Interest Check/Group Buy: Steering Rack Extender, Zero Decibel

[Mechie3]

The early chassis have the mounts for the steering rack in the wrong position placing the rack off center. I don't know how many chassis are affected or what chassis number it was fixed at. One of three things could be done:
1: turning radius left/right was different as the stroke left/right was different
2: minimal thread engagement on the tie rod end,
3, make an extension

I made a couple of steering rack extenders (C. Plavan, Bob n Cincy, RM1Sepex, myself) and finally got them quoted at a third party shop so I can actually sell them (vs just giving things away, lol).

Machined from 1018 steel


Here's a picture of an old prototype on Bob's car. I've changed it slight to allow for easier installation.
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=46920&d=1392261791

Group buy pricing, min 5 required to order. 50% deposits due before ordering (only so I don't get stuck with several hundred dollars worth of parts I don't need). note: the price drop between 5 and 10 pieces is rather substantial and tapers off from there. At the 5 piece price it looks like a majority of my cost is just amortizing the setup fee. After that it's more machine time and material.

5-9: $140
10-14: $95
15-20: $77
20+: $64

1: Nismo_RB25
2: Metros
3: Jrach
4: Ethan818
5: Rori
6: Justin
7: Justin
8: Azpete
9: Santiago
10: Santiago

[RM1SepEx]

Craig, this piece is inside the boot, can you quote out of reg, non stainless steel?

[Mechie3]

Good point. Asked them to requote in plain carbon steel.

[NISMO_RB25]

You can count me in for one. If you don't get enough to make the minimum I will order two just so I don't have to come up with another solution. ;)

[metros]

I'm in. Cheaper steel preferred.

[JRach]

Correct me if i'm wrong here...

But if the steering rack is off center by a little bit, this shouldn't effect the turning radius if the tie-rods are adjusted appropriately. Yes you'll have more threads/adjustment available on one side when compared to the other but turning radius is only effected if someone slaps the rack in place and then puts the steering wheel on not centered with the rack (lock to lock) to compensate.

With that being said, I like having a little more peace of mind that comes with additional meat/threads on my tie rod ends. Count me in for one :)

[Mechie3]

The issue wasn't so much how much adjustability you have but that the side with fewer threads didn't have very many threads total engaged.

[RM1SepEx]

Check out my build thread starting on or about post 398 and read a couple pages. http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?10649-RM1Sepex-Build-Thread/page10

Basically we found that our early chassis had the rack mounted too far to the driver's side by .55 or so... never could get FFR to provide the exact information. this post summarizes the situation best:

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?10649-RM1Sepex-Build-Thread/page12 first post # 441

all the early cars gave up wheel rotation to one side, reducing turning radius in one direction (doesn't give a tighter radius in the other direction, the tire rubs vs the aluminum.)

I have no idea if or when this was resolved by FFR

[Ethan818]

I have an early frame and have found this issue as well. Count me in for one as well. Cheaper steel also preferred.

[Aero STI]

I'm Chassis 73 or 74 and don't recall having this issue. I can't say definitively at this point, but maybe others can chime in so we know when it was fixed.

[Mechie3]

Updated pricing for 1018 steel. It wasn't much cheaper, just a little.

[Santiago]

Looking forward to the new quote.

[Mechie3]

I updated pricing up above. The entry level price dropped ~ $20. Next one dropped...$25?

[NISMO_RB25]

I updated pricing up above. The entry level price dropped ~ $20. Next one dropped...$25?

That's good news for the guy who might be buying a paperweight. :cool:

[Mechie3]

At this point I would buy one or two for myself for inventory. I just left your name there so it shows we hit the 5 limit.

[NISMO_RB25]

Woot! That just means I get to buy a bunch of other things from you. Don't anyone tell the wife.

[rori]

I'm probably going to need one of these. Put me down for one. I hope we can get to that 10 person discount.

[Mechie3]

I typically post these once or twice on facebook just to make sure it gets the most traffic. Letting others know what products I have is certainly my biggest challenge.

[bompus]

I might need it, not quite sure yet. I'm pretty sure my drivers-side wheel is inward by about 1/4" - 1/2" though, if that is the symptom.

[Bob_n_Cincy]

I might need it, not quite sure yet. I'm pretty sure my drivers-side wheel is inward by about 1/4" - 1/2" though, if that is the symptom.

