion-raceworks-coyote-voodoo-engine-lift-plate
You can also find it on ebay and some other places.
AJT '33
12-07-2017, 11:04 AM
ajt 33, here is link.
https://lmr.com/item/lrs-50lp/motion-raceworks-coyote-voodoo-engine-lift-plate
you can also find it on ebay and some other places.
much appreciated!!
Traveled a lot this month so work on the 33 was minimal. When I was at my pops' house my wife and I went through some old pics and came across my first girlfriend, four eyed saleen. Something about your first car that brings so much joy..
Been back a week and finally got started on the wiring. managed to find spots for all the cells and fuses and routed power to all. 7883278833788347883578836
It's been a while and a lot has happened. With the Hotrod, not so much, but in life... a lot. My wife and I had our second child in May, a baby boy. Those of you with children know where the majority of your time goes especially when they are so young.
Winter break has given me some time to work on the Beast though.
I completed all the hose routing for the supercharger cooling. I have quite a small reservoir for the S/C for now, going to see how it works out before I upgrade. I decided to mount the LTR to the front of the car behind the radiator.... Is this a good decision, only time will tell.
I extended the radiator mount about an inch and a half. Planning on getting a nice billet piece custom made for that on final assembly (if cooling works).
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I also routed all the heater and A/C lines. Still scratching my head on what to do about the heater valve with vintage air. Right now I have it hooked up like the instructions say with no bypass. What do you ya'll think or recommend on that? leave as is? Add some sort of bypass?
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Gapped and added colder spark plugs, Hydraulic throwout bearing is bleed, clutch stop is in and ran all the wiring for the coyote harness. On this I had a head scratch moment. I hastily mounted both the top and bottom sensors for the clutch and found out after the fact that I only needed the bottom. Live and learn I guess.
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Fuel Tank is back in with all hoses attached, fuel pump wired and vent tube done.
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Tested the power to the gauges, still need to hook up and install all the sensors and running gear.
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Im sure Im missing some stuff, here is a few more pics of the progress.
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Getting close to first start. Got to get the overflow mounted and plumped. Add all fluids and check all connections, then its time.
As always if anyone see's anything abnormal or wonky feel free to give me advise and suggestions.
jgarner
01-10-2019, 02:24 PM
Hi Byron
I just found your thread and it's very timely that I did. I built my '33 #198 back in 2010 with a ford 347 stroker, but pulled that engine and AOD out for a '57 T-Bird resto-mod project in 2015. Now I'm ready do a heart transplant from a wreaked 2012 Mustang GT into the '33 and add the polished Whipple, just like you have done. I have all of the Coyote installation bits from FFR. If you could answer a couple of questions, I would really appreciate it.
Did you purchase the Whipple Ford Coyote Universal Supercharger System or one for a specific car? If it was the Universal system, did you use the heat exchanger that came with the kit? Are you using the serpentine system that came with the engine or an aftermarket setup? Those answers will get me started.
I'm anxious to hear how your cooling works.
Thanks in advance,
Joe
PS: Here are few pics of my build, if you are interested.
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Disclaimer: I don't know if my combination will work yet, as there is a long road of working out the kinks ahead.
I decided to buy the whipple kit that is made for a mustang 15-17, but without the tune. I do regret purchasing this kit as I have a lot of stuff left over that I did not use. This kit comes with a massive heat exchanger and radiator, it also comes with a large reservoir thats pretty ugly and will not fit anywhere. The massive radiator will only fit one place, that I can see, without major fabrication to chassis and thats the trunk. I did not want to give up my trunk (yet) so I am trying something else before I go that route. I bought an after market radiator from Edelbrock that would fit behind the grill and car radiator. Then I extended the grill mounts (for now i do not plan on running hood or side panels) the appropriate length, which was about an inch and a half. I then purchased a smaller reservoir and placed it between the motor and grill. Like I said earlier, I am not sure that this will cool sufficiently, I am also curious to see how it effects the cooling of the motor. I mounted the intercooler pump (came in whipple kit) right to the bottom of the reservoir.
That was the easy part. The hardest part by far is figuring out the serpentine belt routing. I wanted to stay as close to the belt routing for the whipple system as I could so that I had good belt wrap on everything. As everyone who has built these cars knows everything is tight. I Spent two weeks just on the belt routing and I still don't know if somethings going to snap off on the first start. The biggest issue by far is where to mount the alternator. You cant mount it with the FFR kit because the whipple bracket has replaced that. The whipple kit wants you to route it where it is supposed to go, but we don't have that option unless we plan some chassis modifications. For two weeks I kept looking at the A/C compressor like, "do I really need A/C? I could live without it". If you do not run A/C your problem is solved and there are companies that make brackets to mount the alternator there. I also believe some of the builders on here have mounted it there with custom brackets. I ended up keeping the A/C so I fabricated a piece to make the alternator fit just inside of where it would originally run on the coyote. For now I have the alternator suggested by FFR, I had to flip it like the FFR instructions. After mounting the alternator I took a string (wire) and wrapped it around the serpentine system to get the best wrap on all the pulleys and then measured that. Bought that size belt at auto parts store. Everything fits and when I tested the starter system the other day no weird noises, but like i said we will have to wait and see.
