Worried about resale value of 818

[PepoNY]

Good evening everyone;

I've been looking to purchase an 818 for about a year now. I'n my opinion its a great car to begin getting into kits and I love roadsters. My first delay in purchasing one was when the new front was released, I wanted to make sure that the new front looked appeasing, and now I'm worried about the resale value/total investment involved.

I'm estimating my all in costs will be around $22K for a full build including donor, extra parts and any outside costs. I have now seen at least three (and almost bought one) mostly built cars for sale on craigslist in the $10k-$12k range and a fully built car just sold on Bring a Trailer for $14k (i almost won it).

Other Factory five kits usually sell for well above their cost. I'm guessing this is due to the type of cars being "imagined" as well as the engine/horsepower numbers. I'm also guessing changing the nose has dropped the resale value of original 818 kits.

I wasn't going to post this but also saw another post "did everyone forget about the 818" and have to say that the main thing that keeps me going bat to this car is the community, the people who posts on this forum, and the reputation of factory five products.

I'm wanted to get feedback from others as well as FF5.

thank you

[wirenut]

Other Factory five kits usually sell for well above their cost.


This is not true at all. The Roadsters you see selling for $35k generally cost at least $45k to build. The 818 is a newer car so, less people know about it. However, it is very successful.

If you think you are going to get your money back/make money when finish, don't count on it. These cars are not a good financial investment. You will lose money if/when you sale.

Do I think I get value for my money, totally! I'm paying for the experience of the build, the track days, the car shows and the community. I almost feel like I'm ripping FF5 off.

Also, if you are worried about the new nose being a deterrent, I believe you can order your kit with the old nose.

[STiPWRD]

Personally I'm not worried one bit about resale value, I bought it to build it, not sell it. There's just not a huge market for completed 818's because they are so new and don't have that instant recognition of some of the iconic replicas.

[mikeinatlanta]

If resale value is an issue, pick a different hobby, like maybe a boat.:D

[Hindsight]

Most any car you buy is going to depreciate in value. The exceptions are going to be things like antique collector cars and there are two varieties of those: Drivers and non-drivers. The drivers generally won't increase in value much - they maintain their value. The non-drivers will increase in value but you can't drive them. Yes there are exceptions to everything but I wouldn't bank on them.

It would be ill-advised to buy a kit-car because you want something you can use and still be able to cash in to get all your money back when you are done building and using it. That said, FFR cars hold their value better than most kit cars and the amount you get back for the car depends on the build quality and how much you put into it. Didn't a really nice 818 recently sell for around $30k? As others have said, the roadsters hold their value better for a couple reasons. One is that they've been on the market longer and have a comparable market (Cobra replicas from all makers). There is high demand for cobra replicas and the market is mature. There is no comparable market for the 818 which is a one-off kit car and a replica of nothing. Price will continue going up as more people learn about the car and want one. I was at a car show yesterday that had several thousand people and probably 1,000 cars. I bet 99% of the people there know what a Shelby Cobra was, but only probably 10-20 knew what an 818 was. But even with time, the 818 will still not be the commodity that a cobra replica is and will likely not have the volume of sales and price to support it.

Partially (even mostly) completed cars always go for much less. This is because a lot of people with money can't build a car so they can't finish it - they want something already fully ready to drive. The people who CAN build and finish a car don't want to take over someone else's project - they want to make it their own car from the start to finish. If you are a builder and can get over that last part, you can get cobras and 818s and GTMs for a very good deal.

Also, when building a car, it's like flipping a house. You wouldn't buy a house at retail value and stuff it full of all the goodies you personally wanted and expect to make money or even retain your investment. No, you buy it at a short sale or auction or in a down market, and you put into it what you think will maximize your returns. You buy decent appliances but not the top of the line. You don't replace the roof if it doesn't need it. At the same time, you don't slap it together with duct tape and chicken wire or you won't be able to get much for it.

What did the 818s that sold for $14k look like? Were they finished? Painted? Nicely done or quickly put together? Did they need to sell fast or did they wait for the right buyer? Was it an auction? Any time you auction something that doesn't have a very high demand, you are not going to get much money. Specialty cars are all about waiting for the right buyer. You could build a $22k 818 and get $22k back out of it if you did it right. There are guys on this forum who build FFR cars for a living for people. I believe they are charging $35k and up for a basic car (completed to the FFR manual for the most part), so there is a market for the 818s and at a high price.

Bottom line is that for most people, cars are an expensive hobby and not something that they expect to make money on or event get much of their investment back out of. This is especially true when performance and appearance modifications have been done. Go to any car forum and look at the classifieds and you'll see all sorts of show cars and cars with awesome engine swaps etc, and people are selling them for less than half what they have into them. They do it because it's their hobby and a labor of love and that's the price of admission. They are happy to get something out of what they did that they can then use to put down toward their next project that they'll sink a bunch of money into.

[Courtnie Provencher]

The 818 doesn't have as high of a resale value because it's a cheaper kit. The MK4 Complete Kit, Hot Rod, Coupe Complete Kit and GTM all cost $19,990 and up just for the kit. The most expensive 818 is the coupe and that's only $12,990. We've had customers build an 818 for $15,000. But if you build a kit, you get the experience of building your car from the ground up, and I gotta tell you, there's nothing like starting that car up and taking it for a drive and thinking, "wow, I built this. I made this car run and drive." The experience alone is the best part!

[Mechie3]

I think this is the 818:

http://bringatrailer.com/listing/2014-factory-five-818/

Pretty straightforward on the build. It was the builder's second 818 (states in the ad) so he probably made it much faster and didn't have to buy any tools. Depending on the cost of the donor he could have come out ever so slightly ahead.

[Frank818]

#001 and Chad's (fixed) racer were sold for undisclosed prices (I believe) but apparently not that far from the asked price, which if I recall was around 25k for each of them.
But like everyone says, when you buy it you don't think of selling it soon enough, except #001 (his 5th FFR build at the time).

[Kalstar]

I sold my orange one for 22K.

[PepoNY]

Thanks for the feedback guys. I really appreciate the comments. Hindsight really made me think about it differently than I was originally.

[Mechie3]

Hindisight is 20/20. ;)

(at least when he passes you in his build so you can take ideas from him).

[john g]

I am the seller of the 818 on BoT. Before commenting on the price, let me first thank all who have answered questions and supplied parts. This is a great forum thanks to all who participate.

I build my 818 as a project and learning experience. I never expected to recoup my costs, and I did not. Would I have liked to receive a bit more? Yes, and I think the new owner got a great deal.

That said, I would consider building another 818, but this time electric. I understand that an electric kit would add $10,000, so I will need to think very hard before committing to such a project. I doubt very much I would ever see the extra cost of battery power.

To those considering the 818, I had a great time building my cars (yes, two). So go ahead, order the kit, and be prepared to get dirty. Have fun.

John