The Symptom you will see:
Turn the steering wheel lock to lock.
Clamp your steering at the center of travel.
With both your UCA adjusted to the same length.
Adjust your front wheels until pointing straight ahead.

The thread engagement of the steering tie rod ends should be equal on both sides. Less than a 1/4".

Here is a picture of my old car. notice the steering rack bracket overlaps on the drivers side.

49700

The next picture is a newer correct frame.
notice the steering rack bracket has a gap on the drivers side.

49701




Bob

[metros]

Mine seemed equal when installing the rack. I'm really interested just for the peace of mind in having a lot more thread engagement.

AKA - newer chassis owners - don't dismiss this product because you have a newer chassis.

[bbjones121]

I am in

[Mechie3]

I'll leave this open for a few more days then place the order. 4 more till its $45 cheaper.

[RM1SepEx]

Mine seemed equal when installing the rack. I'm really interested just for the peace of mind in having a lot more thread engagement.

AKA - newer chassis owners - don't dismiss this product because you have a newer chassis.

If there are significantly more threads on one side than the other your rack isn't centered. What serial # do you have?

[metros]

^Which is why I said 'mine seemed equal' in reference to the number of threads on each side. It just doesn't seem like enough to me. This is an easy solution.

[flynntuna]

Not sure if I need it yet. I have frame # 253 and haven't mounted the rack yet. I'll find out soon though. Soon enough for this batch... Can't say

[AZPete]

Craig, put my name on one, please.
Pete

[bbjones121]

Not sure if I need it yet. I have frame # 253 and haven't mounted the rack yet. I'll find out soon though. Soon enough for this batch... Can't say

I have close to same number and I worry by how little thread engagement there is on my 2006 rack at both ends.

[bbjones121]

^Which is why I said 'mine seemed equal' in reference to the number of threads on each side. It just doesn't seem like enough to me. This is an easy solution.

Same here. Not much engagement on both ends to make me feel comfortable.

[flynntuna]

So are you saying you need an extention for each side?

[Mechie3]

Justin us in for two. At that rate I'll knock it down to the $95 price.

[RM1SepEx]

If I centered my rack the right side had only 4-5 threads engaged, with the spacer both sides have more than an inch, plenty of engagement.

[bbjones121]

Isn't this for two? That is what the newer kits need. If it is this cost for only one, I will opt out

[Mechie3]

Its for one. Cost is high because of low quantities. If it was for two I'd be losing money.

[Mechie3]

I dont recall offhand but I think the spacer is a little over an inch long. In a new kit if you added one it could be aligned to split the difference left and right. Not sure what happens to total turning radius though as if the wheel hits sheet metal on both sides before lock it doesn't change effective radius.

[RM1SepEx]

IIRC it is 1.1 inches. If you were to add one on each side you would have some serious bumpsteer as all 3 pivot points should be in a line for zero bumpsteer

[bbjones121]

I understand, that makes sense.

[flynntuna]

When is the closing date for this group buy?

[AZPete]

Craig, please see post #27 and add me to your list on post #1. I don't want to miss the boat.

[Santiago]

I'm in for two. So that should bring us to 9 total - c'mon people!! Just one more to jump in on this and we cut $45 off the price of just one (and I save $90!)...

Best,
-j

[flynntuna]

I'll be in for the 20th. There shouldn't be a problem getting ten more right? I'd rather pay the 20+ rate of $64.00.

[Mechie3]

It can be challenging. I've found with group buys I usually get 80% or more of the final buy members Signed up within the first two weeks. After that it's a slow trickle. Post group buy I'll get random requests here and there. It's a bit of a balancing act. More people would be in at the 20 person rate but until that happens people are reluctant to sign up. The fewer that sign up the higher the cost and it repeats.

[Mechie3]

Last call. :)

[wleehendrick]

I'll check tonight (chassis #52) and let you know first thing in the AM if I think I need it.

[wleehendrick]

I'll check tonight (chassis #52) and let you know first thing in the AM if I think I need it.