To answer your questions more to the point:
Did not use heat exchanger (radiator) that came with kit, may end up using it if more cooling is needed down the road.
You can make the whipple serpentine system work with minor modifications if you decide no A/C. If not you will need to fabricate your own routing.
jgarner
01-12-2019, 11:33 AM
Thanks for sharing your experiences and the wealth of information. I've studied your pictures and it looks like you're on the right track. The question is, will everything cool?
I recently installed a Whipple kit on a 2013 Silverado 2500HD for more towing power so I am somewhat familiar with their kits. I have a friend who is a Whipple dealer and can probably get me connected with someone who can advise me on LTR possibilities. I'll be glad to share that with you. I plan to continue running a hood and side panels, so moving the radiator would not be an option for me. Once I get the dimensions of the LTR that comes with the Universal Coyote kit, I'll be able to investigate possible locations. Right now I'm thinking of a remote mounting with a dedicated fan under the fuel tank. I moved the battery to the trunk already. It may even take two smaller LTRs with fans, connected in series, to do the job. I'm sure that Whipple engineered their systems for extreme use, so a much smaller unit may be sufficient for street use. Having said all of that, your arrangement could work just fine. My concern is the stacking of the AC condenser, radiator, and then LTR. I had some overheating problems with my 347 while running the AC. I finally concluded that the main problem was inadequate discharge of air from the engine bay. Since you're not planning on running a hood or side panels, that won't be an issue for you.
I'd like to follow your lead on the serpentine system, if you don't mind. Would you share the part numbers for the alternator and the belt you bought? Also, if you have a dimensioned drawing of your alternator bracket, that would help a lot. If you would also provide a copy of the FFR instructions for mounting, I'll have that issue solved.
Thanks again.
Very good to see others working the heat exchanger problems out. I hope that you have no heating problems, i had over heating with the AC condenser in front of radiator in 100 temps. Not enough
air getting out of behind radiator, with your no hood and sides it may work, but once you are to hot ever thing is hot!
The other thing is to get cool air for intake, in my first setup had hot air to intake and lost a lot of power. With my twin turbo setup will get outside air( have not came up with air cleaner yet) water to air coolers and will put heat exchanger and AC condenser in trunk, looking to have room for soft overnight bag! I like the idea of putting heat exchanger under the tank you my need to have some ducting to move air. Good luck to us all!!
I am building gas tanks to go under tank for more gas ( it will like it's gas) and plumed with top tank, so i have no room any left!
Well, I planned everything with the "no hood and no sides" in mind. I hope that will help with the cooling. Like I said if I have to I will figure out another place to mount the radiator for the heat exchanger. When I get a chance I will post a pic of the radiator that came from Whipple with the measurements. Mind you it was the mustang kit. One more thing to keep in mind is that if you modify anything on these cars outside of what the FFR instructions tell you, you add time, money and more work to the project. I think all the time about how I would probably already have a go cart, if not a registered car, if I did not decide to modify things. But I guess thats what makes it a hot rod and a great hobby.
Yes it is more time and money, but that is what makes a personal one of a kind car!! My car will be mine and as far as i know a one off, it makes the time and money a good go. The first thing did was start changing things to my way, some good, some not so much. All fun.
bogandoc
01-13-2019, 11:05 PM
Nice to find some fellow supercharger nuts.
I moved the thermostat housing and am using an AC coolant-powered heat exchanger instead of a Low Temp Radiator, will get my act together and post a build thread.
https://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?30993-RHD-33-hot-rod-build-with-Edelbrock-supercharged-Coyote-engine&p=353710#post353710
Yeah I looked long and hard at the "Killer chiller" thing and decided not to go that route. I do look forward to hearing how it works out for you though. What S/C , motor you planning on running?
I have not done much work on the hotrod this year. I finally got to spend a little time in the garage this last week and finalized all the little things to go for first start.
To be honest, it was super uneventful. Fired right up on first crank.
I do have some small oil leaks; one at the remote oil relocation mount in the 1/8npt plug, the other at the oil pressure gauge.
My serpentine belt was one of my biggest concerns going into this. At idle its fine but with small revs the alternator hits the frame. This was the modified location that I put it in. So, I bought the PBH alternate relocation kit for whipple coyotes. I will still have to modify belt routing as the PBH solution includes a power steering pump in the belt routing that I will need to delete. Back to the drawing board for that.
I am using the infinity box, or isis, chassis electronics system. Within that system is the option to have all your controls through a touchscreen. I used my iPad and everything worked well.
Im sure I am forgetting things, but here is a short video. I asked my wife to video the event and she had some technical difficulties but here is some of the footage.
https://youtu.be/hCJrM2cJO1g