My rack appears well centered, so I don't need a spacer for centering. However I have a question regarding acceptable thread engagement:

I've done a rough alignment and I checked the thread engagement at the outer tie rods ends. It's symmetric with a bit over 1/2" of thread engaged, with more than an inch exposed on each side. Can anyone confirm if this is a safe amount of thread engagement? My donor was a 06 WRX wagon which has a narrow track than the sedans. I mounted the LCA's in the outer holes, but the track difference obviously had to be made up for at the TRE's. I f need be, I'll get two extenders, but would rather not revisit the steering if it's safe as is. Thanks!

[RM1SepEx]

1/2 inch of thread in that diameter when used for tension and compression loading backed with a nut is plenty of engagement for the steering loads.

[Mechie3]

Parts ordered. I got a couple extra to fulfill future orders as well.

[Mechie3]

Parts are supposed to have shipped to me today according to an email I got yesterday.

[Mechie3]

Parts arrived today. Took some quick cell phone shots.

http://i.imgur.com/sMxF6wi.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/W0HEB4O.jpg

[metros]

Looks good. That means I need to send another payment. What's the shipping cost? My zip is 22602 if that matters.

[Mechie3]

$7.

[metros]

Payment sent. Thanks!

[Mechie3]

Boxed up and shipping tomorrow. Thanks!

[Mechie3]

I stumbled across something this morning that inner tie rods for the 02-03 have an M14 thread where others are all M16 thread. I guess with all the prototypes I made without asking everyone that did a test fit had an 04+. If you find this doesn't fit let me know and I'll refund everything.

[walt555]

Did you make any rack extender for an 02-03?

[RM1SepEx]

Craig, did any of us ever check bump steer after installing this piece? I know it would absolutely suck, esp on one side, w/o it. :rolleyes:

[Hindsight]

I'm still interested in a pair of rack extenders to fix bump steer. I already found longer boots that should work. The extensions would need to be 2.5" long to fix the bump steer, and be even on each side (so two copies of the exact same part). Unfortunately, I wasn't able to pinpoint the exact length closer to 2.5" due to a number of factors that would take a long time to explain and probably no one is interested in hearing it all, but in the tests I did, 2.5" is very, very close. I'd be happy to be a test mule for these... installing them and checking bump steer after. If you sent me one that was 2.25" long and some shims I could use to experiment with adding length to it, it would make it even easier to fine tune to get the EXACT length needed, but I bet 2.5" would be awfully close.

[Mechie3]

I only made two pieces for 02-03 that were sold. Hindsight, I might be able to make something. Unfortunately we're getting rid of our CNC lathe at work (mostly because I'm the only one that knows how to run it and I 95% of the time used it for personal projects, ha!). Not sure the exact time frame.

[Hindsight]

No worries, just let me know when you could do it. I am guessing the thread size and pitch is consistent across the various years? If so, then you should have everything you need (between that and the 2.5" specified length). So if you turn a set out, let me know and I will test it.

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Craig, did any of us ever check bump steer after installing this piece? I know it would absolutely suck, esp on one side, w/o it. :rolleyes:

Dan,
I also have the offset rack mounts.
I'm running Craig's extension on only passenger side.
I'm running sedan arms in wagon holes.
My bump steer spacers are the same length.
I did not achieve numbers as good as Mitch and Tony. So I will revisit bump steer adjustment this spring.
Bob

[Mechie3]

No worries, just let me know when you could do it. I am guessing the thread size and pitch is consistent across the various years? If so, then you should have everything you need (between that and the 2.5" specified length). So if you turn a set out, let me know and I will test it.

Newer racks had an M16 thread, older ones had an M14 I think.

[longislandwrx]

Unfortunately we're getting rid of our CNC lathe at work

did you make them an offer on it?

[Mechie3]

No. I have no place to put it. It runs on 480V three phase, is about the size of a car, and is an older machine that might need a tune up sometime.

[axelthrasher]

Will you be making another run of these? I am curious to find out if the car I am purchasing is impacted by this issue.

[Mechie3]

I still have a handful on my shelf in a basement. 04+ fitment.

[fastzrex]

Mechie3, please invoice me ('07 fitment) for shipment to 73008. Thanks!

[DanielsDM]

Craig,
How much do these extend the rack?

[Mechie3]

About 1.125". That is how far off center the original frames had the steering rack mounting points.

[RM1SepEx]

Craig, IIRC the offset was 1/2 of that number